How Cults Work

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ajax
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How Cults Work

Postby ajax » Sun Mar 08, 2015 10:27 am

http://www.howcultswork.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Headers:
Deception
Exclusivism
Fear & Indimidation
Love Bombing & Relationship Control
Information Control
Reporting Structure
Time Control
Pressure Selling
Recruiting Techniques
Key Points:
-No legitimate group needs to lie or mislead you about what they practice or believe.
-Any group which says you must belong to their organization to be saved is almost certainly a cult.
-Character Assassination is a sure sign of a cult.
-Cult members are usually very fearful of disobeying or disagreeing in anyway with their leadership. Healthy organizations however are not threatened by openly debating issues.
-Beware of “instant friends”, remember true friendships develop over time.
-Beware of a group that tells you who you can and cannot see.
-If you are instructed by a group not to read information critical of the group, then that is a sign of a cult.
-Legitimate groups have nothing to fear from their members reading critical information about them.
-Is information you expected to be kept confidential reported to leadership? If so, then it’s a cult.
-Never ending compulsory meeting and tasks is a sign of a cult.
-Research the group independently of the group.
Key Warning Signs:
• Single charismatic leader.
• People always seeming constantly happy and enthusiastic. Especially if you discover that they have been told to act that way for the potential new recruits.
• Instant friends.
• If you are told who you can or cannot talk to or associate with.
• They hide what they teach.
• Say they are the only true group, or the best so why go anywhere else.
• Hyped meetings, get you to meetings rather than share with you.
• Experiential rather than logical.
• Asking for money for the next level.
• Some cults travel door to door during times when women are home alone. They, and this is rather sexist, think that women are easier to recruit and once they have the woman then it will be easier to snare the husband or partner.
• Saying that they have to make people pay for it because otherwise they will not appreciate it. This is of course a very silly reason, plenty of people are able to appreciate things which they did not pay for.
“I love that man better who swears a stream as long as my arm, yet deals justice to his neighbors and mercifully deals his substance to the poor, than the smooth-faced hypocrite." - Joseph Smith

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby ajax » Sun Mar 08, 2015 10:52 am

"By definition, it is not possible to be in a cult and at the same time know that you are in one."
https://generalauthority.wordpress.com/ ... religions/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
“I love that man better who swears a stream as long as my arm, yet deals justice to his neighbors and mercifully deals his substance to the poor, than the smooth-faced hypocrite." - Joseph Smith

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Original_Intent » Sun Mar 08, 2015 2:20 pm

So do you agree with most or all of these definitions, or are you just throwing this out there to see how the discussion develops?

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby ajax » Sun Mar 08, 2015 2:29 pm

Original_Intent wrote:or are you just throwing this out there to see how the discussion develops?
Pretty much.
“I love that man better who swears a stream as long as my arm, yet deals justice to his neighbors and mercifully deals his substance to the poor, than the smooth-faced hypocrite." - Joseph Smith

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby jwharton » Sun Mar 08, 2015 2:45 pm

I could likely add some items to these lists.
I can also share some of my personal experiences in dealing with them directly.
Not sure exactly what you are looking for here so I guess I'll just say probe away.
Reality influences perception.
Perception creates reality.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby jwharton » Sun Mar 08, 2015 2:48 pm

To summarize it, look at what it takes to be a narcissistic sociopath and this will characterize the leader to the group and also the group as a whole to outsiders.
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby jbalm » Mon Mar 09, 2015 6:51 am

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Thinker » Mon Mar 09, 2015 9:03 am

A respected friend told me I was in a cult and at first I was defensive, but then I began looking into it and sure enough, our church fits many characteristics.

Still, I see cult qualities in any group - and often those who come to hate the Mormon "cult" just move to another cult, adopting even more dysfunctional ideologies, like killing children as birth control, calling those who don't support legal "rights" based on sexual substitutes, "homophobes" or "bigots" (cult-like shunning), or making fun of "climate deniers" who object to spending billion$ on "climate change" bs.

You can take a person out of a cult, but it's tough to take the cult out of the person.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Sirocco » Mon Mar 09, 2015 3:56 pm

Thinker wrote:A respected friend told me I was in a cult and at first I was defensive, but then I began looking into it and sure enough, our church fits many characteristics.

