Is the Sacrament to Renew Baptismal Covenants? (GD)

[Jeremy]

Is the Sacrament to Renew Baptismal Covenants?

I have often considered the sacrament to be a renewal of baptismal covenants. Many of us have been taught this principle. Here is just one example of that principle being taught:

After baptism we show our faith by keeping our covenant. We also regularly renew the covenant we make when baptized by partaking of the sacrament. Partaking of the sacrament weekly is a commandment. It helps us remain worthy to have the Spirit with us always.

renew:

• to begin or take up again, as an acquaintance, a conversation, etc.; resume
• to make effective for an additional period
• to restore or replenish
• to renew a stock of goods
• to make, say, or do again
• to revive; reestablish
• to recover
• to restore to a former state; make new or as if new again

The nature of a covenant is an agreement such that all participants accept some portion of responsibility. In the case of baptism and the sacrament, an agreement is being made between an individual and God. This means that the individual is responsible for one portion and heaven is responsible for the other.

To renew one of these covenants, both parties would need to renew their portion. It would probably be helpful to highlight the individuals responsibility as well as heavens responsibility expressed in each ordinance.

The covenants of baptism: [individual] [heaven]

And he also said unto him: If thou wilt turn unto me, and hearken unto my voice, and believe, and repent of all thy transgressions, and be baptized, even in water, in the name of mine Only Begotten Son, who is full of grace and truth, which is Jesus Christ, the only name which shall be given under heaven, whereby salvation shall come unto the children of men, ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, asking all things in his name, and whatsoever ye shall ask, it shall be given you.

Now I say unto you, if this be the desire of your hearts, what have you against being baptized in the name of the Lord, as a witness before him that ye have entered into a covenant with him, that ye will serve him and keep his commandments, that he may pour out his Spirit more abundantly upon you?

And when he had said these words, the Spirit of the Lord was upon him, and he said: Helam, I baptize thee, having authority from the Almighty God, as a testimony that ye have entered into a covenant to serve him until you are dead as to the mortal body; and may the Spirit of the Lord be poured out upon you; and may he grant unto you eternal life, through the redemption of Christ, whom he has prepared from the foundation of the world.

Wherefore, my beloved brethren, I know that if ye shall follow the Son, with full purpose of heart, acting no hypocrisy and no deception before God, but with real intent, repenting of your sins, witnessing unto the Father that ye are willing to take upon you the name of Christ, by baptism—yea, by following your Lord and your Savior down into the water, according to his word, behold, then shall ye receive the Holy Ghost; yea, then cometh the baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost; and then can ye speak with the tongue of angels, and shout praises unto the Holy One of Israel.

Wherefore, do the things which I have told you I have seen that your Lord and your Redeemer should do; for, for this cause have they been shown unto me, that ye might know the gate by which ye should enter. For the gate by which ye should enter is repentance and baptism by water; and then cometh a remission of your sins by fire and by the Holy Ghost.

The covenants of the sacrament: [individual] [heaven]

And when the multitude had eaten and were filled, he said unto the disciples: Behold there shall one be ordained among you, and to him will I give power that he shall break bread and bless it and give it unto the people of my church, unto all those who shall believe and be baptized in my name.

And this shall ye do in remembrance of my body, which I have shown unto you. And it shall be a testimony unto the Father that ye do always remember me. And if ye do always remember me ye shall have my Spirit to be with you.

And when the disciples had done this, Jesus said unto them: Blessed are ye for this thing which ye have done, for this is fulfilling my commandments, and this doth witness unto the Father that ye are willing to do that which I have commanded you.

And this shall ye always do to those who repent and are baptized in my name; and ye shall do it in remembrance of my blood, which I have shed for you, that ye may witness unto the Father that ye do always remember me. And if ye do always remember me ye shall have my Spirit to be with you.

