Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

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JK4Woods
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Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by JK4Woods »

For those of you who haven't had the experience of living thru high inflation I am here to say it is a unique experience, and one in which "Normalcy Bias" plays a large role in adding to the confusion and panic.

USA past Inflation Experience
The older participants on this board will remember the (low) double digit inflation here in the States during the late 1970's to early 1980's.
The Savings & Loan collapse and cost of commodities started an upward trend on all cost-of-living items. Housing, automobiles, food, bills, everything started rising in cost and prices well before any kind of wage increases started to try and catch up.

Those people who held adjustable-rate-mortgages were the first to feel the real pinch of adjusted mortgage interest rates, and their monthly mortgage payments rising very quickly, at the same time as utilities started going up.

Wages lagged, and the availability of jobs became in short supply. It was a tight time and one fraught with hand wringing worry on how to make the house payment, buy back-to-school clothes and supplies, and transition to tighter belt tightening because earning power and paychecks got left behind.

Mind you, this was at the relatively modest inflation rate of 8% to 9% per year up to a high of about 14% per year, but usually was around 8% to 9% for the several year run.

Relative Income Comparison 1970 to 2017
Here is a sidebar conversation showing that even “Quiet-Inflation” can run amok in unseen ways.
Back when I was a teenager in 1970, my Dad could buy a brand new Pickup truck off the dealer’s lot for about $2,550. Of course wages were way lower back then and $2,550 was a good amount of money.

Let’s do a comparison; we’ll use units that are easy to understand.
In 1970 minimum wage was $1.45 per hour. It would have taken 1,758 minimum wage hours to buy a brand new pickup.

In 2017 the minimum wage is $8.75/hour. A new standard two wheel drive F-150 Ford Pickup costs about $32,000 off the lot. Today it would take 3,657 minimum wage hours to buy a brand new pickup.

Quiet-Inflation has crept up on people, so that even with a rise of 600% in the minimum wage, a person has to work over twice as long to buy a brand new pickup. The value of money has quietly fallen.

(And did you notice that most items at the grocery store have risen in price lately? And that the quantity of product in the package has been reduced? IE: I used to buy Plackers {those dental floss things} for a buck at the dollar store. There used to be 90 in a package. Now they still cost a buck, and there is only 50 in a package…!?!).

Quiet-Inflation has been decimating the American Middle Class. It used to be a Dad could work and bring home enough to support a wife and four kids, buy a house and keep a couple of cars going; and send a couple kids thru college. Now both spouses have to work to get anywhere close to a middle class lifestyle.

But I digress…. Back to Hyper-Inflation…

Venezuela
Anyone monitoring Venezuela over this last year will have seen the catastrophe in that-once developed,(and still oil-rich) country. It has now devolved into an economy experiencing a 10% cost increase on food and goods every month.

You should read a couple of summary articles about what is happening down there right now-today. Hunger is pervasive, wages haven’t caught up with inflation, and lower denomination bills are worthless. There is so much uncertainty that stores are not re-stocking goods, because they don’t know at what price to sell them at to be able to make enough to re-stock and earn a profit.

Venezuela is entering into the throws of hyper-inflation. This is indeed a tough place to be. I have experienced it personally.

Argentina
1980 to 1982 Argentina. I served a mission there for two years. I was an older missionary- going out at 24 years old and coming home at 26. (I had joined the Church while serving in the Army and had to complete my enlistment before I could go on a mission). During my growing up years, I had spent a year in Mexico, five years in Spain, and extensive travel all over Europe. Then I joined the Army and spent more time in Korea and Germany. Let’s just say my eyes were already opened by the time I headed out on my mission and I knew how things worked in the world.

1st year in Argentina, my monthly cost to be on the mission started at $175 / month and rose over the first twelve months to about $275/ month. Then the economy turned to crap, (after two changes in the Presidency, (with two military juntas for short periods of time) the economy was in a complete shambles. Costs to be on a mission shot thru the roof and every month the cost to be on a mission rose. It jumped to $350/month, then $425/month then $550/month then $650/month, in a few short months. (This was back when we paid our own costs. Later the next year, the missionary law of consecration was instituted church-wide and everyone just paid $350/month).

Salvation came in the form of Argentina lopping off two zeroes from their money for the exchange rate to steady. So in effect we Americans getting US dollars had a safety valve by getting US dollars sent from home every month and so we fared much better than the local population.

Now we are getting to the point of this whole treatise…. The effects of hyper-inflation.
While we were struggling as missionaries, with individual personal support of a monthly allotment of US dollars, the Argentine public was in an entirely different boat… The economy was experiencing 400% inflation per year..!!

