Two Witness in Jerusalem

[durangout]

Something to consider. There is a lot of symbolism going on in revelation chapter 11. Could the 2 witnesses (olive trees often represent peoples or nations rather than individuals) be referring not to individuals but to powerful nations that will subject the rest of the world by their power (there is a lot of resources spent to conduct wars, economic wars, weather wars and biological wars previously and in the future as an example). I do not have in vision Elder Bednar tormenting/oppressing the world (read the whole chapter to see the kind of witnesses they are/will be). When these "nations" die the rest of the world will rejoice. The "nations" will be resurrected but on a more righteous level (taken from Sodom and Egypt to heaven/Zion symbolically). I believe USA (and russia/soviet? England?) has had this power over the nations of the earth (even to keep the state of Israel mostly safe) but it is waning. Perhaps we should not take 1260 days or 3,5 days literally. The beast out of the bottomless pit (the great conspiracy fact or the "NWO" - fiat money is a bottomless mine/resource to make war/oppress with) will overcome these powerful and lately oppressive (due to the NWO agenda) end time witnesses/nations and the deceived world will rejoice with their realized "NWO" (beast) for a short time.

I gotta tell you it's very gratifying to see that there is someone that reads the scriptures the way they were intended. God uses the language of symbols to teach the deeper layers of knowledge. For example, why do we baptize by immersion? It is symbolic of Jesus' death and resurrection.

I can't say I agree with everything you have said but we do seem to be on parallel paths. As you indicate the 2 witnesses are 2 nations or tribes, etc but it's doubtful that they are 2 members of The 15 imho. In fact, I think cpt 11 of Revelations is the most enigmatic of the entire book. I have all the puzzle pieces but I just haven't quite put them all together yet:

“Great City” = Rev 17:18, 14:8

"Temple" = 1 Cor 6:19
Eph 2: 19-22
1 Peter 2: 5-6

All of the scriptures I've found that have to do wiht the "2 Witnesses" =
Zech 4:1-14
Isa 51:19-21, 52 (2Ne 8:17-25)
Ezk 37
3 Ne 21:24-26
Isa 11:11-13
Jacob 5 / Rom 11
Jer 11:16
Isa 44:1-4
Orson Hyde Dedicatory Prayer
Rev 1:12
D&C 77:15
Dan 12: 5-7
Isa 19:18-22
Dan 12:2

[sushi_chef]

"7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
"
(Revelation Chapter 11)


"1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

2 And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.

3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.

4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.

5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.

6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.

7 And the shapes of the locusts were like unto horses prepared unto battle; and on their heads were as it were crowns like gold, and their faces were as the faces of men.

8 And they had hair as the hair of women, and their teeth were as the teeth of lions.

9 And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle.

10 And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.

11And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.
"
(Revelation Chapter 9)


to sushi_, from the stand point view of nasa-nazi connections conspiracy...., those bottomless pit people/beast/angel named Abaddon/Apollyon should be nazi people from antarctica/Neuschwabenland now they live underground.


antarctica nazi
http://image.search.yahoo.co.jp/search? ... ica%20nazi" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Sieg Heil means Hail Apollyon The Destroyer Gorilla199 2011/12/25
"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpJsFHPx70I" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Apollyon abaddon nazi
http://search.yahoo.co.jp/search?ei=UTF ... %20%20nazi" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Apollyon "apollo mission" Abaddon
http://search.yahoo.co.jp/search?ei=UTF ... %20Abaddon" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

nasa nazi connection
http://search.yahoo.co.jp/search?ei=UTF ... connection" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


btw, not sure about the relation of toyotas avalon, which seems church authorities official cars, to those nazi/Abaddon/Apollyon, might be implying something?!

