'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

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AI2.0
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'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by AI2.0 »

Onewhoiswatching is a blog by a LDS church critic (apparently was once LDS but has since 'graduated' and seems to have his own theological beliefs) but in reading one of his other blogs-- 'Because I am Watching', I found this information that I thought I'd share here. Some of you might find this interesting--some of you should take this as a warning that some of what he mentions sounds very much like what is shared in this subsection of the forum; could be this is a warning of what direction some on the forum are headed if they are not careful. He claims there are two groups who call themselves 'the Remnant' and while I'm familiar with both, I didn't know that they both used this name. One group are the Snuffer followers, but he claims that there is another group--the Preppers,, whom we are quite familiar with. Here is a portion of the posting:
A Remnant of Judah is Currently Preparing for the Gathering

In this post I am going to put a spotlight on who they are and give you a synopsis of what their beliefs are and how they are preparing to be gathered out. Some of you may be part of this group.

I have a soft spot in my heart for these people even though I do not feel as if I am part of their tribe.

I know that they are a remnant of God’s people and he loves them very much. Ultimately, after their pain, they will be redeemed and saved in a kingdom of glory.

Interestingly, some of them think that the preliminary gathering out will begin this year.

I am very hopeful also.

I base my speculative conclusions on a different set of data than they do, nevertheless, we both have arrived at the same general timeline with regard to when major events will begin to happen.

Of course I have been speculating about the time that things will begin to happen for many years and I have the dubious distinction of batting 1000% in my speculative predictions.

They have all been wrong.

That is because I am not a prophet, I am a “Yankee Guesser” like BY.

Those of Judah Preparing to Gather have no Formal Organization

This remnant of Judah within the modern church is a rather loosely organized fellowship that sustains the current leaders of the LDS church as prophets, seers and revelators.

They congregate at preparedness fairs, Book of Mormon Conferences, Gileadi Lectures, and other similar events. They even sponsor special “Zion Camps” where fellow “preppers” camp out together for a week at a time to hear lectures from people like Mechelle (Shelle) McDermott and enjoy classes about a multitude of topics having to do with end times prophecy and physical preparations for the impending calamities and the interim gathering out to tent cities.

Some of the main declarations coming from this group of people are as follows-

1- A huge earthquake is going to hit the Wasatch Front very soon followed by financial chaos, plagues, civil war and the invasion of America.

2- The leaders of the LDS Church will not warn the church about this calamity.

3- The more righteous in the church will be temporally prepared for this calamity and will be gathered to “tent cities” in designated “cities of refuge”.

The Leaders of the Church will not Raise the Warning Voice

Those are among the major points of belief and general mantra of this group of believers. Interestingly, they believe selected members of the church are currently getting their calling and election made sure.

Oddly enough, they don’t believe the leaders of the church will raise the warning voice just before calamity hits because they feel that the leaders of the church have already given an adequate general warning for many decades.

The following video titled “There Will Be No General Warning By The Prophet Before The Prophesied Calamities Strike” distills their belief about why the ordained watchmen on the wall will be silent and not offer the voice of warning prior to this great calamity.





Isaiah 52 and 62 informs us that the true watchmen of the latter days will lift up the voice of warning just prior to the calamities, yet Isaiah 56 speaks of latter day watchmen that are impostors. He characterizes them as blind, ignorant dumb dogs that cannot bark.

10 His watchmen are blind: they are all ignorant, they are all dumb dogs, they cannot bark; sleeping, lying down, loving to slumber.

11 Yea, they are greedy dogs which can never have enough, and they are shepherds that cannot understand: they all look to their own way, every one for his gain, from his quarter.

Although these latter day Jews are active in the modern corporate church and claim to sustain the brethren, several leaders of the church have warned the general membership to not pay any attention to them. The leadership has continually admonished members to rely exclusively on the brethren for all of their prophetic guidance.

Since this group of believers appears to be classified among the Jews that only begin to believe in Christ without accepting the fulness when it returns, they do not appear to take the unconditional promises and prophecies in the Doctrine and Covenants literally and seriously nor do they appear to believe in the return of Joseph Smith and his fellow servants of the first laborers of the last kingdom .

Because of this, the Doctrine and Covenants is a sealed book to them regarding the prophecies contained therein.

In some of the presentations the following listing of prophetic books of scripture is what they encourage their followers to study. You will notice that only one section in the D&C is even mentioned:

Jeremiah
Ezekiel
Isaiah
The Book of Revelation
D&C 45
Matthew 24
Mark 13

With the exception of Section 45, the above listing of suggested prophetic scriptures to read seems to avoid the prophecies contained in modern revelation.

You will notice that the following sections containing critical information about the prophetic events of the last days are missing in the suggested reading list above.

Section 1 (preface)
Section 29
Section 88
Section 101
Section 103
Section 105
Section 109
Section 110
Section 112
Section 118
Section 133 (appendix)

To be fair, those that call themselves “the remnant” represent a very broad category and it contains many sub-factions. They do not all believe exactly the same.

It appears as if most of them have discounted the significance of the prophecies contained in the above sections in part.

Many in this group of latter day Jews do not see any need for the leaders and members of the Church to collectively repent of any serious wrongdoing.

It appears to me as if the majority of this collective group, that consider themselves to be the remnant of God’s people, don’t think the church has changed the ordinances and broken the everlasting covenant as documented in section one, Isaiah 24 and the Book of Malachi. They seem to be virtually illiterate regarding the true history of Mormonism with regard to how early the restored church became condemned and then rejected as a church with their dead.

Many of them think the church membership still has access to the fulness of priesthood (even though the fulness of power and blessings have largely been dormant since the martyrdom) and that all that is needed to bring down the fulness of power is greater faith. They do not recognize a need for any kind of course correction or the return of God’s servants.

Some factions within this group are very much oriented towards a gathering that is led by a Davidic Servant of the Lord while others feel that no servant is necessary.

Where do they get their prophetic beliefs from?

