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Michelle
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by Michelle »

duplicate
Last edited by Michelle on October 27th, 2017, 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Michelle
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by Michelle »

Is it a joke?

Some I would agree with:traditional family, stay at home mom. Most parts seem like hyperbole to start a fight/discussion?

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Jonesy
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

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I still have to think about this some more, but these are my off-the-cuff thoughts. I have more to say, but I’ll leave at this for now.

I showed my wife and asked what her initial response to this was. She said, “And this is different from what’s going on in this house how?” Cracked me up. I love my wife. We had a good discussion about it and one that I want to continue. I’m curious to find the complimentary spin on this for the husband.

But you know, the more I look into this, the more I’m in favor. My perspective is that it really puts the husband in a position to own up and take responsibility/accountability of his family’s temporal and spiritual salvation in all ways possible. I liked the tone on the website. It’s a breath of fresh air as opposed to the new generation feminism creeping in society, which is extremely repulsive and unattractive. No self-respecting man would marry one of them.

We have different views in certain areas, of course. I think I’m a very liberal husband to my wife, and I wouldn’t and don’t hold her to some of those high expectations. And I think that is the whole key to it all on the woman’s side. She gets to decide who to marry, and hopefully she’s blessed to find a righteous husband. I’m grateful to have had my wife pointed out to me by the Spirit. Anyways, if my wife did more fully meet these high expectations, I would reciprocate and compliment that action respectfully (or maybe just willingly regardless). She has always naturally inspired me to seek to be better. I think if a woman does put her husband’s desires above her own, I would make sure I would meet her desires. I don’t see that as counterproductive. Maybe it’s the natural way it is supposed to be.

I’ve told my wife before that I don’t think we’re a very compatible match, but I think we’re a very complimentary match. We each have complimentary talents that we use to everyone’s benefit. We fill roles we are each naturally good at, most being in conformity to conservative gender roles. She asked me about woman special forces, and I told her I think it’s a joke. I think it’s selfish to seek something that least benefits society and her God-given instinctive nature. I think it would be a disservice to herself and a wasteful endeavor. But then again, if the husband is good with that, then go for it.

One thing about my wife is that she is very intelligent. I do like to council with her and seek her opinion on things. But if I’m to take accountability for my family, it really presses me to seek God’s will and council; and of course she still retains her rights in her respective stewardship.

To be honest, those types of women can get whatever they want from their husbands; but because they sacrifice above themselves, they surely are goddesses in my eyes. My wife certainly is, and I desire to reciprocate.


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Jonesy
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

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For the women, how do you interpret these scriptures? Do the men have the final say in things?
Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.(Ephesians 5:22)

Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church. (1 Corinthians 14:34-35)
How do you think that applies here?
41 No power or influence can or ought to be maintained by virtue of the priesthood, only by persuasion, by long-suffering, by gentleness and meekness, and by love unfeigned;
42 By kindness, and pure knowledge, which shall greatly enlarge the soul without hypocrisy, and without guile--(D&C 121)

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Sarah
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

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Jonesy wrote: October 28th, 2017, 4:27 pm Anyways, if my wife did more fully meet these high expectations, I would reciprocate and compliment that action respectfully (or maybe just willingly regardless). She has always naturally inspired me to seek to be better. I think if a woman does put her husband’s desires above her own, I would make sure I would meet her desires. I don’t see that as counterproductive. Maybe it’s the natural way it is supposed to be.
Yup, that is how it is supposed to work. How else can a man learn to become like God and learn this principle, if a woman doesn't obey and take the role of follower.

"And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant"

"But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant."

"But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve."

"But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister."

Problem comes when men do not reciprocate, or are not liberal as you mentioned was your tendency, and have an attitude of entitlement for this kind of treatment. If they never learned to serve their mother for example, but were spoiled and took her for granted, they will treat their wives the same way.

