exalted man : "God was a man like you" (serpent to eve)

[brlenox]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

Robin Hood
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

[brlenox]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

I would be more impressed if you actually addressed the very significant issues that I speak to in this post:

https://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtop ... 30#p796771

That you seem reluctant to do so is very telling.

[e-eye2.0]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

I would be more impressed if you actually addressed the very significant issues that I speak to in this post:

https://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtop ... 30#p796771

That you seem reluctant to do so is very telling.

Brlenox - I was just starting to enjoy the thread. Even if Robin Hood doesn't care for a course correction I would like to see your opinion on the matter and supporting information.

[brlenox]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

I would be more impressed if you actually addressed the very significant issues that I speak to in this post:

https://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtop ... 30#p796771

That you seem reluctant to do so is very telling.

Brlenox - I was just starting to enjoy the thread. Even if Robin Hood doesn't care for a course correction I would like to see your opinion on the matter and supporting information.

Very thoughtful of you, thank you.

I work best when I understand the direction of the person I am responding to. That is why I often ask questions, as I have done with Robin Hood here to flush out their clear point of view and perspective--and attitude. That way I am not just supporting a random direction that may not address the perspectives that are important to the person I am engaged in conversation with. So If you can direct my response with a little insight of your perspective or perhaps reiterate an element of this conversation that you would like to see addressed that would guide my efforts.

As you may have noted, because I often feel the need to address the entirety of a topic I cover too much and then lose people in my efforts. I would prefer to make the effort meaningful by developing it a tangent at a time according to your thoughts.

[Robin Hood]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

I would be more impressed if you actually addressed the very significant issues that I speak to in this post:

https://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtop ... 30#p796771

That you seem reluctant to do so is very telling.

Frankly, I have no interest in impressing you, nor anyone else for that matter.
I have learned a great lesson over the years; and that is that those who think they have some special knowledge concerning the mysteries of God, know less than next to nothing.
So go ahead and boast in your knowledge of the "very significant issues that (you) speak to". But remember that God is God and you are not.
Next to him both your understanding and my understanding, even on a good day, is puny and infantile at best.

[brlenox]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

I would be more impressed if you actually addressed the very significant issues that I speak to in this post:

https://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtop ... 30#p796771

That you seem reluctant to do so is very telling.

Frankly, I have no interest in impressing you, nor anyone else for that matter.
I have learned a great lesson over the years; and that is that those who think they have some special knowledge concerning the mysteries of God, know less than next to nothing.
So go ahead and boast in your knowledge of the "very significant issues that (you) speak to". But remember that God is God and you are not.
Next to him both your understanding and my understanding, even on a good day, is puny and infantile at best.

I have no difficulty with your observations but you speak like the person you claim I am. You clearly think you have some special knowledge. You have outlined how you came to your conclusions and my perspective is that you are simply wrong according to your own logic.

But you still fail to address that logic for some reasons.

My second bewilderment is purpose. Why do people come to a discussion forum and then take umbrage and refuse to engage in a discussion? When you responded the first time did you expect that everyone would simply just agree with you or are you able to discuss your perspectives objectively.

If you are afraid to openly address the specifics of others observations of your observations no one is benefited and instead of mature interaction it seems more like a petulant response to a genuine effort to try to expand understandings. I suggest that if you really don't want to discuss - then don't open a discussion with a response on a forum designed to encourage discussion. Just a thought, or two, or three, or ...

[Doug]

There is an only one way to become perdition, to tell God you no longer want his help.
And since God holds our agency sacred, he has no choice but to honor that.
The big problem with this is that perdition is now miserable, blames God and wants
Everyone else to agree with him.

It is clear you don't want help, you just want everyone to agree with you.
So I'm going to stop trying to help where it is not wanted.

[Alaris]

There is an only one way to become perdition, to tell God you no longer want his help.
And since God holds our agency sacred, he has no choice but to honor that.
The big problem with this is that perdition is now miserable, blames God and wants
Everyone else to agree with him.

It is clear you don't want help, you just want everyone to agree with you.
So I'm going to stop trying to help where it is not wanted.

How to become perdition is one of those mysteries many try to explain away without understanding other mysteries that may be required to fully understand ... the first mystery. Growing up in the church, the explanations I received at my questions always bothered me.

"How does one become perdition?"

"Well it's like really hard. You have to like know Jesus and then deny him."