:-B :-B :-B

[oxbloodangel]

Something to consider. There is a lot of symbolism going on in revelation chapter 11. Could the 2 witnesses (olive trees often represent peoples or nations rather than individuals) be referring not to individuals but to powerful nations that will subject the rest of the world by their power (there is a lot of resources spent to conduct wars, economic wars, weather wars and biological wars previously and in the future as an example). I do not have in vision Elder Bednar tormenting/oppressing the world (read the whole chapter to see the kind of witnesses they are/will be). When these "nations" die the rest of the world will rejoice. The "nations" will be resurrected but on a more righteous level (taken from Sodom and Egypt to heaven/Zion symbolically). I believe USA (and russia/soviet? England?) has had this power over the nations of the earth (even to keep the state of Israel mostly safe) but it is waning. Perhaps we should not take 1260 days or 3,5 days literally. The beast out of the bottomless pit (the great conspiracy fact or the "NWO" - fiat money is a bottomless mine/resource to make war/oppress with) will overcome these powerful and lately oppressive (due to the NWO agenda) end time witnesses/nations and the deceived world will rejoice with their realized "NWO" (beast) for a short time.

I love the idea of trees meaning nations or people groups, as in the allegory of the olive trees. I also believe that prophecy has many layers, including symbolic and physical (not literal, necessarily, like the moon turning to blood signifies a physical but not literal change). For instance, when Jesus said, "Destroy this temple and in three days, I will raise it up," he spake of the temple of his body, but it was also a prophecy about the physical destruction of the temple in Jerusalem.

The two witnesses, if they are lands, would have to be old Jerusalem and new Jerusalem. There are so many references to these two groups in the scriptures (Jews and Gentiles) in which the book that came forth from the Jews (the Bible) and the book that came forth from the Gentiles (the Book of Mormon) testify together to all the world, first to the Jew, then to the Gentile; and in the last days, first to the Gentile, then to the Jew. That the Jews should be last because they were first is only strengthened by the widespread disdain for them as a people group and nation. Both Jerusalems are, at present, overrun by corruption of Sodom and Egypt (homosexuality and slavery and infanticide).

Now comes the exciting part: that everything that was spoken of Jerusalem in the last days will also come to pass in America! Just as the Israelites were driven in exodus to promised lands near a salt lake, the Mormons were driven in exodus to promised lands near a salt lake. Just as their temple was destroyed and rebuilt, the Salt Lake Temple was dismantled and rebuilt. Just as water will flow out from under the temple and heal the Dead Sea, so will water flow out from under the temple to heal the Salt Lake. The parallels are mind blowing. Prophecy is real!

[Matchmaker]

Something to consider. There is a lot of symbolism going on in revelation chapter 11. Could the 2 witnesses (olive trees often represent peoples or nations rather than individuals) be referring not to individuals but to powerful nations that will subject the rest of the world by their power (there is a lot of resources spent to conduct wars, economic wars, weather wars and biological wars previously and in the future as an example). I do not have in vision Elder Bednar tormenting/oppressing the world (read the whole chapter to see the kind of witnesses they are/will be). When these "nations" die the rest of the world will rejoice. The "nations" will be resurrected but on a more righteous level (taken from Sodom and Egypt to heaven/Zion symbolically). I believe USA (and russia/soviet? England?) has had this power over the nations of the earth (even to keep the state of Israel mostly safe) but it is waning. Perhaps we should not take 1260 days or 3,5 days literally. The beast out of the bottomless pit (the great conspiracy fact or the "NWO" - fiat money is a bottomless mine/resource to make war/oppress with) will overcome these powerful and lately oppressive (due to the NWO agenda) end time witnesses/nations and the deceived world will rejoice with their realized "NWO" (beast) for a short time.

I love the idea of trees meaning nations or people groups, as in the allegory of the olive trees. I also believe that prophecy has many layers, including symbolic and physical (not literal, necessarily, like the moon turning to blood signifies a physical but not literal change). For instance, when Jesus said, "Destroy this temple and in three days, I will raise it up," he spake of the temple of his body, but it was also a prophecy about the physical destruction of the temple in Jerusalem.

The two witnesses, if they are lands, would have to be old Jerusalem and new Jerusalem. There are so many references to these two groups in the scriptures (Jews and Gentiles) in which the book that came forth from the Jews (the Bible) and the book that came forth from the Gentiles (the Book of Mormon) testify together to all the world, first to the Jew, then to the Gentile; and in the last days, first to the Gentile, then to the Jew. That the Jews should be last because they were first is only strengthened by the widespread disdain for them as a people group and nation. Both Jerusalems are, at present, overrun by corruption of Sodom and Egypt (homosexuality and slavery and infanticide).

