Struggling with Charity for Transwhatever Family

[brianj]

First off, let me say I admire you for putting up with that for so long because you believe it's what the Lord would have you do.

This suggestion may not go over well and may cause alienation, but it may also provide the exact response you want. The next time you are having a personal conversation with one of these people, ask them if they feel you are respectful toward them. If they say yes, ask if they respect you. Then, assuming they say yes again, ask them to show that respect by restricting what they discuss with you. You want to be a part of their life / lives, but when they try pushing you to respect concepts that defy science and logic you are deeply disturbed.

My brother used to be a very profane person. When I asked him to not use that kind of language around me it went over very poorly at first. Later I asked him if he used that kind of language in his grandmother's presence; of course the answer was no. I pointed out that he watches his language in her presence out of respect and asked for the same respect. At that point things began to improve.

[eddie]

Dear eddie,
On second thoughts, as you have been so kind as to trouble yourself to take time out of your busy life to comment on my post, let me modify it for you:

I would just tell them without any apology that their actions and thoughts in this regard are Satanic, disgusting, immoral, against Eternal Law and to stay away until they are ready to repent, stop, and refrain from this filthy loathsome Luciferian abomination.

I have not had this trial, but it seems to me you have been more than charitable. I would just tell them without any apology that their actions and thoughts in this regard are disgusting, immoral, against eternal law and to stay away until they are ready to repent and stop this abomination.

Wow, I always enjoy Elizabeth's tender response.

Well, thank-you for taking the time to modify your tender response, I now know how to treat people. @-)

[passionflower]

Dear eddie,
On second thoughts, as you have been so kind as to trouble yourself to take time out of your busy life to comment on my post, let me modify it for you:

I would just tell them without any apology that their actions and thoughts in this regard are Satanic, disgusting, immoral, against Eternal Law and to stay away until they are ready to repent, stop, and refrain from this filthy loathsome Luciferian abomination.

I have not had this trial, but it seems to me you have been more than charitable. I would just tell them without any apology that their actions and thoughts in this regard are disgusting, immoral, against eternal law and to stay away until they are ready to repent and stop this abomination.

Wow, I always enjoy Elizabeth's tender response.

Well, thank-you for taking the time to modify your tender response, I now know how to treat people. @-)

The way the Apostle Paul talks about homosexuality is not all that tender, either. And neither is Moses all that nice.

Have no fear, though, as all unflattering remarks concerning homosexuality will soon be a criminal offense, as they are already considered hate speech, churches will lose the religious freedom to quote Paul on this subject, and anyone like Elizabeth will be labeled homophobic and forced into "treatment".

[Z2100]

It's quite possible this trans business is a passing fad.

I’m sure it is. Everyone knows there are only two genders.

[bethany]

You cannot heal someone you don't love. I'd stick to the path you said you were first inspired to follow. Be the love that connects this person back to Christ. I've seen a lot of ppl express righteous indignation at church & elsewhere, that message is out there and this individual is well aware of it, why not be the loving embrace? You don't have to sit for far out conversations, but certainly show concern for their well being.

There is an awesome story in Hawaii abt a man who practices something called ho'oponopono, the ancient Hawaian practice of forgiveness. You merely say in your mind.... I'm sorry, I love you, I forgive you, will you forgive me? I've used it when I've felt unsettled about ppl in my life. It works miracles. One friend shared her experience in testimony meeting in using this on a work issue. Someone was expending a load of hate on her & trying to get her fired. She felt that God told her to use this tool regarding the woman seeking her demise. It ended up totally turning around. That was the first I had heard of it. I've used it many times since w very good responses. You simply direct your love & thoughts to the person and mentally repeat those 4 short phrases. It can build love where there is none too. Good luck. It takes strength to be the love in someone's life....

[Yahtzee]

There is an awesome story in Hawaii abt a man who practices something called ho'oponopono, the ancient Hawaian practice of forgiveness. You merely say in your mind.... I'm sorry, I love you, I forgive you, will you forgive me? I've used it when I've felt unsettled about ppl in my life. It works miracles.

That is beautiful. Thank you so much!

[bethany]

It's really easy & will help you to feel the charity that you are struggling with. I just see the person in my mind & repeat those phrases over & over. Just understand that this person feels a void in their life that they are trying to draw attention to, if they are filled, they will no longer need the attention. I'd pick a time that is comfortable to do this, I do this type of work as I am preparing to go to sleep and I wake up about an hour early in the morning to focus on things like this. Cool thing is that they never know what you are doing & you will find more capacity for love toward them.

