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Discuss the last days, Zion, second coming, emergency preparedness, alternative health, etc.
Silver
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5247

Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by Silver »

LDS Anarchist wrote: December 14th, 2017, 4:32 pm
Durzan wrote: December 14th, 2017, 8:53 am LDSAnarchist, you and others have often brought interesting things to the table. You have said many things that have enlightened my mind and gotten me to think, and these thoughts have also led to some moments of communication by the spirit; however, you have also said things that have caused my spirit to shy away.

Your words are as dull two-edged sword; You speak with an enlightened spiritual tongue, but at the same time, the words with which you speak run with a subtle corruption. A corruption that you may or may not realize exists. Your words are even as the writings in the Apocrypha, valuable to those with the Spirit of Discernment, but able to sway those who don't have such gifts onto unseen paths where the Devil can snare them. Note that my words may very well be the same.
I appreciate the care and concern, Durzan. Remember, though, that the word of the Spirit is a two-edged sword:
Behold, I am God; give heed to my word, which is quick and powerful, sharper than a two-edged sword, to the dividing asunder of both joints and marrow; therefore, give heed unto my word. (D&C 12:2)

And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God: (Ephesians 6:17)
Nevertheless, my words will never lead you into devilish paths. I speak plainly and forcefully and authoritatively, but it will cut you both ways. If you believe it, or ponder it and then gain an understanding of it, it'll bless you. But if you disbelieve it, or refuse to ponder and consider it, it'll cut you and make you bleed. What you perceive as the "corruption" of my words is merely the other side of the coin. For there are two sides of the word of the Lord: on one side is mercy and compassion and forgiveness, and on the other side is justice and judgment and condemnation. Everyone sides on the side of mercy, holds to that side, and speaks from that side only. I don't. I happen to like both sides of the coin.
Durzan wrote: December 14th, 2017, 8:53 am Your words and power can unintentionally harm others as much as it helps. Be careful about what you say, as well as what you don't say. Bridle your words, actions, and abilities if you have them, for they are as much a blessing as they are a curse. Also, I do sense a degree of pride and arrogance coming from you. Bridle that as well, lest it lead you unto forbidden paths yourself. True followers of Christ seeks to be humble regardless of the gifts they posses, lest he or she be compelled to be humble by the Lord.
I do appreciate the counsel, Durzan. What you perceive as pride and arrogance, though, is simply an abundance of confidence and faith. I am routinely called "the most prideful man I've ever met" and also "the most humble man I've ever met," by people who know me in real life, and often by the very same people at different moments. What they are perceiving are the two sides of the coin. When one side manifests, I appear more humble than anyone they've ever met. And when the other side manifests, I appear filled with pride and arrogance. But it's just the Spirit manifesting in me. If you can't deal with little old mortal me manifesting a small portion of both modes of the Spirit, you ain't gonna be able to handle being in the presence of God's fullness.

As for the Lord humbling me, He is the only one capable of humbling me to the dust, and He has done this, which is why I am blessed with all these gifts. He doesn't give all these gifts to the prideful, but only to those who humble themselves before Him and exercise mighty faith before Him. And if I ever get out of hand, He is the one who deals with me. But He makes allowances for my nature, for I embrace both modes of His Spirit, not just the one side like everyone else, and as He makes allowances for me, everyone else would be wise to do the same. For God doesn't just love me like He does everyone else, but He also likes me and my nature.

Nevertheless, it is always a joy to find a saint gently scolding me, as you have done. I do not mind that, at all. But just know that behind the scenes God also deals with me. (We like to think of God as merciful, compassionate and so forth, and that's all true for mode one, but mode two of the Spirit is harsh. I am used to basking in both modes from God, which is why I find it kind of amusing when a saint gently slaps my wrists. Compared to what God does with me, it makes me laugh it's so small. But I appreciate the saintly concern, nonetheless.)

