Ether's Avenue

[Silver]

I thought it was a given that neither party is right.

With the exception of the savior, not person that has ever lived on this earth is perfect, and all of us make mistakes. There can be no perfect political party or candidate.

Except for Jesus Christ, there have been no “flawless performances” during mortality. “So while in mortality, let’s strive for steady improvement without obsessing over what behavioral scientists call ‘toxic perfectionism’. - Jeffrey R Holland.

I don't know that I'd say it's a given. What I will say is don't fall victim to false dichotomy thinking.

It absolutely is a given. We are all fallen, and there cannot be a perfect organization created by fallen men. Created by fallen men being the key phrase here. There can only be organizations created by fallen men who strive for perfection.

How about looking at this issue from the following perspective? I am fallen. I sin. I am not perfect. However, I am a perfect tithe payer. I covenanted long ago that I would always pay tithing and I always have. I need to work on other imperfections with the remaining time the Lord gives me. That would fall under the striving "for steady improvement" Elder Holland mentions above.

So applying that perspective to US relations with other countries, we should back away from our current policy of destroying people and committing war crimes among them. So says Brigham Young, prophet of God. That would qualify for steady improvement, not the insane act of following the same failed policies of the past 100 years or more. So says Elder Holland.

[markharr]

I thought it was a given that neither party is right.

With the exception of the savior, not person that has ever lived on this earth is perfect, and all of us make mistakes. There can be no perfect political party or candidate.

I don't know that I'd say it's a given. What I will say is don't fall victim to false dichotomy thinking.

It absolutely is a given. We are all fallen, and there cannot be a perfect organization created by fallen men. Created by fallen men being the key phrase here. There can only be organizations created by fallen men who strive for perfection.

How about looking at this issue from the following perspective? I am fallen. I sin. I am not perfect. However, I am a perfect tithe payer. I covenanted long ago that I would always pay tithing and I always have. I need to work on other imperfections with the remaining time the Lord gives me. That would fall under the striving "for steady improvement" Elder Holland mentions above.

So applying that perspective to US relations with other countries, we should back away from our current policy of destroying people and committing war crimes among them. So says Brigham Young, prophet of God. That would qualify for steady improvement, not the insane act of following the same failed policies of the past 100 years or more. So says Elder Holland.

I would say you should stop judging people who don't have the same level of spiritual knowledge that you do, and who haven't made the same covenants that you have on LDS standards and instead work towards converting them to the truth.

alternatively you could run for office under your own party that is based on gospel standards.

[markharr]

How does Brigham define murder in the context of war?

"Our traditions have been such that we are not apt to look upon war between two nations as murder. . . . Does it justify the slaying of men, women, and children that otherwise would have remained at home in peace, because a great army is doing the work? No: the guilty will be damned for it."
- Brigham Young

I agree that most prophets have said that war should be defensive only, but there are scriptural examples of offensive war being waged by righteous men. The battle of Jericho comes to mind.

There are also examples of defensive war being waged on behalf of Allies. The nephites defending the Anti Nephi Lehi's comes to mind.

[Silver]

I don't know that I'd say it's a given. What I will say is don't fall victim to false dichotomy thinking.

It absolutely is a given. We are all fallen, and there cannot be a perfect organization created by fallen men. Created by fallen men being the key phrase here. There can only be organizations created by fallen men who strive for perfection.

How about looking at this issue from the following perspective? I am fallen. I sin. I am not perfect. However, I am a perfect tithe payer. I covenanted long ago that I would always pay tithing and I always have. I need to work on other imperfections with the remaining time the Lord gives me. That would fall under the striving "for steady improvement" Elder Holland mentions above.

So applying that perspective to US relations with other countries, we should back away from our current policy of destroying people and committing war crimes among them. So says Brigham Young, prophet of God. That would qualify for steady improvement, not the insane act of following the same failed policies of the past 100 years or more. So says Elder Holland.

I would say you should stop judging people who don't have the same level of spiritual knowledge that you do, and who haven't made the same covenants that you have on LDS standards and instead work towards converting them to the truth.

alternatively you could run for office under your own party that is based on gospel standards.

