Joseph Smith/Civil War

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BeNotDeceived
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Re: Joseph Smith/Civil War

Post by BeNotDeceived »

pjbrownie wrote: February 25th, 2011, 10:10 am This one has yet to be verified by me, but here it is again:

Second Great Rebellion or Chicago Quote – A. Milton Musser papers, LDS Church Archives.

This was a letter from Nephi Packard to A. Milton Musser on July 24, 1896:

“… My brother, Noah Packard, says that he heard the Prophet Joseph say that the next great (U.S. civil) war after the war of the rebellion (the Civil War of the 1860′s between the North and the South) would commence in a little town now called Chicago but at that time it would have grown to be a very large city. And another brother told me that the Prophet said that the cause of the next great trouble of the United States would be the depreciation of the currency of the United States. I believe I have given you all the facts in as short and concise manner as possible.”

Another quote regarding the Civil War itself comes from an interview by Dr. Poulson with David Whitmer, printed in the Deseret News on Friday, August 16, 1878:

Question: When will the temple be built in Independence?

Answer: Right after the great tribulation is over

Question: What do you mean by that?

Answer: A civil war more bloody and cruel than the rebellion. It will be the smashing up of this nation, about which time the second great work has to be done, a work like Joseph did, and the translation of the sealed plates and peace all over.
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Stevieb
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Re: Joseph Smith/Civil War

Post by Stevieb »

Oldemandalton wrote: October 6th, 2011, 9:04 am This 'prophecy' has been dubbed the 'White Horse Prophecy " and has been discredited by the Church. There have been other apostles and prophets who have mentioned civil strife and chaos in the latter days that makes the Civil War look like a picnic. No need to use dubious 'prophecies'. If you would like quotes I can post them latter. They're on my home computer.
OMD
I would like the list of quotes.
Last edited by Stevieb on January 16th, 2018, 10:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

Silver
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Re: Joseph Smith/Civil War

Post by Silver »

Stevieb wrote: January 15th, 2018, 9:33 pm
Oldemandalton wrote: October 6th, 2011, 9:04 am This 'prophecy' has been dubbed the 'White Horse Prophecy " and has been discredited by the Church. There have been other apostles and prophets who have mentioned civil strife and chaos in the latter days that makes the Civil War look like a picnic. No need to use dubious 'prophecies'. If you would like quotes I can post them latter. They're on my home computer.
OMD
I would like the list of quotes. Can you email me? Wil11046@byui.edu
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gardener4life
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Re: Joseph Smith/Civil War

Post by gardener4life »

OK, so ...there are a couple of reasons why you have to be careful interpreting this too broadly. It could mean a world war instead of a civil war. It may look initially like a civil war and resemble one and even be tagged by one. And it's true that we've been involved in every world war and that there will be further wars. It can represent war filling the Earth slowly over time (like WW1, WW2, and WW3 with short breaks between them only to buy time to build up warms again as suggested by one of the prophets already; George Albert Smith I think? said this) or a single very identifiable war. It can possibly mean the start of the third world war, which if you watch the news you can tell that we're going to be the start of which matches this. We're the 'boss of the world'. So whatever happens to us will kick off events in other countries; that matches the wording of this now. So if the boss of the world has a civil war, very soon every else that has had their military built up...like they are doing now will have no one holding them in check.

We can see the scriptures being fulfilled before our very eyes. Things are happening.

The Section that is the source for this is D&C Section 87

Also the consumption of nations scriptures show that we're not necessarily saving the country but saving the beliefs and spiritual idea of the Constitution for use in the Millenium. The ideas of the Constitution will live on in the Millenium (D&C 109 suggests this) but the gross worldliness of our current nation won't live on (in part because we cast out the poor and rob the future of the poor to feed the mighty man and the rich). That's why the quote of we'll save the Constitution can be misleading. But a lot of good can be done by believing that and trying to preserve it as long as we can until His Coming. And it's true that a lot of good is being done by the revival going on in our country to try to make things better and get back to a foundation of God. Who knows? If people even tried hard enough they might even be able to bring prayer back in public schools. (Why didn't people fight back against that? That makes no sense.)

There is a consumption decreed and end to all nations as part of before the Savior comes back and that 'every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus is the Christ'. (How can you accomplish that if the Gentiles remain as Gentile Nations instead of becoming aware of an better more enduring stable eternal identity, and remain in their blindness and ignorance, worshiping ourselves, our idols, and our own government and celebrities, and our machines & craftiness? Someday that will change. And you can see those changes happening.)

I would point out something you've seen in other quotes; The children of Israel separating from Egypt is a parable of the Gathering of Israel. Without realizing it you've heard this from other sources, but worded slightly different but having this meaning. IF the Gentile Nations and Babylon state were to remain then wouldn't the Israelites have stayed in Egypt? They could not while retaining an eternal spiritual identity. And at some point Egypt decided to commit harm, and put Israel in bondage. Parable of the Wheat And Tares, and Parable of the 10 Virgins mesh with this concept to reveal what will happen in the Last Days, some time after the gospel fills the whole world, or filled as much as is in our power to do so in being accountable to the Savior.

