Breaking the Rules

[iWriteStuff]

What if it became obvious that no amount of work, savings, or investments would ever be enough to insure a successful retirement?

What if we're only allowed to keep working long enough to outlive our usefulness and then we are discarded by society?

What if we are stuck in a system in which the rules are stacked against us and designed to keep us stuck in the system?

What if no matter what we do, there is a limit affixed to the degree of success we can experience in this life?

What if debt, taxes, and economic instability are tools meant to keep the working population in check?

Let's suppose for a minute that these questions can be answered in the affirmative.

Do you do anything different? Do you change the way you live? Do you defer enjoyment today for a hope of enjoyment in the future? Do you hope you can still beat the odds? Do you take matters into your own hands? If so, how? Or do you stay on the beaten track because "that's just what we do"?

How does one escape the trap of Babylon?

[Col. Flagg]

Live within your means, save some money for a rainy day if you can, be frugal and thrifty, avoid unnecessary debt, be conservative and don't trust the banks, Wall Street or government. For starters.

[Arenera]

What if it became obvious that no amount of work, savings, or investments would ever be enough to insure a successful retirement?

What if we're only allowed to keep working long enough to outlive our usefulness and then we are discarded by society?

What if we are stuck in a system in which the rules are stacked against us and designed to keep us stuck in the system?

What if no matter what we do, there is a limit affixed to the degree of success we can experience in this life?

What if debt, taxes, and economic instability are tools meant to keep the working population in check?

Let's suppose for a minute that these questions can be answered in the affirmative.

Do you do anything different? Do you change the way you live? Do you defer enjoyment today for a hope of enjoyment in the future? Do you hope you can still beat the odds? Do you take matters into your own hands? If so, how? Or do you stay on the beaten track because "that's just what we do"?

How does one escape the trap of Babylon?

Isn't that the point of our existence? To figure out that happiness does not come from Babylon, from the Telestial Kingdom.

Once that is understood, then focusing on Christ, His Gospel, following the Spirit, we can have happiness. Easily said, but we still battle because we are in the middle of Babylon and it is hard to let go.

[larsenb]

What if it became obvious that no amount of work, savings, or investments would ever be enough to insure a successful retirement?

What if we're only allowed to keep working long enough to outlive our usefulness and then we are discarded by society?

What if we are stuck in a system in which the rules are stacked against us and designed to keep us stuck in the system?

What if no matter what we do, there is a limit affixed to the degree of success we can experience in this life?

What if debt, taxes, and economic instability are tools meant to keep the working population in check?

Let's suppose for a minute that these questions can be answered in the affirmative.

Do you do anything different? Do you change the way you live? Do you defer enjoyment today for a hope of enjoyment in the future? Do you hope you can still beat the odds? Do you take matters into your own hands? If so, how? Or do you stay on the beaten track because "that's just what we do"?

How does one escape the trap of Babylon?

You head for Alaska and live a subsistence life style, a la: 'Life Below Zero' or Alaska: The Last Frontier.

[ajax]

What if it became obvious that no amount of work, savings, or investments would ever be enough to insure a successful retirement?

What if we're only allowed to keep working long enough to outlive our usefulness and then we are discarded by society?

What if we are stuck in a system in which the rules are stacked against us and designed to keep us stuck in the system?

What if no matter what we do, there is a limit affixed to the degree of success we can experience in this life?

What if debt, taxes, and economic instability are tools meant to keep the working population in check?

Let's suppose for a minute that these questions can be answered in the affirmative.

Do you do anything different? Do you change the way you live? Do you defer enjoyment today for a hope of enjoyment in the future? Do you hope you can still beat the odds? Do you take matters into your own hands? If so, how? Or do you stay on the beaten track because "that's just what we do"?

How does one escape the trap of Babylon?

What if we realized we live more comfortably with more goods and services available to us than any other generation in the history of the world?