Nevertheless, gentle scolding is one thing, a saintly thing, but if you openly oppose and defy me, tell me to take a trip to outer darkness, etc., that ain't saintly behavior. That's the spirit of contention, which is of the devil, and I am liable to respond to it just as harshly with the other edge of the sword of the Spirit. Or maybe I'll turn the other cheek, like Jesus. My options are always open.
Durzan wrote: December 14th, 2017, 8:53 am Silver and those of you who are "attacking" LDSA, you are all staunch defenders of the traditional gospel, I can sense that. Your rebukes to LDSAnarchist come out of your sense of christ-like love for him, I am sure... but nevertheless you have crossed from a plain and simple rebuke of love into contentious territory, and I would also gently ask you to bridle your tongue.Lets keep things alive in this thread without the corruption of the spirit of contention. If I see it again, I may not be so gentle with my words.

Now, with that out of the way back on topic: this thread is incredibly interesting.
Silver and the rest have dark minds. They are not defending the traditional gospel. I have given the traditional gospel in the OP, namely, that the leadership will tell the saints what they need to know, even concerning the signs of the times, and I quoted Paul to prove the principle, and they have rejected it. They do not believe the words of Paul, nor do they believe that what he said is a gospel principle, nor do they believe that that principle applies to our day. I have explained that the church leadership operate on "lines and precepts and here-a-littles," in which the Lord gives them more and more information over time, but Silver and the others have rejected it. So, when I quote Bruce R. McConkie to prove that the leadership never has all the information, but give knowledge to the saints as they themselves learn it, they will reject it:
We have read these passages and their associated passages for many years. We have seen what the words say and have said to ourselves, “Yes, it says that, but we must read out of it the taking of the gospel and the blessings of the temple to the Negro people, because they are denied certain things.” There are statements in our literature by the early Brethren which we have interpreted to mean that the Negroes would not receive the priesthood in mortality. I have said the same things, and people write me letters and say, “You said such and such, and how is it now that we do such and such?” And all I can say to that is that it is time disbelieving people repented and got in line and believed in a living, modern prophet. Forget everything that I have said, or what President Brigham Young or President George Q. Cannon or whomsoever has said in days past that is contrary to the present revelation. We spoke with a limited understanding and without the light and knowledge that now has come into the world.

We get our truth and our light line upon line and precept upon precept. We have now had added a new flood of intelligence and light on this particular subject, and it erases all the darkness and all the views and all the thoughts of the past. They don’t matter any more. (All Are Alike unto God by Bruce R. McConkie, Aug. 18, 1978.)
So, I come forth and use my gift of the word of knowledge to teach something none of you have ever heard of before, namely that the brethren will announce the start of the end times from the pulpit, and you, Durzan, find it interesting, for your mind is still open to being enlightened, but the others such as Silver have dark minds, and cannot accept it, so they fight against it. They don't find this teaching interesting, at all. They find it heretical, and yet it patently isn't heretical.

What is the gift of the word of knowledge for?
And again, verily I say unto you, to some is given, by the Spirit of God, the word of wisdom. To another is given the word of knowledge, that all may be taught to be wise and to have knowledge. (D&C 46:17-18)
But Silver and the rest cannot be taught, for they don't understand that the gift of the word of knowledge brings forth new knowledge. It doesn't regurgitate the same old teachings over and over again. But that's what they want. They want regurgitation. They can't handle new stuff, because dark minds are stupid minds. (Remember, I speak plainly.) It's impossible to get new ideas into dark minds. Unless they repent of their sin of unbelief, that is.

Now, concerning this thread that you find "incredibly interesting," remove my words from it, Durzan. Remove the OP and all my follow up posts. Is the thread still "incredibly interesting" to you? Are Silver's words "incredibly interesting" to you? Would you classify the words of the others who have mocked me on this post as "incredibly interesting?" Or, is it only my words that are "incredibly interesting?" And if so, if it's not the thread, per se, that is "incredibly interesting," but the words of one particular poster on the thread, namely me, that is "incredibly interesting," then why is that? Why do my words stand out from the words of the others? Is it not because they are words of knowledge which proceed from the gift of the word of knowledge?

See, I agree with you Durzan. I think the premise of the OP is "incredibly interesting." Not because I wrote it, but because it comes of the Spirit, of the gift of the word of knowledge. I don't care who has this gift, or any of the other gifts. If you have the gift of the word of knowledge, your words are incredibly interesting to me, and I want to learn from you. But if you don't have that gift, and cannot enlighten my mind with the things of God, then your words are of no interest to me. Now, I have this gift, and whatever comes of it I find interesting. And when I share these interesting tidbits of knowledge that come of this gift with others, I expect others to be interested, too. Why? Because everything that comes of God is interesting and excellent and enlightening, and I fully expect saints who profess to follow Christ to be just as interested in learning more about the things of God, as I am.

