Conspiracy folks... I finally understand

[lundbaek]

I know very well in who's interest the FED acts. My concern is that now, even after so much discussion about this on this LDSFF so few others seem to get the picture.

[gclayjr]

lundback,

Maybe this is a conspiracy, but I see you posted something here at 4:42 pm, but when I enter this thread I see nothing. I will be glad to respond to what you say if I can see it.

Regards,

George Clay

[skmo]

Conspiracy theorists serve the same purpose that those blood and guts movies from driver's ed classes long ago did: they show the worst that can happen if you're not being careful. Not everyone is going to get in an automobile accident that cuts off their head so it can roll away from their car to be picked up later by the responders, but it has happened.

If it's used by people to practice common sense when driving, great. Unfortunately, all too often it seems more like it's making some people decide cars are too dangerous, walking around in a protective lexan bubble is the only way to safely go anywhere, and convince people to spend their time trying to invent a Star Trek transporter.

[gclayjr]

skmo,

I can't see my last post or ludbacks last post. I don;t know if it is my browser or this site. However I can see yours

Conspiracy theorists serve the same purpose that those blood and guts movies from driver's ed classes long ago did: they show the worst that can happen if you're not being careful. Not everyone is going to get in an automobile accident that cuts off their head so it can roll away from their car to be picked up later by the responders, but it has happened.

If it's used by people to practice common sense when driving, great. Unfortunately, all too often it seems more like it's making some people decide cars are too dangerous, walking around in a protective lexan bubble is the only way to safely go anywhere, and convince people to spend their time trying to invent a Star Trek transporter.

This is an interesting analogy. However I have 1 question. If the purpose of those blood and guts movies from drivers ed is to convince you to change how you drive, then what ACTION are the conspiracy theorists trying to get us to take? (And just being prepared for bad times or currency inflation or whatever doesn't count because you don't need a grand conspiracy to know that these things are likely to happen and you need to prepare).

Regards,

George Clay

[larsenb]

lundbaek,

OK, then in who's interest does the FED act and how ?

I notice that none of you guys has the guts and truly stand up and say what you mean. You prefer to hide behind silly obscure questions somehow hoping that your grand conspiracy wil be proven,

So I do have the courage to speak clearly and I am the one that actually can understand that everything is not black and white. . . . . . . . . . . . .

George Clay

A prime example why it is so 'enjoyable' to talk to George. Not.

But how nice to learn of George's courage, how he speaks clearly, and how he "understands that everything is not black and white", yet start his post with black-and-white accusations.

[Original_Intent]

George you do like to rattle on about things you know next to nothing about.

Of course not all conspiracies are true. But some of the things that you mock simply show you ignorance.

You are making the same logical error that atheists make about God. On the one hand, you have found one bad piece of evidence (the Protocols) and based on your finding that they were a sham, you declare your (false) knowledge that you have now proven or know that the entire banking, globalist conspiracy is a sham. It's equivalent to finding one false God and declaring therefore God doesn't exist.

Secondly, you can prove that a piece of evidence is bad. That doesn't disprove that he thing that the bad evidence was cl;aiming isn't true, it simply means that piece of evidence doesn't prove it. I suspect you are smart enough that you know this, but just like to troll people. If you are serious, then please discount "Proofs of a Conspiracy" and/or "Tragedy and Hope". If you can do that, that would certainly go a long way towards undermining my own views on "The Grand Conspiracy." But I know that you aren''t up to any serious study, and prefer to point the finger of scorn at those who are serious about understanding the world around them - with good, evidence.

[harakim]

lundbaek,

OK, then in who's interest does the FED act and how ?

I notice that none of you guys has the guts and truly stand up and say what you mean. You prefer to hide behind silly obscure questions somehow hoping that your grand conspiracy wil(sic) be proven,

So I do have the courage to speak clearly and I am the one that actually can understand that everything is not black and white.

The FED acts in the interest of the American Economy.

harakim,

The conspiracy is that the Federal Reserve doesn't act in the best interests of America. If you want to attach jewish bankers, etc. to it then that's probably why you can't see it for what it is.

If that was all anybody had to say about it, I would not disagree, nor start this thread.

Regards,

George Clay

Which is it George? The Fed acts in the best interest of America or not? Please elaborate.

[skmo]

This is an interesting analogy. However I have 1 question. If the purpose of those blood and guts movies from drivers ed is to convince you to change how you drive, then what ACTION are the conspiracy theorists trying to get us to take?

That's a very good question, and I'm glad you asked it.

