Deleted

[lundbaek]

CelestialAngel's above statement reminds me of the Arizona state legislator who, some years ago, suggested to an area seventy that the Church discontinue those election time admonitions to members to vote, because most Mormons vote in ignorance and make things worse.

[Silver]

If voting mattered, the elites wouldn't let us do it.

Here I am, once again, recommending that everyone read iWriteStuff's thread entitled Ether's Avenue. If you can comprehend the magnitude of the words of that thread, you will finally realize your votes won't matter in the corrupt two-party system that gives us a choice between a homosexual golfer from Kenya or a traitorous Mormon from Michigan. Or, similarly, between a murderous madame or a Manchurian Marmalade.

But still I vote, if for no other reason than to register my opposition of the status quo.

[Ezra]

Voting is an essential part of maintaining our freedoms. So is educating and warning our neighbors. They go hand in hand.

If we had a educated moral majority of voters we would still have our freedoms instead of loosing them.

The important thing is to not cast our vote with the swine.

Joseph Smith said.

Joseph Smith Jr.: "We shall have the satisfaction of knowing we have acted conscienciously and have used our best judgement, and if we have to throw away our votes, we had better do so upon a worthy rather than an unworthy individual who might make use of the weapon we put in his hand to destroy us!" (Comprehensive History of the Church 2:208-209)


God has consistently raised up a good person to vote for. The media consistently ignores them even if they have a good amount of support. But again if we had a majority vote of good educated people especially this day and age where communication is so easy the elite wouldn’t be able to pull a fast one on us.

Hyrum smith said.




Hyrum Smith the Patriarch of the Church: "We engage in the election the same as in any other principle, you're to vote for good men and if you do not do this it is a sin. To vote for wicked men, it would be sin! Choose the good and refuse the evil. Men of false principles have preyed upon us like wolves upon helpless lambs. Damn the rod of tyrrany and curse it! Let every man use his liberties according to the Constitution. Don't fear man or devil, electioneer with all people, male and female, and exhort them to do the thing which is right. We want a President of the United States, not a party President, but a President of the whole people, for a party President disenfranchises the other party. Have a President who will maintain every man in his rights." (HC 6:323)


D&C 98:9-10 Admonishes us to seek diligently for honest, wise, good men to uphold in political office, and "whatsoever is less than these cometh of evil."

Voting in ignorance is sustaining evil. Not voting is also sustaining evil. We have to do our part. We have to stand and be Counted.

[Arenera]

Voting is an essential part of maintaining our freedoms. So is educating and warning our neighbors. They go hand in hand.

If we had a educated moral majority of voters we would still have our freedoms instead of loosing them.

The important thing is to not cast our vote with the swine.

Joseph Smith said.

Joseph Smith Jr.: "We shall have the satisfaction of knowing we have acted conscienciously and have used our best judgement, and if we have to throw away our votes, we had better do so upon a worthy rather than an unworthy individual who might make use of the weapon we put in his hand to destroy us!" (Comprehensive History of the Church 2:208-209)


God has consistently raised up a good person to vote for. The media consistently ignores them even if they have a good amount of support. But again if we had a majority vote of good educated people especially this day and age where communication is so easy the elite wouldn’t be able to pull a fast one on us.

Hyrum smith said.




Hyrum Smith the Patriarch of the Church: "We engage in the election the same as in any other principle, you're to vote for good men and if you do not do this it is a sin. To vote for wicked men, it would be sin! Choose the good and refuse the evil. Men of false principles have preyed upon us like wolves upon helpless lambs. Damn the rod of tyrrany and curse it! Let every man use his liberties according to the Constitution. Don't fear man or devil, electioneer with all people, male and female, and exhort them to do the thing which is right. We want a President of the United States, not a party President, but a President of the whole people, for a party President disenfranchises the other party. Have a President who will maintain every man in his rights." (HC 6:323)


D&C 98:9-10 Admonishes us to seek diligently for honest, wise, good men to uphold in political office, and "whatsoever is less than these cometh of evil."

Voting in ignorance is sustaining evil. Not voting is also sustaining evil. We have to do our part. We have to stand and be Counted.

You need to define what honest, wise and good means. It seems some of you call a good man traitorous.

Let's take Moore for example. Should the people in Alabama vote for this person who harassed women under the age of 16?

[Fiannan]

Let's take Moore for example. Should the people in Alabama vote for this person who harassed women under the age of 16?

Proven? If it is not true then you are guilty of both gossip (a grave sin according to the Bible) and bearing false witness (again, a huge sin according to the Bible).

