Eclipse, A sign of preparation?

[Durzan]

There is yet another Elias to come... He goes by many names: the Marred Servant, Raphael, the Last Prophet of the Last Dispensation, the Soul of Iron, the Forth Brother, He Who Now Wears the Title of Son of the Morning After Lucifer Fel, etc... The Marred Servant will have the blood of Hyrum or Joseph flowing through his veins, and he shall bring the Church out of condemnation. Like John the Baptist was a precursor to Christ's first ministry, so too shall the Marred Servant serve as a precursor to the Savior's Second Coming. He shall finish what his ancestors had started... he will be the one who leads us back to Zion.

Note that the Marred Servant is a distinct individual separate from the Davidic Servant... but that they are often confused for being one person because their trials and descriptions are similar in nature. One is to minister to Ephriam, while the other ministers to Judah.

Eclipses are a regular sign of the seasons... but what they signify from a spiritual perspective is up to interpretation. Many feel that they represent impending judgement... but I cannot say for sure. Personally, I believe that this Eclipse that happened recently is a sign signifying the coming of Elias to the Americas. He will begin his ministry shortly, I think (though the term "shortly" in the Lord's timeframe could be anywhere from 1 year to a hundred years or more).

[setyourselffree]

There is yet another Elias to come... He goes by many names: the Marred Servant, Raphael, the Last Prophet of the Last Dispensation, the Soul of Iron, the Forth Brother, He Who Now Wears the Title of Son of the Morning After Lucifer Fel, etc... The Marred Servant will have the blood of Hyrum or Joseph flowing through his veins, and he shall bring the Church out of condemnation. Like John the Baptist was a precursor to Christ's first ministry, so too shall the Marred Servant serve as a precursor to the Savior's Second Coming. He shall finish what his ancestors had started... he will be the one who leads us back to Zion.

Note that the Marred Servant is a distinct individual separate from the Davidic Servant... but that they are often confused for being one person because their trials and descriptions are similar in nature. One is to minister to Ephriam, while the other ministers to Judah.

Eclipses are a regular sign of the seasons... but what they signify from a spiritual perspective is up to interpretation. Many feel that they represent impending judgement... but I cannot say for sure. Personally, I believe that this Eclipse that happened recently is a sign signifying the coming of Elias to the Americas. He will begin his ministry shortly

Do you have scriptural evidence to back that up?

[Ezekiel]

The restoration of the Priesthood was the single most important event. All of things you listed can't come forth without the Priesthood. Those things are child's play compared to the restoration of the Priesthood. The restoration has already happened. Elias has already come. And saying we got diddly squat is laughable.

The single most important event of the restoration performed by Joseph Smith was the First Vision, which occurred without priesthood. The First Vision started it all. Then came Moroni (a continuation of the ministration of angels), again without Joseph having any priesthood. Then came the Urim and Thummim, the breastplate, and the plates of Mormon. Again, without Joseph having any priesthood. Then Joseph began his translation (ancient seership.) Without priesthood.

The priesthood is important, sure, but so are the gifts. Joseph possessed gifts of God, before ever getting baptized or receiving priesthood. I, myself, received my first 4 best spiritual gifts before I ever got baptized or received any priesthood. The fifth I got after my baptism, but before I got priesthood.

I do not think you have a proper understanding of what "the restoration of all things" entails if you think it's just child's play compared to the restoration of the priesthood performed by Joseph Smith. Everything Joseph did was in part. Nothing was done to completion. Did he receive all the keys? Nope. The keys of translation were never given, nor the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. Those latter keys are held by Gabriel. They were never transferred to Joseph Smith, because it wasn't Joseph's calling to bring to pass the restoration of all things. But the Elias who restores all things will get both the keys of translation and also the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. He gets all the keys. Why? Because he needs all the keys to get his job done and besides, the man has a right to them!

What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?

Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days. (D&C 113:5-6)

Look at the last verse of section 132. That revelation contained more information which was never given. Look at the Book of Abraham. Notice how it abruptly cuts off at the end. We never got the full account. The Joseph Scroll was never, ever translated, but was lost. Joseph Smith read it, but it wasn't given to the saints. Everything we've got is fragmented, partial, incomplete. It is enough to save and exalt us, provided that the Elias who restores all things comes forth.

The restoration of all things isn't "the restoration of the rest of the things." Elias will not take up where Joseph left off. No, Elias will restore "all things," re-doing all the things that Joseph Smith did imperfectly, but in a perfect manner. For all the work has to be perfectly done, which is impossible, as we are imperfect beings.

Neither can they nor we be made perfect without those who have died in the gospel also; for it is necessary in the ushering in of the dispensation of the fulness of times, which dispensation is now beginning to usher in, that a whole and complete and perfect union, and welding together of dispensations, and keys, and powers, and glories should take place, and be revealed from the days of Adam even to the present time. (D&C 128:18)

For an imperfect being to do something perfect, requires a gift Joseph Smith never had: the gift of the working of miracles. Thus, the Elias who restores all things will be a miracle-working seer, (re-doing and) doing all things perfectly.

Eliases have already come, it is true, but the Elias who restores all things has not, as yet, made a public appearance. He is alive, yes, and thus technically he "is here" on Earth, having already been born, but he is still in his weakness. When the Lord takes him out of his weakness and makes him strong, then you will see "the restoration of all things" that all the prophets prophesied about since the world began.

