Some Red Flags regarding Brazil and Sealed Portion

[SJR3t2]

https://seekingyhwh.com/2017/11/15/some ... d-portion/

[inho]

This is the first time I hear of this group. It is astonishing, how many different Mormon sects exist.

[SJR3t2]

I've heard hundreds of Mormon sects, possibly up to 500.

[creator]

Apparently there are a lot of RLDS that are believing these claims about Moroni appearing to a man in Brazil (Mauricio Berger) and giving him the Book of Mormon gold plates, sword of Laban, and the interpreters. Several are testifying that the Spirit has witnessed to them the truthfulness of these things. Joseph Frederick Smith, the great-grandson of Joseph Smith, believes it.

Source: Video where some of the details are discussed and some people testify about their belief in the Brazil plates: http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/109386345

Other related:
https://thecauseofzion.org/ (pro Brazil plates)
http://restorationbookstore.org/ (anti Brazil plates)

Thoughts?

[nightlight]

"What we've got here is failure to communicate. Some men you just can't reach. So you get what we had here last week, which is the way he wants it. Well, he gets it. I don't like it any more than you men."

[On The Fringe]

Mid-March Price Publishing released a document about all of this mess. A few friends of mine were involved in this but quickly backed out. In a day or two I can supply more information for you all to pray about to know this is a fraud - even if those involved themselves don't know that it is. I don't have much time nowadays but here is a 50 page document on this subject proving his claims false.

File is too large to attach here's a link:

https://restorationbookstore.org/Brazil ... d_v2-3.pdf

[The Airbender]

Apparently there are a lot of RLDS that are believing these claims about Moroni appearing to a man in Brazil (Mauricio Berger) and giving him the Book of Mormon gold plates, sword of Laban, and the interpreters. Several are testifying that the Spirit has witnessed to them the truthfulness of these things. Joseph Frederick Smith, the great-grandson of Joseph Smith, believes it.

Source: Video where some of the details are discussed and some people testify about their belief in the Brazil plates: http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/109386345

Other related:
https://thecauseofzion.org/ (pro Brazil plates)
http://restorationbookstore.org/ (anti Brazil plates)

Thoughts?

My thoughts, which I have already posted elsewhere, are that these are genuine. I read the book once and am now reading through and looking up the cross references as I go. I'm not quite there yet, but I am getting to the point that I believe if this work is false, then my testimony of the original Book of Mormon is invalid as it was gained in the same way.

I read the Price letter which is completely against the whole thing and I recognized patterns of the Adversary the same as I see in other anti-Mormon literature. It has a sort of sickening spirit that completely avoids the actual meat of the discussion but sidesteps with a bunch of logical fallacies.

I only share because... well, why does anyone share anything they believe? I am try and get a hold of Joseph Frederick Smith. They claim Moroni ordained Mauricio to the High Priesthood and Mauricio then ordained Joseph, who then may have ordained Mauricio anew, in the way Joseph and Oliver had done? If they have it, I want it

Perhaps everyone will think me nuts and disbelieve anything else I write, but... well, that's life, eh?

[Rumpelstiltskin]

Mid-March Price Publishing released a document about all of this mess. A few friends of mine were involved in this but quickly backed out. In a day or two I can supply more information for you all to pray about to know this is a fraud - even if those involved themselves don't know that it is. I don't have much time nowadays but here is a 50 page document on this subject proving his claims false.

File is too large to attach here's a link:

https://restorationbookstore.org/Brazil ... d_v2-3.pdf

Having correct knowledge eliminates the need to even consider this falsehood. When a person knows and understands the correct order through which Heavenly Father reveals his will, he won't be deceived by such a spurious claim.

Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.
(Amos 3:7)

[The Airbender]

I have yet to meet another person (other than our B.) who was willing to read the thing, rather than rely on what someone else has said.

[simpleton]

Apparently there are a lot of RLDS that are believing these claims about Moroni appearing to a man in Brazil (Mauricio Berger) and giving him the Book of Mormon gold plates, sword of Laban, and the interpreters. Several are testifying that the Spirit has witnessed to them the truthfulness of these things. Joseph Frederick Smith, the great-grandson of Joseph Smith, believes it.

Source: Video where some of the details are discussed and some people testify about their belief in the Brazil plates: http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/109386345

Other related:
https://thecauseofzion.org/ (pro Brazil plates)
http://restorationbookstore.org/ (anti Brazil plates)

Thoughts?