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Yahtzee
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by Yahtzee »

This is interesting to read as I have a stronger personality than my husband, but we still follow a surprising amount of this. Definitely not all.
I take issue with some of it. I won't tell anyone how their marriage should work, but some of this is too far. We're gonna just assume that no woman who follows this is in an abusive relationship and it's just what they prefer.
Stepford Wives Organization believes that we should strive and spend all our free time to look pretty, since women at Stepford are meant to be seen, not heard. We keep silent and speak only when we are complimenting and admiring our husbands.
Vanity? This is not the Lord's way. The scriptures have choice words for women who care so much for their looks. Also, the scriptures urge women to be industrious with their free time. Nope. Can't agree with this at all.
Stepford Wives Organization believes that as women, we should regard and revere our husband's decisions as the final, penultimate authority in our lives. Our husbands are our fashion advisors: they decide what we wear. They are our food critics: they tell us what we cook well and what we should and should not cook. They are our political advisors: they decide how we should vote. They are our intellectual guides: they tell us what and how we should think.
My husband always asks me who we're voting for as he had neither the time nor inclination to research. Also, he married me for my ability to intellectually challenge him. This sounds like a really boring marriage. But I'm terrible at fashion, so yes, telling me what to wear works for us. I think we're an exception with that though.
Stepford Wives Organization believes our men are always right, and we gals are, as Pope Gregory I once said "slow in understanding and our unstable and naive minds render us by way of natural weakness to the necessity of a strong hand in our husbands. Her 'use' is two fold; [carnal] sex and motherhood."
I wasn't offended until I read this. How incredibly dehumanizing.

Fiannan
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by Fiannan »

Stepford Wives Organization believes our men are always right, and we gals are, as Pope Gregory I once said "slow in understanding and our unstable and naive minds render us by way of natural weakness to the necessity of a strong hand in our husbands. Her 'use' is two fold; [carnal] sex and motherhood."


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Joel
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

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Maybe it is just a way to practice their dominance and submission kinks just overlaid with religious overtones so they don't feel guilty about their kinks. Could be that these people have just conditioned their behavior and worldview to the degree where the reward circuit in their brains is engaged and it feels rewarding and good, like feeling the spirit.



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Jonesy
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

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Sarah wrote: October 30th, 2017, 10:06 pm
Jonesy wrote: October 28th, 2017, 4:27 pm Anyways, if my wife did more fully meet these high expectations, I would reciprocate and compliment that action respectfully (or maybe just willingly regardless). She has always naturally inspired me to seek to be better. I think if a woman does put her husband’s desires above her own, I would make sure I would meet her desires. I don’t see that as counterproductive. Maybe it’s the natural way it is supposed to be.
Yup, that is how it is supposed to work. How else can a man learn to become like God and learn this principle, if a woman doesn't obey and take the role of follower.

"And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant"

"But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant."

"But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve."

"But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister."

Problem comes when men do not reciprocate, or are not liberal as you mentioned was your tendency, and have an attitude of entitlement for this kind of treatment. If they never learned to serve their mother for example, but were spoiled and took her for granted, they will treat their wives the same way.
That’s a good point. What about obeying the husband just because it’s not only a commandment, but also a covenant for the wife? How far does she go to be submissive and obedient to the husband?

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Rensai
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by Rensai »

Women, know your limits:


Be like:



But seriously, that stepford wives stuff goes way too far, it looks like a big knee-jerk reaction to the rampant over the top feminism we have today. The answer to the extremes of feminism isn't to go extreme in the other direction.

God is both male and female, both are perfect, both are greatly intelligent and work together as a team. A woman fully embracing all points of that stepford wives guide would stunt her progression by failing to learn to think and act on her own.