Their beliefs regarding doctrine and the pending calamities and subsequent gathering to tent cities, come largely from the following sources

1- The writings of Avraham Gileadi
2- Podcasts, talks and writings of Mike Stroud
3- The writings and teachings of Val Brinkerhoff
4- Selected writings and talks of Ezra Taft Benson
5- The Book titled “Visions of Glory” by John Pontius
6- The dreams, visions and writings by Sarah Menet
7- The dreams, visions and writings of Julie Rowe
8- The dreams, visions, writings and lectures of Mechelle (Shelle) McDermott
9- A collection of hundreds of other visions which have been collected and published by Roger K. Young.
10- Selected statements about the gathering by Brigham Young and other Utah General Authorities found in Journal of Discourses.

Again, not all members of this loosely organized group believe the same way but many of them are influenced by the teachings of the following teachers.

Shelle McDermott seems to be a chief organizer of some of their conferences and she is one of the primary visionaries that speaks about the tribulations that are about to take place.

Mike Stroud seems to be the doctrinal patriarch of this movement. I would characterize him as the “Denver Snuffer of active Mormons.”

Temporal preparedness is hugely emphasized among these people.

Below is a video of talks that Mike Stroud and Shelle McDermott gave at a recent conference.





The following link is to a podcast that Mike Stroud gives about receiving one’s calling and election. He claims to have over 15,000 followers of his blog.

https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/mstr ... 5_26-07_00

I refer to Stroud as the Denver Snuffer of active Latter day Saints because he emphasized some of the same things regarding the importance of seeing and conversing with God that Snuffer was teaching before getting excommunicated.

He teaches that selected Mormons are currently getting their calling and election (despite the fact that they don’t have the fulness of priesthood, don’t live the fulness of the Gospel and have been rejected as a church with their dead.)

Indeed, there seems to be a strong connection between the group taught Stroud and McDermott, and those that follow the teachings of Denver Snuffer. I have even been informed that some of them follow my blog, dispute the fact that I have a radically different religious world view from either of those groups.

Both Groups Call themselves the Remnant

The preppers are calling themselves “the remnant” and the Snufferites are also calling themselves “the remnant“.

I know of high profile people in this prepper group that are also secretly participating in the new Snufferite church and have received the new baptism protocol set forth by Snuffer. I think the Snufferites do lots of proselytizing among the preppers.

Interestingly, Mike Stroud repeatedly makes reference to the fact that he is being taught by a “holy man”, but refuses to reveal who this holy man is. He also claims to know some anonymous bloggers who teach about the importance of calling and election and the Second Comforter. It is possible that the holy man that is feeding information to Stroud is either Snuffer or one of Snuffers disciples.

Mike Stroud claims that translated beings are currently commissioning and ordaining people as part of the 144,000 servants of God.

He appears to be connected to an underground group of people who claim to have a special authority.

When asked about the Snufferites, Mike Stroud refused to condemn their movement or acknowledge them as apostates. Here is a question that one of his students asked him about the Snufferites and his response

Student 1: The group that is following Denver Snuffer, they think they’re that group? (the remnant mentioned in scripture)

Mike: Well, there may be some of them that are.

Student 1: How could they? How could they since they are apostatizing? Don’t you believe that they’re apostatizing?

Mike: I don’t know. I know some of those people, and I know that they are honorable people and their hearts are in the right place. I don’t know what the Lord is going to do there, but I do know some of them personally, and they are fine, good people and they have strong faith. Whether or not they have been deceived, and whether their doctrine is false, that is something between them and the Lord.

Would the Real “Remnant” Please Stand Up?

It is interesting that both the Preppers and the Snufferites have both chosen to call themselves “the remnant“.

The term remnant shows up throughout the scriptures in many different ways. The scriptures speak of the remnant of Jacob, the remnant of the Gentiles, the remnant of Joseph, the remnant of Judah, the remnant of Israel, etc.

Other times the scriptures only refer to “the remnant”, requiring the student of the scriptures to do extensive keyword searching and employ the spirit of revelation to discern which remnant is being spoken of.

Herein lies the wonderment of how the term is being used among these two groups of people.

One of the few sections in modern revelations that is spotlighted along with prophecies from the other standard works among these two groups is section 45 wherein the term remnant is used.

As previously discussed, Section 133 speaks of two gatherings and associated harvests that are about to take place. The first gathering has to do with those of Joseph and Ephraim that are associated with the gentiles. The second gathering has to do with those of Judah.

In Section 45 the Lord cryptically refers to those among the gentiles as “my disciples” that shall “stand in holy places“. Conversely, that same section speaks of “a remnant” [of the Jews] from Jerusalem that is scattered among all nations that are gathered into the LDS church AFTER the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled during Joseph Smith’s first ministry. Section 133 reveals that the believing remnant of Judah shall be saved and receive their inheritance AFTER their pain.

Both the Snufferites and the Preppers, have unwittingly referred to themselves as “the remnant” in the context of how it is used in Section 45. This group of Latter day Saints feel they can receive the fulness of gospel blessings without living the fulness of the gospel. (additional passages that use the term remnant as it applies to the tribal identify of these two groups are 1 Nephi 10:14, 1 Nephi 15:13-14, 3 Nephi 16:4 & Rev 11:13



Fearful Outlook of the Events to Come

Among the many visions and dreams that create the fearful outlook of this group of people include the vision of John Taylor, the Cardston Temple vision by Sols Caurdisto, a vision by President George Albert Smith, the vision of Patriarch Charles D. Evans, the predictions of Bishop Koyle, the warnings of Apostle Moses Thatcher, the prophetic warnings and writings of Heber C. Kimball, and George Washington’s alleged vision of the invasion of America.

Huge emphasis is place upon the writings of John Pontius.

A typical last days presentation that incorporates the mindset of this group can be seen here

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5Lb8z ... RTM00/view

This group puts a huge emphasis on the role of Jewish Feast days in prophetic fulfillment. Among the prophetic signs and timeline speculations that are discussed within their meetings is the belief that the 70 Jubilees began in 1416 BC when God’s children entered Canaan and the fact that that time period has expired.