[iWriteStuff]

What if it became obvious that no amount of work, savings, or investments would ever be enough to insure a successful retirement?

What if we're only allowed to keep working long enough to outlive our usefulness and then we are discarded by society?

What if we are stuck in a system in which the rules are stacked against us and designed to keep us stuck in the system?

What if no matter what we do, there is a limit affixed to the degree of success we can experience in this life?

What if debt, taxes, and economic instability are tools meant to keep the working population in check?

Let's suppose for a minute that these questions can be answered in the affirmative.

Do you do anything different? Do you change the way you live? Do you defer enjoyment today for a hope of enjoyment in the future? Do you hope you can still beat the odds? Do you take matters into your own hands? If so, how? Or do you stay on the beaten track because "that's just what we do"?

How does one escape the trap of Babylon?

What if we realized we live more comfortably with more goods and services available to us than any other generation in the history of the world?

No one would argue against that point. Babylon has gotten exceedingly fine in her old age.

[ajax]

Does comfort equal babylon?

Retirement is a relatively new idea, confined mostly to first world countries.

We be lucky.

[larsenb]

. . . . How does one escape the trap of Babylon?

What if we realized we live more comfortably with more goods and services available to us than any other generation in the history of the world?

No one would argue against that point. Babylon has gotten exceedingly fine in her old age.

But remember:

Doctrine and Covenants 1:16

16 They seek not the Lord to establish his righteousness, but every man walketh in his own way, and after the image of his own god, whose image is in the likeness of the world, and whose substance is that of an idol, which waxeth old and shall perish in Babylon, even Babylon the great, which shall fall.

Powerful scripture. I love it.

[iWriteStuff]

Does comfort equal babylon?

Retirement is a relatively new idea, confined mostly to first world countries.

We be lucky.

Life long debt is a fairly new idea, too. Even two generations ago it was standard to have one's house paid off in five years or less. Education was affordable, if not free, and people didn't spend 6-7 years paying for a car.

I'd hate to be 21, fresh off a mission, and looking at affording everything while starting with nothing. Without tremendous help, a man in such a position will spend the majority of his working life paying off things he received decades ago.

[marc]

How does one escape the trap of Babylon?

By trusting in the Lord for one's daily bread. I know this sounds vague and maybe even trite, but I am a witness that it is true. I used to own more than one business and lived very well. Through a series of events over the course of a couple of decades, I have little to nothing, and my circumstances are very humble and modest, but where I am today is the result of trusting in the Lord. For people like me, one ends up homeless until taken in to contribute with others. My wife and I, after having raised our adopted sons and then losing everything, now live with her elderly parents. We take care of them and they take care of us. It sounds much simpler than all the events that brought us under the same household, though. But it was a series of events, which the Lord had His hand in every step of the way. At this point, we're just waiting upon the Lord.

[ajax]

Does comfort equal babylon?

Retirement is a relatively new idea, confined mostly to first world countries.

We be lucky.

Life long debt is a fairly new idea, too. Even two generations ago it was standard to have one's house paid off in five years or less. Education was affordable, if not free, and people didn't spend 6-7 years paying for a car.

I'd hate to be 21, fresh off a mission, and looking at affording everything while starting with nothing. Without tremendous help, a man in such a position will spend the majority of his working life paying off things he received decades ago.

I blame this phenomenon on the FEDeral Reserve for it massive and unending credit expansion over the last 100 yrs.

[Sirocco]

I ain't retiring lol
I will have to work until I die
For now I work for me and the cat, so she doesn't starve.
After she goes it's me again. Maybe I'll get another one, but not when I am old or when I die the cat will eat me.

[iWriteStuff]

I ain't retiring lol
I will have to work until I die
For now I work for me and the cat, so she doesn't starve.
After she goes it's me again. Maybe I'll get another one, but not when I am old or when I die the cat will eat me.

So you're saying you are the cat's food storage?