[Arenera]

Let's take Moore for example. Should the people in Alabama vote for this person who harassed women under the age of 16?

Proven? If it is not true then you are guilty of both gossip (a grave sin according to the Bible) and bearing false witness (again, a huge sin according to the Bible).

It is true. What about the Access Hollywood tape? Did you vote for that person?

[Fiannan]

Let's take Moore for example. Should the people in Alabama vote for this person who harassed women under the age of 16?

Proven? If it is not true then you are guilty of both gossip (a grave sin according to the Bible) and bearing false witness (again, a huge sin according to the Bible).

It is true. What about the Access Hollywood tape? Did you vote for that person?

You are deflecting. Answer about your proof of Moore then we can discuss the inspiration for thousands of feminists dressing up like vaginas in their protests.

[Arenera]

Let's take Moore for example. Should the people in Alabama vote for this person who harassed women under the age of 16?

Proven? If it is not true then you are guilty of both gossip (a grave sin according to the Bible) and bearing false witness (again, a huge sin according to the Bible).

It is true. What about the Access Hollywood tape? Did you vote for that person?

You are deflecting. Answer about your proof of Moore then we can discuss the inspiration for thousands of feminists dressing up like vaginas in their protests.

Plenty of proof on Moore. My, the verbiage that is being used, a good indicator of knowing good from evil.

[Fiannan]

Plenty of proof on Moore. My, the verbiage that is being used, a good indicator of knowing good from evil.

I can supply news photographs proving my point, can you, as God is your witness, say with confidence that the accusations against Moore are true?

[Arenera]

Plenty of proof on Moore. My, the verbiage that is being used, a good indicator of knowing good from evil.

I can supply news photographs proving my point, can you, as God is your witness, say with confidence that the accusations against Moore are true?

Show your news photographs. Probably similar to your Romney cartoons.

[Fiannan]

Plenty of proof on Moore. My, the verbiage that is being used, a good indicator of knowing good from evil.

I can supply news photographs proving my point, can you, as God is your witness, say with confidence that the accusations against Moore are true?

Show your news photographs. Probably similar to your Romney cartoons.

Did the Romney cartoons trigger you? Sorry, I could have posted "Mitt Romney Style" from YouTube. My son's teacher showed his classes the video during the 2012 elections and his students loved it. Pretty funny I must admit.

As for the pink hats what were they supposed to represent you think? Many protestors took it a bit further. Also, I could direct link but I will merely give citation, "Lady Part Costumes Ruled the Women's March" Yahoo Lifestyle News, January 22, 2017.

[Gage]

Proven? If it is not true then you are guilty of both gossip (a grave sin according to the Bible) and bearing false witness (again, a huge sin according to the Bible).

It is true. What about the Access Hollywood tape? Did you vote for that person?

You are deflecting. Answer about your proof of Moore then we can discuss the inspiration for thousands of feminists dressing up like vaginas in their protests.

Plenty of proof on Moore. My, the verbiage that is being used, a good indicator of knowing good from evil.

Where is the proof? Where is the proof for many of these sexual misconduct allegations from these so called #metoo women? Allegations are not proof although this society says it is when a woman is the accuser.

[Ezra]

You need to define what honest, wise and good means. It seems some of you call a good man traitorous.


God defines good honest wise. There seems to be a lot of confusion as to what that is even with lds members.

Romney doesn’t fit the good honest wise description for one blaring reason. He doesn’t follow the constitution or it’s principles.

God declared himself the author of the constitution and its principles are defined all over the scriptures.

You cannot be a moral person without following the principles of the constitution.

We know many are called and few chosen. The reason they are not chosen. Unrighteous dominion of their fellow men is one of the main reasons that the scriptures defines.

That happens most with our involvement in government. By our vote and support of people who progress socialist agendas.

Like Welfare. Pubic schools. Medicare Medicaid Obamacare. (Which was drafted by copying romneycare). Social security and numerous other programs in which people’s earnings are stolen from them through taxation (gun point) and distributed to others in some form or another.

That is the main form of unrighteous dominion being practiced in this country. Neighbors stealing from their neighbors through the force of government.

So good moral wise people don’t vote for Romney because he is immoral when it comes to stealing other people’s money through the force of government.

[Robin Hood]

With the single exception of the Brexit referendum last year, I gave up voting many years ago.
Whoever wins the election nothing changes. It's the same agenda.

[Arenera]

You need to define what honest, wise and good means. It seems some of you call a good man traitorous.


God defines good honest wise. There seems to be a lot of confusion as to what that is even with lds members.

Romney doesn’t fit the good honest wise description for one blaring reason. He doesn’t follow the constitution or it’s principles.

