CFR not bad?

For discussion of liberty, freedom, government and politics.
cayenne
captain of 100
Posts: 758

CFR not bad?

Post by cayenne »

I ran across this in the 1997 May Ensign

I always thought CFR and other such organizations were an abomination. Please help me understand this. The China thing does not make sense either. China needs to be spanked like Abraham did to King of Sodom, I don't understand the relations, Abraham did not have relations with Sodom, just very confused.

Here is from LDS.org may 97



Elder Donald L. Staheli
Of the Seventy

“Elder Donald L. Staheli Of the Seventy,” Ensign, May 1997, 107
Image

Having directed businesses in 57 countries on 6 continents, Elder Donald L. Staheli has broad international experience. “I hope the international experiences many of us are having will help us better understand and serve people in various cultures of our rapidly growing worldwide Church,” he says.

Born in Hurricane, Utah, on 19 October 1931, he married Afton Stratton on 24 September 1952 in the St. George Temple. He and his wife have 4 children and 11 grandchildren.

He received a B.S. at Utah State University and an M.S. and a Ph.D. at the University of Illinois and then served for two years as a first lieutenant in the U.S. Air Force.

His professional life began with Swift and Company in 1958 in Chicago. In 1969 he joined Allied Mills, Inc., where he held senior management positions, including president and CEO.

In 1977 he moved to New Canaan, Connecticut, to accept a position as executive vice president and director with Continental Grain Co., a large, private multinational agribusiness and financial services firm headquartered in New York City. In 1984 he became president and chief operating officer and in 1988 was named CEO, eventually becoming chairman of the board. He has served on several corporate boards.

He is currently chairman of the U.S.-China Business Council and a director of the National Committee on U.S.-China Relations and the U.S.-China Society. He served as chairman of an international business leaders advisory council for the mayor of Shanghai. He is a member of the council on foreign relations and is chairman of the Points of Light Foundation, a national organization that encourages volunteer activities.

At the time of his call to the Second Quorum of the Seventy, he was president of the Yorktown New York Stake. He has previously served as a high councilor and as a counselor in two stake presidencies and a bishopric.

“I’m grateful for my heritage,” Elder Staheli says. “My parents’ faith, reliance on prayer, and teachings in the home formed the foundation for my testimony. In addition, I’m deeply grateful for the opportunities I’ve had to serve and grow in the Church. I look forward to serving in my new calling.”

User avatar
BroJones
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 8247
Location: Varies.
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by BroJones »

He was released in Oct. 2006 and is no longer a General Authority:
Eight members of Seventy released
Published: Saturday, Oct. 7, 2006
Print | Email | Share
After serving five years or more in the Second Quorum of the Seventy, eight General Authorities were released Sept. 30.

Appreciation was expressed for the service of Elder Ronald T. Halverson, Elder Dale E. Miller, Elder H. Bryan Richards, Elder Donald L. Staheli, Elder David R. Stone, Elder H. Bruce Stucki, Elder Robert J. Whetten and Elder Richard H. Winkel.

cayenne
captain of 100
Posts: 758

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by cayenne »

So he was released, but why was he called in the first place.

If Hinckley appoints a CFR member to anything in the gospel, that tells me the CFR is a good holy organization, as well as the points of light.

Just confusing because I have heard so many NWO cfr conspiracies, but we follow our prophet, so they must not be bad organizations then?

In turn this really changes my outlook of a lot of conspiracies. I mean Hinckley had really good friends within the United Nations, so the UN must be ok then.

I feel kind of duped thinking of all these conspiracies when If I would just follow our prophet better, a lot of this would make better sense.

User avatar
clarkkent14
LBFOJ
Posts: 1973
Location: Southern Utah
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by clarkkent14 »

cayenne wrote:So he was released, but why was he called in the first place.
Why was Judas called?
cayenne wrote:If Hinckley appoints a CFR member to anything in the gospel, that tells me the CFR is a good holy organization, as well as the points of light.
The Lord is the head of the church, and He has his purposes, The Prophets and Apostles are men. They do all they can to follow the spirit of the Lord, and yet they are still mortal and fallible. The prophet doesn't know everything, Heavenly Father does. Also, not everyone in the CFR realizes what the purpose of it is. If they knew, they would cede their membership.
cayenne wrote:I feel kind of duped thinking of all these conspiracies when If I would just follow our prophet better, a lot of this would make better sense.
Follow the Prophet, don't worry about who is called to the Seventy... Follow the Prophet and the majority in the twelve. Remember The Gospel is perfect, not the members. Follow the prophet and what come from conference. Don't get caught up in so and so did this, or said this. I mean come on, the prophet called me on a mission. :wink:

cayenne
captain of 100
Posts: 758

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by cayenne »

Here is another thing.