Every couple of days prices rose on food and goods. There were no price labels on canned goods anymore. A can of beans would sell for 20 pesos one day and 24 pesos the following week. By next month a can of beans cost 60 pesos. Everything went up in price. It went up so fast that chalk boards were used to mark prices for whole shelves of goods so it could be erased and marked up each night.

The consequence of the dramatic (and tragic) rise in prices, was that when you got pesos, you immediately spent them. Even us missionaries, when we got our little money packet from the Zone Leaders every other week, we had to go out and spend the whole amount on food, cause if you held onto any money, it would buy less the following week.

Hyper-inflation caused Hyper-Consumerism… When anyone got paid, they immediately bought something… (mostly food), and if there was any money left over, they bought anything else, like a kitchen appliance, or a few reams of paper, anything, because any item was worth more money in a few weeks than paper currency was.

All savings accounts and investments were liquidated as fast as possible and turned into cash to buy goods. Interest rates in banks climbed to 15% to 22% annually, but couldn’t keep up with 400% inflation. Money sitting in bank accounts was losing value every day it remained in the bank. Then banks restricted the total value of money that could be withdrawn per day to a measly sum. People who had decent savings account balances, couldn’t access them except for small nibbles week by week… meanwhile the value of their money was dropping like a rock.

By the time I got home in early 1982, inflation had hit 600% / year… The population was in a riotous mood, and the military junta decided to pick a fight with Chile about the Beagle Islands at the tip of Tierra del Fuego. (The Pope stepped in and told both Chile and Argentina to knock it off: “you’re both Catholic countries, stop this non-sense”). So Argentina had to find some other villain outside its borders to fight with, "to unite the population against a common enemy"… Remember the Falkland Island War..?? All caused by desperate Argentine leaders trying to divert the attention of the disgruntled masses at their predicament with a failing economy and growing poverty within a hugely rich (in natural resources) country.

Final Comment: It can happen here in the USA in the (relative) blink of an eye. Inflation can become the worst trial any family could face. Rising inflation turning into hyper-inflation would throw the general population into two camps…. The majority growing more dependent on Government to help them eat…. And a miniscule minority of out of debt, prepared families who can weather an economic disruption.

The most unfortunate part of the whole issue is the powerlessness of faithful honest folks who will be caught up in a maelstrom of confusion, anger, and eventually mob violence and looting.

Get out of debt! Don’t put all your trust in a 401k retirement account, savings in CD’s or stock funds… All these are depending on the arm of man… none will help you when it’s wiped out overnight, and bank assets frozen.

Not a cheerful state of affairs, I know. Just do your part to walk with the Lord, cultivate his Spirit and seek personal revelation of what you should each do individually and as a family to be prepared.
Because once prepared… ye shall not fear… and you’ll be able to help others find the way.

Silver
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by Silver »

Thank you, JK4Woods, for that marvelous post. I appreciate the first-person account of your time in Argentina. Some of your readers may be surprised to learn that the inflation the citizens of Argentina faced was not the worst by far.

Here's another way to see the insidious effects of inflation. In my lifetime, the price for an ounce of gold was about $35. Now it is about $1300, or about 37 times more expensive.

So what changed? An ounce of gold is an ounce of gold. The purity of a one ounce coin from the 1960's and one made today is essentially the same. The gold didn't change. The US dollar did. The dollar has been devalued (inflated) to such an extent that a $35 item (real money in this case) now costs $1300 just within 50 years.

Your recommendation to prepare is a sound one. I would try to minimize the amount of Federal Reserve Hiney Notes in my preps. They are headed even lower.

lundbaek
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by lundbaek »

We experienced 20%/Year inflation 1981-1983 as we lived in Italy as I was working for an American company, General Electric Co. Italian law required that I receive it think it was 80% of my salary in Italian Lira, which I had to get in cash. It was expedient for me to change our Italian Lira into U.S. denominated travelers cheques and send some back to our bank in the U.S.A. and exchange others weeks or months later as we needed Lira.

The U.S.A. was experiencing inflation at the same time, but nothing like that in Italy.

DesertWonderer2
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by DesertWonderer2 »

Interesting topic. What are some real life scenarios that would cause hyper inflation in the US?

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Robin Hood
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by Robin Hood »

High inflation is not always a bad thing.

If you earn £25,000 pa and borrow £100,000 to buy a house, your borrows are 4x your earnings. High inflation will deliver large pay increases, though static in real terms. So high inflation could lead to a doubling of your salary to £50,000 pa, though it wouldn't buy any more than previously. However, you now only owe twice your salary.