After many years of study, mysteries unlocked here and there ... I still don't understand all the ends, or whether rebellious souls are taken from one creation into the next. I have heard the "they are recycled" theory which doesn't quite ring true.

My current understanding: Like just about everything in the gospel, it comes to down to agency. Do you choose A or B. Do you want C, then you must go through steps, D, E, F , etc. At any point someone can jump off the gospel train by their agency and say I choose Z - open rebellion.

Here's a thought provoking question ... if bodies are needed to progress, how were souls condemned to eternal outer darkness (or finite outer darkness ending in destruction) without ever having received a body?

[inho]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

I would be more impressed if you actually addressed the very significant issues that I speak to in this post:

https://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtop ... 30#p796771

That you seem reluctant to do so is very telling.

Brlenox - I was just starting to enjoy the thread. Even if Robin Hood doesn't care for a course correction I would like to see your opinion on the matter and supporting information.

Very thoughtful of you, thank you.

I work best when I understand the direction of the person I am responding to.

Brlenox, I am not sure if I understand the direction you are heading to in the linked post. The point you seem to make is that since Robin Hood referenced the title of this thread, you wanted to point out that Satan in the garden only said to Eve that men would become like gods with lower case g. You wanted to point this out, since this is RH's belief too. This I get. However, I don't understand the relevance of Alma 42:3. The way I read it, it says the exactly same thing as the snake in the Garden. Alma says the man had become as God, knowing good and evil. In other words, Alma refers to only one attribute of God, namely the knowledge of good and evil. This is the same thing Satan referred in the garden: ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Robin Hood asked for scriptural references of becoming like God in every possible way. Alma 42:3 refers to only one attribute. Am I missing something here?

[Robin Hood]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

I would be more impressed if you actually addressed the very significant issues that I speak to in this post:

https://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtop ... 30#p796771

That you seem reluctant to do so is very telling.

Brlenox - I was just starting to enjoy the thread. Even if Robin Hood doesn't care for a course correction I would like to see your opinion on the matter and supporting information.

Very thoughtful of you, thank you.

I work best when I understand the direction of the person I am responding to.

Brlenox, I am not sure if I understand the direction you are heading to in the linked post. The point you seem to make is that since Robin Hood referenced the title of this thread, you wanted to point out that Satan in the garden only said to Eve that men would become like gods with lower case g. You wanted to point this out, since this is RH's belief too. This I get. However, I don't understand the relevance of Alma 42:3. The way I read it, it says the exactly same thing as the snake in the Garden. Alma says the man had become as God, knowing good and evil. In other words, Alma refers to only one attribute of God, namely the knowledge of good and evil. This is the same thing Satan referred in the garden: ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Robin Hood asked for scriptural references of becoming like God in every possible way. Alma 42:3 refers to only one attribute. Am I missing something here?

You're not missing something.
You have put it much better than I could.

[Robin Hood]

It may have become apparent to some participating in this thread, that I do not share the view that we will become God in the sense of acquiring all of the attributes of the almighty, omnipotent, self-existent God we worship, and thus be prayed to and worshipped in our own right.

I have no problem believing that we can become a god through faithfulness and be rewarded by our Father with a position of authority in his enterprise (Moses 1:39); rather like joining the board of a family business, or even heading up a small subsidiary. But those over whom we exercise any authority (which will be the Father's authority, not ours) will pray to, worship and adore the same being we do.

I absolutely maintain that there is no scriptural evidence whatsoever that we will ever be God Almighty.
Indeed, the scriptures contain references to the inspiration which acts as the catalyst for such desires. Sample below:

Isaiah 14:13
For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God....

Moses 4:1
...That Satan...came before me, saying............ wherefore give me thine honour.

Moses 4:3
... and also, that I should give unto him mine own power.....

More could be cited, but these are sufficient for my present purpose.

[Juliet]

This kind of stuff brings tons of questions to my mind.
Is Adam the only one who will become like God? But we all are supposed to have the chance.
Then what about Jesus, did God have to be a Jesus too.

I think Adam means "Many". I think this is where we misunderstand the atonement. To me, the atonement is that Jesus gained power over death because He was able to gain the wisdom and intelligence of His Father. Jesus had such a close relationship with Heavenly Father, that every time He was tempted, He was able to receive God's word and overcome the temptation. So when He suffered in gethsemane, what He did was experienced every kind of temptation that the adversary had and ever could use and every experience we would ever endure where our ignorance would cause sin and suffering. He was able to get the 'keys' on how to be delivered from every negative circumstance because of His ability to receive truth from God. When fully filled with the Spirit of truth, He became perfect, and overcame death.

