Pornography addiction and divorce

[Chive123]

I could use some advice from church leaders, divorcees, or anyone with a family counseling background. My family depends on it as well as my own sanity. I grew up LDS in an active home. I started using pornography at the age of 13. At the same time I was introduced to marijuana, drinking, and smoking. I hid it from my parents because I had a controlling dad and a passive mom. I knew it was bad but I didn't want to hurt them. I struggled with these problems until I went on my mission. I went 16 months on my mission without issues. At 16 month I was again trapped by pornography and couldn't stop. My mission president decided to send me home. It was hard. I felt like it contributed to my depression and porn addiction.

I met my wife shortly after at an lds student ward. She was the most beautiful thing I had ever laid my eyes on. We went on one date and hit it off immediately. She had just purchased an apartment pretty close to me work. She preferred me to sleep there since it was in a rough part of town. The sleepovers led to near fornication. She told me she wanted to get married or break up because she didn't want to have sex before marriage. I felt like I loved her so we eloped only 3 months after we met. She had a dominant personality and I am more passive. I still struggled with pornography but I figured after I could married it wouldn't be an issue. So out of fear of abandonment I decided to keep it a secret.

After marriage the porn use was mostly under control and contained. I few slip ups now and then. Then the stress of life started happening. With added stress I started using porn more and more often. Still keeping it a secret. After 4 years we had our son. Around that time was the first time she caught me viewing pornography. She reacted just like I though she would. Yelling, threats, ultimatums, and belittling. I talked to the bishop and went to counseling for a few months. After that my wife assumed that the problem was under control. But a relapse led to another 5 years of secrets and addiction. On the 9th year of marriage we had our second child, my daughter. My son was now 4. My wife caught me again using porn. She didn't catch me in the act this time she just had a feeling that I was using it again. She started the bullying again and tried to force me into counseling. But since she didn't have proof I continued to deny the problem. After about another month of continued threats and ultimatums she found pornography on my phone. I was forced to confess because I got caught.

She then told me that she wanted a divorce. She said that if I cleaned up my act and learned how to honest with her then she would want to get remarried after I proved myself. I agreed to it. We were both emotionally drained by that point. She said she didn't want to use lawyers to file for our divorce so I let her come up with the terms. I was absolutely sure that I would be able to kick my habits and we would be together again. The amount of alimony and child support that I agreed to pay was more than anyone could afford. But that didn't matter because we had an understanding. Shortly after the divorce reality had set in and I was angry about the situation. Angry with myself and my now Ex Wife. How could we let this happen to my little family? I spiraled out of control at that point. Depression fueled porn use, smoking, and drinking. I told my ex wife that I wanted nothing to do with her. I moved into my parents house at the age of 31 because I couldn't afford the divorce support. 3 months after the divorce my dad caught a hold of the divorce papers. He was astonished and demanded I go see a lawyer and get it fixed immediately. I sat with the lawyer and we developed a plan of attack to get it fixed. I knew my ex wife would be furious if I went after her legally. At that point I decided to make an attempt to reconcile our marriage. But since I had not conquered my demons she told me that I needed to be clean from my struggles for at least 6 months before she would consider it. She demanded that I do it on my own.