All prophecies cast shadows, or foreshadows, before their literal fulfillment. All prophetic sequences likewise cast prophetic foreshadow sequences, in which the foreshadow sequence attempts to silhouette the literal prophetic sequence as best it can. But given that shadows are mere silhouettes and can be sharp, or diffuse, and longer or shorter than the object casting the shadow, depending upon the placement of the light source, etc., all prophetic shadows are as great in difference to the literal fulfillment, as a 2-dimensional shadow is to the 3-dimensional person casting it. In other words, Joseph Smith's 3-fold restoration (of the priesthood, of the gospel and of the church) is, essentially, diddly-squat in comparison to the infinitely larger "restoration of all things," regardless of the fact that you find such a comparison laughable.

Nobody gets saved without the Elias who restores all things. Nobody (and also nothing.) Joseph Smith's restoration is useless to save even a single man unless Elias comes forth. Why? Because everyone must be linked, from beginning to end, before Christ comes back, and Joseph's restoration is powerless to do that. Joseph's restoration, then, does nothing, absolutely nothing for salvation. The salvation of man must be complete, from beginning to end, from Adam all the way to the end of man, before Christ comes back, otherwise not even one single soul can be saved and all of mankind must inevitably perish. Look at Joseph's own words:

Q. What are we to understand by the sounding of the trumpets, mentioned in the 8th chapter of Revelation?

A. We are to understand that as God made the world in six days, and on the seventh day he finished his work, and sanctified it, and also formed man out of the dust of the earth, even so, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years will the Lord God sanctify the earth, and complete the salvation of man, and judge all things, and shall redeem all things, except that which he hath not put into his power, when he shall have sealed all things, unto the end of all things; and the sounding of the trumpets of the seven angels are the preparing and finishing of his work, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years—the preparing of the way before the time of his coming. (D&C 77:12)

This verse is speaking of the ministry of the Elias who restores all things, not of Joseph Smith's ministry. Joseph Smith and Mormonism is nothing more than Elias's foreshadow, for all prophecies, as I have already said, generate foreshadows, and just as the foreshadow seeks to silhouette the prophetic sequence that generates it, so Joseph Smith and Mormonism follows, as best it can, the same sequence that Elias will follow, but without the same results. Thus, Joseph sought to establish Zion. And failed. And he failed to translate the whole Book of Mormon (which is missing 116 pages.) And he failed on many other points, too, just as Moses failed to get the tribes into the promised land, and so on and so forth for each of the servants of God. All prophets of ancient or modern date have failed. But none of that matters, because "the restoration of all things" prophesied by the prophets didn't refer to Joseph Smith or any of the others. It only referred to the Elias who restores all things. He, and he alone, is the one who pulls off the Great and Marvelous work. He is the one God uses to "complete the salvation of man" and "seal all things unto the end of all things." This man won't fail at anything.

Assuming you are LDS like myself, then I will say that we are living in Elias's foreshadow (Mormonism), and it is nothing more than that. Elias is powerful to save, and so his foreshadow is likewise powerful to save. But the two are not equivalent. One is a mere shadow that relies upon the other, while the other is the actual flesh and blood person that needs no shadow. Without Elias, the shadow is useless. Without the ministry of Elias, Mormonism does absolutely nothing. This is why Joseph said:

Therefore, dearly beloved brethren, let us cheerfully do all things that lie in our power; and then may we stand still, with the utmost assurance, to see the salvation of God, and for his arm to be revealed. (D&C 123:17)

The salvation of God and the revelation of God's arm is a reference to Elias and his ministry. We are to do all within our power, performing all the works God has commanded us to do, and then Elias comes forth and re-does them perfectly, plus all the rest we have no power to do. He must do all this work before Christ gets back, otherwise everything perishes. This is why Elias is called God's "salvation unto the end of the earth."

And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth. (Isaiah 49:6)

Beautifully written and you make fantastic points.

[Alaris]

The single most important event of the restoration performed by Joseph Smith was the First Vision, which occurred without priesthood. The First Vision started it all. Then came Moroni (a continuation of the ministration of angels), again without Joseph having any priesthood. Then came the Urim and Thummim, the breastplate, and the plates of Mormon. Again, without Joseph having any priesthood. Then Joseph began his translation (ancient seership.) Without priesthood.

Joseph Smith had already earned to right to be in the presence of the Father. The Melchizedek Priesthood, in my humble estimation, is without beginning of days or end of years because the sons of the morning had received it before a creation is started and will continue to have it throughout eternity.

Alma 13:7 This high priesthood being after the order of his Son, which order was from the foundation of the world; or in other words, being without beginning of days or end of years, being prepared from eternity to all eternity, according to his foreknowledge of all things—
8 Now they were ordained after this manner—being called with a holy calling, and ordained with a holy ordinance, and taking upon them the high priesthood of the holy order, which calling, and ordinance, and high priesthood, is without beginning or end—
9 Thus they become high priests forever, after the order of the Son, the Only Begotten of the Father, who is without beginning of days or end of years, who is full of grace, equity, and truth. And thus it is. Amen.

Everything Joseph did was in part. Nothing was done to completion. Did he receive all the keys? Nope. The keys of translation were never given, nor the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. Those latter keys are held by Gabriel. They were never transferred to Joseph Smith, because it wasn't Joseph's calling to bring to pass the restoration of all things. But the Elias who restores all things will get both the keys of translation and also the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. He gets all the keys. Why? Because he needs all the keys to get his job done and besides, the man has a right to them!

