Women and their Dress

[Melissa]

At church last Sunday, I saw a woman sitting at church who was struggling to look appropriate at church (I say struggling, but she seemed just fine) She was showing too much on top and 3/4 of her thigh when she sat down (yes, half her garment bottom was showing). This is your everyday ordinary mormon woman and was not your risque type. I wondered to my self why is it that women have to be so uncomfortable with just this piece of fabric covering their middle that is not high enough or long enough to really look comfortable. At church, why do the men have have such a dress code of long pants, dress shoes, button shirts (buttoned up) but women do not? Just curious?
In the early church, both genders wore clothing very appropriate for sunday worship, why can't the women today to this?

I understand that the views of gender are that women have represented beauty and sex and therefore "show off" those things and try to be as beautiful as possible, but within the church? - don't we have a bit more class and respect than this philosophy? Women should be more conservative in their dress than they are. I see it constantly at church with all ages of women, and I also see how distracting it is to people. I just don't understand. Also, why can't the women's garments go up a little higher and have more sleeves? More protection right? But as a woman I don't even have a choice to be as covered as a man is and they don't make it anywhere possible for a woman to wear a mans garment unless you didn't have to wear a bra, but for the rest of us - impossible.

What are your thoughts? Have you wondered why men have conservative dress standards for church but women do not?

[Rensai]

In the early church, both genders wore clothing very appropriate for sunday worship, why can't the women today to this?

The simple answer is that women today could dress modestly if they wanted. From my experiences, it seems like most women (and men) have bought into women dressing in immodest Babylon fashion and like it. I've observed women at church mocking the modest dresses the FLDS women wore when Warren Jeffs was in the news. I've also observed countless times where women complain that their garments get in the way, make them unable to wear certain fashionable clothes, etc. It seems like LDS women generally like being on the conservative side of current fashion, but still want to follow along with the trends. The trends are steadily moving towards more and more immodesty so that even the conservative side isn't really very modest except in comparison to what others are currently wearing.

[Fiannan]

I am not quite as prudish as some here might be but when one goes to church I Think they should strive for modesty. If the Relief Society president lives in France and wants to go topless on the beach then no big deal. However, church is a time for total concentration on spiritual matters so what is the problem with dressing in clothes that don't emphasize the body?

Note that when the apostles fished they did so naked, but I am certain that when they were with Jesus and learning of the highest orders of the kingdom they made sure to dress more conservativily.

[Rick Grimes]

Melissa, you are a dying breed sister. Too many times I see way too many sisters wearing way to revealing clothing. Their daughters look worse. I often hear women defending their daughter's dress choice by saying that the outfit looks "fun" or "chic". It's almost as the other is vicariously living thru her daughter.

On a somewhat related subject, many years ago while serving on my mission, the bishop's wife in the ward that I was serving in told us about a letterthat the 1st Presidency had sent out to all of the stakes and units several years before. This letter was to be read out to the congregation in all the units. In this letter, it expressed the Presidency's (I believe President Kimball was in office) wish for all the women of the church to only wear dresses and skirts both in meetings and outside of church. From what the Bishop's wife told us, it was not well recieved. Women came out in open defiance against this and raised holy hell about it. That letter was never mentioned again.

It's sad to see that the battle of morality is slowly being lost even from within the church.

[heartsongs]

At church last Sunday, I saw a woman sitting at church who was struggling to look appropriate at church (I say struggling, but she seemed just fine) She was showing too much on top and 3/4 of her thigh when she sat down (yes, half her garment bottom was showing). This is your everyday ordinary mormon woman and was not your risque type. I wondered to my self why is it that women have to be so uncomfortable with just this piece of fabric covering their middle that is not high enough or long enough to really look comfortable. At church, why do the men have have such a dress code of long pants, dress shoes, button shirts (buttoned up) but women do not? Just curious?
In the early church, both genders wore clothing very appropriate for sunday worship, why can't the women today to this?