People who bought their properties in the early 1970's in the UK were able to pay off their mortgages very quickly because of this phenomenon.

lundbaek
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by lundbaek »

Inflation of any currency lowers the value/purchasing power of that currency. For example, the cost in dollars, marks, euros, pounds, kroner, or whatever increases, even though over years the production of most goods has become less labour intensive.

Silver
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by Silver »

Robin Hood wrote: January 19th, 2018, 2:19 pm High inflation is not always a bad thing.

If you earn £25,000 pa and borrow £100,000 to buy a house, your borrows are 4x your earnings. High inflation will deliver large pay increases, though static in real terms. So high inflation could lead to a doubling of your salary to £50,000 pa, though it wouldn't buy any more than previously. However, you now only owe twice your salary.

People who bought their properties in the early 1970's in the UK were able to pay off their mortgages very quickly because of this phenomenon.
However, you can trust those same treacherous blokes that devalued your currency to promptly raise property taxes on your home AND raise the valuation on your home. Double whammy. After all, the property taxes you were paying when the house was worth £100,000 don't have the same purchasing power as they did previously. Those traitors in the government need pay increases too, you know. They won't be satisfied until they get what's coming to them. What's fair is fair, after all. Can't have the public enjoying all the benefits and the poor civil service chaps living on gruel. That would be most unkind and nobody would be expected to keep a stiff upper lip under those conditions.

And when you sell the home? Well, there's taxes to be paid on the difference between the selling price and the purchase price. Or do you have an exemption on taxes on your personal residence in the UK?

Just in case anyone is wondering, my comments are directed towards the government, not Robin Hood.

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gclayjr
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by gclayjr »

JK4woods,
1980 to 1982 Argentina. I served a mission there for two years.
I worked in Argentina in those years, and on into the time of Guerra de Las Malvinas (Falkland Islands War). It gave me a very close and personal view of super-inflation. I remember in 1 year the NEW peso went from 10,000 to the dollar to 1,000,000 to the dollar. Everybody was a millionaire.

It changed my view of what could happen to an economy, and effected my personal financial decisions ever since then.

Contrary to Robin Hoods fevered imagination, it does NOT help those who are in debt.

Regards,

George Clay

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gclayjr
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by gclayjr »

Robin Hood,
High inflation is not always a bad thing.

If you earn £25,000 pa and borrow £100,000 to buy a house, your borrows are 4x your earnings. High inflation will deliver large pay increases, though static in real terms. So high inflation could lead to a doubling of your salary to £50,000 pa, though it wouldn't buy any more than previously. However, you now only owe twice your salary.
I also worked in Brasil during the early 80's. They didn't have as high an inflation as Argentina, but it was plenty high. ,,, and it went on for a number of years. I had a very good friend who lived in Rio De Janeiro. Banks are not stupid. The adjust their terms. The terms of his mortgage were that the principle was adjusted each month based upon the rate of inflation. After paying each month, he actually owed more than the month before.

Inflation does not HELP debtors. It is like many of those socialist programs you love so much. If you happen to be in the right place at the right time, momentarily, you might benefit. However, over time the people hurt the most are those who it is supposed to help. I'm sure that there are a lot of Venezuelans today,, greatly increasing their wealth, by buying up homes and paying them off with inflated currency.

Regards,

George Clay
Last edited by gclayjr on January 19th, 2018, 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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David13
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by David13 »

Yes I remember the inflation of the 70s.
I was in California (primarily) at that time and do remember.
I also remember the outrageous increases in property taxes that were going on.
And that it led to what they called a "taxpayers revolt" which led to Proposition 13 passing.
That was a proposition that said that your property taxes would remain the same as long as you did not sell, etc.
If you sold your house and bought another one, then they could increase the taxes on both houses.
That went on for some time, then they passed laws that allowed a percent annual increase, and otherwise modified it throughout the years. Where it is now, I have no idea, and no longer care (about California, I mean.)
I don't know how it's been going here, but I'll find out.

Somewhat of an aside, I never saw any of the people who complained about prices going up ever complain about the value of their house going up. I know a lot of them liked the idea of selling their house for a far far far greater sum of money than they paid for it, with no qualms about it.
dc

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Robin Hood
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by Robin Hood »

Silver wrote: January 19th, 2018, 3:26 pm
Robin Hood wrote: January 19th, 2018, 2:19 pm High inflation is not always a bad thing.

If you earn £25,000 pa and borrow £100,000 to buy a house, your borrows are 4x your earnings. High inflation will deliver large pay increases, though static in real terms. So high inflation could lead to a doubling of your salary to £50,000 pa, though it wouldn't buy any more than previously. However, you now only owe twice your salary.

