This post isn't about a Mormon who did awful things. It's merely one more piece of evidence of how groupthink can lead presumably good people to excuse awful things.
Go to the link to see evidence that didn't come along in the copy/paste.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-10-0 ... te-details
Unsealed CIA Memos Provide Shocking 'Salt Pit' Black Site Details
by Tyler Durden
Oct 10, 2017 5:30 AM
A new batch of 274 CIA documents connected with Bush era torture have just been made public as a result of a lawsuit brought by families of victims. Contained in the documents are newly unearthed details on the CIA's "black site" program which reached its peak under Bush's 'war on terror' as well as shocking details revealing how the agency integrated its contract psychologists into its 'enhanced interrogation' program in order to give torture a veneer of legality. While much of this story of CIA torture has already slowly come to light over the past few years, especially with the 2014 Senate Intelligence Committee report, the just released documents capture internal high level agency discussions revealing a cover-up in action.
Many of the memos focus on the CIA's infamous 'Cobalt' site in Afghanistan (also code named The Salt Pit), routinely described in headlines as the "sadistic dungeon" and "dark prison" for its full sensory deprivation darkness which detainees experienced round the clock, sometimes for years, as well as the two psychologists credited with designing the program of brutal interrogation techniques: John "Bruce" Jessen and James Mitchell.
Two surviving prisoners and the family of a detainee who died at the Colbalt site reached an out-of-court settlement with the CIA psychologists in August after a lawsuit was brought for their role in the torture. As was hoped, the CIA and Pentagon were forced to declassify the documents related to the case in pretrial discovery.
Satellite image of Cobalt site, also called the Salt Pitt, from now public documents.
The documents show the psychologists had been directly involved in designing and implementing torture, and that the blurring of lines between CIA interrogators and the psychologists originally brought in for "research" and development of techniques had agency leadership worried over future legal ramifications. Jessen himself had spent 10 days at the Cobalt facility in November 2002 where he was involved in interrogating Gul Rahman - a suspected militant who died of hypothermia while chained naked from the waist down to a concrete floor. He died 5 days after Jessen left.
Ironically, a key fact rarely highlighted is that Gul Rahman was captured among Gulbuddin Hekmatyar's Hezb-i-Islami faction, which itself had previously been funded and vastly expanded by the CIA as part of Operation Cyclone. By 2010 terror leader Hekmatyar himself would enter negotiations with then President Karzai, and by 2017 would be fully reconciled with the US-backed government in Kabul.
Dr. Bruce Jessen, left, and Dr. James Mitchell, psychologists who contracted with the C.I.A.
The Guardian summarizes the newly released "Chronology of Significant Events" court findings covering the specific time period of Rahman's slow death at the Salt Pit as follows:
November 2002: Rahman wearing only socks and diaper; supervisor has concern regarding hypothermia
Rahman subjected to 48 hours of sleep deprivation, rough treatment, cold shower and other measures but remained noncompliant.
Subjected to cold conditions and minimum food and sleep... confused due to dehydration and fatigue.
Cable recommends future use of continued environmental deprivations with interrogations 18 out of 24 hours daily
Linguist asks questions about the temperature at which hypothermia occurs
November 19 2200 hrs guard check - Rahman is alive.
2300 hrs guard check - Rahman is alive.
November 20 0400 hrs guard check - Rahman is alive.
0800 hrs guard check - Rahman is alive.
1000 hrs guard check - Rahman is dead.
The Guardian further describes the now declassified documents as providing "the fullest picture yet of what the three men suffered [associated with the lawsuit] in that secret CIA dungeon – and of how fatefully their lives intersected with the rise and fall of James Mitchell and Bruce Jessen, the men who designed the torture regime."
Highlighted below are some revealing sections from the newly released batch of CIA torture memos - some of the below were already available before the latest release:
CIA contracted psychologists created an “Exploitation Draft Plan” which involved holding captives in soundproof cells in hidden facilities that were beyond the reach of the Red Cross, the press, and even internal US government oversight. The plan notes: No International Red Cross [IRC] nor even US observers. Detainees were essentially "disappeared" individuals and not even family members knowing their fates. Rahman's family didn't know of his whereabouts or death for seven years until an AP report unearthed his name. As noted in the below memo, Pentagon involvement ended with capture and transfer as a DoD psychologist accompanied the captive "unbeknown to the subject" after which the CIA psychologists would be involved in interrogation.
Particularly intense "interrogation" sessions involved medical personnel attending to detainee wounds, and even applying antibiotics, so that torture could continue: "The straps were removed: subjects breathing continued to be rapid. Subject was then instructed to off the [water] board under his own power, which he did. The interrogators pointed to the small box and said, 'you know what to do.'... At 1130 hours, taken out of small box, hooded, and made to stand against a cell wall: at 1230 hrs, back into the large box (unhooded)--note that medical officers dressed as security team member at this time gave subject Betadine to clean wound. Subject was also given a topical antibiotic to apply to the leg wound... At 1450 hrs, back to large box. At 1601 hrs into small box: 1612 hrs, subject was heard crying/wimpering/chanting, 1635 went from small box to floor, sitting down hooded; and 1655 hrs, returned to large box, unhooded..."
CIA leadership envisioned that psychologists Jessen and Mitchel would provide a legally "defensible" veneer to torture sessions (after being paid $81 million). So long as their personal assessments vouched for detainees being of mentally sound mind, "enhanced interrogations" could be initiated. "In my read of the DOJ memo, providing we abide by our water board process on [redacted] (qualified medical staff present, the defensible exam is done and we follow our procedures) I believe the water board can be approved by CTC/LGL [CIA's internal legal review team] without the need for further input from DOJ." Jessen and Mitchel were paid $81 million by the CIA in the process.
CIA leadership suggested psych evals be done from afar based on mere review of a file in order to set up a minimally invasive rubber stamp process. "to get waterboard approvals, we need a psychological evaluation... [Name redacted] indicated that we need to make a 'defensible' psychological analysis indicating that, given the individual's particular mental disposition, he would not suffer prolonged and sever psychological problems resulting from the enhanced interrogation techniques... can OTS make a defensible analysis based on a file review on the targets? Or do they need to have a psych eval done on the ground, face-to-face? [Name redacted] indicates that all it must [be] is 'defensible.'"
Doctors and nurses were requested to be present during sessions. One email with the subject line "Medical coverage planning" asked "There would be nurses on site correct?" This was presumably to allow torture to continue after detainees were injured, wounded, or sick - while also preventing those running the program from being legally exposed to prosecution.
Internal admissions of "blatant disregard for ethics": CIA contracted psychologists' ethics were questioned even by colleagues. They "have both shown blatant disregard for the ethics shared by almost all of their colleagues." Other emails admitted: “No professional in the field would credit their later judgments as psychologists assessing the subjects of their enhanced measures." And also, “if some untoward outcome is later to be explained, their sole use in this role will be indefensible.”
Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
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Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/1 ... 12234.html
Bruce Jessen Built CIA Interrogation Program; Quit Role As Mormon Bishop
SPOKANE, Wa. - One of the chief architects of the CIA’s harsh interrogation program said on Thursday he had to quit as leader of his Mormon church in 2012 amid controversy about his role in fighting terrorism.
No senior policymakers or CIA officials have been charged for the maltreatment of suspects, but at least for former Air Force psychologist Bruce Jessen there has been a repercussion at a local level for his part in the so-called “war on terror.”