I understand that the views of gender are that women have represented beauty and sex and therefore "show off" those things and try to be as beautiful as possible, but within the church? - don't we have a bit more class and respect than this philosophy? Women should be more conservative in their dress than they are. I see it constantly at church with all ages of women, and I also see how distracting it is to people. I just don't understand. Also, why can't the women's garments go up a little higher and have more sleeves? More protection right? But as a woman I don't even have a choice to be as covered as a man is and they don't make it anywhere possible for a woman to wear a mans garment unless you didn't have to wear a bra, but for the rest of us - impossible.

What are your thoughts? Have you wondered why men have conservative dress standards for church but women do not?

Well, IMO "ALL" of the people at church both young and old, male and female have been commanded to be modest and a refined people. It is "we" (I am not saying you and I specifically, but, we in generalized terms.) who CHOOSE to exercise our AGENCY to NOT LISTEN to the counsel that has been provided by how many church leaders and for how many years now? Many...for sure! As for longer garments. This is what I do. I get the "tall" tops and the mid-calf length bottoms. This, for me anyway (I am short!) provides as you said...more coverage.
( ) .

I think it is also partly that some are still listening to the "world" to define them and give them their value/worth instead of listening to the Lord and pleasing him.

Oh what pride will do!!!!!!!!!

[Melissa]

It makes me think about the Isaiah scripture about the women and their fancy apparel and "secret" parts and vainness. The outcome for these women seems very bad, bald and slaves in sackcloth-or sonething like that. I don't have the scripture in front of me. Its very sad! The more I see the world falling, the more I desire to stand out.

I really wish that women of the church would dress better and stop showing their "parts" to the fellow sisters husbands and sons passing the sacrament. Please understand who you are and what you represent. The woman falls, the family falls. You represent "motherhood" in all sense of the word and are the main force to help our HF brings souls back to Him.

I find myself having a harder time at church because it doesn't feel like a refuge from the world. Oh, and sunday school....so bad sometimes! Its getting too worldly for me..what to do?

[Melissa]

At church last Sunday, I saw a woman sitting at church who was struggling to look appropriate at church (I say struggling, but she seemed just fine) She was showing too much on top and 3/4 of her thigh when she sat down (yes, half her garment bottom was showing). This is your everyday ordinary mormon woman and was not your risque type. I wondered to my self why is it that women have to be so uncomfortable with just this piece of fabric covering their middle that is not high enough or long enough to really look comfortable. At church, why do the men have have such a dress code of long pants, dress shoes, button shirts (buttoned up) but women do not? Just curious?
In the early church, both genders wore clothing very appropriate for sunday worship, why can't the women today to this?

I understand that the views of gender are that women have represented beauty and sex and therefore "show off" those things and try to be as beautiful as possible, but within the church? - don't we have a bit more class and respect than this philosophy? Women should be more conservative in their dress than they are. I see it constantly at church with all ages of women, and I also see how distracting it is to people. I just don't understand. Also, why can't the women's garments go up a little higher and have more sleeves? More protection right? But as a woman I don't even have a choice to be as covered as a man is and they don't make it anywhere possible for a woman to wear a mans garment unless you didn't have to wear a bra, but for the rest of us - impossible.

What are your thoughts? Have you wondered why men have conservative dress standards for church but women do not?

Well, IMO "ALL" of the people at church both young and old, male and female have been commanded to be modest and a refined people. It is "we" (I am not saying you and I specifically, but, we in generalized terms.) who CHOOSE to exercise our AGENCY to NOT LISTEN to the counsel that has been provided by how many church leaders and for how many years now? Many...for sure! As for longer garments. This is what I do. I get the "tall" tops and the mid-calf length bottoms. This, for me anyway (I am short!) provides as you said...more coverage.
( ) .

I think it is also partly that some are still listening to the "world" to define them and give them their value/worth instead of listening to the Lord and pleasing him.

Oh what pride will do!!!!!!!!!

True true!

