Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

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Arenera
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:35 pm

lundbaek wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:27 pm
Judgement of LDS voters in issues like those we are discussing here is difficult because so many now have not been exposed to those statements of the Lord and of Latter-day Prophets that urge us to protect our rights of free exercise of conscience, control of property, and to life. These things are not talked or written about as they were "in my day", and there is a good reason for that - to protect the Church from retribution, a danger that was not nearly so serious "in my day". And many members of the Church have not had occasion to think about the ramifications of things that are promoted as in harmony with the gospel but in fact lead to infringements of our God-given and inalienable rights. As examples of such, I offer some of the very things that MItt Romney has promoted.
If something is not in the open, discussed in church, taught by current living leaders, then it is as if there is no law. You may have an opinion that people are sinning, i.e. those that voted for Hillary, but it is not the case.
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lundbaek
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby lundbaek » Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:47 pm

Fortunately, there are those who do not have to be commanded in all things. I can only speak for myself. I have been constrained by the Spirit to study the principles of the Declaration of Independence, of the US Constitution in the tradition of the Founding Fathers, and to study
Ezra Taft Benson's 1968 conference address "The Proper Role of Government, and certain other writings and address that together have shaped my thinking and political persuasions. I have also ben constrained to run for US Congress, and find ways to enlighten LDSs to our doctrinal imperative to preserve liberty. And one of those ways will be a fireside in our home at which the LDS guest speaker will talk on "The Special Importance of the United States Constitution to Latter-day Saints". And I am not alone in such endeavours.

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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:56 pm

lundbaek wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:47 pm
Fortunately, there are those who do not have to be commanded in all things. I can only speak for myself. I have been constrained by the Spirit to study the principles of the Declaration of Independence, of the US Constitution in the tradition of the Founding Fathers, and to study
Ezra Taft Benson's 1968 conference address "The Proper Role of Government, and certain other writings and address that together have shaped my thinking and political persuasions. I have also ben constrained to run for US Congress, and find ways to enlighten LDSs to our doctrinal imperative to preserve liberty. And one of those ways will be a fireside in our home at which the LDS guest speaker will talk on "The Special Importance of the United States Constitution to Latter-day Saints". And I am not alone in such endeavours.
Romney is a good example, also Mormon, who has been involved in Civic affairs and the political system.
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Fiannan
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:49 pm

Romney is a good example, also Mormon, who has been involved in Civic affairs and the political system.
Would you buy a used car from Mitt Romney?

Would you buy one from Evan McMullin?
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lundbaek
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby lundbaek » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:01 pm

Would you support the promoting and advocating of such things as mandatory government-run healthcare, war without a declaration of war by the Congress, "Bailouts" of floundering businesses with taxpayer money, denial of trial and the right of habeus corpus to those accused (not found guilty) of perceived terrorism, specifically the National Defense Authorization Act, and the Patriot Act, which allows homes to be entered and searched without probable cause ?

I suspose some of you would, if for no other reason than because Mitt Romney did.

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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Vgbnd » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:24 pm

Fiannan wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:33 pm
But this is why Constitutional questions don't have easy right or wrong answers. Because the US Constitution actually DOES include both a "right to privacy" and a "right to abortion" because, since the Constitution lists only positive, enumerated powers, the absence of authority to proscribe those items means that technically they exist and can't be prohibited, EXCEPT by the States. This concept is why George Mason didn't want the Bill of Rights, because he essentially argued that if you list ten rights and say they are Constitutionally guaranteed, then by implication its ONLY those rights that are guaranteed--and he was proven right.
Which is the logic used by activist judges who twist the Constitution to fit their leftist agenda and then tell the public that to disagree with them means they are anti-constitutional.
I’ll have to write more when I’m not traveling, But that’s the farthest thing in the world from an activist interpretation of the us federal Constitution. Activist hate that interpretation because it gives the 10th amendment meaning, and activist judges hate that. You’ve made some good points elsewhere, but to say that activist judges favor a strong 10th amendment is demonstrably false.

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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Michelle » Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:11 pm

lundbaek wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:27 pm
Judgement of LDS voters in issues like those we are discussing here is difficult because so many now have not been exposed to those statements of the Lord and of Latter-day Prophets that urge us to protect our rights of free exercise of conscience, control of property, and to life. These things are not talked or written about as they were "in my day", and there is a good reason for that - to protect the Church from retribution, a danger that was not nearly so serious "in my day". And many members of the Church have not had occasion to think about the ramifications of things that are promoted as in harmony with the gospel but in fact lead to infringements of our God-given and inalienable rights. As examples of such, I offer some of the very things that MItt Romney has promoted.
I would agree with you to some extent when speaking specifically of politics and the Constitution.