People who bought their properties in the early 1970's in the UK were able to pay off their mortgages very quickly because of this phenomenon.
However, you can trust those same treacherous blokes that devalued your currency to promptly raise property taxes on your home AND raise the valuation on your home. Double whammy. After all, the property taxes you were paying when the house was worth £100,000 don't have the same purchasing power as they did previously. Those traitors in the government need pay increases too, you know. They won't be satisfied until they get what's coming to them. What's fair is fair, after all. Can't have the public enjoying all the benefits and the poor civil service chaps living on gruel. That would be most unkind and nobody would be expected to keep a stiff upper lip under those conditions.

And when you sell the home? Well, there's taxes to be paid on the difference between the selling price and the purchase price. Or do you have an exemption on taxes on your personal residence in the UK?

Just in case anyone is wondering, my comments are directed towards the government, not Robin Hood.
We don't have property taxes the way you have them in the US.
The Community Charge (more commonly known as "council tax") is not really based on the value of the property, but on the standard of property.
The council tax does rise over the years, that is true, but is not linked to the rise in property values.
For example, I bought my house in 1993 for £67,000. The council tax at that time was around £800 pa. Today my house is worth £280,000 and my council tax is £1,300 pa.

Also, in the UK, profit made on domestic property is exempt from tax. So if I sold my house today I can pocket the £213,000 profit and pay no tax on it at all.

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gclayjr
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by gclayjr »

Robin Hood,
Also, in the UK, profit made on domestic property is exempt from tax. So if I sold my house today I can pocket the £213,000 profit and pay no tax on it at all.
So why don't you go ahead and sell your house for £280,000 and buy another similar house for £67,000 and you can make another £213,000 by selling that house in 30 years? Good retirement plan!

You didn't make anything. You just minimized your losses due to inflation by owning something that has intrinsic value. I don't know the laws in the UK, but you could have preserved your value similarly by buying gold or something else that has value.

While neither the U.K. nor the US has experienced hyperinflation, and there are some "winners" in our countries by people who manage to buy at the right moment, as the inflation changes in an unpredictable way (and there are many people who try to make money on this phantom), generally inflation hurts everybody, and the poor the most. Also, banks factor in inflation in their interest rates. When I bought my house in 1985, the interest rate was 13%. Luckily, under Reagan, inflation abated, and I was able to refinance my home at a better rate, and I made out pretty good.

As I mentioned above, I worked in Argentina in the early 80's when they were living in hyper inflation. Nobody was buying or selling houses. ... or even building them. There was virtually no construction going on. You could see construction equipment just rusting in the fields. Nobody was buying anything that required significant capital. They had laws to build cars Like Fords locally, instead of Importing them (A new Argentine Ford in 1982 looked like a 1963 ford Falcon in the US), but nobody was building them because nobody was buying them. When people got paid, they ran out to spend it as fast as possible, because it would lose much value if you kept it even a day or 2.

Avenida Florida, in Buenos Aires was a pretty busy place. That is kind of like Broadway in NY (I don't know London, but I'm sure every major capital has a place like that). This is where the restaurants, bars, and high end night entertainment was. Of course, as a Steak And Potatoes man from the US, a nice steak meal was pretty good and pretty cheap. Since i was an LDS man then as now, I did not check out the prices for the many ladies of the evening that were available, or how reasonable or wonderful the entertainment in the many bars were, but I'm sure that for an American with dollars, any of that would have all been very reasonably priced.

I doubt all of those people were thinking much of getting a nice down payment, borrowing money from banks who won't loan it, except at inflation adjusting rates and buying a house, and making money off the banks by paying that loan off with inflated currency. They seemed to be more interested in running down to the grocery store and buying some food before the price goes up again.

Regards,

George Clay

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Robin Hood
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by Robin Hood »

gclayjr wrote: January 20th, 2018, 7:10 am Robin Hood,
Also, in the UK, profit made on domestic property is exempt from tax. So if I sold my house today I can pocket the £213,000 profit and pay no tax on it at all.
So why don't you go ahead and sell your house for £280,000 and buy another similar house for £67,000 and you can make another £213,000 by selling that house in 30 years? Good retirement plan!

You didn't make anything. You just minimized your losses due to inflation by owning something that has intrinsic value. I don't know the laws in the UK, but you could have preserved your value similarly by buying gold or something else that has value.

