Study Group in Lehi

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Rose Garden
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Study Group in Lehi

Post by Rose Garden »

I've long wanted to start a study group in my home, but since I live in near constant disaster, I never thought I could. Just occurred to me that I could hold one outside during the summer months, so that's what I'm going to do. Come on over to my house on Wednesdays at 7:00 PM if you want to discuss the Book of Mormon. I live at 2085 N 900 W in Lehi, just off the 2100 N exit in Lehi. Bring a lawn chair or blanket to sit on, your scriptures, your kids, and a snack if you want.

Oh, and if you want to use the bathroom, you have to sign a nondisclosure agreement stating that you will never disclose the condition of my house. :p

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M249Gunner
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by M249Gunner »

Is it the house with the nice brown metal fence and the volleyball net in back? You have a nice yard. Unfortunately, I live too far away to attend. Sounds like fun though-especially if you follow up with a nice volleyballgame :-) .

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Rose Garden
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by Rose Garden »

Nope, the net is gone. It's just a brown (in other words rusted) metal fence now.

Too bad you can't come.

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BroJones
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by BroJones »

Called to Serve wrote:I've long wanted to start a study group in my home, but since I live in near constant disaster, I never thought I could. Just occurred to me that I could hold one outside during the summer months, so that's what I'm going to do. Come on over to my house on Wednesdays at 7:00 PM if you want to discuss the Book of Mormon. I live at 2085 N 900 W in Lehi, just off the 2100 N exit in Lehi. Bring a lawn chair or blanket to sit on, your scriptures, your kids, and a snack if you want.

Oh, and if you want to use the bathroom, you have to sign a nondisclosure agreement stating that you will never disclose the condition of my house. :p
A wonderful invitation, CTS -- thank you for this. Would love to come, but we live now in Missouri having departed the Wasatch front zone... ;)
Wishing you the best -- the Book of Mormon is a wonderful focus!

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TZONE
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by TZONE »

Publishing this on-line. Expect some crazies :) lol jk. Maybe.

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Rose Garden
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by Rose Garden »

Too bad you can't come, Dr. Jones. But Missouri is a bit far.

TZONE, if no crazies come, I'll still be there. ;)

deep water
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by deep water »

CTS:I wish I could attend, but I live in another state. However, I have had some experience being in a study group. And I will share the good things, and the things to avoid, if possible. My experience was from the year 1990 to around 1995. At first, we got together to study Isaiah. We tried to study like the Jews do and take each verse and gain as much incite as we could. That only lasted for a couple of months. Then we went to reading, and would just stop for comments. That lasted for about the rest of the first year. Then their were those who were not stimulated enough and started to search out other people, and their ideas. At first it was just one person every 4 or 5 months, then after a while It seemed that we had a different teacher every month or so. WE had fallen from searching the scriptures, to studying what the last person that gave us a presentation had to offer. They all came telling us that they knew the whole truth. After several years, everyone had their own version of the truth. I was the only one that stayed with the scriptures. It breaks my heart to see the people who I learned to love, believe some of the things they now believe. One person who I would set on the edge of my seat to here his testimony on fast Sunday, now believes that the God of the old testament is the devil, and the devil is really God. HE don't believe that we are going to have rough times ahead, and the only way we can remain friends, is to never bring up religion. Or what ever you call his belief.
As I look back, we were all misfits. We all became family. And just like a family that grows up and goes their own way, so did we. I miss those early days and the relationships that were made. I am as sure that not only did we have the lords presence at first, but that we were overtaken by the dark side in the end. So my advice is to set rules, that the BoM is the course of study. Try to keep outside material to a minimum. We didn't have any husband, wife problems, but you grow close, it becomes your life, so watch that also. good luck PS: The brethren frown upon study groups.

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Rose Garden
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by Rose Garden »

