Among the gifts I received this Christmas, one from my wife and which is currently getting the most use so far, is a DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS Student Manual, Religion 324 and 325. I found a statement on Pg. 244, attributed to Brigham Young, that one interested in history, particularly American history might find interesting. (Discourses of Brigham Young, pp. 359-360) I reads so:
"In this view we consider that the men in the Revolution were inspired by the Almighty, to throw off the shackles of the mother government, with her established religion. For this cause were Adams, Jefferson, Franklin, Washington, and a host of others inspired to deeds of resistance to the acts of the King of Great Britain, who might also have been led to those aggressive acts, for aught we know, to bring to pass the purposes of God, in thus establishing a new government upon a principle of greater freedom, a basis of self-government allowing the free exercise of religious worship."
It is the words " the acts of the King of Great Britain, who might also have been led to those aggressive acts" that caught my attention. Once before I had read this suggestion, I forget where.
The American Declaration of Independence lists (by my count) 27 specific grievances attributed to King George III. I have for many years believed that God inspired the writing of the Declaration of Independence, but only recently has it occurred to me that King George and his "handlers"or advisers might have been inspired (by whom?) to initiate those "aggressive acts" which provided motivation and just cause for America colonists to " throw off the shackles of the mother government".
Was King George III Inspired? By Whom?
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lundbaek
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David13
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Re: Was King George III Inspired? By Whom?
I don't know.
But of course he could have been motivated by Satan.
However, was it not merely a characteristic of the colonial system? Did not the system provide that the colonies were just resources that were for the benefit of England and particularly the crown?
Those who lived in the colonies, the natives, were of no concern.
Those who had set up lives and families and so forth were sort of tools to further that colonial system.
And the whole independence idea was simply, why do we any longer need England and the king?
There was clearly divine inspiration on this side of the ocean, but on the other, rather than any specific evil intent, was it not merely the profit motive?
dc
But of course he could have been motivated by Satan.
However, was it not merely a characteristic of the colonial system? Did not the system provide that the colonies were just resources that were for the benefit of England and particularly the crown?
Those who lived in the colonies, the natives, were of no concern.
Those who had set up lives and families and so forth were sort of tools to further that colonial system.
And the whole independence idea was simply, why do we any longer need England and the king?
There was clearly divine inspiration on this side of the ocean, but on the other, rather than any specific evil intent, was it not merely the profit motive?
dc
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lundbaek
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 11123
- Location: Mesa, Arizona
Re: Was King George III Inspired? By Whom?
The way the statement is worded it might well have been just speculation on the part of Brigham Young that King George III might have been led to those aggressive acts.
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gardener4life
- captain of 1,000
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Re: Was King George III Inspired? By Whom?
It may have been that he was a type of King Noah. King Noah was a force of division because he was a predator and preying off his people rather than serve them. This is hidden skin deep beneath society, that any time you have a sick or wicked leader the people suffer. This is true for King George even though he didn't suffer a death like King Noah.
D&C 98:9
Doctrine and Covenants
Nevertheless, when the wicked rule the people mourn
Also Proverbs 29:2 quotes it a bit differently but also interesting.
It's interesting that people misquote that prophets sometimes cause division, but it's actually obedience and disobedience that cause division. The gulf between the tree of life and the great and spacious building for example. People are given a space of time to repent, so they mistakenly think the prophet causes division but its their own choices based on obedience that cause it.
Ultimately the wheat will be separated from the chaff. We want to be wheat. But the reason why its so hard to separate the wheat and the tares is that the tares are trying to live predator arrangements off the young tender wheat plants, wrapping around and strangling them as they grow. So in conclusion, rather than say King George was inspired, it's more like I think his downfall was assured before then by the French and Indian war years earlier. Part of the reason for why I think this is that with no competition in resources for the New World, (the British beat the Spanish, and then the French) they had gained the attitude of superiority and thought that none could stay them, thus they started to live off the people harshly, and more closely mirror being tyrants that they'd fought against.
Here's another thought, Nephi in vision sees the Gentile nations and that they are ruled over by the church of the Devil, though the people are good themselves among the poor and some among the middle class. (This is interesting because I hadn't noticed this before in quite this point of view. I have cut and pasted the verses below to illustrate this point. See below)
Also its interesting that the founding fathers discovered many truths about inspired government from the Iroquois. And where did the Iroqois get them? The Nephites fragmented ideas were embedded in Iroquois teaching of how to govern themselves.