While neither the U.K. nor the US has experienced hyperinflation, and there are some "winners" in our countries by people who manage to buy at the right moment, as the inflation changes in an unpredictable way (and there are many people who try to make money on this phantom), generally inflation hurts everybody, and the poor the most. Also, banks factor in inflation in their interest rates. When I bought my house in 1985, the interest rate was 13%. Luckily, under Reagan, inflation abated, and I was able to refinance my home at a better rate, and I made out pretty good.

As I mentioned above, I worked in Argentina in the early 80's when they were living in hyper inflation. Nobody was buying or selling houses. ... or even building them. There was virtually no construction going on. You could see construction equipment just rusting in the fields. Nobody was buying anything that required significant capital. They had laws to build cars Like Fords locally, instead of Importing them (A new Argentine Ford in 1982 looked like a 1963 ford Falcon in the US), but nobody was building them because nobody was buying them. When people got paid, they ran out to spend it as fast as possible, because it would lose much value if you kept it even a day or 2.

Avenida Florida, in Buenos Aires was a pretty busy place. That is kind of like Broadway in NY (I don't know London, but I'm sure every major capital has a place like that). This is where the restaurants, bars, and high end night entertainment was. Of course, as a Steak And Potatoes man from the US, a nice steak meal was pretty good and pretty cheap. Since i was an LDS man then as now, I did not check out the prices for the many ladies of the evening that were available, or how reasonable or wonderful the entertainment in the many bars were, but I'm sure that for an American with dollars, any of that would have all been very reasonably priced.

I doubt all of those people were thinking much of getting a nice down payment, borrowing money from banks who won't loan it, except at inflation adjusting rates and buying a house, and making money off the banks by paying that loan off with inflated currency. They seemed to be more interested in running down to the grocery store and buying some food before the price goes up again.

Regards,

George Clay
Absolutely George.
I was simply making the narrow point that high inflation is not so bad if you want to become a property owner quickly. My brother-in-law bought a house in the early 1970's for £2,500, with a £2,000 mortgage. After a few years of high inflation his top line earnings had risen sufficiently (though not their buying power) for him to comfortably pay off the outstanding balance on his mortgage, thus saving £thousands in interest payments in years to come.

As a general rule, if you owe money inflation is your friend, if you have money it isn't.

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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by mudflap »

This thread deserves a revival!

https://www.zerohedge.com/personal-fina ... even-worse

We are currently in the beginning of the worst inflation in 40 years. The beginning. and we have at least 3 years left of "no-pipelines" / "empty-shelves" / "Make CHY-nah great again" Joe. Lumber was $7 a board on Monday. I had to buy some to finish off some interior framing for the cabin, but I also cut a handful of 4x4's (12 footers) on my mill - for the porch. I think I will cut all of them on my mill at this point.

- Georgia just shut down the sale of poultry statewide due to an avian flue outbreak, also happening in several other states.
- I haven't seen a box of Crispix on the shelves anywhere for at least a year.
- Have you bought hamburger recently?
- How about a used car? I saw a truck like I currently drive - 28 years old, toyota, with 300k on it - and they wanted $8k for it. A guy who couldn't even speak english - said he was from Guatamala, as far as I could tell - made a beeline across the parking lot when I parked one day and offered me $10k on the spot. For a nearly 30 year old truck.
- If you didn't get a 7% raise this year, you got a paycut.
- most folks don't have a spare $500 in their bank account.

We are already seeing cracks in the foundation of our country - more 20-30 year olds are living with their parents than any time in history. Blackrock owns 50% of the housing in Atlanta. Rent is at all-time highs. We are sitting in the midst of a housing crisis - the millennials are living at home because they make "minimum wage" ($15) at a fast-food place - and it's not enough to buy a home. Bottom line: the middle class - which is usually made up of 20-40 year olds - is pretty much dead. The only folks getting rich are doing it by way of the stock market. It is more out of touch with "main street" than ever. Covid, mandates, political maneuvering are all working against the middle class. Nothing is working for the middle class. There are no indicators that we will change course economically. They are trying for war, but darn it, Russia won't take the bait. :)

So now to the important question: I posit that "Normies" will rebel when they can't afford bread or housing anymore. When Joe America can't fill his tank, mow the 1/4 acre lawn he lives on in Suburbia, or bread is $10 a loaf - that's when things get real, IMO. How far away from that are we?
- this year?
- next year?
- 2024 elections?
- 2030?

lundbaek
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by lundbaek »

From the August 19, 2019 Issue of The New American magazine, published by the John Birch Society:
"According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, $1 of goods in 1776 cost roughly $1.14 in 1913 (the year the Federal Reserve Act was passed), making for an inflation rate of 13.79 percent over 137 years. But a dollar's worth of goods in 1913 would be worth $25.87 today -- 106 years later. Prices have gone up almost 2,500 percent since the Fed was established and the gold standard was undone.... Flooding the market with money, then, will bring down that money's worth -- diluting the currency's purchasing power.... In short, inflation is making us poorer."

