The irony of freedom

[coachmarcMy own worst enemy]

Something occurred to me just now. The irony of seeking any kind of freedom, whether financial, spiritual, etc, is that the source of your freedom also becomes your master. Choose your master wisely.

[EclecticLibertariancaptain of 50]

Something occurred to me just now. The irony of seeking any kind of freedom, whether financial, spiritual, etc, is that the source of your freedom also becomes your master. Choose your master wisely.

I disagree with this assessment. Something only becomes your master if you allow it to take over your life and allow it to be the determining factor in all, or at least the majority, of your decisions. If instead of allowing a job or the pursuit of an education or career, or even one's religious devotion (which I consider to be different than one's spiritual devotion) to govern your life; if instead you govern your life according to Principles, you will remain the master and you will attain the highest degrees of freedom possible as you align your actions with such principles. Someone who illustrates this fairly well is Stephen Covey in his books, "The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People" and "The Divine Center".

[davedancaptain of 1,000]

The Spirit of Freedom is the light of Christ which all men possess.

The Book of Mormon has many illustrations of the light of Christ and conscience.

Sherem and Korihor deny Christ and or the existence of God and then confess that they always had known that there was a God and Jesus is the Christ.

King Lamoni shows conscience when he thinks Ammon is the Great Spirit come to punish him for killing his servants.

Ammon explains in Alma 26 that even tbrough many Nephites were of the belief that the Lamanites ciukd never be redeemed, Ammon believed otherwise.

[AGalagaChiasmuscaptain of 100]

Something occurred to me just now. The irony of seeking any kind of freedom, whether financial, spiritual, etc, is that the source of your freedom also becomes your master. Choose your master wisely.

I disagree with this assessment. Something only becomes your master if you allow it to take over your life and allow it to be the determining factor in all, or at least the majority, of your decisions. If instead of allowing a job or the pursuit of an education or career, or even one's religious devotion (which I consider to be different than one's spiritual devotion) to govern your life; if instead you govern your life according to Principles, you will remain the master and you will attain the highest degrees of freedom possible as you align your actions with such principles. Someone who illustrates this fairly well is Stephen Covey in his books, "The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People" and "The Divine Center".

I think coachmarc is on the right track. The Savior parabelized: "No man can serve two masters". A master can be anything you serve, as in both positive and negative connotations apply. We should all accept Jesus the Christ as the Master. When we look to him we don't serve anyone or anything else, save "service of our fellow beings (in charity) is the service of God, the Master". Jesus also declared "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life;" and later, "The Truth shall set you Free". Christ offers the only True Freedom, all other "freedoms" being counterfeit.

[EclecticLibertariancaptain of 50]

I think coachmarc is on the right track.

As do I for the most part...

The Savior parabelized: "No man can serve two masters". A master can be anything you serve, as in both positive and negative connotations apply.

Having a master implies being a slave or subject. I prefer the concept of being a Friend or even a disciple.

As to Christ being "the Truth", what do you suppose that to mean? And how does that specifically pertain to the idea of Freedom? It's too easy to quote scripture without taking the trouble to understand what it means.

[coachmarcMy own worst enemy]

Eclectic, I have been the "self employed" type of person for the last 20 years. You say, "Something only becomes your master if you allow it to take over your life and allow it to be the determining factor in all, or at least the majority, of your decisions." And that is true. I let my job take over my life. Some people live to work, some work to live. Some work so hard so that they can be financially free. But it is too easy to get caught up in that freedom that you forget what's important along the way. You are right, though. It only happens when we allow it. Ultimately, however, if Christ isn't our master, He is not our priority. And our actions reflect that. Take this forum for example. People are so caught up with liberty and the Constitution, they may not be seeing the forest for the trees. Is it possible some are so caught up with politics and current events that we focus more on them than the author of our liberty? Obviously this forum is about liberty, yes. We are also LDS. That means something. To me anyway. My posts, you will find, typically reflect who I am. Or was.