Jessen resigned as bishop of a Mormon congregation in Spokane, Washington after civil liberties and human rights activists criticized his professional past in the local newspaper.
“I just felt it would be unfair for me to bring that controversy to a lot of other people, so I decided to step down,” Jessen told Reuters outside his home south of Spokane.
The CIA paid $80 million to a company run by Jessen and another former Air Force psychologist, James Mitchell, according to a U.S. Senate report released this week. The report said the pair recommended waterboarding, slaps to the face and mock burial for prisoners suspected of being terrorists.
The pair are referred to by pseudonyms in the report but intelligence sources have identified them by name. Mitchell said earlier this week the report was a “bunch of hooey.” Jessen said a nondisclosure agreement prevented him from commenting.
“It’s a difficult position to be in,” he said. “You want to set the record straight.” He accused the media of publishing “distortions” about CIA interrogation methods.
Jessen, 65, had only spent a week in the role as head of his 300-member Spokane congregation when he stepped down in October, 2012.
“This was due to concerns expressed about his past work related to interrogation techniques,” said Eric Hawkins, a national spokesman in Salt Lake City for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, as the Mormon faith is formally known.
The position of bishop is unpaid and part-time but well-respected in the Mormon world.
“Local leaders met with Jessen and together determined that it would be difficult for him to serve as an effective leader in that position,” Hawkins said.
A bishop normally serves three to six years, he added. Jessen remains a member of the same congregation.
The American Psychological Association - to which Jessen and Mitchell do not belong and are thus not subject to discipline - has called for the pair to be held accountable. But U.S. officials say there will be no criminal charges. (Reporting by Matt Spetalnick in Washington DC and Jacob Jones in Spokane. Writing by Alistair Bell, editing by Ross Colvin)
Bruce Jessen Built CIA Interrogation Program; Quit Role As Mormon Bishop
SPOKANE, Wa. - One of the chief architects of the CIA’s harsh interrogation program said on Thursday he had to quit as leader of his Mormon church in 2012 amid controversy about his role in fighting terrorism.
No senior policymakers or CIA officials have been charged for the maltreatment of suspects, but at least for former Air Force psychologist Bruce Jessen there has been a repercussion at a local level for his part in the so-called “war on terror.”
Jessen resigned as bishop of a Mormon congregation in Spokane, Washington after civil liberties and human rights activists criticized his professional past in the local newspaper.
“I just felt it would be unfair for me to bring that controversy to a lot of other people, so I decided to step down,” Jessen told Reuters outside his home south of Spokane.
The CIA paid $80 million to a company run by Jessen and another former Air Force psychologist, James Mitchell, according to a U.S. Senate report released this week. The report said the pair recommended waterboarding, slaps to the face and mock burial for prisoners suspected of being terrorists.
The pair are referred to by pseudonyms in the report but intelligence sources have identified them by name. Mitchell said earlier this week the report was a “bunch of hooey.” Jessen said a nondisclosure agreement prevented him from commenting.
“It’s a difficult position to be in,” he said. “You want to set the record straight.” He accused the media of publishing “distortions” about CIA interrogation methods.
Jessen, 65, had only spent a week in the role as head of his 300-member Spokane congregation when he stepped down in October, 2012.
“This was due to concerns expressed about his past work related to interrogation techniques,” said Eric Hawkins, a national spokesman in Salt Lake City for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, as the Mormon faith is formally known.
The position of bishop is unpaid and part-time but well-respected in the Mormon world.
“Local leaders met with Jessen and together determined that it would be difficult for him to serve as an effective leader in that position,” Hawkins said.
A bishop normally serves three to six years, he added. Jessen remains a member of the same congregation.
The American Psychological Association - to which Jessen and Mitchell do not belong and are thus not subject to discipline - has called for the pair to be held accountable. But U.S. officials say there will be no criminal charges. (Reporting by Matt Spetalnick in Washington DC and Jacob Jones in Spokane. Writing by Alistair Bell, editing by Ross Colvin)
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Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2014/1 ... may-be-LDS
Torture's new acronym may be LDS
By Jon Perr
Wednesday Dec 10, 2014 · 7:20 PM CST
The just-release Senate torture report is so horrifying that it is difficult to know where to begin. To be sure, shocking revelations about CIA "rectal hydration," rape by broomstick (also known to Fox News and New Yorkers as "Giuliani Time") and other acts of state-sponsored sadism ensure Americans won't soon forget the term "enhanced interrogation techniques" (EIT). As it turns out, EIT isn't the only acronym likely to be permanently associated with the Bush administration's regime of detainee torture. So, too, may LDS. That is, many of the leading legal architects and most bestial practitioners of U.S. torture are members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Days Saints.
As the Salt Lake Tribune first fretted in April 2009, "LDS lawyers, psychologists had a hand in torture policies." At the top of that list of Mormon Torquemadas are John "Bruce" Jessen and James Mitchell, the two psychologists who designed and also later helped administer the vicious, violent and virtually worthless torture tactics. Many in the CIA itself worried about their regimen reverse-engineered from the American military's own SERE ("Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape") program. As NBC News reported:
John Rizzo, the acting CIA general counsel who met with the psychologists, wrote in his book, "Company Man," that he found some of what Mitchell and Jessen were recommending "sadistic and terrifying." One technique, he wrote, was "so gruesome that the Justice Department later stopped short of approving it."
Earlier this year, James Mitchell defended himself by declaring, "I'm just a guy who got asked to do something for his country." Asked, that his, and paid over $80 million by the federal government. (Of course, one man's war crime is another man's business model, provided the second man is Mitt Romney.) Drs. Jesson and Mitchell started out as Air Force psychologists whose Spokane, Washington company then made millions from dispensing human misery:
The CIA contractors who helped develop and operate the "enhanced interrogation techniques" that the agency used on terror suspects, including waterboarding, were paid more than $80 million, according to the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence report on the CIA's interrogation program released Tuesday.
The contract was for more than $180 million, but the contractors had only received $81 million when their contract was terminated in 2009.
But word of their pain-for-profit enterprise didn't lead to excommunication from their church, but instead greater esteem.
In October 2012--three years after the ABC News segment above--the Spokane Spokesman-Review reported Jessen's elevation within the LDS:
Bruce Jessen was proposed by Spokane Stake President James Lee, or "called" in the terminology of the Mormon faith, to be the bishop of Spokane's 6th Ward, approved by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints hierarchy in Salt Lake City and presented to the congregation on Sunday. He was unanimously accepted by some 200 in attendance, Lee said.
As a bishop - an unpaid, part-time position that usually lasts several years - Jessen will take confessions and help people with their personal problems, Lee said. "They just try to help people with their lives, marriages or finances," he said.
As it turned out, waterboarding was apparently not an ideal enhanced proselytization technique. As Joanna Brooks noted in Religion Dispatches later in October 2012, "Sources have confirmed that Jessen stepped down from the position last Sunday." If LDS wasn't put off by Jessen and Mitchell's past, the APA (the American Psychological Association), was horrified. Last month, APA announced it "will conduct an independent review into whether it colluded with or supported the government's use of torture in the interrogation of prisoners during the Bush administration."
Meanwhile, one of the principal authors of the Bush administration handbook for Inquisitors isn't sitting in a prison cell, but on the bench of the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals. That's right, Judge Jay Bybee was one of the men who helped President Bush and Vice President Cheney render the Geneva Conventions "quaint." As Steve Sebelius wrote Tuesday in the Las Vegas Journal Review, it is "long past time to fire the torture judge."
