Elder Cook calls out preppers?

[Dubs]

looking beyond the mark with "expensive preparation for end of days scenarios."

Starts around 11:50

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/ ... 4?lang=eng" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Onsdag]

Yes, I believe so. It probably wasn't the call-out they were expecting and hoping for though. ;)

[David13]

I think he called out the extremists. Isn't that what he said? Extreme preparation?
There is no question that some people do go too far with it.
dc

[Onsdag]

I think he called out the extremists. Isn't that what he said? Extreme preparation?
There is no question that some people do go too far with it.
dc

What he said was:

Looking beyond the mark is a stumbling block. ... While there are many examples of looking beyond the mark, a significant one in our day is extremism. Gospel extremism is when one elevates any gospel principle above other equally important principles and takes a position that is beyond or contrary to the teachings of Church leaders. One example is when one advocates for additions, changes, or primary emphasis to one part of the Word of Wisdom. Another is expensive preparation for end of days scenarios. In both examples others are encouraged to accept private interpretations. If we turn a health law or any other principle into a form of religious fanaticism we are looking beyond the mark. Speaking of important doctrine the Lord has declared "Whosoever declareth more or less than this the same is not of me." When we elevate any principle in a way that lessens our commitment to other equally important principles, or take a position contrary to, or which exceed teachings of Church leaders, we are looking beyond the mark. In addition, some members elevate causes - many of which are good - to a status superior to basic gospel doctrine. They substitute their devotion to the cause as their first commitment and relegate their commitment to the Savior and His teachings to a secondary position. If we elevate anything above our devotion to the Savior, if our conduct recognizes Him as just another teacher and not the divine Son of God, then we are looking beyond the mark. Jesus Christ is the mark.

The portions that I highlighted, in my estimation, speak out against certain groups and movements we have seen in recent days. Certain movers and shakers within the prepper movement, for example, have been elevating certain gospel principles (the need to prepare temporally) "above other equally important principles and takes a position that is beyond... the teachings of Church leaders" (i.e. the call-out). Furthermore, they have strongly advocated and encouraged others (by writing books, publicly speaking out over radio and internet, going on tour, etc.) "to accept private interpretations" of scripture and prophecy "which exceed teachings of Church leaders." The call-out crowd aren't the only ones either. Just this year we have seen certain movers and shakers in the Constitutional movement doing these same things - getting involved in gospel extremism and looking beyond the mark. As Elder Cook taught, these "members elevate causes - many of which are good - to a status superior to basic gospel doctrine." I'm glad an Apostle did call these groups and practices out. It needed to be said and they should be reigned in. :ymapplause:

[Libertybelle2012]

I think he called out the extremists. Isn't that what he said? Extreme preparation?
There is no question that some people do go too far with it.
dc

What he said was:

Looking beyond the mark is a stumbling block. ... While there are many examples of looking beyond the mark, a significant one in our day is extremism. Gospel extremism is when one elevates any gospel principle above other equally important principles and takes a position that is beyond or contrary to the teachings of Church leaders. One example is when one advocates for additions, changes, or primary emphasis to one part of the Word of Wisdom. Another is expensive preparation for end of days scenarios. In both examples others are encouraged to accept private interpretations. If we turn a health law or any other principle into a form of religious fanaticism we are looking beyond the mark. Speaking of important doctrine the nLord has declared "Whosoever declareth more or less than this the same is not of me." When we elevate any principle in a way that lessens our commitment to other equally important principles, or take a position contrary to, or which exceed teachings of Church leaders, we are looking beyond the mark. In addition, some members elevate causes - many of which are good - to a status superior to basic gospel doctrine. They substitute their devotion to the cause as their first commitment and relegate their commitment to the Savior and His teachings to a secondary position. If we elevate anything above our devotion to the Savior, if our conduct recognizes Him as just another teacher and not the divine Son of God, then we are looking beyond the mark. Jesus Christ is the mark.