But really, these are eternal principles that are being applied in a specific area. Anyone who is actually studying the gospel with the intent to know God's will (or has even heard the basic outline of the plan of salvation) should be able to distill the principle of agency vs. force.

Still, I concede that most do not see this. I believe that this is directly related to the fact that moral relativism and cognitive dissonance are so heavily taught and experienced currently in our society that most people have lost the ability to feel uncomfortable by it.

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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:13 am

Health care is a right that shouldn't be contingent on the ideological agendas of politicians," said Sen. Ron Wyden of Oregon, the top Democrat on the Senate committee that oversees Medicaid.
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:16 am

Arenera wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:13 am
Health care is a right that shouldn't be contingent on the ideological agendas of politicians," said Sen. Ron Wyden of Oregon, the top Democrat on the Senate committee that oversees Medicaid.
So now you are a fan of Wyden?
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Ezra » Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:36 am

Arenera wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:13 am
Health care is a right that shouldn't be contingent on the ideological agendas of politicians," said Sen. Ron Wyden of Oregon, the top Democrat on the Senate committee that oversees Medicaid.

Just because someone says it a right doesn’t make it a right.

South Africa says health care is a right yet its citizens don’t have healthcare.

So someone says healthcare is a right.

That mean that all the doctors who payed to put themselves through school do the work to study and learn have no right to the work they do. If others have a right to healthcare that means that the doctors have no choice in it. They have to provide it.

Even if the government mandated they provide healthcare to others. the effect of that would mean less people would become doctors because it’s not worth it. If they don’t make a good living there is no reason to go through and pay for all the schooling. If the state payed the schooling and payed for the doctors salary to work a job that they were required to do to provide healthcare the quality of the service would go down.

Healthcare is not a right. It’s a desire. It’s is our own responsibility to ensure for ourselves. It’s why following the word of wisdom very very closely is so important.

This is a nation of the people for the people. The governments power comes from the people for the good of the people.

If healthcare is a right that means that as an individual I have the right to have my neighbors pay for my healthcare.

That mean Arenera you are required to pay my healthcare. So pay up. If you don’t I will send the government over and fine you or put you in jail.

But I don’t really have that power do I. So if the government is doing that it has gone from being in service of the people to a tyrant of the people.

Healthcare is a desire not a right.

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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:10 pm

2002 Winter Olympics
In 1998, Ann Romney learned that she had multiple sclerosis; Mitt described watching her fail a series of neurological tests as the worst day of his life. After experiencing two years of severe difficulties with the disease, she found – while living in Park City, Utah, where the couple had built a vacation home – a combination of mainstream, alternative, and equestrian therapies that enabled her to lead a lifestyle mostly without limitations. When her husband received a job offer to take over the troubled organization responsible for the 2002 Winter Olympics and Paralympics, to be held in Salt Lake City in Utah, she urged him to accept it; eager for a new challenge, as well as another chance to prove himself in public life, he did. On February 11, 1999, the Salt Lake Organizing Committee for the Olympic and Paralympic Winter Games of 2002 hired Romney as its president and CEO.

Before Romney took over, the event was $379 million short of its revenue goals. Officials had made plans to scale back the Games to compensate for the fiscal crisis, and there were fears it might be moved away entirely. In addition, the image of the Games had been damaged by allegations of bribery against top officials including prior committee president and CEO Frank Joklik. The Salt Lake Organizing Committee forced Joklik and committee vice president Dave Johnson to resign. Utah power brokers, including Governor Mike Leavitt, searched for someone with a scandal-free reputation to take charge of the Olympics. They chose Romney based on his business and legal expertise as well as his connections to both the LDS Church and the state. The appointment faced some initial criticism from both non-Mormons and Mormons that it represented cronyism and made the Games seem too Mormon-dominated. Romney donated to charity the $1.4 million in salary and severance payments he received for his three years as president and CEO, and also contributed $1 million to the Olympics.