Working in the Office of Legal Counsel in 2002:
Bybee signed off on memos that authorized agents of the U.S. government to engage in torture, in part by re-defining the term. According to the memos -- drafted by then-Office of Legal Counsel attorney John Yoo -- "torture" means severe pain that rises to the level of a serious physical injury "...such as death, organ failure, or serious impairment of body functions."
And "a defendant must specifically intend to cause prolonged mental harm for the defendant to have committed torture," according to the memo. "Thus, if a defendant had a good faith belief that his actions will not result in prolonged mental harm, he lacks the mental state necessary for his actions to constitute torture."
Waterboarding? No problem. Sleep deprivation? OK. Stress positions? Go for it. And if you go too far? "In that case, we believe that [a person accused of torture] could argue that his actions were justified by the executive branch's constitutional authority to protect the nation from attack."
In these documents lay the seeds of America's torture program.
The outsized Mormon influence on the Bush Torture Team didn't end there. As the Trib's David Irvine lamented back in 2009, "Take Latter-day Saint Timothy E. Flanigan, deputy White House counsel, who, along with David Addington, John Yoo, Alberto Gonzales, and Jim Haynes comprised the secretive "War Council" of lawyers -- a self-appointed group [Jane] Mayer describes as having virtually no experience in law enforcement, military service, counterterrorism or the Muslim world."
Flanigan once told his LDS ward congregation that it was gratifying "to work in a White House where every day was begun with prayer." In 2005, prior to his rejection by the Senate to be Gonzales' deputy attorney general, Flanigan was asked whether waterboarding, mock executions, physical beatings and painful stress positions were off-limits. "[It] depends on the facts and circumstances... ." He went on: "'Inhumane' can't be coherently defined."
As it turns out, his fellow Mormon and 2012 GOP presidential nominee Mitt Romney couldn't coherently define "inhumane," either. When asked if waterboarding constituted torture, the man who once promised to "double Guantanamo" declared simply, "I don't." (At that same town hall event in October 2011, would-be President Romney announced, "I will not authorize torture.") Romney didn't just have "binders full of women," but position papers on torture, too. And as the New York Times reported:
In a policy proposal drafted by Mitt Romney's advisers in September 2011, Mr. Romney's advisers urge him to "rescind and replace President Obama's executive order" and permit secret "enhanced interrogation techniques against high-value detainees that are safe, legal and effective in generating intelligence to save American lives."
That December, the former bishop and former governor Romney put it this way:
"We'll use enhanced interrogation techniques which go beyond those that are in the military handbook right now."
Now, none of this is to say that either most Mormons or LDS theology itself endorses the vindictive and counterproductive brutality of the Bush torture enthusiasts. Far from it. As Brooks' explains, in 2005 the LDS Church released a statement "condemning inhumane treatment of any person under any circumstance." And as Mormon Studies expert Professor Patrick Mason has told Brooks:
Mormonism has "no systematic theology" on issues like human rights or poverty or war. Its view of morality is "highly individualized."
But while there cannot be guilt by association, there also cannot be silence. (Among potential 2016 GOP White House hopefuls, Mitt Romney among others has yet to weigh in on the Senate Intelligence Committee's report.) American torture was an abomination. Sadly, many of those who enabled and defended it just happen to be prominent members of the fastest-growing faith in the United States. Yet so far, they have faced not punishment but only prosperity.
Torture's new acronym may be LDS
By Jon Perr
Wednesday Dec 10, 2014 · 7:20 PM CST
The just-release Senate torture report is so horrifying that it is difficult to know where to begin. To be sure, shocking revelations about CIA "rectal hydration," rape by broomstick (also known to Fox News and New Yorkers as "Giuliani Time") and other acts of state-sponsored sadism ensure Americans won't soon forget the term "enhanced interrogation techniques" (EIT). As it turns out, EIT isn't the only acronym likely to be permanently associated with the Bush administration's regime of detainee torture. So, too, may LDS. That is, many of the leading legal architects and most bestial practitioners of U.S. torture are members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Days Saints.
As the Salt Lake Tribune first fretted in April 2009, "LDS lawyers, psychologists had a hand in torture policies." At the top of that list of Mormon Torquemadas are John "Bruce" Jessen and James Mitchell, the two psychologists who designed and also later helped administer the vicious, violent and virtually worthless torture tactics. Many in the CIA itself worried about their regimen reverse-engineered from the American military's own SERE ("Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape") program. As NBC News reported:
John Rizzo, the acting CIA general counsel who met with the psychologists, wrote in his book, "Company Man," that he found some of what Mitchell and Jessen were recommending "sadistic and terrifying." One technique, he wrote, was "so gruesome that the Justice Department later stopped short of approving it."
Earlier this year, James Mitchell defended himself by declaring, "I'm just a guy who got asked to do something for his country." Asked, that his, and paid over $80 million by the federal government. (Of course, one man's war crime is another man's business model, provided the second man is Mitt Romney.) Drs. Jesson and Mitchell started out as Air Force psychologists whose Spokane, Washington company then made millions from dispensing human misery:
The CIA contractors who helped develop and operate the "enhanced interrogation techniques" that the agency used on terror suspects, including waterboarding, were paid more than $80 million, according to the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence report on the CIA's interrogation program released Tuesday.
The contract was for more than $180 million, but the contractors had only received $81 million when their contract was terminated in 2009.
But word of their pain-for-profit enterprise didn't lead to excommunication from their church, but instead greater esteem.
In October 2012--three years after the ABC News segment above--the Spokane Spokesman-Review reported Jessen's elevation within the LDS:
Bruce Jessen was proposed by Spokane Stake President James Lee, or "called" in the terminology of the Mormon faith, to be the bishop of Spokane's 6th Ward, approved by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints hierarchy in Salt Lake City and presented to the congregation on Sunday. He was unanimously accepted by some 200 in attendance, Lee said.
As a bishop - an unpaid, part-time position that usually lasts several years - Jessen will take confessions and help people with their personal problems, Lee said. "They just try to help people with their lives, marriages or finances," he said.
As it turned out, waterboarding was apparently not an ideal enhanced proselytization technique. As Joanna Brooks noted in Religion Dispatches later in October 2012, "Sources have confirmed that Jessen stepped down from the position last Sunday." If LDS wasn't put off by Jessen and Mitchell's past, the APA (the American Psychological Association), was horrified. Last month, APA announced it "will conduct an independent review into whether it colluded with or supported the government's use of torture in the interrogation of prisoners during the Bush administration."
Meanwhile, one of the principal authors of the Bush administration handbook for Inquisitors isn't sitting in a prison cell, but on the bench of the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals. That's right, Judge Jay Bybee was one of the men who helped President Bush and Vice President Cheney render the Geneva Conventions "quaint." As Steve Sebelius wrote Tuesday in the Las Vegas Journal Review, it is "long past time to fire the torture judge."
Working in the Office of Legal Counsel in 2002:
Bybee signed off on memos that authorized agents of the U.S. government to engage in torture, in part by re-defining the term. According to the memos -- drafted by then-Office of Legal Counsel attorney John Yoo -- "torture" means severe pain that rises to the level of a serious physical injury "...such as death, organ failure, or serious impairment of body functions."
And "a defendant must specifically intend to cause prolonged mental harm for the defendant to have committed torture," according to the memo. "Thus, if a defendant had a good faith belief that his actions will not result in prolonged mental harm, he lacks the mental state necessary for his actions to constitute torture."