The portions that I highlighted, in my estimation, speak out against certain groups and movements we have seen in recent days. Certain movers and shakers within the prepper movement, for example, have been elevating certain gospel principles (the need to prepare temporally) "above other equally important principles and takes a position that is beyond... the teachings of Church leaders" (i.e. the call-out). Furthermore, they have strongly advocated and encouraged others (by writing books, publicly speaking out over radio and internet, going on tour, etc.) "to accept private interpretations" of scripture and prophecy "which exceed teachings of Church leaders." The call-out crowd aren't the only ones either. Just this year we have seen certain movers and shakers in the Constitutional movement doing these same things - getting involved in gospel extremism and looking beyond the mark. As Elder Cook taught, these "members elevate causes - many of which are good - to a status superior to basic gospel doctrine." I'm glad an Apostle did call these groups and practices out. It needed to be said and they should be reigned in. :ymapplause:

Wow, I always think it's funny when some people who are not in to something always point fingers at others as being extremists

There are so many examples of what would be termed today as extremists, in the scriptures. This whole idea that we have balance in all things is such a lie. We all have something that we feel more driven to do. That is the lord using each of our gifts and talents.

A prophet of God told people to be prepared

A prophet of God warned people about the loss of Liberty.

I think I will take their example and counsel

[davedan]

There will come a day when gathering with the Stake will be critical to survival.

If an individual has focused too much on prepping, they may feel they don't need the Stake but rely on their own preps alone.

[Libertybelle2012]

There will come a day when gathering with the Stake will be critical to survival.

If an individual has focused too much on prepping, they may feel they don't need the Stake but rely on their own preps alone.

I have no clue where you guys come up with this stuff. So, if members are preparing every needful thing they could not possibly be looking to the savior "looking beyond the mark" or
Be willing to be part of their stake during a catastrophe (LOL who in the heck do you think the stake is going to be looking to.... brother Joe shmo who might have a three month supply or brother mark prepper who has. Even oreosring and training?

This kind of stuff is not scriptural. The use of the scrioture being taken out of context to describe and Shame prepper or those who stand for Liberty is appealing.

[Onsdag]

I think he called out the extremists. Isn't that what he said? Extreme preparation?
There is no question that some people do go too far with it.
dc

What he said was:

Looking beyond the mark is a stumbling block. ... While there are many examples of looking beyond the mark, a significant one in our day is extremism. Gospel extremism is when one elevates any gospel principle above other equally important principles and takes a position that is beyond or contrary to the teachings of Church leaders. One example is when one advocates for additions, changes, or primary emphasis to one part of the Word of Wisdom. Another is expensive preparation for end of days scenarios. In both examples others are encouraged to accept private interpretations. If we turn a health law or any other principle into a form of religious fanaticism we are looking beyond the mark. Speaking of important doctrine the nLord has declared "Whosoever declareth more or less than this the same is not of me." When we elevate any principle in a way that lessens our commitment to other equally important principles, or take a position contrary to, or which exceed teachings of Church leaders, we are looking beyond the mark. In addition, some members elevate causes - many of which are good - to a status superior to basic gospel doctrine. They substitute their devotion to the cause as their first commitment and relegate their commitment to the Savior and His teachings to a secondary position. If we elevate anything above our devotion to the Savior, if our conduct recognizes Him as just another teacher and not the divine Son of God, then we are looking beyond the mark. Jesus Christ is the mark.

The portions that I highlighted, in my estimation, speak out against certain groups and movements we have seen in recent days. Certain movers and shakers within the prepper movement, for example, have been elevating certain gospel principles (the need to prepare temporally) "above other equally important principles and takes a position that is beyond... the teachings of Church leaders" (i.e. the call-out). Furthermore, they have strongly advocated and encouraged others (by writing books, publicly speaking out over radio and internet, going on tour, etc.) "to accept private interpretations" of scripture and prophecy "which exceed teachings of Church leaders." The call-out crowd aren't the only ones either. Just this year we have seen certain movers and shakers in the Constitutional movement doing these same things - getting involved in gospel extremism and looking beyond the mark. As Elder Cook taught, these "members elevate causes - many of which are good - to a status superior to basic gospel doctrine." I'm glad an Apostle did call these groups and practices out. It needed to be said and they should be reigned in. :ymapplause:

Wow, I always think it's funny when some people who are not in to something always point fingers at others as being extremists

There are so many examples of what would be termed today as extremists, in the scriptures. This whole idea that we have balance in all things is such a lie. We all have something that we feel more driven to do. That is the lord using each of our gifts and talents.