I tried and failed multiple times. I realized my life was much better when I was married. As I am struggling through this hard time my ex called me to tell me that she was in a new relationship with a guy she met at an lds mid singles activity. I was devastated. While she dated him I numbed the pain even more with pornography. I had met a girl online that lived in Texas. I hit it off with her and decided to book a flight to go visit her. My ex told me she broke up with her boyfriend two weeks before my trip. I was still hurt by her relationship. But she wanted to attempt to reconcile. So with my flight already booked to Texas my ex and I decided to go to Disneyland with our kids. When we got back from Disneyland I left for Texas to visit the girl I met online. The whole time I was there all I could think about was my ex wife. I lied to her and told her I was going on a work business trip. On my flight back I sent her a message confessing where I had really gone. She was shocked and upset. I tried with all I had to apologize and tell her I love her and that I was sorry. My ex decided that she wanted nothing to do with me again. I made every effort to get her back while she went on a dating frenzy. 8 months later after being there for her 100 % while watching her date other guys she finally told me she wanted to try to reconcile again. She had booked a week long singles trip that she was obligated to go on. After she got back we were to start to working on our relationship. The day she got back she had told me that she met someone on the trip and that they were now a couple. Again ripping my heart out. So I started dating again. Eventually she broke up with her boyfriend after 9 months. After the break up she came to me for another reconciliation attempt. Only this time I didn't take the invitation. I was to pre-occupied with dating another girl. I broke up with the girl I was dating 6 months later. During that 6 months my ex had also dated other guys. It was hard because I had never introduced my kids to anyone I dated. But my ex wife had the kids around all of her boyfriends and even at singles activities. When my ex gets a new boyfriend he is with her and the kids constantly.

Fast forward to the present. 4 years since the divorce. The pain is still there as if it happened yesterday. Both of us with walls up. I decided it is to painful to approach my ex about getting back together while she is still actively going on dates and single activities. When I had recently heard that she had just broken up with yet another boyfriend I decided that it was now or never to make yet another attempt to try and work things out. I told her I still loved her and that I wanted to be a family again. I had a very rigorous work schedule coming up that was to last 6 weeks. She said we could talk after that. That same weekend she was planning a trip down to moab with our kids, some friends, her brother, his wife. I have always been close with her brother. So I asked if he would let me know how she acted while on the trip because I assumed that some of her friends that were going were single guys. They got home earlier than expected so I called her brother to find out why. He told me because my ex wife was acting inappropriately with one of the guys on the trip and that he didn't want to be around that behavior so he insisted that the come home. I was hurt but not surprised. I didn't confront my ex wife about it. But it did ruin my plans to talk to her after my crazy work schedule. During my work schedule I was working graveyard shift. So my ex and I agreed that I would pick the kids up at her house in the morning and help them get to school before I went to sleep for the day. I started noticing an unfamiliar car parked out in front of her house every morning when I came to get them. Whenever the car was parked there my ex would hurry and send the kids out the door. When the car wasn't there she was friendly and usually invited me in to help her get the kids ready. By this time I knew what was going on. The car parked out front in the morning became so consistent that I started taking pictures of it. I sort of thought that I could use it to prove possible cohabitation in court to reduce or eliminate my alimony. On one particular morning my ex messaged me last minute and told me not to come to her house and said that she would take the kids to school. I was already in front of her house so I ignored the message. Sure enough within the same minute a guy walked from the front door of her house out to the car I have been seeing every day and back inside. Since I ignored her message I walked into the house to get the kids hoping I could confront my ex and this guy. Her bedroom door was closed and locked. She told me that I could get the kids and go. I knew that the new guy she was dating was in the bedroom.

It was hard knowing that my ex wife was hiding her new boyfriend from me and letting him sleep over with my kids in her house. Whenever I knew my ex was with him she just referred to him as her "friend". So finally I confronted her about everything I told her that she cant be acting like that with the kids around. I was angry and she lashed back with how I was dishonest during our marriage. I also confronted her about the Moab trip and other inappropriate behavior around the kids. She denied everything even though I sent several of the pictures I took of his car in front of her house in the morning. The excuses kept coming and she never admitted to anything.