So, when I come across a fake saint like Silver (and yes, Silver is a fake saint, a pretend saint), claiming to be "traditional" and mainstream and yet opposing what comes of the gift of the word of knowledge, outright, without pondering or praying about it, just attacking it from the get-go, my gift of the discerning of spirits lights up (for I have all the gifts) and indicates that I've come across a fake saint, who instead of having the Holy Spirit, is acting under direction of the evil one. Just as Silver reacted to me (because this is what happens with those who operate under the spirit of the devil when they come across me), even so I react to anyone possessed of the devil's spirit. Hence this little back and forth clash.

But that's all in the past. I'm done with Hi-Oh silvery-tongued Silver. You and the others can interact with him if you like.
We'll see.

Finrock
captain of 1,000
Posts: 4426

Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by Finrock »

Silver wrote: December 14th, 2017, 4:03 pm
Durzan wrote: December 14th, 2017, 1:52 pm
Silver wrote: December 14th, 2017, 9:39 am
Durzan wrote: December 14th, 2017, 8:53 am LDSAnarchist, you and others have often brought interesting things to the table. You have said many things that have enlightened my mind and gotten me to think, and these thoughts have also led to some moments of communication by the spirit; however, you have also said things that have caused my spirit to shy away.

Your words are as dull two-edged sword; You speak with an enlightened spiritual tongue, but at the same time, the words with which you speak run with a subtle corruption. A corruption that you may or may not realize exists. Your words are even as the writings in the Apocrypha, valuable to those with the Spirit of Discernment, but able to sway those who don't have such gifts onto unseen paths where the Devil can snare them. Note that my words may very well be the same.

Your words and power can unintentionally harm others as much as it helps. Be careful about what you say, as well as what you don't say. Bridle your words, actions, and abilities if you have them, for they are as much a blessing as they are a curse. Also, I do sense a degree of pride and arrogance coming from you. Bridle that as well, lest it lead you unto forbidden paths yourself. True followers of Christ seeks to be humble regardless of the gifts they posses, lest he or she be compelled to be humble by the Lord.

Silver and those of you who are "attacking" LDSA, you are all staunch defenders of the traditional gospel, I can sense that. Your rebukes to LDSAnarchist come out of your sense of christ-like love for him, I am sure... but nevertheless you have crossed from a plain and simple rebuke of love into contentious territory, and I would also gently ask you to bridle your tongue.Lets keep things alive in this thread without the corruption of the spirit of contention. If I see it again, I may not be so gentle with my words.

Now, with that out of the way back on topic: this thread is incredibly interesting.
Durzan, unfortunately a red line has been crossed. LDSA asserted that the Brethren don't understand the scriptures. That falsehood needed to be struck down. Let's liken the scriptures unto ourselves. LDSA is clearly following in the footsteps of Sherem by denigrating the General Authorities. In the 7th chapter of his eponymously named book, we see how Jacob dealt with the deceiver, especially after giving Sherem a few opportunities to recant his heresy.
He has asserted many things, including that the Brethren have an incomplete and flawed understanding of the scriptures... which is a viewpoint that while I do not necessarily agree with, I can understand.

The definition of the word Heresy is as follows: Heresy-- n. belief or opinion contrary to orthodox religious (especially Christian) doctrine.

By definition, any of us who has a opinion contrary to orthodox mormon beliefs, no matter how slight, would be considered a Heretic. Using the term against one of our own brethren regardless of the fact that he may or may not be a wayward traveler is hypocritical at best, and un-christlike at worst... especially in modern society, where we are supposed to be above such things.

On a spiritual note, our understanding of the Scriptures is dependent on the light which the Lord shines through us, and as Alaris aptly pointed out earlier in the thread, the scriptures teach many things, through different interpretations of the same passages. It is entirely possible that LDSA's viewpoint is indeed legitimate to some degree or another. For instance, President Monson may have a greater understanding and a different perspective of the subject of Missionary Work, than say, Elder Oaks, while Elder Bednar may have greater light and knowledge in other areas. Why is it so hard to believe that one not of the Bretheren could potentially have such knowledge concerning the second coming?