I have been fed to believe China is like the big bad wolf, are they really?

I mean if we follow our prophet we are safe, I think I was getting too influened by conspiracies.

In the late 90's if memory serves, China on the hawaiian islands had some deal going on, and they rolled out the red carpet for Hinckley. These were some of the heads of China. Hinckley walked the red carpet, and accepted there gifts.

I know Abraham would not give or accept gifts of the Kings of Sodom.

So this inturn tells me China is not that bad, and they have enough righteousness within the leadership for Hinckley to accept gifts, etc.



It really changes my outlook. I remember a few years ago Hinckley said something about not expecting anything really big and bad to happen in the future. If I would have listened I would not have gotten off on all these WW3. China, Economic collaspe garbage. He said he expected nothing big to happen, so then it won't i suppose. (i paraphrased him, not exact what he said, but same idea.


Oh, and too add something. Monson gave gifts to Obama recently when they met. This tells me Obama cannot be as wicked as Kings of Sodom, it really makes me like Obam a better :)

User avatar
Original_Intent
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 13005

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Original_Intent »

If you haven't I recommend that your read The Naked Capitalist and/or Tragedy and Hope. I have not read the latter, but the former is a synopsis and review of T&H.

The people that are the real problem are the Round Table Groups and the people that set them up. The Round Table groups are an extremely small number of people that st up organizations like the CFR. With the CFR they seek to have members that will infiltrate EVERY group. However, I believe they view members of the CFR (whom the round Table group selects the membership) as potentials to enter the conspiracy. And certainly much of the bad things they do are done through organizations like the CFR. But I do not think that membership in the CFR in and of itself makes you part of the conspiracy. Rather, I think they select you on the basis of whether you are an influential person or not (especially in the realm of international affairs and policy, and also rather you would grant them leverage in another organization should you be accepted into the inner conspiracy.

So the fact that he was a GA and also a member of the CFR I think does not warrant comparisonsto Judas by any means. I think there are probably a lot of good and decent people who are general members of the CFR. Some are used, some are discarded, and occasionally, when they find someone who truly shows himself to be aligned with their purposes, they may be accepted into the inner, conspiratorial group. From my reading that is how I believe it works.

User avatar
Original_Intent
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 13005

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Original_Intent »

cayenne wrote:So he was released, but why was he called in the first place.

If Hinckley appoints a CFR member to anything in the gospel, that tells me the CFR is a good holy organization, as well as the points of light.

Just confusing because I have heard so many NWO cfr conspiracies, but we follow our prophet, so they must not be bad organizations then?

In turn this really changes my outlook of a lot of conspiracies. I mean Hinckley had really good friends within the United Nations, so the UN must be ok then.

I feel kind of duped thinking of all these conspiracies when If I would just follow our prophet better, a lot of this would make better sense.
Your logic is a little flawed. You are saying that because A is a member of B, then if A is a good person then the entire organization B is also by extension good?
President Benson was the U.S. Secretary of Agriculture, does that mean that the Dept of Agriculture had no graft and corruption, or by extension that that the U.S. government was, to use your words, a "good, holy organization"? And by extension ANY organization that ANY GA is a member of is automatically by virtue of said membership a good and holy organization. That's beyond a stretch, that is not well thought out.

cayenne
captain of 100
Posts: 758

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by cayenne »

Thx Original Intent

Ya, I can see where my logic is a little flawed with that on an organization level of many people. What about on a singular level

I still think though there must be hope for China because Hinckley accepted gifts and a red carpet ride from some of there high ups. I am just saying if Chinese leaders were really wicked, then he would not have accepted gifts from them.

Same with Obama. He is probably a pretty decent guy. I mean Monson can go and do the gift thing. If Obama was a really wicked man, ofcourse you would not be giving or receiving gifts from him, you would rebuke them like Abraham, or Elijah, or Jesus himself.

Seems like Obama is getting the short end of the stick. Monson would know right? I believe so. we don't think our leaders can lead us astray so Obama must be alright then :)

The concept that Obama is wicked, and Monson would just side step and appease that is rediculous. That is like saying you will bow to the wicked king Noah out of respect or custom. Uh uh .

It seems we are ok in Zion. The leaders know what is going on. They are not warning us because nothing big is going down. Instead of this idea the leaders know Obama and China are like the anti-christ's, but they are appeasing for now, or just not saying anything because we the lds people are not listening is dumb.

Prophets always warn the people period. This idea they are not warning us because we are dumb, and yet they will accept gifts from wicked men is rediculous. If the LDS leaders appease these supposedly wicked men, then the leaders are astray. Well, we know better than that.

So my conclusion is that Obama and some of the Chinese leaders are actually good men, that is why we are not being warned, nothing to warn about! ofcourse Monson and Obama should exchange gifts then, it is mutual respect for good men one to another!