The bottom line is that I want my family back. My parents are still together after 40 years of marriage. My ex comes from a broken home with a father who was never there and a mother that had to work full time just to keep scraps on the table. I have hurt her and she has hurt me. She thinks all the pain she has caused me is justified because of my porn habits while we were married. I know for sure that if our communication would have been better in the marriage that we could have made it work. I could have conquered my addiction with caring and love from my wife. But her rage and temper when she gets hurt was overbearing. I thought the only safe thing to do was to keep hiding it and hope she never found out again. We had a good marriage overall. We got along great 99 percent of the time. When we did argue she always won. She was dominating when I disagreed so I usually backed down. It was hurtful and I wish she realized that she played a part in the break down of our marriage. But I feel like if we had made better choices with communication and expressing our needs that it would have worked. I still love her and deep down I know she still loves me. But she is so hung up with her single social life that I feel like she cant break away from it. Or her friends would not approve of trying to work things out with me. My son is struggling in school and my ex is selling her house and moving because she cant make ends meet on her low income and my alimony and child support. I am hurting for my kids right now because none of this is their fault. They are 7 and 4 years old now. Switching schools will only add to my sons anxiety. They are to young to express true feelings of pain. They don't fully understand what is going on. They are confused. They are the only thing that bring real joy in my life. They love me unconditionally and love spending every moment they can with me. But none of that is getting through to my ex wife.

What can I do if anything to get her to try and work things out? I love her and its totally worth it to me.

[Nan]

You do need to get help. I am talking about professional help. You and your ex-wife are not good for each other. You are not healthy together. No wife can love you enough to make you stop using porn. You had that addiction before you ever met her. You need to heal first before you get into another relationship because no relationship will ever work out unless you heal. (Not just the porn but the other issues going on in your life.) Hiding issues will always cause things to explode because people will always find out. And dishonesty will ruin any relationship on this planet. I hope you get help.

[Elizabeth]

Chive, You must face the reality of the fact that it was your own choice of immorality which has caused your life and your families to be what it is. Only you can change this.

I started using pornography at the age of 13. At the same time I was introduced to marijuana, drinking, and smoking... I still struggled with pornography... With added stress I started using porn more and more often... After 4 years we had our son. Around that time was the first time she caught me viewing pornography... a relapse led to another 5 years of secrets and addiction. On the 9th year of marriage we had our second child, my daughter. My son was now 4... she found pornography on my phone. I was forced to confess because I got caught.
She then told me that she wanted a divorce... Depression fueled porn use, smoking, and drinking. I told my ex wife that I wanted nothing to do with her. I moved into my parents house at the age of 31 because I couldn't afford the divorce support... I decided to make an attempt to reconcile our marriage. But since I had not conquered my demons she told me that I needed to be clean from my struggles for at least 6 months before she would consider it...
I tried and failed multiple times. I realized my life was much better when I was married... my ex called me to tell me that she was in a new relationship with a guy she met at an lds mid singles activity. I was devastated. While she dated him I numbed the pain even more with pornography... My ex told me she broke up with her boyfriend... she wanted to attempt to reconcile...
Fast forward to the present. 4 years since the divorce. The pain is still there as if it happened yesterday.
The bottom line is that I want my family back... She thinks all the pain she has caused me is justified because of my porn habits while we were married. I know for sure that if our communication would have been better in the marriage that we could have made it work. I could have conquered my addiction with caring and love from my wife.
My son is struggling in school and my ex is selling her house and moving because she cant make ends meet on her low income and my alimony and child support. I am hurting for my kids right now because none of this is their fault. They are 7 and 4 years old now.
What can I do if anything to get her to try and work things out? I love her and its totally worth it to me.

[Matchmaker]

It seems like a case of "the pot calling the kettle black." Your wife's anger and resentment over your pornography addiction is understandable, but also almost hypocritical, considering she is dealing with a sex, or relationship addiction, too - just one that manifests itself differently than the sex addiction you have. Serial monogamy, plus living or sleeping with a guy she isn't married to, isn't a healthy (emotionally or spiritually) way to live either. Unless you both agree to get some serious addiction therapy and marital counseling, I don't think your eternal marriage prospects look very good.

[RyanK]

1 John 4:19
19 We love him, because he first loved us.

Do we believe in miracles? Do we believe that the power of Christ can transform one's life (or a couple's lives) to that of goodness and happiness? If so, that is Faith!