The purpose of the Driver's Ed movies was to remind us to drive responsibly. The purpose of conspiracy theorists is to, ... um, ...

Well, it's so that, uh, so we can... no - wait - it's so that we don't...

Crap.

You got me. I guess that's where my analogy falls through.

Seriously, it's important to remember that some very terrible things can happen right under our noses. Look at between the wars Germany. The German people by and large weren't bad people. However, through complacency and groupthink they allowed something terrible to happen.

We're seeing that with many of today's millennials. Delicate little blossoms who can't change a light bulb (I kid you not - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL_IbUrLxyk ) or hear an opposing idea or concept are in large numbers believing that socialism/communism is the best way to live because schools and universities have all but killed off conservative faculty members. I can laugh at what a ridiculous fool Trudeau is, as well as the Canuckistanis who elected him, but things in our dying country are following along, not all that far behind.

[lundbaek]

I grab onto every opportunity I can find to make folks, even total strangers, aware of that conspiracy to, as a real live Prophet said nearly 30 years ago, overthrow the freedom of all lands, nations, and countries, the one that Moroni warned we should not let get above us, (but which has gotten pretty well above us). In my own words, I describe it as a conspiracy of certain people to gain control of the world's human, financial/economic, natural, and industrial resources.

[gclayjr]

harakim,

I find it hard to believe that this is an honest question.

The FED acts in the interest of the American Economy.

Which is it George? The Fed acts in the best interest of America or not? Please elaborate.

so why did slice off the first sentence of the quote and then ask the question that was clearly answered in the sentences that follow:

The FED acts in the interest of the American Economy. Now as to who determines what is in that interest,there are many. They are mostly professionals who believe that they know better than the common man what is best, and many both act in a way that benefits them personally and listen to people who also claim to be experts who may be giving advice that more further their own agenda than the American peoples (whatever that might be).

So obviously you ask different people you will get different answers. Also, as I mentioned there are certainly people who put their own interests first and scheme and manipulate to obtain that interest.

And of course you dodge the real point here that I am making by ignoring my main point that I have stated over and over

yes there are people conspiring to do many things including manipulating the FED for their own gain but ...

They don't fit into your nice categories. They are not all named Rothschild,. I'm sure there are many more named Smith or Jones. They are not all Jews. I'm sure there are many more who are WASPS. They are not all Masons, or Illuminati, whatever that means.

I understand that pigeonholing them into these categories allows you to sit in your basement and feel that you are wiser, or more enlightened that the sheeple who haven't been enlightened to these evil conspiratorial groups, and you don't even have to really think, You can just regurgitate your well worn conspiracies, and feel superior to everybody else.

Unfortunately, this stuff is not just intellectually lazy and wrong, it can be dangerous and evil. I'm sure most of you plan no actual actions in regards to your favorite conspiracies other than to sit in your basement and write screeds on the Internet blaming the world's problems on them. However, as ridiculous as it may seem, you may actually convince somebody of the truth of your hateful screeds. They may decide to injure or kill somebody, because they are a Jewish Banker, they have a Masonic symbol on their car or belong to one of the other secret world destroying organizations you blame.

I'm sure, that since nobody would be truly innocent if their name was Rothschild, or they were a Mason, or a member of the Council on Foreign Relations or something else, it wouldn't be all bad if someone actually took them out.

This is why when I actually read at least part of the Protocols of the elders of Zion, and saw that it was much more than just accusing Jews of using the blood of Christian babies in unleavened bread, but that the actual text was so close to the things your source documents say about Jewish Bankers, I realized that this was not just a harmless way to waste your time on the Internet, but it is evil and can have bad consequences,

Regards,

George Clay

[Original_Intent]

They don't fit into your nice categories. They are not all named Rothschild,. I'm sure there are many more named Smith or Jones. They are not all Jews. I'm sure there are many more who are WASPS. They are not all Masons, or Illuminati, whatever that means.

That's a straw man if there ever was one. I don't know anyone on these boards that would make a single one of those claims, let alone all of them.

