LDS Church plans to decrease missions; utilize tech savviness to locate religious-minded people

[DEEPER storm]

Five years after the age changes, with missionaries spread throughout more than 400 missions, the Church will be implementing reductions to achieve an overall number “that better fits the total number of missionaries and the needs of each region,” according to Mormon Newsroom.
https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865 ... eople.html

[EmmaLee]

viewtopic.php?p=815844#p815844

[Silver Pie]

Interesting. I wonder what the results/consequences of this will be.

[Sirocco]

Hard to get to the next generation when way more of them live in apartments.

[EmmaLee]

viewtopic.php?p=815844#p815844

There was another previous thread (see link above) on this exact topic - maybe they could be combined?

[DEEPER storm]

The LDS Church announced plans Friday, Oct. 20, to trim its number of missions, to replace the use of tablets in missions with smartphones and to increase the use of technology to help find people interested in religion. This will impact missionaries across the globe, including those receiving instruction at the Provo Missionary Training Center

[Fiannan]

Maybe with the plummeting LDS birthrate we will see the introduction of robot missionaries in 20 years.

[Spaced_Out]

It is the beginning of the missionary withdrawal prior to the tribulations, The hastening has now finished. It is all going as planned... Not long now and earthquakes will start and the meteorite bombardment.

88:72 Behold, and lo, I will take care of your flocks, and will raise up elders and send unto them.
73 Behold, I will hasten my work in its time....
87 For not many days hence and the earth shall tremble and reel to and fro as a drunken man; and the sun shall hide his face, and shall refuse to give light; and the moon shall be bathed in blood; and the stars shall become exceedingly angry, and shall cast themselves down as a fig that falleth from off a fig tree.
88 And after your testimony cometh wrath and indignation upon the people.
89 For after your testimony cometh the testimony of earthquakes, that shall cause groanings in the midst of her, and men shall fall upon the ground and shall not be able to stand.
90 And also cometh the testimony of the voice of thunderings, and the voice of lightnings, and the voice of tempests, and the voice of the waves of the sea heaving themselves beyond their bounds.
91 And all things shall be in commotion; and surely, men’s hearts shall fail them; for fear shall come upon all people.

[Spaced_Out]

The global economy is soon going to fail and it will no longer be safe for missionaries out in the field -it is to prepare the work to continue after missionaries are withdrawn. Many people will be inspires to seek the truth and will look for understanding as all things will be in commotion and wilt acknowledge the had of God's punishment upon the nations..

The start of these things can be counted in weeks and months..... Time to double the food storage... and preparation.

[Thinker]

My hope is that the church will begin sending young missionaries on humanitarian missions!!!!! Please! Pray for this! This is what Christ asked of us and would do.

Let their love and service speak louder than any preaching ever could!

[Arandur]

My hope is that the church will begin sending young missionaries on humanitarian missions!!!!! Please! Pray for this! This is what Christ asked of us and would do.

Let their love and service speak louder than any preaching ever could!

It's certainly an idea. This is already happening (more or less) in certain areas where traditional missionary work is heavily restricted or entirely illegal. I think it would be great to see this on a larger scale, and perhaps it'll happen if the current practice yields good fruit. Maybe even make the first 6 months of every standard mission humanitarian-focused. Start internalizing those Christ-like principles of compassion and service at the same time as they're studying up and getting a better handle on their gospel knowledge. And yes, opportunities to preach would be sure to follow.

[Z2100]

It is the beginning of the missionary withdrawal prior to the tribulations, The hastening has now finished. It is all going as planned... Not long now and earthquakes will start and the meteorite bombardment.