Now, we are to gain that same wisdom Jesus did, by following Jesus' spirit and the Holy Ghost. We too, can gain the same knowledge Jesus did, but we don't have to earn it like Jesus did, we just have to receive it. It is like, Jesus invented electricity. Lets go a step further and say He invented free electricity. So now, anyone who goes to Jesus can get free electricity. It doesn't have to be reinvented because Jesus invented it for us.

Again, one person invented the fridge, now we all have a fridge. We don't all have to go invent the fridge now, because once 1 person invents it, we all get to share in the blessing of the invention.

So, Jesus was able to invent truth through the atonement that applies to us in every circumstance, and as a result, we can also receive perfect truth by living His commandments. And to those who follow Him, "he gives commandments not a few." (D&C59:4)

So, God had all truth, we don't know how He got it, but He did, and Jesus downloaded it while in the flesh into a compatible form with the human existence. Now, we all have the opportunity to become like God, because the information is downloadable via Christ's atonement, whereby He gained the keys for Human salvation and now willingly shares them with us as we keep His commandments.

We don't suffer against all the sin to become like God, we just have to adhere to the Spirit of truth that was made possible to receive by Christ's atonement. And that is how we can all become like God. Jesus paved the way, now we can follow it and make it home.

[Doug]

What did Jesus Do? ‘Why I do the things I saw my father do when worlds came rolling into existence, my Father worked out His kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom, I shall present it to my father so that He may obtain kingdom upon kingdom, an it will exalt Him in glory, He will then take a higher exaltation, and I will take His place, and thereby become exalted myself.’
(Excerpts from the King Follet Discourse, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 345-348)

This is the process of eternal progression.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
...

This is not my doctrine.
This is not Joseph's doctrine.
This is not the Son's doctrine.
This is not the Father's doctrine.
This is not the Grand Father's doctrine.
This is eternal doctrine.

[Robin Hood]

What did Jesus Do? ‘Why I do the things I saw my father do when worlds came rolling into existence, my Father worked out His kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom, I shall present it to my father so that He may obtain kingdom upon kingdom, an it will exalt Him in glory, He will then take a higher exaltation, and I will take His place, and thereby become exalted myself.’
(Excerpts from the King Follet Discourse, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 345-348)

This is the process of eternal progression.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
...

This is not my doctrine.
This is not Joseph's doctrine.
This is not the Son's doctrine.
This is not the Father's doctrine.
This is not the Grand Father's doctrine.
This is eternal doctrine.

I know I said I was finished with this thread, but I just have to comment on the above.
Well, in fact, post a question or two.

1. What happens to all the ones who are not the eldest son?
If I understand your model correctly, it appears to condemn the rest of us (and we're talking billions here) to something less than becoming God (thus it appears you actually agree with me after all!). In fact, it appears this world was created and populated solely for the purpose of providing a vehicle for the eldest son to become God.

2. Daughters? Does your model not suggest that women get a pretty easy ride on one level, but are ultimately damned?

[brlenox]

Brlenox, Doug,
Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.
Clearly you need a little more maturity in the gospel, and possibly a deeper reverence and humility regarding your standing before Almighty God. Remember Moses' experience?
I'm sure you'll find out for yourselves one day.
I wish you well.

I would be more impressed if you actually addressed the very significant issues that I speak to in this post:

https://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtop ... 30#p796771

That you seem reluctant to do so is very telling.

Brlenox - I was just starting to enjoy the thread. Even if Robin Hood doesn't care for a course correction I would like to see your opinion on the matter and supporting information.

Very thoughtful of you, thank you.

I work best when I understand the direction of the person I am responding to.

Brlenox, I am not sure if I understand the direction you are heading to in the linked post. The point you seem to make is that since Robin Hood referenced the title of this thread, you wanted to point out that Satan in the garden only said to Eve that men would become like gods with lower case g. You wanted to point this out, since this is RH's belief too. This I get. However, I don't understand the relevance of Alma 42:3. The way I read it, it says the exactly same thing as the snake in the Garden. Alma says the man had become as God, knowing good and evil. In other words, Alma refers to only one attribute of God, namely the knowledge of good and evil. This is the same thing Satan referred in the garden: ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Robin Hood asked for scriptural references of becoming like God in every possible way. Alma 42:3 refers to only one attribute. Am I missing something here?

