Car Needed

Do you have something to sell/giveaway? A Business you want to let us know about? Found any good deals? Post them here.
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Meili
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Thu Dec 31, 2015 11:13 pm

The bottom line is, the gospel is meant for you, not your neighbor. The moment you begin to purposely seek to manipulate others'behavior in order to get them to do what you think is best, you have entered the devil's realm, even if it is merely withholding something you have the power to give. Go ahead and tell yourself it is for the other person's own good. Make sure you tell God as well, because if you don't now, you will be required to give an accounting at the last judgment. I would definitely plan on one of those listening moments after such a prayer. I'm certain he will understand you.

In the meantime, those who are interested in helping someone who has been unable thus far to acquire more secure transportation for herself and aren't too concerned whether you are enabling her, please help. If all you can do is pray, that would be appreciated.
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Fri Jan 01, 2016 12:29 am

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Re: Car Needed

Postby shadow » Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:17 am

Jezebel wrote:
I do not believe that we will be held accountable for enabling in the way you believe. Father gives breath to all of us, even those who commit the most atrocious sins, murderers, rapists, child molesters. The man committing torturous acts of sexual abuse on an innocent child is being given the power to do so by God. As I said, if we are to be like him, we must give freely as he does, even if people take our gifts and use them for ill as many do with God's gifts.

But if you know a person is a child molestor and you let that person watch your kids anyway then I think you're a terrible steward of your kids and you will be held somewhat accountable.

The same principle can be applied to giving gifts to a person when you know they can't properly use it. Give a suicidal person a loaded gun and you're going to be partially responsible for what happens. One persons blessing is another's curse. The gift giver has some stewardship. A lesson I've sadly learned myself.
This imminent stuff is taking for-freaking-ever :-w

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:26 am

shadow wrote:
Jezebel wrote:
I do not believe that we will be held accountable for enabling in the way you believe. Father gives breath to all of us, even those who commit the most atrocious sins, murderers, rapists, child molesters. The man committing torturous acts of sexual abuse on an innocent child is being given the power to do so by God. As I said, if we are to be like him, we must give freely as he does, even if people take our gifts and use them for ill as many do with God's gifts.

But if you know a person is a child molestor and you let that person watch your kids anyway then I think you're a terrible steward of your kids and you will be held somewhat accountable.

The same principle can be applied to giving gifts to a person when you know they can't properly use it. Give a suicidal person a loaded gun and you're going to be partially responsible for what happens. One persons blessing is another's curse. The gift giver has some stewardship. A lesson I've sadly learned myself.

Perhaps what you say is true. I have my personal reasons for exercising control and dominion over any of my little children who are in the process of running into a busy street. But we can't get around the fact that the Lord routinely sends his precious children directly into the homes of child molester parents every single day in the form of helpless infants. Maybe we would be wiser if we understood why.
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Elizabeth » Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:45 am

:(
Jezebel wrote: But we can't get around the fact that the Lord routinely sends his precious children directly into the homes of child molester parents every single day in the form of helpless infants. Maybe we would be wiser if we understood why.
Doctrines of the Gospel are revealed through the Spirit to Prophets... not through the intellect to scholars.

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Think not, that I am come to send peace on earth;
I came not to send peace, but a sword.

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Jason » Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:15 am

Elizabeth wrote::(
Jezebel wrote: But we can't get around the fact that the Lord routinely sends his precious children directly into the homes of child molester parents every single day in the form of helpless infants. Maybe we would be wiser if we understood why.

Agency....for better or worse!

He doesn't take away the consequences of mortal decisions....but does provide an eternal escape from judgement and everlasting punishment should we decide to repent.
Teuful Hunden - Saepius Exertus, Semper Fidelis, Frater Infinitas

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ!!!