Well said. I believe Joseph Smith's role was actually to fail here - in my 7 levels model Joseph Smith is over the first estate and demonstrates to his order - like all dispensation heads do - how to overcome. He failed and his tasks will be eclipsed (see what I did there?) by a younger soul - the Davidic Servant. This is partly why prophets are always younger brothers - to demonstrate that light is not a right but earned. Joseph Smith demonstrates how to fail on many levels throughout his life and how to persist on. If anyone had justification to throw the stack of papers in the air and storm off it was Joseph Smith.

(Mormon version of the Friday / Monday meme)

What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?

Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days. (D&C 113:5-6)

Look at the last verse of section 132. That revelation contained more information which was never given. Look at the Book of Abraham. Notice how it abruptly cuts off at the end. We never got the full account. The Joseph Scroll was never, ever translated, but was lost. Joseph Smith read it, but it wasn't given to the saints. Everything we've got is fragmented, partial, incomplete. It is enough to save and exalt us, provided that the Elias who restores all things comes forth.

The restoration of all things isn't "the restoration of the rest of the things." Elias will not take up where Joseph left off. No, Elias will restore "all things," re-doing all the things that Joseph Smith did imperfectly, but in a perfect manner. For all the work has to be perfectly done, which is impossible, as we are imperfect beings.

This is an incredible perspective. I'll have to ponder on this.

Neither can they nor we be made perfect without those who have died in the gospel also; for it is necessary in the ushering in of the dispensation of the fulness of times, which dispensation is now beginning to usher in, that a whole and complete and perfect union, and welding together of dispensations, and keys, and powers, and glories should take place, and be revealed from the days of Adam even to the present time. (D&C 128:18)

For an imperfect being to do something perfect, requires a gift Joseph Smith never had: the gift of the working of miracles. Thus, the Elias who restores all things will be a miracle-working seer, (re-doing and) doing all things perfectly.

Eliases have already come, it is true, but the Elias who restores all things has not, as yet, made a public appearance. He is alive, yes, and thus technically he "is here" on Earth, having already been born, but he is still in his weakness. When the Lord takes him out of his weakness and makes him strong, then you will see "the restoration of all things" that all the prophets prophesied about since the world began.

Wow.

All prophecies cast shadows, or foreshadows, before their literal fulfillment. All prophetic sequences likewise cast prophetic foreshadow sequences, in which the foreshadow sequence attempts to silhouette the literal prophetic sequence as best it can. But given that shadows are mere silhouettes and can be sharp, or diffuse, and longer or shorter than the object casting the shadow, depending upon the placement of the light source, etc., all prophetic shadows are as great in difference to the literal fulfillment, as a 2-dimensional shadow is to the 3-dimensional person casting it.

I have discovered this as well as I uncover new layers - there are types everywhere foreshadowing things to come and serving as a type of things that have been (see my signature.)

Q. What are we to understand by the sounding of the trumpets, mentioned in the 8th chapter of Revelation?

A. We are to understand that as God made the world in six days, and on the seventh day he finished his work, and sanctified it, and also formed man out of the dust of the earth, even so, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years will the Lord God sanctify the earth, and complete the salvation of man, and judge all things, and shall redeem all things, except that which he hath not put into his power, when he shall have sealed all things, unto the end of all things; and the sounding of the trumpets of the seven angels are the preparing and finishing of his work, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years—the preparing of the way before the time of his coming. (D&C 77:12)

This verse is speaking of the ministry of the Elias who restores all things, not of Joseph Smith's ministry. Joseph Smith and Mormonism is nothing more than Elias's foreshadow, for all prophecies, as I have already said, generate foreshadows, and just as the foreshadow seeks to silhouette the prophetic sequence that generates it, so Joseph Smith and Mormonism follows, as best it can, the same sequence that Elias will follow, but without the same results. Thus, Joseph sought to establish Zion. And failed. And he failed to translate the whole Book of Mormon (which is missing 116 pages.) And he failed on many other points, too, just as Moses failed to get the tribes into the promised land, and so on and so forth for each of the servants of God. All prophets of ancient or modern date have failed. But none of that matters, because "the restoration of all things" prophesied by the prophets didn't refer to Joseph Smith or any of the others. It only referred to the Elias who restores all things. He, and he alone, is the one who pulls off the Great and Marvelous work. He is the one God uses to "complete the salvation of man" and "seal all things unto the end of all things." This man won't fail at anything.

I've expressed my intent elsewhere to write an article on this very thing - why failure was an essential part of Joseph Smith's ministry and why. Thank you for this.

Assuming you are LDS like myself, then I will say that we are living in Elias's foreshadow (Mormonism), and it is nothing more than that. Elias is powerful to save, and so his foreshadow is likewise powerful to save. But the two are not equivalent. One is a mere shadow that relies upon the other, while the other is the actual flesh and blood person that needs no shadow. Without Elias, the shadow is useless. Without the ministry of Elias, Mormonism does absolutely nothing. This is why Joseph said:

Therefore, dearly beloved brethren, let us cheerfully do all things that lie in our power; and then may we stand still, with the utmost assurance, to see the salvation of God, and for his arm to be revealed. (D&C 123:17)

Very interesting - Gileadi believes the arm of Jehovah in Isaiah is the Davidic Servant.

