The Davidic Servant is The Holy Ghost

[righteousrepublic]

Still, obviously I'm a bit more zealous and passionate not only about the topic but the spirit of telling folks they shouldn't seek the mysteries is contrary to the foundation of our church and our most sacred scriptures.

Feel free to do as you like. I have already proven that the Holy Ghost is not the Davidic Servant. What other mystery should we discuss?

Questions: is the Holy Ghost the offspring of David? Who is the root and offspring of David, Christ or the Holy Ghost?

Rev 22:16
16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Isa. 53:2
2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.

Rev. 5:5
5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David (Jesus Christ), hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

Isa. 11:10
10 ¶ And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

Jesus says, "enter into my rest" therefore, the root of Jesse is Jesus.

The Holy Ghost is neither the root of Jesse nor the offspring of David. This is for sure and for certain. Thus, he cannot be the Davidic Servant either.

The Davidic Servant has to be of the lineage of David; the Holy Ghost doesn't fit this narrative. In attempting to make something out of nothing is what Joseph Fielding Smith means by delving into mysteries that have no relevancy.

Here is a mystery: How does one make black coal bright red? Answer: by putting it into a fire, otherwise, it remains black. Wishing it was red and pretending it is red, doesn't render it red.

You proved the Davidic Servant isn't the Holy Ghost with yet another another another series of scriptures that only shows you do not understand them . you should spend more time seeking the mysteries rather than claim you've "proven" what they aren't.What's in the Coolaid?



D&C 113
5 What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?
6 Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days.

Temper, temper. Are you calling Jesus Christ a liar? He, himself, says he is the root of Jesse and offspring of David. Come on now and see what you are claiming here. I know that Jesus knows what he is saying, and it sure ain't in agreement with what is being claimed as the Holy Ghost having to do with David as a servant. The Holy Ghost is no one's servant. He is a God. Now he has to become a servant? Right! You might want to pay heed to the words of God in the scriptures on how to handle mysteries.

[Alaris]

Still, obviously I'm a bit more zealous and passionate not only about the topic but the spirit of telling folks they shouldn't seek the mysteries is contrary to the foundation of our church and our most sacred scriptures.

Feel free to do as you like. I have already proven that the Holy Ghost is not the Davidic Servant. What other mystery should we discuss?

Questions: is the Holy Ghost the offspring of David? Who is the root and offspring of David, Christ or the Holy Ghost?

Rev 22:16
16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Isa. 53:2
2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.

Rev. 5:5
5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David (Jesus Christ), hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

Isa. 11:10
10 ¶ And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

Jesus says, "enter into my rest" therefore, the root of Jesse is Jesus.

The Holy Ghost is neither the root of Jesse nor the offspring of David. This is for sure and for certain. Thus, he cannot be the Davidic Servant either.

The Davidic Servant has to be of the lineage of David; the Holy Ghost doesn't fit this narrative. In attempting to make something out of nothing is what Joseph Fielding Smith means by delving into mysteries that have no relevancy.

Here is a mystery: How does one make black coal bright red? Answer: by putting it into a fire, otherwise, it remains black. Wishing it was red and pretending it is red, doesn't render it red.

You proved the Davidic Servant isn't the Holy Ghost with yet another another another series of scriptures that only shows you do not understand them . you should spend more time seeking the mysteries rather than claim you've "proven" what they aren't.



D&C 113
5 What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?
6 Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days.

Temper, temper. Are you calling Jesus Christ a liar? He, himself, says he is the root of Jesse and offspring of David. Come on now and see what you are claiming here. I know that Jesus knows what he is saying, and it sure ain't in agreement with what is being claimed as the Holy Ghost having to do with David as a servant. The Holy Ghost is no one's servant. He is a God. Now he has to become a servant? Right! You might want to pay heed to the words of God in the scriptures on how to handle mysteries.

The only tempering going on is my tempering my responses to you to help you save some face here. Reread the first four words of D&C 113:6. That's the Lord speaking there. You're oversimplifying and conflating scriptures together...D&C 113 is the Lord explaining who the root is in isaiah 11....which you quoted saying it was Jesus.

Who is greater the greater God, Jesus or the Holy Ghost? If Jesus who is greater washed the feet of His disciples to teach them the greatest of all is the servant of all then would not the lesser God be blessed by such a title?

[righteousrepublic]

You've shared Many scriptures that have helped reaffirm my witness and show clearly your knowing what can't be is based on a Sandy foundation. A sandy foundation? Now you're speculating. Do you have to resort in breaking forum rules, attacking my intelligence in order to feel good about yourself? You don't know me or what I know. See how this works? Someone disagrees with you and poof, speculation and personal attacks are implemented as a backup? Good grief!

Can you honestly say you've approached this in humility or do you base all the time spent here trusting your own prior knowledge that betrays you at nearly every turn? More personal attacks? Now the truth comes out. Did you read 1 Cor 13:2 and consider its meaning?

1 Cor 13:2
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.

1 Nephi 16:2

2 ...the guilty taketh the truth to be hard, for it cutteth them to the very center.

[Alaris]

You've shared Many scriptures that have helped reaffirm my witness and show clearly your knowing what can't be is based on a Sandy foundation. A sandy foundation? Now you're speculating. Do you have to resort in breaking forum rules, attacking my intelligence in order to feel good about yourself? You don't know me or what I know. See how this works? Someone disagrees with you and poof, speculation and personal attacks are implemented as a backup? Good grief!

Can you honestly say you've approached this in humility or do you base all the time spent here trusting your own prior knowledge that betrays you at nearly every turn? More personal attacks? Now the truth comes out. Did you read 1 Cor 13:2 and consider its meaning?

1 Cor 13:2
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.

I'm sure I could be more charitable in my responses but I am trying. I am certainly not attacking you personally but pointing out why you keep inadvertently helping the truth at the expense of your own point. Are you more interested in being right or learning the next line and the next precept?

If you believe in the Davidic Servant, then why the sheer volume of scriptures across all our standard works about him? Why do Nephi and Mormon and Jesus all tell us to study the prophecies of Isaiah that are full of servant prophecies? Clearly this is not just another prophet or king. Clearly he is both priest and king and this is critical to understanding who he is and where he is on his eternal journey.

[righteousrepublic]

The only tempering going on is my tempering my responses to you to help you save some face here. Reread the first four words of D&C 113:6. That's the Lord speaking there. You're oversimplifying and conflating scriptures together...D&C 113 is the Lord explaining who the root is in isaiah 11....which you quoted saying it was Jesus.

Who is greater the greater God, Jesus or the Holy Ghost? If Jesus who is greater washed the feet of His disciples to teach them the greatest of all is the servant of all then would not the lesser God be blessed by such a title? You're the one telling the story!

Just the opposite holds true. I haven't lost my cool. I have no need to. I know what Jesus has said of himself, as I showed you twice. And I am conflating scripture and have to save face? Believe me, I don't need Gileadi to teach me anything. I allow the Holy Ghost to do that.
Here's an idea, why don't you post the whole talk or article from Gileadi about the Holy Ghost so everyone can see for themselves what is truth as opposed to error? (Afterall, it does contain both.) Let others see where you're coming from instead of merely making claims. That way you can save face. Because it must have been Gileadi that put those notions in your mind in the first place. Scripture in and of itself does not give anyone the idea that the Holy Ghost is the Davidic servant, and I would think that includes Isaiah. Apparently, only after having read Gileadi does one come away with such doctrine, right? References are essential on this forum, aren't they?

[Alaris]

The only tempering going on is my tempering my responses to you to help you save some face here. Reread the first four words of D&C 113:6. That's the Lord speaking there. You're oversimplifying and conflating scriptures together...D&C 113 is the Lord explaining who the root is in isaiah 11....which you quoted saying it was Jesus.

Who is greater the greater God, Jesus or the Holy Ghost? If Jesus who is greater washed the feet of His disciples to teach them the greatest of all is the servant of all then would not the lesser God be blessed by such a title?

Just the opposite holds true. I haven't lost my cool. I have no need to. I know what Jesus has said of himself, as I showed you twice. And I am conflating scripture and have to save face? Believe me, I don't need Gileadi to teach me anything. I allow the Holy Ghost to do that.
Here's an idea, why don't you post the whole talk or article from Gileadi about the Holy Ghost so everyone can see for themselves what is truth as opposed to error? (Afterall, it does contain both.) Let others see where you're coming from instead of merely making claims. That way you can save face. Because it must have been Gileadi that put those notions in your mind in the first place. Scripture in and of itself does not give anyone the idea that the Holy Ghost is the Davidic servant. Apparently, only after having read Gileadi does one come away with such doctrine, right? References are essential on this forum, aren't they?

Again I can tell you haven't read through this thread. Please respect all who have contributed here and do so if you're going to continue to chime in and make accusations. Sacred, solemn witnesses have been shared. Pearls. Folks have accused me of this or that throughout my life. Some were right. Some wrong. But rarely do I get accused of being a liar. I have shared how and when Gileadi came into play after I received a witness the Davidic Servant and The Holy Ghost. I learned through study ponder and prayer of incredible truths that I later land were supported by this amazing Isaiah scholar. I've been clear on where I disagree with him, but I don't need him to agree on all points for there to have been many wonderful confirmations and treasures of knowledge thanks to his expertise and insight. I'm pretty sure I've pointed out to you once already where I disagree with Gileadi in our back and forth.

I've created this thread to share my sacred witness, my experiences and this thread itself is sacred to me due to the many witnesses that have built upon them here. I have never expected anyone to take my word for it at face value but others have come to make this equation through the spirit.

If you want to study Gileadi go to Isaiahexplained.com
I've never read any of his books but I have started one. Occasionally I look at his commentary and iit translation for additional insight. But I've never been his sounding board only.

You've added to my witnesses as well so thank you for that. If you will keep this substantive I'll continue to discuss.

[righteousrepublic]

You've shared Many scriptures that have helped reaffirm my witness and show clearly your knowing what can't be is based on a Sandy foundation. A sandy foundation? Now you're speculating. Do you have to resort in breaking forum rules, attacking my intelligence in order to feel good about yourself? You don't know me or what I know. See how this works? Someone disagrees with you and poof, speculation and personal attacks are implemented as a backup? Good grief!

Can you honestly say you've approached this in humility or do you base all the time spent here trusting your own prior knowledge that betrays you at nearly every turn? More personal attacks? Now the truth comes out. Did you read 1 Cor 13:2 and consider its meaning?

1 Cor 13:2
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.

I'm sure I could be more charitable in my responses but I am trying. I am certainly not attacking you personally I absolutely, unequivocally disagree. Read you very words again directed at me, in large red above. If that isn't personal attacks against my intellect, I don't know what is. but pointing out why you keep inadvertently helping the truth at the expense of your own point. Are you more interested in being right or learning the next line and the next precept?

If you believe in the Davidic Servant, then why the sheer volume of scriptures across all our standard works about him? Why do Nephi and Mormon and Jesus all tell us to study the prophecies of Isaiah that are full of servant prophecies? Clearly this is not just another prophet or king. Clearly he is both priest and king and this is critical to understanding who he is and where he is on his eternal journey.

When and if I genuinely become interested in the Davidic Servant, I'll ask God and have the Holy Ghost reveal it to me. An online professed Isaiah scholar doesn't cut the mustard for me personally. And the diminishing of the Savior's words about being the root and offspring of David I posted doesn't help your case. The Holy Ghost is not of the lineage of David, therefore, he cannot be the Davidic servant. The HG has to be the root and offspring of David, he is neither.

Remember about giving information that ye ought not? I showed you the scripture on this very point. As for me being right, that is here nor there. When I see falsehoods being posted, yes, I will quote scripture at every turn; that doesn't make me right, it only reveals what God has to say, there is a difference. Some people want to be right no matter what. I have already found myself to be in error with regard to some of your statements and have openly stated I stood corrected. So for me being right all the time...I'm not. And it is strange you would ask what you did knowing I have stood corrected before. If I find I am in error on this, I will openly state so, okay?