Waterboarding? No problem. Sleep deprivation? OK. Stress positions? Go for it. And if you go too far? "In that case, we believe that [a person accused of torture] could argue that his actions were justified by the executive branch's constitutional authority to protect the nation from attack."
In these documents lay the seeds of America's torture program.
The outsized Mormon influence on the Bush Torture Team didn't end there. As the Trib's David Irvine lamented back in 2009, "Take Latter-day Saint Timothy E. Flanigan, deputy White House counsel, who, along with David Addington, John Yoo, Alberto Gonzales, and Jim Haynes comprised the secretive "War Council" of lawyers -- a self-appointed group [Jane] Mayer describes as having virtually no experience in law enforcement, military service, counterterrorism or the Muslim world."
Flanigan once told his LDS ward congregation that it was gratifying "to work in a White House where every day was begun with prayer." In 2005, prior to his rejection by the Senate to be Gonzales' deputy attorney general, Flanigan was asked whether waterboarding, mock executions, physical beatings and painful stress positions were off-limits. "[It] depends on the facts and circumstances... ." He went on: "'Inhumane' can't be coherently defined."
As it turns out, his fellow Mormon and 2012 GOP presidential nominee Mitt Romney couldn't coherently define "inhumane," either. When asked if waterboarding constituted torture, the man who once promised to "double Guantanamo" declared simply, "I don't." (At that same town hall event in October 2011, would-be President Romney announced, "I will not authorize torture.") Romney didn't just have "binders full of women," but position papers on torture, too. And as the New York Times reported:
In a policy proposal drafted by Mitt Romney's advisers in September 2011, Mr. Romney's advisers urge him to "rescind and replace President Obama's executive order" and permit secret "enhanced interrogation techniques against high-value detainees that are safe, legal and effective in generating intelligence to save American lives."
That December, the former bishop and former governor Romney put it this way:
"We'll use enhanced interrogation techniques which go beyond those that are in the military handbook right now."
Now, none of this is to say that either most Mormons or LDS theology itself endorses the vindictive and counterproductive brutality of the Bush torture enthusiasts. Far from it. As Brooks' explains, in 2005 the LDS Church released a statement "condemning inhumane treatment of any person under any circumstance." And as Mormon Studies expert Professor Patrick Mason has told Brooks:
Mormonism has "no systematic theology" on issues like human rights or poverty or war. Its view of morality is "highly individualized."
But while there cannot be guilt by association, there also cannot be silence. (Among potential 2016 GOP White House hopefuls, Mitt Romney among others has yet to weigh in on the Senate Intelligence Committee's report.) American torture was an abomination. Sadly, many of those who enabled and defended it just happen to be prominent members of the fastest-growing faith in the United States. Yet so far, they have faced not punishment but only prosperity.
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Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
http://www.ibtimes.com/mormons-cia-tort ... re-1750303
Mormons And CIA Torture Report: Is LDS Church 'Morally Bankrupt' Because Of Involvement In Torture?
BY MORGAN WINSOR @MORGANWINSOR ON 12/11/14 AT 9:00 PM
Temple Square in Salt Lake City is home to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Photo: Reuters
A Mormon blogger is questioning whether the Senate report on the CIA’s use of torture is a condemnation not just of torture itself but also of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, because two distinguished Mormons -- Bruce Jessen and Jay Bybee -- had prominent roles in the CIA’s detention and interrogation program under the George W. Bush administration.
“We contributed to this … Our brothers did this,” Crawford, also known as John C., wrote in a post on a Mormon blog site called By Common Consent, which was started in 2004 by a group of LDS church members to post and discuss Mormon topics.
Crawford wrote that Jessen, a former Mormon bishop, was paid $80 million for drafting the guidelines that developed the torture techniques used on suspected terrorists following the Sept. 11, 2001; and that Bybee, a federal judge at the time, signed the memorandums giving the CIA's controversial interrogation program and its brutal methods legal authorization.
“If we, as a people, are creating good men who do not understand that it is inherently wrong to torture even the worst offenders, then we are not doing a good job at creating good men. If we create men who understand that torture is wrong in the abstract, but when faced with the pressure of keeping a job, the greed of potential government largesse, the opportunity to justify revenge and torture in the name of national security, they fold and authorize it, we are not doing a good job at creating good men. This should not be a position for debate. I’m disgusted that it ever was,” Crawford wrote in the post published Wednesday.
Mormons, also known as Latter-day Saints, are heavily represented in national law enforcement and intelligence agencies. Returned Mormon missionaries are valued for their foreign language skills, abstinence from drugs and alcohol and respect for authority, a CIA recruiter reportedly told the Salt Lake Tribune.
Crawford concluded that if Jessen and Bybee, who are considered to be “good Mormons” by the church, represent the moral judgment of the church’s best and brightest, then “we are morally bankrupt.”
Eric Hawkins, a spokesman for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, said people -- not the church to which they may belong -- are accountable for their own actions. “To suggest that any action by any individual should be laid at the feet of the faith they proclaim to follow is insupportable,” Hawkins wrote to International Business Times in an email Friday.
Mormons And CIA Torture Report: Is LDS Church 'Morally Bankrupt' Because Of Involvement In Torture?
BY MORGAN WINSOR @MORGANWINSOR ON 12/11/14 AT 9:00 PM
Temple Square in Salt Lake City is home to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Photo: Reuters
A Mormon blogger is questioning whether the Senate report on the CIA’s use of torture is a condemnation not just of torture itself but also of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, because two distinguished Mormons -- Bruce Jessen and Jay Bybee -- had prominent roles in the CIA’s detention and interrogation program under the George W. Bush administration.
“We contributed to this … Our brothers did this,” Crawford, also known as John C., wrote in a post on a Mormon blog site called By Common Consent, which was started in 2004 by a group of LDS church members to post and discuss Mormon topics.
Crawford wrote that Jessen, a former Mormon bishop, was paid $80 million for drafting the guidelines that developed the torture techniques used on suspected terrorists following the Sept. 11, 2001; and that Bybee, a federal judge at the time, signed the memorandums giving the CIA's controversial interrogation program and its brutal methods legal authorization.
“If we, as a people, are creating good men who do not understand that it is inherently wrong to torture even the worst offenders, then we are not doing a good job at creating good men. If we create men who understand that torture is wrong in the abstract, but when faced with the pressure of keeping a job, the greed of potential government largesse, the opportunity to justify revenge and torture in the name of national security, they fold and authorize it, we are not doing a good job at creating good men. This should not be a position for debate. I’m disgusted that it ever was,” Crawford wrote in the post published Wednesday.
Mormons, also known as Latter-day Saints, are heavily represented in national law enforcement and intelligence agencies. Returned Mormon missionaries are valued for their foreign language skills, abstinence from drugs and alcohol and respect for authority, a CIA recruiter reportedly told the Salt Lake Tribune.
Crawford concluded that if Jessen and Bybee, who are considered to be “good Mormons” by the church, represent the moral judgment of the church’s best and brightest, then “we are morally bankrupt.”
Eric Hawkins, a spokesman for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, said people -- not the church to which they may belong -- are accountable for their own actions. “To suggest that any action by any individual should be laid at the feet of the faith they proclaim to follow is insupportable,” Hawkins wrote to International Business Times in an email Friday.
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Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
The government paid millions for this torture program? Heck, nothing new there really. One would think that with such knowledge of psychology they could have come up with far more effective ways to break people down.