[EclecticLibertariancaptain of 50]

...Ultimately, however, if Christ isn't our master, He is not our priority. And our actions reflect that. Take this forum for example. People are so caught up with liberty and the Constitution, they may not be seeing the forest for the trees.

Yes, this forum is but one example of many that could be used. The same could be true for any number of other pursuits taken too an extreme including spouse, children, family, church callings, temple work, stake missionary work, etc. Our modern life requires a balance that can only be maintained through developing s strong core or center based on correct principles supporting our values and ideals.

Is it possible some are so caught up with politics and current events that we focus more on them than the author of our liberty?

Of course it's possible. For some it may even be likely. Nevertheless, it is not for us to judge who is the better Christian or the better Latter-Day Saint. Rather, it is for us to determine for ourselves about ourselves...

[jonesdecaptain of 1,000]

coachmarc, is work the main thing you had in mind that becomes a master when you intend it to make you more free?

For some of us I suppose work will literally make is more free, ie for those of us who are in bondage and must buy back our freedom.

For most people they might think that having more than they need so that they don't have to work so much makes them more free, but it really just makes them more dependent on other people. Wealth is just a way to get other people to do things for you so you don't have to, including shelter, food, clothing, education, entertainment, etc. If someone is pursuing that to make them more "free" I'd argue that they are not pursuing freedom at all, but rather a corruption of freedom.

[EclecticLibertariancaptain of 50]

For most people they might think that having more than they need so that they don't have to work so much makes them more free, but it really just makes them more dependent on other people.

If you don't have more than you need, when will you ever have anything to share with those who have less than you? Or are you suggesting that there is something noble in never having enough? That kind of mentality will surely keep you in a state of bondage and poverty. I hope that's not the kind of mentality you have.

Wealth is just a way to get other people to do things for you so you don't have to, including shelter, food, clothing, education, entertainment, etc.

Really? So wealth isn't a way to provide a source of income for others resulting in a higher standard of living? Wealth isn't a way of providing a better education and better opportunities for yourself, your family, and your loved ones?

If someone is pursuing that to make them more "free" I'd argue that they are not pursuing freedom at all, but rather a corruption of freedom.

And I would argue that you appear to have a rather negative view towards those who aspire to do well and in the process assist others in doing well also. Seriously, consider your thinking. I mean this in the kindest way.

[coachmarcMy own worst enemy]

I apologize for sounding judgmental. This was not my intention and certainly not to create contention. I'm going to draw from my own life experience now. I am a very driven and passionate person. I spent years learning a trade and developing a know-how for business. I spent money wisely, though, avoided debt to start a small company and competed against many contractors in Utah to build a name for myself. Twenty years later, the housing bubble burst at the point where I was about to experience smooth sailing into retirement and the ability to help people at any time.

During these 20 years, I still went to church, attended the temple occasionally, read the BOM now and then, served in many callings, etc. But my priority was keeping my business going. After all it was my bread and butter. When the housing bubble burst in '08, I felt it. I lost almost everything including my own house. I was devastated. Ashamed. I felt like a failure. I felt that because I didn't have all my material possessions, all my toys that I worked hard to "earn" that I had failed. But I wasn't humble enough to understand that I had failed and was still failing at something far more important.

Along the way, I allowed myself to be distracted by so many vain and foolish things of the world. Nice truck, toys, fancy this and fancy that. I deserved it, right!? I paid my tithing, I went to church and did all that good stuff. Right? I don't think that way any more. You see, Christ wasn't my master. Sure I was obedient to a certain extent. But my heart wasn't always at church or in the temple or in the Book of Mormon. That's why we get bored when we try to read in it.

