Remarriage equals adultery?

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brianj
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Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by brianj »

I've read it several times, but it never really hit me before. 3 Ne 12:32 and Matt 5:32 state:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, that whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery; and whoso shall marry her who is divorced committeth adultery.


Is this something that has been clarified by modern prophets?

Although my (still) wife put me away and I have had multiple witnesses report adultery (which is fornication involving a married person) and the first part doesn't apply to me, I have come to know several women who became divorced because of a husband committing adultery or who was violently abusive, so the thought that one of these women could be accused of adultery really bothers me.

The second part is more applicable to me and also very disturbing. If I cause someone to sin, I obviously will be accountable. But why would it be adultery for me to marry someone and have a normal life with her?

I'm sure that my concern is nothing new, so I'm sure church leaders have spoken on this subject and I haven't found it yet. So if any of you have answers, I would really appreciate them.

gardener4life
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by gardener4life »

The way I had it explained to me. And I'm not an expert. I'm not married. No spouse.

So the way I had it explained to me is that if you go your separate ways both people need to be taken care of. You don't split up and have one person destitute living in the street and one person having the big house on the hill. This is I think what would make the Lord upset more than anything, especially if the person on the street is one of his followers. But a lot of divorces happen like this. One person is successful. They have a good job and go to work and make a lot. They have people flirting with them often. They hear from their friends they could have a better life if they didn't have to take care of that other person at home with health problems.

Then a divorce happens.

Within a few months they've found someone to hit it off with that not surprisingly matches the descriptions of what their friends have told them the real spouse should be like; big house, big car, and no health problems. The adultery doesn't always happen when they slept with someone but when they kept hearing all the loud voices at work that they should move on and get a spouse of the world. And so they chase that dream while drifting into the mists of darkness and find their way to the great and spacious building.

There are a lot of stories like this.

If you tried to work it out and got divorced and both people were taken care of and able to move on I think that's different from above. But if they can't move on...well that won't be good at the end of this life.

Michelle
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Michelle »

Doctrine and Covenants makes it clear that the righteous spouse can be given to another.
Doctrine and Covenants 132:41 And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man receiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy anointing, she hath committed adultery and shall be destroyed.

42 If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has committed adultery.

43 And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a vow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44 And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and give her unto him that hath not committed adultery but hath been faithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.

gardener4life
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by gardener4life »

Michelle wrote: January 7th, 2018, 6:39 pm Doctrine and Covenants makes it clear that the righteous spouse can be given to another.
Doctrine and Covenants 132:41 And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man receiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy anointing, she hath committed adultery and shall be destroyed.

42 If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has committed adultery.

43 And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a vow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44 And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and give her unto him that hath not committed adultery but hath been faithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.
That is true. And thanks for posting.

However, the trouble is that a righteous person shouldn't want to leave the other spouse in the gutter somewhere.

There might be situations of abuse, and other things that might cause it. But most the time it's pretty hard to end a family without a good reason.

Juliet
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Juliet »

When you are married you develop a spiritual circuit that needs to be reconfigured if you divorce and remarry.

Ideally, this would not need to happen. It is that closeness you had that makes divorce so painful.

I wouldn't worry about any stigma in your situation. I think the book of Mormon is referring to these spiritual circuits that take some work to unhook and reconfigure in a healthier relationship.

I think Jesus can take this and make it into something good.

brianj
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by brianj »

gardener4life wrote: January 7th, 2018, 6:48 pm
Michelle wrote: January 7th, 2018, 6:39 pm Doctrine and Covenants makes it clear that the righteous spouse can be given to another.
Doctrine and Covenants 132:41 And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man receiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy anointing, she hath committed adultery and shall be destroyed.

42 If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has committed adultery.

43 And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a vow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44 And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and give her unto him that hath not committed adultery but hath been faithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.
That is true. And thanks for posting.

However, the trouble is that a righteous person shouldn't want to leave the other spouse in the gutter somewhere.