The family, a proclamation to the world is much better guidance. In particular, my wife and I like this section:
By divine design, fathers are to preside over their families in love and righteousness and are responsible to provide the necessities of life and protection for their families. Mothers are primarily responsible for the nurture of their children. In these sacred responsibilities, fathers and mothers are obligated to help one another as equal partners.
We are a team, we are partners, however, if I, as the man, bear final responsibility to "provide the necessities of life and protection for their families" then in cases where we can't come to agreement, I have to have the final decision, otherwise, I can't be held responsible for that. Likewise, my wife has to have the final say on things regarding "the nurture of their children." If I had my way on everything, then she could not be held responsible for anything and I would be practicing unrighteous dominion. That would not be fair or right. Of course, we only resort to this method in rare cases of a disagreement we cannot resolve; in most cases, we strive to come to a consensus. By working, talking things out, and planning our lives together, we both think and grow and ensure we're making the best decisions we can for our family. I would hate to have a wife who refused to use her brain out of some misguided attempt to defer to me in all things.

One last comment. I don't trust those bible verses, those sound like they came from men, not God. The book of Mormon contains the fullness of the gospel and does not contain anything like that.

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passionflower
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

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LDS Anarchist wrote: November 3rd, 2017, 5:40 pm
Rensai wrote: November 1st, 2017, 4:01 pm One last comment. I don't trust those bible verses, those sound like they came from men, not God. The book of Mormon contains the fullness of the gospel and does not contain anything like that.
Each book of scripture is different, containing information that the other books do not possess. The Book of Mormon doesn't contain anything like what is found in the Doctrine and Covenants, either, but we still are to obey the Doctrine and Covenants.

The Joseph Smith Translation (JST) of those passages is nearly unchanged of how they read in the Bible. The JST states that "the Songs of Solomon are not inspired writings," but doesn't say that those epistles of Paul and Peter or those specific parts of their epistles are not inspired writings, but, in fact, treats them as inspired. In other words, there are a few, slight corrections to the passages made by Joseph Smith, such as changing "conversation" to "conduct." So, Joseph Smith obviously thought this stuff was inspired and holy writ, worthy to correct, unlike the Song of Solomon, which he just passed over, because it was of men. Also, no general authority from the time of Joseph Smith to now has ever stated that those passages came from men, but they have always been treated as the word of God. Given that all the latter-day saints are bound by their covenants to obey the canonized scriptures, at the last day, when we are brought before God to be judged of our works, those words will condemn us if we haven't conformed out lives to them.
I have finished reading the History of the Church as compiled by BH Roberts and, though I could not find it right now, I know there was a story in there where Joseph Smith backs up these verses up there that were written by Paul. At the same time he says that you will know a church is false if a woman is leading it, or if women are set over men who have to defer or be subservient to them.

I don't know if that will mean anything to Rensai, though.

When I worked in the temple we had a rule that no female temple ordinance worker could ever correct or criticize one of the male ordinance workers. It didn't matter how much the guy fouled up, we could NOT correct him. We could correct another female ordinance worker, and the brethren could correct female ordinance workers, but we could not correct the brethren. There is definately a higher order of things, and it was an order, going on in the temple than what goes on in the public church that is abroad in the world.

tribrac
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

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Joseph Smith backs up these verses up there that were written by Paul. At the same time he says that you will know a church is false if a woman is leading it, or if women are set over men who have to defer or be subservient to them.
So, uh Primary? The random and awkwardly out of place guy at Girls Camp. Cub Scouts.

Fiannan
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by Fiannan »

Well maybe your dream of the perfect mate can be a reality soon thanks to new implants just down the road:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... years.html

Convince your mate to go in and have one of these implants. Then slip the doctor some money and have them erase all his/her memories and replace them with new ones. Yes, your spouse will cease to exist as they were, but you will have a replacement similar to putting a new hard-drive in a computer.

Welcome to the future...or the ancient past.

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passionflower
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by passionflower »

tribrac wrote: November 8th, 2017, 4:54 pm
Joseph Smith backs up these verses up there that were written by Paul. At the same time he says that you will know a church is false if a woman is leading it, or if women are set over men who have to defer or be subservient to them.
So, uh Primary? The random and awkwardly out of place guy at Girls Camp. Cub Scouts.
Handbook 2.11:
"All ward and stake auxiliary organizations operate under the direction of the bishop or the President, who holds the keys to preside."