I know we are told to be modest, but the men have it spelled out very well what they are to wear. Why do the women not have the same? Is it really because women will fight against it?
If the men were told to simply be modest, they would wear all sorts of different things, polos, sandles etc. But they are called out on it but the women show the whole ward their goods and no one says anything. Just wish there was a standard for women besides just modest, cause that is defined very differently for most everyone.

[heartsongs]

It makes me think about the Isaiah scripture about the women and their fancy apparel and "secret" parts and vainness. The outcome for these women seems very bad, bald and slaves in sackcloth-or sonething like that. I don't have the scripture in front of me. Its very sad! The more I see the world falling, the more I desire to stand out.

I really wish that women of the church would dress better and stop showing their "parts" to the fellow sisters husbands and sons passing the sacrament. Please understand who you are and what you represent. The woman falls, the family falls. You represent "motherhood" in all sense of the word and are the main force to help our HF brings souls back to Him.

I find myself having a harder time at church because it doesn't feel like a refuge from the world. Oh, and sunday school....so bad sometimes! Its getting too worldly for me..what to do?

Just hang on!!!!!!!!
It will be worth it in the end!!!!!

I know it is difficult...if the people aren't inappropriately dressed, then you would think that they were dressed to impress the Queen of England. The Lord warned us in scripture it would be like this in the last days. I do believe that there will come a time when we see our folly and are more swift to change our ways. Remember in 3rd Nephi when the Lord's voice said..."oh ye that were saved because you were more righteous than they (paraphrasing of course) will you not now return unto me and be healed? I do believe when the time comes that it is possible we may hear something very similar.

I just try to keep in the back of my mind "agency" and they are exercising theirs. I also try to keep in my heart that they must not truly understand the principle and reason for modesty. I suggest reading Stephen Kramer's book "Putting on the Armor of God" It helped me a great deal in understanding why we sin, why we do what we do and how to overcome it and it really helped me to learn how to "overlook" things so to speak (not that I am condoning the sins that others commit or that I am making excuses for them or accepting the sin as being o.k., but, that I finally understand a little better why folks do the things they do, and sadly they don't even realize it.)

I do completely understand what you mean though. To me, my greatest refuge in the storm is "my home" and the temple. In those places I can truly find peace and tranquility for the depth and breadth there of is totally dependent upon me. My home for how close to God I make it with my actions and such and the temple experience for the attitude and mindset I go when in attendance.

Hang in there. Oh, another thing I try to do to keep focused on the speakers and what the Lord would have me learn is to take notes during Sacrament so that I am more focused on that, hopefully, distracting my attention from things that possibly take away from the Spirit.
You are right though...It is to bad that there is to much showing in front of others. Church and or any where else is no place for that.

[heartsongs]

I totally get what you are saying and agree. I still believe that we do have standards that have been voiced. We are told to come in our modest best on Sunday to present ourselves to the Lord. I think we also have been given the definition of modest for years now too. It sounds to me like maybe what you are saying, please correct me if I am wrong, is that you wish that there would be a "calling out" so to speak of what needs to occur just like they do sometimes when they say that the children need to be taken out of the chapel when they are crying during the passing of the Sacrament etc.

I think that if what you have said is that distracting...which if you feel it is, there is also the likelihood that someone else feels the same way you do. Heck, I would go talk to my bishop and tell him my feelings and ask him to pray about it and see how he thinks he should address it. But, I am that kind of person (lol lol) I'm not sure if it is the right answer, but, it is some kind of action that you can take so that you can feel like you have done something and given the one who is responsible for the ward the opportunity to also do something about it.

What do you think?
BTW, what is happening in SS?

[heartsongs]

Melissa, here is the link to that book I was talking about. It really is very good! I think that every LDS should have to read it. To me it was very eye opening.

http://www.amazon.com/Putting-Armor-God ... 1555172830" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

:ymhug: :ymhug:

[djinwa]

I'm sure 100 years ago the same complaints were being made when someone showed up to church with their ankle showing. It's all relative.