My thoughts, which I have already posted elsewhere, are that these are genuine. I read the book once and am now reading through and looking up the cross references as I go. I'm not quite there yet, but I am getting to the point that I believe if this work is false, then my testimony of the original Book of Mormon is invalid as it was gained in the same way.

I read the Price letter which is completely against the whole thing and I recognized patterns of the Adversary the same as I see in other anti-Mormon literature. It has a sort of sickening spirit that completely avoids the actual meat of the discussion but sidesteps with a bunch of logical fallacies.

I only share because... well, why does anyone share anything they believe? I am try and get a hold of Joseph Frederick Smith. They claim Moroni ordained Mauricio to the High Priesthood and Mauricio then ordained Joseph, who then may have ordained Mauricio anew, in the way Joseph and Oliver had done? If they have it, I want it

Perhaps everyone will think me nuts and disbelieve anything else I write, but... well, that's life, eh?

To each his own, but there is no end to claims of being spiritually enlightened. "The spirit testified this" and "the spirit testified that". And on down the rabbit hole we go. People use " I feel the Spirit" so loosely today that I think that most that claim it, dont even know what the Spirit of God truly is. I dont think Moroni appeared to that feller at all, but if there actually was any appearing it was a "familiar spirit", a familiar spirit that knows Moroni very well and unless a person truly does have the spirit of discernment he can in nowise detect it.
Now as far as receiving another record, sorry, but we have not even begun to live up the the BofM. And God is going to bless us with more? I dont believe it for love nor money. We are condemned for not even living up to the BofM. And until we do God will not bless us with any more of His word. In fact He said He will even take away that which we do have...

[Contemplator]

I know there are certain topics and people that are controversial around here. But, It appears that someone else has read it. Not that he is the arbiter of revelation, but he suggests some worthwhile questions.

[Rumpelstiltskin]

I have yet to meet another person (other than our B.) who was willing to read the thing, rather than rely on what someone else has said.

Why read it when it does not come through the proper order in which God reveals something of such major significance? Simply judging it based on this, the prima facia evidence is that it is false. There's no need to read it.

[thestock]

I have yet to meet another person (other than our B.) who was willing to read the thing, rather than rely on what someone else has said.

Why read it when it does not come through the proper order in which God reveals something of such major significance? Simply judging it based on this, the prima facia evidence is that it is false. There's no need to read it.

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

[setyourselffree]

I have yet to meet another person (other than our B.) who was willing to read the thing, rather than rely on what someone else has said.

Why read it when it does not come through the proper order in which God reveals something of such major significance? Simply judging it based on this, the prima facia evidence is that it is false. There's no need to read it.

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

Are you saying the Pharisee's had the truth?

[thestock]

I have yet to meet another person (other than our B.) who was willing to read the thing, rather than rely on what someone else has said.

Why read it when it does not come through the proper order in which God reveals something of such major significance? Simply judging it based on this, the prima facia evidence is that it is false. There's no need to read it.

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

Are you saying the Pharisee's had the truth?

Sure they had the truth. They weren't willing to accept that they didnt have a monopoly on it.

[setyourselffree]

Why read it when it does not come through the proper order in which God reveals something of such major significance? Simply judging it based on this, the prima facia evidence is that it is false. There's no need to read it.

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

Are you saying the Pharisee's had the truth?

Sure they had the truth. They weren't willing to accept that they didnt have a monopoly on it.

I thought Jesus came to restore things. It was my understanding the Jews at the time had the truth taken away. Maybe I am wrong though.

[thestock]

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

Are you saying the Pharisee's had the truth?

Sure they had the truth. They weren't willing to accept that they didnt have a monopoly on it.

I thought Jesus came to restore things. It was my understanding the Jews at the time had the truth taken away. Maybe I am wrong though.

To me, truth isnt a tangible object like a TV remote.....that either you are in possession of it or you aren't. Truth describes any scientific fact that can be backed up with data or any doctrinal truth that is communicated by the Spirit. The Pharisees believed in the resurrection of the dead.....which is truth. What they didnt believe was that the Messiah could be a non-political leader that preached love and tolerance instead of isolationism and freedom. They stumbled because they didnt consider that sometimes God can work in ways that are mysterious to us with all our creeds and traditions and cultures.....and I suspect the same is true today.