Romney restructured the organization's leadership and policies. He reduced budgets and boosted fundraising, alleviating the concerns of corporate sponsors while recruiting new ones. Romney worked to ensure the safety of the Games following the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks by coordinating a $300 million security budget. He oversaw a $1.32 billion total budget, 700 employees, and 26,000 volunteers. The federal government provided approximately $400 million to $600 million of that budget, much of it a result of Romney's having aggressively lobbied Congress and federal agencies. It was a record level of federal funding for the staging of a U.S. Olympics. An additional $1.1 billion of indirect federal funding came to the state in the form of highway and transit projects.

Romney emerged as the local public face of the Olympic effort, appearing in photographs, in news stories, on collectible Olympics pins depicting Romney wrapped by an American flag, and on buttons carrying phrases like "Hey, Mitt, we love you!" Robert H. Garff, the chair of the organizing committee, later said "It was obvious that he had an agenda larger than just the Olympics," and that Romney wanted to use the Olympics to propel himself into the national spotlight and a political career. Garff believed the initial budget situation was not as bad as Romney portrayed, given there were still three years to reorganize. Utah Senator Bob Bennett said that much of the needed federal money was already in place. An analysis by The Boston Globe later stated that the committee had nearly $1 billion in committed revenues at that time. Olympics critic Steve Pace, who led Utahns for Responsible Public Spending, thought Romney exaggerated the initial fiscal state to lay the groundwork for a well-publicized rescue. Kenneth Bullock, another board member of the organizing committee and also head of the Utah League of Cities and Towns, often clashed with Romney at the time, and later said that Romney deserved some credit for the turnaround but not as much as he claimed. Bullock said: "He tried very hard to build an image of himself as a savior, the great white hope. He was very good at characterizing and castigating people and putting himself on a pedestal."

Despite the initial fiscal shortfall, the Games ended up with a surplus of $100 million. President George W. Bush praised Romney's efforts and 87 percent of Utahns approved of his performance as Olympics head. It solidified his reputation as a "turnaround artist", and Harvard Business School taught a case study based around his actions. U.S. Olympic Committee head William Hybl credited Romney with an extraordinary effort in overcoming a difficult time for the Olympics, culminating in "the greatest Winter Games I have ever seen". Romney wrote a book about his experience titled Turnaround: Crisis, Leadership, and the Olympic Games, published in 2004. The role gave Romney experience in dealing with federal, state, and local entities, a public persona he had previously lacked, and the chance to relaunch his political aspirations.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitt_Romney
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:20 pm

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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:43 pm

Arenera wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:20 pm
Queuing up?

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/14/us/p ... -utah.html
Ah, the New York Times. Great source of unbiased information.

Perhaps the corporate military-industrial-entertainment complex sees in Romney a replacement for John McCain.
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby CelestialAngel » Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:20 pm

I'll vote for Romney.

Arenera
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:12 am

CelestialAngel wrote:
Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:20 pm
I'll vote for Romney.
You're in good company. :)
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:13 am

Mitt Romney didn’t say anything about running for Senate in Utah on Tuesday, even though he made a public appearance in the Beehive State, according to the Deseret News.

Romney spoke to reporters and attendees at the 2018 Economic and Public Policy Summit in Utah on Tuesday about the lack of action in Washington to fix problems ailing the nation and Utah.

“He said Utah has a lot to teach the rest of the country after showing a series of slides comparing the state favorably to the United States on a number of issues, including debt and job growth,” according to the Deseret News.

Romney said Utah also has a level of “goodness” that needs to be shared, too.

"But I think there's another component to greatness that we can't afford to lose, and that's goodness. I don't think a nation can be considered a great nation that's not good," he said.
Romney still mum
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:32 am

Arenera wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:13 am
Mitt Romney didn’t say anything about running for Senate in Utah on Tuesday, even though he made a public appearance in the Beehive State, according to the Deseret News.

Romney spoke to reporters and attendees at the 2018 Economic and Public Policy Summit in Utah on Tuesday about the lack of action in Washington to fix problems ailing the nation and Utah.

“He said Utah has a lot to teach the rest of the country after showing a series of slides comparing the state favorably to the United States on a number of issues, including debt and job growth,” according to the Deseret News.

Romney said Utah also has a level of “goodness” that needs to be shared, too.