The salvation of God and the revelation of God's arm is a reference to Elias and his ministry. We are to do all within our power, performing all the works God has commanded us to do, and then Elias comes forth and re-does them perfectly, plus all the rest we have no power to do. He must do all this work before Christ gets back, otherwise everything perishes. This is why Elias is called God's "salvation unto the end of the earth."

And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth. (Isaiah 49:6)

I have wondered if the Elias referred to in the D&C Q&A of Revelation was John rather than the Davidic Servant. That said, the truths you shared are highly appreciated as I felt the spirit burn within me - particularly about the end times' servant restoring all things. Thank you.

[setyourselffree]

The restoration of the Priesthood was the single most important event. All of things you listed can't come forth without the Priesthood. Those things are child's play compared to the restoration of the Priesthood. The restoration has already happened. Elias has already come. And saying we got diddly squat is laughable.

The single most important event of the restoration performed by Joseph Smith was the First Vision, which occurred without priesthood. The First Vision started it all. Then came Moroni (a continuation of the ministration of angels), again without Joseph having any priesthood. Then came the Urim and Thummim, the breastplate, and the plates of Mormon. Again, without Joseph having any priesthood. Then Joseph began his translation (ancient seership.) Without priesthood.

The priesthood is important, sure, but so are the gifts. Joseph possessed gifts of God, before ever getting baptized or receiving priesthood. I, myself, received my first 4 best spiritual gifts before I ever got baptized or received any priesthood. The fifth I got after my baptism, but before I got priesthood.

I do not think you have a proper understanding of what "the restoration of all things" entails if you think it's just child's play compared to the restoration of the priesthood performed by Joseph Smith. Everything Joseph did was in part. Nothing was done to completion. Did he receive all the keys? Nope. The keys of translation were never given, nor the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. Those latter keys are held by Gabriel. They were never transferred to Joseph Smith, because it wasn't Joseph's calling to bring to pass the restoration of all things. But the Elias who restores all things will get both the keys of translation and also the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. He gets all the keys. Why? Because he needs all the keys to get his job done and besides, the man has a right to them!

What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?

Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days. (D&C 113:5-6)

Look at the last verse of section 132. That revelation contained more information which was never given. Look at the Book of Abraham. Notice how it abruptly cuts off at the end. We never got the full account. The Joseph Scroll was never, ever translated, but was lost. Joseph Smith read it, but it wasn't given to the saints. Everything we've got is fragmented, partial, incomplete. It is enough to save and exalt us, provided that the Elias who restores all things comes forth.

The restoration of all things isn't "the restoration of the rest of the things." Elias will not take up where Joseph left off. No, Elias will restore "all things," re-doing all the things that Joseph Smith did imperfectly, but in a perfect manner. For all the work has to be perfectly done, which is impossible, as we are imperfect beings.

Neither can they nor we be made perfect without those who have died in the gospel also; for it is necessary in the ushering in of the dispensation of the fulness of times, which dispensation is now beginning to usher in, that a whole and complete and perfect union, and welding together of dispensations, and keys, and powers, and glories should take place, and be revealed from the days of Adam even to the present time. (D&C 128:18)

For an imperfect being to do something perfect, requires a gift Joseph Smith never had: the gift of the working of miracles. Thus, the Elias who restores all things will be a miracle-working seer, (re-doing and) doing all things perfectly.

Eliases have already come, it is true, but the Elias who restores all things has not, as yet, made a public appearance. He is alive, yes, and thus technically he "is here" on Earth, having already been born, but he is still in his weakness. When the Lord takes him out of his weakness and makes him strong, then you will see "the restoration of all things" that all the prophets prophesied about since the world began.

All prophecies cast shadows, or foreshadows, before their literal fulfillment. All prophetic sequences likewise cast prophetic foreshadow sequences, in which the foreshadow sequence attempts to silhouette the literal prophetic sequence as best it can. But given that shadows are mere silhouettes and can be sharp, or diffuse, and longer or shorter than the object casting the shadow, depending upon the placement of the light source, etc., all prophetic shadows are as great in difference to the literal fulfillment, as a 2-dimensional shadow is to the 3-dimensional person casting it. In other words, Joseph Smith's 3-fold restoration (of the priesthood, of the gospel and of the church) is, essentially, diddly-squat in comparison to the infinitely larger "restoration of all things," regardless of the fact that you find such a comparison laughable.

Nobody gets saved without the Elias who restores all things. Nobody (and also nothing.) Joseph Smith's restoration is useless to save even a single man unless Elias comes forth. Why? Because everyone must be linked, from beginning to end, before Christ comes back, and Joseph's restoration is powerless to do that. Joseph's restoration, then, does nothing, absolutely nothing for salvation. The salvation of man must be complete, from beginning to end, from Adam all the way to the end of man, before Christ comes back, otherwise not even one single soul can be saved and all of mankind must inevitably perish. Look at Joseph's own words:

Q. What are we to understand by the sounding of the trumpets, mentioned in the 8th chapter of Revelation?

A. We are to understand that as God made the world in six days, and on the seventh day he finished his work, and sanctified it, and also formed man out of the dust of the earth, even so, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years will the Lord God sanctify the earth, and complete the salvation of man, and judge all things, and shall redeem all things, except that which he hath not put into his power, when he shall have sealed all things, unto the end of all things; and the sounding of the trumpets of the seven angels are the preparing and finishing of his work, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years—the preparing of the way before the time of his coming. (D&C 77:12)

