Financial Reserve

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iWriteStuff
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by iWriteStuff »

Silver wrote:
dlbww wrote:
Silver wrote:Have any of those proverbial like-minded friends? Then join with them to make a group purchase to save money.

https://www.providentmetals.com/2016-1- ... -leaf.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Quantity Pricing
1 - 49 $132.31
50 - 99 $131.14
100 + $129.96
Funny, I have one of those in my "coin collection" it's the size of a very small ten cent piece; you could lose it in your pocket. I think the one ounce silver CDN maple leaf's would be a better choice. Or shovels, how many times do I have to sell my good forged shovel plan?
Silver Maples are great. I prefer them over the Eagles now. Although I am opposed to monarchy, even if only a figurehead, it would be cool to see coins with the Queen's image on it being used to buy stuff at Walmart. Shovels will be in short supply after the collapse.
I've been reading up on the "numismatic value of coins". Interesting stuff:
Numismatics, according to Merriam Webster, means “ the study or act of collecting of coins, paper money, and medals.” Numismatic coins are essentially rare or valuable coins that have an external value above and beyond the base value of the precious metal. Sometimes they are valuable because they are historical, one-of-a-kind, have special marks, or were minted in an out-of-the-ordinary way. There are many factors that can add value to a coin to put it in the category of numismatics, but they are all generally valued for being rare and collectable.
http://www.sbcgold.com/blog/bullion-vs- ... investing/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Basically it is value based on whether people like to collect them or not.... Still subject to the value of the underlying metal, but with a slight premium based on desirability. The logical part of my brain says I just want the metal, but the less logical side says "Hey what if these are intrinsically more valuable because of where they come from and what they represent?"

My solution: collect both bullion and a smattering of Eagles/Maples/"numismatically valuable" pieces. Couldn't hurt, right? And I get a bit of variety that way too.

But can I just say those Silver Eagles are some darned attractive coins? @-)

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

iWriteStuff wrote:
Silver wrote:
dlbww wrote:
Silver wrote:Have any of those proverbial like-minded friends? Then join with them to make a group purchase to save money.

https://www.providentmetals.com/2016-1- ... -leaf.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Quantity Pricing
1 - 49 $132.31
50 - 99 $131.14
100 + $129.96
Funny, I have one of those in my "coin collection" it's the size of a very small ten cent piece; you could lose it in your pocket. I think the one ounce silver CDN maple leaf's would be a better choice. Or shovels, how many times do I have to sell my good forged shovel plan?
Silver Maples are great. I prefer them over the Eagles now. Although I am opposed to monarchy, even if only a figurehead, it would be cool to see coins with the Queen's image on it being used to buy stuff at Walmart. Shovels will be in short supply after the collapse.
I've been reading up on the "numismatic value of coins". Interesting stuff:
Numismatics, according to Merriam Webster, means “ the study or act of collecting of coins, paper money, and medals.” Numismatic coins are essentially rare or valuable coins that have an external value above and beyond the base value of the precious metal. Sometimes they are valuable because they are historical, one-of-a-kind, have special marks, or were minted in an out-of-the-ordinary way. There are many factors that can add value to a coin to put it in the category of numismatics, but they are all generally valued for being rare and collectable.
http://www.sbcgold.com/blog/bullion-vs- ... investing/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Basically it is value based on whether people like to collect them or not.... Still subject to the value of the underlying metal, but with a slight premium based on desirability. The logical part of my brain says I just want the metal, but the less logical side says "Hey what if these are intrinsically more valuable because of where they come from and what they represent?"

My solution: collect both bullion and a smattering of Eagles/Maples/"numismatically valuable" pieces. Couldn't hurt, right? And I get a bit of variety that way too.

But can I just say those Silver Eagles are some darned attractive coins? @-)
Without a doubt, Silver (and gold) Eagles are Bee-Yoo-Tee-Ful. They are the best bullion coin in the world. I only buy Maples because they have a lower premium and I want to accumulate more silver for when Federal Reserve Hiney Wipes lose a lot of value in a short amount of time.

Diversity in your metal collection IS a good idea. I only caution beginners against it because it requires some knowledge.

A few years back I hung out with a bunch of coin enthusiasts at http://www.realcent.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Those guys know their precious metals coins & bullion. They can even tell you which non-silver "error" coins to watch out for in your change.