They believe a seventy year generation has nearly elapsed from the time the Jews began to gather to the Old World in 1948 brings us to the year 2018.

They also put a huge emphasis on the upcoming September 23 event.

Another important prophecy that leads many of them to believe that the era of the Messiah is upon us in 2017, is the one given 12th century Rabbi, Judah Ben Samuel.

A more detailed listing of their source material can be viewed here. Additional resources are found here.

The following presentation was given by Mechelle McDermott in Arizona



The following statement by Brigham Young is typical of the types of predictions that this group is attracted to-

An inland Empire will be established in these valleys of the mountains, which will be a place of refuge for millions of people to gather to, when the great day of the judgments of God comes upon the earth, and the righteous come here for safety. Our people will go East…, West, North and South, but the day will come, when they will be glad to come back. We will be shut out from the rest of the world.”

As previously stated, there are numerous movers and shakers within this movement, with Avraham Gileadi and Mike Stroud being among the most prolific teachers that are looked up to. Nevertheless, the unique thing about this group is that their prophetic worldview with regard to the pending calamities seems to be dictated primarily by three charismatic and visionary women who claim to have special gifts of the spirit and a connection to heaven.

Sarah Menet
Julie Rowe
Mechelle (Shelle) McDermott

These women love to share their visions and dreams to spell-bound audiences. There seems to be a real market for their special prophetic knowledge gained from their spiritual gifts.

Many members of the church who are watching for the signs of the times and seeking direction on how to prepare, are largely left frustrated and unsatisfied by the modern General Authorities of the Church and therefore are looking for like-minded people who recognize the signs of the times.

Modern leaders seem reticent to offer the voice of warning regarding impending doom. The voice of warning from the pulpit seems to be ever so subtle if not virtually non-existent with regard to an impending calamity.

In addition to being silent about warning people of any impending doom, leaders of the church have indicated that the writings and claims of these women should be considered to be “spurious” and “non-authoritative”.

In August of 2015 a memo was issued by the LDS Church Seminary and Institute Department titled “Spurious Materials in Circulation“.

This memo is updated periodically to clarify statements given by General Authorities, halt rumors about Church policies, or list books that were being used inappropriately in the classroom. Julie’s book fell into the last category.

Here is the actual statement:

Publication Caution: A Greater Tomorrow: My Journey Beyond the Veil
Additional Information: [August 31, 2015]

In 2014, Spring Creek Book Company published A Greater Tomorrow: My Journey Beyond the Veil by Julie Rowe (see shaded box for Amazon’s description of the book). Although Sister Rowe is an active member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, her book is not endorsed by the Church and should not be recommended to students or used as a resource in teaching them. The experiences she shares are her own personal experiences and do not necessarily reflect Church doctrine or they may distort Church doctrine.

A statement from the publisher of Julie Rowe’s book can be seen here.

Julie has since come out with the following statement:

“I agree that the Curriculum for LDS Church classes should only come from sources recognized by the LDS Church as being authoritative. My story is not intended to be authoritative nor to create any Church doctrine. It is simply part of my personal journey that I have chosen to share in hopes that it can help people to prepare for the times we live in by increasing their faith in Christ and by looking to our Prophet and Church leaders for guidance.”

— Julie Rowe
According to one online commenter, their Stake President spoke with General Authorities regarding the claims of Julie Rowe and made the following statement:

“While I do not want to publicly disparage anyone for their personal belief and inspirations, read Jeremiah 23:32. I have been told by leadership that this is the case with Julie Rowe.

“Behold, I am against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the Lord, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness; yet I sent them not, nor commanded them: therefore they shall not profit this people at all, saith the Lord.” Jeremiah 23:32:

It will be interesting to watch those that call themselves the remnant as the momentum builds and as we approach the end of the year.

Although I do not share their belief that you can ascend into heaven and claim the highest gospel blessings in a face to face relationship with the Lord until you have repented, entered into consecration and kept the full law of the gospel, I think their passion and sincerity in looking forth for the signs of the coming of the Son of Man set them apart from most Mormons.

One major question yet to be answered is whether the preppers will ultimately become a front for the Snufferite movement.

Another is will the preppers eventually depart from the main body of the church when they are gathered out.

It is very possible that they will simply remain in full membership and facilitate in preparing other Latter day Saint Jews for the gathering out when that time comes.

Regardless, I acknowledge their legitimacy as a latter day tribal entity.

I believe that they are fulfilling prophecy and that when the calamities do hit, they will probably be a huge catalyst with a huge effect upon others, regardless of how things play out.

I believe God loves them as a remnant of his people and my hope is that God will ultimately redeem them even if they must go through pain as a collective body of believers.

Section 45 informs us that at the time of Christ’s return in glory, these Jews will finally accept the truth. Because of this, they will abide the day of the Lord.

Praise God for his goodness and mercy.

Comments Off on Those Among the Gentiles Go To Zion. Those Among Judah Go To Jer-USA-lem. | Uncategorized | Permalink
Posted by onewhoiswatching
https://onewhoiswatching.wordpress.com/

We know that the Snuffer Remnant already know they are being led away from the LDS church by Snuffer, but what is concerning to me is this second 'Remnant' and some of the claims that this blogger is making. This 'Remnant' is made up loosely of Preppers, AVOW people, Julie Rowe followers, probably some of the posters on the forum who listen to Shelle McDermott and Mike Stroud, a man he calls the 'Denver Snuffer' of active LDS.
What concerns me is the connection he is making between Mike Stroud and Snufferism. He claims that Stroud says he's receiving his information from 'a holy man' but who knows who this is? He suspects it's Denver Snuffer or one of Snuffer's followers. He also claims that he knows of prominent people among the Prepper groups who are secretly involved with Snufferism.

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inho
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by inho »

Prepping and AVOW were mentioned in the recent MormonLeaks about Snufferites. That was critized, but this "two remnants" theory explains the confusion.