Now comes the exciting part: that everything that was spoken of Jerusalem in the last days will also come to pass in America! Just as the Israelites were driven in exodus to promised lands near a salt lake, the Mormons were driven in exodus to promised lands near a salt lake. Just as their temple was destroyed and rebuilt, the Salt Lake Temple was dismantled and rebuilt. Just as water will flow out from under the temple and heal the Dead Sea, so will water flow out from under the temple to heal the Salt Lake. The parallels are mind blowing. Prophecy is real!

Fascinating correlation between the tribe of Judah (Israel) and the tribe of Joseph (the Americas)!

[buffalo_girl]

btw, not sure about the relation of toyotas avalon, which seems church authorities official cars, to those nazi/Abaddon/Apollyon, might be implying something?!

I'm sure you aren't suggesting that the land out of which the Toyota automobile has ascended could possibly be 'the bottomless pit'!

Bless your heart, sometimes you are so amusing..

[sushi_chef]

urrrrr.... nop, nope, sushi_ just imagined might be some connections between church authorities and usa higher ups those might be connected to nasa-nazi connections so on.... after all its latter-day, isnt it, anything can happen, might/will happen....

but interesting enough seems says a green dragon secret society helped German geo-politician and mystic Karl Haushofer(1869 - 1946) to be able to contact with tibetans, those might have helped nazi have Shambhala ufo technology....

Karl Haushofer "green dragon" tibet
http://search.yahoo.co.jp/search?ei=UTF ... 20%20tibet" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Karl Haushofer visited japan
http://search.yahoo.co.jp/search?ei=UTF ... ed%20japan" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

緑龍会 チベット ナチス (green dragon society tibet nazi)
http://image.search.yahoo.co.jp/search? ... 1%E3%82%B9" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

nazi tibet shambhala ufo
http://search.yahoo.co.jp/search?ei=UTF ... hala%20ufo" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ufo nazi mars
http://search.yahoo.co.jp/search?ei=UTF ... azi%20mars" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Roswell was not aliens - it was the Nazis, according to a German documentary ---- A GERMAN TV documentary being screened on Wednesday night claims the mysterious UFO 'Roswell Incident' in the USA nearly 70 years ago was the result of experiments with ultra-secret Nazi rocket technology. ---- Oct 14, 2014
"
http://www.express.co.uk/news/weird/522 ... -UFO-Nazis" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ufo nazi roswell
http://video.search.yahoo.co.jp/search? ... %20roswell" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


"When the members of the Ahnenerbe’s "German Tibet Expedition" returned in 1939, laden with animal skins, artifacts, holy texts, photographs and film reels, and, of course, the facial casts and phrenological data collected by Berger, Himmler declared the expedition an unqualified success. Though in this case Shambhala served as merely a catalyst for the journey rather than its destination, the "German Tibet Expedition" sparked later assertions—despite lack of evidence—that the Nazis made frequent, secretive trips to Tibet in search of the utopian kingdom itself. These rumors have made Shambhala central to a branch of contemporary Neo-Nazi thought known as "Esoteric Hitlerism." Miguel Serrano, a former Chilean diplomat and major figure in the Esoteric Hitlerist movement, in fact asserts that Hitler did not die in Berlin but rather fled to Shambhala (in Serrano’s account, relocated from the Tibetan Himalayas to the center of the earth), whence he will soon emerge, astride a white steed and flanked by an army of UFOs, to inaugurate the "Fourth Reich."
"
http://www.cabinetmagazine.org/issues/27/wiley.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



urrrrr......to sushi_ still, those bottomless pit people are nazi people from antarctica.....

so, urrr, jerusalem/usa pararell is pretty interesting, sushi_ might be all ears/eyes....

