Even the very elect will be deceived....

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Bee Prepared
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by Bee Prepared »

Towards the end of the Savior’s earthly ministry, His disciples came to Him with several questions concerning the future: “Tell us … what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?”

Jesus responded: “Take heed that no man deceive you.

“For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: … and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows” (Matt. 24:3–8).

“And they shall turn away their ears from the truth” (2 Tim. 4:3–4).

Brothers and sisters, the exact time of the Second Coming is known only to the Father (see Matt. 24:36). There are, however, signs that scriptural prophecy relating to that tumultuous day is being fulfilled. Jesus cautioned several times that prior to His Second Coming, “many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many” (Matt. 24:11). As Apostles of the Lord Jesus Christ, it is our duty to be watchmen on the tower, warning Church members to beware of false prophets and false teachers who lie in wait to ensnare and destroy faith and testimony. Today we warn you that there are false prophets and false teachers arising; and if we are not careful, even those who are among the faithful members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints will fall victim to their deception.

M. Russell Ballard

Of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles

freedomforall
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by freedomforall »

Bee Prepared wrote:Towards the end of the Savior’s earthly ministry, His disciples came to Him with several questions concerning the future: “Tell us … what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?”

Jesus responded: “Take heed that no man deceive you.

“For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: … and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows” (Matt. 24:3–8).

“And they shall turn away their ears from the truth” (2 Tim. 4:3–4).

Brothers and sisters, the exact time of the Second Coming is known only to the Father (see Matt. 24:36). There are, however, signs that scriptural prophecy relating to that tumultuous day is being fulfilled. Jesus cautioned several times that prior to His Second Coming, “many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many” (Matt. 24:11). As Apostles of the Lord Jesus Christ, it is our duty to be watchmen on the tower, warning Church members to beware of false prophets and false teachers who lie in wait to ensnare and destroy faith and testimony. Today we warn you that there are false prophets and false teachers arising; and if we are not careful, even those who are among the faithful members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints will fall victim to their deception.

M. Russell Ballard

Of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles
What is a false teacher, and where are some of the places they can be detected?

Bee Prepared
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2536

Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by Bee Prepared »

"Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world," (1 John 4:1).

I believe we all need to adhere to the Scriptures and to grow in our relationship with Jesus Christ.
One of the great powers of the Holy Ghost is to confirm that which is true, and we come to know the truth through study, faith, prayer, and the sincere desire for truth.

keep the faith
captain of 100
Posts: 798

Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by keep the faith »

freedomforall wrote:
Bee Prepared wrote:Towards the end of the Savior’s earthly ministry, His disciples came to Him with several questions concerning the future: “Tell us … what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?”

Jesus responded: “Take heed that no man deceive you.

“For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: … and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows” (Matt. 24:3–8).

“And they shall turn away their ears from the truth” (2 Tim. 4:3–4).

Brothers and sisters, the exact time of the Second Coming is known only to the Father (see Matt. 24:36). There are, however, signs that scriptural prophecy relating to that tumultuous day is being fulfilled. Jesus cautioned several times that prior to His Second Coming, “many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many” (Matt. 24:11). As Apostles of the Lord Jesus Christ, it is our duty to be watchmen on the tower, warning Church members to beware of false prophets and false teachers who lie in wait to ensnare and destroy faith and testimony. Today we warn you that there are false prophets and false teachers arising; and if we are not careful, even those who are among the faithful members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints will fall victim to their deception.

M. Russell Ballard

Of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles
What is a false teacher, and where are some of the places they can be detected?

Easy answer ffa.

“We can accept nothing as authoritative but that which comes directly through the appointed channel, the constituted organizations of the Priesthood, which is the channel that God has appointed through which to make known His mind and will to the world. … And the moment that individuals look to any other source, that moment they throw themselves open to the seductive influences of Satan, and render themselves liable to become servants of the devil; they lose sight of the true order through which the blessings of the Priesthood are to be enjoyed; they step outside of the pale of the kingdom of God, and are on dangerous ground. Whenever you see a man rise up claiming to have received direct revelation from the Lord to the Church, independent of the order and channel of the Priesthood, you may set him down as an imposter” (Gospel Doctrine, 5th ed. [1939], 41–42).

As to the second part of your question, Internet forums are a good place to start looking. ;)

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ajax
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Location: Pf, Texas

Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by ajax »

keep the faith wrote:
freedomforall wrote: What is a false teacher, and where are some of the places they can be detected?

Easy answer ffa.

“We can accept nothing as authoritative but that which comes directly through the appointed channel, the constituted organizations of the Priesthood, [you are setting up an idol my friend] which is the channel that God has appointed through which to make known His mind and will to the world. … And the moment that individuals look to any other source [like the scriptures? the dispensation head?] , that moment they throw themselves open to the seductive influences of Satan, and render themselves liable to become servants of the devil;
Yep, the scriptures, especially the BoM is chopped liver in comparison. Even though God himself called it the new covenant which the church (the leaders as well as membership) was condemned for ignoring.