O God, the Eternal Father, we ask thee in the name of thy Son, Jesus Christ, to bless and sanctify this bread to the souls of all those who partake of it; that they may eat in remembrance of the body of thy Son, and witness unto thee, O God, the Eternal Father, that they are willing to take upon them the name of thy Son, and always remember him, and keep his commandments which he hath given them, that they may always have his Spirit to be with them. Amen.

O God, the Eternal Father, we ask thee, in the name of thy Son, Jesus Christ, to bless and sanctify this wine to the souls of all those who drink of it, that they may do it in remembrance of the blood of thy Son, which was shed for them; that they may witness unto thee, O God, the Eternal Father, that they do always remember him, that they may have his Spirit to be with them. Amen.

Who Can Be Baptized:

And now I speak concerning baptism. Behold, elders, priests, and teachers were baptized; and they were not baptized save they brought forth fruit meet that they were worthy of it.

One must be worthy of baptism?! What qualifies one to be worthy of this ordinance?

Neither did they receive any unto baptism save they came forth with a broken heart and a contrite spirit, and witnessed unto the church that they truly repented of all their sins.

To be worthy of baptism does not mean an individual is cleansed. It means they have repented (even if they are yet to receive the blessings offered through repentance).

And after they had been received unto baptism, and were wrought upon and cleansed by the power of the Holy Ghost...

Who Can Partake of the Sacrament:

And now behold, this is the commandment which I give unto you, that ye shall not suffer any one knowingly to partake of my flesh and blood unworthily, when ye shall minister it;

For whoso eateth and drinketh my flesh and blood unworthily eateth and drinketh damnation to his soul; therefore if ye know that a man is unworthy to eat and drink of my flesh and blood ye shall forbid him.

What does it take to be worthy of the sacrament?

Nevertheless, ye shall not cast him out from among you, but ye shall minister unto him and shall pray for him unto the Father, in my name; and if it so be that he repenteth and is baptized in my name, then shall ye receive him, and shall minister unto him of my flesh and blood.

It seems that the requirements that qualify one as worthy are different between baptism and the sacrament.

To be worthy of baptism requires a broken heart and a contrite spirit. It requires believing and repenting. When these requirements are met, then the individual is cleansed.

To be worthy of partaking of the sacrament requires that baptism has been completed.

If the requirements to participate in two separate ordinances are different, is it really a renewal of the same covenant?

Are the responsibilities of the individual in the covenants made at baptism the same as those made during the sacrament?

Are the responsibilities of heaven in the covenants made at baptism the same as those made during the sacrament?

If one party is taking upon them different responsibilities between the two ordinances, is it really a renewal of the same covenant?

Is there a difference between "he may pour out his Spirit more abundantly upon you" and "always have his Spirit to be with them"?

If the sacrament is not a renewal of baptismal covenants, what is it that heaven offers different than what is offered at baptism?

[Jeremy]

Both baptism and the sacrament have two parts.

Baptism consists of the baptism of water and the baptism of fire. The baptism of water is our acknowledgement, our signature if you will. It is the earthly/physical component of this ordinance. The baptism by fire is heavens acknowledgement. It is the heavenly/spiritual component of this ordinance.

The outcome is the fulfillment (being found true and faithful) of the telestial sphere. The telestial sphere contains two tokens. One representing water baptism. The second representing the fire baptism or the mighty change (the robes are changed to the other shoulder).

When we have been found true and faithful regarding these two tokens and laws we are then invited to a terrestrial sphere or law. We are now worthy of progressing and partaking of the second ordinance and covenant.

While we might have the same responsibilities in both baptism and the sacrament, heavens responsibility changes. In the terrestrial sphere we are presented with the ordinance of the sacrament. It has two parts just as baptism. One is physical. One is spiritual. One is represented by a token that is a sign. The other is a token represented by a sure sign.

When we partake of the first token in the terrestrial sphere we are witnessing our willingness to always have HIS spirit to be with us (not the Holy Ghost). The token we receive bears His name and testifies of whose spirit we receive. He takes up His abode with us to some degree. This is only the first part of the ordinance. It is only the expression of our willingness. It is only a sign.