:-B :-B :-B

[Silver]

sushi_chef
どれぐらい日本語わかるの？

[sushi_chef]

sushi_chef
どれぐらい日本語わかるの？

生まれも、育ちも、日本人だべさ、そんでもって、老人に近いかもっす・・・・ボケ、パワーレス、マネーレス・・・・ＢＵＴ、寝たきりには、ならないぞぉぉぉ・・・・
:-B

[Silver]

sushi_chef
どれぐらい日本語わかるの？

生まれも、育ちも、日本人だべさ、そんでもって、老人に近いかもっす・・・・ボケ、パワーレス、マネーレス・・・・ＢＵＴ、寝たきりには、ならないぞぉぉぉ・・・・
:-B

ご回答、ありがとう。もしかして北海道育ちですか。

[sushi_chef]

んでねずらぁ、東北っしゃぁ。あんだは？？
:-B

[Silver]

僕っすか。私は生まれも育ちもテキサス州ヒューストン市ですよ。バリバリアメリカ人だけど、伝道期間を含む凡そ８年間日本に滞在。そして３０年間近く日系企業で勤めております。よろしくお願いいたします。（ちなみに、日本名が進之介です。）

[GeeR]

The notion that the two witnesses are nations is wrong according to D&C 77:15. I believe the two are twin brothers that cannot be killed, the modern day counterparts of St. Crispin and Crispinian.

[francisco.colaco]

I can quote my bishop ... ... he believes that one of the two is probably Elder Bednar. Actually, he is a very spiritual person with a lot of very neat experiences.

I personally do believe that the two prophets are alive, and that they are or will be most likely members of the quorum of the twelve.

Being born in 1952, Elder Bednar does not fit the age group in Bruce R. McConkie's statement. Taking it at face value, the two witnesses were born between 1962 and 1967.

[GeeR]

Brother McConkie is wrong! Just like he admitted being wrong in saying the Blacks would not receive the priesthood in our time.

[BrotherOfMahonri]

They will be members of the church. It is only by the power of the Priesthood that they will control the elements.

Was Samuel the Lamanite, Nephi, Lehi, Alma Sr., Christ members of the "church" in their times when they did their inspired heavenly work? Is priesthood power limited by some church on earth claiming to be God's only true church, or does the pattern of scriptures tell us another story? An invite to be careful to fall into the tradition of thinking all is well in Zion, Zion prospereth and Zion will bring forth two prophets from the membership of the church, as the scriptures show us a very different story about prophets and most come from No church but end up re-establishing the church because the "church" tried to kill them and were astray.

[Matchmaker]

At the moment, the LDS church does not have permission to proselytize in Israel, that's why we don't send missionaries over there. Something is going to have to happen that will soften the Israeli Government's heart first. Now, if Mitt Romney gets elected as VP, since he and Netanyahu are such good friends, that might start the ball rolling.

Of course, if the lost tribes come back soon, get their temple endowments at the hands of Ephraim in the LDS temples, and then make Aliyah to Israel, a right they have being of Jewish blood, regardless of their religious preferences, the Israeli government will have to recognize the LDS religion due to the influx of new citizens being LDS. Problem solved!

[GeeR]

The notion that the two witnesses are nations is wrong according to D&C 77:15. I believe the two are twin brothers that cannot be killed, the modern day counterparts of St. Crispin and Crispinian.

I've been thinking or wondering if the Lehi and Nephi in the latter part of the Book of Mormon were twins. We know they were brothers but I wouldn't be surprised if they were twin brothers with alliterative names, that just preceded the coming of Christ to the Americas. "Is there not a type in this thing?" (Alma 37:45) I know the two witnesses are scheduled to stave-off the forces that are out to destroy Israel but Revelation chap. 11 implies that they are hated among all nations (even in the USA) to the extant that the wicked the world over will celebrate their deaths by sending each other Christmas gifts. I'm thinking they will "torment" the USA with plague (Isa. 18) like Moses tormented the Egyptian government and people before their ministry in Jerusalem--again a typology. Many of the latter-day plagues are duplicate plagues of what Moses inflicted in Egypt like the plague of flies and the plague of waters turning to blood and the plague of hail. We know that the two witnesses will be empowered with the ability to "smite the earth with all plagues" (Rev. 11:6)--all the 10 plagues of Egypt!? We're talking about typological similitudes here folks thus proving God is the same yesterday, today and forever.

[GeeR]

The notion that the two witnesses are nations is wrong according to D&C 77:15. I believe the two are twin brothers that cannot be killed, the modern day counterparts of St. Crispin and Crispinian.