Nephi seeing in vision the Gentile Nations. Its interesting that he sees that the Gentile Nations are part of the Great and Abominable Church. We can see this from correlating verses 8&9 with 4-6, and 13. 13 says the people of the Gentiles went out of captivity, while it shows the verses showing the Great and Abominable Church put them in captivity. Thus, it's interesting that we can see this because it also shows that many of the hardships that the descendants of Lehi went through happened because of the Great and Abominable Church (of the Devil) being in charge, rather than from the Gentiles themselves. (I don't think the common people hurt the Indians so much as the wicked leaders in Gentile Nations that were part of the Great and Abominable Church. I would try to explain this to Native Americans if I could because I think it would help heal some of the hurts they've received from their losses. And that it wasn't so much white people that was their enemy but the Church of the Devil and those that serve in it for the gains of verse 8. And verses 13 to 15) (The rest of Chapter 13 also shows that the Gentiles were given this land because they humbled themselves before God (verses 13 to 15 apply to this idea as well). And this is important because it shows what we need to start to prosper and become whole again as a people (verse 16!!!)
1 And it came to pass that the angel spake unto me, saying: Look! And I looked and beheld many nations and kingdoms.
2 And the angel said unto me: What beholdest thou? And I said: I behold many nations and kingdoms.
3 And he said unto me: These are the nations and kingdoms of the Gentiles.
4 And it came to pass that I saw among the nations of the Gentiles the formation of a great church.
5 And the angel said unto me: Behold the formation of a church which is most abominable above all other churches, which slayeth the saints of God, yea, and tortureth them and bindeth them down, and yoketh them with a yoke of iron, and bringeth them down into captivity.
6 And it came to pass that I beheld this great and abominable church; and I saw the devil that he was the founder of it.
7 And I also saw gold, and silver, and silks, and scarlets, and fine-twined linen, and all manner of precious clothing; and I saw many harlots.
8 And the angel spake unto me, saying: Behold the gold, and the silver, and the silks, and the scarlets, and the fine-twined linen, and the precious clothing, and the harlots, are the desires of this great and abominable church.
9 And also for the praise of the world do they destroy the saints of God, and bring them down into captivity.
10 And it came to pass that I looked and beheld many waters; and they divided the Gentiles from the seed of my brethren.
11 And it came to pass that the angel said unto me: Behold the wrath of God is upon the seed of thy brethren.
12 And I looked and beheld a man among the Gentiles, who was separated from the seed of my brethren by the many waters; and I beheld the Spirit of God, that it came down and wrought upon the man; and he went forth upon the many waters, even unto the seed of my brethren, who were in the promised land.
13 And it came to pass that I beheld the Spirit of God, that it wrought upon other Gentiles; and they went forth out of captivity, upon the many waters.
14 And it came to pass that I beheld many multitudes of the Gentiles upon the land of promise; and I beheld the wrath of God, that it was upon the seed of my brethren; and they were scattered before the Gentiles and were smitten. (In other places the Lord tells the descendants of Lehi he will give them back their blessings when they humble themselves before him and come back to him.)
15 And I beheld the Spirit of the Lord, that it was upon the Gentiles, and they did prosper and obtain the land for their inheritance; and I beheld that they were white, and exceedingly fair and beautiful, like unto my people before they were slain.
16 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, beheld that the Gentiles who had gone forth out of captivity did humble themselves before the Lord; and the power of the Lord was with them.
Also you can correlate how this happened with King Noah, why King George lost this land, what happened to the Nephites, the descendants of Lehi, and what's happening to us now and why we're suffering as a country with 2 Nephi Chapter 1.
2 Nephi 1; 5 But, said he, notwithstanding our afflictions, we have obtained a land of promise, a land which is choice above all other lands; a land which the Lord God hath covenanted with me should be a land for the inheritance of my seed. Yea, the Lord hath covenanted this land unto me, and to my children forever, and also all those who should be led out of other countries by the hand of the Lord.
6 Wherefore, I, Lehi, prophesy according to the workings of the Spirit which is in me, that there shall none come into this land save they shall be brought by the hand of the Lord.