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Jules » Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:25 am

I hope that somewhere among the pride and fear of the poor, there will be help for your friend. I wish I had an extra car for her or the money to get her one. I will check back here if I come across some options.
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Robert Sinclair » Fri Jan 01, 2016 12:37 pm

Let's all send a little and help out, a kind thing to do, I should have something the second wednesday of the month, when my retirement check comes in.♡

Here is that site again:

https://www.youcaring.com/woman-in-need-495694

"Seek to bring forth and establish the cause of Zion."

"With clean hands and a pure heart"

A happier people ever created by the hand of God, no poor among you, of your own freewill. ♡ :)

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Fri Jan 01, 2016 7:08 pm

Thanks, Jules; thanks, Robert.
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Re: Car Needed

Postby shadow » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:47 am

Jules wrote:I hope that somewhere among the pride and fear of the poor, there will be help for your friend. I wish I had an extra car for her or the money to get her one. I will check back here if I come across some options.

Where's some examples of this "pride and fear of the poor" you speak of.
This imminent stuff is taking for-freaking-ever :-w

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Robert Sinclair » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:58 am

Be nice, shadow gives to the poor, he does it in the way his heart tells him. All good is good.♡
"Seek to bring forth and establish the cause of Zion."

"With clean hands and a pure heart"

A happier people ever created by the hand of God, no poor among you, of your own freewill. ♡ :)

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Re: Car Needed

Postby shadow » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:59 am

Robert Sinclair wrote:Be nice, shadow gives to the poor, he does it in the way his heart tells him. All good is good.♡

Thank you Robert!
This imminent stuff is taking for-freaking-ever :-w

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:42 pm

Jezebel wrote:Thanks, Jules; thanks, Robert.

Seriously? I got edited. That's kind of pathetic.
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Re: Car Needed

Postby shadow » Sun Jan 03, 2016 7:59 am

Jezebel wrote:
Jezebel wrote:Thanks, Jules; thanks, Robert.

Seriously? I got edited. That's kind of pathetic.

Jules' post was edited and mine was deleted. Its the season of niceness and fairness. Glad to see yours was edited, it was kind of mean.
This imminent stuff is taking for-freaking-ever :-w

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:12 am

shadow wrote:
Jezebel wrote:
Jezebel wrote:Thanks, Jules; thanks, Robert.

Seriously? I got edited. That's kind of pathetic.

Jules' post was edited and mine was deleted. Its the season of niceness and fairness. Glad to see yours was edited, it was kind of mean.

It wasn't intended to be mean. But now that I realize it was just part of a series of edits, it makes more sense. If people can't handle a sigh and head shake, well.....
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Jules » Sun Jan 03, 2016 5:58 pm

shadow wrote:
Jules wrote:I hope that somewhere among the pride and fear of the poor, there will be help for your friend. I wish I had an extra car for her or the money to get her one. I will check back here if I come across some options.

Where's some examples of this "pride and fear of the poor" you speak of.

The very fact that there ARE poor among us. It's in the scriptures, and it's all around us. Jesus; King Benjamin; Joseph Smith - this is nothing new. Either is the pride and fear of the poor that keeps people from loving them.

She's a struggling single mom with health issues and an abusive ex for crying out loud, and yet she's vilified as if she is a criminal, or lazy, or ignorant, or whatever other excuse not to simply extend the pure love of Christ, that is pulled out of someone's back pocket.

Oh but wait - we know much better than that stupid, incompetent woman, and we certainly have the right to correct the Savior and other prophets who told us to provide the needs and wants of the poor, and let them keep on begging.
If I haven't offended you, scroll through my posts. It's in there.

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Jules » Sun Jan 03, 2016 5:59 pm

shadow wrote:
Jezebel wrote:
Jezebel wrote:Thanks, Jules; thanks, Robert.

Seriously? I got edited. That's kind of pathetic.

Jules' post was edited and mine was deleted. Its the season of niceness and fairness. Glad to see yours was edited, it was kind of mean.

I edited my own post.
If I haven't offended you, scroll through my posts. It's in there.