Still, I see cult qualities in any group - and often those who come to hate the Mormon "cult" just move to another cult, adopting even more dysfunctional ideologies, like killing children as birth control, calling those who don't support legal "rights" based on sexual substitutes, "homophobes" or "bigots" (cult-like shunning), or making fun of "climate deniers" who object to spending billion$ on "climate change" bs.

You can take a person out of a cult, but it's tough to take the cult out of the person.
You could paint most every religion to be a cult.
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby jwharton » Mon Mar 09, 2015 4:33 pm

I also highly recommend people look into how Monarch Mind-Control works.
Knowing its devices and how practitioners of it use it against you can keep you safe.
The reason it is called Monarch is because it always involves a King-God figure you must please.
You will be entrained as quickly as possible to shift your devotions from God to this person.
If you show resistance you will have something contrived against you to try and fracture you.
You will be ruthlessly chastened for the first thing they can get ahold of for that purpose.
If you keep a cool head and plead innocence and disbelieve their accusations you are "prideful".
They go to whatever extent of mental torture necessary to get you to crack. This is intentional.
When you do this you are actually having a type of schizophrenia induced upon you they will use.
When you are put under extreme duress and crack, it happens as a stress coping mechanism.
When you crack it puts you into a very pure, innocent and even euphoric state, like a new baby.
This new fracture of your psyche is also like a little child, easy to be conditioned and controlled.
The whole point of Monarch Mind-Control is to exploit people to get them into this mode.

This is from the technology that came out of the Nazi MK-Ultra program that was brought over into the USA under operation Paperclip. This has been declassified in recent years so it is all able to be examined from the official records. It is this type of technology that apparently Mitt Romney's father George Romney was very keenly interested in and involved with. It is this kind of technology that will be used by the adversary's kingdom to snap people into this addictive euphoric state of mind that has them easily controlled. Some even seem to want this and believe it is the keys of salvation to have this "new birth" and start fresh and have someone condition you into an obedient and righteous person. From my point of view, this is reprehensible and nothing more than making minions out of people. And, this is in fact how many cults operate. Some likely do this without really being aware that it is something that has been undergoing serious study and experimentation for many decades now.

The reason I happen to have been made aware of this technology is because my grandfather was in the service stationed in San Diego where this program was brought in and he was unknowingly inducted into their studies and became a victim of them. His journals talked about the extreme torture they were doing to him under false pretenses. Both he and the psychologist and my grandmother ultimately lost their lives. When tragedy strikes in your immediate family, things tend to come together to a point of understanding. My uncle has made it a big part of his life's passion to reach an understanding of what happened to his parents and thankfully I listened to him. Nobody else in my family will. They all think he is just a crazy whacko who is a hermit in the desert. I see him as someone who truly cares about what is right and who wants answers. Had I not listened to him and gained this understanding, I would not have been able to recognize danger my family and I confronted and likely would have fallen prey to a more perfected implementation of the same technology in the hands of someone who had alliances with the Romney family that I suspect was their source for this technology. I could of course be mistaken as I didn't hang around long enough to get any proof and I'm not into trying to crusade against it. I simply saw enough evidences to cause me great concern and be suspicious and to want to get the heck out of it.

Also, as an added side note. When people are baffled by how Mitt Romney was such a flip-flopper and unreliable, I would suggest they consider the fact that there is more than one Mitt Romney under the hood. They have perfected the means to literally flip these mind-controlled slaves from one "alter" to another. "Alter" as in "alter-ego". The slaves of this kind of mind-control technology can only be helped if they have someone with them who can stand up to it and help them reintegrate themselves. Very few will ever get this kind of help. This is also how some people can look so good and righteous on the surface but have a secret life of very different values. This is why we find Jesus using the word "hypocrites" about a dozen times when describing the religious leaders of his day. A hypocrite is really a minimum of two personalities in one person. One who says do this, but who himself does not.