There might be situations of abuse, and other things that might cause it. But most the time it's pretty hard to end a family without a good reason.
I'm the one who was thrown in the gutter, figuratively speaking. Through blessings I could never have imagined one year ago, I am thinking it's a real possibility that I can actually take a vacation sometime this year.

And i agree that a righteous person shouldn't want to leave their spouse, in the gutter or otherwise. But I knew for a long time that I didn't want to spend eternity with that woman, and I more recently recognized that if I was stuck with her I wouldn't be able to make it to the Celestial Kingdom.

I do know some people, who seem very righteous, who had to leave a spouse because that spouse became very unrighteous. I am thankful that I was not the one to file and, as painful as it was, I am thankful to have irrefutable evidence of covenants broken as that evidence has provided comforting confirmation that I didn't break my covenants.


Michelle, thank you for sharing that quote. Verse 44 provided a great deal of comfort to me.

gardener4life
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by gardener4life »

brianj wrote: January 7th, 2018, 7:43 pm
gardener4life wrote: January 7th, 2018, 6:48 pm
Michelle wrote: January 7th, 2018, 6:39 pm Doctrine and Covenants makes it clear that the righteous spouse can be given to another.
Doctrine and Covenants 132:41 And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man receiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy anointing, she hath committed adultery and shall be destroyed.

42 If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has committed adultery.

43 And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a vow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44 And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and give her unto him that hath not committed adultery but hath been faithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.
That is true. And thanks for posting.

However, the trouble is that a righteous person shouldn't want to leave the other spouse in the gutter somewhere.

There might be situations of abuse, and other things that might cause it. But most the time it's pretty hard to end a family without a good reason.
I'm the one who was thrown in the gutter, figuratively speaking. Through blessings I could never have imagined one year ago, I am thinking it's a real possibility that I can actually take a vacation sometime this year.

And i agree that a righteous person shouldn't want to leave their spouse, in the gutter or otherwise. But I knew for a long time that I didn't want to spend eternity with that woman, and I more recently recognized that if I was stuck with her I wouldn't be able to make it to the Celestial Kingdom.

I do know some people, who seem very righteous, who had to leave a spouse because that spouse became very unrighteous. I am thankful that I was not the one to file and, as painful as it was, I am thankful to have irrefutable evidence of covenants broken as that evidence has provided comforting confirmation that I didn't break my covenants.


Michelle, thank you for sharing that quote. Verse 44 provided a great deal of comfort to me.
Michelle's comment I thought I could support more too. What she said also ties in what the scriptures say would happen to King David's wives for what he did.

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shadow
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by shadow »

Note that President Hunter married a divorcee. He was an apostle at the time and was sealed to her.

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Sarah
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Sarah »

The most noble and righteous thing to do, at least theoretically in my mind, is to never break a sealing. That doesn't mean you can't live apart. And even with a civil divorce, I think that above scripture still applies. If a man divorces his wife for any other reason besides adultery I think he would be breaking his covenant and causing her to commit adultery.
A woman who needs to leave her husband over abuse or infidelity, or really any other reason, if she is noble, unselfish, and wanting to keep her covenants, she should feel it's appropriate to leave him and separate if that is what is desired, but not ask for a divorce or cancelation just so she can get another guy. It is better for her to sacrifice unless directed by the spirit otherwise, and wait until the final judgment, because there are potential blessings for both if the offending husband repents. But this makes it impossible for a righteous woman to be sealed again because of the rules, so she might end up not ever being able to marry again if she chooses this route, but I believe she will be rewarded if she does this. A man has a lot more freedom (and this would be in your case), in that you can be legally divorced, but also be free to look for another woman to be sealed to without canceling your sealing to your wife.