As I have already made clear, the Davidic servant, whoever it is, will not diminish my salvation by not absolutely knowing who it is. That knowledge isn't something I have to become fanatical about. My interest is in the word of God, what he is all about, what his attributes are, what he believes, and how I can become one with him. Knowing who the Davidic servant is, does not in any way teach me these things. Our focus is supposed to be on Jesus Christ. He is the one that saves us, helps us, teaches us and guides us by his every word.

Matthew 4:4
4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

D&C 84:44 (43–44)
43 And I now give unto you a commandment to beware concerning yourselves, to give diligent heed to the words of eternal life.
44 For you shall live by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God.

The Davidic servant cannot fill these shoes. And if he were the Holy Ghost, he would absolutely confirm this. He is the messenger of truth and light, knows all the thoughts and words of Jesus...because, they are one.

2 Nephi 31:21
21 And now, behold, my beloved brethren, this is the way; and there is none other way nor name given under heaven whereby man can be saved in the kingdom of God. And now, behold, this is the doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen.

Edited because, .......................I want to.

[righteousrepublic]

The only tempering going on is my tempering my responses to you to help you save some face here. Reread the first four words of D&C 113:6. That's the Lord speaking there. You're oversimplifying and conflating scriptures together...D&C 113 is the Lord explaining who the root is in isaiah 11....which you quoted saying it was Jesus.

Who is greater the greater God, Jesus or the Holy Ghost? If Jesus who is greater washed the feet of His disciples to teach them the greatest of all is the servant of all then would not the lesser God be blessed by such a title?

Just the opposite holds true. I haven't lost my cool. I have no need to. I know what Jesus has said of himself, as I showed you twice. And I am conflating scripture and have to save face? Believe me, I don't need Gileadi to teach me anything. I allow the Holy Ghost to do that.
Here's an idea, why don't you post the whole talk or article from Gileadi about the Holy Ghost so everyone can see for themselves what is truth as opposed to error? (Afterall, it does contain both.) Let others see where you're coming from instead of merely making claims. That way you can save face. Because it must have been Gileadi that put those notions in your mind in the first place. Scripture in and of itself does not give anyone the idea that the Holy Ghost is the Davidic servant. Apparently, only after having read Gileadi does one come away with such doctrine, right? References are essential on this forum, aren't they?

Again I can tell you haven't read through this thread. For what purpose? I think I would find Cleansing of America more interesting, or And The Moon Shall Turn To Blood. Please respect all who have contributed here and do so if you're going to continue to chime in and make accusations. Sacred, solemn witnesses have been shared. Pearls. Folks have accused me of this or that throughout my life. Some were right. Some wrong. But rarely do I get accused of being a liar. I have shared how and when Gileadi came into play after I received a witness the Davidic Servant and The Holy Ghost. I learned through study ponder and prayer of incredible truths that I later land were supported by this amazing Isaiah scholar. I've been clear on where I disagree with him, but I don't need him to agree on all points for there to have been many wonderful confirmations and treasures of knowledge thanks to his expertise and insight. I'm pretty sure I've pointed out to you once already where I disagree with Gileadi in our back and forth. Whatever!

I've created this thread to share my sacred witness, my experiences and this thread itself is sacred to me due to the many witnesses that have built upon them here. I have never expected anyone to take my word for it at face value but others have come to make this equation through the spirit. Okay!

If you want to study Gileadi go to Isaiahexplained.com
I've never read any of his books but I have started one. Occasionally I look at his commentary and iit translation for additional insight. But I've never been his sounding board only.

You've added to my witnesses as well so thank you for that. Wasn't my intent. If you will keep this substantive I'll continue to discuss.

Did you show me respect when you attacked my very intelligence? Did you show me respect when you said my beliefs are on a sandy foundation? Did you apologize for doing that? I think not in all cases. So please don't come at me about respect.

I didn't say I was interested in Gileadi, I'm not. I suggested posting a reference so anyone that is interested could research his words. Please make no claims that I didn't make. I simply think is is fair for others to see where you're coming from.

I make no claims of knowing Isaiah's words, I don't. His words are above my pay grade. Yet, I do not trust that for every person writing a book claiming to know and say everything exactly as Isaiah meant it to say is going to help me. For this reason, I must go to God for understanding, but I haven't felt an urgency, because learning Gods word takes a lot of study in and of itself. To me, the Holy Ghost is a wonderful man, a teacher and a friend. As for him taking upon another role, doesn't fit, unless inspired to find out by God. Only then will I move upon that directive. At my age and the fact I now have advanced age syndrome, studying basic scripture is a task as is. Isaiah only complicates things. Is there a book entitled, Isaiah made easy? Maybe that's the book for me.

Years ago, I attended an institution class and read "Jesus The Christ" by Talmage, that was difficult to understand without having a dictionary at hand. But what a wonderful work it is. He wrote that book while in the temple, so I am certain he was guided in his writings.

[righteousrepublic]

In the OP we see this blog by Alaris: http://lordoftheseraphim.blogspot.com/2 ... st-is.html

May I present some food for thought?

The very first sentence of the disclaimer says it all. Personally, I would ask for people to, first, ask God if it is right to read it. Then if they get a burning in their bosom and feel right in their mind, then proceed. Nevertheless, perhaps reading it first may help but remember the article may cause extreme cognitive dissonance. Couldn't this cause the asking of God a disruptive, challenging and heart wrenching experience?

The last sentence of the disclaimer, imo, is far from heart warming.

Here is the opener:

DISCLAIMER:

The following is not official doctrine of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Please pray before reading this article and ask for the Holy Spirit to be your guide. Please pray after to confirm any truth by that same Spirit. This article may cause extreme cognitive dissonance if not approached with a humble prayer and an open heart. Also, you may never hear the sacrament prayer the same after reading this post.
.............................................................................................................
Sacrament prayer in Moroni 4:3
3 O God, the Eternal Father, we ask thee in the name of thy Son, Jesus Christ, to bless and sanctify this bread to the souls of all those who partake of it; that they may eat in remembrance of the body of thy Son, and witness unto thee, O God, the Eternal Father, that they are willing to take upon them the name of thy Son, and always remember him, and keep his commandments which he hath given them, that they may always have his Spirit to be with them. Amen.

The Spirit of God is the Holy Ghost, see below. So who is the Spirit of Christ, the Son, as referenced in the Sacramental prayer? Some information on this below.

God
When one speaks of God, it is generally the Father who is referred to; that is, Elohim. All mankind are His children. The personage known as Jehovah in Old Testament times, and who is usually identified in the Old Testament as Lord (in small capitals), is the Son, known as Jesus Christ, and who is also a God. Jesus works under the direction of the Father and is in complete harmony with Him. All mankind are His brethren and sisters, He being the eldest of the spirit children of Elohim. Many of the things that the scripture says were done by God were actually done by the Lord (Jesus). Thus the scripture says that “God created the heaven and the earth” (Gen. 1:1), but we know that it was actually the Lord (Jesus) who was the creator (John 1:3, 10), or as Paul said, God created all things by Christ Jesus (Eph. 3:9). The Holy Ghost is also a God and is variously called the Holy Spirit, the Spirit, the Spirit of God, etc.
.............................................................................................................
With regards to reading the material, let's see what God says:

Doctrine and Covenants 8:2
2 Yea, behold, I will tell you in your mind and in your heart, by the Holy Ghost, which shall come upon you and which shall dwell in your heart.

D&C 9:8 (8–9)
8 ...behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.
9 But if it be not right you shall have no such feelings, but you shall have a stupor of thought that shall cause you to forget the thing which is wrong....
.............................................................................................................
From LDS org, which, btw, is now ChurchofJesusChrist.org, we read:

I Have a Question, What is the difference between the Holy Ghost, the Spirit of Christ, and the Light of Christ?

Brent Bulloch, instructor at the Tempe Institute of Religion adjacent to Arizona State University. In the scriptures, the Holy Ghost is called by several names, such as: “the Spirit,” “the Spirit of God,” “the Spirit of the Lord,” “the Spirit of Truth,” “the Holy Spirit,” and “the Comforter.” Some of these same terms are also used to refer to the Light of Christ, which may also be called “the Spirit of Christ,” and “the light of truth.” Although the names given them are sometimes the same, the Light of Christ and the Holy Ghost are different and distinct.

The Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit and a member of the Godhead. Elder Joseph Fielding Smith taught that “the Holy Ghost should not be confused with the Spirit [the Light of Christ] which fills the immensity of space and which is everywhere present. This other Spirit is impersonal and has no size, nor dimensions; it proceeds forth from the presence of the Father and the Son and is in all things. We should speak of the Holy Ghost as a personage as ‘he’ and this other Spirit as ‘it,’ although when we speak of the power or gift of the Holy Ghost we may properly say ‘it.’”1

The terms “Spirit of Christ” and the “Light of Christ” are most often used in the scriptures synonymously. Elder Bruce R. McConkie gave this explanation about what the Light of Christ is: “There is a spirit—the Spirit of the Lord, the Spirit of Christ, the light of truth, the light of Christ—that defies description and is beyond mortal comprehension. It is in us and in all things; it is around us and around all things; it fills the earth and the heavens and the universe. It is everywhere, in all immensity, without exception; it is an indwelling, immanent, ever-present, never-absent spirit. It has neither shape nor form nor personality. It is not an entity nor a person nor a personage. It has no agency, does not act independently, and exists not to act but to be acted upon.”2

The scriptures tell us that the Light of Christ, which “proceedeth forth from the presence of God to fill the immensity of space,” is “the light which is in all things, which giveth life to all things, which is the law by which all things are governed, even the power of God.”3 It is manifested in the light of the sun, moon, and stars and is the power by which they and the earth were made. It is also the light that quickens our understanding.4

Elder Bruce R. McConkie taught that the Light of Christ “is the agency of God’s power; it is the means and way whereby ‘he comprehendeth all things,’ so that ‘all things are before him, and all things are round about him.’ It is the way whereby ‘he is above all things, and in all things, and is through all things, and is round about all things.’”5

The Holy Ghost makes use of the Light of Christ to perform his work. “The Spirit of Christ (or Light of Christ) is the agency through which the Holy Ghost operates,” Elder McConkie explained.6 Moroni wrote that all spiritual gifts come through the Spirit of Christ,7 meaning that when the Holy Ghost works with us, he transmits his gifts by the agency of the light of Christ.

After we are baptized and confirmed and we receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, we may enjoy the gifts of the Holy Ghost through the Holy Ghost’s ministration. Since the Holy Ghost uses the Spirit of Christ or Light of Christ to minister to the Saints of God, the term “Spirit of Christ” is sometimes used to refer to the Holy Ghost’s ministration through that Spirit.8

In a general conference address, President Marion G. Romney helped clarify the nature of the connection between the Light of Christ and the Holy Ghost. “There are three phases of the light of Christ that I want to mention,” said President Romney.

“The first one is the light which enlighteneth every man that cometh into the world;

“The second phase is the gift of the Holy Ghost;

“And the third is the more sure word of prophecy.”9

The first phase of the Light of Christ is referred to in the Doctrine and Covenants: “Whatsoever is truth is light, and whatsoever is light is Spirit, even the Spirit of Jesus Christ.

“And the spirit giveth light to every man that cometh into the world.”10 Mormon taught that “the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil.”11 In this respect, the Light of Christ is associated with what we often call conscience. Everyone who is born into mortality receives the Light of Christ.