Matt 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

I see this verse in an entirely new light today:

No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Christ is telling us to LOVE one and HATE anything else that distracts us from LOVING that one master. He is
literally telling us to make a choice. This is why he said that our lips draw near to him, but our hearts our far away. This is why he will spew us out if we're lukewarm. This is why he gives different servants more or less talents according to his ability. And the slothful servants he condemns and gives the talents of the slothful servant to the servant who served most valiantly. They all had the same master, didn't they? Yet not all applied themselves equally.

In Jacob 5 we read about the allegory of the tame and wild olive trees. Without expounding on it, I will draw your attention to one verse:

41 And it came to pass that the Lord of the vineyard wept, and said unto the servant: What could I have done more for my vineyard?

There can be no doubt whatsoever that the Lord of the vineyard has given everything. We know that Christ has been laboring since the foundation of the world. We know that He lived a perfect mortal life and He did everything required of Him, making the ultimate sacrifice. What kind of meekness and humility did it require a God to descend below all mankind? What level of obedience to His Father did He show in drinking the bitter dregs? And when He died, he went straight into the spirit world to teach people there. When He resurrected, he visited his lost sheep around the world. Even today, there is no doubt in my mind that He is still laboring.

So what does this say that He expects of anyone who should consider himself worthy to enter into His kingdom?

D&C 4

2 Therefore, O ye that embark in the service of God, see that ye serve him with all your heart, might, mind and strength, that ye may stand blameless before God at the last day...

5 And faith, hope, charity and love, with an eye single to the glory of God, qualify him for the work.

6 Remember faith, virtue, knowledge, temperance, patience, brotherly kindness, godliness, charity, humility, diligence...

Does anyone know the story of the little currant bush? This is Elder Hugh B. Brown's story. Please read it:

You sometimes wonder whether the Lord really knows what he ought to do with you. You sometimes wonder if you know better than he does about what you ought to do and ought to become. I am wondering if I may tell you a story that I have told quite often in the Church. It is a story that is older than you are. It’s a piece out of my own life, and I’ve told it in many stakes and missions. It has to do with an incident in my life when God showed me that he knew best.

I was living up in Canada. I had purchased a farm. It was run-down. I went out one morning and saw a currant bush. It had grown up over six feet high. It was going all to wood. There were no blossoms and no currants. I was raised on a fruit farm in Salt Lake before we went to Canada, and I knew what ought to happen to that currant bush. So I got some pruning shears and went after it, and I cut it down, and pruned it, and clipped it back until there was nothing left but a little clump of stumps. It was just coming daylight, and I thought I saw on top of each of these little stumps what appeared to be a tear, and I thought the currant bush was crying. I was kind of simpleminded (and I haven’t entirely gotten over it), and I looked at it, and smiled, and said, “What are you crying about?” You know, I thought I heard that currant bush talk. And I thought I heard it say this: “How could you do this to me? I was making such wonderful growth. I was almost as big as the shade tree and the fruit tree that are inside the fence, and now you have cut me down. Every plant in the garden will look down on me, because I didn’t make what I should have made. How could you do this to me? I thought you were the gardener here.” That’s what I thought I heard the currant bush say, and I thought it so much that I answered. I said, “Look, little currant bush, I am the gardener here, and I know what I want you to be. I didn’t intend you to be a fruit tree or a shade tree. I want you to be a currant bush, and some day, little currant bush, when you are laden with fruit, you are going to say, ‘Thank you, Mr. Gardener, for loving me enough to cut me down, for caring enough about me to hurt me. Thank you, Mr. Gardener.’”