A prophet of God told people to be prepared

A prophet of God warned people about the loss of Liberty.

I think I will take their example and counsel

...

I have no clue where you guys come up with this stuff. So, if members are preparing every needful thing they could not possibly be looking to the savior "looking beyond the mark" or
Be willing to be part of their stake during a catastrophe (LOL who in the heck do you think the stake is going to be looking to.... brother Joe shmo who might have a three month supply or brother mark prepper who has. Even oreosring and training?

This kind of stuff is not scriptural. The use of the scrioture being taken out of context to describe and Shame prepper or those who stand for Liberty is appealing.

Again people take what I say and misconstrue it out of context. 8-|

Did I ever say don't get prepared? No. Search through my posts and you'll find nowhere where I have said there is no need to prepare - in fact I have always advocated temporal preparation. These things are what the prophets have always counseled. Where people get into trouble is when they look beyond the mark of what the Prophets and Apostles have counseled, taking it to extremes and inserting their own interpretations. For example - have the Prophets counseled us to buy tents, winter clothing, RV's, etc., in preparation to go live in the mountains for 3 1/2 years? No. Have they counseled us to stock up on guns and ammo in preparation for a time of martial law, civil unrest, and war? No. Have they counseled us to mortgage our homes, take out our 401k's, etc., and invest in gold and silver or other precious commodities for when the economy collapses? No. Yet these very things are what many people in the prepper/tent-city movement are doing and teaching others to do, claiming that there is scriptural and prophetic precedent for such, or, worse, claiming a divine mandate they have been given to teach these things.

Did I ever say not to worry about the loss of liberty, or that the Constitution doesn't matter? No. Again, search my posts and you'll never find it. In fact if you had access to and were able to look up my posts on AVOW you'll see time and again where I have stood up for liberty and shared prophetic quotes on the subject time and again. Ezra Taft Benson is one of my personal heroes and you can't possibly bring up his name without being reminded of what it means to be a true Patriot. Again, where people get into trouble though is when they look beyond the mark of what the Prophets and Apostles have taught and go to extremes, teaching others to do the same. For example - have the Prophets counseled us to take up arms and take over federal property in an attempt to bring attention to unconstitutional acts by our government? No. Have they counseled us to stir up anger, protests, and civil unrest among the citizenry of towns, counties, states, or even countries where we do not live and have no jurisdiction? No. And yet again these are the very things that some people within the Constitutional movement have been involved with recently, claiming that God is on their side for doing so.

Again, to repeat what Elder Cook said, "some members elevate causes - many of which are good - to a status superior to basic gospel doctrine." Is preparation good? Yes! Is Constitutional government and liberty good? Yes! Is good health and well-being good? Yes! And yet these are the very things that some people are turning into gospel extremism, and thereby shooting beyond the mark and find themselves stumbling over because they are no longer in harmony with good and proper gospel principles.

[mirkwood]

Wow, I always think it's funny when some people who are not in to something always point fingers at others as being extremists

Wow, I always think it's funny when some people who are extremists point fingers at others who don't agree with their extremism and say they don't believe in ____________ at all.

[Vision]

It cracks me up, between conference sessions KSL is airing ads for $5K geo dome tents for emergency shelters.

[e-eye2.0]

There are those going to the extreme prepping and need to dial it back. Most members are not doing enough. I do some but probably not enough.

[Lizzy60]

I'm pretty sure Noah was considered an extreme prepper in the days before the flood....... ;)

[Mark]

I'm pretty sure Noah was considered an extreme prepper in the days before the flood....... ;)

Big difference there. The Lord directly commanded Noah to do what he did. Many extremist preppers I have come across are driven by fear and assumptions based on perceived world conditions. More often than not they are dead wrong in their catastrophic prediction time table. Obviously in those cases fear was driving their predictions. The Lord does not operate out of fear.