The site is free to join and they buy and sell among themselves. Lots of good deals. You can check it out as a non-member.

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Robin Hood
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Robin Hood »

Silver wrote:
Without a doubt, Silver (and gold) Eagles are Bee-Yoo-Tee-Ful. They are the best bullion coin in the world.
I believe the most important issue is the quantity and purity of the gold.
I would go for Britannia's or Krugerrand's.

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

This post by Toto is excellent so I'm pasting the link here:
viewtopic.php?p=754503#p754503" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thanks, Toto.

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iWriteStuff
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by iWriteStuff »

Gee, I wonder if this one has any intrinsic value:
TrumpSilver.jpg
TrumpSilver.jpg (21.86 KiB) Viewed 3795 times
https://sdbullion.com/2016-1-oz-silver- ... lver-round" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

brianj
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by brianj »

Silver wrote:
iWriteStuff wrote:But can I just say those Silver Eagles are some darned attractive coins? @-)
Without a doubt, Silver (and gold) Eagles are Bee-Yoo-Tee-Ful. They are the best bullion coin in the world. I only buy Maples because they have a lower premium and I want to accumulate more silver for when Federal Reserve Hiney Wipes lose a lot of value in a short amount of time.
Beauty is, of course, in the eye of the beholder, and to my eyes the South African krugerrand and the Aussie coins are the prettiest. Unfortunately there's a pretty big markup on Aussie coins so I just admire them in the store.

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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

We're talking about tip of the iceberg kind of issues here. Dallas has a police pension plan that is headed towards insolvency. For too long big cities have been under the influence of tax and spend politicians who promise the public employees lucrative retirement packages and health benefits. The plans assume some fantastic annual returns to keep up with the ever-growing expenses of the plan members.

Are you in a retirement plan like that? Are you really counting on it? Don't.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-0 ... r-run-bank" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"The DPFP contreversy comes as hundreds of police and firefighters have poured millions into "DROP" accounts in which they were guaranteed exorbitant returns of 8% while the pension board has proposed a $1 billion bailout from the city of Dallas.

The city estimates that, as of November, 517 police and firefighters have DROP accounts containing more than $1 million. One, belonging to an unnamed first responder, has $4.3 million in it, city figures show. On average, the city estimates that the average DROP account contains nearly $600,000.

The controversy all comes at a time when the board has asked the cash-strapped city for a bailout over $1 billion. The board's position is that they legally can't stop the withdrawals, but the mayor disagrees."

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

And I sincerely believe, with you, that banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies; and that the principle of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but swindling futurity on a large scale.
– Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Taylor, 28 May 1816

Do you know where your financial reserve is now?

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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-0 ... oney-india" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And here is where we go back more than 100 years to see how this all worked out last time. You see, India has battled precious metals imports for quite some time. In 1910 the government of India increased the import tariffs on silver from 5% to 11%. A market report in 1912, by Pixley & Abell, a gold wholesaler, pointed to a 28% fall in silver demand in the Indian bazaars in the three years following the increase. They attributed this to not just a fall in demand for silver due to tax increases, but also a substitution of gold for silver in people’s savings as gold became more attractive on a relative basis.

Between 1910 and 1930 net imports of silver in India fell from 98m ounces to 31m, according to British Geological Survey reports. After this time India gradually became the world’s largest gold consumer, a position it finally lost to China in 2015.

And it seems a return to silver as a major investment for consumers in India may be on the cards. Following the recent import tax hikes for gold, 2015 saw Indian silver imports grow to almost 8,000 tonnes, 14% up on the previous 2014 record. At the same time, demand for gold jewelry, which accounts for 75% of all Indian gold demand, is down 30% for the 12 months to the end of September 2016, according to the World Gold Council. This points to a possible shift back to silver as a more prominent investment in India.

Gold makes up the vast majority of Indian jewelry sales. But the graph shows the rapid growth in silver jewelry demand in India, which is up over 600% in ten years, relative to marginal growth of only 25% in gold jewelry demand.

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iWriteStuff
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Re: Financial Reserve

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Silver wrote:But the graph shows the rapid growth in silver jewelry demand in India, which is up over 600% in ten years, relative to marginal growth of only 25% in gold jewelry demand.
I briefly got excited this morning seeing my silver holdings up 2.5%. Then I promptly realized that it didn't matter because I had no intention of selling any of it. Price only matters when you buy or sell. To that point, it just got more expensive to add to my pile :( :((

P.S. - I couldn't resist - I HAD to have me one of those glorious Trump coins pictured above. Just one, though. I don't want to look at him any more than I have to.

