Reason's Not to Vote for Ron Paul

[Lovely1337Hi, I'm new.]

If you're the Federal Reserve:
1. Your near 100-year monopoly on currency and government control will be more severely threatened than it's ever been.
2. Your ability to print money out of thin air and create a hidden "inflation-tax" will come to a halt.
3. Bailing out massive corporations that caused the financial crisis in the first place will no longer be an option.

[Juliettecaptain of 1,000]

Because he is not electable, is not the candidate, and will dillute the vote allowing Obama another 4 years in office.
If he can't even compete in the nomination, then how is he going to win the election?

The problem is that most of you fail to realize how these power brokers behind the scenes actually operate. Ron Paul is just as deep into it as the rest of them, and you're being made to believe he's an outsider. He's not. He's a high ranking Freemason and you're falling for the old double reverse.

[Juliettecaptain of 1,000]

[InfoWarrior82captain of 1,000]

Because he is not electable, is not the candidate, and will dillute the vote allowing Obama another 4 years in office.
If he can't even compete in the nomination, then how is he going to win the election?

The problem is that most of you fail to realize how these power brokers behind the scenes actually operate. Ron Paul is just as deep into it as the rest of them, and you're being made to believe he's an outsider. He's not. He's a high ranking Freemason and you're falling for the old double reverse.

This is Juliette in 1844:

Reasons not to vote for Joseph Smith Jr. are is that he is not electable, he is not the candidate, and will dilute the vote allowing the Incumbent another term. If he can't even compete in the nomination, then how is he going to win the election?

Sorry I had to point out how silly you sound, Juliette. But it had to be done.

http://www.lds.org/ensign/2009/02/josep ... ted-states

Joseph Smith: Campaign for President of the United States

By Arnold K. Garr

Department Chair, Church History and Doctrine

Brigham Young University

On January 29, 1844, the Prophet Joseph Smith formally decided to run for the office of president of the United States. What did he hope to accomplish?

It began in 1839. The Prophet Joseph Smith, finally free after more than four months of imprisonment in Liberty, Missouri, had settled in Illinois, and the Saints had begun building what would become the city of Nauvoo. With the Missouri persecutions fresh in their minds, the Saints sought redress for the grievances they had suffered, but they were not successful. 1

Frustrated, Joseph determined to seek help from the federal government. After all, weren’t all Americans guaranteed the protections found in the Bill of Rights, the first 10 amendments to the United States Constitution? The very first of these is generally taken as a guarantee of the right to practice religion freely.
The Prophet Visits the President

Joseph Smith left Nauvoo for Washington, D.C., with Sidney Rigdon, Elias Higbee, and Orrin Porter Rockwell in a two-horse carriage “to lay before the Congress of the United States, the grievances of the Saints while in Missouri.” 2 Joseph and Judge Higbee met with President Martin Van Buren on November 29, 1839. At first Van Buren was inconsiderate of the Prophet’s plea. However, as the discussion progressed, the president promised to reconsider his position and “felt to sympathize with [the Mormons], on account of [their] sufferings.” 3

After their visit with President Van Buren, the Prophet and Elias Higbee stayed two months in the East, trying to gain support from senators and representatives who might be willing to espouse their cause. 4 They met with President Van Buren again in February 1840. 5 By this time, Van Buren had lost any sympathetic feelings he might have had for the Church. According to the Prophet, the president treated them rudely and declared: “Gentlemen, your cause is just, but I can do nothing for you. … If I take up for you I shall lose the vote of Missouri.” 6

Joseph Smith’s disappointing visit to Washington, D.C., became a turning point for him. His people had been abused and unjustly treated in Missouri, and the president of the United States had refused to help. The Church leaders would remember this neglect when the time came for another presidential election.
The 1844 Election Cycle Begins

In Nauvoo the Times and Seasons published an editorial on October 1, 1843, titled “Who Shall Be Our Next President?” It did not suggest any specific names but concluded that the candidate must be “the man who will be the most likely to render us assistance in obtaining redress for our grievances.” 7 On November 4, 1843, Joseph Smith wrote letters to John C. Calhoun, Lewis Cass, Richard M. Johnson, Henry Clay, and Martin Van Buren, the five leading candidates for the presidency of the United States. Each letter described the persecutions the Mormons had suffered at the hands of the state of Missouri and then asked the pointed question, “ ‘What will be your rule of action relative to us as a people,’ should fortune favor your ascension to the chief magistracy?” 8 Only Calhoun, Cass, and Clay responded to Joseph Smith’s letters, and they expressed little sympathy for the cause of the Saints.

When the Prophet realized that none of the leading candidates for the presidency would pledge to support redress for the Saints, he held a historic meeting in the mayor’s office at Nauvoo on January 29, 1844, with the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles and others. It was unanimously decided that Joseph Smith would run for president of the United States on an independent platform. 9 Thus began one of the most fascinating third-party presidential campaigns in American history.
Joseph Smith’s Platform

Joseph wasted little time in preparing a platform for his campaign. He met with William W. Phelps and dictated to him the headings for a political pamphlet titled General Smith’s Views of the Powers and Policy of the Government of the United States, 10 the foundation document for his presidential platform. The platform didn’t specifically mention the Latter-day Saints’ persecution in Missouri; instead, it offered solutions for many of the nation’s most pressing problems.