When Jesus accused the scribes and Pharisees of being whited sepulchers full of dead men's bones, he was in essence charging them with having at least two personalities. One to present to the outside world to create the façade and the other secret inward personality that is evil to the core. These are the kinds of forces we are up against in the latter-days when the adversary is pulling out all the stops and using every bit of technology possible to advance his agenda of taking away our agency. We must be ever vigilant to stay on our guards and to have the protection of the Holy Ghost.
Reality influences perception.
Perception creates reality.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Fiannan » Mon Mar 09, 2015 5:35 pm

Thomas S. Monson is charismatic???? Oh please.
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Sirocco » Mon Mar 09, 2015 5:41 pm

Fiannan wrote:Thomas S. Monson is charismatic???? Oh please.
He seems more kind, I donno why but I always get the impression he'd tell me a silly story if I ever met him...no idea why.
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby jwharton » Mon Mar 09, 2015 7:25 pm

Fiannan wrote:Thomas S. Monson is charismatic???? Oh please.
Where is this coming from?
Reality influences perception.
Perception creates reality.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Tony » Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:11 pm

ajax wrote:http://www.howcultswork.com/

Headers:
Deception
Exclusivism
Fear & Indimidation
Love Bombing & Relationship Control
Information Control
Reporting Structure
Time Control
Pressure Selling
Recruiting Techniques
Key Points:
-No legitimate group needs to lie or mislead you about what they practice or believe.
-Any group which says you must belong to their organization to be saved is almost certainly a cult.
-Character Assassination is a sure sign of a cult.
-Cult members are usually very fearful of disobeying or disagreeing in anyway with their leadership. Healthy organizations however are not threatened by openly debating issues.
-Beware of “instant friends”, remember true friendships develop over time.
-Beware of a group that tells you who you can and cannot see.
-If you are instructed by a group not to read information critical of the group, then that is a sign of a cult.
-Legitimate groups have nothing to fear from their members reading critical information about them.
-Is information you expected to be kept confidential reported to leadership? If so, then it’s a cult.
-Never ending compulsory meeting and tasks is a sign of a cult.
-Research the group independently of the group.
Key Warning Signs:
• Single charismatic leader.
• People always seeming constantly happy and enthusiastic. Especially if you discover that they have been told to act that way for the potential new recruits.
• Instant friends.
• If you are told who you can or cannot talk to or associate with.
• They hide what they teach.
• Say they are the only true group, or the best so why go anywhere else.
• Hyped meetings, get you to meetings rather than share with you.
• Experiential rather than logical.
• Asking for money for the next level.
• Some cults travel door to door during times when women are home alone. They, and this is rather sexist, think that women are easier to recruit and once they have the woman then it will be easier to snare the husband or partner.
• Saying that they have to make people pay for it because otherwise they will not appreciate it. This is of course a very silly reason, plenty of people are able to appreciate things which they did not pay for.
People made allegations along these lines to justify their rejection and ultimately crucify the Savior Jesus Christ.
Last edited by Tony on Tue Mar 10, 2015 4:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Look ahead and you see the prophet. Look a little further and you see that he is being led by Jesus Christ. You cannot follow Jesus Christ unless you follow the prophet. Those who have chosen a different path have been deceived by Satan.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby 5tev3 » Mon Mar 09, 2015 11:40 pm

Hmph, that's how a lot of businesses work. You could take several of these elements and put them in any organization where they are no big deal. Charasmatic leader? Steve Jobs, Joseph Smith, Benjamin Franklin, etc. I've made instant friends camping and at the DMV. One true way? Oops, Jesus started a cult. He really fits the bill with secret teachings etc.

I think there are other things like many meetings that are just a product of mismanagement rather than cultic strategy. Any group has to have leadership and organization, but it can get taken too far by people who think more meetings = better results. As a former EQP I had one meeting per month with my counselors. That's all we needed.

Many of these things sound like the dumb stuff that well meaning members do. I've seen people try to bring "business-like" practices into "missionary work" and I truly hate that stuff. But that's just people. I don't accept "missionary challenges" and those kinds of things. We don't need to "sell" the gospel, we just need to be ourselves and truly love people. The gospel probides a reason for why we should love and an interaction with God shows us how we should love. These foolish missionary "tactics" I sometimes see are a desperate attempt to prop up the spiritual failings in the lives of members. I think they are well-meaning, but misguided. But we need to show a better way ourselves because if we are not, then we're part of the problem.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Thinker » Tue Mar 10, 2015 9:11 am

It's true that the cult (or herd) mentality is found in many groups - sport fan clubs, employment, etc.

