Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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Joel
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Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

Utahns overwhelmingly want government and businesses to be more open, but they are less sure about whether churches need to lift veils of secrecy.

While 93 percent of the state’s registered voters desire more transparency from government and 63 percent wish the same from businesses, according to a new Salt Lake Tribune-Hinckley Institute of Politics poll, fewer than half (49 percent) believe faith groups need to reveal more about their dealings.

In fact, most devout Mormons, who make up the largest chunk of the survey sample, oppose the idea.

Overall, 42 percent of Utah voters say churches don’t need to be more transparent. Nine percent are unsure.

The survey question did not ask or prompt respondents on what they thought churches should be more open about — whether religious teachings, practices, politics, finances, missteps, membership information or leadership decisions.

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It also did not identify a specific denomination, although Utah remains predominantly Mormon. The Salt Lake City-based Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the culture emanating from it are seen as wielding significant influence in the Beehive State — from legislative hallways to corporate boardrooms, school classrooms to individual living rooms.

As such, 408 of the survey’s 605 total respondents self-identified as Latter-day Saints of some stripe. The 338 “very active” Mormons were the least likely to call for more transparency from churches, with only 36 percent favoring such action. More than half (54 percent) said no to the notion.

Those results virtually flipped for “somewhat active” and “inactive” members, with 54 percent and 51 percent, respectively, urging more openness from faith groups.

“There’s something about the Mormon culture that sort of fosters this idea that information is not inherently meant to be consumed by the masses, that such things are sacred,” says Ryan McKnight, a former Latter-day Saint who founded MormonLeaks as an online repository for internal LDS documents in hopes of boosting transparency in the church.

“What goes on in the temple is considered sacred,” he says, “and a lot of Mormons also see their financial records as sacred, in that it is nobody’s business to know what the Lord is bringing in from tithing.”

Still, McKnight, who lives in Las Vegas, sees cause for optimism in the poll results, given that more than a third of faithful Latter-day Saints support more transparency.

“That’s still a pretty good number,” he says. “Very rarely have I encountered [active Mormons] who [admit to] wanting that.”

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Patrick Mason, chairman of Mormon studies at Southern California’s Claremont Graduate University, notes that the LDS response seems inexorably linked to how seriously those members practice their religion.

“I’m not surprised that only a minority of ‘very active’ Latter-day Saints feel the need for more [transparency],” he says, “and a solid majority feel otherwise ... an indication that they have tremendous confidence in their leaders and the institution.”

Mason concedes that the swing toward greater transparency by somewhat active and inactive Mormons is “statistically a pretty striking difference,” but says that phenomenon sparks additional questions.

“As people become less active in the church, we see less confidence in the leadership,” Mason explains. “What these numbers don’t tell us is if that increased lack of trust is the cause for them being less active, less socialized within the organization, or whether that contributes [directly] to their desire for more transparency.”

The LDS Church, which declined to comment for this story, has been taking strides toward greater openness, publishing essays with the stated purpose of providing “accurate and transparent information on church history and doctrine.”

Among other Utah believers, there is more agreement on church transparency. More than half of Catholics (52 percent), Protestants (56 percent) and followers of other faiths (60 percent) want more disclosures from religion.

Meanwhile, 82 percent of the state’s so-called “nones,” who profess no religious affiliation and represent a fast-growing segment on the national landscape, want more church transparency.

Unsurprisingly, more than nine in 10 Utah voters back more transparency from government, which already is the most open of the three groups the survey named.

Chase Thomas, policy and advocacy counsel for the left-leaning Alliance for a Better Utah, sees those results as a resounding condemnation of the “status quo.”

“The headlines have not been great as of late,” he says, citing “mismanagement at the Utah Transit Authority and the subsequent closing of their meetings to the public, [Utah] Attorney General [Sean] Reyes and Gov. [Gary] Herbert refusing to issue their election-related legal opinion, and multiple government agencies fighting against [open records] requests.”

Thomas also points to closed Republican caucuses on Capitol Hill, allowing GOP lawmakers to “kill Medicaid expansion . . . without their constituents knowing who voted yea or nay.”
As for most voters supporting more business transparency, Utah Better Business Bureau President and CEO Jane Riggs views that sentiment as confirmation for her organization’s role as a conduit for consumer complaints and business responses.