What is the effect of the Light of Christ on an individual? Elder Joseph Fielding Smith wrote that “if a man who has never heard the gospel will hearken to the teachings and manifestations of the Spirit of Christ, or the Light of Truth, which come to him, often spoken of as conscience … it will lead him eventually to the fulness of the gospel.”12

Similarly, President Harold B. Lee said, “Every one of you born into this world enjoys the blessing of this Light that shall never cease to strive with you until you are led to that further light from the gift of the Holy Ghost that may be received only upon condition of repentance and baptism into the Kingdom of God.”13

The second phase of the Light of Christ spoken of by President Romney is received after baptism. President John Taylor taught that the world has “a portion of the Spirit of God,” but that “we have something more than that portion of the Spirit of God which is given to every man, and it is called the gift of the Holy Ghost, which is received through obedience to the first principles of the Gospel of Christ, by the laying on of hands of the servants of God.”14

President Brigham Young spoke of the Holy Ghost’s influence as “the increased rays of that light which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.”15 Elder Charles W. Penrose taught that a person who receives the gift of the Holy Ghost receives “a greater and higher endowment of the same spirit which enlightens every man that comes into the world.”16 Through this greater endowment of the Light of Christ the Holy Ghost conveys to the Saints such gifts of the Spirit as testimony, revelation, healing, prophecy, and many others.17 President Romney also explained that “one is born again by actually receiving and experiencing the light and power inherent in the gift of the Holy Ghost.”18

The third phase of the Light of Christ spoken of by President Romney is “‘the more sure word of prophecy’ (D&C 131:5), which is obtained by making one’s ‘calling and election sure’ (2 Pet. 1:10).”19 The Prophet Joseph Smith taught that “after a person has faith in Christ, repents of his sins, and is baptized for the remission of his sins and receives the Holy Ghost, … then let him continue to humble himself before God, hungering and thirsting after righteousness, and living by every word of God, and the Lord will soon say unto him, Son, thou shalt be exalted. When the Lord has thoroughly proved him, and finds that the man is determined to serve Him at all hazards, then the man will find his calling and election made sure, then it will be his privilege to receive the other Comforter, which the Lord hath promised the Saints, as is recorded in the testimony of St. John.”20

The Prophet Joseph Smith taught that a person who receives the more sure word of prophecy is “sealed in the heavens and [has] the promise of eternal life in the kingdom of God.”21 Such persons may then, “by making [their] calling and election sure, enjoy the full light of Christ.”22

The Holy Ghost and the gift of the Holy Ghost are not the same. The Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit in the form of a man. He is separate and distinct from the Father and the Son, yet they all work together in perfect unity. The Father and the Son have resurrected bodies of flesh and bone, which the Holy Ghost does not have.23

The body of the Holy Ghost is like the spirit body of the Lord, which the Lord showed unto the brother of Jared before His mortal birth. Such a body resembles that of a man, but consists of spirit matter, a substance finer and purer than temporal matter.24 The Holy Ghost has size and dimensions. He does not transform himself into any other form or manifest himself in any other image than that of a spirit man.

Unlike the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Ghost does not fill the universe and cannot be personally present everywhere at the same time; however, his power and influence, through the Light of Christ, can be manifest at the same time throughout all the immensity of space.25

The gift of the Holy Ghost is the right or blessing extended to those who are baptized whereby they may enjoy the companionship and ministration of the Holy Ghost as long as they are faithful. Often in the scriptures, the term Holy Ghost is used to refer not to the personage of the Holy Ghost, but to the gifts of the Holy Ghost, or his power, influence, or ministrations.26

There is still much that we do not know about the nature and power of the Holy Ghost and the Light of Christ. However, we can have unshaken confidence that “every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father.”27 The Doctrine and Covenants tells us, “That which is of God is light; and he that receiveth light, and continueth in God, receiveth more light; and that light groweth brighter and brighter until the perfect day.”28 It also says that “he that keepeth [the Lord’s] commandments receiveth truth and light, until he is glorified in truth and knoweth all things.”29

Greater understanding about the Light of Christ, the Holy Ghost, and other things of God will come to us as we obey the Lord and seek knowledge with pure intent.30 While we are growing in such knowledge, our greatest concern and effort should be to listen to and follow the voice of the Spirit that we might do the will of our Father in Heaven, to accomplish what he would have us do.
Related Content
1. Doctrines of Salvation, comp. Bruce R. McConkie, 3 vols., Salt Lay: Bookcraft, 1954–56, 1:49–50.
2. A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1985, p. 257; see also D&C 88:41.
3. D&C 88:12–13.
4. See D&C 88:6–11.
5. McConkie, A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, p. 258; see D&C 88:41.
6. Mormon Doctrine, 2d ed., Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1966, p. 314.
7. See Moro. 10:17.
8. See Rom. 8:9; 1 Pet. 1:11 for examples; see also Bruce R. McConkie, Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 3 vols., Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1965–73, 3:286–87.
9. Ensign, May 1977, p. 43.
10. D&C 84:45–46.
11. Moro. 7:16.
12. Doctrines of Salvation, 1:51; see also D&C 84:45–48.
13. Decisions for Successful Living, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1973, p. 144.
14. Journal of Discourses, 23:320–21; see also 23:370–71.
15. Journal of Discourses, 6:315.
16. Journal of Discourses, 23:350.
17. See 1 Cor. 12:4–11; Moro. 10:8–18; D&C 46:8–26.
18. See Ensign, May 1977, p. 44.
19. Ibid.
20. Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, sel. Joseph Fielding Smith, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1938, p. 150.
21. History of the Church, 5:388.
22. Romney, Ensign, May 1977, p. 45.
23. See D&C 130:22–23; see also McConkie, A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, pp. 253–54.
24. See D&C 131:7–8.
25. See Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 1:38; McConkie, Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 2:105.
26. See John 20:22; Acts 7:55–56; Acts 8:14–19; Acts 10:44–48; Acts 19:1–6; see also McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p. 358–59; McConkie, Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 2:78.
27. James 1:17.
28. D&C 50:24.
29. D&C 93:28.
30. See D&C 130:19.

[righteousrepublic]

Questions: if the Holy Ghost were to take upon himself a body, how could he help, influence or confirm truth to anyone? Isn't his role to be a testimony and declaration of God's word and confirm this truth in the hearts and minds of God's children?

Christ, being God in the flesh had a hard time convincing people of what he taught. He didn't jump out of his body and say, hey, I'm God, your creator. People pushed him around and eventually crucified him. What makes anyone think the Holy Ghost in the flesh could be an influence to everyone? This makes no sense whatsoever.

If, and I say if profoundly, the Holy Ghost were to come to earth and gain a body, then die and come back as a Davidic Servant in the form of man, how does this work?

If he doesn't gain a body here, then how could he become a Davidic servant not having been in the lineage of David in the first place?

If he were to gain a body here, he still would not be of the lineage of David. Can someone show how he could become such?

Jesus says he is the root and offspring of David. Would the Holy Ghost set aside this fact and then claim the same thing? He is a spokesman for Christ, not a replacement, right? The Holy Ghost is not an angel, he is a God, one of the Godhead. Christ said he sent his angel to declare who he is.

2 Nephi 21:10
10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek; and his rest shall be glorious. Who was it that said "enter into MY rest?

Revelation 22:16
16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Even if the angel were to be the Holy Ghost, he could not claim to be the root and offspring of David. He would be confirming that Jesus is as the verse declares.

[DJB]

Questions: if the Holy Ghost were to take upon himself a body, how could he help, influence or confirm truth to anyone? Isn't his role to be a testimony and declaration of God's word and confirm this truth in the hearts and minds of God's children?

Christ, being God in the flesh had a hard time convincing people of what he taught. He didn't jump out of his body and say, hey, I'm God, your creator. People pushed him around and eventually crucified him. What makes anyone think the Holy Ghost in the flesh could be an influence to everyone? This makes no sense whatsoever.

If, and I say if profoundly, the Holy Ghost were to come to earth and gain a body, then die and come back as a Davidic Servant in the form of man, how does this work?

If he doesn't gain a body here, then how could he become a Davidic servant not having been in the lineage of David in the first place?

If he were to gain a body here, he still would not be of the lineage of David. Can someone show how he could become such?

Jesus says he is the root and offspring of David. Would the Holy Ghost set aside this fact and then claim the same thing? He is a spokesman for Christ, not a replacement, right?

It's always been a mystery to me ever since I joined the church at the age of 16, that the Holy Ghost was a real person, but his identity being hidden. The father and son's identity are not hidden, only veiled until you pass it. The Holy Ghost is a mystery. What a coincidence... So is the Lord's endtime servant.
The great test coming, and it will be a mighty test to see who has the Holy Ghost as there guide, will be when the Fathers work begins, and who will reject or accept it....

That's why there is need of a mystery up till the Fathers work, because Christ will try the faith of his people.

I will not add to the contention here, but I will bear my own witness and testimony.

I know that my Father and Savior Jesus Christ live! I know it!!! I know that like President Nelson said, that there work is going to be at its mightiest in the coming years. I also know that the Holy Ghost is a God and part of the Godhead, hence he should be respected as a God. If he does, and I personally have received a witness before ever knowing about this blog, that the Lord's Servant will be the Holy Ghost in the flesh. He should be respected. After all he has the power to make us clean and pure from sin because of Jesus Christ's Atonement, and unity with the Godhead.

I don't need to debate this testimony of mine, because it is unshakable!

My advice to all here would be to pray, and stand with your own witness and testimony so that God can judge...

I am forever grateful for my Savior Jesus Christ, and will do anything in my power to assist in the cause of Zion, that Christ and his kings and queens may reign forever...

[righteousrepublic]

It's always been a mystery to me ever since I joined the church at the age of 16, that the Holy Ghost was a real person, but his identity being hidden. The father and son's identity are not hidden, only veiled until you pass it. The Holy Ghost is a mystery. What a coincidence... So is the Lord's endtime servant.
The great test coming, and it will be a mighty test to see who has the Holy Ghost as there guide, will be when the Fathers work begins, and who will reject or accept it....

That's why there is need of a mystery up till the Fathers work, because Christ will try the faith of his people.

I will not add to the contention here, but I will bear my own witness and testimony.

I know that my Father and Savior Jesus Christ live! I know it!!! I know that like President Nelson said, that there work is going to be at its mightiest in the coming years. I also know that the Holy Ghost is a God and part of the Godhead, hence he should be respected as a God. If he does, and I personally have received a witness before ever knowing about this blog, that the Lord's Servant will be the Holy Ghost in the flesh. He should be respected. After all he has the power to make us clean and pure from sin because of Jesus Christ's Atonement, and unity with the Godhead.

I don't need to debate this testimony of mine, because it is unshakable!

My advice to all here would be to pray, and stand with your own witness and testimony so that God can judge...

I am forever grateful for my Savior Jesus Christ, and will do anything in my power to assist in the cause of Zion, that Christ and his kings and queens may reign forever...

I will respect your witness. I respect the Holy Ghost also. If what you say is true, I would think the whole body of the church should know it, not just a few out of thousands. I know without a doubt that God will make changes to this earth and everyone on it. I know these changes will frighten a lot of people. I know that the very elect will scarcely survive them, some may not. I am not new to this knowledge and testimony having read much on the subject over my life time. However, in all my 71 years no one has come up with this doctrine at church or anywhere else except this forum. Go figure. It must be deep, deep, deep doctrine specially formulated for a select few, right? People over the years should have had a chance to digest this way before now, just at the brink of devastation, chaos and death, instead they get a huge surprise? Are we supposed to just accept it and merrily move on? People should not have to read between the lines like it was like some Davinci code to be deciphered. I don't think God works that way. He tells it like it is; some listen some don't. To some he had to use parables. But this stuff isn't being taught in any form. How is this fair to the thousands upon thousands of people who have never heard it?

God says he will gather the righteous like a hen gathers her chicks and put them under his wing, and this is good enough for me. He will fight our battles, and this is good enough for me as well.

President Nelson said nothing of the Holy Ghost coming to earth in his talk. Why do people read into it that which is not there? To make a point? To make claim that their knowledge is supreme? To say, I know something you don't know? By what purpose does anyone come on an open forum and try to stir up confusion and make unproven claims, especially when it doesn't come down from the First Presidency? And since it does not, people in the church have only their own faith and testimony to carry them through the tough times ahead. Are we to assume now that they all will wither away into a barren wasteland because they don't know what is being claimed here, in spite of their own hard earned testimony? Somehow, I don't think this to be the case. Come to think of it, how many of the elect of God ever heard of, know or even believe this stuff?

Carry on. I have made my thoughts known, yet I am willing to depart and give way to those who do believe this doctrine. I am not convinced and that's okay. Perhaps other like-minded folks can come and discuss this without opposite views. God did say that there is opposition in all things, so I don't feel bad for my take on this, nor should I.

[I AM]

The only tempering going on is my tempering my responses to you to help you save some face here. Reread the first four words of D&C 113:6. That's the Lord speaking there. You're oversimplifying and conflating scriptures together...D&C 113 is the Lord explaining who the root is in isaiah 11....which you quoted saying it was Jesus.