[lundbaek]

Here are events in my lifetime in which I perceive conspiracies

Conspiracy to get the U.S.A. into WW2
Tyler Kent discovery

Pearl Harbor betrayal and cover-up
Ralph Briggs affidavit Re. awareness and warning on 4 Dec. 1941
Commander Arthur McCollom's Suggestions to FDR to provoke the Japanese to war

Atom Bomb technology given to USSR
Major Jordan's Diaries

Betrayal of Nationalist China
General Marshall's part in the betrayal

Conduct of the Korean War
General MacArthur's grievances

Bay of Pigs betrayal

Conduct of the Vietnam War

OKC Bombing

911

Effort to create the North American Union

Illegal Immigration and Refugee Crisis

Resistance to an audit of the FED

Effort to remove President Trump from office

[gclayjr]

lundbeck,

Here are events in my lifetime in which I perceive conspiracies

Conspiracy to get the U.S.A. into WW2
Tyler Kent discovery

Pearl Harbor betrayal and cover-up
Ralph Briggs affidavit Re. awareness and warning on 4 Dec. 1941
Commander Arthur McCollom's Suggestions to FDR to provoke the Japanese to war

Atom Bomb technology given to USSR
Major Jordan's Diaries

Betrayal of Nationalist China
General Marshall's part in the betrayal

Conduct of the Korean War
General MacArthur's grievances

Bay of Pigs betrayal

Conduct of the Vietnam War

OKC Bombing

911

Effort to create the North American Union

Illegal Immigration and Refugee Crisis

Resistance to an audit of the FED

Effort to remove President Trump from office

With the exception of 9-11 and maybe some of the details regard Pearl Harbor (There was a conspiracy to get Japan to attack the US instead of the Soviet Union, but there was no prior knowledge about Pearl Harbor specifically), I agree with most of what you said.

If this is truly what you believe, then you should be on my side. All of this caterwauling out there among conspiracy folks about Multi-generations of Jewish Bankers, the Illuminati, Masons, Knights Templars, Secret college fraternities etc as cabals of conspirators who have been secretly manipulating the world throughout the ages discredits and distracts from the real people who have conspired to do real things, who may be named Smith or Jones, be WASPS, and not bankers or fit into any other of convenient categories.

What I discovered as I was studying about the life of Raoul Wallenburg, and what happened to Hungarian Jews in the final months of WW2, that most of the Jesw killed in Hungary were not killed by German Nazis, they were killed by Hungarian youth (Arrow Cross) who as they saw their country falling apart, had be condition to believe that the Jews were responsible for it, from propaganda including The Protocols of the Elders of Zion. When I read (at least part) of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, I discovered an amazing similarity between them and what I have seen posted on the Internet to blame the above group of people for the conspiracies that are leaing us into the abyss.

Therefor I figured out that this BS is not only bad because it distracts from looking at what is really happening, but when things get really bad it could inspire people to go after innocent people that fall into the above classes, just like in the Holocaust in Europe in the 1930s and 40s

Regards,

George Clay

[David13]

lundbeck,

Here are events in my lifetime in which I perceive conspiracies

Conspiracy to get the U.S.A. into WW2
Tyler Kent discovery

Pearl Harbor betrayal and cover-up
Ralph Briggs affidavit Re. awareness and warning on 4 Dec. 1941
Commander Arthur McCollom's Suggestions to FDR to provoke the Japanese to war

Atom Bomb technology given to USSR
Major Jordan's Diaries

Betrayal of Nationalist China
General Marshall's part in the betrayal

Conduct of the Korean War
General MacArthur's grievances

Bay of Pigs betrayal

Conduct of the Vietnam War

OKC Bombing

911

Effort to create the North American Union

Illegal Immigration and Refugee Crisis

Resistance to an audit of the FED

Effort to remove President Trump from office

With the exception of 9-11 and maybe some of the details regard Pearl Harbor (There was a conspiracy to get Japan to attack the US instead of the Soviet Union, but there was no prior knowledge about Pearl Harbor specifically), I agree with most of what you said.

If this is truly what you believe, then you should be on my side. All of this caterwauling out there among conspiracy folks about Multi-generations of Jewish Bankers, the Illuminati, Masons, Knights Templars, Secret college fraternities etc as cabals of conspirators who have been secretly manipulating the world throughout the ages discredits and distracts from the real people who have conspired to do real things, who may be named Smith or Jones, be WASPS, and not bankers or fit into any other of convenient categories.

What I discovered as I was studying about the life of Raoul Wallenburg, and what happened to Hungarian Jews in the final months of WW2, that most of the Jesw killed in Hungary were not killed by German Nazis, they were killed by Hungarian youth (Arrow Cross) who as they saw their country falling apart, had be condition to believe that the Jews were responsible for it, from propaganda including The Protocols of the Elders of Zion. When I read (at least part) of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, I discovered an amazing similarity between them and what I have seen posted on the Internet to blame the above group of people for the conspiracies that are leaing us into the abyss.