The difference between those and a life-encompassing church, is well - the life encompassing aspect. When families are torn apart because the cult takes priority, that defies the principle of "no success can compensate for failure in the home."

When friends or even spouses turn on each other, and get others to, simply because one stops completely blindly putting the cult above all, is not only anti-Christ, but is also bullying.
Many religions have such a cult mentality - some have gone beyond labeling one "apostate" for questioning their cult and have led crucades or even crucified those who object to their cult.

There are so many screwed up aspects of our church, and there's so many good things. Pretending it's either all good or all evil, is polarized/bi-polar thinking. A person or a group with bipolar thinking disorder, struggles because of ignoring the negative - and feeling high with feeling perfect and wonderful... Then, when they realize it isn't all wonderful, they think it's completely awful.
The key is to realize the church, (made up of people) is a mix of good and bad, it's not all evil nor all good.

Again see Fowler's stages of faith 3-5.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fowler%2 ... evelopment" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby jwharton » Tue Mar 10, 2015 9:19 am

Thinker wrote:It's true that the cult (or herd) mentality is found in many groups - sport fan clubs, employment, etc.

The difference between those and a life-encompassing church, is well - the life encompassing aspect. When families are torn apart because the cult takes priority, that defies the principle of "no success can compensate for failure in the home."

When friends or even spouses turn on each other, and get others to, simply because one stops completely blindly putting the cult above all, is not only anti-Christ, but is also bullying.
Many religions have such a cult mentality - some have gone beyond labeling one "apostate" for questioning their cult and have led crucades or even crucified those who object to their cult.

There are so many screwed up aspects of our church, and there's so many good things. Pretending it's either all good or all evil, is polarized/bi-polar thinking. A person or a group with bipolar thinking disorder, struggles because of ignoring the negative - and feeling high with feeling perfect and wonderful... Then, when they realize it isn't all wonderful, they think it's completely awful.
The key is to realize the church, (made up of people) is a mix of good and bad, it's not all evil nor all good.

Again see Fowler's stages of faith 3-5.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fowler%2 ... evelopment" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
THANK BUTTON needed here!

Exactly concur.

This is why the Lord setup the Church to give room for petitions of redress of grievances.
Reality influences perception.
Perception creates reality.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Lizzy60 » Tue Mar 10, 2015 9:19 am

Miss Pink Death --

If you REPLACE God with something or someone else, that can lead to cultism. Putting your trust in God, and Him alone, and worshipping Him and no other, is not a cult.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Sirocco » Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:19 am

Muerte Rosa wrote:Everything is a cult then Ajax
In many ways the only thing that sets apart a cult and religion is the person talking about it. Every religion when they started out were called cults, we don't think about our words anymore we just go to the top shelf with them now.
Like you waste the word amazing on a basket of chicken wings...
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Obrien » Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:22 am

Great insight on the "amazing" chicken wings, Sirocco... LMAO
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby shadow » Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:32 am

Muerte Rosa wrote:Agreed Lizzy but we both know what he's insinuating by this post...and it's just a load of crap
Oh, you mean the church?? And here I thought he was talking about Snuffer and the groupies who follow him around. Well, him and his desk. Can't forget the ever important desk.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Bee Prepared » Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:33 am

Cults, in the most negative sense of the word, have always been shown to fall apart when severe challenges are placed before them. This church, historically speaking, has been challenged from its creation. Yet, it lasts, and every bit of persecution or nay saying has eventually dissipated with time. Ultimately, the reference to this church being a cult comes from severe misunderstandings or outright belligerence.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby abelchirino » Tue Mar 10, 2015 12:34 pm

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the word "cult" come from a latin word that means worship. One definition that I found says "a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object".