My input is to, first, try to envision what a good righteous life would be (together as a family, happy, healthy marriage, etc), next identify the steps that are needed to get there, then deeply rely on the Savior's grace to make that happen in connection with one's actions (exercising agency), and finally never giving up.

If it is God's will that your family be reunited, and I suppose you and the Ex can find out via prayer* (NOTE: mutually!--none of this unrighteous dominion "God told me that you are to be my wife!" stuff while she's not in agreement), then do what must be done to make it a reality. And that will likely require an immense level of forgiveness towards each other (remember though, be the first to love--John 4:19), forsaking sin, developing Christlike attributes, and practical common sense tips to staying on the straight and narrow (perhaps each professional counseling can help, not just for you, but marriage counseling for the two of you--not sure if you're there yet now, but perhaps in the future).

Think of it, if this is the mountain summit that the Lord has in store for you, than this will likely be one of the greatest, most trying, exhausting, yet rewarding climbs of your entire life. But if you don't climb, you won't get there.



* And if, via prayer, you feel a sense that the Lord has other life/family plans for you, then I say be faithful with that impression. Either way, though, you are a father now. And I'm glad that you've recognized your children's current situation they are in now. Doesn't make sense to me that you should disengage from them completely.

[jockeybox]

Chive, I was married to someone (for 13 years) who was controlling, verbally abusive and just not a good fit for me. I can relate to much of what you wrote, even the hiding of porn use and a spouse sleeping with someone else. She pointed the blame of all her decisions to me.

I am not going to suggest that you don't try and reconcile, as that might be the right action. However, the one thing that helped me was asking God to heal my pain.

There was one specific conversation I had with my wife (at the time). I felt the Lord was telling me it was okay to let go based on things she was saying. After that conversation, the pain lessened tremendously. The emotional tie was severed and it freed me. There was still big challenges with kids and divorcing, but the love for her dissipated and it was exactly what I needed. Again, I realize this isn't the path everyone should take.

It's been three years since my divorce. I was just married a few weeks ago and I couldn't be happier. She is a great fit for me. I still regularly see my ex, as we share custody, but it's healthier for everyone.

As a side note, I would get the porn use under wraps before you start any relationship (which you may have). Otherwise, you'll likely justify your use when a relationship gets challenging.

[jnjnelson]

What can I do if anything to get her to try and work things out? I love her and its totally worth it to me.

I have to say - I do not envy your situation. It seems very difficult and I feel for you. Having said that, I have some experience in overcoming relationship problems and I know a few principles that might help.

The best thing you can do to try and convince her to try and work things out is to change yourself, and have no expectation whatsoever for her. I know this is a little counter-intuitive (in order to get what you want, you have to stop focusing on what you want), but the only solution you have control over is within you, so you need to start and finish there.

You work on your weaknesses and let her work on her weaknesses. Don't even recognize her weaknesses, for her weaknesses don't really matter (if it actually is "totally worth it.") For you, the entire issue has to be about changing you - changing your own character, not changing her mind or her character. You need to become a person who is more attractive to the love you desire; and once you attract that love, it will naturally come to you (whether it is from her or not.) However, know that once you become that better person, the question of whether she will try and work things out will be less important to you - because you will have changed your focus from getting her to do something to getting yourself to do something. It is that change in focus that might make you more attractive. And at that point, if she doesn't want to try and work things out, you will be able to move on, because you will have changed yourself for the better.

I give this advice not because I have done it and it works - but because I am currently doing it and it works. It is a process that never ends - sometimes I do it better than at other times, but the more I do it, the happier I am. This process has become my life and the process helps me live a life of happiness.