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Original_Intent
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Original_Intent »

I like bullion, just good ol' Apmex or other rounds.
Junk has some advantages, I don't like that it is at best 90% purity. The plus side is you get it with little premium, and if the SHTF it will probably be the easiest "money" to trade with. I suspect bullion and barter would catch on pretty quick.
Numismatics I steer clear from. The best thing of knowing numismatics is if you can pick up something that the owner doesn't know the value. Problem is, anything old enough and of good enough quality to be a real find, the person will either know the value or will have it appraised before selling. The premium is just too high. If the SHTF, you might be able to pick some up for a good price if you intend to hold them until things come back together (and you don;t think we will be in the millennium.) Oh yeah I prefer solver over gold for two reasons: Gold:Silver ratio is out of whack, and silver has higher volatility ALWAYS. So it drops quicker and rises faster. The fact that the ratio is close to 70 silver : 1 gold means that over the long haul, there should be serious moves either up, or at least the ratio should go below 20 silver : 1 gold at some point. It's unlikely to go much higher as it is rare for it to be 80 silver : 1 gold or above. source http://www.macrotrends.net/1441/gold-to-silver-ratio" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That's just regarding PMs. Of course there are other things to take care of way before you concern yourself with PMs.

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

iWriteStuff wrote:
Silver wrote:But the graph shows the rapid growth in silver jewelry demand in India, which is up over 600% in ten years, relative to marginal growth of only 25% in gold jewelry demand.
I briefly got excited this morning seeing my silver holdings up 2.5%. Then I promptly realized that it didn't matter because I had no intention of selling any of it. Price only matters when you buy or sell. To that point, it just got more expensive to add to my pile :( :((

P.S. - I couldn't resist - I HAD to have me one of those glorious Trump coins pictured above. Just one, though. I don't want to look at him any more than I have to.
I never sell. Other than giving it away to my children I can't see any scenario where I reduce my stack unless there is a personal or national/international crisis. The overcomb is a classic. No shame in owning one. Maybe you and I should corner the market on those puppies and sell them to you know who here. There is also: "Vote for Nobody...Nobody Can Help Us"

The Euro still has some falling to do. PMs will get less expensive as the US$ strengthens...I think.

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dlbww
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by dlbww »

Not looking so good for PM holders in India at the moment. Could that happen here?
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-0 ... dden-money" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I've always thought my forged steel shovel storage plan was a good one. Who raids a garden shed and steals your shovel(s)? Exactly, no one!

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

dlbww wrote:Not looking so good for PM holders in India at the moment. Could that happen here?
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-0 ... dden-money" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I've always thought my forged steel shovel storage plan was a good one. Who raids a garden shed and steals your shovel(s)? Exactly, no one!
You have now mentioned your "forged steel shovel storage plan" twice in this thread. Would you mind fleshing out the details for the rest of us?

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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

Silver (and gold) prices have been suppressed. As the truth of the price fixing becomes general knowledge, the price may seek its true market value. I do not believe that the Gadiantons will give up easily though.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-0 ... ver-market" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Deutsche Bank Provides "Smoking Gun" Proof Of Massive Rigging And Fraud In The Silver Market

by Tyler Durden
Dec 8, 2016 9:03 AM

Back in April, when we first reported that Deutsche Bank had agreed to settle allegations it had rigged the silver market in exchange for $38 million, we revealed something stunning: "in a curious twist, the settlement letter revealed that the former members of the manipulation cartel have turned on each other", and that Deutsche Bank would provide docments implicating other precious metals riggers. To wit: "In addition to valuable monetary consideration, Deutsche Bank has also agreed to provide cooperation to plaintiffs, including the production of instant messages, and other electronic communications, as part of the settlement. In Plaintiff’s estimation, the cooperation to be provided by Deutsche Bank will substantially assist Plaintiffs in the prosecution of their claims against the non-settling defendants."