I also find it inappropriate that members come to church in worldly, fancy cars, or fine clothing. Very immodest, showing off their goods. (And of course, I don't like my old car looking bad in light of better ones - if you can't compete, take out the competition)

So I agree, it would be good to have more strict standards of modesty in all things. We should be like the Amish - conservative transportation, dress, homes, furnishings, and appliances. And you could have the bishopric and RS presidency inspect members before allowing them on church property.

The alternative would be following the advice of Jesus to judge less. And perhaps become pure of heart, and be in the world but not of it. You are never going to take all the worldliness out of church.

Some years ago we had an older couple come for dinner. They had recently returned from a mission from Tonga, if I recall correctly. The brother mentioned that while knocking on doors, they would occasionally have a topless lady answer the door. He said, "You get used to it after a while".

I pondered that for some time. Tonga just sets their modesty standards at a different degree of skin exposure, but at some level, women are complaining. And of course, the job of our missionaries was to convince them that the traditions they have held for thousands of years, are suddenly dirty and disgusting. You have to teach them how evil they have been.

In addition, in that culture, it takes a lot more skin showing to arouse the men than it takes in other cultures.

So the church does pretty much follow society. Who knows where we'll be in 50 years. I'm sure BYU cheerleaders are showing a lot more than they did 50 years ago.

[WhereCanITurn4Peace]

Melissa, I can understand the concern you have, and have seen some risqué clothes myself, but are we to be commanded in all things?

Also, I can think of some worse things I've observed in church. These verses describe some of them...

16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. (Proverbs 6)

[Fiannan]

In addition, in that culture, it takes a lot more skin showing to arouse the men than it takes in other cultures.

So the church does pretty much follow society. Who knows where we'll be in 50 years. I'm sure BYU cheerleaders are showing a lot more than they did 50 years ago.

I wonder about that. I believe that most men get aroused in regards to context. I have been in social situations (i.e. hippie festivals) where nudity or at least toplessness was common. I merely saw these women as...well, women. So what, almost all women have the same parts and it takes little imagination to know what a woman looks like under her clothes. The big difference is if one knows they are connected to that person. So I am sure there are male gynecologists, nudists, photographers and artists who see naked women on a very regular basis but merely see the person, and do not get turned on. However, if they went home and found their wife fully clothed and making it clear her intention they would...well, you get the point. So no, I doubt any psychological differences in arousal really exist except in people who are from really repressive environments and see women as nothing more than sexual objects, or walking porn.

As for BYU cheerleaders they can wear what they wear because we as a Church must compromise with the standards of the world. Didn't you know that? Just curious, would I be in violation of forum guidelines if I posted pics of BYU cheerleaders in their outfits? The answer I would assume would be quite telling.

[Fiannan]

16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. (Proverbs 6)

Best description of US domestic and foreign policy I have seen.

[Melissa]

I'm sure 100 years ago the same complaints were being made when someone showed up to church with their ankle showing. It's all relative.

I also find it inappropriate that members come to church in worldly, fancy cars, or fine clothing. Very immodest, showing off their goods. (And of course, I don't like my old car looking bad in light of better ones - if you can't compete, take out the competition)

So I agree, it would be good to have more strict standards of modesty in all things. We should be like the Amish - conservative transportation, dress, homes, furnishings, and appliances. And you could have the bishopric and RS presidency inspect members before allowing them on church property.

The alternative would be following the advice of Jesus to judge less. And perhaps become pure of heart, and be in the world but not of it. You are never going to take all the worldliness out of church.

Some years ago we had an older couple come for dinner. They had recently returned from a mission from Tonga, if I recall correctly. The brother mentioned that while knocking on doors, they would occasionally have a topless lady answer the door. He said, "You get used to it after a while".

I pondered that for some time. Tonga just sets their modesty standards at a different degree of skin exposure, but at some level, women are complaining. And of course, the job of our missionaries was to convince them that the traditions they have held for thousands of years, are suddenly dirty and disgusting. You have to teach them how evil they have been.