Perhaps... just perhaps LDSAnarchy has a greater understanding of certain second coming prophecies than most people in the church. But no man on earth has a complete understanding of anything, as we are all flawed men, subject to seeing through a mirror darkly, and clouded by our own judgement as well.

LDSA may have some of the pieces of the puzzle, as do I, Alaris, and many others, but we do not have the full picture, nor could we even come close to putting all the pieces together. We all have our flaws, just as you have yours. Don't point out the mote in our eyes, while ignoring the beam in your own eye.
We'll agree to disagree on that one because not only did he disrespect the Brethren, he held himself up as having greater enlightenment. A pox on that kind of thinking.
A pox on thinking that someone might be more enlightened than the "Brethren"? The only way that I can understand this type of reaction is within the context of holding the leaders up on a pedestal or because of veneration towards the leaders. I have no problems supporting them, praying for them, sustaining them, and allowing them to lead the church how they feel it should be lead, but I recognize with eyes wide open that they aren't "demigods" or "extra" special, superior to other mortals, or somehow above mortal failings, frailties, and sin. Because you have a title and a position in the church does not by this virtue alone indicate that you are now "more" enlightened than the rest of us or that you are now always operating under the direction of the Holy Ghost or that nobody on this planet can have more knowledge of the truth, understanding of the gospel, or more access to the Spirit and spiritual gifts.

Getting defensive and antagonistic towards a person who says that the "Brethren" may not understand all things or against a person who thinks they understanding something better than the "Brethren" indicates insecurity in belief and insecurity in one's faith.

-Finrock

Silver
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5247

Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by Silver »

Finrock wrote: December 15th, 2017, 9:45 am
Silver wrote: December 14th, 2017, 4:03 pm
Durzan wrote: December 14th, 2017, 1:52 pm
Silver wrote: December 14th, 2017, 9:39 am

Durzan, unfortunately a red line has been crossed. LDSA asserted that the Brethren don't understand the scriptures. That falsehood needed to be struck down. Let's liken the scriptures unto ourselves. LDSA is clearly following in the footsteps of Sherem by denigrating the General Authorities. In the 7th chapter of his eponymously named book, we see how Jacob dealt with the deceiver, especially after giving Sherem a few opportunities to recant his heresy.
He has asserted many things, including that the Brethren have an incomplete and flawed understanding of the scriptures... which is a viewpoint that while I do not necessarily agree with, I can understand.

The definition of the word Heresy is as follows: Heresy-- n. belief or opinion contrary to orthodox religious (especially Christian) doctrine.

By definition, any of us who has a opinion contrary to orthodox mormon beliefs, no matter how slight, would be considered a Heretic. Using the term against one of our own brethren regardless of the fact that he may or may not be a wayward traveler is hypocritical at best, and un-christlike at worst... especially in modern society, where we are supposed to be above such things.

On a spiritual note, our understanding of the Scriptures is dependent on the light which the Lord shines through us, and as Alaris aptly pointed out earlier in the thread, the scriptures teach many things, through different interpretations of the same passages. It is entirely possible that LDSA's viewpoint is indeed legitimate to some degree or another. For instance, President Monson may have a greater understanding and a different perspective of the subject of Missionary Work, than say, Elder Oaks, while Elder Bednar may have greater light and knowledge in other areas. Why is it so hard to believe that one not of the Bretheren could potentially have such knowledge concerning the second coming?

Perhaps... just perhaps LDSAnarchy has a greater understanding of certain second coming prophecies than most people in the church. But no man on earth has a complete understanding of anything, as we are all flawed men, subject to seeing through a mirror darkly, and clouded by our own judgement as well.

LDSA may have some of the pieces of the puzzle, as do I, Alaris, and many others, but we do not have the full picture, nor could we even come close to putting all the pieces together. We all have our flaws, just as you have yours. Don't point out the mote in our eyes, while ignoring the beam in your own eye.
We'll agree to disagree on that one because not only did he disrespect the Brethren, he held himself up as having greater enlightenment. A pox on that kind of thinking.
A pox on thinking that someone might be more enlightened than the "Brethren"? The only way that I can understand this type of reaction is within the context of holding the leaders up on a pedestal or because of veneration towards the leaders. I have no problems supporting them, praying for them, sustaining them, and allowing them to lead the church how they feel it should be lead, but I recognize with eyes wide open that they aren't "demigods" or "extra" special, superior to other mortals, or somehow above mortal failings, frailties, and sin. Because you have a title and a position in the church does not by this virtue alone indicate that you are now "more" enlightened than the rest of us or that you are now always operating under the direction of the Holy Ghost or that nobody on this planet can have more knowledge of the truth, understanding of the gospel, or more access to the Spirit and spiritual gifts.