There's really nothing wrong with the word cult. I don't understand why some have to rely on labels and ad hominem attacks to make their points. The Church is a cult and there's nothing wrong with that, so long as the worship of the church, according to Christ, bears his name and is centered in His gospel.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby jwharton » Tue Mar 10, 2015 12:36 pm

I think what is really trying to be discerned here is what priest craft is.
The question could be asked, What does priestcraft look like?
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Thinker » Tue Mar 10, 2015 1:51 pm

jwharton wrote:I think what is really trying to be discerned here is what priest craft is.
The question could be asked, What does priestcraft look like?
Thanks for your comments, Jawharton.

The Book of Mormon says, "Priestcrafts are that men preach and set themselves up for a light unto the world, that they may get gain and praise of the world; but they seek not the Welfare of Zion…"

Ie: Hiding and disobeying the commandment of leaders to share TITHES with the poor (Deut. 14:28-29) and instead building up a corporate empire including shopping malls, to get financial gain in the name of Jesus Christ.

What an awful feeling it was when I began to realize I was indeed in a cult. I had been taught as most cults teach, that any objection to the cult was "the adversary" ... but really, what I experienced was a terrible feeling of betrayal. I know that the church does not hold a monopoly on the spirit because since turning away from harmful teachings and toward God, I've felt the spirit stronger and more than ever!

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby jwharton » Tue Mar 10, 2015 1:58 pm

Thinker wrote:
jwharton wrote:I think what is really trying to be discerned here is what priest craft is.
The question could be asked, What does priestcraft look like?
Thanks for your comments, Jwharton.

The Book of Mormon says, "Priestcrafts are that men preach and set themselves up for a light unto the world, that they may get gain and praise of the world; but they seek not the Welfare of Zion…"

Ie: Hiding and disobeying the commandment of leaders to share TITHES with the poor (Deut. 14:28-29) and instead building up a corporate empire including shopping malls, to get financial gain in the name of Jesus Christ.

What an awful feeling it was when I began to realize I was indeed in a cult. I had been taught as most cults teach, that any objection to the cult was "the adversary" ... but really, what I experienced was a terrible feeling of betrayal. I know that the church does not hold a monopoly on the spirit because since turning away from harmful teachings and toward God, I've felt the spirit stronger and more than ever!
And, sadly, when the gain and praise of the world becomes more important than those the church is to serve, the church looses its most spiritually attuned and all that winds up being left are the minions who want it to be a cult and are doing their darnedest to turn it into one.
This is why in the thread about the pollution being in the holy church of God I say that if we as a church humbled ourselves we would start getting a much higher quality of spiritual beings gathered into the fold.

What was the difference between Abel's offering and Cain's?

Abel brought in much higher order "creatures" than Cain did.
Cain only gathers in the cultish minions, not true spiritual giants.
Reality influences perception.
Perception creates reality.

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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Fiannan » Tue Mar 10, 2015 5:01 pm

jwharton wrote:
Fiannan wrote:Thomas S. Monson is charismatic???? Oh please.
Where is this coming from?
On of the generally accepted criteria for a "cult" is a charismatic leader in which people place their faith in their "cult of personality" with blind obedience.
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Epistemology » Tue Mar 10, 2015 5:14 pm

Which LDSFF member do you think would be the best cult leader?
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Epistemology » Tue Mar 10, 2015 5:17 pm

And don't say Denver Snuffer unless you KNOW he is a member here
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Re: How Cults Work

Postby Bee Prepared » Tue Mar 10, 2015 9:07 pm

Thinker wrote:
jwharton wrote:I think what is really trying to be discerned here is what priest craft is.
The question could be asked, What does priestcraft look like?
Thanks for your comments, Jawharton.

The Book of Mormon says, "Priestcrafts are that men preach and set themselves up for a light unto the world, that they may get gain and praise of the world; but they seek not the Welfare of Zion…"

Ie: Hiding and disobeying the commandment of leaders to share TITHES with the poor (Deut. 14:28-29) and instead building up a corporate empire including shopping malls, to get financial gain in the name of Jesus Christ.

What an awful feeling it was when I began to realize I was indeed in a cult. I had been taught as most cults teach, that any objection to the cult was "the adversary" ... but really, what I experienced was a terrible feeling of betrayal. I know that the church does not hold a monopoly on the spirit because since turning away from harmful teachings and toward God, I've felt the spirit stronger and more than ever!
I like you Thinker, and all of this makes me so sad.... :(


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