Who is greater the greater God, Jesus or the Holy Ghost? If Jesus who is greater washed the feet of His disciples to teach them the greatest of all is the servant of all then would not the lesser God be blessed by such a title?

Just the opposite holds true. I haven't lost my cool. I have no need to. I know what Jesus has said of himself, as I showed you twice. And I am conflating scripture and have to save face? Believe me, I don't need Gileadi to teach me anything. I allow the Holy Ghost to do that.
Here's an idea, why don't you post the whole talk or article from Gileadi about the Holy Ghost so everyone can see for themselves what is truth as opposed to error? (Afterall, it does contain both.) Let others see where you're coming from instead of merely making claims. That way you can save face. Because it must have been Gileadi that put those notions in your mind in the first place. Scripture in and of itself does not give anyone the idea that the Holy Ghost is the Davidic servant. Apparently, only after having read Gileadi does one come away with such doctrine, right? References are essential on this forum, aren't they?

Again I can tell you haven't read through this thread. Please respect all who have contributed here and do so if you're going to continue to chime in and make accusations. Sacred, solemn witnesses have been shared. Pearls. Folks have accused me of this or that throughout my life. Some were right. Some wrong. But rarely do I get accused of being a liar. I have shared how and when Gileadi came into play after I received a witness the Davidic Servant and The Holy Ghost. I learned through study ponder and prayer of incredible truths that I later land were supported by this amazing Isaiah scholar. I've been clear on where I disagree with him, but I don't need him to agree on all points for there to have been many wonderful confirmations and treasures of knowledge thanks to his expertise and insight. I'm pretty sure I've pointed out to you once already where I disagree with Gileadi in our back and forth.

I've created this thread to share my sacred witness, my experiences and this thread itself is sacred to me due to the many witnesses that have built upon them here. I have never expected anyone to take my word for it at face value but others have come to make this equation through the spirit.

If you want to study Gileadi go to Isaiahexplained.com
I've never read any of his books but I have started one. Occasionally I look at his commentary and iit translation for additional insight. But I've never been his sounding board only.

You've added to my witnesses as well so thank you for that. If you will keep this substantive I'll continue to discuss.

Did you show me respect when you attacked my very intelligence? Did you show me respect when you said my beliefs are on a sandy foundation? Did you apologize for doing that? I think not in all cases. So please don't come at me about respect.

I didn't say I was interested in Gileadi, I'm not. I suggested posting a reference so anyone that is interested could research his words. Please make no claims that I didn't make. I simply think is is fair for others to see where you're coming from.

I make no claims of knowing Isaiah's words, I don't. His words are above my pay grade. Yet, I do not trust that for every person writing a book claiming to know and say everything exactly as Isaiah meant it to say is going to help me. For this reason, I must go to God for understanding, but I haven't felt an urgency, because learning Gods word takes a lot of study in and of itself. To me, the Holy Ghost is a wonderful man, a teacher and a friend. As for him taking upon another role, doesn't fit, unless inspired to find out by God. Only then will I move upon that directive. At my age and the fact I now have advanced age syndrome, studying basic scripture is a task as is. Isaiah only complicates things. Is there a book entitled, Isaiah made easy? Maybe that's the book for me.

Years ago, I attended an institution class and read "Jesus The Christ" by Talmage, that was difficult to understand without having a dictionary at hand. But what a wonderful work it is. He wrote that book while in the temple, so I am certain he was guided in his writings.

-------------
I'm through with this because I think I have voiced my opinion
about the Holy Ghost being the ( Lord's spirit "my spirit" ), and not The Davidic Servant, but I just wanted to jump in here and say that while I have not really seen much in Gileadi's work where he mentions Holy Ghost very much , I have read extensively what he has to say about the Davidic Servant, and from everything I have read and studied, he never has given even the slight reference to the
Holy Ghost when talking about the Davidic Servant, and from all that I've read,
he is definitely NOT THE HOLY GHOST
I WOULD like to see any quote from him that says otherwise.

Doctrine and Covenants
Section 36
2 And I will lay my hand upon you by the hand of my servant Sidney Rigdon,
and you shall receive my Spirit, the Holy Ghost, even the Comforter, which shall teach you the peaceable things of the kingdom;
and many many other scriptures I've already posted.

[I AM]

http://www.isaiahexplained.com/resource ... ime-events
skip down to
24. The Davidic Monarchy

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viewtopic.php?f=2&t=51369&p=927569&hili ... nt#p927569

http://isaiahinstitute.com/2018/08/05/w ... s-servant/
What Do Isaiah’s Word Links Reveal about God’s Servant?

Avraham Gileadi Ph.D.

Word links to a “servant” in the Book of Isaiah are two kinds: (1) God’s collective servant—his people Israel; and (2) his individual servant—Jehovah’s forerunner who restores his people to prepare them for Jehovah’s coming to reign on the earth: (1) “Ponder these things, O Jacob, and you, O Israel, for you are my servant. I have created you to be my servant, O Israel (Isaiah 44:21; cf. 41:8–9; 44:1–2); (2)
“My servant whom I sustain, my chosen one in whom I delight, him I have endowed with my Spirit; he will dispense justice to the nations” (Isaiah 42:1).

The setting for Jehovah’s calling his individual servant is his collective servant’s slide into apostasy: “O you deaf, listen; O you blind, look and see! Who is blind but my own servant, or so deaf as the messenger I have sent? Who is blind like those I have commissioned, as uncomprehending as the servant of Jehovah—seeing much but not giving heed, with open ears hearing nothing?” (Isaiah 42:18–20):
“Proclaim it aloud without restraint; raise your voice like a trumpet! Declare to my people their transgressions, to the house of Jacob its sins” (Isaiah 58:1).

Israel’s endtime restoration is physical as well as spiritual, extending as far as the ends of the earth: “For now Jehovah has said—he who formed me from the womb to be his servant, to restore Jacob to him, Israel having been gathered to him; for I won honor in the eyes of Jehovah when my God became my strength—he said: It is too small a thing for you to be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob and to restore those preserved of Israel. I will also appoint you to be a light to the nations, that my salvation may be to the end of the earth” (Isaiah 49:5–6);

“I Jehovah have rightfully called you and grasp you by the hand; I have created you and appointed you to be a covenant for the people, a light to the nations, to open eyes that are blind, to free captives from confinement and from prison those who sit in darkness” (Isaiah 42:6–7): “Can the warrior’s spoil be taken from him, or the tyrant’s captives escape free? Thus says Jehovah: The warrior’s spoil shall indeed be taken from him, and the tyrant’s captives escape free:
I will contend with your contenders, and I will deliver your children” (Isaiah 49:24–25).

The verb “appoint” used above in two passages (Isaiah 42:6; 49:6, 8) identifies God’s servant as a latter-day David: “Give ear and come unto me; pay heed, that your souls may live! And I will make with you an everlasting covenant: [my] loving fidelity toward David. See, I have appointed him as a witness to the nations, a prince and lawgiver of the peoples. You will summon a nation that you did not know; a nation that did not know you will hasten to you—because of Jehovah your God, the Holy One of Israel, who gloriously endows you” (Isaiah 55:3–5).

God’s servant not only deals with the tyrannical enemies of God’s people, he is also compelled to deal with accusing enemies within his own people:
“See, my Lord Jehovah sustains me. Who then will incriminate me? Surely all such shall wear out like a garment; the moth shall consume them. Who among you fears Jehovah and heeds the voice of his servant, who, though he walk in the dark and have no light, trusts in the name of Jehovah and relies on his God? But you are lighters of fires, all of you, who illuminate with mere sparks” (Isaiah 50:9–11).

After his enemies cause him to be disfigured beyond recognition, God exalts him: “My servant, being astute, shall be highly exalted; he shall become exceedingly eminent: just as he appalled many—his appearance was marred beyond human likeness, his resemblance unlike that of men—So shall he yet astound many nations, kings shutting their mouths at him—what was not told them, they shall see; what they had not heard, they shall consider” (Isaiah 15:13–15). Word links identify these “kings” as those who help restore God’s people (Isaiah 49:22–23; 60:3–4).

As a proxy savior in obtaining Israel’s temporal salvation—emulating Jehovah who obtains Israel’s spiritual salvation—the servant suffers: “He shall see the toil of his soul and be satisfied; because of his knowledge, and by bearing their iniquities, shall my servant, the righteous one, vindicate many. I will assign him an inheritance among the great; he shall divide the spoil with the mighty, because he poured out his soul unto death and was numbered with criminals—he bore the sins of many and made intercession for the transgressors” (Isaiah 53:11–12).

Because Jehovah himself pays the price of peace and healing for all—“He was pierced for our transgressions, crushed because of our iniquities; the price of our peace he incurred, and with his wounds we are healed” (Isaiah 53:5)—he heals his servant and those with him who restore his people Israel: “I have seen his conduct and I will heal him; I will guide him and amply console him and those who mourn for him, who partake of the fruit of the lips: Peace, well being, to those far off and to those who are near, says Jehovah who heals him” (Isaiah 57:18–19).

Many heroes of ancient Israel and the roles they performed typify the endtime roles of God’s servant, including “my servant Isaiah” (Isaiah 20:3), “my servant Eliakim” (Isaiah 22:20), “my servant David” (Isaiah 37:35), “his servant . . . Cyrus” (Isaiah 44:26–28), and others who foreshadow God’s servant through a network of words links, key words, codenames, parallelisms, typologies, motifs, and imagery.
None of these roles take away from the saving mission of Jehovah the God of Israel, however, who takes center stage in the Book of Isaiah."

[I AM]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=51369&p=927583&hili ... l.#p927583

I believe he could very well be a member of the church,
and just like Christ, he will come to his own people (with the words of Christ (sealed portion),
and be rejected by them.

"At the center of this latter-day work of grafting, and it's involvement in the bring forth of ancient records, is the Lord's servant.
All the olive tree allegories assign to the Lord's servant the task of
reuniting Israel.
That task, therefore, places the servant's mission initially among the Gentiles
(compare Isaiah 42:1-6; 49:1-8) as restoring Israel is a role which the Gentiles perform.

The servant brings forth the words of Christ to the Gentiles
(3 Nephi 21:10-11
in other words, he reveals ancient records.

The Gentiles receive the first opportunity to accept or reject those records.
The servant additionally gathers Israel and Judah, and allocates their lands
of inheritance. (Isaiah 11:10-12; 49:8, 19-21).
In that work, the Gentiles assist him. (Isaiah 49:22;
compare 1 Nephi 22:4-12).

These responsibilites place a heavy burden on the Gentiles.
First, the Gentiles must demonstrate exceeding faith and righteousness.
In order to merit the coming forth of additional records, they must keep all
Jesus' commandments (D&C 93:18-20).
When the Gentiles exercise faith even as the brother of Jared, becoming clean and sanctified through Christ, then will the sealed portion of the
Book of Mormon come forth to them (Ether 4:5-7, 13).
The convincing power of ancient scriptural records makes their coming forth necessary.

Second,to convey the substance of these records to the Jews and Lehi's descendants, the Gentiles must themselves know and understand them.

So great is this challenge, in fact, that many Gentiles will not accept it.
Instead, they will reject the words of Christ, and be "cut off" as
bitter branches, from His people (3 Nephi 21:11"

3 Nephi 21

11 Therefore it shall come to pass that whosoever will not believe in my words, who am Jesus Christ, which the Father shall cause him to bring forth unto the Gentiles, and shall give unto him power that he shall bring them forth unto the Gentiles, (it shall be done even as Moses said) they shall be cut off from among my people who are of the covenant.

[Alaris]

BTW, the spirit of the Lord is not the Holy Ghost. It is the Spirit of Christ, or the Light of Christ. See: Answers to Gospel Questions, Vol 5, pg 119. BTW, these five volumes are from Joseph Fielding Smith's own words, and not Gileadi.

I've already addressed this - the "Spirit of the Lord" can be the Holy Ghost or Jesus or Jesus' "light of Christ" depending on the context.

https://www.lds.org/topics/spirit-of-truth?lang=eng
https://www.lds.org/topics/spirit-of-the-lord?lang=eng

Doctrine and Covenants 63
32 I, the Lord, am angry with the wicked; I am holding my Spirit from the inhabitants of the earth.