[light-one]

You've already got some good advice. Look at the big picture. Your kids are old enough now to know what is going on. You will be those children's father forever, so be a good one. Fix yourself. You can do it. Let your ex have her space and be a good father to those kids. The kids will love you more than you can imagine. Your wife will see that she is the one missing out on the family relationship as the kids will opt to live with you. That fixed child support and alimony right there. Make sure that those kids know that you love them more than anything in the world. This pays off big when they are in their thirties. When you have become clean, and you have your children, and you are right with God, you may look at the various women that find you attractive and decide if you still want your ex in your life. If, while you were making great strides, she has been her same old self, she will no longer appeal to you. On the other hand, if she woke up when the kids moved in with you and got right with God herself, you have a lifetime of things to talk about.

I got custody of my kids when they were young. In their teenage years they decided to try living with their mother. My children are all girls. They figured when I said their mother was crazy, I was just being resentful. They lived with their mother for less than a year and now know that she truly is crazy.

Get clean, love your kids, forget about dating for a while. Get your life in order. Be a winner!

[Chive123]

I appreciate all of the advice I have been given so far. I know it has to all start with me and I am working on the courage to try to become better. My fear of failure and self doubt has overcome with every attempt. I always get discouraged and down on myself. The guilt and shame of relapse is almost worse than just being numb and giving in. But I know I have to keep trying. With that said my biggest issue is what is going on n the presence of my kids. The evidence is there is that she is having her boyfriend sleep at her house with the kids home. I don't know if they see him in her bedroom or if she has been good at hiding it. I was very angry when I confronted her. She gets very upset with rage even when I try to talk calmly. So knowing that she would fly off the handle I decided to go in with guns blazing. I needed to know how serious I am. While we were married if I had any form of constructive critizism or if I disagreed on things she would get upset. Her tone is naturally very arguementive. I grew up in a home with a father who would yell and lose his temper when he got upset. So when I hear her lose her temper I would naturally back down to keep the peace. I have always had self esteem and abandonment issues. She has never witnessed as upset as I was when I found out about the kids. Especially since I know from close mutual friends that she acts inappropriatly with other men in front of the kids. Also many times when I ask the kids what they did or who they were with for the day then my son goes silent. When my son would tell me about his day he would never give me details of who he was with. This was during the time that my ex wife was dating her current boyfriend behind my back. My 4 year old daughter finally mentioned his name to me. Whenever I ask my kids if they saw "John Doe" today then they would get defensive and deny it. My point is that my ex has been telling the kids to lie to me about his very existence. She hid him from me for two months. A guy that has been basically living with my kids that my ex never bothered to tell me about. Before whenever she got in a new relationship she would rub it in my face. Now she is being secretive. I am positive he will continue to sleep at her house. Especially because she denied it and deflected blame when I had evidence. It makes me want to have them move in with me now. So my question is why did she hide this relationship when her previous ones she made known to me. Should I just drop it even if I continue to find out that he is still sleeping over with the kids home? Or do I need to keep closer tabs on everything she does with the kids and badger her with questions about what she is doing and who she is with?

[passionflower]

I appreciate all of the advice I have been given so far. I know it has to all start with me and I am working on the courage to try to become better. My fear of failure and self doubt has overcome with every attempt. I always get discouraged and down on myself. The guilt and shame of relapse is almost worse than just being numb and giving in. But I know I have to keep trying. With that said my biggest issue is what is going on n the presence of my kids. The evidence is there is that she is having her boyfriend sleep at her house with the kids home. I don't know if they see him in her bedroom or if she has been good at hiding it. I was very angry when I confronted her. She gets very upset with rage even when I try to talk calmly. So knowing that she would fly off the handle I decided to go in with guns blazing. I needed to know how serious I am. While we were married if I had any form of constructive critizism or if I disagreed on things she would get upset. Her tone is naturally very arguementive. I grew up in a home with a father who would yell and lose his temper when he got upset. So when I hear her lose her temper I would naturally back down to keep the peace. I have always had self esteem and abandonment issues. She has never witnessed as upset as I was when I found out about the kids. Especially since I know from close mutual friends that she acts inappropriatly with other men in front of the kids. Also many times when I ask the kids what they did or who they were with for the day then my son goes silent. When my son would tell me about his day he would never give me details of who he was with. This was during the time that my ex wife was dating her current boyfriend behind my back. My 4 year old daughter finally mentioned his name to me. Whenever I ask my kids if they saw "John Doe" today then they would get defensive and deny it. My point is that my ex has been telling the kids to lie to me about his very existence. She hid him from me for two months. A guy that has been basically living with my kids that my ex never bothered to tell me about. Before whenever she got in a new relationship she would rub it in my face. Now she is being secretive. I am positive he will continue to sleep at her house. Especially because she denied it and deflected blame when I had evidence. It makes me want to have them move in with me now. So my question is why did she hide this relationship when her previous ones she made known to me. Should I just drop it even if I continue to find out that he is still sleeping over with the kids home? Or do I need to keep closer tabs on everything she does with the kids and badger her with questions about what she is doing and who she is with?