The most important plank in Joseph’s platform concerned the powers of the president. Joseph wanted to give the chief magistrate “full power to send an army to suppress mobs … [without requiring] the governor of a state to make the demand.” 11

Eliminating slavery was another important part of his platform. He wrote in General Smith’s Views: “The Declaration of Independence ‘holds these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness;’ but at the same time some two or three millions of people are held as slaves for life, because the spirit in them is covered with a darker skin.” 12 Instead of simply calling for the abolition of slavery, Joseph Smith’s platform would have Congress “pay every man a reasonable price for his slaves out of the surplus revenue arising from the sale of public lands, and from the deduction of pay from members of Congress.” 13

The platform also proposed changes to Congress. Joseph wanted to reduce congressional pay from eight dollars to two dollars per day. He wanted to have only two members of the House of Representatives for every one million people. 14

In addition, Joseph favored extensive prison reform, forming a national bank, and annexing Oregon and Texas. 15 He favored extending the United States “from the east to the west sea,” but only if Native Americans gave their consent. 16

On February 24, the Prophet had 1,500 copies of the pamphlet printed. Copies were mailed to the president of the United States and his cabinet, the justices of the Supreme Court, senators, representatives, editors of principal newspapers, postmasters, and other prominent citizens. 17

General Smith’s Views is an intriguing document. Many of Joseph Smith’s proposals came to pass, although not necessarily in the way he had envisioned: the power of the presidency was increased by Abraham Lincoln during the U.S. Civil War; the Civil War led to emancipation of the slaves; the penal system improved, although not to the extent that Joseph prescribed; and Oregon and Texas did become part of the United States. The Union’s borders soon stretched from sea to sea, but without the consent of Native Americans. Elder John A. Widtsoe evaluated General Smith’s Views as “an intelligent, comprehensive, forward-looking statement of policies, worthy of a trained statesman.” 18
The Campaign

On April 9, 1844, during general conference, the campaign began to take on a unique nature. Brigham Young announced that elders would be called to both “preach the Gospel and electioneer.” 19 During the latter part of the meeting, when President Young called for volunteers to serve these missions, 244 men stepped forward. 20

Additional electioneer missionaries were called, bringing the total to at least 337. On April 15 they were assigned to all 26 states in the Union and to the Wisconsin Territory. 21 Not only the number but also the quality of missionaries called was striking. Ten members of the Quorum of the Twelve—Brigham Young, Heber C. Kimball, Orson Hyde, Parley P. Pratt, William Smith, Orson Pratt, John E. Page, Wilford Woodruff, George A. Smith, and Lyman Wight—served as electioneer missionaries. 22

The Quorum of the Twelve scheduled a series of conferences to be held all over the United States. The Illinois state convention, held at Nauvoo on May 17, 1844, formally nominated Joseph Smith for president of the United States and Sidney Rigdon for vice president. The delegates organized a national convention to be held in Baltimore, Maryland, on July 13. 23

The journal of Wilford Woodruff describes the activities of an electioneer missionary. Elder Woodruff left Nauvoo on May 9 in company with George A. Smith, Jedediah M. Grant, and Ezra Thayer for an electioneer mission that would last just nine weeks. During that time he recorded that he spoke in at least six “political meetings.” He spoke at many more religious meetings than political gatherings, and he always kept his religious sermons and political speeches separate. The political gatherings were usually held the night before or very soon after the traditional Church conferences. 24

Elder Woodruff and at least four other members of the Quorum of the Twelve attended the Massachusetts state convention in Boston on July 1, 1844. 25 Elder Woodruff recorded in his journal: “The Melodeon was crowded in the evening, and it was soon evident that a large number of rowdies were in the galleries and felt disposed to make [a] disturbance.” One young man rose and made a series of disruptive remarks, and fighting broke out. The police were called in to restore order. Elder Woodruff recorded, “One person got badly cut in the face but not dangerous. The meeting was soon broken up.” 26 Despite the disturbance, Brigham Young wrote in a letter to Willard Richards, “All this did us good in Boston.” 27
Assassination Ends the Campaign

In the meantime, William Law and others in Illinois were plotting to take the life of Joseph Smith. Dr. Wall Southwick recounted a meeting he had attended in Carthage, Illinois, wherein the enemies of the Prophet had gathered together from every state in the Union but three. They were concerned that Joseph’s “views on government were widely circulated and took like wildfire.” According to Southwick, they believed that if the Prophet “did not get into the Presidential chair this election, he would be sure to the next time; and if Illinois and Missouri would join together and kill him, they would not be brought to justice for it.” 28 Dr. Southwick’s statement suggests that the Prophet’s presidential campaign was at least a contributing cause for his assassination.

Joseph Smith was martyred on June 27, 1844, at the Carthage Jail, ending his brief presidential campaign. Although he did not gain redress for the wrongs suffered by the Saints in Missouri, his campaign had brought much favorable public attention to the Church. Many years later, President Ezra Taft Benson said, “We should be ‘anxiously engaged’ in good causes and leave the world a better place for having lived in it (D&C 58:27).” 29 Joseph Smith’s presidential campaign had sought to make the United States a better place, not only for the Latter-day Saints, but for all Americans.
Why Joseph Smith Ran for President

“I would not have suffered my name to have been used by my friends on anywise as President of the United States, or candidate for that office, if I and my friends could have had the privilege of enjoying our religious and civil rights as American citizens, even those rights which the Constitution guarantees unto all her citizens alike. But this as a people we have been denied from the beginning. Persecution has rolled upon our heads from time to time, from portions of the United States, like peals of thunder, because of our religion; and no portion of the Government as yet has stepped forward for our relief. And in view of these things, I feel it to be my right and privilege to obtain what influence and power I can, lawfully, in the United States, for the protection of injured innocence.”

Joseph Smith, History of the Church, 6:210–11.
Political Neutrality

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints does not endorse, promote, or oppose political parties, candidates, or platforms. See the Newsroom at LDS.org for details.