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Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
http://tortureaccountability.org/bruce_jessen
Bruce Jessen
Torture Connection:
The shrink
Born in 1949, raised in Idaho
Joined the Air Force as an enlisted man, attended college and graduate school while in the service
Ph.D. in psychology, Utah State University. Dissertation on family therapy.
In late 2001, obtained copy, possibly through CIA channels, of alleged "Al-Qaeda training manual" that discussed resistance to standard interrogation procedures.
From 2002 on, left air force to work with fellow psychologist James Mitchell in private corporation, Mitchell Jessen Associates, that contracted with the CIA to supervise "enhanced" interrogation procedures--i.e., torture.
Jessen's military background, contacts, draw him into CIA planning for detainee interrogation
As chief psychologist for the air force's SERE (Survival Evasion Resistance Escape) program, Jessen helped train special forces and aviation officers and enlisted men in dealing with abuse that might be expected if they were captured by enemy forces. SERE training, based on the experience of American soldiers captured in the Korean and Vietnam wars, included isolation, mock interrogations, and exposure to waterboarding and other forms of torture. Jessen reported to Col. Roger Aldrich, a Special Forces officer regarded as a "legendary military survival trainer." Aldrich is believed to have well-developed contacts within the CIA, who may have brought him into the early post-9/11 discussion/planning stages regarding interrogations of suspected enemy combatants. Perhaps through Aldrich, a copy of a document alleged to represent an "al-Qaeda training manual" was obtained by Jessen, who shared it with James Mitchell, a fellow psychologist recently retired from the military, who had worked with Aldrich and Jessen in the SERE program.
Aldrich had already contacted the CIA regarding SERE, which he considered the military's most valuable resource with respect to interrogation expertise. In truth, however, SERE only orchestrated mock interrogations; no one in the program, certainly not Mitchell or Jessen, had expertise in actual interrogations.
Jessen retires from the military for a private-sector opportunity as a civilian torturer
Although the "training manual" that wound up in the hands of Jessen and Mitchell does not mention al-Qaeda by name and may in fact be a CIA-produced document, they were able to use it as the basis for a torture contract proposal. Their argument was that al-Qaeda was familiar with standard interrogation techniques, as described in the "training manual," and thus was prepared to counter them. Only SERE-like torture could crack these "trained terrorists" and induce them to reveal helpful information regarding their organization and its plans. The proposal utilized psychological jargon in asserting that the goal of the torture should be "learned helplessness," a conditioned response to dehumanizing treatment. Jessen and Mitchell wrote up the proposal as though these ideas were original to them, but it is likely that military colleagues, perhaps including Col. Aldrich, helped them tailor the write-up to the interests of the CIA.
During the immediate post-9/11 period, when interest in military service peaked dramatically, Jessen bucked the trend by resigning his commission. He and Mitchell formed a company known as Mitchell Jessen Associates (MJA), which consisted basically of a phone answering service and possibly a small office in Spokane, WA. MJA contracted with the CIA to conduct torture sessions at black sites around the globe. Mitchell and Jessen often personally led the "enhanced interrogations" and/or trained others. While Mitchell maintained something of a public profile, participating in conferences and other activities so as to sustain MJA's reputation as a "professional" outfit, Jessen apparently remained more or less under cover for long periods, quietly completing CIA torture assignments.
Sources on Bruce Jessen
NewsWeek
The New York Times Psychologists Shielded U.S. Torture Program, Report Finds by James Risen
The Guardian US torture doctors could face charges after report alleges post-9/11 'collusion' by Spencer Ackerman
The Intercept Emails Reveal Close Relationship Between Psychology Group and CIA by Cora Currier
Guardian Psychologists met in secret with Bush officials to help justify torture – report by Raya Jalabi
The New York Times Prosecute Torturers and Their Bosses by THE EDITORIAL BOARD
Slate Magazine CIA on the Couch: Why there would have been no torture without the psychologists. by Steven Reisner
The Daily Beast The Luxury Homes That Torture and Your Tax Dollars Built by Michael Daly
Huffington Post Bruce Jessen Built CIA Interrogation Program; Quit Role As Mormon Bishop by Reuters
IB Times Who Are Jim Mitchell And Bruce Jessen? CIA Torture Psychologists Were Experts In Communist Chinese Interrogation by Philip Ross
Truthout EXCLUSIVE: CIA Psychologist's Notes Reveal True Purpose Behind Bush's Torture Program by Jason Leopold and Jeffrey Kaye
The Spokesman-Review Fairchild’s torture ties extend their reach by Shawn Vestal
Eurasia Review US Pentagon Releases Training Manual Used As Basis For Bush’s Torture Program by Andy Worthington
Truthout CIA: Detainee's Torture Drawings, Writings, "Should They Exist," to Remain Top Secret by Jason Leopold
The Guardian Guantánamo files: US agencies fought internal war over handling of detainees by Ewen MacAskill
Eurasia Review The Dark Desires Of Bruce Jessen: The Architect Of Bush’s Torture Program by Andy Worthington
The Atlantic Was Bush Torture Really About Interrogation? by Andrew Sullivan
Truthout CIA Psychologist's Notes Reveal True Purpose Behind Bush's Torture Program by Jason Leopold and Jeffrey Kaye
AmericanTorture.com Expanding the Investigation into SERE Torture by Valtin (Michael Otterman)
AmericanTorture.com NYT Misses Full Story on Mitchell-Jessen (Expose Part 1) by Valtin (Michael Otterman)
American Torture Expose (Part 3): Roger Aldrich, the Al Qaeda Manual, and the Origins of Mitchell-Jessen by Jeff Kaye
AmericanTorture.com Roger Aldrich, the Al-Qaeda Manual, and the Origins of Mitchell-Jessen by Aldin (Michael Otterman)
American Torture Expose (Part 2) : Expanding the Investigation into SERE Torture by Jeff Kaye
American Torture Expose (Part 1): NYT Misses Full Story on Mitchell-Jessen by Jeff Kaye
Salon.com Torture planning began in 2001, Senate Report Reveals by Mark Benjamin
Global Research The CIA's Torture Teachers by Mark Benjamin
Bruce Jessen
Torture Connection:
The shrink
Born in 1949, raised in Idaho
Joined the Air Force as an enlisted man, attended college and graduate school while in the service
Ph.D. in psychology, Utah State University. Dissertation on family therapy.
In late 2001, obtained copy, possibly through CIA channels, of alleged "Al-Qaeda training manual" that discussed resistance to standard interrogation procedures.
From 2002 on, left air force to work with fellow psychologist James Mitchell in private corporation, Mitchell Jessen Associates, that contracted with the CIA to supervise "enhanced" interrogation procedures--i.e., torture.
Jessen's military background, contacts, draw him into CIA planning for detainee interrogation
As chief psychologist for the air force's SERE (Survival Evasion Resistance Escape) program, Jessen helped train special forces and aviation officers and enlisted men in dealing with abuse that might be expected if they were captured by enemy forces. SERE training, based on the experience of American soldiers captured in the Korean and Vietnam wars, included isolation, mock interrogations, and exposure to waterboarding and other forms of torture. Jessen reported to Col. Roger Aldrich, a Special Forces officer regarded as a "legendary military survival trainer." Aldrich is believed to have well-developed contacts within the CIA, who may have brought him into the early post-9/11 discussion/planning stages regarding interrogations of suspected enemy combatants. Perhaps through Aldrich, a copy of a document alleged to represent an "al-Qaeda training manual" was obtained by Jessen, who shared it with James Mitchell, a fellow psychologist recently retired from the military, who had worked with Aldrich and Jessen in the SERE program.