deep water wrote:CTS:I wish I could attend, but I live in another state. However, I have had some experience being in a study group. And I will share the good things, and the things to avoid, if possible. My experience was from the year 1990 to around 1995. At first, we got together to study Isaiah. We tried to study like the Jews do and take each verse and gain as much incite as we could. That only lasted for a couple of months. Then we went to reading, and would just stop for comments. That lasted for about the rest of the first year. Then their were those who were not stimulated enough and started to search out other people, and their ideas. At first it was just one person every 4 or 5 months, then after a while It seemed that we had a different teacher every month or so. WE had fallen from searching the scriptures, to studying what the last person that gave us a presentation had to offer. They all came telling us that they knew the whole truth. After several years, everyone had their own version of the truth. I was the only one that stayed with the scriptures. It breaks my heart to see the people who I learned to love, believe some of the things they now believe. One person who I would set on the edge of my seat to here his testimony on fast Sunday, now believes that the God of the old testament is the devil, and the devil is really God. HE don't believe that we are going to have rough times ahead, and the only way we can remain friends, is to never bring up religion. Or what ever you call his belief.
As I look back, we were all misfits. We all became family. And just like a family that grows up and goes their own way, so did we. I miss those early days and the relationships that were made. I am as sure that not only did we have the lords presence at first, but that we were overtaken by the dark side in the end. So my advice is to set rules, that the BoM is the course of study. Try to keep outside material to a minimum. We didn't have any husband, wife problems, but you grow close, it becomes your life, so watch that also. good luck PS: The brethren frown upon study groups.
Thanks for the tips. I totally forgot tonight since I had something else to go to. Hope no one showed up while I was gone. :)

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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by natasha »

Deepwater: You are correct. We have been cautioned against study groups....and I believe there is reason for that. Those of you who are wanting to be involved with such might want to heed the caution.

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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by keep the faith »

natasha wrote:Deepwater: You are correct. We have been cautioned against study groups....and I believe there is reason for that. Those of you who are wanting to be involved with such might want to heed the caution.

Just look into the beginnings of the True and Living church out of Sanpete County in Utah and that alone should provide ample caution to those who get together in these study groups. Satan is a master at turning seemingly good pursuits into a varitable mecca for false spirits to bring souls down. The true and living bunch started up by studying wonderful topics like calling and election etc yet ended up trashing the modern church and apostatizing from it after pursuing a variety of deceptive and immoral practices with each other. Buyer beware.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/True_and_L ... _Last_Days" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Study Group in Lehi

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...
Last edited by SempiternalHarbinger on June 16th, 2014, 9:25 pm, edited 2 times in total.

keep the faith
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by keep the faith »

SempiternalHarbinger wrote:
natasha wrote:Deepwater: You are correct. We have been cautioned against study groups....and I believe there is reason for that. Those of you who are wanting to be involved with such might want to heed the caution.
Please tell me your kidding? Cautioned against study groups? Heaven forbid if do any studying that doesn't that have the church stamp of a approval? Unbelievable. Instead, do whatever it takes ( loans,debt) to get a great Babylonian education. Preferably at a church owned school.

One of the main purposes of having presiding officers of the Priesthood in attendence at church meetings is to protect the flock from grevious wolves entering in declaring false doctrine that could scatter the flock. Some study groups can be totally harmless but as history has shown others like those implemented by the true and living folks got out of control in a hurry and ended up breaking apart families and leading people away from the safety of the church. Just ask people who lost family members to this group and others who have become outshoots from the church if they see any harm in these study groups. They will tell you the harm in them in a NY minute.

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TZONE
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

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Yet Joseph Smith held constant study groups. School of the Prophets is one example. Where there is good there is the opposite. If so much evil comes from one thing like that its only because its based off a really good principle. Look how many people fall away from missions or come home FAR worse than they left. Should they avoid that too? No. Its because its a testing ground to prove if you can keep your faith during hard times or not. Thats the real test on anything.

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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by EmmaLee »

From - http://www.latterdayconservative.com/blog/study-groups/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
BrianM wrote:Recently it was proposed on my discussion forum that we start up a study group for those interested in meeting together to discuss Liberty, the Gospel and related topics. I was somewhat surprised when someone inquired whether the Church (LDS) discourages study groups?

While we certainly don’t need to be commanded in all things, and there doesn’t seem to be anything inherently wrong with a study group, I have found some interesting related counsel from the Church pertaining to this question. Hopefully this will clear up any confusion.

From the LDS First Presidency in 2001 (excerpts):

The First Presidency directed that the following letter be read in sacrament meeting… We repeat the counsel set forth in the Church Handbook of Instruction, page 157: “Church members should not participate in groups that… Challenge religious and moral values… Imitate sacred rites or ceremonies… Meet late into the evening or in the early-morning hours… We strongly counsel against affiliation with any such group…”

Another statement which is more specific to study groups, and especially regarding groups such as this one, was given by the First Presidency when David O. McKay was President of the Church:

“In order that there may be no misunderstandings by bishops, stake presidents, and others regarding members of the Church participating in non-church meetings to study and become informed on the Constitution of the United States, Communism, etc., I wish to make the following statements that I have been sending out from my office for some time and that have come under question by some stake authorities, bishoprics, and others.