Joseph in the Grove, by Archie D. Shaw; photograph of flag by Getty Images

After failing to acquire reassurances from leading candidates, Joseph Smith decided to run for president.

Document courtesy Church History Library

The Prophet’s political platform attempted to help the Saints by addressing the nation’s most pressing problems.

Documents courtesy Church History Library

The political campaign organized electioneers to preach the gospel and spread Joseph’s political position. Electioneering officials, assigned to all 26 states in the Union, included members of the Quorum of the Twelve.

Courtesy Church History Library

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008 ... 7mZL8WwWcA

The First Mormon Presidential Candidate


By JAKE TAPPER (@jaketapper)
Dec. 6, 2007

Mitt Romney is the most recent member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints to seek the office of president.

But the first Mormon to seek the White House was also the first Mormon -- Joseph Smith Jr., the founder of the Mormon Church, whose 1844 presidential campaign is historically notable not only because it was the first one in which the candidate was assassinated.

Smith's campaign 163 years ago was quite a bit different than Romney's, of course. In Romney's highly anticipated address Thursday about the role of faith in America, he only mentioned Mormonism by name once, and he invoked Abraham Lincoln's concept of "America's 'political religion' -- the commitment to defend the rule of law and the Constitution."

First Mormon to Seek White House

Smith directly pushed what he called "theodemocracy," the blending of religious belief and democracy. And his campaign was rooted entirely within the church that he founded; at the April 1844 LDS general conference, 244 church elders heeded the call to volunteer for Smith's campaign.

Hundreds of Mormons traveled the United States to spread the word not just of Smith's prophesies but his candidacy; many of them met with angry mobs and violence.

"There is not a nation or a dynasty now occupying the Earth which acknowledges almighty God as their lawgiver," Smith told the Neighbor newspaper in Nauvoo, Ill., where he and his church brethren were then headquartered.

"I go emphatically, virtuously, and humanely, for a theodemocracy, where God and the people hold the power to conduct the affairs of men in righteousness."

Announcing his candidacy Jan. 29, 1844, Smith told his supporters, "Tell the people we have had Whig and Democrat presidents long enough. We want a president of the United States."

Megalomaniacal Madness

To Smith's detractors, his presidential run could only be seen within the context of his megalomaniacal madness. Mormon historians, however, argue that Smith was trying to stand for his principles, argue publicly for civil liberties for Mormons and publicize the church.

According to "The Prophet and the Presidency: Mormonism and Politics in Joseph Smith's 1844 Presidential campaign," a 2000 study of Smith's campaign by Timothy Wood in the Illinois State Historical Society, Smith's supporters even had their own catchy cheer:

"Kinderhook, Kass, Kalhoun, nor Klay/Kan never surely win the day./But if you want to know who Kan/You'll find in General Smith the man."

Claimed to See God and Jesus

Smith's presidential run came approximately 25 years after he claimed to have first seen God and Jesus in Palmyra, N.Y., 21 years after he said he was visited by the resurrected prophet Moroni, and 17 years after he announced his discovery of a long-buried book about the Lord's dealings with early Israelite inhabitants of the Americas.

Questions about Smith's teachings remain hotly contested well into the 21st century. Just this week, Romney faced questions about the role of African-Americans in the Mormon Church.

Blacks have long been derided as an inferior people in some Mormon teachings, and it wasn't until 1978 that black men were permitted to become Mormon priests. The South Carolina state co-chair of the Fred Thompson for president campaign, Cyndi Mosteller, this week told The Palmetto Scoop Web site that voters will question "the Church's history, and almost theology, on the issue of race -- particularly the black race."

In that context it's interesting to note that Smith's campaign in 1844 sought to end slavery.

Sought to End Slavery

Smith's solution was gradualist -- to purchase the freedom of slaves with funds amassed by the reduction in the size of Congress, pay for members of Congress and the sale of public lands.

He "was not an abolitionist in the strictest sense," wrote Margaret Robertson in her Brigham Young University study of Smith's campaign.

"He felt slavery was not right and saw the need to abolish slavery to preserve the nation. But he also realized the need to save the economy of the South." He "refused to take the extreme abolitionist point."

These and other views were published in Smith's campaign book.

Fourteen years after Smith translated the metal pages he said he discovered and published the Book of Mormon in 1830 came the publication of his presidential treatise, "General Smith's Views of the Power and Policy of the Government of the United States," (an image of which can be seen HERE from Brigham Young University's archives).

In his campaign book, Smith outlined a six-point platform: gradually ending slavery; reducing the size of Congress by at least two-thirds; re-establishing a national bank; annexing Texas, California and Oregon; prison reform; and a position near and dear to Mormons at the time -- empowering the federal government to protect the liberties of minorities from "mobocracy."

Referring specifically to Gov. Lilburn Boggs, who had used his state militia to evict Mormons from his home state of Missouri in 1838, Smith wanted to ensure federal civil rights protections even if a governor himself were "a mobber."

Support for Polygamy

Though Smith enjoyed support among his followers, his support for polygamy, starting in 1841, as well as other church issues, had begun to alienate some supporters.

A rival newspaper, the Nauvoo Expositor, questioned whether Smith could serve as a federal and local official at the same time. "We see that our friend the Neighbor, advocates the claims of Gen. Joseph Smith for the presidency; we also see from the records of the grand Jury of Hancock Co. at their recent term, that the general is a candidate to represent the branch of the state government at Alton [prison]. We would respectfully suggest to the Neighbor, whether the two offices are not incompatible with each other."

Smith had an interesting concept of the First Amendment, one that might make Romney's attitude towards the Boston Globe seem downright friendly. Working with the Nauvoo City Council, Smith had the Expositor's printing press seized and every copy of the newspaper he could find burned.