88:72 Behold, and lo, I will take care of your flocks, and will raise up elders and send unto them.
73 Behold, I will hasten my work in its time....
87 For not many days hence and the earth shall tremble and reel to and fro as a drunken man; and the sun shall hide his face, and shall refuse to give light; and the moon shall be bathed in blood; and the stars shall become exceedingly angry, and shall cast themselves down as a fig that falleth from off a fig tree.
88 And after your testimony cometh wrath and indignation upon the people.
89 For after your testimony cometh the testimony of earthquakes, that shall cause groanings in the midst of her, and men shall fall upon the ground and shall not be able to stand.
90 And also cometh the testimony of the voice of thunderings, and the voice of lightnings, and the voice of tempests, and the voice of the waves of the sea heaving themselves beyond their bounds.
91 And all things shall be in commotion; and surely, men’s hearts shall fail them; for fear shall come upon all people.

Thats What I'VE been thinking! The Times of The Gentiles are going to end soon!

[Z2100]

The global economy is soon going to fail and it will no longer be safe for missionaries out in the field -it is to prepare the work to continue after missionaries are withdrawn. Many people will be inspires to seek the truth and will look for understanding as all things will be in commotion and wilt acknowledge the had of God's punishment upon the nations..

The start of these things can be counted in weeks and months..... Time to double the food storage... and preparation.

What is really scary is that the next Great Depression is on its way. Recently, the stock market hit 23,000. Right before Black Tuesday in 1929, the US economy was uber successful and people were merry. Then the Depression hit. The only way we got-out of the Great Depression was when we entered WW2. This will happen all over again with WW3. Right after WW3 is when the Times of The Gentiles end.

[Fiannan]

I believe the leaders are preparing for the results of the baby-bust for the bast decade. Less Mormon children being born mean a less dynamic and powerful Church. Even the Deseret News was showcasing a couple who have decided to stop at two. Sadly the leaders don't dare speak out forcefully on why having big families is fantastic because they fear how today's members would react. Thing is, this liberal infection could have been averted if leaders had maintained the "be in the world but not of it" principle rather than "we are just like the rest of you" approach.

[Spaced_Out]

I believe the leaders are preparing for the results of the baby-bust for the bast decade. Less Mormon children being born mean a less dynamic and powerful Church. Even the Deseret News was showcasing a couple who have decided to stop at two. Sadly the leaders don't dare speak out forcefully on why having big families is fantastic because they fear how today's members would react. Thing is, this liberal infection could have been averted if leaders had maintained the "be in the world but not of it" principle rather than "we are just like the rest of you" approach.

The church has done no such thing _ people are getting married at much older age, there are severe economic issues. The church is still growing, you are just getting left behind, stuck in a rut with all you constant fault finding.
People do not make a decision on number of children they are going to have, who they marry etc based on your misinterpreted message from PH leaders. Some of the apostles only have 2 children,, l suppose you condemn them to hel as well...

[brianj]

I believe the leaders are preparing for the results of the baby-bust for the bast decade. Less Mormon children being born mean a less dynamic and powerful Church. Even the Deseret News was showcasing a couple who have decided to stop at two. Sadly the leaders don't dare speak out forcefully on why having big families is fantastic because they fear how today's members would react. Thing is, this liberal infection could have been averted if leaders had maintained the "be in the world but not of it" principle rather than "we are just like the rest of you" approach.

Do you think it's possible that economic reality plays a part in this? I just took a quick look at actual numbers. The most recent income data is from first quarter of 2016, when the average weekly income (I couldn't find median) for Salt Lake county was $973. That comes to $50,596 per year. The average weekly income for Utah county was $794, which multiplies to $41,288 per year. Keep in mind the average is skewed upward by high earners, which is why median income is popular among economists. The median household incomes for Utah and salt Lake counties is slightly over $65,500 per year. This means that if you tabulate everything brought in by all members in one year, half of all households bring in less than $65,500 and half bring in more. Since most families, particularly those below the median, have multiple sources of income (one job per adult, government spending, etc.) the median individual income is far below $65.5K.
I also looked at current home listings, looking specifically at houses since that's what most of us aspire to, and found very little that can be purchased with an average credit rating, little to no down payment, and an income $60,000 per year.