The sure sign comes when we have finally taken His name upon us.

There is a significant difference between expressing a willingness to take upon us His name and actually doing it. To actually do it will require the second comforter. At which point a terrestrial law is fulfilled and we are presented to The Father. This is where the next ordinance and covenant is offered.

[brrgilbert]

God Bless.

[samizdat]

Is the Sacrament to Renew Baptismal Covenants?

I have often considered the sacrament to be a renewal of baptismal covenants. Many of us have been taught this principle. Here is just one example of that principle being taught:

After baptism we show our faith by keeping our covenant. We also regularly renew the covenant we make when baptized by partaking of the sacrament. Partaking of the sacrament weekly is a commandment. It helps us remain worthy to have the Spirit with us always.

renew:

• to begin or take up again, as an acquaintance, a conversation, etc.; resume
• to make effective for an additional period
• to restore or replenish
• to renew a stock of goods
• to make, say, or do again
• to revive; reestablish
• to recover
• to restore to a former state; make new or as if new again

The nature of a covenant is an agreement such that all participants accept some portion of responsibility. In the case of baptism and the sacrament, an agreement is being made between an individual and God. This means that the individual is responsible for one portion and heaven is responsible for the other.

To renew one of these covenants, both parties would need to renew their portion. It would probably be helpful to highlight the individuals responsibility as well as heavens responsibility expressed in each ordinance.

The covenants of baptism: [individual] [heaven]

And he also said unto him: If thou wilt turn unto me, and hearken unto my voice, and believe, and repent of all thy transgressions, and be baptized, even in water, in the name of mine Only Begotten Son, who is full of grace and truth, which is Jesus Christ, the only name which shall be given under heaven, whereby salvation shall come unto the children of men, ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, asking all things in his name, and whatsoever ye shall ask, it shall be given you.

Now I say unto you, if this be the desire of your hearts, what have you against being baptized in the name of the Lord, as a witness before him that ye have entered into a covenant with him, that ye will serve him and keep his commandments, that he may pour out his Spirit more abundantly upon you?

And when he had said these words, the Spirit of the Lord was upon him, and he said: Helam, I baptize thee, having authority from the Almighty God, as a testimony that ye have entered into a covenant to serve him until you are dead as to the mortal body; and may the Spirit of the Lord be poured out upon you; and may he grant unto you eternal life, through the redemption of Christ, whom he has prepared from the foundation of the world.

Wherefore, my beloved brethren, I know that if ye shall follow the Son, with full purpose of heart, acting no hypocrisy and no deception before God, but with real intent, repenting of your sins, witnessing unto the Father that ye are willing to take upon you the name of Christ, by baptism—yea, by following your Lord and your Savior down into the water, according to his word, behold, then shall ye receive the Holy Ghost; yea, then cometh the baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost; and then can ye speak with the tongue of angels, and shout praises unto the Holy One of Israel.

Wherefore, do the things which I have told you I have seen that your Lord and your Redeemer should do; for, for this cause have they been shown unto me, that ye might know the gate by which ye should enter. For the gate by which ye should enter is repentance and baptism by water; and then cometh a remission of your sins by fire and by the Holy Ghost.

The covenants of the sacrament: [individual] [heaven]

And when the multitude had eaten and were filled, he said unto the disciples: Behold there shall one be ordained among you, and to him will I give power that he shall break bread and bless it and give it unto the people of my church, unto all those who shall believe and be baptized in my name.

And this shall ye do in remembrance of my body, which I have shown unto you. And it shall be a testimony unto the Father that ye do always remember me. And if ye do always remember me ye shall have my Spirit to be with you.

And when the disciples had done this, Jesus said unto them: Blessed are ye for this thing which ye have done, for this is fulfilling my commandments, and this doth witness unto the Father that ye are willing to do that which I have commanded you.

And this shall ye always do to those who repent and are baptized in my name; and ye shall do it in remembrance of my blood, which I have shed for you, that ye may witness unto the Father that ye do always remember me. And if ye do always remember me ye shall have my Spirit to be with you.