[Bee Prepared]

Having lived a lot of life, I will impart of my wisdom. ( what little I have)

First of all, get help, learn from the experience and remember, think of this often, say it to yourself everyday, " Wickedness never was happiness."

I have also been victim of choosing coping methods that are wrong. We all know or have family members who choose alcohol as a coping method, compounding their problems with an addiction, bad choice. In talking with the Bishop one time, I was explaining all the reasons I made a bad choice.
He looked at me and said, " Do you know right from wrong?" I answered " yes," he then said, " Stop making excuses and trying to place blame."

Satan is so cunning, he has brought pornography right into the home via the internet. He makes sin readily available. He knows how strong a man's desires are and uses it to destroy lives and marriages. We are living in the fullness of times, put on the whole armor of God, steel yourself against
the adversary, pray, fortify yourself, resist temptation, do not be an easy target. Study the atonement, Jesus Christ took upon Himself all the sins of the world so that you can repent and be forgiven, it makes me cry that He would do that for me. You definitely have some white water to manuever, get a good boat, use the skills the Lord has given, and water that looks like glass will soon come. There will always be challenges, but if you learn from this, it will be easier to handle the challenges of life. You are loved, you are a child of God, never forget that.

[BrotherOfMahonri]

You do need to get help. I am talking about professional help. You and your ex-wife are not good for each other. You are not healthy together. No wife can love you enough to make you stop using porn. You had that addiction before you ever met her. You need to heal first before you get into another relationship because no relationship will ever work out unless you heal. (Not just the porn but the other issues going on in your life.) Hiding issues will always cause things to explode because people will always find out. And dishonesty will ruin any relationship on this planet. I hope you get help.

I disagree with this perspective almost entirely and feel it is too common a reaction in the LDS culture, and promulgates and extends the problem (because of how Satan bashes anyone struggling with anything) more than helps with it. I invite you to ignore this feedback for your own sake. There are absolutely lies in it from my perspective and very shallow conclusions.

[BrotherOfMahonri]

Chive, You must face the reality of the fact that it was your own choice of immorality which has caused your life and your families to be what it is. Only you can change this.

Another heartless conclusion in my view, all to typical in this culture of ours, Christ is much more than this type of response, much more. This feels like a manual response, rather than a heavenly inspired response to someone whose heart is hurting, despite whatever he has or is struggling with. Christ's gospel is so much more than these conclusive - one-way-only responses. Please don't let such dissuade you. Hope to respond soon, but this type of thinking has to be at least countered.

[BrotherOfMahonri]

Chive, I was married to someone (for 13 years) who was controlling, verbally abusive and just not a good fit for me. I can relate to much of what you wrote, even the hiding of porn use and a spouse sleeping with someone else. She pointed the blame of all her decisions to me.

I am not going to suggest that you don't try and reconcile, as that might be the right action. However, the one thing that helped me was asking God to heal my pain.

There was one specific conversation I had with my wife (at the time). I felt the Lord was telling me it was okay to let go based on things she was saying. After that conversation, the pain lessened tremendously. The emotional tie was severed and it freed me. There was still big challenges with kids and divorcing, but the love for her dissipated and it was exactly what I needed. Again, I realize this isn't the path everyone should take.