He wrote a letter in the Neighbor accusing the rival newspaper of plotting "the destruction of the institutions of this city, both civil and religious… to rid the city of a paper so filthy and pestilential as this become the duty of every good citizen who loves good order and morality."

The controversy, combined as it was with other questions about Smith's leadership and charges brought against him by the government, soon spiraled out of control. Smith was killed by an angry mob on June 25, 1844.

But many of his electioneers spread throughout the country to campaign for him continued on their journeys. Referring to Smith as a "martyr," they now talked up his religion, not his White House hopes.

LOL! Ron Paul, some maniacal, evil, scheming Illuminati Free Mason?
You have got to be kidding me. Look at his record Juliette. It doesn't lie.

[Legioncaptain of 1,000]

If you're the Federal Reserve:
1. Your near 100-year monopoly on currency and government control will be more severely threatened than it's ever been.
2. Your ability to print money out of thin air and create a hidden "inflation-tax" will come to a halt.
3. Bailing out massive corporations that caused the financial crisis in the first place will no longer be an option.

1. How is it threatened? By competing currencies controlled by the market? Who controls the market? Are gold and silver controlled and manipulated by "the market"?
2. How hard is it to print digital gold? Don't the global private banks control the market and thus any new "competing currencies"? Same old agenda and folks but with a new facade?
3. No instead we will use their competing currencies. Privatize government and pay them directly. Instead of a revolving door between government and corporations it will just be corporations. Get rid of TSA and go straight to Blackwater/XE Services/Academi. That will solve the problem won't it?

[davedancaptain of 1,000]

(good points Legion)


I am no FED Reserve Fan But, So what is we END THE FED. All the FED does is sell bonds and print money based on how many bonds they sell. If countries or private individuals or banks buy bonds the USD increases in value. If the FED buys it's own bonds and prints money anyways, USD decreases in value. The FED also determines the interest rate of lending and the fractional reserve requirement of banks (money multiplier, btw the FED increased the fractional reserve requirement in 2007 triggering the collapse)

The Banks then borrow money (USD) from the FED and then they create money out of thin air at a 10/1 ratio or worse (50/1 or 100/1). It's the mega banks doing most of the magic money creation.

So even if you END THE FED and have Geitner at the Treasury sell bonds, determine interest rate, and fractional reserve requirement or you have Bernanke at the FED do it; what's that going to change?

And even if you switched to a gold-based currency and said that the US Treasury could only print money it has gold for. The banks are still going to borrow USD from the Treasury and money multiply it like they always have.

Unless you get rid of fractional reserve banking, control inflation, offer lending at simple interest, and create alternatives to the amortized loan; not much is going to change.

[mattctrcaptain of 100]

If it is an Abrahamic-type test. If the Lord is asking you to vote for someone else whom you would loathe to vote for under any other circumstance, knowing that politics is very, very important to you, and you must prove your love of God is greater than your love of politics by doing something that under no other circumstance would be the right thing to do. That is the only compelling reason I can think of at this point...

[InfoWarrior82captain of 1,000]

(good points Legion)


I am no FED Reserve Fan But, So what is we END THE FED. All the FED does is sell bonds and print money based on how many bonds they sell. If countries or private individuals or banks buy bonds the USD increases in value. If the FED buys it's own bonds and prints money anyways, USD decreases in value. The FED also determines the interest rate of lending and the fractional reserve requirement of banks (money multiplier, btw the FED increased the fractional reserve requirement in 2007 triggering the collapse)

The Banks then borrow money (USD) from the FED and then they create money out of thin air at a 10/1 ratio or worse (50/1 or 100/1). It's the mega banks doing most of the magic money creation.

So even if you END THE FED and have Geitner at the Treasury sell bonds, determine interest rate, and fractional reserve requirement or you have Bernanke at the FED do it; what's that going to change?

And even if you switched to a gold-based currency and said that the US Treasury could only print money it has gold for. The banks are still going to borrow USD from the Treasury and money multiply it like they always have.

Unless you get rid of fractional reserve banking, control inflation, offer lending at simple interest, and create alternatives to the amortized loan; not much is going to change.

http://www.amazon.com/End-Fed-Ron-Paul/ ... 534&sr=1-1

[Truth B Knowncaptain of 100]

How about a thread titled 'reasons to vote for Ron Paul'?

[Juliettecaptain of 1,000]

How about a thread titled 'reasons to vote for Ron Paul'?

I'm almost convinced Truth!

[Truth B Knowncaptain of 100]

How about a thread titled 'reasons to vote for Ron Paul'?

I'm almost convinced Truth!

Can you elaborate Juliette?

[Liberty_Agentcaptain of 100]

Ron Paul won't get my vote since he isn't going to get the nomination. If he were able to become the Republican nominee then I would give him my vote but that's not saying much. His foreign policy would allow for many small, democratic, capitalistic nations to be swallowed up by their tyrannical neighbors. While I do agree we should go to war only when needed, and we shouldn't be as spread out as we are now, that doesn't mean we have to enforce some non-interventionist foreign policy. That would be a gigantic mistake.

Because he is not electable, is not the candidate, and will dillute the vote allowing Obama another 4 years in office.
If he can't even compete in the nomination, then how is he going to win the election?

The problem is that most of you fail to realize how these power brokers behind the scenes actually operate. Ron Paul is just as deep into it as the rest of them, and you're being made to believe he's an outsider. He's not. He's a high ranking Freemason and you're falling for the old double reverse.

Could you elaborate a little more about this? Why do you think Ron Paul may be an insider besides the Mason stuff? Is he disinfo?