Michelle
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Michelle »

Sarah wrote: January 7th, 2018, 11:10 pm The most noble and righteous thing to do, at least theoretically in my mind, is to never break a sealing. That doesn't mean you can't live apart. And even with a civil divorce, I think that above scripture still applies. If a man divorces his wife for any other reason besides adultery I think he would be breaking his covenant and causing her to commit adultery.
A woman who needs to leave her husband over abuse or infidelity, or really any other reason, if she is noble, unselfish, and wanting to keep her covenants, she should feel it's appropriate to leave him and separate if that is what is desired, but not ask for a divorce or cancelation just so she can get another guy. It is better for her to sacrifice unless directed by the spirit otherwise, and wait until the final judgment, because there are potential blessings for both if the offending husband repents. But this makes it impossible for a righteous woman to be sealed again because of the rules, so she might end up not ever being able to marry again if she chooses this route, but I believe she will be rewarded if she does this. A man has a lot more freedom (and this would be in your case), in that you can be legally divorced, but also be free to look for another woman to be sealed to without canceling your sealing to your wife.
I'm not sure of your background Sarah, but I would disagree.

My ex-husband (that I was sealed to) was unfaithful with other men. He finally confessed after 3 years of marriage that he was gay, that he was acting on that tendency and that he wanted a divorce.

The Spirit directed both me, and my bishop at the time, independently that the marriage would likely end, though neither of us knew why at the time. The counsel of my bishop and stake president at the time was invaluable.

Even though I knew I hadn't done anything wrong, I still felt like my standing before God was somehow in jeopardy or displeasing to him. My first week in my new ward I went to visit the bishop after the meetings. (You know the standard meet the bishopric so they can get to know you.) He asked me my name and my story. I told him. (Keep in mind divorces aren't final in Utah for months so I was technically still married at the time. He just reminded me no dating until it was all final.) He then extended me a calling to serve in the Relief Society Presidency. I had seriously only met him 10 minutes before. The sister who had been called president felt impressed during Sunday School that I was to be her counselor and she didn't even know my name. It was a great comfort to me and testimony that the Lord still accepted me as I was and my standing before him was fine.

When I went to get remarried the Stake President warned that the process could take awhile since it had to be approved by the First Presidency. I believe he said he had never seen a cancellation come back in less than 6 weeks. I had to write a letter and so did my ex. Luckily, he was willing to do so. My bishop at the time (different bishop) personally went and got the letter from him.

We got an almost immediate response that the sealing had been cancelled and that I would be able to be sealed to my fiance in the temple on our chosen date.

I had a lonely and unpleasant life with my first husband, I have a great priesthood holder now. I had no children with my first husband and I have 7 now. When I prayed about marrying my second husband (I was understandably hesitant) the answer I received from the Spirit was more direct and clear than any other in my life that this would be pleasing to God.

I have had a number of friends in similar situations, though their spouse was not gay, who had similar experiences. (You might be surprised that the divorce rate in the church is sadly the same as the world, so there may be a lot of divorced people you might not know about in your ward. I found this out in a previous ward when the Relief Society set up a lunch for a sister who felt alone because she was divorced. The RS pres invited a handful of sisters who had been divorced so the struggling sister would see she was not alone. I was so surprised by those invited. The previously divorced sisters included the RS Pres, me, and I was the Primary President at the time, as well as many other sister positions of leadership in the ward. You could have knocked me over with a feather!)

I do not believe your advice is sound considering the counsel given in the Doctrine and Covenants and my own experience.

janderich
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by janderich »

Jesus himself was questioned about marriage and divorce by the Pharisees. It is hard doctrine but I think it is clear:
The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. (Matt 19:4-11)
So in the heaven there is no divorce. A man or a woman are joined by God and do not separate. This is how it was in the beginning and how it will be in the end for the righteous. However, because in this day and age people are unfaithful, mean, etc. all people cannot receive this law, so Christ in his mercy has provided a lower law in which one partner may divorce another. This allows a woman who has an abusive spouse to terminate the marriage. This allows a husband to leave a marriage wherein the wife has been unfaithful. But let those couples who can receive the higher law receive it.