In addition, in that culture, it takes a lot more skin showing to arouse the men than it takes in other cultures.

So the church does pretty much follow society. Who knows where we'll be in 50 years. I'm sure BYU cheerleaders are showing a lot more than they did 50 years ago.

I am not trying to judge others or anything but the culture and society have to at some time be called out when they push the envelope. I am striving to have a pure heart and live in the world and not of it etc etc BUT, at the same time I am a wife and mother and have responsibilities beyond my own self and my own salvation to concern myself with. Also, as a member of this church why do I not have a voice to urge others to live the standards? I believe in living high standards, and at church I would expect there to be higher standards than outside of church. Ever since I was little, before being taught anything about modesty, I was modest. I have respect for the human body and don't understand why it is that women "must" show their chest so much - men don't.

For me, its not as much that parts are being shown, but the reason behind it. Our culture is quite immature with sexuality and get all worked up over cleavage and thighs, so why do women (especially in the church) show cleavage? What is the reason? That is my greatest concern. I am not against the human body but the "reasons" people try to exploit it. I can only guess that women do it because of society and society has made it the norm and they are mere following, or they are competing for attention, or trying to prove their womanhood, or something related to that. We are told to not show our bodies, so there is a reason they go against it.

Again, not trying to judge individual people - but I have a hard time just sitting back and watching everything fall apart everywhere.
Having Christ like love doesn't mean that you have to sit back and accept everything either, can't this love also be expressed toward the welfare of people? I have a young son and I do wish that he could have someplace besides our home where he can have a good view of virtuous women so his definition of woman can be one of respect.

I do however realize that my views are not mainstream and will only get worse and worse. The main question I had in the OP was, "why do the men have a prescribed dress code for church but women do not?" Men must wear white shirt and tie with it tucked in and "not sandals" while passing the sacrament for example so why can't women have a dress code when they are speaking in church or teaching a lesson?

[Fiannan]

Is there a Mormon versian?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... tries.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[whatever]

*

[Fiannan]

Men must wear white shirt and tie with it tucked in and "not sandals" while passing the sacrament for example so why can't women have a dress code when they are speaking in church or teaching a lesson?

Actually you do not have to wear a tie when blessing the sacrament and the white shirt thing is merely someone's opinion, not doctrine.

[Squally]

fine linen costly apparel/modesty checkpoints for people when they enter the church. anyone with substandard dress should be cast out.

[Hyrcanus]

I value modesty quite a bit, I think it is a virtue often ignored in the name of fashion/appeal. That said, I don't think it is worthwhile to pick at how people come to church anymore than it is worthwhile to pick at how people speak, act or dress anywhere else. When people choose to allow their kids to act like barbarians in Church it drives me crazy, but I have to remind myself that all of us struggle and that some peoples struggles are more obvious.

The lady who wears a low cut dress to church is easy to focus on, but is she more deserving of our judgement and scorn than someone who behaves uncharitably on an internet forum?

[heartsongs]

Maybe I am wrong, I don't mean to be, but, it seems like from reading the posts that everybody is writing, it seems like everybody is kinda "getting on," all though that may not be the best term to use here (but I can't think of anything else at this time), poor Melissa.

It seems to me that she is just trying to "express" how she feels and why she feels the way she does. I personally don't hear any "judgment of others" in her posts, mostly just frustration. I know that I get tired of being "surrounded on all sides" so to speak with yucky things. Don't you? I don't want to become "desensitized" to what is going on around me, I want to rise above it and put off the natural man and become like Christ. We must admit that in today's world, which is so racked with evil at every turn, it is difficult to put off worldly things, but, put them off we must. Over all of these years we have heard or seen that it is O.K. to do these things such as lie, be immodest, etc etc. until I think some of us really don't pay any mind to such things any more. No, we are not perfect in our obedience, however, you would think that modesty would be an easy thing to be obedient to, especially if you are LDS. Maybe I am wrong though. I recall in the scriptures that when the people became more laxed in their ways, more rebellious in their behavior, increasingly irreverent and disobedient folks like Alma and others stepped down to go and preach to the people, teach them and help them to get back on track.