But maybe you're right, maybe I just need to study the words of a magazine twice a year. Since I certainly can't figure out what the scriptures mean or say, my leaders will tell me which parts are important. I will ignore the rest. Hallelujah!

drip...drip...drip...

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MelissaM
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by MelissaM »

ajax wrote:
keep the faith wrote:
freedomforall wrote: What is a false teacher, and where are some of the places they can be detected?

Easy answer ffa.

“We can accept nothing as authoritative but that which comes directly through the appointed channel, the constituted organizations of the Priesthood, [you are setting up an idol my friend] which is the channel that God has appointed through which to make known His mind and will to the world. … And the moment that individuals look to any other source [like the scriptures? the dispensation head?] , that moment they throw themselves open to the seductive influences of Satan, and render themselves liable to become servants of the devil;
Yep, the scriptures, especially the BoM is chopped liver in comparison. Even though God himself called it the new covenant which the church (the leaders as well as membership) was condemned for ignoring.

But maybe you're right, maybe I just need to study the words of a magazine twice a year. Since I certainly can't figure out what the scriptures mean or say, my leaders will tell me which parts are important. I will ignore the rest. Hallelujah!

drip...drip...drip...
It's just easier to be told what to do, than to seek the face of God or to even want to. So much the same as the Jews.

Exodus 20:18-21

18 ¶And all the people saw the thunderings, and the lightnings, and the noise of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking: and when the people saw it, they removed, and stood afar off.

19 And they said unto Moses, Speak thou with us, and we will hear: but let not God speak with us, lest we die.

20 And Moses said unto the people, Fear not: for God is come to prove you, and that his fear may be before your faces, that ye sin not.

21 And the people stood afar off, and Moses drew near unto the thick darkness where God was.

keep the faith
captain of 100
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by keep the faith »

Me thinks the irony of this discussion on proper Priesthood channels may be lost on a few here. Melissa uses Moses and the children of Israel to make her point of going directly to The Lord rather than listen to the Prophet. However she seems to miss the whole purpose for why The Lord wants us to give heed to His Prophet. Section 84 illustrates this point very well.

23 Now this aMoses plainly taught to the children of Israel in the wilderness, and sought diligently to bsanctify his people that they might cbehold the face of God;

24 But they ahardened their hearts and could not endure his bpresence; therefore, the Lord in his cwrath, for his danger was kindled against them, swore that they should not eenter into his rest while in the wilderness, which rest is the fulness of his glory.

25 Therefore, he took aMoses out of their midst, and the Holy bPriesthood also;

So if the children of Israel would have listened to and followed the directives of the Lords Prophet Moses they would have sanctified themselves and entered into the rest of The Lord. Moses was trying to lead the people into the Lords rest and guarantee them of celestial glory. They wanted no part of taking that step and chose instead to remain in darkness.

The point of all this is that if people WILL listen to and follow the counsel of the Lords mouthpiece they will be filled with the spirit and will desire to taste of the precious fruit and thereby will be prepared to receive The Lord when He choses to make Himself known unto them. Prophets are there to teach us how to connect with The Lord in a personal way and prepare us for those wonderful spiritual experiences The Lord wants to give us. They are not a stumbling block to those who desire to listen to their words and follow their directives as given through them by The Lord. Just the opposite in fact. They provide additional strength and direction to help take us back into the loving arms of our Savior. Those who think otherwise do not understand the purpose and role of a Prophet and will most likely as Joseph F Smith testified succumb to deceptive voices all around them.

natasha
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by natasha »

I have noticed in various scriptures where the Savior...and prophets...state that they have "beckoned" the people to come unto them. I believe the Savior still "beckons us"...as do His annointed here on earth. The "Church" beckons us to come unto the Savior and to the Gospel.

freedomforall
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by freedomforall »

keep the faith wrote:Me thinks the irony of this discussion on proper Priesthood channels may be lost on a few here. Melissa uses Moses and the children of Israel to make her point of going directly to The Lord rather than listen to the Prophet. However she seems to miss the whole purpose for why The Lord wants us to give heed to His Prophet. Section 84 illustrates this point very well.

23 Now this aMoses plainly taught to the children of Israel in the wilderness, and sought diligently to bsanctify his people that they might cbehold the face of God;

24 But they ahardened their hearts and could not endure his bpresence; therefore, the Lord in his cwrath, for his danger was kindled against them, swore that they should not eenter into his rest while in the wilderness, which rest is the fulness of his glory.