[Lizzy60]

I'm pretty sure Noah was considered an extreme prepper in the days before the flood....... ;)

Big difference there. The Lord directly commanded Noah to do what he did. Many extremist preppers I have come across are driven by fear and assumptions based on perceived world conditions. More often than not they are dead wrong in their catastrophic prediction time table. Obviously in those cases fear was driving their predictions. The Lord does not operate out of fear.

Perhaps some are driven out of fear, and perhaps there are also others, (who you may judge as looking beyond the mark), who have received revelation from God to prepare in an "extreme" way, and it's really not up to you to judge who is who, if they are outside your immediate stewardship.

[JK4Woods]

My ribs are still hurting from where my wife elbowed me in the ribs during Elder Cook's talk..... ouch!

Interestingly enough... I had already toned down the urgency within myself a bunch of months ago...
Now I worry more about rotating home storage and figuring out a way to make HT a nice experience for both parties.
That and increasing my fitness level...

[iWriteStuff]

My ribs are still hurting from where my wife elbowed me in the ribs during Elder Cook's talk..... ouch!

Interestingly enough... I had already toned down the urgency within myself a bunch of months ago...
Now I worry more about rotating home storage and figuring out a way to make HT a nice experience for both parties.
That and increasing my fitness level...

Bingo! That's what I've been working on too. Got my preps mostly done (are they ever REALLY done?) and now I'm working on some personal items like: learning how to eat less and eat better, getting in shape, learning skills that would make life more comfortable without electricity, etc.

Especially a big fan of hiking and mountain climbing at the moment. Learning some great things there. Also, still teach firearms classes for free to folks in the ward who want to know how to safely handle them and such. That's my free will offering to local preppers ;)

[gclayjr]

Elder Cook did not say anything new. Below is a link to a BYU speech by Dallin H Oaks titled "Our Strengths cam become our Downfall" June 7, 1992

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5xCeiXDN9E

Look in about 28:35, and you will hear almost exactly the same thing as was stated by Elder Cook.

Below is a print version of this talk.

http://emp.byui.edu/SATTERFIELDB/PDF/StrengthsDHO.pdf

I think 2 sources means that we REALLY should pay attention.

Regards,

George Clay

[Onsdag]

Elder Cook did not say anything new. Below is a link to a BYU speech by Dallin H Oaks titled "Our Strengths cam become our Downfall" June 7, 1992

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5xCeiXDN9E

Look in about 28:35, and you will hear almost exactly the same thing as was stated by Elder Cook.

Below is a print version of this talk.

http://emp.byui.edu/SATTERFIELDB/PDF/StrengthsDHO.pdf

I think 2 sources means that we REALLY should pay attention.

Regards,

George Clay

Wow! Amazing talk! Thanks for finding and sharing it!

[lundbaek]

I note that some Church members consider promoting Liberty in light of the restored Gospel of Jesus Christ, including knowledge of the American Declaration of Independence, the US Constitution, the proper role of government, principles of freedom, political news, current events, secret combinations (conspiracy), and "last days" prophecy to be going "beyond the mark".

[Sarah]

My ribs are still hurting from where my wife elbowed me in the ribs during Elder Cook's talk..... ouch!

Interestingly enough... I had already toned down the urgency within myself a bunch of months ago...
Now I worry more about rotating home storage and figuring out a way to make HT a nice experience for both parties.
That and increasing my fitness level...

I got the same reaction from my husband. I don't disagree with Elder Cook, but the problem is at least for me, anything to a non-prep minded person seems extreme and expensive.