In other words, Primary is under the direction of the Priesthood. So is YW Girls Camp and Cub Scouting. An elder teaching Primary is still working under the Bishop and SP.

When I served as the ward music director and choir director. All choir numbers and other special musical numbers had to be preapproved by the bishop, and over the years there were a good number of Sundays where the Bishop changed the congregational hymns to something other than the ones I had chosen. This was his privilege and he was always the one in charge, not me.
Last edited by passionflower on November 18th, 2017, 1:47 pm, edited 4 times in total.

MMbelieve
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by MMbelieve »

The husband having the say on everything in the wives life...? Why? Why would any man want to do that? That's controlling and dominating. I think the person who said it's a twisted kinkyou thing to activate their reward system in their brain (or something like that) is on to something.

Women can often desire to be dominated by their husbands in the bedroom, but dominated outside the bedroom...on everything. How dumb. I do not desire to be a slave. Plus, this wouldn't work with my husband anyway. He would think it was dumb and would refuse to tell me what to think, eat, feel, dress like, clean like...he would look at me like I lost my mind if all of a sudden I needed him to tell me how to do my job.

What a great way to lose the respect of your husband. If I was a man and my wife asked for me to decide everything...I would view her as an idiot and a burden making me think for her.

Some aspects I like, like putting spouses needs above your own needs (within reason of course). Respecting and honoring our husbands and desiring to please them. After all don't us women want the exact same thing?

My opinion is that they have taken it way too far and put the responsibility of themselves and their roles onto their husbands and are essentially placing their agency in his hands which results in her or the wife not having to ever be responsible or accountable for anything. Way too far and I believe it is wrong and yet another twisted form of lifting the men yet not really, more like harming them.

Women need to do their job and be kind and respectful and let the men be responsible for themselves. Much like the modesty/lust discussions. Women take the responsibility upon themselves for the men's lust when it's in fact the men responsibility not the women for him to learn to control and manage his own thoughts.

I see this Uber submission as twisted form of respect that actually places the woman's responsibility onto the plate of the man. Men be weary, she will hold you 100% responsible in the end for EVERYTHING.

Juliet
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by Juliet »

Men, when you are truly like Jesus, your wives will want to serve you in the end. They may crucify you at first, but they will turn to respect you in the end. Remember all the scripture where Jesus compares the children of Israel to harlots? But He loves His adulteress wife through it all and He gets her heart in the end.

Really guys, please, please just love us no matter what. Please. Don't make us have to please you or earn your care and love and compassion. Love us for who we are where we are at whether we do or do not do things. You will end up the real treasure, a woman who loves you back and will be loyal to you for ever.

Have compassion on us and our emotions and our Hormones. Adam was given work to endure, but Eve was given pain. Please forgive us for our lack of works, but usually we fail to flourish because of pain and if you love us, we will start to love ourselves and then we will do what is right. So please, please, please just love us.

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Sarah
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by Sarah »

This conversation brings to mind some thoughts....
There is a woman in my family, and I don't know how to help her. Loving her is very hard. She has very low self-confidence, and this causes her to be judgemental, to gossip (not realizing what she is doing), and to assume that people want her to do or not do certain things. She cannot make decisions on her own. (Her husband made all the decisions while he was alive, partly because she didn't want to make any.) So she never has a mind of her own. There will be two bottles of salad dressing on the table and she'll never ask someone to pass one to her, she'll just announce to the entire table "pass the salad dressing," Finally someone will say, "which one do you want? "She replies with "It doesn't matter." She is afraid of making someone feel put out by her requests, and only does things to please others, but in a grudgingly sort of way. She holds resentments for little things from 50 years ago, when someone took advantage of her or got offended by something she did.