[InfoWarrior82captain of 1,000]

Agent- Non interventionist foreign policy is the constitutional standpoint. It's what the founders had in mind and on top of that, it's what the book of Mormon teaches. Also, read my post above to Juliette and consider standing for something instead of standing for party.

[Teancumcaptain of 100]

I am no FED Reserve Fan But, So what is we END THE FED. All the FED does is sell bonds and print money based on how many bonds they sell.

Sure. The Fed isn't that bad.

They just bailout their rich buddies at the expense of the poor; they rob from the elderly's retirement accounts through inflation; they allow the US to fund and prop up dictators and stomp out agency around the world; their shenanigans allow the US to believe we can never go broke as did Greece, Portugal, Iceland, etc. so we can continue merrily along spending what we don't have while going against prophetic counsel on saving and spending everytime we vote for expediency rather than principle at the ballot box; they fund all of the evil wars that ultimately are used to cash in on the fruit of the American people's labor and cause bloodshed; they put us, our kids, our grandkids, great-grandkids, etc. into deep debt which "officially" currently stands at $15.6 trillion (to put this into perspective, equating this to a dollar per second of time yields 494,000 years) which we will never pay off under the current state of things...

Yeah, the Fed isn't that bad...

[Teancumcaptain of 100]

I would really enjoy someone standing up to explain to all of us why we should vote for someone like Romney, who touts the following resume:

1. Obamacare was one of the worst pieces of legislation ever passed by the U.S. Congress. Mitt Romney says that he would repeal Obamacare, but the reality is that Romneycare was what Obamacare was based on. Romney’s government run “universal” healthcare plan was endorsed by Ted Kennedy, Hillary Clinton, and Planned Parenthood, but has been labeled a total failure according to the Wall St. Journal, Boston Globe, and Cato Institute.

“We passed health care with an assist from a former Massachusetts governor” (Barack Obama, CNN, May 9, 2011)

2. Romney supported a taxpayer bail-out of the Detroit auto industry on the eve of the 2008 Michigan primary then later opposed it.

3. Romney is a big time Wall Street insider … Wall Street’s money is being absolutely showered on his campaign as he was a very enthusiastic supporter of the Wall Street bailouts:

I believe that it was necessary to prevent a cascade of bank collapses- Romney, CPAC Speech 2009, Politico February 27, 2009

4. Romney supported Bush’s in the 1st bailout of our recent recession, back when Bush stated:

"I've abandoned free-market principles to save the free-market system," as told to CNN television.

5. In an article entitled “The Big Wall Street Banks Are Already Trying To Buy The 2012 Election,” The Center for Responsive Politics data shows that Mitt Romney is getting far more money from the “too big to fail” Wall Street banks than all of the other Republican candidates combined.

6. Al Gore recently praised on Mitt Romney on his blog:

"Good for Mitt Romney — though we've long passed the point where weak lip-service is enough on the Climate Crisis," Gore wrote. "While other Republicans are running from the truth, he is sticking to his guns in the face of the anti-science wing of the Republican Party." (Al Gore)

“I don’t speak for the scientific community, of course, but I believe the world’s getting warmer. I can’t prove that, but I believe based on what I read that the world is getting warmer. And number two, I believe that humans contribute to that…I also think it’s important for us to reduce our emissions of pollutants and greenhouse gases that may well be significant contributors to the climate change and the global warming that you’re seeing.” – Mitt Romney, UNH Townhall, Washington Post, June 3, 2011

7.

“I support Cap-and-Trade on a global basis but not the USA going alone. I want to do it with other nations involved and on a global scale.”

(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3G598Xno5qU&feature=related

8. The Boston Globe reported on July 25, 2005 that Romney had passed over Republican lawyers for three-quarters of the 36 judicial vacancies he faced, instead nominating registered Democrats, Independents, and two open homosexuals. In fact, Romney only nominated 9 Republicans for judgeships in Massachusetts, but he did nominate 14 Democrats.

9. Mitt Romney is incredibly soft on illegal immigration and even supported the McCain-Kennedy “comprehensive immigration reform” (i.e. amnesty Back in 2007). Mitt Romney made the following statement….

“But my view is that those 12 million who’ve come here illegally should be given the opportunity to sign up to stay here”

10. Mitt Romney was rated the #8 RINO (Republican in Name Only) by the long-time conservative journal Human Events on December 27, 2005.

11. Mitt Romney once claimed that he was more “pro-choice” than Ted Kennedy, but now he claims that he is pro-life. In a recent article for WorldNetDaily, Chaplain Gordon James Klingenschmitt explained why so many voters are still skeptical….
This year he’s the only major Republican presidential candidate who has yet to sign the Susan B. Anthony List pledge to defend life and defund Planned Parenthood nationwide. Candidates Bachmann, Perry, Gingrich, Paul, Pawlenty and Santorum all signed the pledge, although it should be noted Herman Cain supports everything in the pledge except the Fetal Pain Act. And who can forget Mitt’s famous 2002 campaign debate bragging repeatedly that he’s more pro-choice than Ted Kennedy?
As governor of MA, Romney also supported the funding of abortions for poor women and legalization of RU-486, a drug used to terminate established pregnancies (abortion inducer).

12. During this campaign season, Mitt Romney has stated that he only supports partnership agreements for gay couples and not gay marriage, but what Romney actually did while governor of Massachusetts suggests otherwise. In the WorldNetDaily article referenced above, Chaplain Gordon James Klingenschmitt detailed how Mitt Romney aggressively implemented gay marriage in the state of Massachusetts….
When the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court decided in 2003 to recognize homosexual “marriage,” ignoring the voters and the Constitution, the court admitted it did not have power to issue licenses or force participation by justices of the peace to solemnize the weddings. Romney illegally authorized changes to, and issuance of, legally null and void marriage licenses to same sex couples without a binding enabling statute falsely claiming that "everybody (knew) that the MSJC (Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court) legalized same sex marriage."
Romney used a non-existent state law to force Catholic Charities, the state's largest adoption and foster care agency, to provide children to homosexuals even when normal mother-father families were lined up to give them a home.
On June 6, 2007, Romney said:

"There are other ways to raise kids that's fine--single moms, grandparents raising kids, gay couples raising kids. That's the American way, to have people have their freedom of choice."