We live in a world where it's increasingly difficult to make ends meet on a typical single income. It's no surprise that an increasing number of mothers are working outside the home because they can't afford to stay at home. I really doubt that most church members can afford to have a stay at home mother and five kids.

[Spaced_Out]

I believe the leaders are preparing for the results of the baby-bust for the bast decade. Less Mormon children being born mean a less dynamic and powerful Church. Even the Deseret News was showcasing a couple who have decided to stop at two. Sadly the leaders don't dare speak out forcefully on why having big families is fantastic because they fear how today's members would react. Thing is, this liberal infection could have been averted if leaders had maintained the "be in the world but not of it" principle rather than "we are just like the rest of you" approach.

Do you think it's possible that economic reality plays a part in this? I just took a quick look at actual numbers. The most recent income data is from first quarter of 2016, when the average weekly income (I couldn't find median) for Salt Lake county was $973. That comes to $50,596 per year. The average weekly income for Utah county was $794, which multiplies to $41,288 per year. Keep in mind the average is skewed upward by high earners, which is why median income is popular among economists. The median household incomes for Utah and salt Lake counties is slightly over $65,500 per year. This means that if you tabulate everything brought in by all members in one year, half of all households bring in less than $65,500 and half bring in more. Since most families, particularly those below the median, have multiple sources of income (one job per adult, government spending, etc.) the median individual income is far below $65.5K.
I also looked at current home listings, looking specifically at houses since that's what most of us aspire to, and found very little that can be purchased with an average credit rating, little to no down payment, and an income $60,000 per year.

We live in a world where it's increasingly difficult to make ends meet on a typical single income. It's no surprise that an increasing number of mothers are working outside the home because they can't afford to stay at home. I really doubt that most church members can afford to have a stay at home mother and five kids.

very true, one neds to consider it takes +18y to make a missionary, you have to look at what was taught +20y ago. It is a very silly statement. Well that is 2 decades back...?

[gkearney]

I believe the leaders are preparing for the results of the baby-bust for the bast decade. Less Mormon children being born mean a less dynamic and powerful Church. Even the Deseret News was showcasing a couple who have decided to stop at two. Sadly the leaders don't dare speak out forcefully on why having big families is fantastic because they fear how today's members would react. Thing is, this liberal infection could have been averted if leaders had maintained the "be in the world but not of it" principle rather than "we are just like the rest of you" approach.

Not even the church can get past economic conditions. This is not a case of lazy families wanting a second home or a boat over children. This is hard economics at play. If the church wants big families they will need to figure out how to address these economic issues. Otherwise we will continue to see later marriages and smaller families like it or not. It is not fair to try and blame families for being caught up in economic conditions beyond their control.

[yjacket]

[/quote]

We live in a world where it's increasingly difficult to make ends meet on a typical single income. It's no surprise that an increasing number of mothers are working outside the home because they can't afford to stay at home. I really doubt that most church members can afford to have a stay at home mother and five kids.
[/quote]

No that's the excuse people use for not sacrificing to make it happen. I've lived in one of the most expensive cities in the US, making less than the median income supporting a wife and 2 kids without her working.

Fact is, it's possible but most people are too spoiled and don't want to make the sacrifice to actually want it to happen. It's no more difficult today than it was 30 years ago. It's just peoples expectations of what they should be able to afford has dramatically changed.

[brianj]

I believe the leaders are preparing for the results of the baby-bust for the bast decade. Less Mormon children being born mean a less dynamic and powerful Church. Even the Deseret News was showcasing a couple who have decided to stop at two. Sadly the leaders don't dare speak out forcefully on why having big families is fantastic because they fear how today's members would react. Thing is, this liberal infection could have been averted if leaders had maintained the "be in the world but not of it" principle rather than "we are just like the rest of you" approach.

Not even the church can get past economic conditions. This is not a case of lazy families wanting a second home or a boat over children. This is hard economics at play. If the church wants big families they will need to figure out how to address these economic issues. Otherwise we will continue to see later marriages and smaller families like it or not. It is not fair to try and blame families for being caught up in economic conditions beyond their control.