Z2100
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Z2100 »

brianj wrote: January 7th, 2018, 5:05 pm I've read it several times, but it never really hit me before. 3 Ne 12:32 and Matt 5:32 state:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, that whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery; and whoso shall marry her who is divorced committeth adultery.


Is this something that has been clarified by modern prophets?

Although my (still) wife put me away and I have had multiple witnesses report adultery (which is fornication involving a married person) and the first part doesn't apply to me, I have come to know several women who became divorced because of a husband committing adultery or who was violently abusive, so the thought that one of these women could be accused of adultery really bothers me.

The second part is more applicable to me and also very disturbing. If I cause someone to sin, I obviously will be accountable. But why would it be adultery for me to marry someone and have a normal life with her?

I'm sure that my concern is nothing new, so I'm sure church leaders have spoken on this subject and I haven't found it yet. So if any of you have answers, I would really appreciate them.
if a divorce happens and you get un-married in the temple, then it is not adultery

Juliet
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Juliet »

I think it is important to remember that our temple blessings are only made final if we remain faithful. Receiving the ordinance physically does not guarantee that we will receive the blessings of that ordinance unless we remain faithful and endure to the end. No one is going to be forced to remain with someone if it is against their will and brings them sadness. The physical ordinance is important but the spirit of the law is what authorizes it.

A lot of these things will be resolved in the terrestrial kingdom. We just do our best where we are now.

gardener4life
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by gardener4life »

I just wanted reiterate our Heavenly Father will know if we treat our partner unfairly. Some of you have been treated unfairly. And when you have been treated unfairly I think somehow that will get worked out for your gain in the next life. That is what Joseph Smith was told about his experiences with persecution as well in D&C ...121 or 120 forgot which it is. 'Know this my son/daughter, that it will all work out for your gain..."

We have to have faith that Heavenly Father also will count it for something that we tried even if it didn't work out.

Michelle
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Michelle »

janderich wrote: January 8th, 2018, 5:43 am Jesus himself was questioned about marriage and divorce by the Pharisees. It is hard doctrine but I think it is clear:
The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. (Matt 19:4-11)
So in the heaven there is no divorce. A man or a woman are joined by God and do not separate. This is how it was in the beginning and how it will be in the end for the righteous. However, because in this day and age people are unfaithful, mean, etc. all people cannot receive this law, so Christ in his mercy has provided a lower law in which one partner may divorce another. This allows a woman who has an abusive spouse to terminate the marriage. This allows a husband to leave a marriage wherein the wife has been unfaithful. But let those couples who can receive the higher law receive it.
This scripture does not contradict Doctrine and Covenants, it confirms it. Notice the exception, highlighted in red?

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Sarah
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Sarah »

Michelle wrote: January 7th, 2018, 11:50 pm
Sarah wrote: January 7th, 2018, 11:10 pm The most noble and righteous thing to do, at least theoretically in my mind, is to never break a sealing. That doesn't mean you can't live apart. And even with a civil divorce, I think that above scripture still applies. If a man divorces his wife for any other reason besides adultery I think he would be breaking his covenant and causing her to commit adultery.
A woman who needs to leave her husband over abuse or infidelity, or really any other reason, if she is noble, unselfish, and wanting to keep her covenants, she should feel it's appropriate to leave him and separate if that is what is desired, but not ask for a divorce or cancelation just so she can get another guy. It is better for her to sacrifice unless directed by the spirit otherwise, and wait until the final judgment, because there are potential blessings for both if the offending husband repents. But this makes it impossible for a righteous woman to be sealed again because of the rules, so she might end up not ever being able to marry again if she chooses this route, but I believe she will be rewarded if she does this. A man has a lot more freedom (and this would be in your case), in that you can be legally divorced, but also be free to look for another woman to be sealed to without canceling your sealing to your wife.
I'm not sure of your background Sarah, but I would disagree.

My ex-husband (that I was sealed to) was unfaithful with other men. He finally confessed after 3 years of marriage that he was gay, that he was acting on that tendency and that he wanted a divorce.