13.

“I am more convinced than ever before that as we seek to establish full equality for America’s gays and lesbian citizens, I will provide more effective leadership than my opponent” -- Romney in 1994 MA Senate Campaign against Ted Kennedy.

14.

"I feel that all people should be allowed to participate in the Boy Scouts regardless of their sexual orientation." (Romney, Boston Globe, 10/27/1994)

15. Romney jokingly stated that he believes no one after Moses has spoken to God
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiQdIwUrejc

If someone could explain all of this, then maybe, just maybe, I would consider taking another look at Romney. For now, I cannot do so. I have found these item to make him completely unqualified to capture my support. I vote on princples, not political short-term expediency. The 15 points above show Romney has no principle (unless proven otherwise); therefore I cannot vote for him, regardless if he holds the priesthood or not. I know plenty of inactives who hold the Melchizedek priesthood: should I nominate them for the presidency??

I am dying for someone to show me that the above list is a complete fabrication. I put it together myself after my own research on Romney.

[Lovely1337Hi, I'm new.]

I would really enjoy someone standing up to explain to all of us why we should vote for someone like Romney, who touts the following resume:

1. Obamacare was one of the worst pieces of legislation ever passed by the U.S. Congress. Mitt Romney says that he would repeal Obamacare, but the reality is that Romneycare was what Obamacare was based on. Romney’s government run “universal” healthcare plan was endorsed by Ted Kennedy, Hillary Clinton, and Planned Parenthood, but has been labeled a total failure according to the Wall St. Journal, Boston Globe, and Cato Institute.

“We passed health care with an assist from a former Massachusetts governor” (Barack Obama, CNN, May 9, 2011)

2. Romney supported a taxpayer bail-out of the Detroit auto industry on the eve of the 2008 Michigan primary then later opposed it.

3. Romney is a big time Wall Street insider … Wall Street’s money is being absolutely showered on his campaign as he was a very enthusiastic supporter of the Wall Street bailouts:

I believe that it was necessary to prevent a cascade of bank collapses- Romney, CPAC Speech 2009, Politico February 27, 2009

4. Romney supported Bush’s in the 1st bailout of our recent recession, back when Bush stated:

"I've abandoned free-market principles to save the free-market system," as told to CNN television.

5. In an article entitled “The Big Wall Street Banks Are Already Trying To Buy The 2012 Election,” The Center for Responsive Politics data shows that Mitt Romney is getting far more money from the “too big to fail” Wall Street banks than all of the other Republican candidates combined.

6. Al Gore recently praised on Mitt Romney on his blog:

"Good for Mitt Romney — though we've long passed the point where weak lip-service is enough on the Climate Crisis," Gore wrote. "While other Republicans are running from the truth, he is sticking to his guns in the face of the anti-science wing of the Republican Party." (Al Gore)

“I don’t speak for the scientific community, of course, but I believe the world’s getting warmer. I can’t prove that, but I believe based on what I read that the world is getting warmer. And number two, I believe that humans contribute to that…I also think it’s important for us to reduce our emissions of pollutants and greenhouse gases that may well be significant contributors to the climate change and the global warming that you’re seeing.” – Mitt Romney, UNH Townhall, Washington Post, June 3, 2011

7.

“I support Cap-and-Trade on a global basis but not the USA going alone. I want to do it with other nations involved and on a global scale.”

(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3G598Xno5qU&feature=related

8. The Boston Globe reported on July 25, 2005 that Romney had passed over Republican lawyers for three-quarters of the 36 judicial vacancies he faced, instead nominating registered Democrats, Independents, and two open homosexuals. In fact, Romney only nominated 9 Republicans for judgeships in Massachusetts, but he did nominate 14 Democrats.

9. Mitt Romney is incredibly soft on illegal immigration and even supported the McCain-Kennedy “comprehensive immigration reform” (i.e. amnesty Back in 2007). Mitt Romney made the following statement….

“But my view is that those 12 million who’ve come here illegally should be given the opportunity to sign up to stay here”

10. Mitt Romney was rated the #8 RINO (Republican in Name Only) by the long-time conservative journal Human Events on December 27, 2005.

11. Mitt Romney once claimed that he was more “pro-choice” than Ted Kennedy, but now he claims that he is pro-life. In a recent article for WorldNetDaily, Chaplain Gordon James Klingenschmitt explained why so many voters are still skeptical….
This year he’s the only major Republican presidential candidate who has yet to sign the Susan B. Anthony List pledge to defend life and defund Planned Parenthood nationwide. Candidates Bachmann, Perry, Gingrich, Paul, Pawlenty and Santorum all signed the pledge, although it should be noted Herman Cain supports everything in the pledge except the Fetal Pain Act. And who can forget Mitt’s famous 2002 campaign debate bragging repeatedly that he’s more pro-choice than Ted Kennedy?
As governor of MA, Romney also supported the funding of abortions for poor women and legalization of RU-486, a drug used to terminate established pregnancies (abortion inducer).