Meow Mix sure looks different than I remember it

[David13]

Over the last 20 years I tried retirement.
It was far too boring to do.
I have to get out and have some work to do.
So as long as I can, I will work.
I know two men in their 80s, they both work.
Another in his 80s across the street usually works in his yard, firewood, something. The other day he said he vacuumed, washed the tables, and mopped the floor. "Look at that floor", he says, "it's cleaner than the floor at the Huntsman Cancer Center".
I certainly have to have something to keep the blood flowing.
dc

[iWriteStuff]

Over the last 20 years I tried retirement.
It was far too boring to do.
I have to get out and have some work to do.
So as long as I can, I will work.
I know two men in their 80s, they both work.
Another in his 80s across the street usually works in his yard, firewood, something. The other day he said he vacuumed, washed the tables, and mopped the floor. "Look at that floor", he says, "it's cleaner than the floor at the Huntsman Cancer Center".
I certainly have to have something to keep the blood flowing.
dc

I consider "retirement" to be defined as "the ability to do something other than what one has to do to pay the bills". It is not a permission slip to sit at home and watch reruns for the next 20 years. It is merely the ability to do what one wants to do rather than what one has to do.

For me, I hope some day to escape the daily grind.

[David13]

Over the last 20 years I tried retirement.
It was far too boring to do.
I have to get out and have some work to do.
So as long as I can, I will work.
I know two men in their 80s, they both work.
Another in his 80s across the street usually works in his yard, firewood, something. The other day he said he vacuumed, washed the tables, and mopped the floor. "Look at that floor", he says, "it's cleaner than the floor at the Huntsman Cancer Center".
I certainly have to have something to keep the blood flowing.
dc

I consider "retirement" to be defined as "the ability to do something other than what one has to do to pay the bills". It is not a permission slip to sit at home and watch reruns for the next 20 years. It is merely the ability to do what one wants to do rather than what one has to do.

For me, I hope some day to escape the daily grind.

I don't have a tv, so I sure don't watch any tv.
But I need a daily grind. Just sitting around trying to think of what I want to do is boring.
I still ride my motorcycle. Last two years I didn't get that many miles, but 3 years ago I had 15,000 miles on the bike over 90 days on the road. And still worked. So it was a good balance.

Doing nothing is a full time job.

What I want to do is work. I worked on a large building for a few years, and that was very rewarding when it was finished. And still had plenty of motorcycle riding along the way.

I guess it was never really a 'daily grind' for me.

I start Monday on 3 days a week. That will still give me plenty of time to sit around and do nothing.

I just been very fortunate.
dc

Maybe that's it. Work at something you like or enjoy to pay the bills.

[farmerchick]

I think if you decide to break the rules as it were and lived within or under your means, that you could break free from societal debt norms and live a perfectly happy existence. So the question I would ask is What if a person were to forgo all the luxuries and just stick to the necessities? Would anyone be able to keep you down? what If a person were to live happily in a condition that was beneath what he could actually afford? What if a person paid cash for a humble home that was livable and functional and was in good repair? What if a person had a good older economical model car that was cheap to drive and paid for? Does this mean other people would think less of you if you don't participate in the latest and greatest the world has to offer? What if you lived like no one else now so you could live like no one else later? I stole that from Dave Ramsey. Having money is something everyone would like, but not many are thoughtful enough to beat the system per say,restrain themselves from things they don't need or able to wrap their minds around real freedom. Debt free is really freedom. Those who pay interest don't understand it. Anybody can get into debt for education, housing, car, credit cards ect. That's easy. Only a few can be humble enough to be happy in the richest society the world has ever seen, with the best living conditions of all time, living within their means and creating a pattern of wealth that can have a ripple effect on your posterity. I know your questions are based on a theory of globalization and that the fix is in, which I do acknowledge does exist, but no one has to buy into it. You do have to plan around it.

[Sirocco]

I ain't retiring lol
I will have to work until I die
For now I work for me and the cat, so she doesn't starve.
After she goes it's me again. Maybe I'll get another one, but not when I am old or when I die the cat will eat me.