Time passed. Years passed, and I found myself in England. I was in command of a cavalry unit in the Canadian Army. I had made rather rapid progress as far as promotions are concerned, and I held the rank of field officer in the British Canadian Army. And I was proud of my position. And there was an opportunity for me to become a general. I had taken all the examinations. I had the seniority. There was just one man between me and that which for ten years I had hoped to get, the office of general in the British Army. I swelled up with pride. And this one man became a casualty, and I received a telegram from London. It said: “Be in my office tomorrow morning at 10:00,” signed by General Turner in charge of all Canadian forces. I called in my valet, my personal servant. I told him to polish my buttons, to brush my hat and my boots, and to make me look like a general because that is what I was going to be. He did the best he could with what he had to work on, and I went up to London. I walked smartly into the office of the General, and I saluted him smartly, and he gave me the same kind of a salute a senior officer usually gives—a sort of “Get out of the way, worm!” He said, “Sit down, Brown.” Then he said, “I’m sorry I cannot make the appointment. You are entitled to it. You have passed all the examinations. You have the seniority. You’ve been a good officer, but I can’t make the appointment. You are to return to Canada and become a training officer and a transport officer. Someone else will be made a general.” That for which I had been hoping and praying for ten years suddenly slipped out of my fingers.

Then he went into the other room to answer the telephone, and I took a soldier’s privilege of looking on his desk. I saw my personal history sheet. Right across the bottom of it in bold, block-type letters was written, “THIS MAN IS A MORMON.” We were not very well liked in those days. When I saw that, I knew why I had not been appointed. I already held the highest rank of any Mormon in the British Army. He came back and said, “That’s all, Brown.” I saluted him again, but not quite as smartly. I saluted out of duty and went out. I got on the train and started back to my town, 120 miles away, with a broken heart, with bitterness in my soul. And every click of the wheels on the rails seemed to say, “You are a failure. You will be called a coward when you get home. You raised all those Mormon boys to join the army, then you sneak off home.” I knew what I was going to get, and when I got to my tent, I was so bitter that I threw my cap and my saddle brown belt on the cot. I clinched my fists and I shook them at heaven. I said, “How could you do this to me, God? I have done everything I could do to measure up. There is nothing that I could have done—that I should have done—that I haven’t done. How could you do this to me?” I was as bitter as gall.

And then I heard a voice, and I recognized the tone of this voice. It was my own voice, and the voice said, “I am the gardener here. I know what I want you to do.” The bitterness went out of my soul, and I fell on my knees by the cot to ask forgiveness for my ungratefulness and my bitterness. While kneeling there I heard a song being sung in an adjoining tent. A number of Mormon boys met regularly every Tuesday night. I usually met with them. We would sit on the floor and have a Mutual Improvement Association. As I was kneeling there, praying for forgiveness, I heard their voices singing:

“It may not be on the mountain height
Or over the stormy sea;
It may not be at the battle’s front
My Lord will have need of me;
But if, by a still, small voice he calls
To paths that I do not know,
I’ll answer, dear Lord, with my hand in thine:
I’ll go where you want me to go.”
(Hymns, no. 75.)

I arose from my knees a humble man. And now, almost fifty years later, I look up to him and say, “Thank you, Mr. Gardener, for cutting me down, for loving me enough to hurt me.” I see now that it was wise that I should not become a general at that time, because if I had I would have been senior officer of all western Canada, with a lifelong, handsome salary, a place to live, and a pension when I’m no good any longer, but I would have raised my six daughters and two sons in army barracks. They would no doubt have married out of the Church, and I think I would not have amounted to anything. I haven’t amounted to very much as it is, but I have done better than I would have done if the Lord had let me go the way I wanted to go.

I wanted to tell you that oft-repeated story because there are many of you who are going to have some very difficult experiences: disappointment, heartbreak, bereavement, defeat. You are going to be tested and tried to prove what you are made of. I just want you to know that if you don’t get what you think you ought to get, remember, “God is the gardener here. He knows what he wants you to be.” Submit yourselves to his will. Be worthy of his blessings, and you will get his blessings.

I realize that for twenty years, I was working hard, I thought I was doing what I was supposed to be doing, but I was too proud to let the Lord lead me. Rather than consult with the Lord and let him mold me, I molded myself and allowed myself to get distracted by way too many different things. Today, I don't care that I lost my house. My very nice home that I build with my own two hands. Had I lived my life the Lord's way, with my eye single to his glory and not my own, my path might have been similar, but I know that He would have guided me so that I could keep what He wanted me to keep so that I could be a more effective instrument in His hands to help others the way He wants me to. Not the way I wanted to, when I wanted to and how I wanted to. I was not bent to His will then. Like the impoverished Zoramites who were cast out of their synagogues, compelled to be humble, I was compelled to be humble.