Therefor I figured out that this BS is not only bad because it distracts from looking at what is really happening, but when things get really bad it could inspire people to go after innocent people that fall into the above classes, just like in the Holocaust in Europe in the 1930s and 40s

Regards,

George Clay

George
You have identified your own problem.

You assume that if Lundbaek, myself and others on this forum believe in the conspiracies listed by Lundbaek, or more than that, or less than that, that we all believe in the Protocol of the Elders of Zion.

I don't believe that any of us do.

But with your black and white thinking you lump us all together. To you, to believe in one conspiracy fact is to believe in them all. That just isn't so.

We all pick and choose what we believe and which ones we follow, AND the degree to which we follow.

But I think we all believe like Ezra Taft Benson, that it is not conspiracy theory, it is conspiracy fact.
dc

[gclayjr]

David13,

You have identified your own problem.

You assume that if Lundbaek, myself and others on this forum believe in the conspiracies listed by Lundbaek, or more than that, or less than that, that we all believe in the Protocol of the Elders of Zion.

I don't believe that any of us do.

I have not identified you. You kind of self identified yourselves when you jump against me for railing after those who do fall into this category. As I said before, if you truly believe as Lunbaek, claims to believe specifically above, you should be agreeing with me that those who foment the mindless stuff, I have identified as distracting people from considering from more thoughtful conspiracy theories, are dangerous.

You guys are the one who claim that I am the black and white person who groups everybody together, while jumping to the defense of these ridiculous, destructive ideas.

I think if you look closely, you are the black and white people who lump all conspiracies together as wonderful, and I am the only one trying to separate the wheat form the chaff.

Regards,

George Clay

[David13]

David13,

You have identified your own problem.

You assume that if Lundbaek, myself and others on this forum believe in the conspiracies listed by Lundbaek, or more than that, or less than that, that we all believe in the Protocol of the Elders of Zion.

I don't believe that any of us do.

I have not identified you. You kind of self identified yourselves when you jump against me for railing after those who do fall into this category. As I said before, if you truly believe as Lunbaek, claims to believe specifically above, you should be agreeing with me that those who foment the mindless stuff, I have identified as distracting people from considering from more thoughtful conspiracy theories, are dangerous.

You guys are the one who claim that I am the black and white person who groups everybody together, while jumping to the defense of these ridiculous, destructive ideas.

I think if you look closely, you are the black and white people who lump all conspiracies together as wonderful, and I am the only one trying to separate the wheat form the chaff.

Regards,

George Clay

No George, I believe I have seen you go against ALL conspiracies, and just the concept of conspiracies in general. That's quite a popular endeavor in the general society today by those who remain unaware that government, and others could ever do anything wrong.

There are many such people who would think that any one of Lundbaek's listed conspiracies are "sheer lunacy" and worth of severe mocking and ridicule. That is also the way you have come off in the past.

And it seems to be the blatant theme of your "all you conspiracy nuts believe in the Protocol of the Elders of Zion" nonsense you have posted here.
dc

[gclayjr]

David13,

No George, I believe I have seen you go against ALL conspiracies, and just the concept of conspiracies in general. That's quite a popular endeavor in the general society today by those who remain unaware that government, and others could ever do anything wrong.

I find it difficult to even follow your logic. If I had a nickel, for every time I noted that my problem with the wild outrageous conspiracy theories that conspiracy folks promote is that they discredit real conspiracies, I could have a New York Strip Steak Dinner at the best restaurant in town. No matter how many times I say it, you guys come back with some statement that I oppose all conspiracies. I'm sure if I say it 1000 more times you will continue to make the same assertion as if your continued assertions make it true.

Now interestingly, I am the most open and honest person who says it like it is... clearly. Now you guys are the ones who dissemble and hide what you truly mean. Let's look at what is said on this thread

larsenb says

Ah George. Forever attracted to the simple, facile answer and/or exposition. Why even worry about such things? Just ignore them. That would be even more in keeping with your general approach to this topic.

of course you chime in with

George, there you go again.
There are conspiracy theorists who do not hate Jews. Believe it or not.
And they may believe in some conspiracies, but not others. Believe it or not.
And they may believe in some conspiracies, but not in any Jewish Banker conspiracy. But you continue to fail to understand that.
Like larsenb posts, you just like your simple, one size fits all answers.
Isn't there some tv on or something that you would enjoy?
dc

so believing this to be a valid misunderstanding I respond with

I do agree that not all conspiracy folks agree with every conspiracy, but you guys stick together enough that it is hard to tell. I don't see you rebuking such things as :

you respond with

Not only do I not subscribe to the 4 threads you linked to, I had never even seen them. I will say one mentions the Islamatization of London. That is clearly happening. Now, I only read the titles of the 4 links, not any of the content. So I don't know if the one about London turning into a Moslim city has any other things in it, but clearly, with a Moslim mayor, they are going Islam in a big and fast way.
But as to the 4 titles of the links. No. I do not subscribe.