Overnight we finally got a glimpse into what this "production" contained, and according to documents filed by the plaintiffs in the class action lawsuit, what Deutsche Bank provided as part of its settlement was nothing short of "smoking gun" proof that UBS Group AG, HSBC Holdings Plc, Bank of Nova Scotia and other firms rigged the silver market. The allegation, as Bloomberg first noted, came in a filing Wednesday in a Manhattan federal court lawsuit filed in 2014 by individuals and entities that bought or sold futures contracts.

In the document records surrendered by Deutsche Bank and presented below, traders and submitters were captured coordinating trades in advance of a daily phone call, manipulating the spot market for silver, conspiring to fix the spread on silver offered to customers and using illegal strategies to rig prices.

“Plaintiffs are now able to plead with direct, ‘smoking gun’ evidence,’ including secret electronic chats involving silver traders and submitters across a number of financial institutions, a multi-year, well-coordinated and wide-ranging conspiracy to rig the prices,” the plaintiffs said in their filing.

The latest evidence is critical because as the plaintiffs add, the new scheme “far surpasses the conspiracy alleged earlier.” As a result, the litigants are seeking permission to file a new complaint with the additional allegations, i.e., demand even more reparations from the defendants who have not yet settled, and perhaps even more evidence of ongoing market rigging. Their proposed complaint broadens the case beyond the four banks initially sued to include claims against units of Barclays Plc, BNP Paribas Fortis SA, Standard Chartered Plc and Bank of America Corp.

Representatives of UBS, BNP Paribas Fortis, HSBC, Standard Chartered and Scotiabank didn’t immediately respond to e-mails outside regular business hours seeking comment on the allegations. Barclays and Bank of America declined to immediately comment.

The Deutsche Bank documents show, among other things, how two UBS traders communicated directly with two Deutsche Bank traders and discussed ways to rig the market. The traders shared customer order-flow information, improperly triggered customer stop-loss orders, and engaged in practices such as spoofing, all meant to destabilize the price of silver ahead of the fix and result in forced selling or buying. It is also what has led on so many occasions to the infamous previous metals "slam", when out of nowhere billions in notional contracts emerge, usually with the intent to sell, to halt any upside moment in the precious metals/

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Original_Intent
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Original_Intent »

Beat me, Silver! ^^

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iWriteStuff
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by iWriteStuff »

It's ok. The banks will pay a meager fine and the guilty parties will go on to serve in the Trump administration.

Side note: he certainly is collecting a lot of generals and bankers. It's almost as though he's preparing for two kinds of war... :-? :-? :-?

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dlbww
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by dlbww »

Silver wrote:
dlbww wrote:Not looking so good for PM holders in India at the moment. Could that happen here?
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-0 ... dden-money" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I've always thought my forged steel shovel storage plan was a good one. Who raids a garden shed and steals your shovel(s)? Exactly, no one!
You have now mentioned your "forged steel shovel storage plan" twice in this thread. Would you mind fleshing out the details for the rest of us?
Well it looks like no one listened to me years ago (and now it's mostly too late; the prices have doubled or tripled) and now you're begging for my "plan", the "forged steel shovel plan" (those are the good ones that cost $$ because they don't fold in half when you try and dig out a rock) which consisted of stocking up on shovels, one for every member of the family and extended family for the lean times ahead when you're going to have to grow your own food (by digging up your back yard). IWS might be OK if he has a forge to beat all those rifle barrels he has stockpiled into plow-shares; "And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plow-shares, and their spears into pruning-hooks—nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more." (2Ne 12:4)

I think the best "plan" is still a self-reliancy plan, it was God's original plan to Adam and Eve, "By the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, until thou shalt return unto the ground—for thou shalt surely die—for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou wast, and unto dust shalt thou return." (Moses4:25)

This is Chris Martenson's plan: https://www.peakprosperity.com/video/85 ... -should-do" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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dlbww
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by dlbww »

Silver wrote:Silver (and gold) prices have been suppressed. As the truth of the price fixing becomes general knowledge, the price may seek its true market value. I do not believe that the Gadiantons will give up easily though.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-0 ... ver-market" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I'm not so sure that the "true market value" would be any different than it is today. And today it's down (a better investment would have been purchasing a beaten down natgas stock a few days ago and you'd be up 5.7 % with little downside risk and an expected double by the end of February). PM's are a hedge against government, nothing more. So when you see people start losing confidence in government that will be your PM moment (and it might be short-lived) and your short window of opportunity to trade PM's for things that you really need (which may have increased in value as well); just my opinion.