Only now do I realize, finally, the level of meekness and humility that is required to hear Christ knocking on my door, to hear what He's been trying to tell me for most of my adult life. And that is because He hasn't been been my master all that time. I had always acknowledged that He was my master, but my actions really didn't show it. My heart really didn't show it.

[coachmarcMy own worst enemy]

It's different now. My heart is open. It's in a different place. I am vulnerable. I am teachable. I am free in a different way that I never have been. And I am learning. His way. I know that He doesn't just want me when I'm available. Or when I'm in the mood. Or just a part of me as I see fit. He wants ALL of me. This is that mighty change of heart Alma is talking about in Alma 5. Not just a little change here and there. Where your heart is there will your treasure be also.

[jonesdecaptain of 1,000]

For most people they might think that having more than they need so that they don't have to work so much makes them more free, but it really just makes them more dependent on other people.

If you don't have more than you need, when will you ever have anything to share with those who have less than you? Or are you suggesting that there is something noble in never having enough? That kind of mentality will surely keep you in a state of bondage and poverty. I hope that's not the kind of mentality you have.

Wealth is just a way to get other people to do things for you so you don't have to, including shelter, food, clothing, education, entertainment, etc.

Really? So wealth isn't a way to provide a source of income for others resulting in a higher standard of living? Wealth isn't a way of providing a better education and better opportunities for yourself, your family, and your loved ones?

If someone is pursuing that to make them more "free" I'd argue that they are not pursuing freedom at all, but rather a corruption of freedom.

And I would argue that you appear to have a rather negative view towards those who aspire to do well and in the process assist others in doing well also. Seriously, consider your thinking. I mean this in the kindest way.

Sorry, I guess I wasn't clear enough. That's not what I meant at all. There is nothing wrong, and in fact something very right, with working hard to make things better for yourself and others, including putting away extra for unanticipated needs.

The problem with "freedom" through wealth is that what people really want to be "free" of is work. To be more specific, working really hard at the sacrifice of everything else just to become "free" of having to work isn't real freedom at all. Work in some form or other is an expression of freedom and adds meaning to life from beginning to end.

Freedom from work and freedom to work, develop, and build are very different things.

[EclecticLibertariancaptain of 50]

Sorry, I guess I wasn't clear enough. That's not what I meant at all. There is nothing wrong, and in fact something very right, with working hard to make things better for yourself and others, including putting away extra for unanticipated needs.

The problem with "freedom" through wealth is that what people really want to be "free" of is work. To be more specific, working really hard at the sacrifice of everything else just to become "free" of having to work isn't real freedom at all. Work in some form or other is an expression of freedom and adds meaning to life from beginning to end.

Freedom from work and freedom to work, develop, and build are very different things.

Execellent points all. Thank you for the clarification.

[JasonI am a nobody!]

It's different now. My heart is open. It's in a different place. I am vulnerable. I am teachable. I am free in a different way that I never have been. And I am learning. His way. I know that He doesn't just want me when I'm available. Or when I'm in the mood. Or just a part of me as I see fit. He wants ALL of me. This is that mighty change of heart Alma is talking about in Alma 5. Not just a little change here and there. Where your heart is there will your treasure be also.

Thank you for sharing your insights and education...very much appreciated reminder!!!

[jonesdecaptain of 1,000]

Sorry, I guess I wasn't clear enough. That's not what I meant at all. There is nothing wrong, and in fact something very right, with working hard to make things better for yourself and others, including putting away extra for unanticipated needs.