I recently talked to one of her friends who said that her husband was "in charge." She often couldn't get together with others in the ward because her husband expected her to always be there to cook for him. But after living with her a bit, I can see that it might have been that she assumed she had to please him at all costs. Her poor relationships particularly with the men in her life have gotten her to the point where she can feel no true love or appreciation. She is wrapped up in her own self and feelings of victim-hood. She has women friends and family members that talk to her often, but I've come to the conclusion that the only way she can be healed of these bad habits of thinking and acting is through repentance, humility and love from God and from men in her life. No amount of sisterly love is ever going to fill her bucket. But then again, no amount of manly love will either unless she willingly decides to appreciate it, which she has a hard time doing. But all the men in her life never truly accepted her. They all had high expectations which she felt she had to meet in order to earn their love, and she came to resent that.

What it all comes down to is our need on an individual level to developing humility, a true love for God and a desire to serve him (and not grudgingly, or with an expectation for his blessings in return.) No amount of service from our spouse can replace the love we need to feel from God our Father and the mercy we feel through our Savior.

Having an eternal perspective - that we each will ultimately attract others to us with no compulsion involved. Right now we make promises to remain loyal to spouses, but there will be a day of reckoning to assess how well we have kept our covenants. We wait for the Lord and his servants to be the judge, rather than choosing to break our own covenants. Our job is to help our spouse progress and to have children, and we do our best to love unconditionally. But unconditional love doesn't mean unconditional giving. The Lord loves us unconditionally, but he doesn't give unconditionally. We all need to come to understand this aspect of love.

MMbelieve
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by MMbelieve »

Sarah wrote: November 19th, 2017, 7:55 pm This conversation brings to mind some thoughts....
There is a woman in my family, and I don't know how to help her. Loving her is very hard. She has very low self-confidence, and this causes her to be judgemental, to gossip (not realizing what she is doing), and to assume that people want her to do or not do certain things. She cannot make decisions on her own. (Her husband made all the decisions while he was alive, partly because she didn't want to make any.) So she never has a mind of her own. There will be two bottles of salad dressing on the table and she'll never ask someone to pass one to her, she'll just announce to the entire table "pass the salad dressing," Finally someone will say, "which one do you want? "She replies with "It doesn't matter." She is afraid of making someone feel put out by her requests, and only does things to please others, but in a grudgingly sort of way. She holds resentments for little things from 50 years ago, when someone took advantage of her or got offended by something she did.

I recently talked to one of her friends who said that her husband was "in charge." She often couldn't get together with others in the ward because her husband expected her to always be there to cook for him. But after living with her a bit, I can see that it might have been that she assumed she had to please him at all costs. Her poor relationships particularly with the men in her life have gotten her to the point where she can feel no true love or appreciation. She is wrapped up in her own self and feelings of victim-hood. She has women friends and family members that talk to her often, but I've come to the conclusion that the only way she can be healed of these bad habits of thinking and acting is through repentance, humility and love from God and from men in her life. No amount of sisterly love is ever going to fill her bucket. But then again, no amount of manly love will either unless she willingly decides to appreciate it, which she has a hard time doing. But all the men in her life never truly accepted her. They all had high expectations which she felt she had to meet in order to earn their love, and she came to resent that.

What it all comes down to is our need on an individual level to developing humility, a true love for God and a desire to serve him (and not grudgingly, or with an expectation for his blessings in return.) No amount of service from our spouse can replace the love we need to feel from God our Father and the mercy we feel through our Savior.

Having an eternal perspective - that we each will ultimately attract others to us with no compulsion involved. Right now we make promises to remain loyal to spouses, but there will be a day of reckoning to assess how well we have kept our covenants. We wait for the Lord and his servants to be the judge, rather than choosing to break our own covenants. Our job is to help our spouse progress and to have children, and we do our best to love unconditionally. But unconditional love doesn't mean unconditional giving. The Lord loves us unconditionally, but he doesn't give unconditionally. We all need to come to understand this aspect of love.
Maybe she just needs a real friend that she can trust and have understand her. Many of the behaviors you stated, are a projection of her pain and desire to be helped and or listed to.
We cannot "fix" everyone...some people just like the idea of someone trying to help them.