My point with Robinhood is simply that he claimed by inference that Satan had stated that we could become as "God" (big G) and that we should not allow the words of "Satan to Eve" to become our doctrine i.e. that we could become as "GOD". He then implied that he firmly believed we were "gods" "little g" and that all of his research had brought him to the point that he could except that we were "gods" (little g) and that this was a major distinction between becoming a BIG G God.

My point was that according to scripture Satan claimed that we could become little g gods only. Therefore his observation was that we should not build our doctrine on the words of Satan to EVE but he had done exactly that. He claimed that Satan was perfectly correct and that all man could attain was the little g god state of being. In other words Robin Hood disagreed with Robin Hood. I also would expect that if he had thought I had mischaracterized his point of view that he would correct me and illustrate where I had erred.

My point with the Alma verse was to illustrate that at least one scripture was out there that man was as GOD (Big G). My point being that if a prophet of the Book of Mormon intimated that man was as a God, (Big G)then was he willing to accept the error of his method of evaluation and pursue additional material that discussed this possibility further.

Now to put this all in perspective, little "g" big "G" is not a particularly relevant point in the least. I would never use any sort of comparison between "G's" and "g" as it is just not the degree of relevance that Robin Hood gave it. This is not my line of reasoning and I consider it sorrowfully lacking as a process of conclusion to say the least. However, it was the evidence the Robin put forth that he claimed was compelling to him. So to respond to him my first effort was to solicit his own claims and show him that the way he had defined things was clearly inconsistent with himself and then to invite him to further discussion on the subject to illustrate the many sources, scripture and prophetic and apostolic commentary which illustrate that the Doctrine of Godhood embraced the concepts of becoming as God ( bid "G"). To date Robin Hood has not manifest any interest in exploring why this doctrine is so widely accepted and what the valid sources are that speak to the material. He is one of the several that lock onto an unfoundated opinion and then it becomes their gospel. I worry about individuals who can be so self affirming, stating clearly that they know the truth and everyone else around them is wrong and in poor standing with God (of the Big "G) because they have a confirmed belief that is in opposition to prophets and apostles. We one can adamantly continue in this path there is risk involved.

Now one final point is that when one truly understands the doctrine of "G"odhood, there is some possibilities found in the quotes and scriptures that allow for some different informed speculations that actually Robin Hood might be inclined to like and accept however we cannot get to those perspectives because he lacks the ability to converse and dialogue and discuss without getting emotionally distraught by having to defend an undefendable position.

[Doug]

What did Jesus Do? ‘Why I do the things I saw my father do when worlds came rolling into existence, my Father worked out His kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom, I shall present it to my father so that He may obtain kingdom upon kingdom, an it will exalt Him in glory, He will then take a higher exaltation, and I will take His place, and thereby become exalted myself.’
(Excerpts from the King Follet Discourse, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 345-348)

This is the process of eternal progression.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
...

This is not my doctrine.
This is not Joseph's doctrine.
This is not the Son's doctrine.
This is not the Father's doctrine.
This is not the Grand Father's doctrine.
This is eternal doctrine.

I know I said I was finished with this thread, but I just have to comment on the above.
Well, in fact, post a question or two.

1. What happens to all the ones who are not the eldest son?
If I understand your model correctly, it appears to condemn the rest of us (and we're talking billions here) to something less than becoming God (thus it appears you actually agree with me after all!). In fact, it appears this world was created and populated solely for the purpose of providing a vehicle for the eldest son to become God.

2. Daughters? Does your model not suggest that women get a pretty easy ride on one level, but are ultimately damned?

You become an eldest Son.
Becoming what an eldest Son would chose to be the mother of a world is not an easy ride.

[brlenox]

What did Jesus Do? ‘Why I do the things I saw my father do when worlds came rolling into existence, my Father worked out His kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom, I shall present it to my father so that He may obtain kingdom upon kingdom, an it will exalt Him in glory, He will then take a higher exaltation, and I will take His place, and thereby become exalted myself.’
(Excerpts from the King Follet Discourse, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 345-348)

This is the process of eternal progression.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
A world is created to be the residence of the Children of a Father.
The Father's eldest Son Redeems that world and presents it to his Father.
The Father becomes a Grand Father.
The Son Becomes a Father and has Spirit Children.
...