The problem with "freedom" through wealth is that what people really want to be "free" of is work. To be more specific, working really hard at the sacrifice of everything else just to become "free" of having to work isn't real freedom at all. Work in some form or other is an expression of freedom and adds meaning to life from beginning to end.

Freedom from work and freedom to work, develop, and build are very different things.

Execellent points all. Thank you for the clarification.

I was thinking about this a bit more, and there is another distinction that is possibly important.

Working hard to build wealth and not have to work as much later might not be the highest of virtues, but is it FAR better than other options for enabling people to live without work. To be more specific here are some ways people avoid honest, productive work (in order of most moral to least):

1. work hard now to build wealth of things others desire so that others will work to take care of you later
2. "vice" services that are marketable, and produced and consumed voluntarily, but are not productive: prostitution, gambling, base or degrading forms of entertainment, etc
3. receiving the spoils of violence or theft done by other people, defining "theft" as taking by threat or actual use of force: voluntarily being a dependent of or working for a criminal, warlord, or corrupt politician; receiving government welfare paid for by taxes or other non-voluntarily extractions of wealth; working in a government position, especially one that incites conflict or that people would not voluntarily pay for, or a position that people would voluntarily pay for, but is corrupted by government to involve force and threats
4. living by theft, actual use of force or threats of force to get things from people against their will
5. murder for profit, ie going being threatening or using non-injurious force and killing to take things

While none of these are completely moral and ideal, some are clear worse than others. You might be able to get into the Celestial kingdom doing #1, but I think the point coachmarc is making is that this is one of many dividing lines between Terrestrial and Celestial living.

My understanding of the difference between the Terrestrial and Telestial kingdoms are living honorably or not, ie dealing honestly and justly with others which mostly means voluntary interactions (not involve deception or force). Based on that definition 1, 2, and maybe 3 above are Terrestrial (I say maybe three because there might be mitigating circumstances), and 5, 4, and sometimes 3 are Telestial.


Some may disagree with these levels of priority, but I think there is scriptural basis for this. One prophetic quote that is a little more entertaining than inspirational is when a soldier said that his was the oldest and most honorable profession, and Brigham Young replied that "no, there is one older and more honorable" (referring to prostitution). Is prostitution really more honorable than forced redistribution of wealth? I would say yes. People like to say that we are taught that adultery is next to murder in sinfulness, but those are extremes of the categories of violence and sexual immorality. Perhaps in general at lesser scales the same applies, ie lesser violence is worse than lesser sexual immorality (and no, I don't agree with those who say all violence and all sexual sin are on the same level).

Consider the effects of forced redistribution of wealth and prostitution (and sexual immorality in general): both have a destructive effect on the soul, on one's confidence, and on families. This applies to both sides of people in both situations, ie to people stolen from and people given to in redistribution of wealth, and both those who solicit and offer sexual services.

We live in a culture that so forcefully attacks sexual immorality and other "sins" that sometimes we forget the severity and sinfulness of other ways that we immorally interact with others. This is especially true because our government universally preaches that violence is okay if done through the proper channels. Some in government speak against sexual immorality, but they are clearly not honest and moral people and often the most vocal against sexual immorality are the ones caught in the act... they are true hypocrites. Also, most of those who speak against sexual immorality in government are hugely in favor of violence. They may prefer to dedicate their violence to killing those in other countries who don't agree with them and won't comply, but it is still violence... and perhaps the worst form as #5 above where they kill and injure for their gain, ie in order to avoid productive work.

Maybe this deserves a thread of it's own, but I think the subject "irony of freedom" actually applies to corrupt uses of government very well, and that is one key aspect of these points.

Agree? Disagree? Different order of severity?

[EclecticLibertariancaptain of 50]

But my heart wasn't always at church or in the temple or in the Book of Mormon.

Church meetings, temple service, and scripture reading are all means to an end - becoming like Christ. One's heart or focus should not be on the means, but on the end.

Christ is telling us to LOVE one and HATE anything else that distracts us from LOVING that one master. He is
literally telling us to make a choice.