Now it seems that maybe, possibly you are distancing yourself from the Idea of a grand Global conspiracy by Jewish Bankers, Illuminati, Masons etc, but you don't actually say it ... so what is one to conclude?

lundbaek wrote: ↑
Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:51 pm
I agree that "We should also think twice about how we choose to treat those whom the Lord has brought here, by His own hand (and, really, as the result of our own greed.)" Lehi prophesied that "there shall none come into this land save they shall be brought by he hand of the Lord." That's clear enough. Now consider carefully that many have come to America who have contributed greatly to its deterioration: for example: the Rothschild agents who financed both sides of the American Civil War, Paul Warburg, Leon Trotsky, Victor Perlo, Bella Dodd (who did repent in her later years), Henry Kissinger, and others whose names elude me at the moment, but who infiltrated into government, education, finance, and communication. (See PROPHETS, PRINCIPLES, AND NATIONAL SURVIVAL by Jerreld Newquist, Pages 222 & 316)

Then he said

Here are events in my lifetime in which I perceive conspiracies

Interesting he makes no comment as to WHO is behind those conspiracies, but I give him the benefit of the doubt.

With the exception of 9-11 and maybe some of the details regard Pearl Harbor (There was a conspiracy to get Japan to attack the US instead of the Soviet Union, but there was no prior knowledge about Pearl Harbor specifically), I agree with most of what you said.

If this is truly what you believe, then you should be on my side. All of this caterwauling out there among conspiracy folks about Multi-generations of Jewish Bankers, the Illuminati, Masons, Knights Templars, Secret college fraternities etc as cabals of conspirators who have been secretly manipulating the world throughout the ages discredits and distracts from the real people who have conspired to do real things, who may be named Smith or Jones, be WASPS, and not bankers or fit into any other of convenient categories.

and you come back with

You assume that if Lundbaek, myself and others on this forum believe in the conspiracies listed by Lundbaek, or more than that, or less than that, that we all believe in the Protocol of the Elders of Zion.

I don't believe that any of us do.

So it looks like I am the only one who consistently and clearly states what I mean, and you guys consistently accuse me of saying what I don't say, and write about your own beliefs in a way to make implications that you can conveniently deny.

I will stand by my clear honest statements and will infer the obvious about your own deliberate, repeated misrepresentation of what I say combined with with your own dissembling, allowing you to deny obvious implications and come to the obvious conclusions about what you all believe and how willing you are to stand by it.

Regards,

George Clay

[David13]

David13,

No George, I believe I have seen you go against ALL conspiracies, and just the concept of conspiracies in general. That's quite a popular endeavor in the general society today by those who remain unaware that government, and others could ever do anything wrong.

I find it difficult to even follow your logic. If I had a nickel, for every time I noted that my problem with the wild outrageous conspiracy theories that conspiracy folks promote is that they discredit real conspiracies, I could have a New York Strip Steak Dinner at the best restaurant in town. No matter how many times I say it, you guys come back with some statement that I oppose all conspiracies. I'm sure if I say it 1000 more times you will continue to make the same assertion as if your continued assertions make it true.

Now interestingly, I am the most open and honest person who says it like it is... clearly. Now you guys are the ones who dissemble and hide what you truly mean. Let's look at what is said on this thread

larsenb says

Ah George. Forever attracted to the simple, facile answer and/or exposition. Why even worry about such things? Just ignore them. That would be even more in keeping with your general approach to this topic.

of course you chime in with

George, there you go again.
There are conspiracy theorists who do not hate Jews. Believe it or not.
And they may believe in some conspiracies, but not others. Believe it or not.
And they may believe in some conspiracies, but not in any Jewish Banker conspiracy. But you continue to fail to understand that.
Like larsenb posts, you just like your simple, one size fits all answers.
Isn't there some tv on or something that you would enjoy?
dc

so believing this to be a valid misunderstanding I respond with

I do agree that not all conspiracy folks agree with every conspiracy, but you guys stick together enough that it is hard to tell. I don't see you rebuking such things as :

you respond with

Not only do I not subscribe to the 4 threads you linked to, I had never even seen them. I will say one mentions the Islamatization of London. That is clearly happening. Now, I only read the titles of the 4 links, not any of the content. So I don't know if the one about London turning into a Moslim city has any other things in it, but clearly, with a Moslim mayor, they are going Islam in a big and fast way.
But as to the 4 titles of the links. No. I do not subscribe.