I note that things generally cost about 10x as many U.S. dollars and cents as they did in 1960, even though improvements in manufacturing technology make production of most goods less labour intensive.

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Original_Intent
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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by Original_Intent »

https://www.zerohedge.com/personal-fina ... even-worse

Too many people have been conditioned to believe the stock market reflects the health of the economy. In hyperinflation, the stock market will go WAY higher.

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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by JuneBug12000 »

I don't think inflation is good, but an anecdote:

I have friends who are really good at listening to the Spirit.

They have ten kids and have always rented. Manual labor paid the bills and mom stayed home. Not wealthy, but the best kind of people.

About 3 years ago the Spirit told them to move to Idaho, very specific small town. They bought their first house.

1 year later Spirit says move to Missouri. Sold the Idaho home for a ridiculous amount. Over $200,000 left after sale, for just 1 year! They bought a peace of land for cash. Arrived in Mo. and were going to build on land. On their way to hook up utilities at rental when the Spirit tells them to stop immediately and look up real estate site. Up pops a property they can't afford but they are told to see.

Guy sells it to them way below value for the cash they have. He is getting divorced and just wants it gone.

Now they own 2 properties. They live there a year.

Spirit says go back to Utah. They don't feel good about buying right now, so they are renting.

It appears they are about in the same position they were three years ago, with the exception that they have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank just from moving around in a circle.

I'm no fan of the false idea of something for nothing, but the Lord does work in mysterious ways.

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Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by mudflap »

JuneBug12000 wrote: February 16th, 2022, 4:26 pm I don't think inflation is good, but an anecdote:

I have friends who are really good at listening to the Spirit.

They have ten kids and have always rented. Manual labor paid the bills and mom stayed home. Not wealthy, but the best kind of people.

About 3 years ago the Spirit told them to move to Idaho, very specific small town. They bought their first house.

1 year later Spirit says move to Missouri. Sold the Idaho home for a ridiculous amount. Over $200,000 left after sale, for just 1 year! They bought a peace of land for cash. Arrived in Mo. and were going to build on land. On their way to hook up utilities at rental when the Spirit tells them to stop immediately and look up real estate site. Up pops a property they can't afford but they are told to see.

Guy sells it to them way below value for the cash they have. He is getting divorced and just wants it gone.

Now they own 2 properties. They live there a year.

Spirit says go back to Utah. They don't feel good about buying right now, so they are renting.

It appears they are about in the same position they were three years ago, with the exception that they have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank just from moving around in a circle.

I'm no fan of the false idea of something for nothing, but the Lord does work in mysterious ways.
yes. I love stories like that.

I was looking for jobs while teaching at one of the worst high schools (in terms of performance on standardized tests) in the state. Principle was crap. district was crap. All the kids were from the projects. out of 170 kids, I think 3 had a father in the home. I got hired to teach calculus, but in a "bait-&-switch" move, the principle had me teaching algebra. So I hated teaching. started looking for other jobs. Started praying. drew a circle on the map and said, "I'll work anywhere within 20 miles of our zip code." nothing. expanded the circle to 40 miles. nothing, 100 miles, nothing. Meanwhile, my wife is praying and looking for inspiration in the scriptures for where we should move. Just opens the Bible/BOM, let's her finger fall on a passage, and starts reading. Feels like we are supposed to move somewhere with:
- mountains to the West
- a little creek in the front yard
- lots of fruit trees and berries
- lots of times, she opens to noah building a ship out of wood (a wooden house?)
- Nephi and his ship
- references to timbers
- references to making tools
- a place of refuge from a storm

Meanwhile, I'm expanding my job search - all the way to Montana, Coeur d'Alene and Burley Idaho - had some phone interviews, then a phone company flies me out for an interview for a job where I'm the only qualified applicant - job has been open for 6 months. Interview is great, there are mountains to the west, so I look at houses while I'm there. They tell me I basically have the job, that I'm a shoe-in. I fly home, and don't hear from them within 3 days like they said, so after a week I call them - right after I left, some guy shows up, not even as qualified as me, and they decide to hire him instead. A few weeks later, I find a job right within my zip code as an engineer (dream job). My boss can't believe he hired a mathematician right from his hometown.

We all but forget about the inspiration for where we're supposed to live while we look for "already built homes", but we can't find anything we like. Finally, my wife gives in and says, "maybe we should build our own home - didn't you always want to live in a cabin? Maybe we should look into that."