Thou shalt not kill has universal application. I want everyone to obey that one, especially when the murder is being done in my name and with my taxes.

[Silver]

How does Brigham define murder in the context of war?

"Our traditions have been such that we are not apt to look upon war between two nations as murder. . . . Does it justify the slaying of men, women, and children that otherwise would have remained at home in peace, because a great army is doing the work? No: the guilty will be damned for it."
- Brigham Young

I agree that most prophets have said that war should be defensive only, but there are scriptural examples of offensive war being waged by righteous men. The battle of Jericho comes to mind.

There are also examples of defensive war being waged on behalf of Allies. The nephites defending the Anti Nephi Lehi's comes to mind.

These are the exceptions and not the issue. We are talking about both parties for over 100 years using US military might in unrighteous ways. It's time to stop voting for Republicans and Democrats.

[markharr]

It absolutely is a given. We are all fallen, and there cannot be a perfect organization created by fallen men. Created by fallen men being the key phrase here. There can only be organizations created by fallen men who strive for perfection.

How about looking at this issue from the following perspective? I am fallen. I sin. I am not perfect. However, I am a perfect tithe payer. I covenanted long ago that I would always pay tithing and I always have. I need to work on other imperfections with the remaining time the Lord gives me. That would fall under the striving "for steady improvement" Elder Holland mentions above.

So applying that perspective to US relations with other countries, we should back away from our current policy of destroying people and committing war crimes among them. So says Brigham Young, prophet of God. That would qualify for steady improvement, not the insane act of following the same failed policies of the past 100 years or more. So says Elder Holland.

I would say you should stop judging people who don't have the same level of spiritual knowledge that you do, and who haven't made the same covenants that you have on LDS standards and instead work towards converting them to the truth.

alternatively you could run for office under your own party that is based on gospel standards.

Thou shalt not kill has universal application. I want everyone to obey that one, especially when the murder is being done in my name and with my taxes.

I'm 100% certain that none of these people see themselves as murderers. I'm certain that in their mind they are justified.

Maybe they are. I don't know their hearts, and all of the circumstances that led to their decisions and therefore have no authority to judge them.

[iWriteStuff]

I'm 100% certain that none of these people see themselves as murderers. I'm certain that in their mind they are justified.

Maybe they are. I don't know their hearts, and all of the circumstances that led to their decisions and therefore have no authority to judge them.

How likely do you think it is that there's a human being out there who doesn't know war is bad? And if they believe war is good, what does that say about their hearts?

[markharr]

I'm 100% certain that none of these people see themselves as murderers. I'm certain that in their mind they are justified.

Maybe they are. I don't know their hearts, and all of the circumstances that led to their decisions and therefore have no authority to judge them.

How likely do you think it is that there's a human being out there who doesn't believe war is bad? And if they believe war is good, what does that say about their hearts?

If they are warmongers and strive for bloodshed and war and to accomplish wicked things then I expect that they will be judged accordingly.

If the intent of their heart is indeed to defend weaker people or to preserve life then I expect that they will be judged accordingly.

[iWriteStuff]

I'm 100% certain that none of these people see themselves as murderers. I'm certain that in their mind they are justified.

Maybe they are. I don't know their hearts, and all of the circumstances that led to their decisions and therefore have no authority to judge them.

How likely do you think it is that there's a human being out there who doesn't believe war is bad? And if they believe war is good, what does that say about their hearts?

If they are warmongers and strive for bloodshed and war and to accomplish wicked things then I expect that they will be judged accordingly.

If the intent of their heart is indeed to defend weaker people or to preserve life then I expect that they will be judged accordingly.

From your mouth to God's ears.

[markharr]

Just out of curiosity. This is a quote from General Mattis who is now our secretary of defense. It is a quote he made to leaders of various areas of Iraq after the invasion of Iraq before he would send his men in. I am going to censor part of it for obvious reasons.

"I come in peace. I didn’t bring artillery. But I’m pleading with you, with tears in my eyes: If you **** with me, I’ll kill you all."