Getting defensive and antagonistic towards a person who says that the "Brethren" may not understand all things or against a person who thinks they understanding something better than the "Brethren" indicates insecurity in belief and insecurity in one's faith.

-Finrock
Stop making stuff up. I never got defensive. I attacked, which is the opposite of defense. LDSA claimed the Brethren do not understand the scriptures, at least not as well as he does. That's nonsense and if you don't think talk like that is a sandy foundation then have fun with LDSA's version of heresy.

I just laugh when you guys make me your punching bag. You now have a choice. Will you ignore me or fight some more?

Finrock
captain of 1,000
Posts: 4426

Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by Finrock »

Silver wrote: December 15th, 2017, 9:53 am
Finrock wrote: December 15th, 2017, 9:45 am
Silver wrote: December 14th, 2017, 4:03 pm
Durzan wrote: December 14th, 2017, 1:52 pm

He has asserted many things, including that the Brethren have an incomplete and flawed understanding of the scriptures... which is a viewpoint that while I do not necessarily agree with, I can understand.

The definition of the word Heresy is as follows: Heresy-- n. belief or opinion contrary to orthodox religious (especially Christian) doctrine.

By definition, any of us who has a opinion contrary to orthodox mormon beliefs, no matter how slight, would be considered a Heretic. Using the term against one of our own brethren regardless of the fact that he may or may not be a wayward traveler is hypocritical at best, and un-christlike at worst... especially in modern society, where we are supposed to be above such things.

On a spiritual note, our understanding of the Scriptures is dependent on the light which the Lord shines through us, and as Alaris aptly pointed out earlier in the thread, the scriptures teach many things, through different interpretations of the same passages. It is entirely possible that LDSA's viewpoint is indeed legitimate to some degree or another. For instance, President Monson may have a greater understanding and a different perspective of the subject of Missionary Work, than say, Elder Oaks, while Elder Bednar may have greater light and knowledge in other areas. Why is it so hard to believe that one not of the Bretheren could potentially have such knowledge concerning the second coming?

Perhaps... just perhaps LDSAnarchy has a greater understanding of certain second coming prophecies than most people in the church. But no man on earth has a complete understanding of anything, as we are all flawed men, subject to seeing through a mirror darkly, and clouded by our own judgement as well.

LDSA may have some of the pieces of the puzzle, as do I, Alaris, and many others, but we do not have the full picture, nor could we even come close to putting all the pieces together. We all have our flaws, just as you have yours. Don't point out the mote in our eyes, while ignoring the beam in your own eye.
We'll agree to disagree on that one because not only did he disrespect the Brethren, he held himself up as having greater enlightenment. A pox on that kind of thinking.
A pox on thinking that someone might be more enlightened than the "Brethren"? The only way that I can understand this type of reaction is within the context of holding the leaders up on a pedestal or because of veneration towards the leaders. I have no problems supporting them, praying for them, sustaining them, and allowing them to lead the church how they feel it should be lead, but I recognize with eyes wide open that they aren't "demigods" or "extra" special, superior to other mortals, or somehow above mortal failings, frailties, and sin. Because you have a title and a position in the church does not by this virtue alone indicate that you are now "more" enlightened than the rest of us or that you are now always operating under the direction of the Holy Ghost or that nobody on this planet can have more knowledge of the truth, understanding of the gospel, or more access to the Spirit and spiritual gifts.

Getting defensive and antagonistic towards a person who says that the "Brethren" may not understand all things or against a person who thinks they understanding something better than the "Brethren" indicates insecurity in belief and insecurity in one's faith.

-Finrock
Stop making stuff up. I never got defensive. I attacked, which is the opposite of defense. LDSA claimed the Brethren do not understand the scriptures, at least not as well as he does. That's nonsense and if you don't think talk like that is a sandy foundation then have fun with LDSA's version of heresy.