This is not my doctrine.
This is not Joseph's doctrine.
This is not the Son's doctrine.
This is not the Father's doctrine.
This is not the Grand Father's doctrine.
This is eternal doctrine.

There is one distinction that I find very important in this listing hierarchy. I have highlighted in Blue the relationship that I thing we should reconsider. Now I may be misunderstanding the intent of the above but if not it does not embrace this distinction spoken to by Bruce R. McConkie:

As men [and women] pursue the goal of eternal life, they first enter in at the gate of repentance and baptism, thereby taking upon themselves the name of Christ. They then gain power to become his sons and daughters, to be adopted into his family, to be brethren and sisters in his kingdom. Baptism standing alone does not transform them into family members, but it opens the door to such a blessed relationship; and if men so live as to obtain the Spirit and are in fact born again, then they become members of the Holy Family. Then, if they press forward with a steadfastness in Christ, keeping the commandments and living by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God, they qualify for celestial marriage, and this gives them power to become the sons [and daughters] of God, meaning the Father. They thus become joint-heirs with Christ who is his natural heir. Those who are sons [and daughters] of God in this sense are the ones who become gods in the world to come. (D&C 76:54–60) They have exaltation and godhood because the family unit continues in eternity. (D&C 132:19–24). (McConkie, Bruce R., Doctrinal New Testament Commentary 2:474.)

The point of becoming joint-heirs with Christ ads a dimension that appears to be missing from the above listing. Those who remain sons and daughters of Christ do not become as God (of the big "G") but if they have become sons and daughters of Christ they now have the opportunity to become the sons and daughters of GOD by celestial marriage and becoming as the Father is.

[Doug]

brlenox,
Christ redeems all of this world and we become his spirit children. Ether 3:14
Out of those he redeems, now his children, there is a first born.

Everyone that becomes a Father did so through inheritance and they inherit everything Christ does because they are a Christ.
Thus they are joint heirs with Christ.

[Doug]

When you climb up a ladder, you must begin at the bottom, and ascend step by step, until you arrive at the top…It is not all to be comprehended in this world; it will be a great work to learn our salvation and exaltation even beyond the grave.” (Excerpts from the King Follet Discourse, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 345-348)

[Doug]

https://daysidixonleli.files.wordpress. ... nymous.pdf

[Robin Hood]

Personally I think some on here are so far off the truth in this matter that it is bordering on theological heresy. But that's just what I think.

However, to further illustrate my point about the significance of the capital and lower case "g", I did a little digging.
The scriptures have a remarkable consistency throughout, which is why cross-referencing is so useful. Themes introduced in one book are often repeated or emphasized in another. This consistency can span several independent prophets, often separated by many centuries.

The word "God" appears countless times throughout the scriptures. When written with a capital "G" it always, without exception that I can find, refers to the being we worship. I don't think this is controversial.

The word "god" or "gods" appears far less frequently, about 217 times in all, and always, without exception, refers to something other than God.
This is true in Genesis, Exodus, Daniel, Numbers, Leviticus, Chronicles, Judges, Isaiah, Joshua, Kings, Deuteronomy, Psalms, Hosea, Acts, Corinthians, Mormon, Alma, D&C 76, D&C 121, and even Facsimile 1.

This is unquestionably a remarkable level of consistency. However, it appears that some participating in this discussion are making one single exception to this consistent and repeated scriptural rule; namely D&C 132. Here, we are informed that exaltation in the highest level of the Celestial Kingdom is reserved for those who become "gods", while also being informed that those who qualify in every respect other than celestial marriage will become angels and not "gods".

I strongly suggest that it is unreasonable to ignore the repeated testimony of scripture throughout thousands of years in this one instance in order to maintain a doctrinal position which cannot be supported in any other way.

Just to repeat; in every instance of the lower case "god" or "gods" being used throughout the scriptural record it is to describe something less than or inferior to God. I believe Joseph Smith was a true prophet and applied the same rule. In fact, Joseph used "God" when referring to the being we worship around 20 times in D&C 132! But when referring to us (ie. something other than God) he used the lower case "gods".
Some here believe this is of no significance, but they are wrong. If Joseph was a true prophet we would expect to find his approach to the production of scripture consistent with every prophet that had gone before.
The good news is that is exactly what we find.

