underdog wrote: ↑September 21st, 2017, 1:39 pmGood point, and good questions, Mark.Mark wrote: ↑September 21st, 2017, 10:57 amunderdog wrote: ↑September 21st, 2017, 9:43 am Shadow,
When you come with something that is non circular and fresh and not based on your false premise (and then reasoning backwards, as if that makes any sense), then I'll respond. Otherwise, you'll get crickets from me. It's a waste of time for you to repeat yourself, and for me to respond.
I'm looking for serious discussion and not a repeat of your traditions.
AI2 had a response that showed research and thoughtfulness, quoting references, etc. Your responses are always based in your assumptions of what is true. Opinions and assertions can't be brought forth as evidence. Need something that at least appears to be factual.
Why do you even care? You have already made your choice and a stick of dynamite wouldn't move you off your intended remnant path. Is this just a game to you to get people's blood pressure to elevate? Clearly you are not trying to decide which path to follow. It just seems so fruitless to pursue any more discussion on this topic. Nothing said here will make any difference at this point. Just move forward with your new path and live your life.
I am persuaded by your points.
I will cautiously move forward.
Like you, and like the good folks here, I do want to follow the Lord and I want to do that by following His commandments and repenting and getting to the point where I understand His voice.
I know I'm a good person, and because I do the things I should be doing as a good member of the Church like reading the BoM, Bible, etc., going to the Temple, magnifying my callings, being a good dad and husband, etc. I think I should expect to be led by the Spirit.
Could I be wrong about Denver? I could. I walk by faith. I do not believe I could be wrong about the BoM or Jesus Christ. I believe both to be true.
To me, Denver's teachings match up and corroborate and sustain and conform to the Scriptures. The Scriptures testify of latter-day apostasy. I wish the Church didn't have so many black eyes, but what can I say, it just keeps giving itself black eyes. I truly and fervently wish the Church would stop it.
If Denver is a Pied Piper, then I could be victim. It's true. But right now, he's leading me to wake up and look to the Lord and not man. I have stopped my preoccupation with the Brethren -- my self-confessed idolatry. They don't claim anything more than what I've received and so why should I exalt them more than any other man?
If I am to be a victim, then I wonder what the result will be? Will Denver ask us to drink poisoned Koolaid, ala Jim Jones? Surely I won't fall for that one. Could I lose money by donating to the Temple fund? If I uproot and head to Zion, that would be a sacrifice and my non member family would think I'm nuts. But they think I'm nuts anyway for having joined the LDS Church 30 years ago.
I'm not sure how I can really be hurt negatively by trying to rely more on Jesus Christ and not on man?
At the end of the day, if I understand God's will for me, then I will be safe. Isn't that all any of us can do? At the end of the day, we must be plugged into the True Vine and we must do His will.
How can you be hurt negatively? By leaving the Lord's true church and abandoning your real, valid ordinances for a sham offered by a charlatan. That's how you can be hurt. And your family can be hurt by it too, because they will be affected by your choices.
And something else to consider which might help you determine truth. Do you know where Joseph Smith said that Zion, the New Jerusalem would be built? Jackson Country Missouri--it's in your scriptures unless the Scripture committee has removed those sections. So, if Denver Snuffer tries to get you to accept any other place as 'Zion' and wants you all to move there, then please recognize that he's breaking with Joseph Smith jr. and you should be very wary of his 'revelations' and not follow him to any supposed 'Zion' community.