[Rumpelstiltskin]

I have yet to meet another person (other than our B.) who was willing to read the thing, rather than rely on what someone else has said.

Why read it when it does not come through the proper order in which God reveals something of such major significance? Simply judging it based on this, the prima facia evidence is that it is false. There's no need to read it.

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

The preachers in Joseph Smith's day were all completely dead wrong, so the truth cut them to the very center. If what I have written you consider to be false, then the scriptures are also false because they say, "Surely the Lord God will do nothing except he revealeth his secrets unto his servants the prophets," and not to some person in the outback who does not have the keys or the rights to being a seer. That is the key: there is only one seer on the earth who holds all the keys. This is where correct knowledge comes in. This is the order through which God gives revelation. Since this spurious document came outside those channels, then there is absolutely no reason to read this. It will be used by Satan to distract and deceive those whose knowledge and/or testimony of the Gospel are weak.

[thestock]

I have yet to meet another person (other than our B.) who was willing to read the thing, rather than rely on what someone else has said.

Why read it when it does not come through the proper order in which God reveals something of such major significance? Simply judging it based on this, the prima facia evidence is that it is false. There's no need to read it.

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

The preachers in Joseph Smith's day were all completely dead wrong, so the truth cut them to the very center. If what I have written you consider to be false, then the scriptures are also false because they say, "Surely the Lord God will do nothing except he revealeth his secrets unto his servants the prophets," and not to some person in the outback who does not have the keys or the rights to being a seer. That is the key: there is only one seer on the earth who holds all the keys. This is where correct knowledge comes in. This is the order through which God gives revelation. Since this spurious document came outside those channels, then there is absolutely no reason to read this. It will be used by Satan to distract and deceive those whose knowledge and/or testimony of the Gospel are weak.

Hey no disrespect. I haven't looked into the claims and more than likely they are false. But consider what you sound like. You act like you know all of God's truths, as if they are all revealed and God is bound to operate based on what you know about him. I can see the preachers in Joseph's day saying "some stupid farm boy doesnt have the authority to claim visions and new scriptures" etc. The Pharisees in Christ's time thought they had a pretty good idea of what kind of Messiah God would send to them, and they werent willing to accept that maybe what they thought was wrong. If God wanted to unseal more scriptures to the Earth, and he had a chosen vessel ready to perform the work.....do you really think he'd give a damn what you have to say about it and that the work must be done by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? A church that has 14 million people in a world of 7 billion of his children? Has it crossed your mind that the Mormon people are mostly a product of Babylon by now? And that perhaps we've lost the gift. Have you read in 3 Nephi were it shows how the gentiles will be destroyed, and only a righteous few will gather with the remnant of Jacob to establish Zion?

[shadow]

Why read it when it does not come through the proper order in which God reveals something of such major significance? Simply judging it based on this, the prima facia evidence is that it is false. There's no need to read it.

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

The preachers in Joseph Smith's day were all completely dead wrong, so the truth cut them to the very center. If what I have written you consider to be false, then the scriptures are also false because they say, "Surely the Lord God will do nothing except he revealeth his secrets unto his servants the prophets," and not to some person in the outback who does not have the keys or the rights to being a seer. That is the key: there is only one seer on the earth who holds all the keys. This is where correct knowledge comes in. This is the order through which God gives revelation. Since this spurious document came outside those channels, then there is absolutely no reason to read this. It will be used by Satan to distract and deceive those whose knowledge and/or testimony of the Gospel are weak.

Hey no disrespect. I haven't looked into the claims and more than likely they are false. But consider what you sound like. You act like you know all of God's truths, as if they are all revealed and God is bound to operate based on what you know about him. I can see the preachers in Joseph's day saying "some stupid farm boy doesnt have the authority to claim visions and new scriptures" etc. The Pharisees in Christ's time thought they had a pretty good idea of what kind of Messiah God would send to them, and they werent willing to accept that maybe what they thought was wrong. If God wanted to unseal more scriptures to the Earth, and he had a chosen vessel ready to perform the work.....do you really think he'd give a damn what you have to say about it and that the work must be done by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? A church that has 14 million people in a world of 7 billion of his children? Has it crossed your mind that the Mormon people are mostly a product of Babylon by now? And that perhaps we've lost the gift. Have you read in 3 Nephi were it shows how the gentiles will be destroyed, and only a righteous few will gather with the remnant of Jacob to establish Zion?