Here we are 6 years later, mountains to the west, a little creek in the yard, lots of fruit trees, making our own tools, a wooden house. The thing that reminded us of the scripture chase was a guy who came to look at it one time and said, "Gee - that looks like an ark!"

What the....

Start looking through my wife's journals and diaries - there it all is, in all its details.

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Original_Intent
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Posts: 13008

Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by Original_Intent »

JuneBug12000 wrote: February 16th, 2022, 4:26 pm I don't think inflation is good, but an anecdote:

I have friends who are really good at listening to the Spirit.

They have ten kids and have always rented. Manual labor paid the bills and mom stayed home. Not wealthy, but the best kind of people.

About 3 years ago the Spirit told them to move to Idaho, very specific small town. They bought their first house.

1 year later Spirit says move to Missouri. Sold the Idaho home for a ridiculous amount. Over $200,000 left after sale, for just 1 year! They bought a peace of land for cash. Arrived in Mo. and were going to build on land. On their way to hook up utilities at rental when the Spirit tells them to stop immediately and look up real estate site. Up pops a property they can't afford but they are told to see.

Guy sells it to them way below value for the cash they have. He is getting divorced and just wants it gone.

Now they own 2 properties. They live there a year.

Spirit says go back to Utah. They don't feel good about buying right now, so they are renting.

It appears they are about in the same position they were three years ago, with the exception that they have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank just from moving around in a circle.

I'm no fan of the false idea of something for nothing, but the Lord does work in mysterious ways.
I don't think it is something for nothing - it took a LOT of faith to follow the Spirit.

JuneBug12000
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2066

Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by JuneBug12000 »

JK4Woods wrote: January 19th, 2018, 12:56 pm
(And did you notice that most items at the grocery store have risen in price lately? And that the quantity of product in the package has been reduced? IE: I used to buy Plackers {those dental floss things} for a buck at the dollar store. There used to be 90 in a package. Now they still cost a buck, and there is only 50 in a package…!?!).
Amos 8 speaks to this:

4 ¶ Hear this, O ye that swallow up the needy, even to make the poor of the land to fail,

5 Saying, When will the new moon be gone, that we may sell corn? and the sabbath, that we may set forth wheat, making the ephah small, and the shekel great, and falsifying the balances by deceit?

6 That we may buy the poor for silver, and the needy for a pair of shoes; yea, and sell the refuse of the wheat?

7 The Lord hath sworn by the excellency of Jacob, Surely I will never forget any of their works.

Meaning make the amount smaller and the price higher and lie if anyone complains.

What follows after this warning is a famine of the word of God.

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harakim
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2819
Location: Salt Lake Megalopolis

Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by harakim »

mudflap wrote: February 16th, 2022, 5:49 pm
JuneBug12000 wrote: February 16th, 2022, 4:26 pm I don't think inflation is good, but an anecdote:

I have friends who are really good at listening to the Spirit.

They have ten kids and have always rented. Manual labor paid the bills and mom stayed home. Not wealthy, but the best kind of people.

About 3 years ago the Spirit told them to move to Idaho, very specific small town. They bought their first house.

1 year later Spirit says move to Missouri. Sold the Idaho home for a ridiculous amount. Over $200,000 left after sale, for just 1 year! They bought a peace of land for cash. Arrived in Mo. and were going to build on land. On their way to hook up utilities at rental when the Spirit tells them to stop immediately and look up real estate site. Up pops a property they can't afford but they are told to see.

Guy sells it to them way below value for the cash they have. He is getting divorced and just wants it gone.

Now they own 2 properties. They live there a year.

Spirit says go back to Utah. They don't feel good about buying right now, so they are renting.

It appears they are about in the same position they were three years ago, with the exception that they have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank just from moving around in a circle.

I'm no fan of the false idea of something for nothing, but the Lord does work in mysterious ways.
yes. I love stories like that.