"But I think there's another component to greatness that we can't afford to lose, and that's goodness. I don't think a nation can be considered a great nation that's not good," he said.
Romney still mum
How does Mittens define "good?"
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby lundbaek » Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:41 am

It would appear (to anyone who studied the issues carefully) that Mitt Romney considers mandatory government-run healthcare, war without a declaration of war by the Congress, "Bailouts" of floundering businesses with taxpayer money, denial of trial and the right of habeus corpus to those accused (not found guilty) of perceived terrorism, specifically the National Defense Authorization Act, and the Patriot Act, which allows homes to be entered and searched without probable cause, to be good

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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:56 am

lundbaek wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:41 am
It would appear (to anyone who studied the issues carefully) that Mitt Romney considers mandatory government-run healthcare, war without a declaration of war by the Congress, "Bailouts" of floundering businesses with taxpayer money, denial of trial and the right of habeus corpus to those accused (not found guilty) of perceived terrorism, specifically the National Defense Authorization Act, and the Patriot Act, which allows homes to be entered and searched without probable cause, to be good
You think? Maybe? Maybe not?

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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:20 am

70%. That is the expected percentage of those voting for Romney versus the other candidates. 70%.
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:07 pm

Arenera wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:20 am
70%. That is the expected percentage of those voting for Romney versus the other candidates. 70%.
Yeah, you've said that a lot. Have not mentioned why they should vote for him though, not really specifically. Do you agree with his support for women to choose abortion if they want, or do you support his stand to protect human life in the womb and reverse Roe v. Wade?

Oh, and again, have you had a chance to form an opinion on Evan McMullin? You could just go to his twitter page. He has 422 thousand followers which is pretty good and thus must make him righteous.
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Arenera
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:15 pm

Fiannan wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:07 pm
Arenera wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:20 am
70%. That is the expected percentage of those voting for Romney versus the other candidates. 70%.
Yeah, you've said that a lot. Have not mentioned why they should vote for him though, not really specifically. Do you agree with his support for women to choose abortion if they want, or do you support his stand to protect human life in the womb and reverse Roe v. Wade?

Oh, and again, have you had a chance to form an opinion on Evan McMullin? You could just go to his twitter page. He has 422 thousand followers which is pretty good and thus must make him righteous.
Utahns have vetted Romney, that is why he has 70% acceptance.
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:23 pm

Arenera wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:15 pm
Fiannan wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:07 pm
Arenera wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:20 am
70%. That is the expected percentage of those voting for Romney versus the other candidates. 70%.
Yeah, you've said that a lot. Have not mentioned why they should vote for him though, not really specifically. Do you agree with his support for women to choose abortion if they want, or do you support his stand to protect human life in the womb and reverse Roe v. Wade?

Oh, and again, have you had a chance to form an opinion on Evan McMullin? You could just go to his twitter page. He has 422 thousand followers which is pretty good and thus must make him righteous.
Utahns have vetted Romney, that is why he has 70% acceptance.
You catch the irony of that statement? Where do 70% of people in Utah get their news and information?

Image
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Arenera
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:25 pm

Fiannan wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:23 pm
Arenera wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:15 pm
Fiannan wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:07 pm
Arenera wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:20 am
70%. That is the expected percentage of those voting for Romney versus the other candidates. 70%.
Yeah, you've said that a lot. Have not mentioned why they should vote for him though, not really specifically. Do you agree with his support for women to choose abortion if they want, or do you support his stand to protect human life in the womb and reverse Roe v. Wade?

Oh, and again, have you had a chance to form an opinion on Evan McMullin? You could just go to his twitter page. He has 422 thousand followers which is pretty good and thus must make him righteous.
Utahns have vetted Romney, that is why he has 70% acceptance.
You catch the irony of that statement? Where do 70% of people in Utah get their news and information?

Image
You make fun of Utahns. Is that Mormon-Like?
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:36 pm

You make fun of Utahns. Is that Mormon-Like?
Are you assuming the only people who vote Romney are Mormon?
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Arenera » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:24 pm

Mitt Romney skirts question about Senate run in tech summit speech

Source
America is the innovator of the world, and "as long as government gets out of the way and Uncle Sam doesn't come in and mess things up, America can win. And America winning is the key to liberty on this planet," he said.
Nice and conservative.
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Re: Hatch to Retire - Possible Senator Romney?

Postby Fiannan » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:42 pm

Arenera wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:24 pm
Mitt Romney skirts question about Senate run in tech summit speech

Source
America is the innovator of the world, and "as long as government gets out of the way and Uncle Sam doesn't come in and mess things up, America can win. And America winning is the key to liberty on this planet," he said.
Nice and conservative.
Like this guy?

Image

http://www.breitbart.com/2016-president ... ssibility/
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