It's interesting that you point out just how small the church is and then you follow up with saying only a few of the gentiles will gather to build Zion. It's pretty easy to connect the dots.

As far as this topic- people will believe the darndest things that aren't true. Itching ear syndrome.

[thestock]

Spoken like a true Pharisee. I'm sure the preachers in Joseph Smith's day felt the same way...

The preachers in Joseph Smith's day were all completely dead wrong, so the truth cut them to the very center. If what I have written you consider to be false, then the scriptures are also false because they say, "Surely the Lord God will do nothing except he revealeth his secrets unto his servants the prophets," and not to some person in the outback who does not have the keys or the rights to being a seer. That is the key: there is only one seer on the earth who holds all the keys. This is where correct knowledge comes in. This is the order through which God gives revelation. Since this spurious document came outside those channels, then there is absolutely no reason to read this. It will be used by Satan to distract and deceive those whose knowledge and/or testimony of the Gospel are weak.

Hey no disrespect. I haven't looked into the claims and more than likely they are false. But consider what you sound like. You act like you know all of God's truths, as if they are all revealed and God is bound to operate based on what you know about him. I can see the preachers in Joseph's day saying "some stupid farm boy doesnt have the authority to claim visions and new scriptures" etc. The Pharisees in Christ's time thought they had a pretty good idea of what kind of Messiah God would send to them, and they werent willing to accept that maybe what they thought was wrong. If God wanted to unseal more scriptures to the Earth, and he had a chosen vessel ready to perform the work.....do you really think he'd give a damn what you have to say about it and that the work must be done by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? A church that has 14 million people in a world of 7 billion of his children? Has it crossed your mind that the Mormon people are mostly a product of Babylon by now? And that perhaps we've lost the gift. Have you read in 3 Nephi were it shows how the gentiles will be destroyed, and only a righteous few will gather with the remnant of Jacob to establish Zion?

It's interesting that you point out just how small the church is and then you follow up with saying only a few of the gentiles will gather to build Zion. It's pretty easy to connect the dots.

As far as this topic- people will believe the darndest things that aren't true. Itching ear syndrome.

Yes that's not lost on me....but what is interesting is it doesnt say that the Remnant of Jacob will gather with the righteous few gentiles. It basically says the gentiles will be destroyed and the Remnant will be among them like a lion that treadeth down and none can deliver and that the righteous few gentiles will be permitted to tarry with them. In other words....it seems like God has a work that will mainly be done by a different group of people and we will join in to help rather than we lead the work and they join in to help. Interesting to consider either way!

[shadow]

The promises of old regarding who will preach the gospel and to whom the gospel will be preached is set, according to the scriptures. At some point soon, the gospel won't be preached to the west, or the gentiles, and it will go to the jews. The gentile nations will outright reject the Gospel. It will in some way begin to be accepted by the Jews, but not by many. Christ himself will come to them (physically saving them from the army's that are attacking them) and then they will see him for who he is. The jews won't get another new restoration, the already restored church will take it to them. On that token, I found Pres. Nelson's "hinge" comment in Rome interesting.

There will not be another restoration. The Priesthood will not be restored again. What began with Joseph Smith will continue uninterrupted. The church holds the keys. They will not lose them.

[thestock]

The promises of old regarding who will preach the gospel and to whom the gospel will be preached is set, according to the scriptures. At some point soon, the gospel won't be preached to the west, or the gentiles, and it will go to the jews. The gentile nations will outright reject the Gospel. It will in some way begin to be accepted by the Jews, but not by many. Christ himself will come to them (physically saving them from the army's that are attacking them) and then they will see him for who he is. The jews won't get another new restoration, the already restored church will take it to them. On that token, I found Pres. Nelson's "hinge" comment in Rome interesting.

There will not be another restoration. The Priesthood will not be restored again. What began with Joseph Smith will continue uninterrupted. The church holds the keys. They will not lose them.

I dont disagree. I dont think the Church loses the keys and it will remain until Christ returns....but I also dont think that the Church has a monopoly on truth. If God reveals a truth to another people at some point, and that truth becomes revealed to us....we will either need accept it or reject it (hopefully having the Spirit to discern). Its hard for me to imagine that when someone is called to translate the sealed portion, that this call will be generated within the church behind a closed door the way we give out callings. Something like that always has a divine hand guiding it along, not a council of men that give it a sustaining vote.