The church will also see fewer marriages.

I feel sorry for a lot of women I have met in the world because they bought the big lie that they could have it all. They went to university, as they were told they had to do. They got around more than a city bus, because they were told it's empowering. They enjoyed attention from guys their own age as well as older men who enjoy younger women, thinking there are no consequences. They graduated, got jobs, and built careers. They didn't take thought for the future, spending money as quickly as they earned it, if not using credit to spend money more quickly. As they hit 30 they enjoyed attention from men under 25, thinking it proves they are attractive when those guys know that older, attention starved women are an easy lay. Then, in their early to mid 30s, they expect to find no shortage of eligible bachelors close to their own age that will still be interested in them. But they only show interest in an eligible bachelor who wants children quickly and earn enough money to support the woman at or above the level she's accustomed to while also providing for children and saving for retirement. In reality they find very few eligible bachelors close to their age with the necessary income, most of whom are only interested in younger women. And almost all of these men are paying child support and alimony to women who will quickly have them thrown in jail for not paying child support or alimony, but whom courts never hold accountable for refusing to let them see their children. After getting burned like that, they don't want any more children.

It seems mind numbingly obvious to me but, as life gets more expensive and young men postpone a marriage they can't afford, we will see LDS women looking for men with an unrealisticy high income. We will see the few faithful men 30-35 finding spoiled women close to their age with unrealistic expectations, turning to young women 5-10 years younger. This will make it even more difficult for any younger man in or just out of university to find a wife, if he desires to, as the women know they can get a more comfortable life with someone established in a career. The results of this will be very bad.

[brianj]

We live in a world where it's increasingly difficult to make ends meet on a typical single income. It's no surprise that an increasing number of mothers are working outside the home because they can't afford to stay at home. I really doubt that most church members can afford to have a stay at home mother and five kids.

No that's the excuse people use for not sacrificing to make it happen.

If you would be so kind as to leave the top most line in your responses, so we can see who is replying to what, it would be appreciated. Do you see how my post says it's quoting you, but your post only has an end quote tag? That's because you took out at least one too many lines at the top.

You can claim it's an excuse, but your claim suggests to me that you aren't really connected to current economic reality.

The few couples I know who do "sacrifice to make it happen" are getting as much from government and church , if not more, than they are from employment.

There's also an issue with women unwilling to sacrifice the expectation of a nice house with a big yard, a new minivan, and regular expensive vacations.

[yjacket]

We live in a world where it's increasingly difficult to make ends meet on a typical single income. It's no surprise that an increasing number of mothers are working outside the home because they can't afford to stay at home. I really doubt that most church members can afford to have a stay at home mother and five kids.

No that's the excuse people use for not sacrificing to make it happen.

If you would be so kind as to leave the top most line in your responses, so we can see who is replying to what, it would be appreciated. Do you see how my post says it's quoting you, but your post only has an end quote tag? That's because you took out at least one too many lines at the top.

You can claim it's an excuse, but your claim suggests to me that you aren't really connected to current economic reality.

The few couples I know who do "sacrifice to make it happen" are getting as much from government and church , if not more, than they are from employment.

There's also an issue with women unwilling to sacrifice the expectation of a nice house with a big yard, a new minivan, and regular expensive vacations.

Apologies, getting used to this. The bottom line that you comment on is what I'm referring to. But it's not just women . . .it's men too. Many men aren't willing to sacrifice. We hear stories from 20-30 years ago about fathers working 2-3 jobs working 80+ hours a week or more just so mother could stay at home. How many men do that today?? Most just want to work 40 hours and be done.