Be careful not to assume that you know why she does things or what her problems are. Judging someone in pain is a death sentence because it's usually wrong and compassion less from those offering their "judgements".

We all need to be humble, she is no different than the rest of us are. Isolating her is not a good idea.

I'm not coming from the outside here, I too have a difficult person in my life that sounds much like the one you described. It is hard and painful at times to try to have a relationship with someone who is as you described.
I wouldn't ever call her to repentance or to be humble as that is not my place at all nor my judgement of the situation.
I happen to be at the receiving end of her issues (when I visit) in how she treats me and I refrain from calling her out because she is an old woman with enough probless already. I have given her the opportunity but she hurt me instead, my act of love and compassion is to have mercy on her instead of being rude back. I'm no one to be trampled upon as I stand up for myself, but I respect her due to her position in my life.
She has created a reality that allows her to keep chugging along in life. I express compassion and kindness and give compliments that she doesn't receive otherwise. It has softened her and brought tears to her eyes when I told her that it takes strength to be a peace maker instead of fighting (she has a difficult husband and she chose to make peace in her marriage at her own demise - to please him even if never appreciated), she has said a few times to me that she has never received such kindness or thoughtfulness or was taken back by a comment I gave...just acknowledging her and her struggles instead of her faults.

It's not easy for sure.

Just be different and do different. Show love even if there is no reason she deserves it except that she is a fellow sister or a daughter of God. We all experience pain and sorrow, we don't need another person to add to that...what we all need is a real true friend.

MMbelieve
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by MMbelieve »

Juliet wrote: November 19th, 2017, 6:52 pm Men, when you are truly like Jesus, your wives will want to serve you in the end. They may crucify you at first, but they will turn to respect you in the end. Remember all the scripture where Jesus compares the children of Israel to harlots? But He loves His adulteress wife through it all and He gets her heart in the end.

Really guys, please, please just love us no matter what. Please. Don't make us have to please you or earn your care and love and compassion. Love us for who we are where we are at whether we do or do not do things. You will end up the real treasure, a woman who loves you back and will be loyal to you for ever.

Have compassion on us and our emotions and our Hormones. Adam was given work to endure, but Eve was given pain. Please forgive us for our lack of works, but usually we fail to flourish because of pain and if you love us, we will start to love ourselves and then we will do what is right. So please, please, please just love us.
This is great. This is truly inspired - when God tells the husband to love his wife as Christ loved the church and gave his life for it, THIS is the key! It was stated and commanded for a reason. Because women need this to reach their potential.

What he says to the women is equally the key to understand and living with our husbands and benefiting them in the best way.

We do not know the value of these two phrases yet, but if both couples did this, miracles and deep love would happen.

moving2zion
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by moving2zion »

Let me get this straight. Women that chase the world will loose their husbands and real meaning to life. Women that chase their husbands find their life's meaning, and live longer and happier. What a concept.

MMbelieve
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by MMbelieve »

moving2zion wrote: November 19th, 2017, 10:44 pm Let me get this straight. Women that chase the world will loose their husbands and real meaning to life. Women that chase their husbands find their life's meaning, and live longer and happier. What a concept.
ANYONE who chases the world loses themselves and the meaning of life.

simonalia
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by simonalia »

That miracles and deep love would happen.

tdj
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Re: The Stepford Wives Organization

Post by tdj »

I'm new here so bear with me.

I don't think I could ever be a stepford wife. It's not that I wouldn't want too, but I just don't think I COULD. Putting that kind of power over you into a man's hands would have a tendency to corrupt him a bit. It would take a VERY special and unique person not to let that go to their head and use it to basically bully their wife.
Besides, the men I know wouldn't want it to that extreme. They want a wife with a bit of sand and character, and a REAL helpmate. A woman who doesn't contest when you are in the wrong and tell you you're wrong isn't much of a real helpmate. She can't be the iron that sharpens HIS iron by holding him accountable and helping him stay on track.
I'd be interested to know what the divorce rate is amongst that group.

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