This verse is speaking of the ministry of the Elias who restores all things, not of Joseph Smith's ministry. Joseph Smith and Mormonism is nothing more than Elias's foreshadow, for all prophecies, as I have already said, generate foreshadows, and just as the foreshadow seeks to silhouette the prophetic sequence that generates it, so Joseph Smith and Mormonism follows, as best it can, the same sequence that Elias will follow, but without the same results. Thus, Joseph sought to establish Zion. And failed. And he failed to translate the whole Book of Mormon (which is missing 116 pages.) And he failed on many other points, too, just as Moses failed to get the tribes into the promised land, and so on and so forth for each of the servants of God. All prophets of ancient or modern date have failed. But none of that matters, because "the restoration of all things" prophesied by the prophets didn't refer to Joseph Smith or any of the others. It only referred to the Elias who restores all things. He, and he alone, is the one who pulls off the Great and Marvelous work. He is the one God uses to "complete the salvation of man" and "seal all things unto the end of all things." This man won't fail at anything.

Assuming you are LDS like myself, then I will say that we are living in Elias's foreshadow (Mormonism), and it is nothing more than that. Elias is powerful to save, and so his foreshadow is likewise powerful to save. But the two are not equivalent. One is a mere shadow that relies upon the other, while the other is the actual flesh and blood person that needs no shadow. Without Elias, the shadow is useless. Without the ministry of Elias, Mormonism does absolutely nothing. This is why Joseph said:

Therefore, dearly beloved brethren, let us cheerfully do all things that lie in our power; and then may we stand still, with the utmost assurance, to see the salvation of God, and for his arm to be revealed. (D&C 123:17)

The salvation of God and the revelation of God's arm is a reference to Elias and his ministry. We are to do all within our power, performing all the works God has commanded us to do, and then Elias comes forth and re-does them perfectly, plus all the rest we have no power to do. He must do all this work before Christ gets back, otherwise everything perishes. This is why Elias is called God's "salvation unto the end of the earth."

And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth. (Isaiah 49:6)

Of course some other things will come forth. In regards to Elias it is a title given to people who prepare the way thus Joseph Smith could also be considered an Elias. As far as I know all things pertaining to salvation have already been restored. Me thinks you may be reading into some things that arent there. I dont think you are giving Joseph Smith enough credit of what he has accomplished. Maybe thats why you call yourself an anarchist? I appreciate you though.

[oxbloodangel]

I think of events like this eclipse as a trail marker, or a reminder of what is coming further along the path. Just as "all things denote there is a God", there are signs in the heavens and on the earth in our day pointing us back to God, either as comfort for the faithful or as a warning for the wicked to repent.

Yes, this! The Sunday before the Great American Solar Eclipse, we had a beautiful rainbow across the sky, then Monday we almost missed the eclipse because of the cloudy skies, but with eclipse glasses and the diffusion through the clouds, we still got to witness it. All day, though, at home or driving around under all that cloud cover, I felt this loving protection from Heavenly Father and Mother. I don't know if the cloudy skies represented that to anybody else, and it doesn't much matter to me if it did, but I am comforted by the signs. Good things are coming for those who wait on the Lord. Hard things, yes, but good things, too!

[Ezekiel]

The restoration of the Priesthood was the single most important event. All of things you listed can't come forth without the Priesthood. Those things are child's play compared to the restoration of the Priesthood. The restoration has already happened. Elias has already come. And saying we got diddly squat is laughable.

The single most important event of the restoration performed by Joseph Smith was the First Vision, which occurred without priesthood. The First Vision started it all. Then came Moroni (a continuation of the ministration of angels), again without Joseph having any priesthood. Then came the Urim and Thummim, the breastplate, and the plates of Mormon. Again, without Joseph having any priesthood. Then Joseph began his translation (ancient seership.) Without priesthood.

The priesthood is important, sure, but so are the gifts. Joseph possessed gifts of God, before ever getting baptized or receiving priesthood. I, myself, received my first 4 best spiritual gifts before I ever got baptized or received any priesthood. The fifth I got after my baptism, but before I got priesthood.

I do not think you have a proper understanding of what "the restoration of all things" entails if you think it's just child's play compared to the restoration of the priesthood performed by Joseph Smith. Everything Joseph did was in part. Nothing was done to completion. Did he receive all the keys? Nope. The keys of translation were never given, nor the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. Those latter keys are held by Gabriel. They were never transferred to Joseph Smith, because it wasn't Joseph's calling to bring to pass the restoration of all things. But the Elias who restores all things will get both the keys of translation and also the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. He gets all the keys. Why? Because he needs all the keys to get his job done and besides, the man has a right to them!

What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?

Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days. (D&C 113:5-6)

Look at the last verse of section 132. That revelation contained more information which was never given. Look at the Book of Abraham. Notice how it abruptly cuts off at the end. We never got the full account. The Joseph Scroll was never, ever translated, but was lost. Joseph Smith read it, but it wasn't given to the saints. Everything we've got is fragmented, partial, incomplete. It is enough to save and exalt us, provided that the Elias who restores all things comes forth.

The restoration of all things isn't "the restoration of the rest of the things." Elias will not take up where Joseph left off. No, Elias will restore "all things," re-doing all the things that Joseph Smith did imperfectly, but in a perfect manner. For all the work has to be perfectly done, which is impossible, as we are imperfect beings.