It's been three years since my divorce. I was just married a few weeks ago and I couldn't be happier. She is a great fit for me. I still regularly see my ex, as we share custody, but it's healthier for everyone.

As a side note, I would get the porn use under wraps before you start any relationship (which you may have). Otherwise, you'll likely justify your use when a relationship gets challenging.

Great advice in my view, except for this part: "I would get the porn use under wraps before you start any relationship (which you may have). Otherwise, you'll likely justify your use when a relationship gets challenging." - unless it is so bad that you can't think clearly which doesn't FEEL like is the case in your opening post (OP).

Unless it has become you entirely and you can't see anyone for who they are (which does not feel like the case at all, even and esp. the beauty I felt just reading the simple statement you made about seeing your wife for the first time).

Most marriages in my view, dealing with this issue, fall to divorce because of what is pushed upon us in our culture - I will respond more later when I have some prayer and thought to help aid my response, but please take hope, don't stop dating or entertaining healthy relationships with first your ex wife (in my view) as you seem to still lover her greatly, just have this huge wall that can be broken down, as WHAT A BETTER WAY TO SPEND YOUR TIME THAN WITH A POTENTIAL WOMAN YOU CAN LOVE TRULY - satan wants you to avoid dating and healthy potential relationships at all costs, he wants you to avoid any HEALTHY activity like proper dating, so he can try and depress you and trap you in what I call Lucifer's Lounge - more on that later - a lounge wherein if you can learn to recognize, there is power in knowing what things really are, and there is power to overcome these carnal natural man issues that Satan wants to keep you trapped within.

One quick suggestion is the power in fasting. Satan will do all he can to dissuade you before and during a personal private fast between you and the Lord, but I have a powerful witness of the power of the fast, in that fasting (try it for a few days asking God on your knees to renew your body when you are starving - fasting gives your body the back seat so you can see more clearly to tackle a struggle, whereas tackling a powerful struggle like this no matter how good your efforts fails almost always (as you have alluded to) until you force the powerful body to put the spirit in the front seat - and fasting is the FIRST STEP in my view to overcoming any addiction.

I feel great faith in your OP above, take faith over all other societal norms and remedies to this, and fast, fast specifically - and when your body is clamoring for food in this sincere fast (of a day or two) go to the knees, and excersize your great faith in that God can renew your body, can strengthen you, and give you power over the body.

[Sirocco]

Lucifer's Lounge, what even is that...?

[shadow]

Lucifer's Lounge, what even is that...?

The kick back place on ldsff where apostates don't have to worry about being called apostates. Sit back, down a few homemade brews, bad talk the Lords Prophets and apostles, share disgust about the church. Make up precepts regarding tithing and other commandments. Lots of mingling and planning camp outs and stuff :ymcowboy:

[Bee Prepared]

Lucifer's Lounge, what even is that...?

I'm not sure but...

[BrotherOfMahonri]

Lucifer's Lounge, what even is that...?

The kick back place on ldsff where apostates don't have to worry about being called apostates. Sit back, down a few homemade brews, bad talk the Lords Prophets and apostles, share disgust about the church. Make up precepts regarding tithing and other commandments. Lots of mingling and planning camp outs and stuff :ymcowboy:

Fools will mock, hopefully you don't become one. Lucifer's lounge - which I've answered you previously, came from the Lord, where he introduced the phrase to me the first time I ever heard it in a part of my patriarchal blessing, stating I would understand Lucifer's Lounge, philosophies of men, etc. as I went forward in my strong capacity to fraternize with people in a friendly supportive manner, and would be able to lift, inspire and help them because of understanding Lucifer's Lounge and the great love I have for people.

I invite you to have confidence in what gifts the Lord bestows upon you despite the mockery that occurs from others in your attempt to use them.