So you're saying you are the cat's food storage?

Meow Mix sure looks different than I remember it

It would seem that way.
When my finances get better I want to buy one of those emergency food boxes from Infowars or some site, my dad bought one, stuff lasts for like 25 years.
I am only 1 man and I am sure the cat would eat whatever if need be lol (except me, unless I am dead)

[Sirocco]

I think if you decide to break the rules as it were and lived within or under your means, that you could break free from societal debt norms and live a perfectly happy existence. So the question I would ask is What if a person were to forgo all the luxuries and just stick to the necessities? Would anyone be able to keep you down? what If a person were to live happily in a condition that was beneath what he could actually afford? What if a person paid cash for a humble home that was livable and functional and was in good repair? What if a person had a good older economical model car that was cheap to drive and paid for? Does this mean other people would think less of you if you don't participate in the latest and greatest the world has to offer? What if you lived like no one else now so you could live like no one else later? I stole that from Dave Ramsey. Having money is something everyone would like, but not many are thoughtful enough to beat the system per say,restrain themselves from things they don't need or able to wrap their minds around real freedom. Debt free is really freedom. Those who pay interest don't understand it. Anybody can get into debt for education, housing, car, credit cards ect. That's easy. Only a few can be humble enough to be happy in the richest society the world has ever seen, with the best living conditions of all time, living within their means and creating a pattern of wealth that can have a ripple effect on your posterity. I know your questions are based on a theory of globalization and that the fix is in, which I do acknowledge does exist, but no one has to buy into it. You d

I'd kill to have a humble home and an old car lol

[farmerchick]

[quote=farmerchick post_id=835101 time=1518068569 user_id=8525

I'd kill to have a humble home and an old car lol

You can have one..... plan the work... work the plan.

[Sirocco]

[quote=farmerchick post_id=835101 time=1518068569 user_id=8525

I'd kill to have a humble home and an old car lol

You can have one..... plan the work... work the plan.

Well, problem is with Canada is that we have like 5 places one can live and the housing market is insane in those places (our rural places are a mess and no jobs are there).
And I am a single guy on disability and the government upped the min wage so I all but lost my job.
All my money goes to my bills now.

[farmerchick]

I know its hard, but cutting your expenses and saving money is the only way to get ahead. If you want something bad enough, you will find a way.... maybe you eat at home and not out. Maybe you don't impulse buy things for a month... you know like sweets and pop..... maybe you find a roomie and cut your rent for awhile. Maybe you only save 50.00 a month.... still better than nothing. Saving money is a habit that is cultivated and grown over time and the act of saving money changes the character of the saver. It's really quite an amazing process. It's a good habit to have in any situation you find yourself in.

[Sirocco]

I know its hard, but cutting your expenses and saving money is the only way to get ahead. If you want something bad enough, you will find a way.... maybe you eat at home and not out. Maybe you don't impulse buy things for a month... you know like sweets and pop..... maybe you find a roomie and cut your rent for awhile. Maybe you only save 50.00 a month.... still better than nothing. Saving money is a habit that is cultivated and grown over time and the act of saving money changes the character of the saver. It's really quite an amazing process. It's a good habit to have in any situation you find yourself in.

Oh I already have a room mate... sort of (my brother is in the army, so he pays me but his things are my room mate).
It would take me decades to afford the houses where I live, the average being 500 000 (if I wanted to live in Toronto its 1 000 000).
Canada is insane.
Normal, not insane places one very could indeed build something like that for themselves.
I had to cut out my impulse spending and eating out since basically losing my job (my hatred for socialism and left wing politics only grows).

[marc]

For me, I hope some day to escape the daily grind.

Amen and amen!

[ajax]

For me, I hope some day to escape the daily grind.

Amen and amen!

The daily grind is ordained of heaven:

19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

What's that saying? It's the journey that matters, not the destination.