“Church members are at perfect liberty to act according to their own consciences in the matter of safeguarding our way of life. They are, of course, encouraged to honor the highest standards of the gospel and to work to preserve their own freedoms. They are free to participate in non-church meetings that are held to warn people of the threat of Communism or any other theory or principle that will deprive us of our free agency or individual liberties vouchsafed by the Constitution of the United States.

“The Church, out of respect for the rights of all its members to have their political views and loyalties, must maintain the strictest possible neutrality. We have no intention of trying to interfere with the fullest and freest exercise of the political franchise of our members under and within our Constitution, which the Lord declared he established “by the hands of wise men whom [he] raised up unto this very purpose” (D&C 101:80) and which, as to the principles thereof, the Prophet Joseph Smith, dedicating the Kirtland Temple, prayed should be “established forever.” (D&C 109:54.) The Church does not yield any of its devotion to or convictions about safeguarding the American principles and the establishments of government under federal and state constitutions and the civil rights of men safeguarded by these.

“. . . We therefore commend and encourage every person and every group who is sincerely seeking to study Constitutional principles and awaken a sleeping and apathetic people to the alarming conditions that are rapidly advancing about us.” (”Statement Concerning the Position of the Church on Communism” 477)

The Lord through his prophets has encouraged us to become educated and informed, whether individually or with a group. There is no problem in forming a study group, any problems would be the result of the group, or members of the group, straying from Gospel principles.

keep the faith
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by keep the faith »

TZONE wrote:Yet Joseph Smith held constant study groups. School of the Prophets is one example. Where there is good there is the opposite. If so much evil comes from one thing like that its only because its based off a really good principle. Look how many people fall away from missions or come home FAR worse than they left. Should they avoid that too? No. Its because its a testing ground to prove if you can keep your faith during hard times or not. Thats the real test on anything.

I think the School of the Prophets had proper Priesthood leadership present to correct errors in doctrine if they came up.. All I am saying is that the Brethren have cautioned against holding study groups because they have seen some of the fruits of these groups and they were very destructive to unsuspecting members. It is a caution they gave at a time when many were falling for false and misleading doctrine being spouted by wolves in sheeps clothing. James Harmston and those who hooked up with him were just such wolves that the church warned against in the example I cited above. I don't need to go touch fire to know it will burn me. Warnings are given to protect us from harm and danger. The Brethren of the church want to protect the flock from just such wolves. They do so out of love and concern for our souls. As The Lord tells us concerning Satan he is actively trying to lead us away into filthy waters so he gives us a pattern to follow in section 52. This is a very important pattern to observe when faced with choices of truth vs deception. Verse 16 should be particularly evident to those who have experienced wolves in sheeps clothing. Yet compare that with the words and actions of someone like Pres. Monson or Pres. Eyring or Pres. Uchtdorf or others in the quorum of the 12. Stark contrasts will be evident.



14 And again, I will give unto you a pattern in all things, that ye may not be deceived; for Satan is abroad in the land, and he goeth forth deceiving the nations—

15 Wherefore he that prayeth, whose spirit is contrite, the same is accepted of me if he obey mine ordinances.

16 He that speaketh, whose spirit is contrite, whose language is meek and edifieth, the same is of God if he obey mine ordinances.

17 And again, he that trembleth under my power shall be made strong, and shall bring forth fruits of praise and wisdom, according to the revelations and truths which I have given you.

18 And again, he that is overcome and bringeth not forth fruits, even according to this pattern, is not of me.

19 Wherefore, by this pattern ye shall know the spirits in all cases under the whole heavens.

keep the faith
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by keep the faith »

Stella Solaris wrote:From - http://www.latterdayconservative.com/blog/study-groups/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
BrianM wrote:Recently it was proposed on my discussion forum that we start up a study group for those interested in meeting together to discuss Liberty, the Gospel and related topics. I was somewhat surprised when someone inquired whether the Church (LDS) discourages study groups?

While we certainly don’t need to be commanded in all things, and there doesn’t seem to be anything inherently wrong with a study group, I have found some interesting related counsel from the Church pertaining to this question. Hopefully this will clear up any confusion.

From the LDS First Presidency in 2001 (excerpts):

The First Presidency directed that the following letter be read in sacrament meeting… We repeat the counsel set forth in the Church Handbook of Instruction, page 157: “Church members should not participate in groups that… Challenge religious and moral values… Imitate sacred rites or ceremonies… Meet late into the evening or in the early-morning hours… We strongly counsel against affiliation with any such group…”

Another statement which is more specific to study groups, and especially regarding groups such as this one, was given by the First Presidency when David O. McKay was President of the Church:

“In order that there may be no misunderstandings by bishops, stake presidents, and others regarding members of the Church participating in non-church meetings to study and become informed on the Constitution of the United States, Communism, etc., I wish to make the following statements that I have been sending out from my office for some time and that have come under question by some stake authorities, bishoprics, and others.