Neither can they nor we be made perfect without those who have died in the gospel also; for it is necessary in the ushering in of the dispensation of the fulness of times, which dispensation is now beginning to usher in, that a whole and complete and perfect union, and welding together of dispensations, and keys, and powers, and glories should take place, and be revealed from the days of Adam even to the present time. (D&C 128:18)

For an imperfect being to do something perfect, requires a gift Joseph Smith never had: the gift of the working of miracles. Thus, the Elias who restores all things will be a miracle-working seer, (re-doing and) doing all things perfectly.

Eliases have already come, it is true, but the Elias who restores all things has not, as yet, made a public appearance. He is alive, yes, and thus technically he "is here" on Earth, having already been born, but he is still in his weakness. When the Lord takes him out of his weakness and makes him strong, then you will see "the restoration of all things" that all the prophets prophesied about since the world began.

All prophecies cast shadows, or foreshadows, before their literal fulfillment. All prophetic sequences likewise cast prophetic foreshadow sequences, in which the foreshadow sequence attempts to silhouette the literal prophetic sequence as best it can. But given that shadows are mere silhouettes and can be sharp, or diffuse, and longer or shorter than the object casting the shadow, depending upon the placement of the light source, etc., all prophetic shadows are as great in difference to the literal fulfillment, as a 2-dimensional shadow is to the 3-dimensional person casting it. In other words, Joseph Smith's 3-fold restoration (of the priesthood, of the gospel and of the church) is, essentially, diddly-squat in comparison to the infinitely larger "restoration of all things," regardless of the fact that you find such a comparison laughable.

Nobody gets saved without the Elias who restores all things. Nobody (and also nothing.) Joseph Smith's restoration is useless to save even a single man unless Elias comes forth. Why? Because everyone must be linked, from beginning to end, before Christ comes back, and Joseph's restoration is powerless to do that. Joseph's restoration, then, does nothing, absolutely nothing for salvation. The salvation of man must be complete, from beginning to end, from Adam all the way to the end of man, before Christ comes back, otherwise not even one single soul can be saved and all of mankind must inevitably perish. Look at Joseph's own words:

Q. What are we to understand by the sounding of the trumpets, mentioned in the 8th chapter of Revelation?

A. We are to understand that as God made the world in six days, and on the seventh day he finished his work, and sanctified it, and also formed man out of the dust of the earth, even so, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years will the Lord God sanctify the earth, and complete the salvation of man, and judge all things, and shall redeem all things, except that which he hath not put into his power, when he shall have sealed all things, unto the end of all things; and the sounding of the trumpets of the seven angels are the preparing and finishing of his work, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years—the preparing of the way before the time of his coming. (D&C 77:12)

This verse is speaking of the ministry of the Elias who restores all things, not of Joseph Smith's ministry. Joseph Smith and Mormonism is nothing more than Elias's foreshadow, for all prophecies, as I have already said, generate foreshadows, and just as the foreshadow seeks to silhouette the prophetic sequence that generates it, so Joseph Smith and Mormonism follows, as best it can, the same sequence that Elias will follow, but without the same results. Thus, Joseph sought to establish Zion. And failed. And he failed to translate the whole Book of Mormon (which is missing 116 pages.) And he failed on many other points, too, just as Moses failed to get the tribes into the promised land, and so on and so forth for each of the servants of God. All prophets of ancient or modern date have failed. But none of that matters, because "the restoration of all things" prophesied by the prophets didn't refer to Joseph Smith or any of the others. It only referred to the Elias who restores all things. He, and he alone, is the one who pulls off the Great and Marvelous work. He is the one God uses to "complete the salvation of man" and "seal all things unto the end of all things." This man won't fail at anything.

Assuming you are LDS like myself, then I will say that we are living in Elias's foreshadow (Mormonism), and it is nothing more than that. Elias is powerful to save, and so his foreshadow is likewise powerful to save. But the two are not equivalent. One is a mere shadow that relies upon the other, while the other is the actual flesh and blood person that needs no shadow. Without Elias, the shadow is useless. Without the ministry of Elias, Mormonism does absolutely nothing. This is why Joseph said:

Therefore, dearly beloved brethren, let us cheerfully do all things that lie in our power; and then may we stand still, with the utmost assurance, to see the salvation of God, and for his arm to be revealed. (D&C 123:17)

The salvation of God and the revelation of God's arm is a reference to Elias and his ministry. We are to do all within our power, performing all the works God has commanded us to do, and then Elias comes forth and re-does them perfectly, plus all the rest we have no power to do. He must do all this work before Christ gets back, otherwise everything perishes. This is why Elias is called God's "salvation unto the end of the earth."

And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth. (Isaiah 49:6)

Of course some other things will come forth. In regards to Elias it is a title given to people who prepare the way thus Joseph Smith could also be considered an Elias. As far as I know all things pertaining to salvation have already been restored. Me thinks you may be reading into some things that arent there. I dont think you are giving Joseph Smith enough credit of what he has accomplished. Maybe thats why you call yourself an anarchist? I appreciate you though.

I can see your concern, however I wouldn't take what LDS Anarchist said as detracting from the work of Joseph Smith. Just because the Elias does all of these things doesn't make what Joseph did any less spectacular or incredible.

It's kind of when our Lord Jesus Christ came upon the land and did his awesome ministry. His work didn't detract from the amazing work Moses and the other prophets of old did in the Old Testament - it just swallowed it up and introduced in a higher law - thus replacing the law of Moses with the law of Christ.