Working on finishing this up as I've written my ponderings in journals on the topic the Lord introduced to me.
http://voiceofanearthquake.blogspot.com ... ounge.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Now, back on topic please - isn't about your feelings about new things you don't understand, but the invitations of the OP.

[russdm]

Self Erased

[Bee Prepared]

Lucifer's Lounge, what even is that...?

The kick back place on ldsff where apostates don't have to worry about being called apostates. Sit back, down a few homemade brews, bad talk the Lords Prophets and apostles, share disgust about the church. Make up precepts regarding tithing and other commandments. Lots of mingling and planning camp outs and stuff :ymcowboy:

Don't forget all that good food on the campouts. Deviled eggs, red devils food cupcakes, devils brew and a cool cauldron.
GOOD TIMES!

[BrotherOfMahonri]

You do need to get help. I am talking about professional help. You and your ex-wife are not good for each other. You are not healthy together. No wife can love you enough to make you stop using porn. You had that addiction before you ever met her. You need to heal first before you get into another relationship because no relationship will ever work out unless you heal. (Not just the porn but the other issues going on in your life.) Hiding issues will always cause things to explode because people will always find out. And dishonesty will ruin any relationship on this planet. I hope you get help.

I disagree with this perspective almost entirely and feel it is too common a reaction in the LDS culture, and promulgates and extends the problem (because of how Satan bashes anyone struggling with anything) more than helps with it. I invite you to ignore this feedback for your own sake. There are absolutely lies in it from my perspective and very shallow conclusions.

Nan's comment sounds like good advice to me. The research I have done suggests having a year of being sober before dating. Yes, LDS Culture has some weird reactions to issues it teaches, but that is LDS Culture, it's crazy anyway.

So you might be ok to say this, "You and your ex-wife are not good for each other." when you know only the information shared in the OP?

Agreed on the LDS culture - it doesn't have to be this way, but it is sadly, and is not getting better IMHO - which hurts the process that this person is seeking, doesn't help.

[Sirocco]

Lucifer's Lounge, what even is that...?

The kick back place on ldsff where apostates don't have to worry about being called apostates. Sit back, down a few homemade brews, bad talk the Lords Prophets and apostles, share disgust about the church. Make up precepts regarding tithing and other commandments. Lots of mingling and planning camp outs and stuff :ymcowboy:

Fools will mock, hopefully you don't become one. Lucifer's lounge - which I've answered you previously, came from the Lord, where he introduced the phrase to me the first time I ever heard it in a part of my patriarchal blessing, stating I would understand Lucifer's Lounge, philosophies of men, etc. as I went forward in my strong capacity to fraternize with people in a friendly supportive manner, and would be able to lift, inspire and help them because of understanding Lucifer's Lounge and the great love I have for people.

I invite you to have confidence in what gifts the Lord bestows upon you despite the mockery that occurs from others in your attempt to use them.

Working on finishing this up as I've written my ponderings in journals on the topic the Lord introduced to me.
http://voiceofanearthquake.blogspot.com ... ounge.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Now, back on topic please - isn't about your feelings about new things you don't understand, but the invitations of the OP.

I still don't get it, what is the problem with a lounge?

[BrotherOfMahonri]

I still don't get it, what is the problem with a lounge?

For brevity's sake - think of what Lucifer would have you doing to be in His lounge, and there you have a playground where temptations are harder to resist. Recognizing the lounge, when you are stepping into it, or are in it, helps to step out where temptations are much less likely to lead to sin.

[Sirocco]

I still don't get it, what is the problem with a lounge?

For brevity's sake - think of what Lucifer would have you doing to be in His lounge, and there you have a playground where temptations are harder to resist. Recognizing the lounge, when you are stepping into it, or are in it, helps to step out where temptations are much less likely to lead to sin.

Oh yeah, I think with me it'd be like I live above it and wander threw it everytime I leave the house :)) (and below all that is a bowling alley)

[russdm]

Self Erased