Aldrich had already contacted the CIA regarding SERE, which he considered the military's most valuable resource with respect to interrogation expertise. In truth, however, SERE only orchestrated mock interrogations; no one in the program, certainly not Mitchell or Jessen, had expertise in actual interrogations.
Jessen retires from the military for a private-sector opportunity as a civilian torturer
Although the "training manual" that wound up in the hands of Jessen and Mitchell does not mention al-Qaeda by name and may in fact be a CIA-produced document, they were able to use it as the basis for a torture contract proposal. Their argument was that al-Qaeda was familiar with standard interrogation techniques, as described in the "training manual," and thus was prepared to counter them. Only SERE-like torture could crack these "trained terrorists" and induce them to reveal helpful information regarding their organization and its plans. The proposal utilized psychological jargon in asserting that the goal of the torture should be "learned helplessness," a conditioned response to dehumanizing treatment. Jessen and Mitchell wrote up the proposal as though these ideas were original to them, but it is likely that military colleagues, perhaps including Col. Aldrich, helped them tailor the write-up to the interests of the CIA.
During the immediate post-9/11 period, when interest in military service peaked dramatically, Jessen bucked the trend by resigning his commission. He and Mitchell formed a company known as Mitchell Jessen Associates (MJA), which consisted basically of a phone answering service and possibly a small office in Spokane, WA. MJA contracted with the CIA to conduct torture sessions at black sites around the globe. Mitchell and Jessen often personally led the "enhanced interrogations" and/or trained others. While Mitchell maintained something of a public profile, participating in conferences and other activities so as to sustain MJA's reputation as a "professional" outfit, Jessen apparently remained more or less under cover for long periods, quietly completing CIA torture assignments.
Sources on Bruce Jessen
NewsWeek
The New York Times Psychologists Shielded U.S. Torture Program, Report Finds by James Risen
The Guardian US torture doctors could face charges after report alleges post-9/11 'collusion' by Spencer Ackerman
The Intercept Emails Reveal Close Relationship Between Psychology Group and CIA by Cora Currier
Guardian Psychologists met in secret with Bush officials to help justify torture – report by Raya Jalabi
The New York Times Prosecute Torturers and Their Bosses by THE EDITORIAL BOARD
Slate Magazine CIA on the Couch: Why there would have been no torture without the psychologists. by Steven Reisner
The Daily Beast The Luxury Homes That Torture and Your Tax Dollars Built by Michael Daly
Huffington Post Bruce Jessen Built CIA Interrogation Program; Quit Role As Mormon Bishop by Reuters
IB Times Who Are Jim Mitchell And Bruce Jessen? CIA Torture Psychologists Were Experts In Communist Chinese Interrogation by Philip Ross
Truthout EXCLUSIVE: CIA Psychologist's Notes Reveal True Purpose Behind Bush's Torture Program by Jason Leopold and Jeffrey Kaye
The Spokesman-Review Fairchild’s torture ties extend their reach by Shawn Vestal
Eurasia Review US Pentagon Releases Training Manual Used As Basis For Bush’s Torture Program by Andy Worthington
Truthout CIA: Detainee's Torture Drawings, Writings, "Should They Exist," to Remain Top Secret by Jason Leopold
The Guardian Guantánamo files: US agencies fought internal war over handling of detainees by Ewen MacAskill
Eurasia Review The Dark Desires Of Bruce Jessen: The Architect Of Bush’s Torture Program by Andy Worthington
The Atlantic Was Bush Torture Really About Interrogation? by Andrew Sullivan
Truthout CIA Psychologist's Notes Reveal True Purpose Behind Bush's Torture Program by Jason Leopold and Jeffrey Kaye
AmericanTorture.com Expanding the Investigation into SERE Torture by Valtin (Michael Otterman)
AmericanTorture.com NYT Misses Full Story on Mitchell-Jessen (Expose Part 1) by Valtin (Michael Otterman)
American Torture Expose (Part 3): Roger Aldrich, the Al Qaeda Manual, and the Origins of Mitchell-Jessen by Jeff Kaye
AmericanTorture.com Roger Aldrich, the Al-Qaeda Manual, and the Origins of Mitchell-Jessen by Aldin (Michael Otterman)
American Torture Expose (Part 2) : Expanding the Investigation into SERE Torture by Jeff Kaye
American Torture Expose (Part 1): NYT Misses Full Story on Mitchell-Jessen by Jeff Kaye
Salon.com Torture planning began in 2001, Senate Report Reveals by Mark Benjamin
Global Research The CIA's Torture Teachers by Mark Benjamin
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Ezra
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 4357
- Location: Not telling
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
Wow.
“I just felt it would be unfair for me to bring that controversy to a lot of other people, so I decided to step down,” Jessen told Reuters outside his home south of Spokane.
Didn't feel ashamed at what he did.
Scary.
“I just felt it would be unfair for me to bring that controversy to a lot of other people, so I decided to step down,” Jessen told Reuters outside his home south of Spokane.
Didn't feel ashamed at what he did.
Scary.
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iWriteStuff
- blithering blabbermouth
- Posts: 5523
- Location: Sinope
- Contact:
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Arenera
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 2712
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iWriteStuff
- blithering blabbermouth
- Posts: 5523
- Location: Sinope
- Contact:
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
I think this explains our current situation well:
At every confrontation of the Nephites and Lamanites in war, the Book of Mormon is at pains to point out that the conflict is to be attributed to the wickedness of both parties. Indeed, the greatest battle before the final debacle was fought not between the Nephites and Lamanites but between Nephite armies (3 Nephi 4:11). "They shall have no power over thy seed," the Lord promised Nephi, "except they shall rebel against me also" (1 Nephi 2:23). The "also" is important—it means that whenever the Nephites and Lamanites fight it is because both have rebelled against God. It is never a case of "good guys versus bad guys."
- Hugh Nibley, Since Cumorah
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iWriteStuff
- blithering blabbermouth
- Posts: 5523
- Location: Sinope
- Contact:
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
Yes, I bet between water boarding sessions he read to them out of the latest Conference report
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Silver
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 5247
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
History lessons mean nothing unless we actually learn and improve. Look around. Is God blessing us for righteousness?
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Ezra
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 4357
- Location: Not telling
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
Thanks for that quote. I just love anti war quotes that are indisputable.iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 10th, 2017, 8:16 am I think this explains our current situation well:
At every confrontation of the Nephites and Lamanites in war, the Book of Mormon is at pains to point out that the conflict is to be attributed to the wickedness of both parties. Indeed, the greatest battle before the final debacle was fought not between the Nephites and Lamanites but between Nephite armies (3 Nephi 4:11). "They shall have no power over thy seed," the Lord promised Nephi, "except they shall rebel against me also" (1 Nephi 2:23). The "also" is important—it means that whenever the Nephites and Lamanites fight it is because both have rebelled against God. It is never a case of "good guys versus bad guys."
- Hugh Nibley, Since Cumorah
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kittycat51
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1844
- Location: Looking for Zion
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
This is just plain sick and sad. I did not like that some of the articles seemed to draw lots of attention to the fact Jessen is a Latter Saints thus the rest of us are just as bad?
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Silver
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 5247
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... rboarding/
Trump-O-Meter
Bring back waterboarding
“I would bring back waterboarding, and I’d bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding,”
Sources: A Republican primary debate in New Hampshire
PolitiFact is tracking the promises of President Donald Trump. See them all at PolitiFact.com.