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Re: Car Needed

Postby shadow » Sun Jan 03, 2016 7:25 pm

Jules wrote:
shadow wrote:
Jules wrote:I hope that somewhere among the pride and fear of the poor, there will be help for your friend. I wish I had an extra car for her or the money to get her one. I will check back here if I come across some options.

Where's some examples of this "pride and fear of the poor" you speak of.

The very fact that there ARE poor among us. It's in the scriptures, and it's all around us. Jesus; King Benjamin; Joseph Smith - this is nothing new. Either is the pride and fear of the poor that keeps people from loving them.

She's a struggling single mom with health issues and an abusive ex for crying out loud, and yet she's vilified as if she is a criminal, or lazy, or ignorant, or whatever other excuse not to simply extend the pure love of Christ, that is pulled out of someone's back pocket.

Oh but wait - we know much better than that stupid, incompetent woman, and we certainly have the right to correct the Savior and other prophets who told us to provide the needs and wants of the poor, and let them keep on begging.

Nobody said there weren't poor among us. The question is how best help them. Giving cars is not always the best way. I'd like to see an argument from you that says otherwise if you don't believe me. I've personally learned a lesson on this very issue. With a stewardship comes a responsibility.
As far as jezebels friend- nobody said to NOT give her a car. If you think otherwise please quote it. As far as her friends issues, Jezebel didn't offer what you posted. She said she was a divorced mother who does not have custody of her kids who is trying to jugle time between visiting them and seeing her boyfriend and that her car is in need of repairs. That's not a reason to deny or give her a car. But if someone had something to give, it would be under their stewardship on how to best help. Maybe giving a car is best, maybe it's not. I suggest getting an extra car then take the issue to God. If you feel prompted to give it to her then do it.
You read waaaay too much into other people's posts. Look at things as half full, not half empty :D
This imminent stuff is taking for-freaking-ever :-w

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:44 pm

shadow wrote:
Jules wrote:
shadow wrote:
Jules wrote:I hope that somewhere among the pride and fear of the poor, there will be help for your friend. I wish I had an extra car for her or the money to get her one. I will check back here if I come across some options.

Where's some examples of this "pride and fear of the poor" you speak of.

The very fact that there ARE poor among us. It's in the scriptures, and it's all around us. Jesus; King Benjamin; Joseph Smith - this is nothing new. Either is the pride and fear of the poor that keeps people from loving them.

She's a struggling single mom with health issues and an abusive ex for crying out loud, and yet she's vilified as if she is a criminal, or lazy, or ignorant, or whatever other excuse not to simply extend the pure love of Christ, that is pulled out of someone's back pocket.

Oh but wait - we know much better than that stupid, incompetent woman, and we certainly have the right to correct the Savior and other prophets who told us to provide the needs and wants of the poor, and let them keep on begging.

Nobody said there weren't poor among us. The question is how best help them. Giving cars is not always the best way. I'd like to see an argument from you that says otherwise if you don't believe me. I've personally learned a lesson on this very issue. With a stewardship comes a responsibility.
As far as jezebels friend- nobody said to NOT give her a car. If you think otherwise please quote it. As far as her friends issues, Jezebel didn't offer what you posted. She said she was a divorced mother who does not have custody of her kids who is trying to jugle time between visiting them and seeing her boyfriend and that her car is in need of repairs. That's not a reason to deny or give her a car. But if someone had something to give, it would be under their stewardship on how to best help. Maybe giving a car is best, maybe it's not. I suggest getting an extra car then take the issue to God. If you feel prompted to give it to her then do it.
You read waaaay too much into other people's posts. Look at things as half full, not half empty :D

:) Jules knows the woman too. She does have a lot of health problems as well. She's been in the ER several times in the past few months and is facing a few other serious problems at present. I'm not really good at making people look like a good bet for giving charity. Her bishop turned her down in the past as well as many other organizations. If you want to judge whether or not she is a good candidate to give a car to, I don't think anyone would fault you (speaking generally here) for moving along.