Now it seems that maybe, possibly you are distancing yourself from the Idea of a grand Global conspiracy by Jewish Bankers, Illuminati, Masons etc, but you don't actually say it ... so what is one to conclude?

lundbaek wrote: ↑
Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:51 pm
I agree that "We should also think twice about how we choose to treat those whom the Lord has brought here, by His own hand (and, really, as the result of our own greed.)" Lehi prophesied that "there shall none come into this land save they shall be brought by he hand of the Lord." That's clear enough. Now consider carefully that many have come to America who have contributed greatly to its deterioration: for example: the Rothschild agents who financed both sides of the American Civil War, Paul Warburg, Leon Trotsky, Victor Perlo, Bella Dodd (who did repent in her later years), Henry Kissinger, and others whose names elude me at the moment, but who infiltrated into government, education, finance, and communication. (See PROPHETS, PRINCIPLES, AND NATIONAL SURVIVAL by Jerreld Newquist, Pages 222 & 316)

Then he said

Here are events in my lifetime in which I perceive conspiracies

Interesting he makes no comment as to WHO is behind those conspiracies, but I give him the benefit of the doubt.

With the exception of 9-11 and maybe some of the details regard Pearl Harbor (There was a conspiracy to get Japan to attack the US instead of the Soviet Union, but there was no prior knowledge about Pearl Harbor specifically), I agree with most of what you said.

If this is truly what you believe, then you should be on my side. All of this caterwauling out there among conspiracy folks about Multi-generations of Jewish Bankers, the Illuminati, Masons, Knights Templars, Secret college fraternities etc as cabals of conspirators who have been secretly manipulating the world throughout the ages discredits and distracts from the real people who have conspired to do real things, who may be named Smith or Jones, be WASPS, and not bankers or fit into any other of convenient categories.

and you come back with

You assume that if Lundbaek, myself and others on this forum believe in the conspiracies listed by Lundbaek, or more than that, or less than that, that we all believe in the Protocol of the Elders of Zion.

I don't believe that any of us do.

So it looks like I am the only one who consistently and clearly states what I mean, and you guys consistently accuse me of saying what I don't say, and write in a way to allow implications that you can conveniently deny.

I will stand by my clear honest statements and will infer the obvious about your own deliberate, repeated misrepresentation of what I say combined with with your own dissembling, allowing you to deny obvious implications and come to the obvious conclusions about what you all believe and how willing you are to stand by it.

Regards,

George Clay

Of course you can't follow the logic. Because you don't go by logic.
I can only guess that it's emotions you go by.
But not logic.
dc

[gclayjr]

Daviid13,

Of course you can't follow the logic. Because you don't go by logic.
I can only guess that it's emotions you go by.
But not logic.
dc

Ha ha that is funny. you should tell that to my wife, friends and associates. They always accuse me of being too logical and not having emotions.

Regards,

George Clay

[Hogmeister]

<-- the FABIAN WINDOW says more than a million words


Ignorant fools mock (Ether 12:26)...

Ether 8:24 Wherefore, the Lord commandeth you, when ye shall see these things come among you that ye shall awake to a sense of your awful situation, because of this secret combination which shall be among you; or wo be unto it, because of the blood of them who have been slain; for they cry from the dust for vengeance upon it, and also upon those who built it up.

25 For it cometh to pass that whoso buildeth it up seeketh to overthrow the freedom of ALL lands, nations, and countries; and it bringeth to pass the destruction of all people, for it is built up by the devil, who is the father of all lies; even that same liar who beguiled our first parents, yea, even that same liar who hath caused man to commit murder from the beginning; who hath hardened the hearts of men that they have murdered the prophets, and stoned them, and cast them out from the beginning.

26 Wherefore, I, Moroni, AM COMMANDED to write these things that evil may be done away, and that the time may come that Satan may have no power upon the hearts of the children of men, but that they may be persuaded to do good continually, that they may come unto the fountain of all righteousness and be saved.

