Maybe v.42 has a higher meaning, maybe?AI2.0 wrote: ↑October 21st, 2017, 3:46 pmArenera wrote: ↑October 21st, 2017, 11:55 amThe Power of the PriesthoodAI2.0 wrote: ↑October 21st, 2017, 11:12 amYou don't give examples of where they said this, so I can only make an assumption, but from what I've read from both of them, it would be that men don't have 'power' in their priesthood if they lack faith, do not magnify it, are unworthy to exercise it, etc.--there are many reasons which would limit or blunt the power they have access to, through the ordination they've received. The ordination is still valid, as it stands, because of our merciful God who has compassion on his sons. Power in the Priesthood can be theirs, because men are always able to repent, rely upon the Lord and humble themselves to be able to give them power in their priesthood.Arenera wrote: ↑October 21st, 2017, 8:49 am Of recent times, both Elder Nelson and Elder Packer have suggested we don’t have power in the priesthood.
If there is no power, has the ordination been of value?
The power comes from accessing heaven. This is where the Holy Spirit of Promise, the Holy Ghost, Christ himself. This is also where the Church of the Firstborn is.
From the things that some have said, such as Finrock and Jaredbees, it seems they do not understand that the Holy Spirit of Promise does not 'ratify' or empower a person who does not have the office or the priesthood already bestowed. Some also seem to believe that when the Lord in D&C 121 said in 'amen' to the priesthood/authority of that man who practices unrighteous dominion etc., that this was some kind of final judgment-- this meant their priesthood ordination is no longer valid. Well, to me, that's obviously not what the Lord meant, because he always stands with his arms outstretched for us to humble ourselves, repent and come to him to heal us of our sins and infirmities--including the sin of unrighteous dominion. This is NOT what we believe in the LDS church--we believe that through the atonement, we can overcome our sins and iniquities and the Lord can use us to build his kingdom and serve our fellowmen. So, an ordination done on earth is not simply lost because all too human men make mistakes, but it will not do them any good when they are not worthy to exercise it.
The second comforter is Jesus Christ, but he is also God and the head of our church. He has set up a church which follows a pattern. He does not empower men or women outside the established pattern which he has set up, unless that system is irrevocably destroyed. If one has a testimony that the CofJCofLDS is the Lord's only true and living church on the earth today and is NOT in apostasy, then they will not trust or give heed to the claims of any man or woman who says that they've been called and set apart, given power, through God (or the holy spirit of promise, or an angel or vision etc.) directly . They will know that this is not how the Lord works. If they believe the church is the Lord's only true church, they will also believe that it is through staying on the strait and narrow path--living/following the teachings, practices and commandments in righteousness, as taught to them, then they will be heirs to salvation and members of the Church of the Firstborn.The Price of Priesthood PowerYears ago a family gathered at the bedside of an aged little Danish woman. Among them was her middle-aged, wayward son. For the past number of years he had been living at home.
Tearfully he pleaded, “Mama, you’ve got to live. Mama, you can’t die.” He said, “Mama, you can’t go. I won’t let you go.”
The little mother looked up at her son and in her broken Danish accent said, “But ver is yo powah?”—where is your power?
In our Church, men are ordained to the Aaronic and Melchisedek priesthood by men who have been so ordained, mostly.
This is explained in D&C 84:As you can see by these verses in Section 84, men ordain other men, God ordains men, and angels ordain men.6 And the sons of Moses, according to the Holy Priesthood which he received under the hand of his father-in-law, Jethro;
12 And Esaias received it under the hand of God.
17 Which priesthood continueth in the church of God in all generations, and is without beginning of days or end of years.
23 Now this Moses plainly taught to the children of Israel in the wilderness, and sought diligently to sanctify his people that they might behold the face of God;
24 But they hardened their hearts and could not endure his presence; therefore, the Lord in his wrath, for his anger was kindled against them, swore that they should not enter into his rest while in the wilderness, which rest is the fulness of his glory.
28 For he was baptized while he was yet in his childhood, and was ordained by the angel of God at the time he was eight days old unto this power, to overthrow the kingdom of the Jews, and to make straight the way of the Lord before the face of his people, to prepare them for the coming of the Lord, in whose hand is given all power.
35 And also all they who receive this priesthood receive me, saith the Lord;
42 And wo unto all those who come not unto this priesthood which ye have received, which I now confirm upon you who are present this day, by mine own voice out of the heavens; and even I have given the hea
And verse 42 makes it interesting!
The story of the mother asking 'where is your power' reiterates what I said. Her son was ordained but not worthy which caused her to have no faith in his ability to bless her and him of course, to doubt himself as well. That didn't mean that he was past being able to repent and be able to bless with power. If I was sick and only an unworthy man was around to bless me, I'd ask for a blessing, because I believe if Heavenly Father has a blessing for me he can still bestow it because he is an ordained Priesthood holder; and because my faith and my worthiness allow me to receive the blessing--but that's just my feelings on this.
Verse 42 says; "And wo unto all those who come not unto this priesthood which he yave received, which I now confirm upon you who are present this day, by mine own voice out of the heavens; and even I have given the heavenly hosts and mine angels charge concerning you."
He did this, didn't he. Joseph as the prophet, received revelation by God's own voice out of the heavens and he and others were ministered to by those angels and heavenly hosts who had charge over them. But, if you think this means that God is going to ordain other men to the priesthood himself, ignoring the proper priesthood authority he set up and not use his duly called and appointed servants to do his work-- you are believing something that is not correct for LDS doctrine. It is also a belief that has led many to follow after various false leaders of break off sects. that's exactly what men like Ervil LeBaron, Roger Billings, James Strang, Christopher Nemelka and Denver Snuffer have claimed. They claim God spoke to them and told them they held the keys and were called and appointed/ordained to received revelation from God. If you are going to believe that God does in our day (when we have the true church on the earth) by directly ordaining some men without proper priesthood authority, then you run the risk of being deceived by these types of claimants.
I know the pattern which the church follows, I know that while you interpret this scripture a certain way, I interpret it so that it conforms to other scriptures that point out that a man must be called and set apart by those having authority, and since we have a church set up and men called who hold keys and authority, there is no reason to believe that God would go outside of his 'true and living church' to directly call or ordain others--as was necessary when his true church was not organized upon the earth.
The Church of the Firstborn is the church of the Celestial Kingdom. If a person qualifies, might there be an ordination, maybe?
Christ will reign in the terrestrial world. Might a person qualify for the terrestrial world before the millennium starts, maybe?
If a person is being taught by the Lord himself, is she/he a Zion person, a terrestrial person, maybe?