I think anyone who really knows me would tell you that you can trust that I am telling the truth. Beyond that, I haven't got much of a foundation to stand on when it comes to being trustworthy. I think I've convinced the majority of people that I'm stubbornly foolish. I think my friend needs a new car (because the old one is so broken down it wouldn't be worth fixing) and I don't see my friend being able to buy herself one any time soon (like before the old car dies). I might be wrong in that. Maybe she would get along just fine. Or maybe the Lord has some other plan for her. But anyway, I'm planning on buying her a car and feel free to pitch in if you like. I do know her better than anyone else here and no one else is going to be better situated to determine what she needs than me.

Shadow, I want to mention that my observations are just observations. I'm just saying what things look like to me. But of course, your journey is your journey, and I would never want to cause a person to falter in what they believe is right. I'm sure you haven't let what I've said change your mind in anything. ;) And I agree at least on one point. I think it's a good idea to pray about it.
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Separatist » Mon Jan 04, 2016 7:17 am

Jules wrote:
shadow wrote:
Jules wrote:I hope that somewhere among the pride and fear of the poor, there will be help for your friend. I wish I had an extra car for her or the money to get her one. I will check back here if I come across some options.

Where's some examples of this "pride and fear of the poor" you speak of.

The very fact that there ARE poor among us. It's in the scriptures, and it's all around us. Jesus; King Benjamin; Joseph Smith - this is nothing new. Either is the pride and fear of the poor that keeps people from loving them.

She's a struggling single mom with health issues and an abusive ex for crying out loud, and yet she's vilified as if she is a criminal, or lazy, or ignorant, or whatever other excuse not to simply extend the pure love of Christ, that is pulled out of someone's back pocket.

Oh but wait - we know much better than that stupid, incompetent woman, and we certainly have the right to correct the Savior and other prophets who told us to provide the needs and wants of the poor, and let them keep on begging.


This is all very manipulative. Throwing guilt on others who don't see it your way. Don't we get enough of that on Sunday's? The pure love of Christ does not equal our back pockets.

I've come to the conclusion that all true charity it local. It ought to be up close and personal, where local parties have local knowledge and act accordingly. Soliciting charity on anonymous internet forums and then berating those who question is damn sick. And the berating always seems to come from those who can't even help themselves. The locals who know her should take care of the issue with other locals who know her.

You work in your part of the vineyard and I'll work in mine. How's that for charity?

Good day.
"The love of liberty is the love of others; the love of power is the love of ourselves. We cannot force love" --William Hazlitt

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Mon Jan 04, 2016 10:19 am

Separatist wrote:
Jules wrote:
shadow wrote:
Jules wrote:I hope that somewhere among the pride and fear of the poor, there will be help for your friend. I wish I had an extra car for her or the money to get her one. I will check back here if I come across some options.

Where's some examples of this "pride and fear of the poor" you speak of.

The very fact that there ARE poor among us. It's in the scriptures, and it's all around us. Jesus; King Benjamin; Joseph Smith - this is nothing new. Either is the pride and fear of the poor that keeps people from loving them.

She's a struggling single mom with health issues and an abusive ex for crying out loud, and yet she's vilified as if she is a criminal, or lazy, or ignorant, or whatever other excuse not to simply extend the pure love of Christ, that is pulled out of someone's back pocket.

Oh but wait - we know much better than that stupid, incompetent woman, and we certainly have the right to correct the Savior and other prophets who told us to provide the needs and wants of the poor, and let them keep on begging.


This is all very manipulative. Throwing guilt on others who don't see it your way. Don't we get enough of that on Sunday's? The pure love of Christ does not equal our back pockets.

I've come to the conclusion that all true charity it local. It ought to be up close and personal, where local parties have local knowledge and act accordingly. Soliciting charity on anonymous internet forums and then berating those who question is damn sick. And the berating always seems to come from those who can't even help themselves. The locals who know her should take care of the issue with other locals who know her.