I am just saying that I can totally understand and see where Melissa is coming from and can relate to her frustration. These are her feelings and I think they deserve to be validated and discussed if she so chooses. I personally don't see anything wrong with Melissa wanting herself and her family to be surrounded by "good" things that would be pleasing to God.

Me personally...I can't wait until the day when "all" evil is put away and the devil and his minions can tempt us no more. What a glorious day that will be!

Just my two cents anyway and do not mean to cause any offense to anyone.

[Dubs]

Yikes

[OnGoing]

Heartsongs speaks with wisdom, I believe. Thank you for sharing your thoughts!

I was once the woman at church tugging my skirt down to try to touch my knees while my shirt clung a bit too tight across my chest. That was the time in my life when my husband was so embroiled in pornography that I could barely get through the days of my life as they ticked by. I was pretty but it was like I had to "prove" it to everyone with eyeballs so that if they ever found out about my husband, they would know it wasn't my fault for not being "hot" enough.

Heavenly Father truly is our parent in heaven and he has not surrendered any of his parenting responsibilities just because we are legal adults in mortality. He taught me a lot as I sat uncomfortably through sacrament meeting, tugging at my clothing that looked fabulous in the mirror when I left the house but somehow shrank three inches in every direction the moment I walked in the chapel. My heart changed slowly over the period of a few months and with it my wardrobe did too.

Now when I see one of my friends repeating the same pattern, I try to give her my time and lend an extra special listening ear because the shreds of clothing she's trying to cover her body with usually represent her hidden, shredded heart. You can't apply this to everyone across the board, of course, but I've seen three instances where fitted clothing on my friends went hand-in-hand with an emotional affair, a physical affair and a diagnosis of female infertility. These things are heart-shattering and I'm recognizing that as women, sometimes clothing is a way that we mourn.

This may not be the case in your ward but as an ex-short skirt offender, I wanted to share what was going on for me!

[freedomforall]

It makes me think about the Isaiah scripture about the women and their fancy apparel and "secret" parts and vainness. The outcome for these women seems very bad, bald and slaves in sackcloth-or sonething like that. I don't have the scripture in front of me. Its very sad! The more I see the world falling, the more I desire to stand out.

I really wish that women of the church would dress better and stop showing their "parts" to the fellow sisters husbands and sons passing the sacrament. Please understand who you are and what you represent. The woman falls, the family falls. You represent "motherhood" in all sense of the word and are the main force to help our HF brings souls back to Him.

I find myself having a harder time at church because it doesn't feel like a refuge from the world. Oh, and sunday school....so bad sometimes! Its getting too worldly for me..what to do?

Just hang on!!!!!!!!
It will be worth it in the end!!!!!

I know it is difficult...if the people aren't inappropriately dressed, then you would think that they were dressed to impress the Queen of England. The Lord warned us in scripture it would be like this in the last days. I do believe that there will come a time when we see our folly and are more swift to change our ways. Remember in 3rd Nephi when the Lord's voice said..."oh ye that were saved because you were more righteous than they (paraphrasing of course) will you not now return unto me and be healed? I do believe when the time comes that it is possible we may hear something very similar.

I just try to keep in the back of my mind "agency" and they are exercising theirs. I also try to keep in my heart that they must not truly understand the principle and reason for modesty. I suggest reading Stephen Kramer's book "Putting on the Armor of God" It helped me a great deal in understanding why we sin, why we do what we do and how to overcome it and it really helped me to learn how to "overlook" things so to speak (not that I am condoning the sins that others commit or that I am making excuses for them or accepting the sin as being o.k., but, that I finally understand a little better why folks do the things they do, and sadly they don't even realize it.)