User avatar
clarkkent14
LBFOJ
Posts: 1973
Location: Southern Utah
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by clarkkent14 »

Original_Intent wrote:So the fact that he was a GA and also a member of the CFR I think does not warrant comparisonsto Judas by any means.
Forgive me if I made it that sound that way... I was just asking a rhetorical question.
cayenne wrote:So he was released, but why was he called in the first place.
I was saying... not everyone that is called to a position in the Church will be righteous followers of Christ. Judas being the prime example, and he was called by The Lord himself. As for Bro. Staheli (pronounced Staley), I can't say anything. I know the Staheli family in St. George is very well known, and a good LDS family.

Sorry for the confusion... Clark

User avatar
Original_Intent
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 13005

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Original_Intent »

I would not say they are good men. But I also do not believe our church leaders are cravenly kow towing to wicked leaders in order to not rock the boat.

My suggestion, and it is only me own, is that many of the leaders are not completely wicked men like King Noah. Maybe they are not so far gone in wicked ways that they can still be reached and influenced for the good. that is one of many poossibilities. Another possibility is that we are approaching a time when the wicked will destroy the wicked. Think of the huge "entitlement class" that are soon not going to be able to get their welfare benefits as the dollar crashes and burns. They have been trained to hate the wealthy, many of whom are responsible for crashing the dollar. Is it unthinkable that the unrighteous thieves fromt he bottom will rise up against the unrighteous thieves at the top? Maybe we are meant to stand aside and stay above the fray? Another possibility that is almost a certainty is we do not know what all is going on behind the scenes, and we are not always meant to understand God's ways.

I strongly feel that saying "BYU gave this man this honor, therefore, that shows he must be a jsut and holy man." is not correct thinking.
I strongly feel that a prophet introducing a world leader and speaking only of the positive and not bringing up the wickedness does not equate to a seal of approval that we can judge "Oh, he must be a pretty good guy then."

You point out allt he examples of prophets that have called out world leaders as evil, and seem to think that the prophets are always required to do so or they are not filling their requirements. Wrong. Their requirement is to follow God's will. Jesus was often baited by those who wished to entrap Him into speaking out against Rome. Jesus always saw thru the deception and never took the bait. But by refusing to do so, I do not think the conclusion should be made that everyone should have just said "Oh, Rome must not bea ll that bad then."

User avatar
truthseeds
captain of 100
Posts: 924
Location: Utah
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by truthseeds »

So, all is well in Zion then? Whew! I was getting a little worried. Yes, interesting reason and logic here.

User avatar
2BFree
captain of 100
Posts: 762

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by 2BFree »

The Brethren know who REALLY is in control and also who the puppets are. The public "puppets" they interact with are only tools and they know this. Thus they have to play the PR game with them to show a cooperative face publicly. The Lord knows who the real sinister elements in the world are and He loves them just like everyone else. But He will not let them mess with His kingdom so as the true PTB start to show themselves we will see just how the Lord deals with such. BTW haven't you heard the saying "keep your friends close and your enemies closer"?

User avatar
creator
(of the Forum)
Posts: 8237
Location: The Matrix
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by creator »

Just because a Seventy happened to be in the CFR and Points of Light, doesn't mean those organizations are good or holy! that's absurd. Giving a calling to a man is not an endorsement of the non-Church groups he belongs to.

Ezra Taft Benson, through his endorsement of the Book "None Dare Call it Conspiracy" taught us that the CFR is part of the Secret Combinations. But that doesn't mean all CFR members are part of the combinations (Haven't you heard of the circles of power within those organizations?).

Anti-Socialist
captain of 10
Posts: 35

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Anti-Socialist »

It might just be, but who knows? I think that everyone who responded to this forum thread totally missed what cayenne is really implying here.. I dunno, maybe it is just me.

User avatar
creator
(of the Forum)
Posts: 8237
Location: The Matrix
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by creator »

Anti-Socialist wrote:It might just be, but who knows? I think that everyone who responded to this forum thread totally missed what cayenne is really implying here.. I dunno, maybe it is just me.
Cayenne's last response made the think she/he is either being sarcastic or is naively deceived and ignorant.

pritchet1
captain of 1,000
Posts: 3600

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by pritchet1 »

Did not Christ sit with the sinners and discuss matters with them? Was He not chastised for doing so? The premise is that good and holy persons participating in organizations, automatically make the organizations good and holy - Not!

User avatar
Mark
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 6929

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Mark »

This whole discussion is a good example of the need to find balance on our lives. We can go overboard on any point concerning conspiracy and become completely myopic and one sided on all things pertaining to that line of thinking if we are not careful. Some look at conspiracy and will find it in everything they see even if they have to create it for themselves. Others do not want to see conspiracy and ignore it at every turn. Balance is the key.