God declared himself the author of the constitution and its principles are defined all over the scriptures.

You cannot be a moral person without following the principles of the constitution.

We know many are called and few chosen. The reason they are not chosen. Unrighteous dominion of their fellow men is one of the main reasons that the scriptures defines.

That happens most with our involvement in government. By our vote and support of people who progress socialist agendas.

Like Welfare. Pubic schools. Medicare Medicaid Obamacare. (Which was drafted by copying romneycare). Social security and numerous other programs in which people’s earnings are stolen from them through taxation (gun point) and distributed to others in some form or another.

That is the main form of unrighteous dominion being practiced in this country. Neighbors stealing from their neighbors through the force of government.

So good moral wise people don’t vote for Romney because he is immoral when it comes to stealing other people’s money through the force of government.

So your definition of good is based on how you interpret the constitution. Less than 1% of the US population agree with your definition of the constitution.

It doesn't sound like you would like Zion, where people are equal and there is no poor. There is no poor because those that have give to those that don't.

[lundbaek]

I hope you folks realize that "...he [God] holds men accountable for their acts in relation to them [governments], both in making laws and administering them, for the good and safety of society."

[BeNotDeceived]

I can’t vote for President, but then I don’t have to pay federal income tax.

[lundbaek]

Well then, Celestial Angel, ask God what He thinks of your decision to unregister to vote.

[Alaris]

I put in a solid vote for "no Hillary no way no how." Given all the shenanigans that continue to surface, I'm glad I did and will be able to look at the Lord straight in the eye and give an accounting of my vote.

[Ezra]

You need to define what honest, wise and good means. It seems some of you call a good man traitorous.


God defines good honest wise. There seems to be a lot of confusion as to what that is even with lds members.

Romney doesn’t fit the good honest wise description for one blaring reason. He doesn’t follow the constitution or it’s principles.

God declared himself the author of the constitution and its principles are defined all over the scriptures.

You cannot be a moral person without following the principles of the constitution.

We know many are called and few chosen. The reason they are not chosen. Unrighteous dominion of their fellow men is one of the main reasons that the scriptures defines.

That happens most with our involvement in government. By our vote and support of people who progress socialist agendas.

Like Welfare. Pubic schools. Medicare Medicaid Obamacare. (Which was drafted by copying romneycare). Social security and numerous other programs in which people’s earnings are stolen from them through taxation (gun point) and distributed to others in some form or another.

That is the main form of unrighteous dominion being practiced in this country. Neighbors stealing from their neighbors through the force of government.

So good moral wise people don’t vote for Romney because he is immoral when it comes to stealing other people’s money through the force of government.

So your definition of good is based on how you interpret the constitution. Less than 1% of the US population agree with your definition of the constitution.

It doesn't sound like you would like Zion, where people are equal and there is no poor. There is no poor because those that have give to those that don't.

Would love Zion because it follows constitutional principles. Where people voluntarily give their earned goods to others. That is the difference between the 2 plans. Jesus and Satan’s. Satan’s plan uses force to compel people Jesus plan uses agency. Satan’s plan is socialism. And how the government is implementing force to take care of the sick needy and old is exactly what Satan’s plan was in the pre existence.

It doesn’t matter that according to you 1% agree with what constitutional principles are. God is the one who defines them to be correct. And the scriptures back it up. The real question is do you agree with god?

You will find if you study that the same morality taught in scriptures is the same morality that is in the constitution. And is why our prophets asked us to study the constitution as well as the federalist papers and scriptures to better understand those principles.

Have you done as the prophets have asked and studied the constitution as well as federalist papers and scriptures to see how they are all the same?

I ask because so far your arguments are typical of someone who has not.

Also I’m surprised you know so little of Zion to not know that it’s voluntary not forced socialism in nature.

I will add this quote.