I do completely understand what you mean though. To me, my greatest refuge in the storm is "my home" and the temple. In those places I can truly find peace and tranquility for the depth and breadth there of is totally dependent upon me. My home for how close to God I make it with my actions and such and the temple experience for the attitude and mindset I go when in attendance.

Hang in there. Oh, another thing I try to do to keep focused on the speakers and what the Lord would have me learn is to take notes during Sacrament so that I am more focused on that, hopefully, distracting my attention from things that possibly take away from the Spirit.
You are right though...It is to bad that there is to much showing in front of others. Church and or any where else is no place for that.

Ladies, if you want to send a message, get yourself a business suit closely resembling a man's suit, complete with shirt and a tie, because it would draw more attention than something very modest, like a floor length dress and a top with long sleeves and an outer jacket. Wear it at church and see if there are any questions. For anyone wondering about your attire, just tell them your wearing modest clothing because it pleases Christ, and that your not there as part of a popularity contest. After all, we don't go to church as a social club do we? It is Christ's church, first and foremost. Tell them you want to be among the wheat, not the tares.

My 2 cents.

[Melissa]

It makes me think about the Isaiah scripture about the women and their fancy apparel and "secret" parts and vainness. The outcome for these women seems very bad, bald and slaves in sackcloth-or sonething like that. I don't have the scripture in front of me. Its very sad! The more I see the world falling, the more I desire to stand out.

I really wish that women of the church would dress better and stop showing their "parts" to the fellow sisters husbands and sons passing the sacrament. Please understand who you are and what you represent. The woman falls, the family falls. You represent "motherhood" in all sense of the word and are the main force to help our HF brings souls back to Him.

I find myself having a harder time at church because it doesn't feel like a refuge from the world. Oh, and sunday school....so bad sometimes! Its getting too worldly for me..what to do?

Just hang on!!!!!!!!
It will be worth it in the end!!!!!

I know it is difficult...if the people aren't inappropriately dressed, then you would think that they were dressed to impress the Queen of England. The Lord warned us in scripture it would be like this in the last days. I do believe that there will come a time when we see our folly and are more swift to change our ways. Remember in 3rd Nephi when the Lord's voice said..."oh ye that were saved because you were more righteous than they (paraphrasing of course) will you not now return unto me and be healed? I do believe when the time comes that it is possible we may hear something very similar.

I just try to keep in the back of my mind "agency" and they are exercising theirs. I also try to keep in my heart that they must not truly understand the principle and reason for modesty. I suggest reading Stephen Kramer's book "Putting on the Armor of God" It helped me a great deal in understanding why we sin, why we do what we do and how to overcome it and it really helped me to learn how to "overlook" things so to speak (not that I am condoning the sins that others commit or that I am making excuses for them or accepting the sin as being o.k., but, that I finally understand a little better why folks do the things they do, and sadly they don't even realize it.)

I do completely understand what you mean though. To me, my greatest refuge in the storm is "my home" and the temple. In those places I can truly find peace and tranquility for the depth and breadth there of is totally dependent upon me. My home for how close to God I make it with my actions and such and the temple experience for the attitude and mindset I go when in attendance.

Hang in there. Oh, another thing I try to do to keep focused on the speakers and what the Lord would have me learn is to take notes during Sacrament so that I am more focused on that, hopefully, distracting my attention from things that possibly take away from the Spirit.
You are right though...It is to bad that there is to much showing in front of others. Church and or any where else is no place for that.

Ladies, if you want to send a message, get yourself a business suit closely resembling a man's suit, complete with shirt and a tie, because it would draw more attention than something very modest, like a floor length dress and a top with long sleeves and an outer jacket. Wear it at church and see if there are any questions. For anyone wondering about your attire, just tell them your wearing modest clothing because it pleases Christ, and that your not there as part of a popularity contest. After all, we don't go to church as a social club do we? It is Christ's church, first and foremost. Tell them you want to be among the wheat, not the tares.

My 2 cents.

? Don't get it.