The Lord tells us that it is the nature and disposition of ALMOST all men, that as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, they will immediately begin to exercise unrighteous dominion. If we gratify our pride or vain ambitions and attempt to exercise compulsion or control on others in any degree of unrighteousness we open ourselves to the powers of darkness and lose the Spirit.

We are all susceptible to this sin. It can happen to us at any stage of life or circumstances that we find ourselves in. Do men who join organizations like the CFR have this problem? Of course they do. It is in their disposition. However we must be careful not to label all who join in that boat because of our belief in conspiracies. That is exercising unrighteous judgement on another individual. This would apply here in the case of Elder Staheli. Since we are not privy to his heart and He shows no bad fruits in his actions I would be very careful in throwing out determinations of his worthiness or his standing before God.

However having said that we must recognise those individuals who have denied the spirit and are attempting to exercise unrighteous dominion over others because of their supposed authority. Their attempts must be countered with standing for righteous principles and defending truth. That is our responsibility as Saints of God.

Scarecrow
captain of 100
Posts: 873

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Scarecrow »

My theory is that Staheli was a mole for the Church and he would gather intelligence so the Brethren would know what PTB were planning. :lol:

pritchet1
captain of 1,000
Posts: 3600

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by pritchet1 »

At least give them a 2nd witness, the Urim and Thummim being the first.

User avatar
Original_Intent
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 13005

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Original_Intent »

holyhabanero wrote:My theory is that Staheli was a mole for the Church and he would gather intelligence so the Brethren would know what PTB were planning. :lol:
:lol: :lol: :lol:

User avatar
ready2prepare
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1063
Location: Quitman, MS
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by ready2prepare »

Mark wrote:This whole discussion is a good example of the need to find
balance on our lives.
We can go overboard on any point concerning
conspiracy and become completely myopic and one sided on all things
pertaining to that line of thinking if we are not careful. Some look at
conspiracy and will find it in everything they see even if they have to
create it for themselves. Others do not want to see conspiracy and
ignore it at every turn. Balance is the key...

Amen, Mark! :D

...However having said that we must recognise those individuals
who have denied the spirit and are attempting to exercise
unrighteous dominion over others because of their supposed
authority. Their attempts must be countered with standing for
righteous principles and defending truth. That is our responsibility
as Saints of God.
The key word here is "responsibility." Taking an "all is well in Zion"
approach and expecting the Prophet to warn us about every little
detail (especially since we've been warned and warned again) is
simply a way of avoiding responsibility. It's a sign of spiritual
laziness and lethargy. (IMHO)

More on this subject here:
http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopi ... 610#p97610

Best Regards, :)
Sharon (Making the Best of Basics) in Mississippi

Helping people prepare for uncertain times ahead:
http://www.preparednessyellowpages.com
Last edited by ready2prepare on October 21st, 2009, 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Jason
Master of Puppets
Posts: 18296

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Jason »

Not everyone within the CFR is in the inner circle just like not every Mason is a 33 degree Mason with full knowledge and participation in the conspiracy.

These organizations try to attract decent folks to camouflage their other activities....

User avatar
BroJones
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 8247
Location: Varies.
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by BroJones »

Jason wrote:Not everyone within the CFR is in the inner circle just like not every Mason is a 33 degree Mason with full knowledge and participation in the conspiracy.

These organizations try to attract decent folks to camouflage their other activities....
Well said, Jason.
(And good to hear from you.)

User avatar
Jason
Master of Puppets
Posts: 18296

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by Jason »

DrJones wrote:
Jason wrote:Not everyone within the CFR is in the inner circle just like not every Mason is a 33 degree Mason with full knowledge and participation in the conspiracy.

These organizations try to attract decent folks to camouflage their other activities....
Well said, Jason.
(And good to hear from you.)
Thank you!

User avatar
ithink
captain of 1,000
Posts: 3206
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: CFR not bad?

Post by ithink »

Mark wrote:Balance is the key.
Isn't that the truth? However, balance could be equated with being lukewarm, so be sure that you are balanced, but not lukewarm -- meaning in practice you may withold for wisdom sake, but philosophically, there should be no holds barred and you should be openly seeking all truth from anywhere and everywhere.

Keep in mind that Satan took 1/3 of the host of heaven with him in deception. The deception was that he was a priesthood holder, and an important and prominent one at that. Many followed him because he "was my priesthood leader". How do I know this? I don't, but c'mon, how many would have followed a horned devil out of heaven? I would say not many. But many would follow their leader, dressed as he was.

I'm not suggesting choosing Staheli was a mistake, my point is it is a mistake to say that because a man is called to a position, everything he touched from top to bottom was gold -- and vice versa. That is faulty logic. The situation with BYU giving Cheney an honorary doctorate also shows us that.

Post Reply