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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by inho »

This is from Mike Stroud's podcast (episode 22 The Remnant):
Student: A question.
Mike: Okay!
Student: The group that is following Denver Snuffer, they think that group.
Mike: Well there may be some that are
Student: How could they? How could they since they are apostatizing?
Mike: I don't know. I don't know what the Lord is going to do there. I know some of those people. I
know that they're good people. I know that they are honorable people and their hearts are in the right
place. Whether or not they have been deceived, and whether their doctrine is false, that is something
between them and the Lord. But, I know some of those people personally and they are fine, fine, good
people... and they have strong faith.

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AI2.0
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by AI2.0 »

inho wrote: September 12th, 2017, 10:36 am Prepping and AVOW were mentioned in the recent MormonLeaks about Snufferites. That was critized, but this "two remnants" theory explains the confusion.
I think also, it's because up until recently, it seemed that the AVOW people were firmly and strongly against The Snuffer Remnant, they consider themselves loyal to the church, active. There was some postings from AVOW where it seemed some were slightly sympathetic to some Snuffer teachings. It could be that onewhoiswatching may be right that there are some within that group that are being seduced by some Snuffer teachings--he says they claim the church will not warn the members, but allow them to be victims of the calamities to come. That's a pretty jaded view of church leaders IMO. They may be more open to viewing the church as part of the problem, as the Snuffer followers have.

I have not heard of Mike Stroud, but it sounds like he's a pretty influential person within the Prepper movement. I don't know if he is associated with AVOW--I'm going to have to do some research on him when I have some time.

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inho
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by inho »

Mike Stroud is popular among the fans of Michelle McDermott (No Fear Preps).

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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by inho »

I finally read through the whole quotation frome onewhoiswatching. He also mentions Val Brinkerhoff. I have noticed that there are people in both remnants who like his writings. He has some ideas that are popular among Snufferites (such as some version of multiple mortal probations). Another name who too is popular among both remnants is John P. Pratt, who appeared in the recent Snufferite conference.

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mirkwood
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by mirkwood »

I've read a couple transcripts of Stroud's podcasts, literally, two or maybe three, so not many. In them I saw him using Remnant language we have seen before.

I sent this on to another person who is listening to Stroud's podcasts. I see some concerning red flags with him and stopped reading his stuff very quickly.

Guys, I am the first to admit that I am not the sharpest tool in the shed. So if I can pick up on these doctrinal inconsistencies and darn right deceptions, how in the world is this man fooling the masses???

Let's take one of his newest podcasts for example.

He starts out this podcast talking about familiar spirits. He walks you through the scriptures and correctly defines familiar spirits and even correctly links them to wizards, idols, charmers, and abominations.

Mike Stroud said:

"Can you see that this term “familiar spirits” is not listed with anything that is godly or is from light sources. It is always ungodly and has to do with dark sources""

We all agree with this right???

Mike Stroud is actually teaching a truth about familiar spirits. They are from dark and evil sources. He even correctly identifies them as an abomination.

Then he starts teaching a contradiction:

He said:

"I wondered why they are called familiar spirits. I found out they are called that because the word “familiar” is tied to the word “family.” So whenever we are dealing with dark familiar spirits, you are dealing with your own family, ancestry. These are men and women in your ancestry who plague and a curse their posterity. That’s the key you want to dial in on.".

So first he says familiar spirits are from dark sources and an abomination and then in the very next paragraph he is identifying them as your ancestors!!! Your family members and familiar just really means family.

You can't make this up people!!!!

But it gets worse. He then shares a spiritual experience of a man who he does not identify. This man shares an experience of healing his wife by going through a portal to the spirit world and meeting the familiar spirit of his wife's ancestor who is suffering from pain and anguish and cursing his wife which causes her to experience migraines.

"As I was taught this principle, I was also taught some other things by the Spirit. And that’s this: these spirits that are your ancestors, who are dark spirits, and they come in every grade that you can imagine. Some of them are murderous and malevolent, and some, degrees less than that"...

As he relates this tall tale, he actually tries to convince you that this story is filled with "doctrinal insights".

Just ignore the fact that there is absolutely nothing in the scriptures to back up this man's visit to the spiritual realm through portals where he blesses and teaches this "familiar spirit" who he earlier called an abomination and from ungodly and dark sources and is now the great great great... grandmother of his wife who just needs to be taught the gospel and accept the atonement.

K let's continue through this maze of bull crap.

Mike says:

"I want to share with you a story, an experience that a man shared with me that’s just marvelous. I have been given permission to share this with you and we will put it in Dropbox so you can look at it. This is so filled with doctrinal insights. And this man also shared with me a principle called “Revelatory Triggers.”
And this document is so filled with that. The names have been changed, obviously, because this is taken from his personal journal dated February 20, 2017.

So Mike actually wants you to believe this man's experience is filled with doctrinal insights as he just makes up a new gospel principle found no where in scripture called "revelatory triggers".

You will have to read this experience here. I read it out loud to my husband and at first we laughed because it almost sounded like it was made up and unbelievable. then we actually experienced a little bit of sadness knowing how deceived this man is and that he has the attention of thousands and thousands of Latter Day Saints .

In another one I was reading he talks about a guy...here let me just post what he said:
I know a man who was concerned about the dark side using scriptural references and prophetic utterances in order to move forward their agenda of deception, captivity and enslavement. They were using the very thing that the sons and daughters of God were using to promote and advance the cause of God in Zion.


This man was concerned because he observed many of our Brothers and Sisters being sucked into these false movements that were talking about the establishment of Zion, translation and different things like that. And as he stood in the presence of Father, he expressed his concern about this deception.


The interesting thing that I found out was that Father quoted to this man a scripture found in the Book of Mormon.

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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by lyanne7 »

A WORD OF WARNING....
After much research, talking to someone who used to know the former Mike Stroud, talking to priesthood leaders after a scary possession episode. I am going to implore true humble LDS Saints of who i pray are still in the majority on this site to AVOID LIKE POISON (words from church leadership) the writings of Mike Stroud and these so called Quorum blessings that are being done at these prepper camps.