Trump's team mostly against waterboarding
By John Kruzel on Thursday, July 13th, 2017 at 10:15 a.m.
Donald Trump's campaign trail promise to bring back waterboarding is at a standstill.
Since taking office, Trump has stepped back from the issue of interrogation methods, deferring to top advisers for guidance on how to handle enemy combatants in U.S. custody.
In his most recent comments on the matter, Trump said he would rely on his secretary of defense, former Marine Gen. James Mattis, about whether to reinstate the practice of waterboarding, which is illegal under current U.S. law.
"Mattis (has) stated publicly that he does not necessarily believe in torture or waterboarding," Trump said in a Jan. 27 press conference. "I don't necessarily agree, but I would tell you that he will override because I'm giving him that power."
During his confirmation process, Mattis told lawmakers that as Pentagon chief, all U.S. military interrogations would comply with the Army Field Manual, which is codified in U.S. law, and prohibits waterboarding and other so-called "enhanced interrogation techniques."
Earlier, Mattis told Trump "a pack of cigarettes and a couple of beers" worked better than torture.
If Trump relied solely on Mattis's input, waterboarding would remain verboten.
However, Trump has previously said he would defer to other members of his circle on the question of waterboarding, and specifically named CIA Director Mike Pompeo.
"I will rely on Pompeo and Mattis and my group," Trump said in a Jan. 25 interview with ABC News. "And if they don't want to do, that's fine. If they do want to do, then I will work for that end."
It's unclear if Trump intends to give equal weight to Mattis and Pompeo. But it's worth noting Mattis' vow to lawmakers referred only to interrogations carried out by the U.S. military, not intelligence operatives.
Pompeo's views on waterboarding are more ambiguous than Mattis'.
During Pompeo's confirmation hearing, he too reassured senators the CIA would comply with the Army Field Manual and would not conduct enhanced interrogation techniques, even at Trump's request.
But in subsequent written responses to senators' questions, Pompeo's position seemed more equivocal, and appeared to leave open the possibility of reviewing the agency's interrogation methods.
Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif., asked whether Pompeo would consider bringing waterboarding back to the CIA. Pompeo replied that he would consult with intelligence and other officials on whether the Army Field Manual's constraints posed "an impediment to gathering vital intelligence to protect the country."
"If experts believed current law was an impediment to gathering vital intelligence to protect the country," he wrote, "I would want to understand such impediments and whether any recommendations were appropriate for changing current law."
That provoked a stern rebuke from Human Rights Watch and others that have been outspoken in criticizing the application of harsh interrogation methods.
Pompeo's responses to questions about torture "are dangerously ambiguous about whether he would endorse abusive practices and seek to subvert existing legal protections," said Maria McFarland Sanchez-Moreno, who co-directs Human Rights Watch's U.S. program.
The CIA would not say whether Pompeo has reviewed the current law governing interrogation, or consulted with intelligence or other officials on the matter.
There's no sign Trump has taken direct action to bring back waterboarding. Rather, his most recent position is that he intends to rely on guidance from his defense secretary.
In earlier statements, however, Trump also said he would defer to his CIA director, who appears to be holding the door ajar for revisiting the law governing U.S. interrogation methods.
For these reasons, we rate Trump's promise as Stalled.
Sources:
PolitiFact, "Bring back waterboarding," Jan. 16, 2017
NPR, "Trump's Press Conference With British Prime Minister, Annotated," Jan. 27, 2017
New York Times, "Inside Trump Defense Secretary Pick's Efforts to Halt Torture," Jan. 2, 2017
ABC News, "Transcript: ABC News anchor David Muir interviews President Trump," Jan. 25, 2017
NBC News, "CIA Pick Pompeo Defies Trump, Says He Won't Waterboard," Jan. 12, 2017
Email interview with CIA Spokesperson Ryan Trapani, July 7, 2017
Trump-O-Meter
Bring back waterboarding
“I would bring back waterboarding, and I’d bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding,”
Sources: A Republican primary debate in New Hampshire
PolitiFact is tracking the promises of President Donald Trump. See them all at PolitiFact.com.
Trump's team mostly against waterboarding
By John Kruzel on Thursday, July 13th, 2017 at 10:15 a.m.
Donald Trump's campaign trail promise to bring back waterboarding is at a standstill.
Since taking office, Trump has stepped back from the issue of interrogation methods, deferring to top advisers for guidance on how to handle enemy combatants in U.S. custody.
In his most recent comments on the matter, Trump said he would rely on his secretary of defense, former Marine Gen. James Mattis, about whether to reinstate the practice of waterboarding, which is illegal under current U.S. law.
"Mattis (has) stated publicly that he does not necessarily believe in torture or waterboarding," Trump said in a Jan. 27 press conference. "I don't necessarily agree, but I would tell you that he will override because I'm giving him that power."
During his confirmation process, Mattis told lawmakers that as Pentagon chief, all U.S. military interrogations would comply with the Army Field Manual, which is codified in U.S. law, and prohibits waterboarding and other so-called "enhanced interrogation techniques."
Earlier, Mattis told Trump "a pack of cigarettes and a couple of beers" worked better than torture.
If Trump relied solely on Mattis's input, waterboarding would remain verboten.
However, Trump has previously said he would defer to other members of his circle on the question of waterboarding, and specifically named CIA Director Mike Pompeo.
"I will rely on Pompeo and Mattis and my group," Trump said in a Jan. 25 interview with ABC News. "And if they don't want to do, that's fine. If they do want to do, then I will work for that end."
It's unclear if Trump intends to give equal weight to Mattis and Pompeo. But it's worth noting Mattis' vow to lawmakers referred only to interrogations carried out by the U.S. military, not intelligence operatives.
Pompeo's views on waterboarding are more ambiguous than Mattis'.
During Pompeo's confirmation hearing, he too reassured senators the CIA would comply with the Army Field Manual and would not conduct enhanced interrogation techniques, even at Trump's request.
But in subsequent written responses to senators' questions, Pompeo's position seemed more equivocal, and appeared to leave open the possibility of reviewing the agency's interrogation methods.
Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif., asked whether Pompeo would consider bringing waterboarding back to the CIA. Pompeo replied that he would consult with intelligence and other officials on whether the Army Field Manual's constraints posed "an impediment to gathering vital intelligence to protect the country."
"If experts believed current law was an impediment to gathering vital intelligence to protect the country," he wrote, "I would want to understand such impediments and whether any recommendations were appropriate for changing current law."
That provoked a stern rebuke from Human Rights Watch and others that have been outspoken in criticizing the application of harsh interrogation methods.
Pompeo's responses to questions about torture "are dangerously ambiguous about whether he would endorse abusive practices and seek to subvert existing legal protections," said Maria McFarland Sanchez-Moreno, who co-directs Human Rights Watch's U.S. program.
The CIA would not say whether Pompeo has reviewed the current law governing interrogation, or consulted with intelligence or other officials on the matter.
There's no sign Trump has taken direct action to bring back waterboarding. Rather, his most recent position is that he intends to rely on guidance from his defense secretary.
In earlier statements, however, Trump also said he would defer to his CIA director, who appears to be holding the door ajar for revisiting the law governing U.S. interrogation methods.
For these reasons, we rate Trump's promise as Stalled.