Wow! Fantastic scripture!

33 I have sworn in my wrath, and decreed wars upon the face of the earth, and the wicked shall slay the wicked, and fear shall come upon every man;
34 And the saints also shall hardly escape; nevertheless, I, the Lord, am with them, and will come down in heaven from the presence of my Father and consume the wicked with unquenchable fire.

I've been pondering the following scripture a lot lately. I believe this addresses another questions of yours later, but it certainly expounds upon the above:

D&C 103:18 And as your fathers were led at the first, even so shall the redemption of Zion be.
19 Therefore, let not your hearts faint, for I say not unto you as I said unto your fathers: Mine angel shall go up before you, but not my presence.
20 But I say unto you: Mine angels shall go up before you, and also my presence, and in time ye shall possess the goodly land.
21 Verily, verily I say unto you, that my servant Joseph Smith, Jun., is the man to whom I likened the servant to whom the Lord of the vineyard spake in the parable which I have given unto you.

You ask in a subsequent post, how is the Office of Holy Ghost performed if the Holy Ghost is in the flesh. D&C 103:18-21 is the answer. The angel of the Lord was executing his godhood, his power, and his dominion from the other side of the veil in ancient Israel. In modern Israel, the redemption of ZION will mirror how the fathers were led at first, except this time it is the Lord Jehovah Himself and angels, plural. Why? Because the advocate of Israel is now in the flesh. This is quite simply amazing and fills my soul with light and joy as I write this. I hope you will come to see this as I do, though that is between you and the Lord.

1:33
33 And he that repents not, from him shall be taken even the light which he has received; for my Spirit shall not always strive with man, saith the Lord of Hosts.

That could absolutely be the light of Christ and / or the Holy Ghost. The nephites were past feeling the light of Christ and the Holy Ghost also ceased striving with them. The Angel of the Lord is the Holy Ghost. When righteous, he literally destroyed (red apparel) Israel's enemies. When wicked, sometimes he leveled destruction back at them, and in my opinion, eventually left them altogether to be then scattered.

D&C 84:45-53
45 For the word of the Lord is truth, and whatsoever is truth is light, and whatsoever is light is Spirit, even the Spirit of Jesus Christ.
46 And the Spirit giveth light to every man that cometh into the world; and the Spirit enlighteneth every man through the world, that hearkeneth to the voice of the Spirit.
47 And every one that hearkeneth to the voice of the Spirit cometh unto God, even the Father.
48 And the Father teacheth him of the covenant which he has renewed and confirmed upon you, which is confirmed upon you for your sakes, and not for your sakes only, but for the sake of the whole world.
49 And the whole world lieth in sin, and groaneth under darkness and under the bondage of sin.
50 And by this you may know they are under the bondage of sin, because they come not unto me.
51 For whoso cometh not unto me is under the bondage of sin.
52 And whoso receiveth not my voice is not acquainted with my voice, and is not of me.
53 And by this you may know the righteous from the wicked, and that the whole world groaneth under sin and darkness even now.

So there we have it. The Holy Ghost is not the same as the Spirit of the Lord.
The Light of Christ is not the same as the Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost.
Man is born with the Light of Christ but not the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Again - depends on the scripture and the context. This is fundamental to our religion, so let's not try to shoehorn scriptures to "win" a debate. Let's please do our best to keep the Spirit of contention out of this - more on this in a moment.

[Alaris]

When and if I genuinely become interested in the Davidic Servant, I'll ask God and have the Holy Ghost reveal it to me.

Yet you have left how many words in this thread now amidst those who are genuinely interested in the Davidic Servant - who have asked God. I'll echo Nephi's question to his brothers: Have you inquired of the Lord? You say no. Then please cease trying to poke holes in something over which you are clearly relying on your own understanding - for your own sake.

And the diminishing of the Savior's words about being the root and offspring of David I posted doesn't help your case.

This is completely inaccurate to put it lightly. I pointed out that one of the scriptures you used was not about Jesus Christ to illustrate you should spend more time studying on this - you just admitted above you haven't even inquired ^ I did not even address any of the other root and offspring of David scriptures at all. So ... false accusation?

The Holy Ghost is not of the lineage of David, therefore, he cannot be the Davidic servant. The HG has to be the root and offspring of David, he is neither.

Uh what? How on earth can you possibly say "The Holy Ghost is not the lineage of David" - ? I've already shown the many, many key words that link the comforter of John 14-16 to the Rod of Jesse (lineage of David) If anyone has ever put that together, I've never heard of it which is amazing considering how many word links there are. Did you read that post?

As I have already made clear, the Davidic servant, whoever it is, will not diminish my salvation by not absolutely knowing who it is. That knowledge isn't something I have to become fanatical about. My interest is in the word of God, what he is all about, what his attributes are, what he believes, and how I can become one with him. Knowing who the Davidic servant is, does not in any way teach me these things. Our focus is supposed to be on Jesus Christ. He is the one that saves us, helps us, teaches us and guides us by his every word.

I will hope you read through this entire thread at the very least and see how many scriptures show that the Gathering and new covenant God makes with Israel is all about the Davidic Servant's ascension to becoming a Prince forever over Israel. If you are Israel, then he is your eternal King. If you don't think your salvation is impacted by that fact ... well consider that rejecting the greatest product of the Atonement of Jesus Christ is what Paul meant by crucifying the Lord afresh and putting him to open shame.

Ezekiel 37:24 And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them.
25 And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children’s children for ever: and my servant David shall be their (that's us) prince for ever.
26 Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.

Matthew 4:4
4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

D&C 84:44 (43–44)
43 And I now give unto you a commandment to beware concerning yourselves, to give diligent heed to the words of eternal life.
44 For you shall live by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God.

The Davidic servant cannot fill these shoes. And if he were the Holy Ghost, he would absolutely confirm this. He is the messenger of truth and light, knows all the thoughts and words of Jesus...because, they are one.

Who is the mouth of God? As Aaron is to Moses so is the Angel of the Lord to Jehovah. Think about that while reading D&C 85:7.

7 And it shall come to pass that I, the Lord God, will send one mighty and strong, holding the scepter of power in his hand, clothed with light for a covering, whose mouth shall utter words, eternal words; while his bowels shall be a fountain of truth, to set in order the house of God, and to arrange by lot the inheritances of the saints whose names are found, and the names of their fathers, and of their children, enrolled in the book of the law of God;

That last statement is clearly regarding an eternal inheritance - lots arranged by the newly crowned King David - who is a prince forever over Israel.

2 Nephi 31:21
21 And now, behold, my beloved brethren, this is the way; and there is none other way nor name given under heaven whereby man can be saved in the kingdom of God. And now, behold, this is the doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen.

Edited because, .......................I want to.

Great scripture that underscores the critical membership of the Holy Ghost which underscores the fact that this new covenant God makes with Israel and his servant David are one and the same.

[Alaris]

Did you show me respect when you attacked my very intelligence? Did you show me respect when you said my beliefs are on a sandy foundation? Did you apologize for doing that? I think not in all cases. So please don't come at me about respect.

I didn't say I was interested in Gileadi, I'm not. I suggested posting a reference so anyone that is interested could research his words. Please make no claims that I didn't make. I simply think is is fair for others to see where you're coming from.

I make no claims of knowing Isaiah's words, I don't. His words are above my pay grade. Yet, I do not trust that for every person writing a book claiming to know and say everything exactly as Isaiah meant it to say is going to help me. For this reason, I must go to God for understanding, but I haven't felt an urgency, because learning Gods word takes a lot of study in and of itself. To me, the Holy Ghost is a wonderful man, a teacher and a friend. As for him taking upon another role, doesn't fit, unless inspired to find out by God. Only then will I move upon that directive. At my age and the fact I now have advanced age syndrome, studying basic scripture is a task as is. Isaiah only complicates things. Is there a book entitled, Isaiah made easy? Maybe that's the book for me.

Years ago, I attended an institution class and read "Jesus The Christ" by Talmage, that was difficult to understand without having a dictionary at hand. But what a wonderful work it is. He wrote that book while in the temple, so I am certain he was guided in his writings.

As Jordan Peterson says, I am very careful with my words. I have very carefully not insulted you, called you names, or insulted your intelligence. I'm sorry if you feel that way - my pointing out the scriptures that don't reinforce your point - scriptures that you clearly didn't understand hurt your point rather than help it - if there's a better way to point that out without making your intelligence feel insulted, I'll happily consider leveling up my charitable debate skills.

Again, if you read through this thread, you'll see where I disagree with Gileadi - Gileadi makes no claim about the servant being the Holy Ghost - he does however say the servant is participator in the Davidic Covenant to a lesser degree and explains that the Davidic Covenant is one of a ruler who intercedes and suffers on behalf of his people and he does explain that the servant is a lesser participator than Jehovah Himself is. etc. There are other differences of opinion - I believe the one wearing read is the Davidic Servant - Gileadi does not apparently. etc.

I don't know what else to say here except point out the sheer quantity of posts and words you've left here in this thread over which you admit you have little knowledge, interest, and prayer.

[Alaris]

In the OP we see this blog by Alaris: http://lordoftheseraphim.blogspot.com/2 ... st-is.html

May I present some food for thought?

The very first sentence of the disclaimer says it all. Personally, I would ask for people to, first, ask God if it is right to read it. Then if they get a burning in their bosom and feel right in their mind, then proceed. Nevertheless, perhaps reading it first may help but remember the article may cause extreme cognitive dissonance. Couldn't this cause the asking of God a disruptive, challenging and heart wrenching experience?

The last sentence of the disclaimer, imo, is far from heart warming.

Here is the opener:

DISCLAIMER:

The following is not official doctrine of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Please pray before reading this article and ask for the Holy Spirit to be your guide. Please pray after to confirm any truth by that same Spirit. This article may cause extreme cognitive dissonance if not approached with a humble prayer and an open heart. Also, you may never hear the sacrament prayer the same after reading this post.
.............................................................................................................
Sacrament prayer in Moroni 4:3
3 O God, the Eternal Father, we ask thee in the name of thy Son, Jesus Christ, to bless and sanctify this bread to the souls of all those who partake of it; that they may eat in remembrance of the body of thy Son, and witness unto thee, O God, the Eternal Father, that they are willing to take upon them the name of thy Son, and always remember him, and keep his commandments which he hath given them, that they may always have his Spirit to be with them. Amen.

The Spirit of God is the Holy Ghost, see below. So who is the Spirit of Christ, the Son, as referenced in the Sacramental prayer? Some information on this below.

God
When one speaks of God, it is generally the Father who is referred to; that is, Elohim. All mankind are His children. The personage known as Jehovah in Old Testament times, and who is usually identified in the Old Testament as Lord (in small capitals), is the Son, known as Jesus Christ, and who is also a God. Jesus works under the direction of the Father and is in complete harmony with Him. All mankind are His brethren and sisters, He being the eldest of the spirit children of Elohim. Many of the things that the scripture says were done by God were actually done by the Lord (Jesus). Thus the scripture says that “God created the heaven and the earth” (Gen. 1:1), but we know that it was actually the Lord (Jesus) who was the creator (John 1:3, 10), or as Paul said, God created all things by Christ Jesus (Eph. 3:9). The Holy Ghost is also a God and is variously called the Holy Spirit, the Spirit, the Spirit of God, etc.
.............................................................................................................
With regards to reading the material, let's see what God says:

Doctrine and Covenants 8:2
2 Yea, behold, I will tell you in your mind and in your heart, by the Holy Ghost, which shall come upon you and which shall dwell in your heart.

D&C 9:8 (8–9)
8 ...behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.
9 But if it be not right you shall have no such feelings, but you shall have a stupor of thought that shall cause you to forget the thing which is wrong....
.............................................................................................................
From LDS org, which, btw, is now ChurchofJesusChrist.org, we read:

I Have a Question, What is the difference between the Holy Ghost, the Spirit of Christ, and the Light of Christ?