7 Wherefore, this land is consecrated unto him whom he shall bring. And if it so be that they shall serve him according to the commandments which he hath given, it shall be a land of liberty unto them; wherefore, they shall never be brought down into captivity; if so, it shall be because of iniquity; for if iniquity shall abound cursed shall be the land for their sakes, but unto the righteous it shall be blessed forever.
9 Wherefore, I, Lehi, have obtained a promise, that inasmuch as those whom the Lord God shall bring out of the land of Jerusalem shall keep his commandments, they shall prosper upon the face of this land; and they shall be kept from all other nations, that they may possess this land unto themselves. And if it so be that they shall keep his commandments they shall be blessed upon the face of this land, and there shall be none to molest them, nor to take away the land of their inheritance; and they shall dwell safely forever.
10 But behold, when the time cometh that they shall dwindle in unbelief, after they have received so great blessings from the hand of the Lord—having a knowledge of the creation of the earth, and all men, knowing the great and marvelous works of the Lord from the creation of the world; having power given them to do all things by faith; having all the commandments from the beginning, and having been brought by his infinite goodness into this precious land of promise—behold, I say, if the day shall come that they will reject the Holy One of Israel, the true Messiah, their Redeemer and their God, behold, the judgments of him that is just shall rest upon them.
11 Yea, he will bring other nations unto them, and he will give unto them power, and he will take away from them the lands of their possessions, and he will cause them to be scattered and smitten.
2 Nephi 10:11 And this land shall be a land of liberty unto the Gentiles, and there shall be no kings upon the land, who shall raise up unto the Gentiles.
D&C 98:9
Doctrine and Covenants
Nevertheless, when the wicked rule the people mourn
Also Proverbs 29:2 quotes it a bit differently but also interesting.
It's interesting that people misquote that prophets sometimes cause division, but it's actually obedience and disobedience that cause division. The gulf between the tree of life and the great and spacious building for example. People are given a space of time to repent, so they mistakenly think the prophet causes division but its their own choices based on obedience that cause it.
Ultimately the wheat will be separated from the chaff. We want to be wheat. But the reason why its so hard to separate the wheat and the tares is that the tares are trying to live predator arrangements off the young tender wheat plants, wrapping around and strangling them as they grow. So in conclusion, rather than say King George was inspired, it's more like I think his downfall was assured before then by the French and Indian war years earlier. Part of the reason for why I think this is that with no competition in resources for the New World, (the British beat the Spanish, and then the French) they had gained the attitude of superiority and thought that none could stay them, thus they started to live off the people harshly, and more closely mirror being tyrants that they'd fought against.
Here's another thought, Nephi in vision sees the Gentile nations and that they are ruled over by the church of the Devil, though the people are good themselves among the poor and some among the middle class. (This is interesting because I hadn't noticed this before in quite this point of view. I have cut and pasted the verses below to illustrate this point. See below)
Also its interesting that the founding fathers discovered many truths about inspired government from the Iroquois. And where did the Iroqois get them? The Nephites fragmented ideas were embedded in Iroquois teaching of how to govern themselves.
Nephi seeing in vision the Gentile Nations. Its interesting that he sees that the Gentile Nations are part of the Great and Abominable Church. We can see this from correlating verses 8&9 with 4-6, and 13. 13 says the people of the Gentiles went out of captivity, while it shows the verses showing the Great and Abominable Church put them in captivity. Thus, it's interesting that we can see this because it also shows that many of the hardships that the descendants of Lehi went through happened because of the Great and Abominable Church (of the Devil) being in charge, rather than from the Gentiles themselves. (I don't think the common people hurt the Indians so much as the wicked leaders in Gentile Nations that were part of the Great and Abominable Church. I would try to explain this to Native Americans if I could because I think it would help heal some of the hurts they've received from their losses. And that it wasn't so much white people that was their enemy but the Church of the Devil and those that serve in it for the gains of verse 8. And verses 13 to 15) (The rest of Chapter 13 also shows that the Gentiles were given this land because they humbled themselves before God (verses 13 to 15 apply to this idea as well). And this is important because it shows what we need to start to prosper and become whole again as a people (verse 16!!!)