I therefore maintain that to apply a different rule to this one section of the D&C (remember, he applied the rule elsewhere in the D&C too) is a prime example of wresting the scriptures.

So, to claim that we are destined to become Almighty God (with all the trappings that suggests) may well be what some here believe, but it is inconsistent with the testimony of scripture both ancient and modern.

[Doug]

Personally I think some on here are so far off the truth in this matter that it is bordering on theological heresy. But that's just what I think.

However, to further illustrate my point about the significance of the capital and lower case "g", I did a little digging.
The scriptures have a remarkable consistency throughout, which is why cross-referencing is so useful. Themes introduced in one book are often repeated or emphasized in another. This consistency can span several independent prophets, often separated by many centuries.

The word "God" appears countless times throughout the scriptures. When written with a capital "G" it always, without exception that I can find, refers to the being we worship. I don't think this is controversial.

The word "god" or "gods" appears far less frequently, about 217 times in all, and always, without exception, refers to something other than God.
This is true in Genesis, Exodus, Daniel, Numbers, Leviticus, Chronicles, Judges, Isaiah, Joshua, Kings, Deuteronomy, Psalms, Hosea, Acts, Corinthians, Mormon, Alma, D&C 76, D&C 121, and even Facsimile 1.

This is unquestionably a remarkable level of consistency. However, it appears that some participating in this discussion are making one single exception to this consistent and repeated scriptural rule; namely D&C 132. Here, we are informed that exaltation in the highest level of the Celestial Kingdom is reserved for those who become "gods", while also being informed that those who qualify in every respect other than celestial marriage will become angels and not "gods".

I strongly suggest that it is unreasonable to ignore the repeated testimony of scripture throughout thousands of years in this one instance in order to maintain a doctrinal position which cannot be supported in any other way.

Just to repeat; in every instance of the lower case "god" or "gods" being used throughout the scriptural record it is to describe something less than or inferior to God. I believe Joseph Smith was a true prophet and applied the same rule. In fact, Joseph used "God" when referring to the being we worship around 20 times in D&C 132! But when referring to us (ie. something other than God) he used the lower case "gods".
Some here believe this is of no significance, but they are wrong. If Joseph was a true prophet we would expect to find his approach to the production of scripture consistent with every prophet that had gone before.
The good news is that is exactly what we find.

I therefore maintain that to apply a different rule to this one section of the D&C (remember, he applied the rule elsewhere in the D&C too) is a prime example of wresting the scriptures.

So, to claim that we are destined to become Almighty God (with all the trappings that suggests) may well be what some here believe, but it is inconsistent with the testimony of scripture both ancient and modern.

Again, the difference between God and god(s) is a matter of grammar not attributes. If all you look at are the scriptures that contain either God or god(s), this can be argued forever. But if you look at the whole of what is said about the plan of salvation, there is no argument. Every male has equal opportunity to become God because all males are gods. And all females have equal opportunity to become the wife of a God and the Mother of a world.

Go read The Journal Of Discourses, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, ...

[Robin Hood]

Again, the difference between God and god(s) is a matter of grammar not attributes. If all you look at are the scriptures that contain either God or god(s), this can be argued forever. But if you look at the whole of what is said about the plan of salvation, there is no argument. Every male has equal opportunity to become God because all males are gods. And all females have equal opportunity to become the wife of a God and the Mother of a world.

Go read The Journal Of Discourses, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, ...

There's none as blind as those who refuse to see.

[Doug]

Again, the difference between God and god(s) is a matter of grammar not attributes. If all you look at are the scriptures that contain either God or god(s), this can be argued forever. But if you look at the whole of what is said about the plan of salvation, there is no argument. Every male has equal opportunity to become God because all males are gods. And all females have equal opportunity to become the wife of a God and the Mother of a world.

Go read The Journal Of Discourses, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, ...

There's none as blind as those who refuse to see.

Now that you realize that, maybe you will chose to see.

[brlenox]

brlenox,
Christ redeems all of this world and we become his spirit children. Ether 3:14
Out of those he redeems, now his children, there is a first born.

Everyone that becomes a Father did so through inheritance and they inherit everything Christ does because they are a Christ.
Thus they are joint heirs with Christ.

I can't tell if you are fully embracing the implications of Elder McConkies observation that through Celestial Marriage we become sons and daughters of God the Father and that we receive exaltational blessings from God the Father as firstborn heirs just as his Son does. Either way we are getting closer.