I just laugh when you guys make me your punching bag. You now have a choice. Will you ignore me or fight some more?
A person who is insecure in their beliefs and in their faith have a hard time processing information that contradicts their faith, their belief, or their egocentric views. They might feel like a human punching bag. A human punching bag feels attacked. Feeling attacked, a person gets defensive, hoping to stop the perceived attack. Feeling defensive because they feel attacked, its quite common to go on the attack themselves.

You have done the attacking here, Silver. But get this: My post wasn't for you. I fully expect you to reject anything that I say that contradicts your perspective and paradigm.

-Finrock

Silver
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5247

Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by Silver »

Finrock wrote: December 15th, 2017, 10:00 am
Silver wrote: December 15th, 2017, 9:53 am
Finrock wrote: December 15th, 2017, 9:45 am
Silver wrote: December 14th, 2017, 4:03 pm

We'll agree to disagree on that one because not only did he disrespect the Brethren, he held himself up as having greater enlightenment. A pox on that kind of thinking.
A pox on thinking that someone might be more enlightened than the "Brethren"? The only way that I can understand this type of reaction is within the context of holding the leaders up on a pedestal or because of veneration towards the leaders. I have no problems supporting them, praying for them, sustaining them, and allowing them to lead the church how they feel it should be lead, but I recognize with eyes wide open that they aren't "demigods" or "extra" special, superior to other mortals, or somehow above mortal failings, frailties, and sin. Because you have a title and a position in the church does not by this virtue alone indicate that you are now "more" enlightened than the rest of us or that you are now always operating under the direction of the Holy Ghost or that nobody on this planet can have more knowledge of the truth, understanding of the gospel, or more access to the Spirit and spiritual gifts.

Getting defensive and antagonistic towards a person who says that the "Brethren" may not understand all things or against a person who thinks they understanding something better than the "Brethren" indicates insecurity in belief and insecurity in one's faith.

-Finrock
Stop making stuff up. I never got defensive. I attacked, which is the opposite of defense. LDSA claimed the Brethren do not understand the scriptures, at least not as well as he does. That's nonsense and if you don't think talk like that is a sandy foundation then have fun with LDSA's version of heresy.

I just laugh when you guys make me your punching bag. You now have a choice. Will you ignore me or fight some more?
A person who is insecure in their beliefs and in their faith have a hard time processing information that contradicts their faith, their belief, or their egocentric views. They might feel like a human punching bag. A human punching bag feels attacked. Feeling attacked, a person gets defensive, hoping to stop the perceived attack. Feeling defensive because they feel attacked, its quite common to go on the attack themselves.

You have done the attacking here, Silver. But get this: My post wasn't for you. I fully expect you to reject anything that I say that contradicts your perspective and paradigm.

-Finrock
You're not very good at misrepresenting the facts. Your mistake is readily seen. Anyone can return to the first page of this thread and see where I attacked. Being at leisure, I spent a few moments on this obscure website and told another anonymous participant that he is wrong. Because he is. So your psychobabble is wrong just like his doctrinal exposition is wrong.

gardener4life
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1690

Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by gardener4life »

LDS Anarchist wrote: December 11th, 2017, 4:40 pm
LdsMarco wrote: December 11th, 2017, 3:45 pm President Kimball's 2 cents


I never read that book, but I actually got a manifestation of the Holy Ghost about President Kimball, concerning one of his sermons, so I know that he was a servant of the Lord. Nevertheless, the Holy Ghost never gave him the correct understanding and interpretation of that parable.

Now, I think I gave the correct interpretation of the parable of the ten virgins somewhere on this forum. Or, maybe it was a private message I sent to someone. At any rate, the parable doesn't have a terrestrial meaning, but a celestial one. The virgins are comets being captured and so on. (I'm not going to give the interpretation again.) But let's liken it to people on earth, anyway. The virgins went forth to meet the Bridegroom on the evening of he was supposed to come. How did they know the day he was going to come? Their leaders told them. But then they waited and waited and the Bridegroom delayed a bit, so they went asleep, all of them, all ten of them. But then they were woken up by a cry:
And at midnight there was a cry made,
Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
(Matthew 25:6)
Who was making that cry? Again, it was their leaders. So, now they knew the hour of the coming.
Sometimes we should focus only on the basics of faith and repentance. Here is one case. We can miss things. We usually don't miss things when we're keeping it simple but when we're trying too hard to stretch into unknown areas. I thought I should revisit this to help people, and to correct a few things.