You work in your part of the vineyard and I'll work in mine. How's that for charity?

Good day.

I believe that giving should generally be kept close to home as well. I used to give to the beggars on the street whenever I saw one. The Spirit would warn me beforehand, tell me which lane to get in as I was driving or tell me to get cash out of my wallet and get it ready, and sure enough, I would see someone standing on a corner with a cardboard sign.

There came a time, though, when I wasn't able to give to the people on the corners anymore and every time I passed them up, I felt sorrow in my heart. One day, as I was passing a person with a sign, the Spirit impressed upon me that those people wouldn't be there if they had family and friends who were looking out for them. After that, I began to focus on doing whatever I could for those I love who needed help, so they never felt like they would have to stand on a corner with a sign. When I pass the people with signs, I send them love and truly say in my heart that I would give if I could, but I can't. I can't because the people I know come first and I just don't have the resources to help everyone. I still give if the Spirit tells me to, or if someone asks me directly themselves. Otherwise, I accept peace knowing that I am doing my best and am not passing anyone up out of pride or selfishness.

True charity is the pure love of Christ. It isn't encased by boundaries of knowing someone or whether or not they live near you. Jesus loves everyone. I believe we can feel love for everyone ourselves. But I do believe that those under our stewardship need to come first when it comes to giving.

There are those who can afford to look outside their immediate circles to give. Additionally, there are those on this forum I feel connected to, who are like family to me. I know people on here have given generously in the past. I hope a few feel inclined to give again. There are so many needs in the world and we can't do much alone. But if we can work together, we could do some great things.
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Mon Jan 04, 2016 10:27 am

Jezebel wrote:I have a friend in need of a car. I am trying to raise enough to cover a running car, the registration, and 6 months worth of insurance. If you can donate money or a car, please let me know. I live in Utah County.

To donate by card: https://www.youcaring.com/woman-in-need-495694

If you would like to donate via paypal, you can send it to: rosefromarock@yahoo.com. (Please include a note stating the purpose)

Or you can send a donation to:
1274 North State Street #5
Orem, UT 84057

Please note that I have updated the OP with additional donation information.
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Robert Sinclair » Mon Jan 11, 2016 8:03 am

How are things going?♡
"Seek to bring forth and establish the cause of Zion."

"With clean hands and a pure heart"

A happier people ever created by the hand of God, no poor among you, of your own freewill. ♡ :)

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Mon Jan 11, 2016 8:15 am

:) Nothing is happening so far....
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Re: Car Needed

Postby Robert Sinclair » Wed Jan 13, 2016 6:34 am

Thought I would bring this up again, best wishes for your friend to get all the help she needs both temporal and spiritual.♡
"Seek to bring forth and establish the cause of Zion."

"With clean hands and a pure heart"

A happier people ever created by the hand of God, no poor among you, of your own freewill. ♡ :)

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Re: Car Needed

Postby Meili » Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:59 pm

I want to return to this topic and say that I'm coming around to a perspective more like shadow's. I have come to realize that some people will create problems no matter what you do to help and so it is best at times to step back and let them suffer the consequences of their choices. That sometimes is the only thing that is going to help them take a step up.

The idea presented by King Benjamin, I've come to believe, is a "letter" of the law. It is an instruction that if followed, will teach you lessons you need to know. However, I believe there is a time to graduate to a more spirit of law understanding.

When I first began giving, I needed to have a lot of my hang ups about giving cleaned out of me. The giving was for me and so it didn't really matter who I gave to or what I gave, so long as it stretched my perspective. But there comes a time when, if you really truly want to help people, you need to learn additional lessons.

I gave things because I wanted to help others. I began by helping myself. I hope I can now learn what I need to so that I can truly benefit those around me. Sometimes that means telling them no. I'm coming to see that.
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