[nightfury1]

I know time is short for getting prepared. I'm freaking out because I believe what I've read concerning "end times." I'm grateful for those who felt like their fellow saints were important enough to warn. The only warning I have recently seen was Pres. Monson's "Are Ye Prepared" article from the September 2014 Ensign. We aren't going to be warned much more than that. They might warn us through magazines, but that seems to be about it. It is almost as if you aren't spiritually awake and have been preparing for years, then you will likely die. What are the general authorities going to say to those who are surprised by the call out and who mentally loose it because of the drastic change in lifestyle, "Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't think you could handle it so we didn't tell you." I can see why the saints would then feel bitter towards their leaders who were supposed to warn and protect.
I know that people think that we still have time to buy "one or two cans at a time" when we don't. I'm grateful to those who are waking up pampered people like me, who was happy enough to just shop at Walmart and not worry about food storage. Unfortunately we got ourselves out of debt instead of poising money towards food storage. I'm afraid we are going to pay for not having heeded the advice to be self reliant. Growing up I saw my mom canning and stuff like that, but I came from a home where both parents worked and could afford food storage on the side.

[DesertWonderer]

I note that some Church members consider promoting Liberty in light of the restored Gospel of Jesus Christ, including knowledge of the American Declaration of Independence, the US Constitution, the proper role of government, principles of freedom, political news, current events, secret combinations (conspiracy), and "last days" prophecy to be going "beyond the mark".

I note that I may be one of them.

[DesertWonderer]

I know time is short for getting prepared. I'm freaking out because I believe what I've read concerning "end times." I'm grateful for those who felt like their fellow saints were important enough to warn. The only warning I have recently seen was Pres. Monson's "Are Ye Prepared" article from the September 2014 Ensign. We aren't going to be warned much more than that. They might warn us through magazines, but that seems to be about it. It is almost as if you aren't spiritually awake and have been preparing for years, then you will likely die. What are the general authorities going to say to those who are surprised by the call out and who mentally loose it because of the drastic change in lifestyle, "Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't think you could handle it so we didn't tell you." I can see why the saints would then feel bitter towards their leaders who were supposed to warn and protect.
I know that people think that we still have time to buy "one or two cans at a time" when we don't. I'm grateful to those who are waking up pampered people like me, who was happy enough to just shop at Walmart and not worry about food storage. Unfortunately we got ourselves out of debt instead of poising money towards food storage. I'm afraid we are going to pay for not having heeded the advice to be self reliant. Growing up I saw my mom canning and stuff like that, but I came from a home where both parents worked and could afford food storage on the side.

Which is exactly why E Cook specifically brought this up. IT's not too late. Freaking out b/c of it is fear; fear of not from Christ. Don't believe what you read concerning end times (unless it's from an authorized or reputable source--self-proclaimed prophets are not a reputable source).

[Sarah]

I know time is short for getting prepared. I'm freaking out because I believe what I've read concerning "end times." I'm grateful for those who felt like their fellow saints were important enough to warn. The only warning I have recently seen was Pres. Monson's "Are Ye Prepared" article from the September 2014 Ensign. We aren't going to be warned much more than that. They might warn us through magazines, but that seems to be about it. It is almost as if you aren't spiritually awake and have been preparing for years, then you will likely die. What are the general authorities going to say to those who are surprised by the call out and who mentally loose it because of the drastic change in lifestyle, "Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't think you could handle it so we didn't tell you." I can see why the saints would then feel bitter towards their leaders who were supposed to warn and protect.
I know that people think that we still have time to buy "one or two cans at a time" when we don't. I'm grateful to those who are waking up pampered people like me, who was happy enough to just shop at Walmart and not worry about food storage. Unfortunately we got ourselves out of debt instead of poising money towards food storage. I'm afraid we are going to pay for not having heeded the advice to be self reliant. Growing up I saw my mom canning and stuff like that, but I came from a home where both parents worked and could afford food storage on the side.

My husband and I discussed this the other night. He sincerely believes that the Prophet will give a warning before it gets bad. The fact that they are not talking about preparing like they are talking about missionary work and religious liberty and Sabbath day observance. That's what he expects before it's too late, but in regard to preparation. I told him that I didn't think they would come out with much more warning.

[mmm..cheese]

He totally called out preppers and anyone who says he didn't is just making the choice to twist his words into a pretzel to justify the things they are basically hoping for.

I would hope everyone of those preppers is working on their families, their Scripture study, and thinking about others other than themselves just as hard as they are prepping.