“Church members are at perfect liberty to act according to their own consciences in the matter of safeguarding our way of life. They are, of course, encouraged to honor the highest standards of the gospel and to work to preserve their own freedoms. They are free to participate in non-church meetings that are held to warn people of the threat of Communism or any other theory or principle that will deprive us of our free agency or individual liberties vouchsafed by the Constitution of the United States.

“The Church, out of respect for the rights of all its members to have their political views and loyalties, must maintain the strictest possible neutrality. We have no intention of trying to interfere with the fullest and freest exercise of the political franchise of our members under and within our Constitution, which the Lord declared he established “by the hands of wise men whom [he] raised up unto this very purpose” (D&C 101:80) and which, as to the principles thereof, the Prophet Joseph Smith, dedicating the Kirtland Temple, prayed should be “established forever.” (D&C 109:54.) The Church does not yield any of its devotion to or convictions about safeguarding the American principles and the establishments of government under federal and state constitutions and the civil rights of men safeguarded by these.

“. . . We therefore commend and encourage every person and every group who is sincerely seeking to study Constitutional principles and awaken a sleeping and apathetic people to the alarming conditions that are rapidly advancing about us.” (”Statement Concerning the Position of the Church on Communism” 477)

The Lord through his prophets has encouraged us to become educated and informed, whether individually or with a group. There is no problem in forming a study group, any problems would be the result of the group, or members of the group, straying from Gospel principles.

Thank you Stella. I am specifically referring in my post to the warning given by the first Presidency stated above in their 2001 letter to all the Saints. I am not talking about studying the constitution together or the like as encouraged by Pres. McKay. The true and living Manti group is a good example of the dangers involved as they began forming study groups by studying sacred church doctrines together which then evolved into performing non sanctioned sacred temple rituals outside of the temple and teaching as doctrines things not sanctioned by the church and its Prophets like multiple mortal probations etc etc. Soon spiritual marriages were being performed under shade trees and... well you know the rest. There are wolves in sheeps clothing among the Saints who want to lead people away from the safety of the church and the umbrella of Priesthood leadership and proper keys.

deep water
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by deep water »

I gave CTS my warning on study groups. I don't think anyone will find safety in a organisation that is under condemnation either. The origination of the Church has been In existence for 175 years+, how many members have we had like unto the brother of Jared. I don't think many members even think what the brother Jared did is even possible, or even think to try to follow his example.The only way to find safety, is in the lord and the pure word of God. Test everything by the scriptures. To do this you have to first, know the scriptures. The Gospel is line upon line, you cannot hurry the hand of the lord. Their are no shortcuts. Study groups, Churches, gatherings, can add to the path, but beware, they all can become a stumbling block also. Happy day, all is well in Zion!!!!

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Rose Garden
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by Rose Garden »

Oiy!

Perhaps I ought to get permission from my church leaders before I hold a party, too. I mean, I do have a tendency to turn the subject to the gospel whenever possible. That's dangerous, though, you know. I already need to check with them about the type of soda pop I am going to consume. Wouldn't want anything bad to happen.

Are study groups dangerous? Yeah, sure. So's crossing the street. And while we're on the subject, so is being born. I didn't come to this life to be coddled through mortality until I can be safely returned to Heavenly Father. That sounds just a little too much like Satan's plan to make me comfortable.

Seems to me that the Lord sent me here to mess up. To get scraped knees and catch colds. Seems to me He sent me here to experience opposition so I could know the good from the bad. If there's a different agenda, then someone forgot to inform me that the program had changed.

All those who aren't scared to climb a mountain or two, feel free to drop by Wednesday nights. All the rest of you who would prefer to have the brethren tuck you in at night, feel free to sleep on.

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Jake
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by Jake »

keep the faith wrote:I think the School of the Prophets had proper Priesthood leadership present to correct errors in doctrine if they came up.. All I am saying is that the Brethren have cautioned against holding study groups because they have seen some of the fruits of these groups and they were very destructive to unsuspecting members.
This statement appears to be rooted with the following assumptions: 1) Only proper priesthood leadership can correct doctrinal errors and 2) Because someone has proper priesthood authority, as they suppose, they are able to correct doctrinal errors. Stated another way, if we are not priesthood leaders, we cannot know all correct doctrine nor can we correct incorrect doctrines.