WE WILL SPEND ETERNITY WITH THOSE WHO WILL ALLOW US NO MORE FREEDOM THAN WE ARE WILLING TO ALLOW THEM.
Over and over again, the scriptures emphasize that we will be judged according to our treatment of our fellowmen. If we are charitable, we will be placed with the sheep in the Lord’s kingdom rather than with the goats in outer darkness. (Matt. 25:31—46) If we forgive, we may be forgiven. (Matt.6:12) If we are just, we may rise in the resurrection of the Just: and dwell with them. (D&C Sec. 76) If we refrain from exercising compulsion unrighteously, our dominion in the hereafter may be everlasting and flow unto us forever and ever without compulsory means. (D&C Sec. 121) In short, we can expect to be treated in the next life as we treat others here.
The exact implementation of this law of the harvest will occur at the end of this life, when we will be divided into groups and each will be consigned to spend eternity with those with whom he is most like. An unjust person will dwell with those who will treat him unjustly; a kind, forgiving person will enjoy the companionship of kind and forgiving associates, etc. But the fact which is important to our discussion here is that each person will be with that group who will allow him to exercise no more freedom than he is willing to allow them.
If, during this life, we have been persuaded to believe that the force of government, or any other agency, should be used to deny our fellowmen the stewardship which God has given them over their families, their property, and their private affairs, we can be very certain that we will be placed with a group in the hereafter who will hold similar views. With such an attitude, we cannot expect to have stewardship or dominions of our own because we do not believe in them for others and neither will those with whom we will dwell believe in them for us. The poetic justice of God decrees that if we deprive our fellow of those unalienable rights which, according to the
Declaration of Independence, they have been endowed by their Creator, we will lose our free agency to the same extent.
H. Verlin. Anderson, “The Great and Abominable Church of the
Devil”


Those who use unrighteous dominion will be dominated by others. Those who use force of government to steal from there neighbors will have all their positions stolen for eternity.

I want agency freedoms and to be treated fairly and not have my things stolen or dictated.

What do you want?

[brianj]

So your definition of good is based on how you interpret the constitution. Less than 1% of the US population agree with your definition of the constitution.

It doesn't sound like you would like Zion, where people are equal and there is no poor. There is no poor because those that have give to those that don't.

Majority opinion doesn't make something right.

And Ezra would like Zion. The difference between you and Zion is that you believe right involves forcing people to unwillingly give of their resources to help those with less, while in Zion there will be no compulsion. In Zion people will live the principle taught by the Savior of giving cheerfully.

[Gage]

I hope you folks realize that "...he [God] holds men accountable for their acts in relation to them [governments], both in making laws and administering them, for the good and safety of society."

My vote has never mattered and will never matter and until I see a vote in America come down to 1 vote to decide something, I will not be impressed. Politics and voting is corrupt and are of the world and I do not care for the world, I care for God and Jesus.

Same thing goes for every human that has lived past the age of accountability. We will all be held accountable.

"My vote has never mattered" DO you realize the votes that you could influence if you believed in a candidate and his platform and actually got out and tried to influence others votes? You know if you believe in a candidate, there are actions you can take other than just casting your vote. Our freedoms will be lost because we are complacent and don't think we can make a difference by our casting our 1 vote. It can be so much bigger than that, if you make it bigger than that.

[Gage]

I hope you folks realize that "...he [God] holds men accountable for their acts in relation to them [governments], both in making laws and administering them, for the good and safety of society."

My vote has never mattered and will never matter and until I see a vote in America come down to 1 vote to decide something, I will not be impressed. Politics and voting is corrupt and are of the world and I do not care for the world, I care for God and Jesus.

Same thing goes for every human that has lived past the age of accountability. We will all be held accountable.

"My vote has never mattered" DO you realize the votes that you could influence if you believed in a candidate and his platform and actually got out and tried to influence others votes? You know if you believe in a candidate, there are actions you can take other than just casting your vote. Our freedoms will be lost because we are complacent and don't think we can make a difference by our casting our 1 vote. It can be so much bigger than that, if you make it bigger than that.

You do realize I can always change my mind and vote in the future or register to vote in the future if a candidate or position sways me to. It's really easy to do. It's not like this is the end of the world.

Yes I do, but even if you just casted your vote and nothing else, is there no pride in just doing that? Pride that you still have at least that freedom and right to cast your vote? If nothing else vote in remembrance of the everyday folks that died for your right to do so.

[Arenera]

You need to define what honest, wise and good means. It seems some of you call a good man traitorous.


God defines good honest wise. There seems to be a lot of confusion as to what that is even with lds members.

Romney doesn’t fit the good honest wise description for one blaring reason. He doesn’t follow the constitution or it’s principles.

God declared himself the author of the constitution and its principles are defined all over the scriptures.

You cannot be a moral person without following the principles of the constitution.

We know many are called and few chosen. The reason they are not chosen. Unrighteous dominion of their fellow men is one of the main reasons that the scriptures defines.

That happens most with our involvement in government. By our vote and support of people who progress socialist agendas.

Like Welfare. Pubic schools. Medicare Medicaid Obamacare. (Which was drafted by copying romneycare). Social security and numerous other programs in which people’s earnings are stolen from them through taxation (gun point) and distributed to others in some form or another.