The Spirit directed both me, and my bishop at the time, independently that the marriage would likely end, though neither of us knew why at the time. The counsel of my bishop and stake president at the time was invaluable.

Even though I knew I hadn't done anything wrong, I still felt like my standing before God was somehow in jeopardy or displeasing to him. My first week in my new ward I went to visit the bishop after the meetings. (You know the standard meet the bishopric so they can get to know you.) He asked me my name and my story. I told him. (Keep in mind divorces aren't final in Utah for months so I was technically still married at the time. He just reminded me no dating until it was all final.) He then extended me a calling to serve in the Relief Society Presidency. I had seriously only met him 10 minutes before. The sister who had been called president felt impressed during Sunday School that I was to be her counselor and she didn't even know my name. It was a great comfort to me and testimony that the Lord still accepted me as I was and my standing before him was fine.

When I went to get remarried the Stake President warned that the process could take awhile since it had to be approved by the First Presidency. I believe he said he had never seen a cancellation come back in less than 6 weeks. I had to write a letter and so did my ex. Luckily, he was willing to do so. My bishop at the time (different bishop) personally went and got the letter from him.

We got an almost immediate response that the sealing had been cancelled and that I would be able to be sealed to my fiance in the temple on our chosen date.

I had a lonely and unpleasant life with my first husband, I have a great priesthood holder now. I had no children with my first husband and I have 7 now. When I prayed about marrying my second husband (I was understandably hesitant) the answer I received from the Spirit was more direct and clear than any other in my life that this would be pleasing to God.

I have had a number of friends in similar situations, though their spouse was not gay, who had similar experiences. (You might be surprised that the divorce rate in the church is sadly the same as the world, so there may be a lot of divorced people you might not know about in your ward. I found this out in a previous ward when the Relief Society set up a lunch for a sister who felt alone because she was divorced. The RS pres invited a handful of sisters who had been divorced so the struggling sister would see she was not alone. I was so surprised by those invited. The previously divorced sisters included the RS Pres, me, and I was the Primary President at the time, as well as many other sister positions of leadership in the ward. You could have knocked me over with a feather!)

I do not believe your advice is sound considering the counsel given in the Doctrine and Covenants and my own experience.
You may be right that I should not go around telling people that this is what they should do, and I certainly have never done so, and stay out of those kind of questions on a personal level. I don't think you did anything wrong in your case, as you'll notice that in my post I said if directed by the spirit, it is okay. I just brought this up because I did know a woman who decided to not pursue a cancellation even though they were separated, and this was her point of view, and what she felt the spirit was directing her to do. Our ward has lots of divorcees or second marriages. I suspect that in many cases, truly the best thing to do is to move on to another spouse, but certainly every case is different. I'm glad you ended up with a great guy!

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LdsMarco
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by LdsMarco »

It is my understanding is when someone puts away (divorces) a wife for another. That's adultery.

Some people get bored of their marriage and begin searching for another. That is wrong and that is adultery

janderich
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by janderich »

Michelle wrote: January 8th, 2018, 10:29 am
janderich wrote: January 8th, 2018, 5:43 am Jesus himself was questioned about marriage and divorce by the Pharisees. It is hard doctrine but I think it is clear:
The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. (Matt 19:4-11)
So in the heaven there is no divorce. A man or a woman are joined by God and do not separate. This is how it was in the beginning and how it will be in the end for the righteous. However, because in this day and age people are unfaithful, mean, etc. all people cannot receive this law, so Christ in his mercy has provided a lower law in which one partner may divorce another. This allows a woman who has an abusive spouse to terminate the marriage. This allows a husband to leave a marriage wherein the wife has been unfaithful. But let those couples who can receive the higher law receive it.
This scripture does not contradict Doctrine and Covenants, it confirms it. Notice the exception, highlighted in red?
So give me a little more detail about the D&C scripture you quoted and why you believe it allows a married spouse to be given to another. I'll then consider what you say.