I've been thinking or wondering if the Lehi and Nephi in the latter part of the Book of Mormon were twins. We know they were brothers but I wouldn't be surprised if they were twin brothers with alliterative names, that just preceded the coming of Christ to the Americas. "Is there not a type in this thing?" (Alma 37:45) I know the two witnesses are scheduled to stave-off the forces that are out to destroy Israel but Revelation chap. 11 implies that they are hated among all nations (even in the USA) to the extant that the wicked the world over will celebrate their deaths by sending each other Christmas gifts. I'm thinking they will "torment" the USA with plague (Isa. 18) like Moses tormented the Egyptian government and people before their ministry in Jerusalem--again a typology. Many of the latter-day plagues are duplicate plagues of what Moses inflicted in Egypt like the plague of flies and the plague of waters turning to blood and the plague of hail. We know that the two witnesses will be empowered with the ability to "smite the earth with all plagues" (Rev. 11:6)--all the 10 plagues of Egypt!? We're talking about typological similitudes here folks thus proving God is the same yesterday, today and forever.

Moses and Aaron were brothers--twin brothers?

[BurningSword]

The two witnesses are Elias and Moses, they will gather the tribes of Israel and bring some to repentance in the time of the tribulation, a remnant of the Jews will repent and be saved. Elias will have power to seal for he is the angel ascending out of the east and will seal the chosen. They will have power to bring consequence upon nations for its evils if will not repent. They will be hated by all nations except those whom are the righteous few among them. They will not be able to be killed until the opening of the Bottomless pit when Abaddon arises and upon their death soon after comes the 5 months of darkness in which those upon earth in those days will be tormented by the legions at Abaddon command. It is true the world will celebrate their deaths and they will arise 3 days and a half later just as Jesus Christ their Lord arose. The world becomes a dwelling of devils of every foul creatures and beast and bird and fish of hades, what will come in the future is going to shock so many mankind has no idea what really exists.

[francisco.colaco]

Brother McConkie is wrong! Just like he admitted being wrong in saying the Blacks would not receive the priesthood in our time.

There are too much specifics in the Two Witnesses statements to rule out a non-spiritual provenance.

Came to me last night that, talking to me, a member here was derisive, even furious, to have learned that the "authorities in Salt Lake" had said the two witnesses would be or had been born in the Salt Lake Area. He was furious because he thought that the Church considered the members of the Utah area somewhat special and the only ones deemed for honours. I have not read the quote myself, but assume that he did. He talked to me about that subject at the late nineties, but I do remember the uncomfortable position of having to defend the Church once again to the members of the Church.

If true, Brother Bednar would not be one of the two witnesses, being born in California, even though I would not be surprised were he a member of the First Presidency, or even the President of the Church, at the time of Christ's coming.

[francisco.colaco]

They will be members of the church. It is only by the power of the Priesthood that they will control the elements.

Was Samuel the Lamanite, Nephi, Lehi, Alma Sr., Christ members of the "church" in their times when they did their inspired heavenly work? Is priesthood power limited by some church on earth claiming to be God's only true church, or does the pattern of scriptures tell us another story? An invite to be careful to fall into the tradition of thinking all is well in Zion, Zion prospereth and Zion will bring forth two prophets from the membership of the church, as the scriptures show us a very different story about prophets and most come from No church but end up re-establishing the church because the "church" tried to kill them and were astray.

To answer your questions, yes (the lamanites were converted then), yes and yes (Zoram thought Nephi was referring to his brothers of the Church), yes (Alma was a priest in the kingdom on Noah), and yes (Christ reestablished the Church, and as the boss he was a first member).

[BurningSword]

Brother McConkie is wrong! Just like he admitted being wrong in saying the Blacks would not receive the priesthood in our time.

There are too much specifics in the Two Witnesses statements to rule out a non-spiritual provenance.

Came to me last night that, talking to me, a member here was derisive, even furious, to have learned that the "authorities in Salt Lake" had said the two witnesses would be or had been born in the Salt Lake Area. He was furious because he thought that the Church considered the members of the Utah area somewhat special and the only ones deemed for honours. I have not read the quote myself, but assume that he did. He talked to me about that subject at the late nineties, but I do remember the uncomfortable position of having to defend the Church once again to the members of the Church.