“Being transparent doesn’t mean a business has to give away how they make a product or how much profit they make on a service,” she says. “It does mean that a business is upfront with a consumer about where the business is located, costs, policies and provides any written documentation necessary.”

The poll, conducted by Dan Jones & Associates from Oct. 10 to 13, has an overall margin of error of plus or minus 3.98 percentage points. The margin is higher for subcategories.

gardener4life
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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Interesting idea. But the problem is we're not in charge. But to be clear it is an interesting topic you brought up. You brought up something we can discuss. I think there's nothing wrong with being curious. I mean we are living in a time when the work is sped up and going faster than any other time on the Earth in all of its history probably. So it's not wrong to be curious. It's interesting to see what people think too.

Well let's see what the scriptures say about it;

D&C 136:42 Be diligent in keeping all my commandments, lest judgments come upon you, and your faith fail you, and your enemies triumph over you. So no more at present. Amen and Amen. (We're working on the basics still. When we can get that then maybe we can earn more.) Also verse 37 Therefore, marvel not at these things, for ye are not yet pure; ye can not yet bear my glory; but ye shall behold it if ye are faithful in keeping all my words...(other scriptures repeatedly tell us we can't bear all things and are still like little children> but being like little children can be positive too.)

D&C 124:84
And with my servant Almon Babbitt, there are many things with which I am not pleased; behold, he aspireth to establish his counsel instead of the counsel which I have ordained, even that of the Presidency of my Church; and he setteth up a golden calf for the worship of my people. (People have tried to counsel the Lord in the past. Also there's the story of one of the men tried to tell Joseph Smith that he could write a revelation better than the Lord.)

D&C 100:2 Therefore, follow me, and listen to the counsel which I shall give unto you. (our job is to follow him as little children full of trust.)
D&C 63:55 And now behold, verily I say unto you, I, the Lord, am not pleased with my servant Sidney Rigdon; he exalted himself in his heart, and received not counsel, but grieved the Spirit (It didn't work out well for Sidney Rigdon trying to be in charge when he couldn't follow.)
Moses 6:28 And for these many generations, ever since the day that I created them, have they gone astray, and have denied me, and have sought their own counsels in the dark; and in their own abominations have they devised murder, and have not kept the commandments, which I gave unto their father, Adam. (Yeah another bad example.)

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Joel
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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I would favor more transparency in churches in general because the influence churches have over people's lives can be immense. Some people allow their church influence most of the major decisions in their lives. Information is power. Having more information allows people make more informed choices how they choose to allow a church influence their lives and the lives of their family.

The film Spotlight did a good job showing how one influential church worked without transparency


gardener4life
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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You know I keep wondering what your picture means Joel? You have the pic of a certain successful guy holding gobs and gobs of money. I can't tell if its like a humor thing or something else and it's made me curious.

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Joel
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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It's a humor thing :) It is a photoshop picture, the real picture is of the president http://time.com/4404431/harry-benson-donald-trump/

brianj
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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And the "successful guy" went from a modest middle class upbringing to become the fourth richest preacher in the US with a net worth of $40 million. He and his family live in an estimated $10,500,000 home paid for through priestcraft.

I don't see a need for more transparency from the church. If too much were known openly, people would have even more opportunity to be critical of the church and its leaders. We would see even more attacks on the character of our leaders, based on their decisions or recordings of their conversations.

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Thinker
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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I’m surprised almost half of lds want church financial transparency. To me, being open about church finances makes sense. Why would anyone want to hide it? Honesty (including being open about how sacred money is spent) in ALL dealings. Lead by example.

brianj
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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Thinker wrote: November 5th, 2017, 4:02 pm I’m surprised almost half of lds want church financial transparency. To me, being open about church finances makes sense. Why would anyone want to hide it? Honesty (including being open about how sacred money is spent) in ALL dealings. Lead by example.
Every single time a temple is built, anti-Mormons and anti-Christians come out of the woodwork to harshly criticize the 'waste of money' of building the temple. They always justify their outrage by claiming that if we really were Christian, we would spend the money on humanitarian aid instead of temples. Even some church members, people who don't comprehend the importance of temples or that the church wouldn't receive as much in donations without temples, make this complaint, Giving the exact amount spent on a new temple would add fuel to that fire of unrighteous indignation.