That is the main form of unrighteous dominion being practiced in this country. Neighbors stealing from their neighbors through the force of government.

So good moral wise people don’t vote for Romney because he is immoral when it comes to stealing other people’s money through the force of government.

So your definition of good is based on how you interpret the constitution. Less than 1% of the US population agree with your definition of the constitution.

It doesn't sound like you would like Zion, where people are equal and there is no poor. There is no poor because those that have give to those that don't.

Would love Zion because it follows constitutional principles. Where people voluntarily give their earned goods to others. That is the difference between the 2 plans. Jesus and Satan’s. Satan’s plan uses force to compel people Jesus plan uses agency. Satan’s plan is socialism. And how the government is implementing force to take care of the sick needy and old is exactly what Satan’s plan was in the pre existence.

It doesn’t matter that according to you 1% agree with what constitutional principles are. God is the one who defines them to be correct. And the scriptures back it up. The real question is do you agree with god?

You will find if you study that the same morality taught in scriptures is the same morality that is in the constitution. And is why our prophets asked us to study the constitution as well as the federalist papers and scriptures to better understand those principles.

Have you done as the prophets have asked and studied the constitution as well as federalist papers and scriptures to see how they are all the same?

I ask because so far your arguments are typical of someone who has not.

Also I’m surprised you know so little of Zion to not know that it’s voluntary not forced socialism in nature.

I will add this quote.

WE WILL SPEND ETERNITY WITH THOSE WHO WILL ALLOW US NO MORE FREEDOM THAN WE ARE WILLING TO ALLOW THEM.
Over and over again, the scriptures emphasize that we will be judged according to our treatment of our fellowmen. If we are charitable, we will be placed with the sheep in the Lord’s kingdom rather than with the goats in outer darkness. (Matt. 25:31—46) If we forgive, we may be forgiven. (Matt.6:12) If we are just, we may rise in the resurrection of the Just: and dwell with them. (D&C Sec. 76) If we refrain from exercising compulsion unrighteously, our dominion in the hereafter may be everlasting and flow unto us forever and ever without compulsory means. (D&C Sec. 121) In short, we can expect to be treated in the next life as we treat others here.
The exact implementation of this law of the harvest will occur at the end of this life, when we will be divided into groups and each will be consigned to spend eternity with those with whom he is most like. An unjust person will dwell with those who will treat him unjustly; a kind, forgiving person will enjoy the companionship of kind and forgiving associates, etc. But the fact which is important to our discussion here is that each person will be with that group who will allow him to exercise no more freedom than he is willing to allow them.
If, during this life, we have been persuaded to believe that the force of government, or any other agency, should be used to deny our fellowmen the stewardship which God has given them over their families, their property, and their private affairs, we can be very certain that we will be placed with a group in the hereafter who will hold similar views. With such an attitude, we cannot expect to have stewardship or dominions of our own because we do not believe in them for others and neither will those with whom we will dwell believe in them for us. The poetic justice of God decrees that if we deprive our fellow of those unalienable rights which, according to the
Declaration of Independence, they have been endowed by their Creator, we will lose our free agency to the same extent.
H. Verlin. Anderson, “The Great and Abominable Church of the
Devil”


Those who use unrighteous dominion will be dominated by others. Those who use force of government to steal from there neighbors will have all their positions stolen for eternity.

I want agency freedoms and to be treated fairly and not have my things stolen or dictated.

What do you want?

Nice quote. There are 100 Senators. 435 congressmen. 1 President. 9 Supreme Court Justices.

The Senators, Congressmen and President are voted into office. I can cast 1 vote for a Senator, Congressman and President. I do vote.

The less than 1% can vote as a block, and will never elect anyone. That is their choice, their agency.

5 or 6 millions Mormons in the US, large number in Utah, Arizona, Idaho. They might be able to put 1-2 Senators, 1-5 Congressmen, 1-5 Electoral Votes for President. Not much impact there.

1% of the Mormon Votes won’t impact anything either.

Now what are you going to do?

[Ezra]

So your definition of good is based on how you interpret the constitution. Less than 1% of the US population agree with your definition of the constitution.

It doesn't sound like you would like Zion, where people are equal and there is no poor. There is no poor because those that have give to those that don't.

I would take a guess that it’s the wealthy Mormons that would have the hardest time with Zion. Like Romney and Marriott.

After all those who already live Zion principles will have the easiest time doing what they are already doing.

The millionaire Mormons will have to get used to a much less worldly lifestyle if all are to be equal. If they were already living a Zion lifestyle I don’t see how they would be millionaires as they would give it to the poor. Kinda a hard balance though I would imagine.