D&C Section 49;
6 And they have done unto the Son of Man even as they listed; and he has taken his power on the right hand of his glory, and now reigneth in the heavens, and will reign till he descends on the earth to put all enemies under his feet, which time is nigh at hand—
7 I, the Lord God, have spoken it; but the hour and the day no man knoweth, neither the angels in heaven, nor shall they know until he comes.
8 Wherefore, I will that all men shall repent, for all are under sin, except those which I have reserved unto myself, holy men that ye know not of.

Also JST-Matthew

37 And whoso treasureth up my word, shall not be deceived, for the Son of Man shall come, and he shall send his angels before him with the great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together the remainder of his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
38 Now learn a parable of the fig tree—When its branches are yet tender, and it begins to put forth leaves, you know that summer is nigh at hand;
39 So likewise, mine elect, when they shall see all these things, they shall know that he is near, even at the doors;
40 But of that day, and hour, no one knoweth; no, not the angels of God in heaven, but my Father only.

This is all really good stuff. I sometimes see new things here that I hadn't picked up before even though I've seen this many times. (It says ...send his angels before him....they shall gather the elect ...from one end of heaven to the other. (This explains the outcry of others before the bridegroom. "The bridegroom cometh go ye out to meet him", and it also explains the Apostles and prophets going before him also crying out the same. But it clearly states in at least two places, "But of that day, and hour, no one knoweth; no, not even the angels of God in heaven...my father only.

I had an interesting insight on this recently on why the rest of us don't really need to know everything. If you picture a household. Let's say you picture a father, a mother, and several children. Some of the children are pure, sweet, and innocent. Some of them are cruel and vicious. The Father knows he has to punish the ones that are cruel to save the ones that are pure and innocent. What does he do? He first realizes, if I punish the bad children in front of the good children then they will cry. And they won't understand what's going on because they are young children. Even older children if they see someone being punished their first instinct is to get confused about why so and so is being punished.

That's partly why I think some of the winding up scenes we need to know why they have to happen. But we don't need to know all the nitty gritty details about how the Earth will be cleaned of the wicked as part of his coming. Most people probably won't ever see the full details of the Flood either, because not a lot of people can handle those sorts of things, even when we think we can. We want to keep on giving people second chances even when they don't deserve them (when they will continue having many victims).

Even though we don't know the time and won't. Every time I come back to these scriptures I can feel the Spirit very strongly telling me to get ready now. Don't wait. That time is very short. I won't know the time. That's OK with me. But I can feel the urgency in the Spirit to not wait, and a burning feeling inside encouraging me. We should escalate our faith because there's so little time left.

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abijah
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Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by abijah »

The brethren are competent in their appointed jurisdiction. Whenever I hear them or meet them, I always get the same impression that they are good men, sincerely endeavouring to do the will of God. But it’s important to remember that their calling is maintaining spiritual Zion, gathering the elect into the fold and preparing the saints for the second advent of Christ. The endtime has a great deal to do with the establishment of physical Zion, and the restoration of the political kingdom of God. The brethren don’t have jurisdiction over that, it’s not their place save they should be commanded to do so. And they haven’t been.

Anyone who puts these men down, deems them incompetent or presumes to be higher than them is presumptuous and arrogant. Likewise anyone who perceives them as infallible, or that they are the ultimate authority of what is or isn’t true is also foolish.

Concerning the endtime, I don’t see why there should be a need for any sort of official proclamation. It will be marked by the return of the political kingdom of God as well as the restoration of the birthright priesthood with its attendant miracles, visions and prophecies enjoyed primarily by those prophets in the scriptures who were of literal Israel.

neldon
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Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by neldon »

Most of the end times have already been announched>>FROM the time of Enoch to Joseph Smith jr. to Pres Monson.

neldon
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Re: The end times will be officially announced by the leadership

Post by neldon »

to identify the true servant or messinger is to identify the tokens and signs that he will reveal. The scriptures contain those tokens and signs. they are revealed to those that have the proper spirit. President Monson has shown his tokens and signs to all those that want to accept them.

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