Ether 12:23 And I said unto him: Lord, the Gentiles will mock at these things, because of our weakness in writing;

Ether 12:26 And when I had said this, the Lord spake unto me, saying: Fools mock, but they shall mourn; and my grace is sufficient for the meek, that they shall take no advantage of your weakness;



In addition to the Protocols (leaked 1903) also read/listen to:

None Dare Call it Conspiracy, by Gary Allen, 1971 (Recommended book study to all members of the church by Ezra Taft Benson in general conference april 1972 and never rescinded)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJNMcD2IY_k

The 1976 Harold Wallace Rosenthal interview
http://www.antichristconspiracy.com/HTM ... w_1976.htm

Benjamin Freedman (warning from a Jew) 1961 speech at the Willard Hotel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhFRGDyX48c

"Red Symphony" by Dr. J. Landowsky (The leaked minutes of the 1938 interrogation of a Trotskyist)
https://archive.org/stream/RedSymphony/ ... y_djvu.txt

Another great study for understanding modern history and economics is the book "Keynes at Harvard" by Zygmund Dobbs, 1969
http://keynesatharvard.org/book/index.html


PS. I am a banker (money changer).

PS2. Who conspired against Jesus?

PS3. I have never been anti-semite (this is foremost a propaganda label parroted by the ignorant and the conspiring to unwittingly or wittingly protect the conspiracy). Jews have, and will, suffer from the conspiracy more than most.

PS4. Apostle J. Reuben Clark apparently had the Protocols in his library.

PS5. Everything is connected.

Financial international
....<->
........Globalism
............<->
................Open Societies Foundations
................<->
................Fabian Socialism
............<->
........Socialism
....<->
Communist international

[gclayjr]

hogmeister,

In addition to the Protocols (leaked 1903) also read/listen to:

disgusting, proven fake!! Unbelievable the horrors and brutally vicious events perpetrated, that are justified by this faker y, which by the way was the purpose of it.

PS3. I have never been anti-semite (this is foremost a propaganda label parroted by the ignorant and the conspiring to protect the conspiracy).

Whitewash of anti-semitic conspiracy theorists the world over as if somehow making such a declaration immunes them from people recognizing the truth of this hatred.

None Dare Call it Conspiracy, by Gary Allen

Standard anti-Semitic conspiracy trick. As if somehow "None dare call it conspiracy" and the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" are equal. They are not.

Again, I would like to thank you for another of so many, posts proving the very essence of the point I have been making about conspiracy theorists, and the root of anti-Semitism that is underneath so much of the conspiracy stuff.

Now I know not all conspiracy folks are anti_Semitic. However, if you truly believe that your anti-conspiracy stuff is important, and true, why don't you stand up boldly, and reject this stuff instead of hiding behind pathetic vague claims that you don't believe ALL conspiracy literature and theories,

Again, I would think that you would want to boldly stand with me, rather than throw out pathetic attempts at insulting me as one who doesn't understand. But I guess that is the real attraction to conspiracy theories. They make you feel more superior and enlightened than the rest of us, without actually having to stand up and do anything.


Regards,

George Clay

[Hogmeister]

hogmeister,

In addition to the Protocols (leaked 1903) also read/listen to:

disgusting, proven fake!! Unbelievable the horrors and brutally vicious events perpetrated, that are justified by this faker y, which by the way was the purpose of it.

PS3. I have never been anti-semite (this is foremost a propaganda label parroted by the ignorant and the conspiring to protect the conspiracy).

Whitewash of anti-semitic conspiracy theorists the world over as if somehow making such a declaration immunes them from people recognizing the truth of this hatred.

None Dare Call it Conspiracy, by Gary Allen

Standard anti-Semitic conspiracy trick. As if somehow "None dare call it conspiracy" and the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" are equal. They are not.

Again, I would like to thank you for another of so many, posts proving the very essence of the point I have been making about conspiracy theorists, and the root of anti-Semitism that is underneath so much of the conspiracy stuff.

Now I know not all conspiracy folks are anti_Semitic. However, if you truly believe that your anti-conspiracy stuff is important, and true, why don't you stand up boldly, and reject this stuff instead of hiding behind pathetic vague claims that you don't believe ALL conspiracy literature and theories,

Again, I would think that you would want to boldly stand with me, rather than throw out pathetic attempts at insulting me as one who doesn't understand. But I guess that is the real attraction to conspiracy theories. They make you feel more superior and enlightened than the rest of us, without actually having to stand up and do anything.


Regards,

George Clay

You haven't provided a single reasoned and researched argument yet (Stefan Molyneux would throw a fit). Instead throwing labels and insults like a raving lunatic.

Sincerely,

Samuel Höglund

[Hogmeister]

Another great read for revealing the "illusion" of Keynesianism (modern economics) that you will never come across at university or business school:

"The Failure of the New Economics", Henry Hazlitt 1959
https://mises.org/sites/default/files/F ... mics_3.pdf

[Hogmeister]

hogmeister,

In addition to the Protocols (leaked 1903) also read/listen to:

disgusting, proven fake!! Unbelievable the horrors and brutally vicious events perpetrated, that are justified by this faker y, which by the way was the purpose of it.