Doctrine and Covenants 87:6

6 And thus, with the sword and by bloodshed the inhabitants of the earth shall mourn; and with famine, and plague, and earthquake, and the thunder of heaven, and the fierce and vivid lightning also, shall the inhabitants of the earth be made to feel the wrath, and indignation, and chastening hand of an Almighty God, until the consumption decreed hath made a full fend of all nations;

Isaiah 10:22 (2 Nephi 20)

22 For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness.

I would point out something else. Why do these things have to happen? The story of Moses leading the children of Israel out of Egypt reveals part of this and fits with verse 7.

D&C 87 verse 7 That the cry of the saints, and of the blood of the saints, shall cease to come up into the ears of the Lord of Sabaoth, from the earth, to be avenged of their enemies.

Both in the story of Moses and in the last days this consumption decreed and many of the tribulations, plagues, and so on will occur to save the innocents of God, and the righteous from the hands of the wicked. We hear some of the things happening in the scriptures and wonder why they have to happen. But if we listen we can see it's the mercy and love of God that he will hear the cries of his faithful and those that love him, against the hands of those that would try to destroy them.

Consider the disciples in Jesus' day. Sometimes he'd say something and then they'd say... "Lord what meaneth...x x x and x." Then he'd have to explain it many times. And they'd usually have leaned on an understanding of the temporal world too much in their interpretations of scriptures. That's OK they were trying. I still respect them. But you can see how limited their view is and how limited our view is. We can easily miss the meanings because we just don't have the infinite wisdom that Christ had.

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Re: Joseph Smith/Civil War

Post by Reylani »

Aaronjs0005 wrote: December 18th, 2016, 12:02 am How can you guys be sure this means civil war? It sounds more like a war of words between 2 parties and then world war breaks out and we are obviously the main target.
It is 2021. The republicans and democrats are seething with hate and distrust. The enemies of the Unites States have preparec for war for decades. The riots at the capitol yesterday, i believe, have begun the 7 years tribulation. We are entering a warring period. Be prepared. I believe we will fall to civil war, then outer war, then be descended upon by other enemies. We will have to flee for our lives. The republicans won't stand for oppression and the democrats will oppress. War is here. I will not partake of the bloodshed until it is righteous, which it is not yet.

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BeNotDeceived
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Re: Joseph Smith/Civil War

Post by BeNotDeceived »

Reylani wrote: January 7th, 2021, 11:40 am
Aaronjs0005 wrote: December 18th, 2016, 12:02 am How can you guys be sure this means civil war? It sounds more like a war of words between 2 parties and then world war breaks out and we are obviously the main target.
It is 2021. The republicans and democrats are seething with hate and distrust. The enemies of the Unites States have preparec for war for decades. The riots at the capitol yesterday, i believe, have begun the 7 years tribulation. We are entering a warring period. Be prepared. I believe we will fall to civil war, then outer war, then be descended upon by other enemies. We will have to flee for our lives. The republicans won't stand for oppression and the democrats will oppress. War is here. I will not partake of the bloodshed until it is righteous, which it is not yet.
Hey Reylani,

It’s good to see you.

Lani may mean heaven, or maybe not?

Anyways, what are you meaning by “outer” war?

Sorry for two questions, right off the bat, and welcome aboard.

Bronco73idi
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Re: Joseph Smith/Civil War

Post by Bronco73idi »

BeNotDeceived wrote: January 7th, 2021, 1:55 pm
Reylani wrote: January 7th, 2021, 11:40 am
Aaronjs0005 wrote: December 18th, 2016, 12:02 am How can you guys be sure this means civil war? It sounds more like a war of words between 2 parties and then world war breaks out and we are obviously the main target.
It is 2021. The republicans and democrats are seething with hate and distrust. The enemies of the Unites States have preparec for war for decades. The riots at the capitol yesterday, i believe, have begun the 7 years tribulation. We are entering a warring period. Be prepared. I believe we will fall to civil war, then outer war, then be descended upon by other enemies. We will have to flee for our lives. The republicans won't stand for oppression and the democrats will oppress. War is here. I will not partake of the bloodshed until it is righteous, which it is not yet.
Hey Reylani,

It’s good to see you.

Lani may mean heaven, or maybe not?

Anyways, what are you meaning by “outer” war?

Sorry for two questions, right off the bat, and welcome aboard.
I think outer war definition is the war that will be fought by a foreign invader.

Reylani is tying the civil war and the invasion from China together. Joseph Smith prophesied about both wars. I personally think the sixth seal earthquake will happen between the 2.

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