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AI2.0
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by AI2.0 »

brianj wrote: January 7th, 2018, 5:05 pm I've read it several times, but it never really hit me before. 3 Ne 12:32 and Matt 5:32 state:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, that whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery; and whoso shall marry her who is divorced committeth adultery.


Is this something that has been clarified by modern prophets?

Although my (still) wife put me away and I have had multiple witnesses report adultery (which is fornication involving a married person) and the first part doesn't apply to me, I have come to know several women who became divorced because of a husband committing adultery or who was violently abusive, so the thought that one of these women could be accused of adultery really bothers me.

The second part is more applicable to me and also very disturbing. If I cause someone to sin, I obviously will be accountable. But why would it be adultery for me to marry someone and have a normal life with her?

I'm sure that my concern is nothing new, so I'm sure church leaders have spoken on this subject and I haven't found it yet. So if any of you have answers, I would really appreciate them.
Well, does the church allow it's members to remarry? Did Joseph Smith and Brigham Young and on down to Pres. Nelson allow divorced members to remarry? (Brigham Young and Joseph F. Smith were both divorced and remarried additional wives) The answer is yes, the LDS church is not like the Catholic church--we do recognize divorce and we do allow couples to divorce and remarry without calling it adultery, so you can rest assured that if you remarry after having been divorced, you won't be committing adultery. That's the standard we live by and the standard we will be judged by.

Michelle
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by Michelle »

janderich wrote: January 8th, 2018, 12:31 pm
Michelle wrote: January 8th, 2018, 10:29 am
janderich wrote: January 8th, 2018, 5:43 am Jesus himself was questioned about marriage and divorce by the Pharisees. It is hard doctrine but I think it is clear:
The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. (Matt 19:4-11)
So in the heaven there is no divorce. A man or a woman are joined by God and do not separate. This is how it was in the beginning and how it will be in the end for the righteous. However, because in this day and age people are unfaithful, mean, etc. all people cannot receive this law, so Christ in his mercy has provided a lower law in which one partner may divorce another. This allows a woman who has an abusive spouse to terminate the marriage. This allows a husband to leave a marriage wherein the wife has been unfaithful. But let those couples who can receive the higher law receive it.
This scripture does not contradict Doctrine and Covenants, it confirms it. Notice the exception, highlighted in red?
So give me a little more detail about the D&C scripture you quoted and why you believe it allows a married spouse to be given to another. I'll then consider what you say.
Doctrine and Covenants 132:41 And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man receiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy anointing, she hath committed adultery and shall be destroyed.

42 If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has committed adultery.

43 And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a vow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44 And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and give her unto him that hath not committed adultery but hath been faithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.

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gclayjr
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by gclayjr »

Brianj,

For what it is worth. My wife was married before, in the temple. Her husband found another woman, he decided that he preferred this other woman and sued for divorce. Years Later, I met her, married her. offered her ex a deal. If he signed the adoption papers for me to adopt his daughter (not required for the Church, Children go with the mother, she was sealed to me the day my wife was sealed to me. We had a ceremony in the temple and she attended) we would forgive him his past due child support. He quickly signed and I got both his ex-wife and his daughter to be the beginning of my family.

I think I won, he lost!

Regards,

George Clay

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AI2.0
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by AI2.0 »

Sarah wrote: January 7th, 2018, 11:10 pm The most noble and righteous thing to do, at least theoretically in my mind, is to never break a sealing. That doesn't mean you can't live apart. And even with a civil divorce, I think that above scripture still applies. If a man divorces his wife for any other reason besides adultery I think he would be breaking his covenant and causing her to commit adultery.
A woman who needs to leave her husband over abuse or infidelity, or really any other reason, if she is noble, unselfish, and wanting to keep her covenants, she should feel it's appropriate to leave him and separate if that is what is desired, but not ask for a divorce or cancelation just so she can get another guy. It is better for her to sacrifice unless directed by the spirit otherwise, and wait until the final judgment, because there are potential blessings for both if the offending husband repents. But this makes it impossible for a righteous woman to be sealed again because of the rules, so she might end up not ever being able to marry again if she chooses this route, but I believe she will be rewarded if she does this. A man has a lot more freedom (and this would be in your case), in that you can be legally divorced, but also be free to look for another woman to be sealed to without canceling your sealing to your wife.
In the Catholic church, this is the way it is--they don't recognize divorce. It causes a lot of heartache for a church to enforce this view.