[harakim]

I have not had this trial, but it seems to me you have been more than charitable. I would just tell them without any apology that their actions and thoughts in this regard are disgusting, immoral, against eternal law and to stay away until they are ready to repent and stop this abomination.

Wow, I always enjoy Elizabeth's tender response.

I could not help but laugh out loud.

[harakim]

Maybe someone here has some great advice, but I'm really struggling to love my LGBTW family. I'm the only person my sibling will even talk to now because I've made great efforts over the years to use correct names, pronouns, etc. I've felt strongly from the Lord that my role is to love, not to correct, so they can have a path back to the family.
But my patience is wearing thin with this non gender binary garbage. Menstruation isn't only for women is the latest. It makes me fume to read this anti science, anti logic propaganda.
And what I've realized is that I truly don't feel charity for them. It's a facade. I pity them, but also secretly look forward to the day they realize their idiocy.
I'm really not sure what to do spiritually at this point. Maintaining a relationship is what I feel the Lord has asked me to do, but the more I interract with them, the less love I feel.

If you find out, let me know. This is one of the things I struggle with most. Most things, I know what the right answer is but I forget or it's hard to put into practice so I allow my minor doubts to succeed. In this case I am at a loss. When people talk to me about male menstruation, I just let my natural reaction go, which is to laugh out loud. This turns what could have been a very negative and stressful experience into one that makes me happier and less stressed. While this offends surprisingly fewer people than I would have expected, something tells me that's not the right answer...

One thing you could perhaps do is do projects with them or share some out-of-the-ordinary experiences like a hike. This will cause you to bond and maybe they will be more willing to see your point of view. Run of the mill experiences or conversations don't help a lot with bonding.

[Elizabeth]

Three more for the ignore list, and yet another reason to not join a "Zion" community.

I have not had this trial, but it seems to me you have been more than charitable. I would just tell them without any apology that their actions and thoughts in this regard are disgusting, immoral, against eternal law and to stay away until they are ready to repent and stop this abomination.

Wow, I always enjoy Elizabeth's tender response.

I could not help but laugh out loud.

[passionflower]

Yahtzee, if you didn't love your brother, you wouldn't be so concerned about him. You wouldn't have started this thread. Being frustrated, angry or upset does not mean you don't love him. In fact, these emotions can be a strong indication that you do. My husband's southern grandmother used to say, " there is nothing so full of love as a good fight".

Here's my take on it, and you can tell your brother this for me:

Whatever your brother thinks his problem is, whatever he thinks the cause of it is, and no matter how much personal pain and confusion he finds himself in, he needs to come up with an ethical solution to his dilemma just like anybody else. This means defining a solution that creates the most value and the most benefit for all people concerned, not just himself or other people like him. A solution that blatantly hurts others, takes value from others, makes more problems for them or just ends up trading one set of problems for another set of problems is NOT a solution.

If he doesn't find such a solution, then no matter what, he will not have the personal strength to face and deal with his problems, and your fears that he just might begin comtemplating suicide could become reality.

Ordinarily, women cannot lift cars or pianos up, but when a child is underneath, suddenly great power is unleashed, and they lift the car or piano up, freeing the child. Later on, amazed themselves at what happened, try lifting the heavy object, discovering they can't even budge it. This is because great subconscious power is unleashed when we are out to help others. People get added strength, sometimes superhuman added strength, when they put of the feelings and needs or even life of others ahead of their own. This is why the most stage frightened socially insecure person can get up and talk convincingly in front of others, or hold himself up socially to the point of being brilliant. Formerly impossible things become more than possible when the person gets himself unselfed in the cause of someone or something outside himself.

Put yourself first, disregarding all others, and you are psychologically dead where you stand and are engulged and suffocated by your own self consciousness.

The LBGTW community would like to spread the lie that someone like themselves has to be "true to themselves" to be freed from unhappiness. But being true to yourself has no value unless you are true to the highest in you. The highest in you includes being true to the highest ideals of self sacrifice you can muster. Only by finding a cause to live for that is outside yourself does a person truly find himself.

[brianj]

The LBGTW community would like to spread the lie that someone like themselves has to be "true to themselves" to be freed from unhappiness. But being true to yourself has no value unless you are true to the highest in you. The highest in you includes being true to the highest ideals of self sacrifice you can muster. Only by finding a cause to live for that is outside yourself does a person truly find himself.

This paragraph is intellectual gold! This is truth! Thank you for writing it!