I don't see any good reason for total transparency.

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Thinker
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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brianj wrote: November 5th, 2017, 4:43 pm
Thinker wrote: November 5th, 2017, 4:02 pm I’m surprised almost half of lds want church financial transparency. To me, being open about church finances makes sense. Why would anyone want to hide it? Honesty (including being open about how sacred money is spent) in ALL dealings. Lead by example.
Every single time a temple is built, anti-Mormons and anti-Christians come out of the woodwork to harshly criticize the 'waste of money' of building the temple. They always justify their outrage by claiming that if we really were Christian, we would spend the money on humanitarian aid instead of temples. Even some church members, people who don't comprehend the importance of temples or that the church wouldn't receive as much in donations without temples, make this complaint, Giving the exact amount spent on a new temple would add fuel to that fire of unrighteous indignation.

I don't see any good reason for total transparency.
If I understand you correctly, you think that by revealing how the church spends money would cause more criticism of the church and possibly limit donations.

Once, years ago, I was placed in a very difficult situation in which I knew someone was doing something very wrong (legally & morally). I feared that if I reported them, they would criticize me and maybe even worse. I wasn’t sure what to do. One night, I was at church playing vollyball & went to the bathroom to pray. Then I heard the hymn, “Do what is right, let the consequence follow” and felt the spirit strong and knew what I was going to do.

People have called me names and criticized me when I’ve defended babies killed in abortion or marriage between a man & a woman. But their criticisms don’t dictate what I choose to do. I do what I feel is right and I live with the consequences. I respect and trust others who do that too.

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Joel
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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This looks like an interesting project:
The MormonLeaks™ Team Launches FaithLeaks and the Truth and Transparency Foundation


The MormonLeaks™ team is proud to announce critical expansions to its efforts by offering additional channels that build on our news reporting, public commentary, and criticism of all things Mormon.

In the past year MormonLeaks has aimed to “[expand] news reporting, public commentary, and criticism related to Mormonism” by “[providing] sources and whistleblowers with the technical ability to anonymously submit sensitive documents” related to the Mormon Church. The impact of MormonLeaks efforts has been seen in the release of recordings of private meetings with top Mormon officials, in confirmation of the long hidden fact that the Mormon Church pays its highest clergy, in the issuance of a DMCA takedown request from the Mormon Church, and in the publication of many previously classified documents. Arguably, there has never been so much transparency in the Mormon Church.

To answer the demand for similar results across the entire spectrum of high demand religions, the MormonLeaks team is pleased today to announce FaithLeaks. FaithLeaks, like MormonLeaks, is founded on the belief that increased transparency results in fewer untruths, less corruption, and less abuse in any organization. It provides the same service of anonymizing sources from all religions, religious nonprofits, cults, and creeds with documented information they believe deserves to be made public.

Additionally, the team has also acted to incorporate the Truth and Transparency Foundation (TTF), a nonprofit to support the administration and operations of both MormonLeaks and FaithLeaks. Donations to both projects will be tax deductible in the United States via the TTF. TTF hopes to leverage its efforts to encourage transparent financials, policies, and statistics from all religions and religious non profits. We aim to set and promote a societal standard for truth and transparency in the religious sector in an age where it is grossly lacking. For more information about the mission and objectives of TTF, visit truthandtransparency.org.

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Joel
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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Memo to all religions: MormonLeaks may be coming after you with new FaithLeaks site

Get ready to be scrutinized, “high-demand religions” (whoever you are).

MormonLeaks, which until now has focused exclusively on publishing purloined papers from within the LDS Church, is expanding into the larger universe of religious organizations.

The Nevada-based nonprofit announced that it is expanding its publication channels with the launch of FaithLeaks.

Like MormonLeaks, FaithLeaks is rooted on the premise that “increased transparency results in fewer untruths, less corruption and less abuse in any organization,” founder Ryan McKnight said in a news release. “It provides the same service of anonymizing sources from all religions, religious nonprofits, cults, and creeds with documented information they believe deserves to be made public.”