I view it as a relay race. Each key figure in the different dispensations holds the baton and passes it to the next. At certain points the work and laws have to evolve and progress in order to get us closer and closer to perfection so the second coming of Jesus and the millennium can come forth.

Just things for all of us to ponder. Regardless, I'm sure the fullness of times will be insane and awesome at the same time.

[Alaris]

I think of events like this eclipse as a trail marker, or a reminder of what is coming further along the path. Just as "all things denote there is a God", there are signs in the heavens and on the earth in our day pointing us back to God, either as comfort for the faithful or as a warning for the wicked to repent.

Yes, this! The Sunday before the Great American Solar Eclipse, we had a beautiful rainbow across the sky, then Monday we almost missed the eclipse because of the cloudy skies, but with eclipse glasses and the diffusion through the clouds, we still got to witness it. All day, though, at home or driving around under all that cloud cover, I felt this loving protection from Heavenly Father and Mother. I don't know if the cloudy skies represented that to anybody else, and it doesn't much matter to me if it did, but I am comforted by the signs. Good things are coming for those who wait on the Lord. Hard things, yes, but good things, too!

Did you see the year with no rainbow thread on these forums?

[setyourselffree]

The restoration of the Priesthood was the single most important event. All of things you listed can't come forth without the Priesthood. Those things are child's play compared to the restoration of the Priesthood. The restoration has already happened. Elias has already come. And saying we got diddly squat is laughable.

The single most important event of the restoration performed by Joseph Smith was the First Vision, which occurred without priesthood. The First Vision started it all. Then came Moroni (a continuation of the ministration of angels), again without Joseph having any priesthood. Then came the Urim and Thummim, the breastplate, and the plates of Mormon. Again, without Joseph having any priesthood. Then Joseph began his translation (ancient seership.) Without priesthood.

The priesthood is important, sure, but so are the gifts. Joseph possessed gifts of God, before ever getting baptized or receiving priesthood. I, myself, received my first 4 best spiritual gifts before I ever got baptized or received any priesthood. The fifth I got after my baptism, but before I got priesthood.

I do not think you have a proper understanding of what "the restoration of all things" entails if you think it's just child's play compared to the restoration of the priesthood performed by Joseph Smith. Everything Joseph did was in part. Nothing was done to completion. Did he receive all the keys? Nope. The keys of translation were never given, nor the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. Those latter keys are held by Gabriel. They were never transferred to Joseph Smith, because it wasn't Joseph's calling to bring to pass the restoration of all things. But the Elias who restores all things will get both the keys of translation and also the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. He gets all the keys. Why? Because he needs all the keys to get his job done and besides, the man has a right to them!

What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?

Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days. (D&C 113:5-6)

Look at the last verse of section 132. That revelation contained more information which was never given. Look at the Book of Abraham. Notice how it abruptly cuts off at the end. We never got the full account. The Joseph Scroll was never, ever translated, but was lost. Joseph Smith read it, but it wasn't given to the saints. Everything we've got is fragmented, partial, incomplete. It is enough to save and exalt us, provided that the Elias who restores all things comes forth.

The restoration of all things isn't "the restoration of the rest of the things." Elias will not take up where Joseph left off. No, Elias will restore "all things," re-doing all the things that Joseph Smith did imperfectly, but in a perfect manner. For all the work has to be perfectly done, which is impossible, as we are imperfect beings.

Neither can they nor we be made perfect without those who have died in the gospel also; for it is necessary in the ushering in of the dispensation of the fulness of times, which dispensation is now beginning to usher in, that a whole and complete and perfect union, and welding together of dispensations, and keys, and powers, and glories should take place, and be revealed from the days of Adam even to the present time. (D&C 128:18)

For an imperfect being to do something perfect, requires a gift Joseph Smith never had: the gift of the working of miracles. Thus, the Elias who restores all things will be a miracle-working seer, (re-doing and) doing all things perfectly.

Eliases have already come, it is true, but the Elias who restores all things has not, as yet, made a public appearance. He is alive, yes, and thus technically he "is here" on Earth, having already been born, but he is still in his weakness. When the Lord takes him out of his weakness and makes him strong, then you will see "the restoration of all things" that all the prophets prophesied about since the world began.

All prophecies cast shadows, or foreshadows, before their literal fulfillment. All prophetic sequences likewise cast prophetic foreshadow sequences, in which the foreshadow sequence attempts to silhouette the literal prophetic sequence as best it can. But given that shadows are mere silhouettes and can be sharp, or diffuse, and longer or shorter than the object casting the shadow, depending upon the placement of the light source, etc., all prophetic shadows are as great in difference to the literal fulfillment, as a 2-dimensional shadow is to the 3-dimensional person casting it. In other words, Joseph Smith's 3-fold restoration (of the priesthood, of the gospel and of the church) is, essentially, diddly-squat in comparison to the infinitely larger "restoration of all things," regardless of the fact that you find such a comparison laughable.