Brent Bulloch, instructor at the Tempe Institute of Religion adjacent to Arizona State University. In the scriptures, the Holy Ghost is called by several names, such as: “the Spirit,” “the Spirit of God,” “the Spirit of the Lord,” “the Spirit of Truth,” “the Holy Spirit,” and “the Comforter.” Some of these same terms are also used to refer to the Light of Christ, which may also be called “the Spirit of Christ,” and “the light of truth.” Although the names given them are sometimes the same, the Light of Christ and the Holy Ghost are different and distinct.

The Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit and a member of the Godhead. Elder Joseph Fielding Smith taught that “the Holy Ghost should not be confused with the Spirit [the Light of Christ] which fills the immensity of space and which is everywhere present. This other Spirit is impersonal and has no size, nor dimensions; it proceeds forth from the presence of the Father and the Son and is in all things. We should speak of the Holy Ghost as a personage as ‘he’ and this other Spirit as ‘it,’ although when we speak of the power or gift of the Holy Ghost we may properly say ‘it.’”1

The terms “Spirit of Christ” and the “Light of Christ” are most often used in the scriptures synonymously. Elder Bruce R. McConkie gave this explanation about what the Light of Christ is: “There is a spirit—the Spirit of the Lord, the Spirit of Christ, the light of truth, the light of Christ—that defies description and is beyond mortal comprehension. It is in us and in all things; it is around us and around all things; it fills the earth and the heavens and the universe. It is everywhere, in all immensity, without exception; it is an indwelling, immanent, ever-present, never-absent spirit. It has neither shape nor form nor personality. It is not an entity nor a person nor a personage. It has no agency, does not act independently, and exists not to act but to be acted upon.”2

The scriptures tell us that the Light of Christ, which “proceedeth forth from the presence of God to fill the immensity of space,” is “the light which is in all things, which giveth life to all things, which is the law by which all things are governed, even the power of God.”3 It is manifested in the light of the sun, moon, and stars and is the power by which they and the earth were made. It is also the light that quickens our understanding.4

Elder Bruce R. McConkie taught that the Light of Christ “is the agency of God’s power; it is the means and way whereby ‘he comprehendeth all things,’ so that ‘all things are before him, and all things are round about him.’ It is the way whereby ‘he is above all things, and in all things, and is through all things, and is round about all things.’”5

The Holy Ghost makes use of the Light of Christ to perform his work. “The Spirit of Christ (or Light of Christ) is the agency through which the Holy Ghost operates,” Elder McConkie explained.6 Moroni wrote that all spiritual gifts come through the Spirit of Christ,7 meaning that when the Holy Ghost works with us, he transmits his gifts by the agency of the light of Christ.

After we are baptized and confirmed and we receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, we may enjoy the gifts of the Holy Ghost through the Holy Ghost’s ministration. Since the Holy Ghost uses the Spirit of Christ or Light of Christ to minister to the Saints of God, the term “Spirit of Christ” is sometimes used to refer to the Holy Ghost’s ministration through that Spirit.8

In a general conference address, President Marion G. Romney helped clarify the nature of the connection between the Light of Christ and the Holy Ghost. “There are three phases of the light of Christ that I want to mention,” said President Romney.

“The first one is the light which enlighteneth every man that cometh into the world;

“The second phase is the gift of the Holy Ghost;

“And the third is the more sure word of prophecy.”9

The first phase of the Light of Christ is referred to in the Doctrine and Covenants: “Whatsoever is truth is light, and whatsoever is light is Spirit, even the Spirit of Jesus Christ.

“And the spirit giveth light to every man that cometh into the world.”10 Mormon taught that “the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil.”11 In this respect, the Light of Christ is associated with what we often call conscience. Everyone who is born into mortality receives the Light of Christ.

What is the effect of the Light of Christ on an individual? Elder Joseph Fielding Smith wrote that “if a man who has never heard the gospel will hearken to the teachings and manifestations of the Spirit of Christ, or the Light of Truth, which come to him, often spoken of as conscience … it will lead him eventually to the fulness of the gospel.”12

Similarly, President Harold B. Lee said, “Every one of you born into this world enjoys the blessing of this Light that shall never cease to strive with you until you are led to that further light from the gift of the Holy Ghost that may be received only upon condition of repentance and baptism into the Kingdom of God.”13

The second phase of the Light of Christ spoken of by President Romney is received after baptism. President John Taylor taught that the world has “a portion of the Spirit of God,” but that “we have something more than that portion of the Spirit of God which is given to every man, and it is called the gift of the Holy Ghost, which is received through obedience to the first principles of the Gospel of Christ, by the laying on of hands of the servants of God.”14

President Brigham Young spoke of the Holy Ghost’s influence as “the increased rays of that light which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.”15 Elder Charles W. Penrose taught that a person who receives the gift of the Holy Ghost receives “a greater and higher endowment of the same spirit which enlightens every man that comes into the world.”16 Through this greater endowment of the Light of Christ the Holy Ghost conveys to the Saints such gifts of the Spirit as testimony, revelation, healing, prophecy, and many others.17 President Romney also explained that “one is born again by actually receiving and experiencing the light and power inherent in the gift of the Holy Ghost.”18

The third phase of the Light of Christ spoken of by President Romney is “‘the more sure word of prophecy’ (D&C 131:5), which is obtained by making one’s ‘calling and election sure’ (2 Pet. 1:10).”19 The Prophet Joseph Smith taught that “after a person has faith in Christ, repents of his sins, and is baptized for the remission of his sins and receives the Holy Ghost, … then let him continue to humble himself before God, hungering and thirsting after righteousness, and living by every word of God, and the Lord will soon say unto him, Son, thou shalt be exalted. When the Lord has thoroughly proved him, and finds that the man is determined to serve Him at all hazards, then the man will find his calling and election made sure, then it will be his privilege to receive the other Comforter, which the Lord hath promised the Saints, as is recorded in the testimony of St. John.”20

The Prophet Joseph Smith taught that a person who receives the more sure word of prophecy is “sealed in the heavens and [has] the promise of eternal life in the kingdom of God.”21 Such persons may then, “by making [their] calling and election sure, enjoy the full light of Christ.”22

The Holy Ghost and the gift of the Holy Ghost are not the same. The Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit in the form of a man. He is separate and distinct from the Father and the Son, yet they all work together in perfect unity. The Father and the Son have resurrected bodies of flesh and bone, which the Holy Ghost does not have.23

The body of the Holy Ghost is like the spirit body of the Lord, which the Lord showed unto the brother of Jared before His mortal birth. Such a body resembles that of a man, but consists of spirit matter, a substance finer and purer than temporal matter.24 The Holy Ghost has size and dimensions. He does not transform himself into any other form or manifest himself in any other image than that of a spirit man.

Unlike the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Ghost does not fill the universe and cannot be personally present everywhere at the same time; however, his power and influence, through the Light of Christ, can be manifest at the same time throughout all the immensity of space.25

The gift of the Holy Ghost is the right or blessing extended to those who are baptized whereby they may enjoy the companionship and ministration of the Holy Ghost as long as they are faithful. Often in the scriptures, the term Holy Ghost is used to refer not to the personage of the Holy Ghost, but to the gifts of the Holy Ghost, or his power, influence, or ministrations.26

There is still much that we do not know about the nature and power of the Holy Ghost and the Light of Christ. However, we can have unshaken confidence that “every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father.”27 The Doctrine and Covenants tells us, “That which is of God is light; and he that receiveth light, and continueth in God, receiveth more light; and that light groweth brighter and brighter until the perfect day.”28 It also says that “he that keepeth [the Lord’s] commandments receiveth truth and light, until he is glorified in truth and knoweth all things.”29

Greater understanding about the Light of Christ, the Holy Ghost, and other things of God will come to us as we obey the Lord and seek knowledge with pure intent.30 While we are growing in such knowledge, our greatest concern and effort should be to listen to and follow the voice of the Spirit that we might do the will of our Father in Heaven, to accomplish what he would have us do.
Related Content
1. Doctrines of Salvation, comp. Bruce R. McConkie, 3 vols., Salt Lay: Bookcraft, 1954–56, 1:49–50.
2. A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1985, p. 257; see also D&C 88:41.
3. D&C 88:12–13.
4. See D&C 88:6–11.
5. McConkie, A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, p. 258; see D&C 88:41.
6. Mormon Doctrine, 2d ed., Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1966, p. 314.
7. See Moro. 10:17.
8. See Rom. 8:9; 1 Pet. 1:11 for examples; see also Bruce R. McConkie, Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 3 vols., Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1965–73, 3:286–87.
9. Ensign, May 1977, p. 43.
10. D&C 84:45–46.
11. Moro. 7:16.
12. Doctrines of Salvation, 1:51; see also D&C 84:45–48.
13. Decisions for Successful Living, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1973, p. 144.
14. Journal of Discourses, 23:320–21; see also 23:370–71.
15. Journal of Discourses, 6:315.
16. Journal of Discourses, 23:350.
17. See 1 Cor. 12:4–11; Moro. 10:8–18; D&C 46:8–26.
18. See Ensign, May 1977, p. 44.
19. Ibid.
20. Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, sel. Joseph Fielding Smith, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1938, p. 150.
21. History of the Church, 5:388.
22. Romney, Ensign, May 1977, p. 45.
23. See D&C 130:22–23; see also McConkie, A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, pp. 253–54.
24. See D&C 131:7–8.
25. See Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 1:38; McConkie, Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 2:105.
26. See John 20:22; Acts 7:55–56; Acts 8:14–19; Acts 10:44–48; Acts 19:1–6; see also McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p. 358–59; McConkie, Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 2:78.
27. James 1:17.
28. D&C 50:24.
29. D&C 93:28.
30. See D&C 130:19.

First of all - thank you for reading from the OP even if it's only a paragraph or two.

Some here on LDSFF once said, "to take upon you the name of Jesus Christ is to take upon you the Holy Ghost." This again underscores the fact that Davidic King with whom Israel covenants is in fact the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is part of the baptism ordinance - in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Now, we don't know the Father's name or the Holy Ghost's, but we still reference their names.

After a quick google, the fact most believe the end of the sacrament prayer references the Holy Ghost rather than Jesus is pretty clear. However, the fruits of studying the Davidic Servant, the Holy Ghost, the Angel of the Lord and the pertinent scriptures and yes even the works of Gileadi, etc. but most importantly - seeking understanding in humility through prayer - underscores why the sacrament is worded this way. The sacrament prayer points to Ezekiel 37, the fulfillment of the fall festivals, and the new covenants that are made.

Ezekiel 37:24 And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them.
25 And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children’s children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever.
26 Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.
27 My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
28 And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify (role of the Holy Ghost uncoincidentally) Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.

Jeremiah 31:31 ¶ Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


Compare Jeremiah back to the D&C scripture I quoted earlier about how the redemption of ZION must mirror the redemption of our fathers - and the important differences cited.

By whose power is the law written in our inward parts? The repetition of a covenant we make at the morning of the first day of the week points to the new covenant we make at the end of this world, for what is an end but a new beginning? How can the Lord Jesus Christ move on to join the Elohim without a designated heir of His own for this is how Jesus earned His right to be firstborn by joining the church of the firstborn and proceeding along this same path - this one path to Godhood.

[Alaris]

Questions: if the Holy Ghost were to take upon himself a body, how could he help, influence or confirm truth to anyone? Isn't his role to be a testimony and declaration of God's word and confirm this truth in the hearts and minds of God's children?

I addressed this earlier from D&C 103. The angel of the Lord - who appears to have been the sole, well arm of Jehovah, in the Old Testament seems to be missing from the other side of the veil in the end times' redemption of ZION. This is such an important clue that seemingly has gone over the heads of our church for centuries now - almost as though there's been a spirit of deep sleep poured out upon us. I mean, have you ever heard anyone in our church ask, "Who is this Angel of the Lord who clearly has glory and dominion who tells Samson's parents his name is secret?" Why is it a secret? Why doesn't anyone even think to ask these questions.

D&C 103:15 Behold, I say unto you, the redemption of Zion must needs come by power;
16 Therefore, I will raise up unto my people a man, who shall lead them like as Moses led the children of Israel.
17 For ye are the children of Israel, and of the seed of Abraham, and ye must needs be led out of bondage by power, and with a stretched-out arm.
18 And as your fathers were led at the first, even so shall the redemption of Zion be.