12. During this campaign season, Mitt Romney has stated that he only supports partnership agreements for gay couples and not gay marriage, but what Romney actually did while governor of Massachusetts suggests otherwise. In the WorldNetDaily article referenced above, Chaplain Gordon James Klingenschmitt detailed how Mitt Romney aggressively implemented gay marriage in the state of Massachusetts….
When the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court decided in 2003 to recognize homosexual “marriage,” ignoring the voters and the Constitution, the court admitted it did not have power to issue licenses or force participation by justices of the peace to solemnize the weddings. Romney illegally authorized changes to, and issuance of, legally null and void marriage licenses to same sex couples without a binding enabling statute falsely claiming that "everybody (knew) that the MSJC (Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court) legalized same sex marriage."
Romney used a non-existent state law to force Catholic Charities, the state's largest adoption and foster care agency, to provide children to homosexuals even when normal mother-father families were lined up to give them a home.
On June 6, 2007, Romney said:

"There are other ways to raise kids that's fine--single moms, grandparents raising kids, gay couples raising kids. That's the American way, to have people have their freedom of choice."

13.

“I am more convinced than ever before that as we seek to establish full equality for America’s gays and lesbian citizens, I will provide more effective leadership than my opponent” -- Romney in 1994 MA Senate Campaign against Ted Kennedy.

14.

"I feel that all people should be allowed to participate in the Boy Scouts regardless of their sexual orientation." (Romney, Boston Globe, 10/27/1994)

15. Romney jokingly stated that he believes no one after Moses has spoken to God
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiQdIwUrejc

If someone could explain all of this, then maybe, just maybe, I would consider taking another look at Romney. For now, I cannot do so. I have found these item to make him completely unqualified to capture my support. I vote on princples, not political short-term expediency. The 15 points above show Romney has no principle (unless proven otherwise); therefore I cannot vote for him, regardless if he holds the priesthood or not. I know plenty of inactives who hold the Melchizedek priesthood: should I nominate them for the presidency??

I am dying for someone to show me that the above list is a complete fabrication. I put it together myself after my own research on Romney.

But Teancum, he's a priesthood holder, and a priesthood holder can do no wrong. You're trying too hard to look at his fruits. Just pay attention to his appearance. He looks so "presidential", and he's the only one that's "electable" that can beat Obama. If nothing else, history has shown us that ignoring principle and having an "anyone but the last guy" philosophy is the way we should think. Haven't you noticed that each president for the last 100 years has just gotten better, and better? Can't you see that Clinton was better than Bush Sr., Bush Jr. was better than Clinton, and Obama is better than Bush Jr.? I'm so glad that I'm sensible and stand with Bob, Juli, Dave and Dalton on this issue.

[Teancumcaptain of 100]

But Teancum, he's a priesthood holder, and a priesthood holder can do no wrong. You're trying too hard to look at his fruits. Just pay attention to his appearance. He looks so "presidential", and he's the only one that's "electable" that can beat Obama. If nothing else, history has shown us that ignoring principle and having an "anyone but the last guy" philosophy is the way we should think. Haven't you noticed that each president for the last 100 years has just gotten better, and better? Can't you see that Clinton was better than Bush Sr., Bush Jr. was better than Clinton, and Obama is better than Bush Jr.? I'm so glad that I'm sensible and stand with Bob, Juli, Dave and Dalton on this issue.

Good one Lovely. And welcome.

[karen2cruisecaptain of 100]

But Teancum, he's a priesthood holder, and a priesthood holder can do no wrong. You're trying too hard to look at his fruits. Just pay attention to his appearance. He looks so "presidential", and he's the only one that's "electable" that can beat Obama. If nothing else, history has shown us that ignoring principle and having an "anyone but the last guy" philosophy is the way we should think. Haven't you noticed that each president for the last 100 years has just gotten better, and better? Can't you see that Clinton was better than Bush Sr., Bush Jr. was better than Clinton, and Obama is better than Bush Jr.? I'm so glad that I'm sensible and stand with Bob, Juli, Dave and Dalton on this issue.

Reasons to not vote for Mitt Romney:

"Unfortunately some men who do not honor their stewardships may have an adverse affect on many people. Often the greater the man’s responsibility the more good or evil he can accomplish. The Lord usually gives a man a long enough rope and sufficient time to determine whether that man wants to pull himself into the presence of God or drop off somewhere below.

There are some regrettable things being said and done by some people in the Church today. As President Clark so well warned, “The ravening wolves are amongst us, from our own membership and they, more than any others, are clothed in sheep’s clothing because they wear the habiliments of the priesthood…. We should be careful of them"

from President Benson Talk -
http://www.latterdayconservative.com/ez ... nsibility/

[InfoWarrior82captain of 1,000]

You may want to type that in a larger font, Karen. Bob usually doesn't have his reading glasses on.

[Juliettecaptain of 1,000]

You may want to type that in a larger font, Karen. Bob usually doesn't have his reading glasses on.

Oh come on baby, lets do the TWIST! Spin and twist the facts, like we don't see it. I stay on this forum, and I listen. I often wonder if you people even realize that you have already been WRONG in so many of you're words? " Ron Paul runs, Ron Paul wins". " Ron Paul IS electable".
Paul in Iowa got his #@@ handed to him with his not even close third place finish.

He has failed miserably over a long period to gain support within Congress even from his Republican colleagues. He can't get things done. How could he possibly be a president that gets things done? I don't believe him and neither do the majority of the American public.
Now, because you are losing, you spend your time convincing people NOT to vote for Romney so we can have Obama for another 4 years! GET A CLUE!!

You don't need glasses on to see that Ron Paul will NEVER be the President. And that was a CHEAP shot!

[mattctrcaptain of 100]

You may want to type that in a larger font, Karen. Bob usually doesn't have his reading glasses on.

