I meant the term herd not in terms of group think but in social terms.Sarah wrote: ↑October 18th, 2017, 4:42 pmYou're right that "herd" is not a positive or negative word, but the only time anyone uses the phrase "herd mentality" is with a negative connotation, meaning, that no one is thinking for themselves. So for me,this once again demonstrates why these complaints and concerns using words and phrases like these need to be really defined. Sure, use the word herd to describe female behavior, but what are the herd-like behaviors in the Church you don't like and what can we do to fix them? It sounds like you'd really like some more discussion of meaty topics. What is the "meat" you'd like to be discussing in the Church? Do you think having more meaty discussions would motivate people to do their home and visiting teaching?Serragon wrote: ↑October 18th, 2017, 3:35 pmThis is a good example of why things get watered down. I say "herd" and you think I am associating negative things with females. Herd is neither positive or negative. And women in general are more herd-like than men. We end up denying truths about ourselves and our natures for fear of offending leading to watered down doctrine. This desire to not overtly offend is also a feminine trait. Men prefer direct confrontation. Women prefer a smile and a hug all while building a coalition against the person behind the scenes. Neither is good or bad, just different. And each has their place.
I agree that the Lords plan involves balance and opposites. I believe we are way out of balance right now, and it is not beneficial for either the men or the women. The result for men is that they stop engaging. The result for women is that there is nothing there to check their pride. In the past, we have been out of balance in the opposite direction with similar results.Sarah wrote: ↑October 18th, 2017, 3:13 pm If there is one thing I've noticed about the Lord's plan and all his truths, it is that there is a balance to things and also opposites, which when you look at and define the contradictions, and then try to reconcile, the truth of how to live in manifested. So we can say that men in particular, and I would say women too, like challenges. We also like to feel independent to some degree. The Church has centralized a lot of these challenges and has made things easier for us at the local level. I think what this teaches us is that while we are commanded to be one, and work together, the further we are from sharing in the work load, the less motivated we are and the feeling of being one is ironically reduced. The Church is by no means in it's perfected and redeemed state, so someday when we live the United Order we'll see how all these weaknesses in the organization can be solved. In the mean-time, I think our leaders are doing the best they can and that the Lord is in charge. I know our Bishop's number one concern right now is that Home and Visiting Teaching is so poor. He sees that we have so many secure, talented, smart, gospel rooted men and women in our ward and why should it be so hard for them to do one simple thing. I'm sure that is how many of the brethren feel about the saints in general. Maybe it is the Lord who is testing us with this challenge of doing the simple things first rather than it being a problem with our Leaders not giving us enough meat or challenges.
Your story of your Bishop is right in line with what I am addressing. You have a ward full of awesome people, yet no one does anything. I would suggest that the root of that problem lies in the subject I am addressing.
I understand that women also want challenges. I was suggesting that the types of challenges men want are not available to them very easily in the current structure, not that women don't also want challenges.
The key point is not the deeper doctrine, but the forum and structure to discuss that doctrine if it arises. If there is no place people feel comfortable discussing these things, they won't get discussed even though many people want to discuss them. Currently, if you find something exciting to you in your scripture study or temple attendance, there is no real place or time to talk about that with other priesthood holders. It certainly isn't at church, where anything slightly controversial or off topic makes certain people uncomfortable. That is a shame.
I do not desire to pit men vs women. We need each other to be one. Each of us have traits that are beneficial to the other. Each of us have traits that should be subdued. But my point remains that the current church appeals much more to the needs/wants/desires of women than it does to men. If calling this feminized offends some, so be it.