I don't think that's quite what He's saying, but almost. I think He's saying that it is impossible to be equally devoted to "masters" that are sometimes, if not frequently or always, at odds with each other. I don't think He's saying that we MUST or SHOULD hate anything that distracts us; but rather that we will hate or despise that which opposes our devotion to the other. If, on the other hand, we don't try to serve two masters, if we only try to serve one, there won't be any hating or despising at all, merely a bending and conforming of our actions and behaviors in accordance with the one master we choose to serve. We'll almost certainly still need to work to provide for ourselves and our loved ones, but our labors will be in accordance with rather than at odds with our master.

Had I lived my life the Lord's way, with my eye single to his glory and not my own, my path might have been similar...

Exactly. The path might have been similar, and you may have seen more, or possibly less material success. One can't know what didn't happen, and there's little point in lamenting and dwelling upon the past; that only wastes the present and erodes the future potential.

... I had always acknowledged that He was my master, but my actions really didn't show it. My heart really didn't show it.

I can certainly relate. Our actions speak far louder than words and reveal the truth or falsity of our professed (if only professed to ourselves) devotion.

[coachmarcMy own worst enemy]

But my heart wasn't always at church or in the temple or in the Book of Mormon.

Church meetings, temple service, and scripture reading are all means to an end - becoming like Christ. One's heart or focus should not be on the means, but on the end.

Christ is telling us to LOVE one and HATE anything else that distracts us from LOVING that one master. He is
literally telling us to make a choice.

I don't think that's quite what He's saying, but almost. I think He's saying that it is impossible to be equally devoted to "masters" that are sometimes, if not frequently or always, at odds with each other. I don't think He's saying that we MUST or SHOULD hate anything that distracts us; but rather that we will hate or despise that which opposes our devotion to the other.

For me the means is part of the end. For example, while I read the Book of Mormon, I do literally feast on the words, as we've been admonished. It literally brightens my heart. I can't explain it any other way. But this is now; today, whereas in the past, I just went through motions, because I would rather watch TV or was caught up in something else. The Book of Mormon was boring and dry. So I feel that it really didn't count. It's like the Savior says, the gift isn't counted to man who gives it grudgingly. And so I didn't feel the Spirit anywhere near like I feel it now, where my heart is immersed in it. That's the difference. For me.

As for the second quote, that about sums it up. I find that as I devote myself, my heart, completely to my studies, my service, my calling, nothing else is as sweet. For example, I took a break to watch an episode of Clone Wars on starwars.com (yes, as mentioned before elsewhere, I'm a sci fi nerd), while it was mildly entertaining, it just didn't do anything for me. I have a DVD collection of all kinds of cool shows like Lord of the Rings, all of the Star Wars movies, Iron Man, etc. And as entertaining as they are, they just seem hollow now. And I feel the same way about watching anything on Netflix. I was enjoying a series called "The Guardian," which I enjoyed, but now, it's just "eh." And so I find myself drawn back to my studies of the Book of Mormon and church history, doctrine, etc.

I don't "hate" any of those programs, and there are far more things to hate, especially anything that detracts me from where I am at now. Therefore, I choose to give all my devotion to coming closer to Christ and anything at all that distracts me from this, I simply don't care for. So yes, that is ALMOST the same thing. But I will choose to hate anything from here on out that would pull me from this single-minded goal because I have been distracted easily in the past by simple things. And this is how Satan works. He will draw us away with a single flaxen cord by the neck. And this was discussed in another thread:

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=21640

So you hit the nail right on the head, Eclectic!

[alexoyarzuncaptain of 10]

thanks coachmarc for sharing... you were sort of born again... hope you always keep on the path, which never ends... the best brother

[coachmarcMy own worst enemy]

Thank you, alexoyarzun and thank you, Jason. I only wish I had been compelled to be humble twenty years ago. We all have our path to walk and only we make it as simple or difficult as it is.