What you are suggesting is something that individuals can choose to do, but it is not required or encouraged by the LDS church. Personally, if I'd shared that belief (that it would be more noble to remain unmarried when my temple marriage ended after two years and no children) I'd never have been sealed to my sweet husband and had three daughters, being married now for over 30 year and hoping for an eternity together--which is what I think Our heavenly father wants for us. I'm glad I didn't make the mistake of thinking I'd be better off devoting myself to a loveless life as some sort of 'sacrifice'. I think it is better to accept that the church allows for couples to divorce and to remarry and not be or feel they are being accused of committing adultery.

The first time I was exposed to this belief, that if a woman married again after divorce, it was adultery--it was in a book by a polygamist--Ogden Kraut. I think this is one of those beliefs that was embraced by fundamentalists, but not an LDS teaching.

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AI2.0
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by AI2.0 »

Another thing I just remembered; Pres. Howard W. Hunter's second wife was divorced, and he was sealed to her in the temple. I don't for one minute believe that his marrying her 'caused' her to commit adultery. I don't think we should feel obligated to accept that perception that divorce is not allowed.

https://www.mormonwiki.com/Inis_Egan_Hunter

janderich
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by janderich »

Michelle wrote: January 8th, 2018, 5:56 pm
janderich wrote: January 8th, 2018, 12:31 pm
Michelle wrote: January 8th, 2018, 10:29 am
janderich wrote: January 8th, 2018, 5:43 am Jesus himself was questioned about marriage and divorce by the Pharisees. It is hard doctrine but I think it is clear: So in the heaven there is no divorce. A man or a woman are joined by God and do not separate. This is how it was in the beginning and how it will be in the end for the righteous. However, because in this day and age people are unfaithful, mean, etc. all people cannot receive this law, so Christ in his mercy has provided a lower law in which one partner may divorce another. This allows a woman who has an abusive spouse to terminate the marriage. This allows a husband to leave a marriage wherein the wife has been unfaithful. But let those couples who can receive the higher law receive it.
This scripture does not contradict Doctrine and Covenants, it confirms it. Notice the exception, highlighted in red?
So give me a little more detail about the D&C scripture you quoted and why you believe it allows a married spouse to be given to another. I'll then consider what you say.
Doctrine and Covenants 132:41 And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man receiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy anointing, she hath committed adultery and shall be destroyed.

42 If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has committed adultery.

43 And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a vow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44 And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and give her unto him that hath not committed adultery but hath been faithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.
Sorry, but this doesn't provide me any more understanding. There are multiple ways to interpret these verses. Do you not want to explain it?

brianj
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Re: Remarriage equals adultery?

Post by brianj »

janderich wrote: January 8th, 2018, 7:14 pm
Michelle wrote: January 8th, 2018, 5:56 pm
Doctrine and Covenants 132:41 And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man receiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy anointing, she hath committed adultery and shall be destroyed.

42 If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has committed adultery.

43 And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a vow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44 And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and give her unto him that hath not committed adultery but hath been faithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.
Sorry, but this doesn't provide me any more understanding. There are multiple ways to interpret these verses. Do you not want to explain it?
When I read 132:44, I had a very distinct impression that a divorced woman who didn't break her vows can become married to a man who hasn't break his vows.

Finding out about sins of my not-yet-ex really hurt, but the information was provided to assure me that I hadn't broken my vows. And, when I chose to follow the counsel to create a list of attributes I want in a wife, one of the things that quickly came up was "Did not cause her divorce." As long as I find that, I now feel comforted that we both will be living the higher law.

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