1) I want you to read Jacob chapter 4 focus on versus 14 and 15 to understand what is happening with these people that are "Looking beyond the mark".

2) So called Quorum blessing are not ordained, taught nor done by the brethren. If this style of blessing was to be used it would be taught by one with the keys to do so. I have spoken and the church authorities are now investigating this. It is a man made falsehood, but it is more dangerous than you realize.

3) Because it is not sanctioned, I have it on eye witness that they are not rebuking evil spiritual possession but opening a portal for that person to be possessed. I have seen in my friends that have participated in this that they have more than one person in them, there eyes are darkened, the light is gone. They say all the right things but the spirit is gone and their eyes show a darkness. There were many at this last Prepare a people conference, who had also participated in these AVOW camps who had done this blessing. I walked around and saw the blindness in there eyes.

4) Mike Stroud (read Jacob chapter 4 verse 14 to the end) to understand why and how Mike has gone off the path. His podcasts and writing are like poison please avoid it.

WHY DO I IMPLORE YOU????? A friend brought over a printout of his podcasts for me because he knew I was researching it. I left it on the couch, the spirit kept telling me to put it away, but I began to struggle with a spirit of confusion all that day. I had to leave and my teenage daughter sat down as i was leaving and placed her hand on the binder. I instantly felt a fear through this haze and said "Don't touch that". I wanted to then put it away and tell her not to read it, but all of a sudden other family came into the room, i was hit with a panic attack and focused on rushing out the door in haste.
Later i get a call from my husband. My daughter is in hysterics, crying, ranting, saying she is possessed, afraid feeling ashamed I wont believe her. I rush home and discover she read those damn articles of Mike Stroud, all of them! She said she felt like an addict and couldn't stop. We had to get the Bishop and Elders quorum president over to give her a blessing. His work opens a doorway to let these evil spirits in.
I have a friend who is a counselor and has worked with the church with survivor of Satanic ritual abuse. The Church has special missionaries who deal with rebuking possessions..this is not for us to play with.
The Gospel is simple, plain, perfect and true. An adulterous nation seeketh after signs....
You must learn now to tell the difference between the sweet quiet peace of the Holy Ghost or the titillating emotional highs of Satan
These groups are wrong in what they are doing..... ZION is here right now in our hearts in our stakes in the good ship ZION. These groups even though they say they follow the prophet they do not. AVOW, Prepare a People groups, Chad Daybell (UGH!!!_) Julie Rowe etc they talk like the Zoramites...how they are so :awake:!!!! "Thank you God that we are not like the general membership of the church" "Thank you God that we know we are of the 144,000" Boasting all the day long talking about seperation from the body of the church. As my Bishop so clearly put it..."They are literally spiritually killing the prophet"

Brothers and sisters on this site, it is enough!!!!! repent of any thoughts, arrogance, high mindness.....come back to the plain and simple things...READ your scriptures, Pray daily, live your callings, be one with the Saints in the designated ward setting and programs of the church...please cease going to these non approved by the church spiritual and prepper fairs...
Please you are the elect being deceived right now!!!!!!!!!!!!

Love your sister in Christ, may God take the blinders of your eyes and the spirit pierce the wall around your heart
In the sacred name of Jesus Christ

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inho
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by inho »

lyanne7 wrote: September 12th, 2017, 10:50 pm 2) So called Quorum blessing are not ordained, taught nor done by the brethren. If this style of blessing was to be used it would be taught by one with the keys to do so. I have spoken and the church authorities are now investigating this. It is a man made falsehood, but it is more dangerous than you realize.
I haven't heard of "quorum blessings" before. What are they? That definitely sounds like a red flag.

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kittycat51
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by kittycat51 »

lyanne7 wrote: September 12th, 2017, 10:50 pm A WORD OF WARNING....
After much research, talking to someone who used to know the former Mike Stroud, talking to priesthood leaders after a scary possession episode. I am going to implore true humble LDS Saints of who i pray are still in the majority on this site to AVOID LIKE POISON (words from church leadership) the writings of Mike Stroud and these so called Quorum blessings that are being done at these prepper camps.

1) I want you to read Jacob chapter 4 focus on versus 14 and 15 to understand what is happening with these people that are "Looking beyond the mark".

2) So called Quorum blessing are not ordained, taught nor done by the brethren. If this style of blessing was to be used it would be taught by one with the keys to do so. I have spoken and the church authorities are now investigating this. It is a man made falsehood, but it is more dangerous than you realize.

3) Because it is not sanctioned, I have it on eye witness that they are not rebuking evil spiritual possession but opening a portal for that person to be possessed. I have seen in my friends that have participated in this that they have more than one person in them, there eyes are darkened, the light is gone. They say all the right things but the spirit is gone and their eyes show a darkness. There were many at this last Prepare a people conference, who had also participated in these AVOW camps who had done this blessing. I walked around and saw the blindness in there eyes.

4) Mike Stroud (read Jacob chapter 4 verse 14 to the end) to understand why and how Mike has gone off the path. His podcasts and writing are like poison please avoid it.