If true, Brother Bednar would not be one of the two witnesses, being born in California, even though I would not be surprised were he a member of the First Presidency, or even the President of the Church, at the time of Christ's coming.

The two witnesses are a mystery concerning reincarnation which is a concept that has not been explained to mankind correctly. Reincarnation is limited to certain spirits only with higher purposes in plan of God, God has power to permit a spirit more than one incarnation if it has special purpose. Normally the reason why people cant have more than one life is due to the underworld, most spirits whom die are bound in underworlds the rest await in Abraham's Bosom. The doctrines of mankind as understood as reincarnation are doctrines of the devil, as it is based on idea of reoccurring life's based on karma and is not the truth. It is not possible for normal mankind to have more than one incarnation more than one life before judgement which comes in the time of resurrection. However it is possible for Gods prophets certain ones as well as God Himself to come in more than one body if it serves purpose in the eternal plan of Salvation.

This is why Jesus implied that John was Elijah and Elias to come, such mystery's were hidden from mankind's understanding. Elijah is John the Baptist and also Elias whom would come in the last generation as the ascending angel from the east to gather and seal the chosen tribes of Israel on behalf of Christ. Concerning them being members of the church, both were born into the church but not in America, they are special witnesses directly of the mystery of God, Jesus Christ work in fulfilling prophecy and promises made to Abraham's Bloodline. both Elias and Moses are unique spirits and have a special relationship with Jesus Christ, they have long worked on Mystery of God together since the foundation of the world, this is why they spoke at the mount of olives.

To understand this one must look at the body as but a vessel and the spirit as a occupant, the soul of a person is linked to matter of their body and through resurrection they will be brought forth out of the underworld or Abraham's Bosom. But certain spirits were permitted to have more than one vessel with purpose in the plan of salvation.

Remember even Joseph smith said not all things were ever revealed to the world, that even if many things were revealed to the church members many would fall away, I am giving people this knowledge to make them realise that not everything is known by the church at this time concerning Gods work and that they should be more humble in how they act and judge.

[francisco.colaco]

Burning Sword,

There is no reincarnation. We know that Elias has been translated, and so has Moses, most certainly, because no grave was found, according to Deuteronomy.

But the two witnesses are NOT nations nor ancient prophets. Unfortunately, Moses and Elias have probably been already judged and resurrected, since many saints were resurrected after Jesus was. If so, they will not be killed again.

Moses and Elias have already transferred the keys they held to Joseph Smith. The record is in D&C 110. The two witnesses will be members of the Church, as the keys rest now on the three quorums (first presidency, quorum of the twelve and seventies, in order). The keys are now ours, and we better make good use of them. We can and will appoint the two witnesses, which will act 3 1/2 years before the coming in glory. When they will be known or anointed, I do not know.

[Silver]

Burning Sword,

There is no reincarnation. We know that Elias has been translated, and so has Moses, most certainly, because no grave was found, according to Deuteronomy.

But the two witnesses are NOT nations nor ancient prophets. Unfortunately, Moses and Elias have probably been already judged and resurrected, since many saints were resurrected after Jesus was. If so, they will not be killed again.

Moses and Elias have already transferred the keys they held to Joseph Smith. The record is in D&C 110. The two witnesses will be members of the Church, as the keys rest now on the three quorums (first presidency, quorum of the twelve and seventies, in order). The keys are now ours, and we better make good use of them. We can and will appoint the two witnesses, which will act 3 1/2 years before the coming in glory. When they will be known or anointed, I do not know.

You are a real trooper for trying, but BS is unreachable. You will not dissuade him from his heresies. What concerns me more though is there are members of LDSFF who are thanking him for the nonsense he types.

[francisco.colaco]

You are a real trooper for trying, but BS is unreachable. You will not dissuade him from his heresies. What concerns me more though is there are members of LDSFF who are thanking him for the nonsense he types.

Good advice. I will follow it.

I hope US Road Service builds more bridges in Utah. There is little living space for such a raising crowd. :p