Oh come on baby, lets do the TWIST! Spin and twist the facts, like we don't see it. ...
Paul in Iowa got his #@@ handed to him with his not even close third place finish.

FYI, Ron Paul won Iowa.
He captured Iowa's delegates, and since, delegates matter, while caucus straw poll results mean nothing come convention time, let's all do that twist!

[Juliettecaptain of 1,000]

You may want to type that in a larger font, Karen. Bob usually doesn't have his reading glasses on.

Oh come on baby, lets do the TWIST! Spin and twist the facts, like we don't see it. ...
Paul in Iowa got his #@@ handed to him with his not even close third place finish.

FYI, Ron Paul won Iowa.
He captured Iowa's delegates, and since, delegates matter, while caucus straw poll results mean nothing come convention time, let's all do that twist!

Just keep telling yourself that. He will not be the candidate.

[Juliettecaptain of 1,000]

TeaPartyFail in NevadaYeah, I’m “Judgeing” →


Lie, Cheat, and Steal – It’s the Ron Paul Way!

April 25th, 2012 · 57 Comments




I recently received an E-mail from a disaffected Ron Paul supporter that Nevada Paul Campaign Chair Carl Bunce recently sent out to his supporters. The long and the short of it is that it’s a battle plan which encourages Paul folks to lie to pollsters to “fool” the Romney campaign, in order to make it easier to shock-’n'-awe their way to a Ron Paul National Convention slate. It’s full of paranoia about information control (Hah! Fail!) and secrecy, with a nice dab of Personality Cult for Doctor Paul.

Well, secret’s out, you dishonest goofballs. Everyone knows your game.

I’ve already detailed how these people have no respect for elections, the express will of an electorate, or anyone’s liberty except their own. Bunce signs his E-mails “In Liberty” – what a bunch of bullcrap. (I guess it’s kind of like how they call it the “People’s Republic.”) This E-mail provides ample proof that these people don’t care about winning elections or building majorities, but simply want to throw temper tantrums like entitled babies, all the while thinking they’re oh so clever. They don’t just think they’re entitled to vote, they think they have some God-given entitlement to win every election just because they showed up! Honestly – they’re much, much more akin to Occupy Wall Street hippies than any recognizable brand of libertarianism or conservatism.

Don’t these people realize that if they had a winning message, they wouldn’t have the need for all the secrecy? Don’t they see what hypocrites they look like when they cry about dishonesty and lack of transparency in government? And remember, this isn’t just some independent Paul supporter. This IS the Ron Paul campaign, and Ron Paul himself is directly responsible for it. Either the Congressman is blind to these types of shenanigans, or he endorses it. Which is it, Good Doctor? Will you renounce this assault on actual liberty being perpetuated in your name? There’s certainly nothing “libertarian” about any of this.

Nevada Republicans were promised by their Central Committee that their caucus votes would be proportionally binding all the way through the first round of voting at the national convention. I have to wonder – if these Paul people wind up going to the national convention, will they honor that promise? Or will they just openly betray the Nevadans they claim to want to represent?

Just remember this – people willing to lie, cheat, or steal in order to get power will lie, cheat and steal once they’re in power. Even if you find Paul’s platform compelling, after this there’s no way you could trust he’d follow through with any of it.

~~~

Speaking of lying, cheating, and stealing, I wonder if our new state party chair Michael McDonald will try to crack down on this nonsense. He’s certainly painted himself in a corner. If he stands up to these petty thugs, he’ll lose his entire base of support. If he stand with the thugs, the convention will be a national embarrassment to make 2008 look like a garden party, and the 81% of Nevada Republicans who DIDN’T support Ron Paul will take their time and energy elsewhere.

It almost – almost – makes me sorry I’m going to miss the fireworks. I can only hope the ensuing chaos will finally put an end to this perennial nonsense.

I honestly and truly want to see a single Ron Paul supporter justify this nonsense, or explain how – even if this plan succeeds and Ron Paul upsets Mitt Romney on the convention floor to be the GOP nominee against Obama – Paul could go to the general election with a single shred of legitimacy.

[mattctrcaptain of 100]

Just keep telling yourself that. He will not be the candidate.

I didn't say he will be the candidate. I only said that come convention time, Iowa delegates will be supporting Ron Paul, barring any nefarious rule dodging or manipulation by the RNC. I was only correcting you on the point of "who won Iowa" in terms of delegates.

[Juliettecaptain of 1,000]

Just keep telling yourself that. He will not be the candidate.

I didn't say he will be the candidate. I only said that come convention time, Iowa delegates will be supporting Ron Paul, barring any nefarious rule dodging or manipulation by the RNC. I was only correcting you on the point of "who won Iowa" in terms of delegates.

Yeah, well read on..........

[mattctrcaptain of 100]

Frankly, at the end of the day, I don't care who wins the Republican party nomination. It's irrelevant.

If Mitt wins, I will find myself trying to help friends and family navigate the deluge of reporting that will paint church policies and history in a negative light.

If Ron Paul pulls off an unlikely win, I will find myself trying to help family and friends navigate the deluge of reporting that will paint his policies and history in a negative light.

[karen2cruisecaptain of 100]

**

[InfoWarrior82captain of 1,000]

Sad, sad, Juliette. Can't even tell that Mitt Romney is a progressive even when all the facts have been shooting you in the face. You deserve what you get.

[Juliettecaptain of 1,000]

Sad, sad, Juliette. Can't even tell that Mitt Romney is a progressive even when all the facts have been shooting you in the face. You deserve what you get.

Sad, sad Info. He wants to be Ron Paul, and he wants to be a winner. Lost on both accounts.

[InfoWarrior82captain of 1,000]

It's ok Juliette. You'll get it someday. And I forgive you for calling me a loser.