So lets start by hearing the undeniable proof that will make the discussion of the actual contents entirely obsolete. I bet you have to do some actual research (not your own but still) first, but I am all ears.

By the way, I have read the "Dialogue aux enfers entre Machiavel et Montesquieu ou la politique de Machiavel au XIXe siècle" as part of my own research.

I have to admit it is rather astonishing the amount of books and articles that have been written the last 100 years in order to debunk the Protocols. What was the saying of Shakespeares Queen Gertrude...?

Don't come saying you don't believe in conspiracies. You believe in a conspiracy against the Jews. I believe in a conspiracy against ALL people, including Jews (Ether 8:25).

[gclayjr]

hogmeister

You haven't provided a single reasoned and researched argument yet. Instead throwing labels and insults like a raving lunatic.

I know that like so many anti-Semetic conspiracy theorists, you think that making an assertion makes it true. Of course like the rest of your disgusting remarks, it is completely unfounded.

What started this thread, was that I decided to start to read actually what was contained in the Protocols of the (Learned) Elders of Zion, rather than just go on what people said was in it. I did this because I recently read a biography on Raoul Wallenburg, in my opinion, the greatest hero of WW2, and perhaps of the 20th century. In this biography, it noted that Hitler, Eichmann and so many others used it as a basis for their justification for their "Final Solution" to the Jewish problem.

Nazi party ideologue Alfred Rosenberg introduced Hitler to the Protocols during the early 1920s, as Hitler was developing his worldview. Hitler referred to the Protocols in some of his early political speeches, and, throughout his career, he exploited the myth that "Jewish-Bolshevists" were conspiring to control the world.

https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.ph ... d=10007058

In the reading that I did, before becoming too disgusted to continue, I discovered that so much of the text of the Protocols, resemble the stuff promoted by you conspiracy theorists (see first posts). Hence the title of this thread. After posting the fact that I noticed such similarities between the Protocols, used by Hitler to justify killing Jews, and stuff promoted by conspiracy folks here, I expected many of you conspiracy folks to be equally disgusted, and to boldly distance themselves from this stuff. Instead I get from larsonb, an unreasoned argument limply accusing me, without taking any strong stand against this filth.

Ah George. Forever attracted to the simple, facile answer.

Then I got several other such weak attacks from other well known conspiracy folks here on this board, with no logic, and only vaguely distancing themselves by stating that they don't believe ALL conspiracy literature.

then azalea.rubicon starts a thread named "Jew/Israel the most wicked nation in the world?" and Sandman45 posts

I recommend watching the documentary “The Greatest Story Never Told”

A documentary using a play on Christian terminology to portray Adolf Hitler as the great hero of the world.

Again I point this out and try to get Conspiracy folks on the board to distance themselves from this hateful crap instead I get stuff like

What do you suppose was taught among the Lamanites for generations about the Nephites and their leaders, such as Mormon and his son Moroni? Do you think there could have possibly been any parallels of the views held today of leaders such as Adolf Hitler? Victors (re)write history. Please stop with the anti Semitic nonsense anytime Israel and it's supporters are called out for their crimes or exposed as frauds.

from Sirius

and

People forget that a day is coming when false Jews will be shown that they worship in the 'synagogue of Satan'.

from Kingdom of Zion

I challenge several vocal conspiracy folks on the board to distance themselves from this, and All I get back is either the sound of crickets in the night or vague attacks on me.

Today Islamic terrorists are embracing this fake document

As popular opposition to Israel spread across the Middle East in the years following its creation in 1948, many Arab governments funded new printings of the Protocols and taught them in their schools as historical fact. They have been accepted as such by many Islamist organizations, such as Hamas and Islamic Jihad. A 2005 report by the Intelligence and Terrorism Information Center found that Arabic editions issued in the Middle East were being sold as far away as London.[2] There are at least nine different Arabic translations of the Protocols and more editions than in any other language including German.[3] The Protocols also figure prominently in the antisemitic propaganda distributed internationally by the Arab countries and have spread to other Muslim countries, such as Pakistan, Malaysia, and Indonesia.[3]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contempor ... rs_of_Zion

So unfortunately, this is not just something that can be used to justify wild Jewish conspiracies by harmless conspiracy folks ranting on the Internet in their basement, but is actually an evil document used by many truly evil groups to promote terrorism, mayhem and death

Regards,

George Clay