I can think of many priesthood leaders at local and worldwide levels who have taught false doctrine, starting with Brigham Young. One is not protected from errors in understanding because of calling. Further, one is not prevented from knowing truth because of a lack of calling. Just ask Joseph Smith. We are saved as fast we gain knowledge, not as fast as we are spoon-fed from our priesthood leaders.

Members of the church are perfectly capable of obtaining the Holy Ghost, which testifies of truth. If followed, such a person who has obtained the Holy Ghost cannot be deceived. Shall we refrain from studying the gospel together because we might be deceived? That is the same argument that antis make for why someone should not pray to ask if the Book of Mormon is true. We should not be afraid of study or truth.

deep water
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by deep water »

I know that I suggested to limit the amount of outside information that was brought in. However I just read a class study guide of Hugh Nibleys here on freedom forum, and would have to say that it is very good in summing up what the authors of the book were trying to get across. There is only one sentence that I disagree with in the whole paper. The name of the study : How to survive the calamities of the last days. I would sagest that it is worth a read.

natasha
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by natasha »

Called to Serve wrote:Oiy!

Perhaps I ought to get permission from my church leaders before I hold a party, too. I mean, I do have a tendency to turn the subject to the gospel whenever possible. That's dangerous, though, you know. I already need to check with them about the type of soda pop I am going to consume. Wouldn't want anything bad to happen.

Are study groups dangerous? Yeah, sure. So's crossing the street. And while we're on the subject, so is being born. I didn't come to this life to be coddled through mortality until I can be safely returned to Heavenly Father. That sounds just a little too much like Satan's plan to make me comfortable.

Seems to me that the Lord sent me here to mess up. To get scraped knees and catch colds. Seems to me He sent me here to experience opposition so I could know the good from the bad. If there's a different agenda, then someone forgot to inform me that the program had changed.

All those who aren't scared to climb a mountain or two, feel free to drop by Wednesday nights. All the rest of you who would prefer to have the brethren tuck you in at night, feel free to sleep on.

Called to Serve: I think your strong sarcasm is unnecessary. No one expects you to do any of the above....but rather, be aware that sometimes things can get out of control....hence the loving "warnings" we receive from time to time. Therefore, go ahead with your study group....but just heed the warnings and counsel that have been given to us and work within that framework.

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Rose Garden
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by Rose Garden »

You did catch that it was sarcastic, but I think you missed the overall point. There is something seriously messed up when "leaders" are warning you against activities which encourage you to think.

Loving "warnings" indeed. They should be warning us not to take their word for anything instead.

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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by Lizzy60 »

I was in a Stake RS Presidency some years ago when the Enrichment program was introduced. The Stake RS President was developing a list of ideas for Enrichment groups to recommend to the ward leaders. She counseled with "SL" on appropriate groups, and was told that study groups, including scripture study groups were prohibited. It was further stated that all gospel study and scripture study was to be within the confines of Sunday RS classes, and from the correlated manuals only. She was very adamant in her counsel to our ward RS leaders because the General RS Board in SL had very adamant in their instructions to her. She was fine with it, but I was bothered, to say the least.
Yeah, we ended up with Ladies Who Lunch, Playgroup at the Park, Scrapbooking, etc.

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Jake
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by Jake »

Lizzy60 wrote:I was in a Stake RS Presidency some years ago when the Enrichment program was introduced. The Stake RS President was developing a list of ideas for Enrichment groups to recommend to the ward leaders. She counseled with "SL" on appropriate groups, and was told that study groups, including scripture study groups were prohibited. It was further stated that all gospel study and scripture study was to be within the confines of Sunday RS classes, and from the correlated manuals only. She was very adamant in her counsel to our ward RS leaders because the General RS Board in SL had very adamant in their instructions to her. She was fine with it, but I was bothered, to say the least.
Yeah, we ended up with Ladies Who Lunch, Playgroup at the Park, Scrapbooking, etc.
Wow. The thinking certainly has been done. Thank goodness. I would hate to have to think for myself. Good thing someone is there to make sure I keep all the commandments, so none shall be lost. That reminds me of a book I read once...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thought_Police" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

natasha
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Re: Study Group in Lehi

Post by natasha »

Called to Serve wrote:You did catch that it was sarcastic, but I think you missed the overall point. There is something seriously messed up when "leaders" are warning you against activities which encourage you to think.

Loving "warnings" indeed. They should be warning us not to take their word for anything instead.
Called to Serve: I think the scriptures are full of "warnings" and suggestions. I'm sorry that this talk has irritated you in some way. I think it's fine to give and receive counsel and use it when it applies to you in various life situations. I don't recall our leaders EVER saying we shouldn't think.

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