Sources:
PolitiFact, "Bring back waterboarding," Jan. 16, 2017
NPR, "Trump's Press Conference With British Prime Minister, Annotated," Jan. 27, 2017
New York Times, "Inside Trump Defense Secretary Pick's Efforts to Halt Torture," Jan. 2, 2017
ABC News, "Transcript: ABC News anchor David Muir interviews President Trump," Jan. 25, 2017
NBC News, "CIA Pick Pompeo Defies Trump, Says He Won't Waterboard," Jan. 12, 2017
Email interview with CIA Spokesperson Ryan Trapani, July 7, 2017
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larsenb
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 10895
- Location: Between here and Standing Rock
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
This topic has been covered before on this forum. However, I originally thought that James Mitchell, Jessen’s partner in promulgating enhanced torture techniques, was LDS, too. But the Wikipedia article on Mitchel indicates “he is an atheist who supports Amnesty International”. However, one of Silver’s posts from the Daily KOS tags Mitchell as LDS, as well. Perhaps Mitchell has just updated his present belief status.
Here’s another unfortunate LDS man who got caught up in the enabling of torture: Jay Bybee, also mentioned by one of Silver's posts in this thread. From Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jay_Bybee
Sad stories.
Here’s another unfortunate LDS man who got caught up in the enabling of torture: Jay Bybee, also mentioned by one of Silver's posts in this thread. From Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jay_Bybee
And:Jay Scott Bybee (born October 27, 1953) is a United States Circuit Judge of the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit. He has published numerous articles in law journals[1] and has taught in law school. His primary research interests are in constitutional and administrative law.
While serving in the Bush administration as the Assistant Attorney General for the Office of Legal Counsel, United States Department of Justice, he signed the controversial "Torture Memos" in August 2002. These authorized "enhanced interrogation techniques" that were used in the systematic torture of detainees at Guantanamo Bay detention camp beginning in 2002 and at the Abu Ghraib facility following the United States' invasion of Iraq in 2003. . . . . . . .
Finally:Bybee memo
During Jay Bybee's tenure at the OLC, the CIA acting General Counsel John A. Rizzo requested a legal opinion on detainee interrogation. That request was routed to the OLC by the White House General Counsel Alberto Gonzales, who desired the "ability to quickly obtain information from captured terrorists and their sponsors."[14] The CIA inquired whether, after the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, it could aggressively interrogate suspected high-ranking Al-Qaeda members captured outside the United States in ways some regard as torture. In effect, the CIA was asking for an interpretation of the statutory term of "torture" as defined in 18 U.S.C. § 2340. That section implements, in part, the obligations of the United States under the Geneva Convention Against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman and Degrading Treatment or Punishment.
Bybee signed that legal memorandum which endorsed "enhanced interrogation techniques" as lawful. These same techniques are viewed as torture by the Justice Department,[15] Amnesty International,[16] Human Rights Watch,[17] medical experts in the treatment of torture victims,[18][19] intelligence officials,[20] and American allies.[21] This memo has been the source of controversy; critics of his action have called for his impeachment or resignation.[22] Bybee and five others, known as the "Bush Six", were the subject of a war crimes investigation in Spain,[23] but the government decided against prosecution in 2011.
A memo declassified in 2012 indicates that some in the Bush State Department believed that the methods were illegal under domestic and international law, and constituted war crimes.[24] Secretary of State Colin Powell strongly opposed the invalidation of the Geneva Conventions,[25] and U.S. Navy general counsel Alberto Mora campaigned internally against what he saw as the "catastrophically poor legal reasoning" of the memo.[26] Philip D. Zelikow, former State Department adviser to Condoleezza Rice, in 2009 testified to the Senate Judiciary Committee studying the matter, "It seemed to me that the OLC interpretation of U.S. Constitutional Law in this area was strained and indefensible. I could not imagine any federal court in America agreeing that the entire CIA program could be conducted and it would not violate the American Constitution." Zelikow also alleged that Bush administration officials attempted to destroy his memos alleging fault in Bybee's reasoning.[27]
Office of Professional Responsibility investigation
In July 2009, after a five-year inquiry, the Office of Professional Responsibility released a report, later modified by the Justice Department, saying Jay Bybee and his deputy John Yoo committed "professional misconduct"[28] by providing legal advice that was in possible violation of international and federal laws on torture.[29][30] The OPR initial report recommended that both Bybee and Yoo be referred to the bar associations of the states where they were licensed for further disciplinary action and possible disbarment.[31] David Margolis, Associate Deputy Attorney General of the Department of Justice, examined the OPR report and wrote that Bybee and Yoo had used "poor judgement"[32] but did not "knowingly or recklessly provide incorrect legal advice or ... provide advice in bad faith."[33]
One could surmise that his son’s actions may have been precipitated by his Dad’s involvement with ‘torture’ and the resulting investigations regarding this involvement.On November 19, 2013, Bybee's twenty-six-year-old son, Scott Greer Bybee, committed suicide at the Las Vegas Mormon Temple. Judge Bybee's colleague, Milan D. Smith, Jr. released a statement from Jay and Dianna Bybee: "From the time he was a very young man, Jay and Dianna's son Scott has suffered from severe depression. Over the years, Jay and Dianna have sought the best professional advice and treatments available for Scott, and have done all else they could as loving parents to help Scott cope with his struggles. Yesterday evening, however, Scott's sufferings became too great, and he took his own life.
Sad stories.
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Dave62
- destroyer of hopes & dreams
- Posts: 1341
- Location: Rural Australia
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
The end will never justify the means; unless, of course, you happen to ascribe to ideology that dwells in the shadows of the left or the right.
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buffalo_girl
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7085
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
I don't recall any of the major Christian Church leadership making a public statement condemning torture during that time.
It was an LDS returned missionary, though, whose objections to the torture of Iraqi prisoners cost her her life!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alyssa_Peterson
Here are more details. One must wonder how a young woman on 'suicide watch' is able to commit suicide by shooting herself with her assigned military rifle.
For those of us left in mortality, some realities are just too difficult to process; denial is much more comfortable.
http://www.historycommons.org/entity.js ... peterson_1
It was an LDS returned missionary, though, whose objections to the torture of Iraqi prisoners cost her her life!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alyssa_Peterson
Here are more details. One must wonder how a young woman on 'suicide watch' is able to commit suicide by shooting herself with her assigned military rifle.
For those of us left in mortality, some realities are just too difficult to process; denial is much more comfortable.
http://www.historycommons.org/entity.js ... peterson_1
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RAB
- captain of 100
- Posts: 175
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
These all just make me sad. If anyone should understand that ends don't justify immoral means, it should be LDS folks. The examples of people sacrificing themselves rather than giving in to immoral conduct are replete throughout the scriptures. Not that any of us is perfect, but we should know better than this.
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djinwa
- captain of 100
- Posts: 809
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
If the church doesn't condemn him or take disciplinary action, then it doesn't have a problem with it. So other members could do the same.kittycat51 wrote: ↑October 10th, 2017, 1:07 pm This is just plain sick and sad. I did not like that some of the articles seemed to draw lots of attention to the fact Jessen is a Latter Saints thus the rest of us are just as bad?
Torture, no biggie, but looking at porn requires serious action.
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buffalo_girl
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7085
Re: Bruce Jessen, Mormon Torturer
I wouldn't worry about what others see or don't see, or even what they do or fail to do.If the church doesn't condemn him or take disciplinary action, then it doesn't have a problem with it. So other members could do the same.
Torture, no biggie, but looking at porn requires serious action.
If we know The Book of Mormon is true - despite everything else happening in The Church or out of it - we have God's LAW upon which to measure and conduct our own moral agency.
After all, it does get down to individual standing before The LORD.