O God, the Eternal Father, we ask thee in the name of thy Son, Jesus Christ, to bless and sanctify this bread to the souls of all those who partake of it; that they may eat in remembrance of the body of thy Son, and witness unto thee, O God, the Eternal Father, that they are willing to take upon them the name of thy Son, and always remember him, and keep his commandments which he hath given them, that they may always have his Spirit to be with them. Amen.

O God, the Eternal Father, we ask thee, in the name of thy Son, Jesus Christ, to bless and sanctify this wine to the souls of all those who drink of it, that they may do it in remembrance of the blood of thy Son, which was shed for them; that they may witness unto thee, O God, the Eternal Father, that they do always remember him, that they may have his Spirit to be with them. Amen.

Who Can Be Baptized:

And now I speak concerning baptism. Behold, elders, priests, and teachers were baptized; and they were not baptized save they brought forth fruit meet that they were worthy of it.

One must be worthy of baptism?! What qualifies one to be worthy of this ordinance?

Neither did they receive any unto baptism save they came forth with a broken heart and a contrite spirit, and witnessed unto the church that they truly repented of all their sins.

To be worthy of baptism does not mean an individual is cleansed. It means they have repented (even if they are yet to receive the blessings offered through repentance).

And after they had been received unto baptism, and were wrought upon and cleansed by the power of the Holy Ghost...

Who Can Partake of the Sacrament:

And now behold, this is the commandment which I give unto you, that ye shall not suffer any one knowingly to partake of my flesh and blood unworthily, when ye shall minister it;

For whoso eateth and drinketh my flesh and blood unworthily eateth and drinketh damnation to his soul; therefore if ye know that a man is unworthy to eat and drink of my flesh and blood ye shall forbid him.

What does it take to be worthy of the sacrament?

Nevertheless, ye shall not cast him out from among you, but ye shall minister unto him and shall pray for him unto the Father, in my name; and if it so be that he repenteth and is baptized in my name, then shall ye receive him, and shall minister unto him of my flesh and blood.

It seems that the requirements that qualify one as worthy are different between baptism and the sacrament.

To be worthy of baptism requires a broken heart and a contrite spirit. It requires believing and repenting. When these requirements are met, then the individual is cleansed.

To be worthy of partaking of the sacrament requires that baptism has been completed.

If the requirements to participate in two separate ordinances are different, is it really a renewal of the same covenant?

Are the responsibilities of the individual in the covenants made at baptism the same as those made during the sacrament?

Are the responsibilities of heaven in the covenants made at baptism the same as those made during the sacrament?

If one party is taking upon them different responsibilities between the two ordinances, is it really a renewal of the same covenant?

Is there a difference between "he may pour out his Spirit more abundantly upon you" and "always have his Spirit to be with them"?

If the sacrament is not a renewal of baptismal covenants, what is it that heaven offers different than what is offered at baptism?

I don't really see it as much of a difference when we put "endure to the end" in the equation.

Because when we have repented and become worthy of baptism, and receive the ordinance, we are commanded to endure until the end.

Taking the Sacrament makes us remember what we decided to do when we accept baptism.

You are correct in saying that baptism is a qualification that is necessary before one partakes of the Sacrament. I myself attended Church for a few months before getting baptized, but did not partake of the sacrament until after my baptism.

The spirit flowing more abundantly upon us is done via baptism and confirmation. Whereas we could receive touches of inspiration from the Holy Spirit, the touches can become permanent with obedience to God's commandments after baptism.

The Sacrament simply asks those that have already been baptized to have the Spirit to be with them always.

For me it is a progression. Two different ordinances to be sure. But still the Sacrament is a renewal of baptism covenants.

[FoxMammaWisdom]

The Sacrament simply asks those that have already been baptized to have the Spirit to be with them always.

Is that really all the Sacrament is?