1 And it came to pass that the angel spake unto me, saying: Look! And I looked and beheld many nations and kingdoms.
2 And the angel said unto me: What beholdest thou? And I said: I behold many nations and kingdoms.
3 And he said unto me: These are the nations and kingdoms of the Gentiles.
4 And it came to pass that I saw among the nations of the Gentiles the formation of a great church.
5 And the angel said unto me: Behold the formation of a church which is most abominable above all other churches, which slayeth the saints of God, yea, and tortureth them and bindeth them down, and yoketh them with a yoke of iron, and bringeth them down into captivity.
6 And it came to pass that I beheld this great and abominable church; and I saw the devil that he was the founder of it.
7 And I also saw gold, and silver, and silks, and scarlets, and fine-twined linen, and all manner of precious clothing; and I saw many harlots.
8 And the angel spake unto me, saying: Behold the gold, and the silver, and the silks, and the scarlets, and the fine-twined linen, and the precious clothing, and the harlots, are the desires of this great and abominable church.
9 And also for the praise of the world do they destroy the saints of God, and bring them down into captivity.
10 And it came to pass that I looked and beheld many waters; and they divided the Gentiles from the seed of my brethren.
11 And it came to pass that the angel said unto me: Behold the wrath of God is upon the seed of thy brethren.
12 And I looked and beheld a man among the Gentiles, who was separated from the seed of my brethren by the many waters; and I beheld the Spirit of God, that it came down and wrought upon the man; and he went forth upon the many waters, even unto the seed of my brethren, who were in the promised land.
13 And it came to pass that I beheld the Spirit of God, that it wrought upon other Gentiles; and they went forth out of captivity, upon the many waters.
14 And it came to pass that I beheld many multitudes of the Gentiles upon the land of promise; and I beheld the wrath of God, that it was upon the seed of my brethren; and they were scattered before the Gentiles and were smitten. (In other places the Lord tells the descendants of Lehi he will give them back their blessings when they humble themselves before him and come back to him.)
15 And I beheld the Spirit of the Lord, that it was upon the Gentiles, and they did prosper and obtain the land for their inheritance; and I beheld that they were white, and exceedingly fair and beautiful, like unto my people before they were slain.
16 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, beheld that the Gentiles who had gone forth out of captivity did humble themselves before the Lord; and the power of the Lord was with them.
Also you can correlate how this happened with King Noah, why King George lost this land, what happened to the Nephites, the descendants of Lehi, and what's happening to us now and why we're suffering as a country with 2 Nephi Chapter 1.
2 Nephi 1; 5 But, said he, notwithstanding our afflictions, we have obtained a land of promise, a land which is choice above all other lands; a land which the Lord God hath covenanted with me should be a land for the inheritance of my seed. Yea, the Lord hath covenanted this land unto me, and to my children forever, and also all those who should be led out of other countries by the hand of the Lord.
6 Wherefore, I, Lehi, prophesy according to the workings of the Spirit which is in me, that there shall none come into this land save they shall be brought by the hand of the Lord.
7 Wherefore, this land is consecrated unto him whom he shall bring. And if it so be that they shall serve him according to the commandments which he hath given, it shall be a land of liberty unto them; wherefore, they shall never be brought down into captivity; if so, it shall be because of iniquity; for if iniquity shall abound cursed shall be the land for their sakes, but unto the righteous it shall be blessed forever.
9 Wherefore, I, Lehi, have obtained a promise, that inasmuch as those whom the Lord God shall bring out of the land of Jerusalem shall keep his commandments, they shall prosper upon the face of this land; and they shall be kept from all other nations, that they may possess this land unto themselves. And if it so be that they shall keep his commandments they shall be blessed upon the face of this land, and there shall be none to molest them, nor to take away the land of their inheritance; and they shall dwell safely forever.
10 But behold, when the time cometh that they shall dwindle in unbelief, after they have received so great blessings from the hand of the Lord—having a knowledge of the creation of the earth, and all men, knowing the great and marvelous works of the Lord from the creation of the world; having power given them to do all things by faith; having all the commandments from the beginning, and having been brought by his infinite goodness into this precious land of promise—behold, I say, if the day shall come that they will reject the Holy One of Israel, the true Messiah, their Redeemer and their God, behold, the judgments of him that is just shall rest upon them.
11 Yea, he will bring other nations unto them, and he will give unto them power, and he will take away from them the lands of their possessions, and he will cause them to be scattered and smitten.
2 Nephi 10:11 And this land shall be a land of liberty unto the Gentiles, and there shall be no kings upon the land, who shall raise up unto the Gentiles.