To answer your question more specifically, I don't know how the machinations of the power of the Holy Ghost works. I know there is some great inconsistency between the earlier and later versions of the section in D&C where it reads that the Holy Ghost is a spirit else he could not dwell within us - almost like this was muddied on purpose, like it's, I don't know, hidden or something! Here's a question that should help shed some light: Do we need to understand the machinations of how the power of the Holy Ghost is executed before we can consider these scriptures that clearly align the Comforter to the Rod of Jesse?

Christ, being God in the flesh had a hard time convincing people of what he taught. He didn't jump out of his body and say, hey, I'm God, your creator. People pushed him around and eventually crucified him. What makes anyone think the Holy Ghost in the flesh could be an influence to everyone? This makes no sense whatsoever.

Actually, as participator in the Davidic Covenant (which is about inheritance and the temple) this makes perfect sense. The Holy Ghost didn't convince the Pharisees - DJB nails this in the post below here that having this truth hidden from us until now makes perfect sense. A God requires an acute level of opposition to provide a god-level trial and opposition to ascend to a higher sphere. Red carpets rolled out make no sense. Being able to convince folks magically makes little sense.

If, and I say if profoundly, the Holy Ghost were to come to earth and gain a body, then die and come back as a Davidic Servant in the form of man, how does this work?

Huh? The Holy Ghost comes as the Davidic Servant. He doesn't know who he is until he is awakened (Isaiah 51:9-10.)

If he doesn't gain a body here, then how could he become a Davidic servant not having been in the lineage of David in the first place?

I really don't know where you're coming from here. The lineage of David is a spiritual lineage first just as Israel is spiritual first. The Holy Ghost will absolutely have a genealogy that points back to Jesse and very likely to Jesus Christ Himself.

If he were to gain a body here, he still would not be of the lineage of David. Can someone show how he could become such?

Again, I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Jesse had some kids - one was David. His kids had kids and so on to Mary. There are kids after that who have kids and so on until the Holy Ghost is born to this lineage.

Jesus says he is the root and offspring of David. Would the Holy Ghost set aside this fact and then claim the same thing? He is a spokesman for Christ, not a replacement, right? The Holy Ghost is not an angel, he is a God, one of the Godhead. Christ said he sent his angel to declare who he is.

The Holy Ghost won't ever claim to be Jesus or equal to Him. The Holy Ghost actually is an angel in the truest sense of the word - messenger / malaki.

2 Nephi 21:10
10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek; and his rest shall be glorious. Who was it that said "enter into MY rest?

Jesus. The root of Jesse will enter into Jesus' rest.

Revelation 22:16
16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Even if the angel were to be the Holy Ghost, he could not claim to be the root and offspring of David. He would be confirming that Jesus is as the verse declares.

Agreed - I don't know anyone who believes Revelation 22:16 is the Angel claiming to be Jesus. The Angel of the Lord speaks first person on behalf of Jehovah all throughout the Bible, even in Revelation, but that doesn't mean he is claiming to be Jesus. I really don't know where you're coming from here.

[Alaris]

It's always been a mystery to me ever since I joined the church at the age of 16, that the Holy Ghost was a real person, but his identity being hidden. The father and son's identity are not hidden, only veiled until you pass it. The Holy Ghost is a mystery. What a coincidence... So is the Lord's endtime servant.
The great test coming, and it will be a mighty test to see who has the Holy Ghost as there guide, will be when the Fathers work begins, and who will reject or accept it....

Exactly

That's why there is need of a mystery up till the Fathers work, because Christ will try the faith of his people.

Wait, but I thought we had prophets who try our faith for us? President Nelson prophesied of the coming days where we will have to rely on the Holy Ghost individually. I personally believe President Nelson is aware he is giving a layered prophesy here. You must rely on the Holy Ghost's power and him individually as he arises and gathers the tribes of Israel and subjugates the kingdoms of this world. I mean think about that! Why would this just be some prophet or some king? Of course all of these prophecies point to something deeply important for all of us to discover.

I will not add to the contention here, but I will bear my own witness and testimony.

I know that my Father and Savior Jesus Christ live! I know it!!! I know that like President Nelson said, that there work is going to be at its mightiest in the coming years. I also know that the Holy Ghost is a God and part of the Godhead, hence he should be respected as a God. If he does, and I personally have received a witness before ever knowing about this blog, that the Lord's Servant will be the Holy Ghost in the flesh. He should be respected. After all he has the power to make us clean and pure from sin because of Jesus Christ's Atonement, and unity with the Godhead.

Apologies if I have contributed to the spirit of contention. I'm doing my best to refute, and even be sharp at times, but not contribute to the chasing away of the power of the Holy Ghost.

I don't need to debate this testimony of mine, because it is unshakable!

Here here!

My advice to all here would be to pray, and stand with your own witness and testimony so that God can judge...

I am forever grateful for my Savior Jesus Christ, and will do anything in my power to assist in the cause of Zion, that Christ and his kings and queens may reign forever...

I agree with this statement to righteousrepublic. Get a witness one way or the other, but you cannot learn something you are closed-minded towards. The scriptures are clear in this regard.

How many have received a witness of this truth who have prayed about it - there are several in this thread. More than 3. I've had folks reach out to me individually on my blog who have received this witness who don't even post here. I've made friends who have shared amazing pearls - visions - that confirm this truth and the name of the Angel of the Lord. The Angel of the Lord is the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is the Davidic Servant. Feel the power of this truth.

[Alaris]

-------------
I'm through with this because I think I have voiced my opinion
about the Holy Ghost being the ( Lord's spirit "my spirit" ), and not The Davidic Servant, but I just wanted to jump in here and say that while I have not really seen much in Gileadi's work where he mentions Holy Ghost very much , I have read extensively what he has to say about the Davidic Servant, and from everything I have read and studied, he never has given even the slight reference to the
Holy Ghost when talking about the Davidic Servant, and from all that I've read,
he is definitely NOT THE HOLY GHOST
I WOULD like to see any quote from him that says otherwise.

Doctrine and Covenants
Section 36
2 And I will lay my hand upon you by the hand of my servant Sidney Rigdon,
and you shall receive my Spirit, the Holy Ghost, even the Comforter, which shall teach you the peaceable things of the kingdom;
and many many other scriptures I've already posted.

If I recall correctly, you don't believe there is a "he" behind the Holy Ghost at all. I'm curious what your take is on the baptism prayer or 2 Nephi 31, etc. (if I do indeed recall correctly.)

I will tell you this - Gileadi is not the source of truth. His commentary is sometimes incorrect. I can tell you with 100 percent certainty that he's wrong about Isaiah 51:9 having to do with Egypt - or at least any layered meaning aligned to Egypt is extremely secondary.

I do respect him tremendously and have learned a great deal from including his website in my studies - but he's definitely not the source of my testimony of the Davidic Servant but a supporting witness.

Consider if you would (and you may have been the one from whom I learned this) that Gileadi says it's not his place to identify who the Davidic Servant is. Could he actually mean "the Holy Ghost" there? Clearly he's not revealed all he knows or believes.

Doctrine and Covenants
Section 36
2 And I will lay my hand upon you by the hand of my servant Sidney Rigdon,
and you shall receive my Spirit, the Holy Ghost, even the Comforter, which shall teach you the peaceable things of the kingdom;

^ I completely get we're using to reading scriptures about the Comforter / Holy Ghost in certain ways, but this verse only reinforces the fact that the one mighty and strong will be sent who will be a fountain of truth.

D&C 85:7 And it shall come to pass that I, the Lord God, will send one mighty and strong, holding the scepter of power in his hand, clothed with light for a covering, whose mouth shall utter words, eternal words; while his bowels shall be a fountain of truth, to set in order the house of God, and to arrange by lot the inheritances of the saints whose names are found, and the names of their fathers, and of their children, enrolled in the book of the law of God;
8 While that man, who was called of God and appointed, that putteth forth his hand to steady the ark of God, shall fall by the shaft of death, like as a tree that is smitten by the vivid shaft of lightning.

Consider the Ark metaphor. To whom does the ultimate right of High Priest of Israel belong? Consider the Ark is seen in heaven just after the two witnesses ascend and the seventh trump is sounded where the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord and His Christ.

Could the one who was called of God be the devil? Was this role as lesser God first his? Or is this a general warning that there is one man appointed to be the one who fulfills Yom Kippur and sprinkles the blood of Jesus Christ upon the mercy seat seven times? Wow, I just had a thought here ... maybe later I'll share after I let it matriculate.

In your other posts, you paste some commentary on Gileadi and proxy salvation through the Davidic Covenant. Doesn't it make more sense that the Davidic Servant is the Lesser God of Israel if he is indeed participating in proxy salvation to a much greater degree than we and that there are so very many scriptures about him - Jesus quotes them! Nephi, Moroni, Ether are all forbidden from sharing WITH US what they've seen ... yet they all plead with us to read Isaiah. *SHAKES I AM* For Peter's sake, think about that!

[I AM]

-------------
I'm through with this because I think I have voiced my opinion
about the Holy Ghost being the ( Lord's spirit "my spirit" ), and not The Davidic Servant, but I just wanted to jump in here and say that while I have not really seen much in Gileadi's work where he mentions Holy Ghost very much , I have read extensively what he has to say about the Davidic Servant, and from everything I have read and studied, he never has given even the slight reference to the
Holy Ghost when talking about the Davidic Servant, and from all that I've read,
he is definitely NOT THE HOLY GHOST
I WOULD like to see any quote from him that says otherwise.

Doctrine and Covenants
Section 36
2 And I will lay my hand upon you by the hand of my servant Sidney Rigdon,
and you shall receive my Spirit, the Holy Ghost, even the Comforter, which shall teach you the peaceable things of the kingdom;
and many many other scriptures I've already posted.

If I recall correctly, you don't believe there is a "he" behind the Holy Ghost at all. I'm curious what your take is on the baptism prayer or 2 Nephi 31, etc. (if I do indeed recall correctly.)

I will tell you this - Gileadi is not the source of truth. His commentary is sometimes incorrect. I can tell you with 100 percent certainty that he's wrong about Isaiah 51:9 having to do with Egypt - or at least any layered meaning aligned to Egypt is extremely secondary.

I do respect him tremendously and have learned a great deal from including his website in my studies - but he's definitely not the source of my testimony of the Davidic Servant but a supporting witness.

Consider if you would (and you may have been the one from whom I learned this) that Gileadi says it's not his place to identify who the Davidic Servant is. Could he actually mean "the Holy Ghost" there? Clearly he's not revealed all he knows or believes.

Doctrine and Covenants
Section 36
2 And I will lay my hand upon you by the hand of my servant Sidney Rigdon,
and you shall receive my Spirit, the Holy Ghost, even the Comforter, which shall teach you the peaceable things of the kingdom;

^ I completely get we're using to reading scriptures about the Comforter / Holy Ghost in certain ways, but this verse only reinforces the fact that the one mighty and strong will be sent who will be a fountain of truth.

D&C 85:7 And it shall come to pass that I, the Lord God, will send one mighty and strong, holding the scepter of power in his hand, clothed with light for a covering, whose mouth shall utter words, eternal words; while his bowels shall be a fountain of truth, to set in order the house of God, and to arrange by lot the inheritances of the saints whose names are found, and the names of their fathers, and of their children, enrolled in the book of the law of God;
8 While that man, who was called of God and appointed, that putteth forth his hand to steady the ark of God, shall fall by the shaft of death, like as a tree that is smitten by the vivid shaft of lightning.

Consider the Ark metaphor. To whom does the ultimate right of High Priest of Israel belong? Consider the Ark is seen in heaven just after the two witnesses ascend and the seventh trump is sounded where the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord and His Christ.

Could the one who was called of God be the devil? Was this role as lesser God first his? Or is this a general warning that there is one man appointed to be the one who fulfills Yom Kippur and sprinkles the blood of Jesus Christ upon the mercy seat seven times? Wow, I just had a thought here ... maybe later I'll share after I let it matriculate.

In your other posts, you paste some commentary on Gileadi and proxy salvation through the Davidic Covenant. Doesn't it make more sense that the Davidic Servant is the Lesser God of Israel if he is indeed participating in proxy salvation to a much greater degree than we and that there are so very many scriptures about him - Jesus quotes them! Nephi, Moroni, Ether are all forbidden from sharing WITH US what they've seen ... yet they all plead with us to read Isaiah. *SHAKES I AM* For Peter's sake, think about that!