I was looking for jobs while teaching at one of the worst high schools (in terms of performance on standardized tests) in the state. Principle was crap. district was crap. All the kids were from the projects. out of 170 kids, I think 3 had a father in the home. I got hired to teach calculus, but in a "bait-&-switch" move, the principle had me teaching algebra. So I hated teaching. started looking for other jobs. Started praying. drew a circle on the map and said, "I'll work anywhere within 20 miles of our zip code." nothing. expanded the circle to 40 miles. nothing, 100 miles, nothing. Meanwhile, my wife is praying and looking for inspiration in the scriptures for where we should move. Just opens the Bible/BOM, let's her finger fall on a passage, and starts reading. Feels like we are supposed to move somewhere with:
- mountains to the West
- a little creek in the front yard
- lots of fruit trees and berries
- lots of times, she opens to noah building a ship out of wood (a wooden house?)
- Nephi and his ship
- references to timbers
- references to making tools
- a place of refuge from a storm

Meanwhile, I'm expanding my job search - all the way to Montana, Coeur d'Alene and Burley Idaho - had some phone interviews, then a phone company flies me out for an interview for a job where I'm the only qualified applicant - job has been open for 6 months. Interview is great, there are mountains to the west, so I look at houses while I'm there. They tell me I basically have the job, that I'm a shoe-in. I fly home, and don't hear from them within 3 days like they said, so after a week I call them - right after I left, some guy shows up, not even as qualified as me, and they decide to hire him instead. A few weeks later, I find a job right within my zip code as an engineer (dream job). My boss can't believe he hired a mathematician right from his hometown.

We all but forget about the inspiration for where we're supposed to live while we look for "already built homes", but we can't find anything we like. Finally, my wife gives in and says, "maybe we should build our own home - didn't you always want to live in a cabin? Maybe we should look into that."

Here we are 6 years later, mountains to the west, a little creek in the yard, lots of fruit trees, making our own tools, a wooden house. The thing that reminded us of the scripture chase was a guy who came to look at it one time and said, "Gee - that looks like an ark!"

What the....

Start looking through my wife's journals and diaries - there it all is, in all its details.
I have had this happen a lot. I've turned down several very good jobs in the last few years and ended up in a whirlwind of moves. I haven't made any money or ended up in a situation from my imagination, but I feel much more at peace and prepared for whatever comes because of the skills I have learned and also just because I have learned to have more peace.

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harakim
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2819
Location: Salt Lake Megalopolis

Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by harakim »

JuneBug12000 wrote: February 16th, 2022, 4:26 pm I don't think inflation is good, but an anecdote:

I have friends who are really good at listening to the Spirit.

They have ten kids and have always rented. Manual labor paid the bills and mom stayed home. Not wealthy, but the best kind of people.

About 3 years ago the Spirit told them to move to Idaho, very specific small town. They bought their first house.

1 year later Spirit says move to Missouri. Sold the Idaho home for a ridiculous amount. Over $200,000 left after sale, for just 1 year! They bought a peace of land for cash. Arrived in Mo. and were going to build on land. On their way to hook up utilities at rental when the Spirit tells them to stop immediately and look up real estate site. Up pops a property they can't afford but they are told to see.

Guy sells it to them way below value for the cash they have. He is getting divorced and just wants it gone.

Now they own 2 properties. They live there a year.

Spirit says go back to Utah. They don't feel good about buying right now, so they are renting.

It appears they are about in the same position they were three years ago, with the exception that they have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank just from moving around in a circle.

I'm no fan of the false idea of something for nothing, but the Lord does work in mysterious ways.
Maybe they have stewardship over that land because they are willing to prepare a place of refuge for the Saints.

JuneBug12000
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2066

Re: Effects of Hyper-Inflation - Real World Experience

Post by JuneBug12000 »

harakim wrote: February 18th, 2022, 12:43 am
JuneBug12000 wrote: February 16th, 2022, 4:26 pm I don't think inflation is good, but an anecdote:

I have friends who are really good at listening to the Spirit.

They have ten kids and have always rented. Manual labor paid the bills and mom stayed home. Not wealthy, but the best kind of people.

About 3 years ago the Spirit told them to move to Idaho, very specific small town. They bought their first house.

1 year later Spirit says move to Missouri. Sold the Idaho home for a ridiculous amount. Over $200,000 left after sale, for just 1 year! They bought a peace of land for cash. Arrived in Mo. and were going to build on land. On their way to hook up utilities at rental when the Spirit tells them to stop immediately and look up real estate site. Up pops a property they can't afford but they are told to see.

Guy sells it to them way below value for the cash they have. He is getting divorced and just wants it gone.

Now they own 2 properties. They live there a year.

Spirit says go back to Utah. They don't feel good about buying right now, so they are renting.

It appears they are about in the same position they were three years ago, with the exception that they have hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank just from moving around in a circle.

I'm no fan of the false idea of something for nothing, but the Lord does work in mysterious ways.
Maybe they have stewardship over that land because they are willing to prepare a place of refuge for the Saints.
Yes. My friend said that she had a blessing that told her she would help people find their way to Zion and that the Spirit confirms she now knows the way, the area and people who want to help others there. It was an intentional learning experience from the Lord.

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