WHY DO I IMPLORE YOU????? A friend brought over a printout of his podcasts for me because he knew I was researching it. I left it on the couch, the spirit kept telling me to put it away, but I began to struggle with a spirit of confusion all that day. I had to leave and my teenage daughter sat down as i was leaving and placed her hand on the binder. I instantly felt a fear through this haze and said "Don't touch that". I wanted to then put it away and tell her not to read it, but all of a sudden other family came into the room, i was hit with a panic attack and focused on rushing out the door in haste.
Later i get a call from my husband. My daughter is in hysterics, crying, ranting, saying she is possessed, afraid feeling ashamed I wont believe her. I rush home and discover she read those damn articles of Mike Stroud, all of them! She said she felt like an addict and couldn't stop. We had to get the Bishop and Elders quorum president over to give her a blessing. His work opens a doorway to let these evil spirits in.
I have a friend who is a counselor and has worked with the church with survivor of Satanic ritual abuse. The Church has special missionaries who deal with rebuking possessions..this is not for us to play with.
The Gospel is simple, plain, perfect and true. An adulterous nation seeketh after signs....
You must learn now to tell the difference between the sweet quiet peace of the Holy Ghost or the titillating emotional highs of Satan
These groups are wrong in what they are doing..... ZION is here right now in our hearts in our stakes in the good ship ZION. These groups even though they say they follow the prophet they do not. AVOW, Prepare a People groups, Chad Daybell (UGH!!!_) Julie Rowe etc they talk like the Zoramites...how they are so :awake:!!!! "Thank you God that we are not like the general membership of the church" "Thank you God that we know we are of the 144,000" Boasting all the day long talking about seperation from the body of the church. As my Bishop so clearly put it..."They are literally spiritually killing the prophet"

Brothers and sisters on this site, it is enough!!!!! repent of any thoughts, arrogance, high mindness.....come back to the plain and simple things...READ your scriptures, Pray daily, live your callings, be one with the Saints in the designated ward setting and programs of the church...please cease going to these non approved by the church spiritual and prepper fairs...
Please you are the elect being deceived right now!!!!!!!!!!!!

Love your sister in Christ, may God take the blinders of your eyes and the spirit pierce the wall around your heart
In the sacred name of Jesus Christ
AMEN! (Thank you for your post!)

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AI2.0
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by AI2.0 »

lyanne7 wrote: September 12th, 2017, 10:50 pm A WORD OF WARNING....
After much research, talking to someone who used to know the former Mike Stroud, talking to priesthood leaders after a scary possession episode. I am going to implore true humble LDS Saints of who i pray are still in the majority on this site to AVOID LIKE POISON (words from church leadership) the writings of Mike Stroud and these so called Quorum blessings that are being done at these prepper camps.

1) I want you to read Jacob chapter 4 focus on versus 14 and 15 to understand what is happening with these people that are "Looking beyond the mark".

2) So called Quorum blessing are not ordained, taught nor done by the brethren. If this style of blessing was to be used it would be taught by one with the keys to do so. I have spoken and the church authorities are now investigating this. It is a man made falsehood, but it is more dangerous than you realize.

3) Because it is not sanctioned, I have it on eye witness that they are not rebuking evil spiritual possession but opening a portal for that person to be possessed. I have seen in my friends that have participated in this that they have more than one person in them, there eyes are darkened, the light is gone. They say all the right things but the spirit is gone and their eyes show a darkness. There were many at this last Prepare a people conference, who had also participated in these AVOW camps who had done this blessing. I walked around and saw the blindness in there eyes.

4) Mike Stroud (read Jacob chapter 4 verse 14 to the end) to understand why and how Mike has gone off the path. His podcasts and writing are like poison please avoid it.

WHY DO I IMPLORE YOU????? A friend brought over a printout of his podcasts for me because he knew I was researching it. I left it on the couch, the spirit kept telling me to put it away, but I began to struggle with a spirit of confusion all that day. I had to leave and my teenage daughter sat down as i was leaving and placed her hand on the binder. I instantly felt a fear through this haze and said "Don't touch that". I wanted to then put it away and tell her not to read it, but all of a sudden other family came into the room, i was hit with a panic attack and focused on rushing out the door in haste.
Later i get a call from my husband. My daughter is in hysterics, crying, ranting, saying she is possessed, afraid feeling ashamed I wont believe her. I rush home and discover she read those damn articles of Mike Stroud, all of them! She said she felt like an addict and couldn't stop. We had to get the Bishop and Elders quorum president over to give her a blessing. His work opens a doorway to let these evil spirits in.
I have a friend who is a counselor and has worked with the church with survivor of Satanic ritual abuse. The Church has special missionaries who deal with rebuking possessions..this is not for us to play with.
The Gospel is simple, plain, perfect and true. An adulterous nation seeketh after signs....
You must learn now to tell the difference between the sweet quiet peace of the Holy Ghost or the titillating emotional highs of Satan
These groups are wrong in what they are doing..... ZION is here right now in our hearts in our stakes in the good ship ZION. These groups even though they say they follow the prophet they do not. AVOW, Prepare a People groups, Chad Daybell (UGH!!!_) Julie Rowe etc they talk like the Zoramites...how they are so :awake:!!!! "Thank you God that we are not like the general membership of the church" "Thank you God that we know we are of the 144,000" Boasting all the day long talking about seperation from the body of the church. As my Bishop so clearly put it..."They are literally spiritually killing the prophet"

Brothers and sisters on this site, it is enough!!!!! repent of any thoughts, arrogance, high mindness.....come back to the plain and simple things...READ your scriptures, Pray daily, live your callings, be one with the Saints in the designated ward setting and programs of the church...please cease going to these non approved by the church spiritual and prepper fairs...
Please you are the elect being deceived right now!!!!!!!!!!!!

Love your sister in Christ, may God take the blinders of your eyes and the spirit pierce the wall around your heart
In the sacred name of Jesus Christ
I'm also not familiar with these 'Quorum blessings' which you mention and I'm not familiar with AVOW camps, but I have an idea. From the blog I posted, he mentioned that some of the preppers go out together to camp as a sort of trial run, I guess, to practice living out in the woods. The belief that they will be called to live in tent cities is still very strong with these groups, it seems.

Thank you for your warning--I hope if there are any among us involved with these groups, they will consider what you've said and I agree, I've also felt that some of these groups remind me of the Zoramites--they feel they are the 'elect'--they are enlightened and 'awake' to what's happening around them and they think this makes them special.