---------------
I AM not, I AM,
and I"m surely not an authority on everything,
but to tell you the truth Alaris,
like I said - I'm through with this - not because I can not defend my opinion, but
because, for the most part, I'm really not interested that much in your theory.

I believe in what I believe - and nothing will change that.
( IMO) If you really want to know about the Holy Ghost,
and if you want to know WHO the Davidic Servant is,
the scriptures are full, and I would suggest you forget about what you've learned from Joseph Smith
or someone else and going so deep like you do into your theory, based on that,
and ONLY READ ALL the scriptures that have to do with both of these.
The scriptures are full - and in the past year - I have posted 100's of them on both of theses two things,
which btw I'm sure you know most of those scriptures.
To tell you the truth Alaris - you know more about this than I do, (as far as the path you have studied)
but I think you are looking for something that is more complicated than it really is, (just my opinion)
while I'm just taking the scriptures - for exactly what THEY SAY (and not what someone else says(even J.S.)

Please don't take this wrong - because I'm definitely not a know it all,
but even though I quote Gileadi, I go completely 100% by scripture.
IMO - you seem to have a way of going around everything, and only seeing what you want to see
to further justify your point of view, even though the scriptures speak for themselves.
I have no doubt that no matter what I say or scriptures I show, you
would still argue your point - and so would I - because we both want to believe
in what we want to believe in., I will continue to believe in what I've studied all my life to be the truth, because it is based ONLY ON SCRIPTURE. - NOT MY OPINION.
Soooo many here think I'm against the church -
you know, in the old days, I use to record on VHS tape church General conferences
so I could watch them over and over again,
so if it does appear that I think the church is in apostasy, it's not because of MY OPINION,
it's simply because I choose to believe and put the word of God - our scriptures above the church, and from my life-time study of them, and the Gentiles, I believe that is what the scriptures
are saying, so I have to follow that, and NOT JUST CONTINUE TO BELIEVE as so many members do that
"ALL IS WELL IN ZION"
I believe, and I have shown by scriptures, that the church is in total apostasy,
but it's obvious, by how you defend the church, you don't believe in the scriptures
the same way I do, or you choose to put the church and it's leaders above our scriptures
and the words of Christ.

Really, whatever our differences are - that's perfectly fine - no hard feelings.
But I think it's a waste of time for me, especially when my interests all elsewhere.
again - no hard feelings.

[righteousrepublic]

The idea about the Holy Ghost being the Davidic Servant being true...is profoundly questionable!!

Taking scriptures and putting meaning into them that do not exist is, well, let's see what scripture tells us:

Doctrine and Covenants 10:63
63 And this I do that I may establish my gospel, that there may not be so much contention; yea, Satan doth stir up the hearts of the people to contention concerning the points of my doctrine; and in these things they do err, for they do wrest the scriptures and do not understand them.

We've had here on this very thread contention, a twist on points of the doctrines of God, and attempts to make those who do not believe this Davidic servant being the Holy Ghost to look silly. And for what? A well known, childish comment like, I know something you don't know!!

[Alaris]

--------------
I AM not, I AM,
and I"m surely not an authority on everything,
but to tell you the truth Alaris,
like I said - I'm through with this - not because I can not defend my opinion, but
because, for the most part, I'm really not interested that much in your theory.

My witness you mean. I am not alone - RR's post above is hillarious because I agree - in the mouth of two or three witnesses, and there are more than three here. Yet you are not interested in my theory and RR hasn't really looked into this and hasn't prayed about it ... but you two are what exactly? Not witnessing. You haven't looked. You haven't asked. You haven't received. Simple, simple math.

I believe in what I believe - and nothing will change that.

Isn't agency wonderful? You can have the Son of God standing right in front of you and still believe what you want to believe and not have anything He says to you change that. Again, I'm speaking of the principle on display by Pharisees and not comparing myself to Jesus.

( IMO) If you really want to know about the Holy Ghost,
and if you want to know WHO the Davidic Servant is,
the scriptures are full, and I would suggest you forget about what you've learned from Joseph Smith
or someone else and going so deep like you do into your theory, based on that,
and ONLY READ ALL the scriptures that have to do with both of these.

Well you're not going to convince me to not consider what our dispensation patriarch had to say in his sermons. HOWever, *siiiigghhh* how much of this thread have you actually read? Anyone else want to chime in here and tell me I need to look at the scriptures again? Please read through each page here and come back and tell me I need to look at the scriptures.

The scriptures are full - and in the past year - I have posted 100's of them on both of theses two things,
which btw I'm sure you know most of those scriptures.
To tell you the truth Alaris - you know more about this than I do, (as far as the path you have studied)
but I think you are looking for something that is more complicated than it really is, (just my opinion)
while I'm just taking the scriptures - for exactly what THEY SAY (and not what someone else says(even J.S.)

Again, read through the thread. There are some beautiful witnesses here. Abijah has stated his belief that looking more closely at Heavenly Father, Jesus, and The Holy Ghost is simply looking at an advanced eternal family. Grandfather, Son, Grandson. It doesn't get much more simple than that yet look at the many efforts to nothing-ize the Holy Ghost - nothing to see here folks. Just a God whose name hasn't been revealed.

Please don't take this wrong - because I'm definitely not a know it all,
but even though I quote Gileadi, I go completely 100% by scripture.

You realize the conflict here? You quote Gileadi and go 100 % by scripture. I rarely quote Gileadi and stick to nearly always scripture and Joseph Smith. Occasionally I'll bring in the Apocrypha to show how it underscores the connections I make as another witness.

IMO - you seem to have a way of going around everything, and only seeing what you want to see
to further justify your point of view, even though the scriptures speak for themselves.

Imagine if you will that God handed this knowledge to you - just gave it to you straight from him to you. "The Davidic Servant is The Holy Ghost." Now, I don't expect you to read through this thread with that in mind, but if you have some time on your hands do so. I haven't shared the foundation of how I came to know these things, but however you wish to call it, this isn't my "point of view" but my sacred solemn witness. I say, "imagine god handed this to you" because I want you to ask yourself. What would you do with it? How would you feel when folks come here and chime in and admit they've not asked. They've looked into it less. Yet somehow ALL of these connections are just mere coincidences.

I have no doubt that no matter what I say or scriptures I show, you
would still argue your point - and so would I - because we both want to believe
in what we want to believe in., I will continue to believe in what I've studied all my life to be the truth, because it is based ONLY ON SCRIPTURE. - NOT MY OPINION.

DJB said it wonderfully about the same truth. My testimony is unshakable. Two years it took me to even start looking into this after this knowledge was gifted to me. And there have been SO VERY MANY confirmations - spiritual confirmations. Yet you and RR want to turn this into a scripture wagging contest.

Soooo many here think I'm against the church -
you know, in the old days, I use to record on VHS tape church General conferences
so I could watch them over and over again,
so if it does appear that I think the church is in apostasy, it's not because of MY OPINION,
it's simply because I choose to believe and put the word of God - our scriptures above the church, and from my life-time study of them, and the Gentiles, I believe that is what the scriptures
are saying, so I have to follow that, and NOT JUST CONTINUE TO BELIEVE as so many members do that
"ALL IS WELL IN ZION"

I hope you can tell I respect you and your beliefs despite our differences.

I believe, and I have shown by scriptures, that the church is in total apostasy,
but it's obvious, by how you defend the church, you don't believe in the scriptures
the same way I do, or you choose to put the church and it's leaders above our scriptures
and the words of Christ.

And I believe the church is exactly where God wants it - and that these truths have been hidden for this time and season. You know there's a scripture in this thread where Paul basically says the High Priest of Israel is the Holy Ghost? Did you know that? If not, maybe open your mind a bit and take a closer look.

Really, whatever our differences are - that's perfectly fine - no hard feelings.
But I think it's a waste of time for me, especially when my interests all elsewhere.
again - no hard feelings.

I agree on no hard feelings. However, let's agree to disagree that discovering the spiritual identity of the Davidic Servant is a waste of time. Ask yourself - why are there so very many prophecies of an end time King who gathers Israel? Israel has been gathered before. Israel has had kings before. Yet the scriptures are full of these prophecies - just full of them. This isn't just a king - but a participant in proxy salvation at a higher level than all of us. Who is he? Where is he on his eternal journey? Have you looked at the word links (words Gileadi has identified repeatedly as pertaining to the Davidic Servant) between the Comforter and the servant?

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;
11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.
12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

Verses 13 and 14 rid any notion of this being the same person. He shall not speak of himself but glorify me. Got it - separate individual. A man. A person. Not an "it"

Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:
2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD;
3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the LORD: and he shall not judge: after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:
4 But with righteousness: shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity: for the meek of the earth:: and he shall smite: the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay: the wicked.:
5 And righteousness: shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.


How about you look at the scriptures. Look!

D&C 113:3 What is the rod spoken of in the first verse of the 11th chapter of Isaiah, that should come of the Stem of Jesse?
4 Behold, thus saith the Lord: It is a servant in the hands of Christ, who is partly a descendant of Jesse as well as of Ephraim, or of the house of Joseph, on whom there is laid much power.

These links just continue on through the scriptures. Compare D&C 113:3 and the two tribes of the Rod to Ezekiel 37 where the two sticks of Ephraim and Judah become one and the rest of the chapter is all about the servant David who becomes both King and prince forever over Israel. Is D&C 113:3 a tribal coincidence with Ezekiel 37? No.

18 ¶ And when the children of thy people shall speak unto thee, saying, Wilt thou not shew us what thou meanest by these?

19 Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand.

20 ¶ And the sticks whereon thou writest shall be in thine hand before their eyes.

21 And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land:

22 And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all:

For anyone who thinks the Comforter isn't central to our own eternal progression / salvation /exaltation:

D&C 88:3 Wherefore, I now send upon you another Comforter, even upon you my friends, that it may abide in your hearts, even the Holy Spirit of promise; which other Comforter is the same that I promised unto my disciples, as is recorded in the testimony of John.

4 This Comforter is the promise which I give unto you of eternal life, even the glory of the celestial kingdom;

Do the David prophecies sound like you can watch from afar and not have to subjugate yourself to him? Who is he? It doesn't matter? ... It matters. He matters to your salvation. This is not a temporal Kingdom and covenant but an eternal kingdom and an eternal covenant (see Ezekiel 37.) Rejecting the greatest product of the Atonement of Jesus Christ - the purchasing of an unconditional inheritor (Gileadi's phrase) by His blood and suffering to secure a joint heir (see those two sermons I quote last page) - that is why we crucify the Lord afresh when we blaspheme the Holy Ghost (see Hebrews and Joseph Smith's Elias, Elijah, Messiah sermon) This is the most misunderstood doctrine in our church and for good reason.

One more scripture before I get another grossly uninformed recommendation to "stick to the scriptures"

Isaiah 63:9 In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them: in his love and in his pity he redeemed them; and he bare them, and carried them all the days of old.

10 ¶ But they rebelled, and vexed his holy Spirit: therefore he was turned to be their enemy, and he fought against them.

Now, you can interpret that scripture however you want, but the angel of the presence is referred to in verse 9, the "but" conjunction in verse 10 links the two verses together, and "they vexed his holy Spirit" ties the Holy Spirit to the angel of his presence. See that how you may but please don't infer I haven't considered scripture enough where there are plenty of powerful links. This isn't some random scripture from the old testament but Isaiah where he links the identity of the Angel of the Lord - (who is already tied to the servant in Isaiah 51:9-10) to the Holy Spirit.

Here's Gileadi's Isaiah Institute Translation (includes Isaiah scroll as a source)

9 with all their troubles he troubled himself,
the angel of his presence delivering them.
In his love and compassion
he himself redeemed them;
he lifted them up and carried them
all the days of old.
10 Yet they rebelled and grieved his holy Spirit,
till he became their enemy
and himself fought against them.

"his holy spirit" - there it is again. You can say this is Jesus and I can show you where the angel of the presence went from defending Israel to fighting against her. That's also in this thread.