25 Therefore, he took aMoses out of their midst, and the Holy bPriesthood also;

So if the children of Israel would have listened to and followed the directives of the Lords Prophet Moses they would have sanctified themselves and entered into the rest of The Lord. Moses was trying to lead the people into the Lords rest and guarantee them of celestial glory. They wanted no part of taking that step and chose instead to remain in darkness.

The point of all this is that if people WILL listen to and follow the counsel of the Lords mouthpiece they will be filled with the spirit and will desire to taste of the precious fruit and thereby will be prepared to receive The Lord when He choses to make Himself known unto them. Prophets are there to teach us how to connect with The Lord in a personal way and prepare us for those wonderful spiritual experiences The Lord wants to give us. They are not a stumbling block to those who desire to listen to their words and follow their directives as given through them by The Lord. Just the opposite in fact. They provide additional strength and direction to help take us back into the loving arms of our Savior. Those who think otherwise do not understand the purpose and role of a Prophet and will most likely as Joseph F Smith testified succumb to deceptive voices all around them.
Scriptures give us many examples of what happens to those who reject the Prophets. Same thing for anyone setting themselves up as a light unto the world.
Instead of where humility is supposed to be...ego is found, instead of love for the Prophets...hard heartedness.
I think it was Lundbaek that said "in the church are the Saints and the Aints." I've been impressed by that statement. There's a huge difference between those folks struggling, striving and wanting to do better, to improve, and to be perfected...compared to those who think they are above the rest because of claims of higher knowledge and insight, and who also mock church leadership and reject the prophets.
Who has a better chance for exaltation, the meek, the humble, the sinner striving to do better each day...or those that mock in all its forms?

Volante
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by Volante »

Matthew 23:29-30 wrote:Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
Turn to the prophets, both ancient and living. Perhaps there is a bit of position-worship going on in the Church, but it doesn't seem fair to blame that on the men filling those positions. the Spirit has testified to me that the 12 Apostles are the 12 Apostles, and are all prophets, seers, and revelators, and that President Monson is the Prophet that leads the Church today under the direction of God and Our Savior. They are on the same page as Moses, Moroni, Jeremiah, et al. I look to them as men set apart to lead us, just as I look to the BoM, which was written for our day.

Did King Benjamin set himself up as a light unto the world, when he made his people come together and preached from a high tower? Did Captain Moroni, when he marched through the streets with the Title of Liberty and had his words mounted on every tower? Nephi prayed in a high tower along a busy highway where everyone would see him. I recognize that there is a fine line that must be carefully examined and tread with the guidance of the Spirit and a clear head. Personally, I see the living prophets as prophets and I'm thankful that we live in an age where I can access their words with much greater ease than in the days of our fathers. Magazines are much easier to distribute than gold plates!

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Melissa
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by Melissa »

Its also important to know that we are given a prophet in our day to lead the church in our time. We must give heed to past prophets for their examples and messages for us but OUR prophet today is OUR prophet. Thats what is so great about this church, continous revelation and timely (so to speak) guidance and direction. Pres. Monson was forordained as prophet to lead the church at THIS time and season that it must pass through. I put much more on MY living prophet today than I do on prophets past.

deep water
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by deep water »

The elect are those who have been chosen and cleansed by Christ, through the HG. Another way to say it is, those who have had and retain the BOFHG. It has nothing to do with Church office, Priesthood, authority, membership, or laying on hands. How could something so simple, have so many interpretations?

freedomforall
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Re: Even the very elect will be deceived....

Post by freedomforall »

Who are the elect? Let's find out.

D&C 29:7
7 And ye are called to bring to pass the gathering of mine elect; for mine elect hear my voice and harden not their hearts;

John 6:44 (44, 63–65)
44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

Alma 5:41 (37–41)
37 O ye workers of iniquity; ye that are puffed up in the vain things of the world, ye that have professed to have known the ways of righteousness nevertheless have gone astray, as sheep having no shepherd, notwithstanding a shepherd hath called after you and is still calling after you, but ye will not hearken unto his voice!
38 Behold, I say unto you, that the good shepherd doth call you; yea, and in his own name he doth call you, which is the name of Christ; and if ye will not hearken unto the voice of the good shepherd, to the name by which ye are called, behold, ye are not the sheep of the good shepherd.
39 And now if ye are not the sheep of the good shepherd, of what fold are ye? Behold, I say unto you, that the devil is your shepherd, and ye are of his fold; and now, who can deny this? Behold, I say unto you, whosoever denieth this is a liar and a child of the devil.
40 For I say unto you that whatsoever is good cometh from God, and whatsoever is evil cometh from the devil.
41 Therefore, if a man bringeth forth good works he hearkeneth unto the voice of the good shepherd, and he doth follow him; but whosoever bringeth forth evil works, the same becometh a child of the devil, for he hearkeneth unto his voice, and doth follow him.

So, who are the elect?

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