Warmonger or not? I'm asking out of curiosity. I haven't come to a conclusion.

[Silver]

Just out of curiosity. This is a quote from General Mattis who is now our secretary of defense. It is a quote he made to leaders of various areas of Iraq after the invasion of Iraq before he would send his men in. I am going to censor part of it for obvious reasons.

"I come in peace. I didn’t bring artillery. But I’m pleading with you, with tears in my eyes: If you **** with me, I’ll kill you all."


Warmonger or not? I'm asking out of curiosity. I haven't come to a conclusion.

That's easy. He is a bloodthirsty warmonger, the likes of which President Kimball warned against. Mad Dog may have good intentions, but his intentions are entirely evil. Besides, the whole premise of the war was wrong in the first place. He should have never been in theater to threaten anyone.

[markharr]

Just out of curiosity. This is a quote from General Mattis who is now our secretary of defense. It is a quote he made to leaders of various areas of Iraq after the invasion of Iraq before he would send his men in. I am going to censor part of it for obvious reasons.

"I come in peace. I didn’t bring artillery. But I’m pleading with you, with tears in my eyes: If you **** with me, I’ll kill you all."


Warmonger or not? I'm asking out of curiosity. I haven't come to a conclusion.

That's easy. He is a bloodthirsty warmonger, the likes of which President Kimball warned against. Mad Dog may have good intentions, but his intentions are entirely evil. Besides, the whole premise of the war was wrong in the first place. He should have never been in theater to threaten anyone.

Well It wasn't up to General Mattis where we went to war. It was authorized by congress. He would have had the choice to resign if he strongly disagreed with what we were doing.

[Silver]

Just out of curiosity. This is a quote from General Mattis who is now our secretary of defense. It is a quote he made to leaders of various areas of Iraq after the invasion of Iraq before he would send his men in. I am going to censor part of it for obvious reasons.

"I come in peace. I didn’t bring artillery. But I’m pleading with you, with tears in my eyes: If you **** with me, I’ll kill you all."


Warmonger or not? I'm asking out of curiosity. I haven't come to a conclusion.

That's easy. He is a bloodthirsty warmonger, the likes of which President Kimball warned against. Mad Dog may have good intentions, but his intentions are entirely evil. Besides, the whole premise of the war was wrong in the first place. He should have never been in theater to threaten anyone.

Well It wasn't up to General Mattis where we went to war. It was authorized by congress. He would have had the choice to resign if he strongly disagreed with what we were doing.

Wouldn't it be a better world if more men and women of the military kept their oath to defend the country by not following orders to kill innocent people overseas?

[markharr]

Just out of curiosity. This is a quote from General Mattis who is now our secretary of defense. It is a quote he made to leaders of various areas of Iraq after the invasion of Iraq before he would send his men in. I am going to censor part of it for obvious reasons.

"I come in peace. I didn’t bring artillery. But I’m pleading with you, with tears in my eyes: If you **** with me, I’ll kill you all."


Warmonger or not? I'm asking out of curiosity. I haven't come to a conclusion.

That's easy. He is a bloodthirsty warmonger, the likes of which President Kimball warned against. Mad Dog may have good intentions, but his intentions are entirely evil. Besides, the whole premise of the war was wrong in the first place. He should have never been in theater to threaten anyone.

Well It wasn't up to General Mattis where we went to war. It was authorized by congress. He would have had the choice to resign if he strongly disagreed with what we were doing.

Wouldn't it be a better world if more men and women of the military kept their oath to defend the country by not following orders to kill innocent people overseas?

I don't know that it would be a better world. I'm not saying you're wrong, just that I don't know.
I'm only a man. I can only see time in the linear manner of this world and not all things at once as god can.

[iWriteStuff]

"We have a tragedy. We're going to do — and what happened in Las Vegas, it's in many ways a miracle. The police department has done such an incredible job and we'll be talking about gun laws as time goes by," Trump said as he departed for Puerto Rico.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/trump ... le/2636361

Well, that sounds just wonderful, don't it?