[Jeremy]

Thank you for the response samizdat. You are one of the individuals who questioned why I believe the sacrament is not a renewal of baptismal covenants. I am glad you took the time to read this. Thank you.

I don't really see it as much of a difference when we put "endure to the end" in the equation.

Because when we have repented and become worthy of baptism, and receive the ordinance, we are commanded to endure until the end.

Im not following. Could you explain this more?

Taking the Sacrament makes us remember what we decided to do when we accept baptism.

Agreed. But covenants go two ways - right? Does heaven give the same thing?
If I buy item "A" from you for $10. My part is $10. Your part is item "A". To renew this "covenant", I would have to give you $10 and you would have to give me item "A".

If I buy item "B" from you for $10. My part is $10 and it might be the exact same things as the item "A" agreement, but it is not a "renewal" because you are not going to give me item "A"... you are giving me item "B".

Just because our part is the same does not mean the covenant is the same. If the requirements change and the "items" exchanged change... I don't think it is the same covenant.

You are correct in saying that baptism is a qualification that is necessary before one partakes of the Sacrament.

This changes the "agreement" doesn't it?

The Sacrament simply asks those that have already been baptized to have the Spirit to be with them always.

Whose spirit? THE Spirit or HIS spirit? If THE spirit, what was baptism and "confirmation" for? The companionship of THE spirit - right? If HIS spirit, what do we call it when HE takes up HIS abode with us?

Two different ordinances to be sure. But still the Sacrament is a renewal of baptism covenants.

Two different ordinances which require different things from both the individual and heaven, yet the covenant is the same?

[BDS]

:ymapplause:

You layed this out beautifully! Our problem has been a lack of understanding of the sacrament all together. Baptism I think most can grasp, but to understand the sacrament requires diving in much deeper and a long time ago someone decided that was too complicated, and the two covenants seem similar, so let's just say they are the same thing. It hedges up the way! Creates walls of unbelief! I am grateful God has people on the earth willing to hear Him. Thanks for being one of those people!

[aeon]

Why isn't this topic more popular ? Strange..

If the sacrament is not a renewal of baptismal covenants, what is it that heaven offers different than what is offered at baptism?

"always" is what heaven offers to us. If we aren't capable to have his light always with us, we won't be able to bear His presence.

Whose spirit? THE Spirit or HIS spirit? If THE spirit, what was baptism and "confirmation" for? The companionship of THE spirit - right? If HIS spirit, what do we call it when HE takes up HIS abode with us?

There's a long thread on that. Personally, I love this post by bro Pontius who explains the difference.
https://unblogmysoul.wordpress.com/2012 ... is-spirit/

I personally believe our spirit becomes worthy to receive influence by His spirit. It seems like this is the way spirits communicate in the other world. (See Visions of Glory)

This is a very unique ordinance. It is the only one we perform for ourselves multiples times (we exclude priesthood blessings and temple work for the dead as there are meant to bless others though it's a good way to remember all the ordinances)

The day of the atonement used to be once a year in the OT times. Today we partake of the sacrament almost every sunday but the frequency is not so important. We know for example the in special meetings some may partake of the Sacrament at other times and location.

If the sole purpose of the sacrament were to make a covenant with God, we could partake only once after our confirmation.
In his own words, the Lords mentions something very specific in the D&C 27 :2

For, behold, I say unto you, that it mattereth not what ye shall eat or what ye shall drink when ye partake of the sacrament, if it so be that ye do it with an eye single to my glory--remembering unto the Father my body which was laid down for you, and my blood which was shed for the remission of your sins.


Remembrance is the great purpose of the ordinance. We remember what the Lord did for us while in the flesh but not only.
We look forward with an eye of faith the day when we will comune with him and all the other prophets.

D&C 27:5 : Behold, this is wisdom in me; wherefore, marvel not, for the hour cometh that I will drink of the fruit of the vine with you on the earth...

The sacrament is not on of the saving ordinances. We don't perform for the dead.
Maybe the Sacrament is a teachmaster that teaches us how to communicate between spirits while in the flesh.