[DEEPER storm]

The announcement yesterday about new mission stuff only makes sense if you are a critical thinker. Companies closes stores in malls and other places when they are loosing money or customers. There is no need for their services. For the Church to decrease the number of missions means less customers or a way to reduce costs. Not, the way they presented it as "new and improved." The questions for missionaries is right out of a legal brief. Designed to prevent people from going on a mission. Whatever happened to Ballard's "Raising the Bar?" General Conference address. Remember, how he told us this was going to increase baptisms, etc, because we had great missionaries who had the Spirit. Ot what about the book they wanted everyone to read about Teach my Gospel, Called to Serve. Something like that. We were told it was inspired and was from God and members would flock to the church because of this book. Remember. How is that doing? It can't be doing much good as we decrease missions and make calling a missionary feeling either guilty or a liar.

[Sirocco]

We live in a world where it's increasingly difficult to make ends meet on a typical single income. It's no surprise that an increasing number of mothers are working outside the home because they can't afford to stay at home. I really doubt that most church members can afford to have a stay at home mother and five kids.
[/quote]

No that's the excuse people use for not sacrificing to make it happen. I've lived in one of the most expensive cities in the US, making less than the median income supporting a wife and 2 kids without her working.

Fact is, it's possible but most people are too spoiled and don't want to make the sacrifice to actually want it to happen. It's no more difficult today than it was 30 years ago. It's just peoples expectations of what they should be able to afford has dramatically changed.
[/quote]

Yeah I've noticed that, while I make less then my friends I live in a better place then they do.
They spend all their money on junk, video games and stuff, and I spend more of it on my living situation and my eating situation, so I eat better too.

[Sunain]

My hope is that the church will begin sending young missionaries on humanitarian missions!!!!! Please! Pray for this! This is what Christ asked of us and would do.

Let their love and service speak louder than any preaching ever could!

We need to really get away from proselytizing missionaries as their effectiveness in the world is continuing to decrease. I agree, we need more service, humanitarian and even construction missions. So many places in the world have been devastated that service and rebuilding is necessary.

I don't know why they are getting rid of tablets. A tablet is really good for discussions with a bigger screen to show off church videos rather than a cellphone and to read text. I guess you could use a phone with mini-HDMI out but not everyone around the world is going to have a TV with that feature. I remember on my mission having DVD's and not many had a DVD player. Many tablets have LTE built-in or have a sim slot or can be paired via Bluetooth. Tablet's usually have a lot larger battery too, so for day long use, you don't have to worry about charging. Cellphones have GPS, cell, ect. They drain the battery faster in my experience. Wouldn't it be better to give the missionary the option which devices they want to use?

I believe the leaders are preparing for the results of the baby-bust for the bast decade. Less Mormon children being born mean a less dynamic and powerful Church. Even the Deseret News was showcasing a couple who have decided to stop at two. Sadly the leaders don't dare speak out forcefully on why having big families is fantastic because they fear how today's members would react. Thing is, this liberal infection could have been averted if leaders had maintained the "be in the world but not of it" principle rather than "we are just like the rest of you" approach.

Not even the church can get past economic conditions. This is not a case of lazy families wanting a second home or a boat over children. This is hard economics at play. If the church wants big families they will need to figure out how to address these economic issues. Otherwise we will continue to see later marriages and smaller families like it or not. It is not fair to try and blame families for being caught up in economic conditions beyond their control.

The church is out of touch with the economic reality for most members of the church worldwide. It's becoming extremely unaffordable to have the nuclear family, which the church is very keen to promote. A one income family is nearly impossible for the middle-class now.

We live in a world where it's increasingly difficult to make ends meet on a typical single income. It's no surprise that an increasing number of mothers are working outside the home because they can't afford to stay at home. I really doubt that most church members can afford to have a stay at home mother and five kids.

I have an above average paying job but I still find it difficult as a single male living in Vancouver to even afford monthly rent. I couldn't afford a family here unfortunately. Townhouses are approaching a million dollars here now. I don't think the church realizes that living conditions and prices in many places in the world have becoming very high making it very hard to start a family. "Affordable housing" is one step up from the slums and not the conditions anyone should want to raise a family in.