[iWriteStuff]

Added elsewhere, but deserves a place of honor here as well:

At every confrontation of the Nephites and Lamanites in war, the Book of Mormon is at pains to point out that the conflict is to be attributed to the wickedness of both parties. Indeed, the greatest battle before the final debacle was fought not between the Nephites and Lamanites but between Nephite armies (3 Nephi 4:11). "They shall have no power over thy seed," the Lord promised Nephi, "except they shall rebel against me also" (1 Nephi 2:23). The "also" is important—it means that whenever the Nephites and Lamanites fight it is because both have rebelled against God. It is never a case of "good guys versus bad guys."
- Hugh Nibley, Since Cumorah

Do we think we're the good guys? We are only if we are repenting and coming unto the Lord.

Who is righteous? Anyone who is repenting. No matter how bad he has been, if he is repenting he is a righteous man. There is hope for him. And no matter how good he has been all his life, if he is not repenting, he is a wicked man. The difference is which way you are facing. The man on the top of the stairs facing down is much worse off than the man on the bottom step who is facing up. The direction we are facing, that is repentance; and that is what determines whether we are good or bad.
- Hugh Nibley, Approaching Zion

[Silver]

https://www.opensecrets.org/parties/

Look at all the money those fiends in Washington extract from "we the people" to keep themselves in power with a goal of enriching themselves. Billions and billions (where's Karl Sagan when you need him?) wasted on those traitors.

2016 dem_rep money.JPG (111.02 KiB) Viewed 1053 times

Wait, who donates to Democrats? Yuck. Well, Trump does. Mnuchin does. Ross does. Such loyal patriots they are, knowing exactly upon which side of their toast the butter dwells.

[iWriteStuff]

Wait, who donates to Democrats? Yuck. Well, Trump does. Mnuchin does. Ross does. Such loyal patriots they are, knowing exactly upon which side of their toast the butter dwells.

I used to donate to the Republicans until I wised up.

heads&tails.png (171.99 KiB) Viewed 1046 times

[iWriteStuff]

In honor of the release of the JFK files:

Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.
- John Fitzgerald Kennedy

[iWriteStuff]

And a timely reminder, mostly for myself:

"Every step in the direction of increasing one's personal holdings is a step away from Zion, which is another way of saying, as the Lord has proclaimed in various ways, that one cannot serve two masters: to the degree in which he loves the one he will hate the other, and so it is with God and business, for mammon is simply the standard Hebrew word for any kind of financial dealing."
- Hugh Nibley, Approaching Zion

[iWriteStuff]

Slight detour, but what does Global Warming have to do with national sovereignty? Any guesses?

global warming.jpg (143.05 KiB) Viewed 938 times

[Hogmeister]

Hegelian dialectic. Global warming is only one of many, more and more, "pressing global issues" that will be required to launch the final phase of the Anti-Christ (the counterfeit savior) beast system.

[iWriteStuff]

"Freedom lies in being bold."
--Robert Frost

[iWriteStuff]

Hello and welcome back to Ether's Avenue! Here's a good one from that guy that likes to talk about the economy, ole what's his name:

“In a nation distracted by faction, there are, no doubt, always a few, though commonly but a very few, who preserve their judgment untainted by the general contagion. They seldom amount to more than, here and there, a solitary individual, without any influence, excluded, by his own candour, from the confidence of either party, and who, though he may be one of the wisest, is necessarily, upon that very account, one of the most insignificant men in the society.”
― Adam Smith, The Theory of Moral Sentiments

[iWriteStuff]

Here's another great observation about the National Debt from the same white-powder wig dude:

"It is the highest impertinence and presumption, therefore, in kings and ministers, to pretend to watch over the economy of private people, and to restrain their expence, either by sumptuary laws, or by prohibiting the importation of foreign luxuries. They are themselves always, and without any exception, the greatest spendthrifts in the society. Let them look well after their own expence, and they may safely trust private people with theirs. If their own extravagance does not ruin the state, that of their subjects never will."
- Adam Smith, The Wealth of Nations