MormonLeaks began in late 2016 with the goal of providing a means whereby disgruntled or disillusioned Latter-day Saints could post internal and confidential documents without fear of discovery.

Since then, it has published on its website pay stubs of top LDS officials, minutes of meetings with church authorities, PowerPoint presentations about groups and individuals the faith considers apostate and private correspondence between leaders and members.

At the same time, McKnight and the site’s technical adviser, Ethan Dodge, have received queries from people eager to replicate MormonLeaks to divulge documents about other denominations.

At the end of July, Dodge, a cybersecurity expert who also goes by the moniker “Privacy P. Pratt,” gave a presentation to a packed audience at DefCon, the nation’s largest conference of hackers.

“A significant number of folks who aren’t Mormon understood our motives and the effects of our work,” said Dodge, who, like McKnight, has resigned from the Utah-based Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Many attendees came up afterward, wanting help setting up a similar site.

“When it got right down to it, they didn’t want to put in the amount of work Ryan and I have put into MormonLeaks — anywhere from 20 to 60 hours a week,” he said Monday.

“But the demand was obvious. Transparency is grossly lacking in so many of these groups.”

For example, Jehovah’s Witnesses and Scientology are two faiths that could be considered “high-demand religions,” Dodge said, but the label might apply to any denomination, “depending on how believers allow that faith to control their lives.”

Is the team expecting lawsuits?

Yes, Dodge said, but MormonLeaks and FaithLeaks are prepared for them and remain undeterred by the prospect. The LDS Church, for instance, previously accused the site of copyright violations.

“We felt maybe there was a need to widen our net and broaden our mission,” McKnight said in an interview. “These tools give power back to the people, who may have been previously silenced.”

Still, determining the veracity of leaks from so many sources will be “magnitudes more challenging than it is with MormonLeaks,” McKnight acknowledged. “Not only because we don’t have the same level of sourcing, but because our own personal knowledge of many faiths is lacking.”

McKnight and Dodge, the two co-founders for FaithLeaks, have established relationships with people from various religions who “might be able to help us with the vetting process,” McKnight explained. “The more salacious a document is, the more proof it will require.”

Both sites have been put under the umbrella of a newly formed nonprofit called the Truth and Transparency Foundation, which can accept tax-deductible donations.

“We will just put documents out as we have been doing, and let the public and media decide their significance,” Dodge said. “That’s worked well so far.”

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Col. Flagg
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

Post by Col. Flagg »

If the church were ever forced to open its books, a lot of members would lose their testimonies. Not because of what would be uncovered, but because most members don't have their testimonies rooted in the gospel, instead, they are rooted in the arm of the flesh. :(

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Joel
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Jehovah's Witnesses: Your money is going to protect pedophiles

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Different people have their own style:
On November 5, 2017 I went in to a Kenosha Wisconsin Kingdom Hall to inform the congregation about the pedophilia cases that the organization faces. My comment was not well received and the elders quickly forced me to leave. Please visit jwvictims.com, jwfacts.com and the internet for more information. Google Australian Royal Commission Case 29. This organization silences any opposition but it cannot hide from the light that the courts are shining upon it.

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Joel
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Jehovah’s Witnesses Face $2 Million Penalty

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justkeepswimming
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

Post by justkeepswimming »

We've been groomed to not 'need' this type of information. Oddly enough, we were given some type of general information into the 50s, then the church got in a hot mess financially, then they brought in N. Eldon Tanner, corporate finance expert to fix everything, and from then on it's been kept quiet.

My guess is there's no mischief going on but it's just easier to keep silent about finances so more questions aren't asked.

http://www.sltrib.com/religion/local/20 ... ots-of-it/
Thinker wrote: November 5th, 2017, 4:02 pm I’m surprised almost half of lds want church financial transparency. To me, being open about church finances makes sense. Why would anyone want to hide it? Honesty (including being open about how sacred money is spent) in ALL dealings. Lead by example.

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Joel
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Jehovah's Witnesses hide Child molesters & Pedophilia and Mind control

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Sirocco
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Re: Utahns split on desire for more church transparency, but most active Mormons say it isn’t needed, poll shows

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Those Jo-ho's always weirded me out lol

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