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

dlbww wrote:
Silver wrote:Silver (and gold) prices have been suppressed. As the truth of the price fixing becomes general knowledge, the price may seek its true market value. I do not believe that the Gadiantons will give up easily though.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-0 ... ver-market" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I'm not so sure that the "true market value" would be any different than it is today. And today it's down (a better investment would have been purchasing a beaten down natgas stock a few days ago and you'd be up 5.7 % with little downside risk and an expected double by the end of February). PM's are a hedge against government, nothing more. So when you see people start losing confidence in government that will be your PM moment (and it might be short-lived) and your short window of opportunity to trade PM's for things that you really need (which may have increased in value as well); just my opinion.
Philosophical differences between us. I refuse to personally own paper or digital other than the minimum amount of Federal Reserve Hiney Wipes in my credit union account. Therefore, I knowingly miss out on all natgas stock deals, for example. I have no delusions about how quickly things can go bad. There might very well be a moment where I'm standing on the proverbial roof of the US embassy in Saigon trying desperately to get on the last helicopter. In that sudden scenario, very little of my precious metals will be going with me. That's why I recommend that everyone get their food storage and other supplies first.

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dlbww
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by dlbww »

We are entering a dangerous period of government control around the globe; governments are broke and they are hunting taxes. PM's like gold and silver may not be the safe haven once thought, see: https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/mark ... the-abyss/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That doesn't make paper currencies more safe because there is also a push to eliminate cash, it's all about the hunt for taxes. Socialist governments are going to fight all the way to the end; what's yours is theirs.

And bonds are heading down, they've peaked, which means interest rates are going up and real estate is heading down, see: https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/mark ... y-is-over/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I should add a disclaimer at this point: I'm not that smart (nor have the time) at following global economic conditions but I have friends that are that give me advice. I've also been following Armstrong's work for the past several years and he hasn't disappointed but the best advice has come from Church leaders and personal revelation.

Now back to my shovel plan (self-reliancy plan actually) ....
Last edited by dlbww on December 9th, 2016, 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

dlbww wrote:We are entering a dangerous period of government control around the globe; governments are broke and they are hunting taxes. PM's like gold and silver may not be the safe haven once thought, see: https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/mark ... the-abyss/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That doesn't make paper currencies more safe because there is also a push to eliminate cash, it's all about the hunt for taxes. Socialist governments are going to fight all the way to the end; what's yours is theirs.

And bonds are heading down, they've peaked, which means interest rates are going up and real estate is heading down, see: https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/mark ... y-is-over/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Now back to my shovel plan (self-reliancy plan actually) ....
You're right. The government is the great and abominable church. Only the government has the power to rob us of our lives, our wealth, our children, our heritage, our freedom.

The government can confiscate anything...even shovels.

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dlbww
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by dlbww »

Silver wrote:The government can confiscate anything...even shovels.
What? NNNNOOoooooo not my shovels!!! Actually that might be the last thing that is confiscated because now they're going to have to feed me. :)

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

dlbww wrote:
Silver wrote:The government can confiscate anything...even shovels.
What? NNNNOOoooooo not my shovels!!! Actually that might be the last thing that is confiscated because now they're going to have to feed me. :)
Nah, you're a survivor. You'll figure out what to do.

Silver
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Re: Financial Reserve

Post by Silver »

Does anyone have a strong counter-argument to this statement found on Zerohedge?

"Deflation

Quantitative easing was also introduced as a way of increasing private-sector spending and raising inflation. Some investors even worried it would spark hyperinflation and rushed to buy gold. Instead, say some managers, it has led to deflation.

“It took me a long time to work it out,” said CQS’s Mr. Hintze. “It’s a very complex issue.” He said that massive amounts of liquidity mean that “liquidity’s not worth much anymore,” which leads to negative interest rates. “I do think it [QE] is a massive deflationary force. The reason is because money is worth less but the price of real assets goes up.”

Mr. Odey said quantitative easing leads to deflation because weaker competitors are kept alive by cheap debt as “zombie” companies." (end quote)

I would add to that by saying that many have been fooled into thinking that the economy is strong, or at least getting stronger, because the stock market is rising. That thought should be tempered by the fact that many (most?) large corporations have been engaging in their own stock buy-backs, enabled by ultra-low interest rates.

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