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AI2.0
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by AI2.0 »

LDS Anarchist wrote: September 12th, 2017, 5:38 pm I am only familiar with OWIW (One Who Is Watching) and not any of the other people he mentions. OWIW used to contribute to the LDS Anarchy blog. The link to OWIW's original blog post can be found here:

Those Among the Gentiles Go To Zion. Those Among Judah Go To Jer-USA-lem.
https://onewhoiswatching.wordpress.com/ ... jerusalem/

OWIW looks upon the scriptures and prophecies as "cryptic" with hidden, "mystical" messages that need to be decoded. He does extensive key word searches and digs deep on everything he looks at, keeping records of everything he finds, trying to find the hidden meaning in all things. He is no longer Mormon and believes the church was rejected long ago (during the time of Joseph Smith.) I think he may have resigned from the church. (He can correct me if I'm wrong.)

His doctrine is his own and he never makes any claims to have gotten any knowledge by the gift of the word of knowledge. Everything he states is always just couched as his belief, which he sincerely believes is correct, until it is proven wrong. Then he will alter things a bit and give a modified teaching. So, he is quite literally fulfilling 2 Timothy 3:7.
Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
There are people who believe that what he teaches is truth, but it is the dog endlessly chasing the tail. A ton of cryptic teachings which he must decode for you by his keyword searches, and that you must believe, in order for you to understand any of it.

I both claim to have, and actually do have, the gift of the word of knowledge, and so whatever he teaches that contradicts my own teachings by that gift, is false. I don't go around stating, "This is just my belief. I may be wrong about this." I will give my understanding of things, and that may be erroneous. But when I give a manifested understanding of things, that ain't belief. That is a fact, a truth. And I will teach it as a truth. As a result, OWIW and I have sometimes clashed. I am firm in my beliefs, and so is he, but whereas I say my stuff is manifested (for the stuff that is manifested), he says his stuff is just his diligent searching, that is possibly true. He doesn't believe I have the gifts I profess to have, for he doesn't believe that anyone today has any spiritual gifts.

That said, due to his diligence in researching things, despite no perceived gift of the word of knowledge in him, nor any perceived spirit of prophecy in hiim--for I cannot perceive any of these things in him--sometimes he does stumble across a gem or two of truth. It almost cannot be helped. When you dig through piles of stuff, certainly you must find something of value.

So, if he has looked into the remnant movement, and I know he has, for he has researched Denver Snuffer extensively, because he believes he is a false prophet--but then he also likely believes I am a false prophet, and I most certainly am not, therefore his assessments are way off--then the information he comes up with is usually reliable. His interpretations of that information is not always reliable, but his research is always extensive, and thus is worth a looksie, for the information, not necessarily for his interpretation of that information.

Btw, his wife goes by One Who Is Searching and also runs a blog:

One Who Is Searching
https://onewhoissearching.com/
Interesting that he used to contribute to your blog, was this before he left the church?

I believe I read where he admitted that none of the things he's predicted have come true--he'd be in good company on this forum as we have tons of posters who predict things that never happen. But, as you say, he doesn't claim any special insights, whereas many on this forum say they believe they have revelatory dreams and visions, yet they are wrong. Personally, I take most of these claims with a big grain of salt.

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Jesef
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by Jesef »

LDS Anarchist, you said:
I both claim to have, and actually do have, the gift of the word of knowledge, and so whatever he teaches that contradicts my own teachings by that gift, is false. I don't go around stating, "This is just my belief. I may be wrong about this." I will give my understanding of things, and that may be erroneous. But when I give a manifested understanding of things, that ain't belief. That is a fact, a truth. And I will teach it as a truth.
Can you list some of your manifested understandings/facts/truths that you've received, maybe call out which have already been proven and which are yet to be proven?

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Jesef
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by Jesef »

Obviously, reading your entire blog is one way to get the answer to my question. Perhaps you would be willing to start a thread that lists your manifested understandings/truths/facts, kind of briefly, concisely, including which ones have been fulfilled, and if you have expounded upon those further on your blog, link to them so people can read the entire articles. This would give a place on LDSFF that consolidates a lot of your stuff so you don't have to repeat yourself, but also saves LDSFF from having to read your entire blog. Or put it as an index/summary/title page on your blog. My point is, listing what has been manifested to you in sort of an index or table format would be very cool. I'm already searching your blog/site using Google search:
"manifested" or "revealed" site:https://ldsanarchy.wordpress.com

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Jesef
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by Jesef »

Ha, ha, I'm totally lazy too. I might consolidate what I've been able to easily glean from Google searching your website/blog though, and maybe I'll start a thread, probably in the "fullness of the gospel" subforum listing them briefly like I described. You can comment or clarify there as you like and make sure I don't misrepresent anything.

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Summerwind
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by Summerwind »

Interesting. I know Mike Stroud quite well. I think a lot of people like to use his recorded classes as some kind of movement... although in asking him about that he said that's not at all the reason he was posting them.

I've heard a few seriously die hard very nasty people say Mike Stroud is apostate, but that couldn't be further from the truth. I haven't listened to all of his stuff, but I have only found 1 reference in 18 podcasts that had a denver snuffer reference, and it was really a reference to something doctrinal that denver happened to have also mentioned. Otherwise he notes his opinion, and gives his references on everything he teaches. So while some have decided to dive head first into ONLY Mike Stroud, and others have decided to vilify him - neither view squares with the man I know personally and who was my seminary teacher, and remains a good friend of my family.


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Summerwind
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by Summerwind »

I came to my own conclusions on my own because I happen to know the man personally - do you? In any case, he isn't forming any remnant group. There may be groups that use his stuff, but he's not interested in forming some remnant group himself.

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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by EmmaLee »

Summerwind wrote: September 23rd, 2017, 10:44 am
I came to my own conclusions on my own because I happen to know the man personally - do you? In any case, he isn't forming any remnant group. There may be groups that use his stuff, but he's not interested in forming some remnant group himself.
What about my post (other than it happened to come after yours, because I just now saw this thread for the first time) made you think I was talking to you? If I was commenting specifically TO YOU, I would have quoted YOU. My post was directed to the several others in this thread who are asking questions about Stroud. No, I don't know him personally - I don't know Snuffer personally either. Do you? Do you know Julie Rowe personally? Because you sure talk a lot about her on LDSFF, giving your opinions of her left and right.