[brlenox]

Yahtzee, if you didn't love your brother, you wouldn't be so concerned about him. You wouldn't have started this thread. Being frustrated, angry or upset does not mean you don't love him. In fact, these emotions can be a strong indication that you do. My husband's southern grandmother used to say, " there is nothing so full of love as a good fight".

Here's my take on it, and you can tell your brother this for me:

Whatever your brother thinks his problem is, whatever he thinks the cause of it is, and no matter how much personal pain and confusion he finds himself in, he needs to come up with an ethical solution to his dilemma just like anybody else. This means defining a solution that creates the most value and the most benefit for all people concerned, not just himself or other people like him. A solution that blatantly hurts others, takes value from others, makes more problems for them or just ends up trading one set of problems for another set of problems is NOT a solution.

If he doesn't find such a solution, then no matter what, he will not have the personal strength to face and deal with his problems, and your fears that he just might begin comtemplating suicide could become reality.

Ordinarily, women cannot lift cars or pianos up, but when a child is underneath, suddenly great power is unleashed, and they lift the car or piano up, freeing the child. Later on, amazed themselves at what happened, try lifting the heavy object, discovering they can't even budge it. This is because great subconscious power is unleashed when we are out to help others. People get added strength, sometimes superhuman added strength, when they put of the feelings and needs or even life of others ahead of their own. This is why the most stage frightened socially insecure person can get up and talk convincingly in front of others, or hold himself up socially to the point of being brilliant. Formerly impossible things become more than possible when the person gets himself unselfed in the cause of someone or something outside himself.

Put yourself first, disregarding all others, and you are psychologically dead where you stand and are engulged and suffocated by your own self consciousness.

The LBGTW community would like to spread the lie that someone like themselves has to be "true to themselves" to be freed from unhappiness. But being true to yourself has no value unless you are true to the highest in you. The highest in you includes being true to the highest ideals of self sacrifice you can muster. Only by finding a cause to live for that is outside yourself does a person truly find himself.

Passionflower, I must agree with brianj. This entire post is of exceptional worth. Very good.

[Yahtzee]

Yahtzee, if you didn't love your brother, you wouldn't be so concerned about him. You wouldn't have started this thread. Being frustrated, angry or upset does not mean you don't love him. In fact, these emotions can be a strong indication that you do. My husband's southern grandmother used to say, " there is nothing so full of love as a good fight".

Here's my take on it, and you can tell your brother this for me:

Whatever your brother thinks his problem is, whatever he thinks the cause of it is, and no matter how much personal pain and confusion he finds himself in, he needs to come up with an ethical solution to his dilemma just like anybody else. This means defining a solution that creates the most value and the most benefit for all people concerned, not just himself or other people like him. A solution that blatantly hurts others, takes value from others, makes more problems for them or just ends up trading one set of problems for another set of problems is NOT a solution.

If he doesn't find such a solution, then no matter what, he will not have the personal strength to face and deal with his problems, and your fears that he just might begin comtemplating suicide could become reality.

Ordinarily, women cannot lift cars or pianos up, but when a child is underneath, suddenly great power is unleashed, and they lift the car or piano up, freeing the child. Later on, amazed themselves at what happened, try lifting the heavy object, discovering they can't even budge it. This is because great subconscious power is unleashed when we are out to help others. People get added strength, sometimes superhuman added strength, when they put of the feelings and needs or even life of others ahead of their own. This is why the most stage frightened socially insecure person can get up and talk convincingly in front of others, or hold himself up socially to the point of being brilliant. Formerly impossible things become more than possible when the person gets himself unselfed in the cause of someone or something outside himself.

Put yourself first, disregarding all others, and you are psychologically dead where you stand and are engulged and suffocated by your own self consciousness.

The LBGTW community would like to spread the lie that someone like themselves has to be "true to themselves" to be freed from unhappiness. But being true to yourself has no value unless you are true to the highest in you. The highest in you includes being true to the highest ideals of self sacrifice you can muster. Only by finding a cause to live for that is outside yourself does a person truly find himself.

This is the most accurate thing I have ever read. Applicable across the board. Thank you.

[eddie]

Three more for the ignore list, and yet another reason to not join a "Zion" community.

I have not had this trial, but it seems to me you have been more than charitable. I would just tell them without any apology that their actions and thoughts in this regard are disgusting, immoral, against eternal law and to stay away until they are ready to repent and stop this abomination.

Wow, I always enjoy Elizabeth's tender response.

I could not help but laugh out loud.

Well darn..