I've listened to Stroud, and read his OWN words (not the words of someone who knows him, but HIS words), and the conclusion I personally have come to is that he is basically no different than Snuffer, Rowe, et al. All of these fringe types will fall away eventually (some may come back, you never know), and will take many members with them down that road. It's sad that so many LDS people are so incredibly bored with their religion that they have to go seek titillating and ear-tingling "doctrines" to excite them and make them feel alive - or worse, make them feel important and that they are somehow "special" or "know more" than the "milk-drinking" members.

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AI2.0
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by AI2.0 »

Summerwind wrote: September 18th, 2017, 5:01 pm Interesting. I know Mike Stroud quite well. I think a lot of people like to use his recorded classes as some kind of movement... although in asking him about that he said that's not at all the reason he was posting them.

I've heard a few seriously die hard very nasty people say Mike Stroud is apostate, but that couldn't be further from the truth. I haven't listened to all of his stuff, but I have only found 1 reference in 18 podcasts that had a denver snuffer reference, and it was really a reference to something doctrinal that denver happened to have also mentioned. Otherwise he notes his opinion, and gives his references on everything he teaches. So while some have decided to dive head first into ONLY Mike Stroud, and others have decided to vilify him - neither view squares with the man I know personally and who was my seminary teacher, and remains a good friend of my family.

Thanks for sharing your personal insights on this. I think we should take note that several people were listed as being influential with these two remnant groups; one being Pres. Ezra Taft Benson. I think these groups read and listen to those who discuss topics they are interested in. And, I think we do not want a witch hunt.

I haven't read or listened to his stuff, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. We have a negative view posted by lyanne and then we have your positive portrayal, so it's clear this is not cut and dried.

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Arenera
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by Arenera »

AI2.0 wrote: September 23rd, 2017, 3:00 pm
Summerwind wrote: September 18th, 2017, 5:01 pm Interesting. I know Mike Stroud quite well. I think a lot of people like to use his recorded classes as some kind of movement... although in asking him about that he said that's not at all the reason he was posting them.

I've heard a few seriously die hard very nasty people say Mike Stroud is apostate, but that couldn't be further from the truth. I haven't listened to all of his stuff, but I have only found 1 reference in 18 podcasts that had a denver snuffer reference, and it was really a reference to something doctrinal that denver happened to have also mentioned. Otherwise he notes his opinion, and gives his references on everything he teaches. So while some have decided to dive head first into ONLY Mike Stroud, and others have decided to vilify him - neither view squares with the man I know personally and who was my seminary teacher, and remains a good friend of my family.

Thanks for sharing your personal insights on this. I think we should take note that several people were listed as being influential with these two remnant groups; one being Pres. Ezra Taft Benson. I think these groups read and listen to those who discuss topics they are interested in. And, I think we do not want a witch hunt.

I haven't read or listened to his stuff, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. We have a negative view posted by lyanne and then we have your positive portrayal, so it's clear this is not cut and dried.
I haven't listened to or read anything to cause concern with Mike Stroud. He believes the spiritual experiences in the Book of Mormon are individually attainable in life, like Baptism of Fire, receiving Angels, receiving the Second Comforter.

Since Mormons don't discuss these, except at LDSFF, some think Stroud is fringe. I think Stroud has awakened to the "higher levels" in the Book of Mormon

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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by braingrunt »

I listened to some Mike Stroud in the past.
I concluded he had gone terribly wrong.

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Summerwind
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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by Summerwind »

Actually Joseph Smith taught all of those topics.. baptism of Fire (also found in scripture), receiving angels and being taught by them (ministering of angels), and receiving the second comforter (also spoken of in scripture).

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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by gardener4life »

If anyone wants to know what's going to happen in the last days they can find it all in the scriptures. Isaiah, the D&C, the Book of Mormon, and many other chapters. We don't need to follow anyone but the prophet. People don't like the idea of people saying to follow the prophet. But Christ himself said upon this rock I will build my church (referring to Peter as his leading authority after him). Also Christ set apart 12 among the Nephites, and commanded them to teach lead, and baptize the people.

We just need to try to understand what we've been given already, not abandon it for some butterflies on the way side.

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Re: 'Onewhoiswatching' claims Two different 'Remnant Groups'

Post by Zathura »

I’ve been introduced to Mike Stroud today, and read through the transcripts of 3 of his podcasts. I listened to his last podcast which was only like 8 minutes.

He isn’t Denver Snuffer. I don’t fault him for learning from Snuffer of 10 years ago, Snuffer was very pro church. He doesn’t seem to support Snuffer now. His last podcast he admits that he talked about certain sacred things, his own opinion, and that his loving church leaders counseled him in the correct way, and he would do the same thing in their shoes. He asked forgiveness for what he had done. ‘

He obviously spoke his own opinion on some things, but from what i’ve Gathered so far, he’s a true Christian. A true follower of Jesus Christ. When he was chastised, he did not respond in anger, but in humility. I can’t say I would have done the same without much irritation and murmuring.

What he has said about the Holy Spirit, Holy Ghost, Baptism of fire and Holy Ghost is true. I share his sentiment that the primary reason so many people are not retained and leave church is because they were never born of God to begin with. Sometimes that’s because they never had real intent from the start, but usually it’s because they think they have something they don’t actually have. They aren’t going to seek something they think they already have. Without this conversion to Jesus Christ, they have no real anchor, and silly tenets and historical facts eat away at their faulty foundation and they leave, never having a firm understanding and knowledge of Jesus Christ.

After pondering the words and observing Julie Rowe, Hector, the “remnants”, and the followers of those people over the past few years, I think it’s all nonsense. I don’t know where they went wrong, but they took a risk and I believe they made a mistake.I think they make valid points, some of which are factual, others are opinions that I also believe, but in general I see what they teach in their blogs and forums and I don’t see truth. In trying to escape one “strongman”, they just began following another. Others truly itch for anything pleasing to them. I wonder how long that will last.

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