Nobody gets saved without the Elias who restores all things. Nobody (and also nothing.) Joseph Smith's restoration is useless to save even a single man unless Elias comes forth. Why? Because everyone must be linked, from beginning to end, before Christ comes back, and Joseph's restoration is powerless to do that. Joseph's restoration, then, does nothing, absolutely nothing for salvation. The salvation of man must be complete, from beginning to end, from Adam all the way to the end of man, before Christ comes back, otherwise not even one single soul can be saved and all of mankind must inevitably perish. Look at Joseph's own words:

Q. What are we to understand by the sounding of the trumpets, mentioned in the 8th chapter of Revelation?

A. We are to understand that as God made the world in six days, and on the seventh day he finished his work, and sanctified it, and also formed man out of the dust of the earth, even so, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years will the Lord God sanctify the earth, and complete the salvation of man, and judge all things, and shall redeem all things, except that which he hath not put into his power, when he shall have sealed all things, unto the end of all things; and the sounding of the trumpets of the seven angels are the preparing and finishing of his work, in the beginning of the seventh thousand years—the preparing of the way before the time of his coming. (D&C 77:12)

This verse is speaking of the ministry of the Elias who restores all things, not of Joseph Smith's ministry. Joseph Smith and Mormonism is nothing more than Elias's foreshadow, for all prophecies, as I have already said, generate foreshadows, and just as the foreshadow seeks to silhouette the prophetic sequence that generates it, so Joseph Smith and Mormonism follows, as best it can, the same sequence that Elias will follow, but without the same results. Thus, Joseph sought to establish Zion. And failed. And he failed to translate the whole Book of Mormon (which is missing 116 pages.) And he failed on many other points, too, just as Moses failed to get the tribes into the promised land, and so on and so forth for each of the servants of God. All prophets of ancient or modern date have failed. But none of that matters, because "the restoration of all things" prophesied by the prophets didn't refer to Joseph Smith or any of the others. It only referred to the Elias who restores all things. He, and he alone, is the one who pulls off the Great and Marvelous work. He is the one God uses to "complete the salvation of man" and "seal all things unto the end of all things." This man won't fail at anything.

Assuming you are LDS like myself, then I will say that we are living in Elias's foreshadow (Mormonism), and it is nothing more than that. Elias is powerful to save, and so his foreshadow is likewise powerful to save. But the two are not equivalent. One is a mere shadow that relies upon the other, while the other is the actual flesh and blood person that needs no shadow. Without Elias, the shadow is useless. Without the ministry of Elias, Mormonism does absolutely nothing. This is why Joseph said:

Therefore, dearly beloved brethren, let us cheerfully do all things that lie in our power; and then may we stand still, with the utmost assurance, to see the salvation of God, and for his arm to be revealed. (D&C 123:17)

The salvation of God and the revelation of God's arm is a reference to Elias and his ministry. We are to do all within our power, performing all the works God has commanded us to do, and then Elias comes forth and re-does them perfectly, plus all the rest we have no power to do. He must do all this work before Christ gets back, otherwise everything perishes. This is why Elias is called God's "salvation unto the end of the earth."

And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth. (Isaiah 49:6)

Of course some other things will come forth. In regards to Elias it is a title given to people who prepare the way thus Joseph Smith could also be considered an Elias. As far as I know all things pertaining to salvation have already been restored. Me thinks you may be reading into some things that arent there. I dont think you are giving Joseph Smith enough credit of what he has accomplished. Maybe thats why you call yourself an anarchist? I appreciate you though.

I can see your concern, however I wouldn't take what LDS Anarchist said as detracting from the work of Joseph Smith. Just because the Elias does all of these things doesn't make what Joseph did any less spectacular or incredible.

It's kind of when our Lord Jesus Christ came upon the land and did his awesome ministry. His work didn't detract from the amazing work Moses and the other prophets of old did in the Old Testament - it just swallowed it up and introduced in a higher law - thus replacing the law of Moses with the law of Christ.

I view it as a relay race. Each key figure in the different dispensations holds the baton and passes it to the next. At certain points the work and laws have to evolve and progress in order to get us closer and closer to perfection so the second coming of Jesus and the millennium can come forth.

Just things for all of us to ponder. Regardless, I'm sure the fullness of times will be insane and awesome at the same time.

I don't claim to be an expert on the gospel. But the fact of the matter is I've never heard we weren't in the fullness of times or that the restoration of all things has not already happened. Do you have an ensign article or conference address to show me? Otherwise I'm just going to chalk it up to anarchists opinion. Which not knowing the guy doesn't mean that much to me.

[gardener4life]

No, no, no. The solar eclipse is not a sign of anything. It''s just an eclipse. The planets lining up this way and that are not signs, either. The wonders to be seen in the heavens, spoken of in the scriptures, concern the end times. We are not in the end times. These heavenly wonders and signs have nothing, whatsoever, to do with normal things like eclipses and the normal movement of planets. They have nothing to do with normal planetary alignments, either. So, this planet and that planet are aligned. Big deal. It means absolutely nothing.

When the real signs start happening in the heavens, they will be big things, unusual things, like the planets moving out of their places and coming closer to earth and to each other, so that instead of tiny specks in the sky, they will be great big imposing spheres, terrifying orbs, with rings and dust and lightning and interplanetary lightning and so on. They will be huge comets coming into the solar system, causing a re-arrangement of things, of the planets and moons and asteroids and so forth. The sky will become like a huge stage with all the celestial objects acting out things which, in appearance, look like things on earth or in fictional stories (like dragons, etc.) and none of this stuff will be tiny dots in the sky, but terrifyingly close, so that we see all the colors and interactions between these heavenly bodies in great detail. No telescope needed.

But none of this end times heavenly stuff starts without Elias. So, everybody can just chill. Elias hasn't stood up, yet. No Elias, no heavenly signs. That's how it works. Remember the key the scribes and Jesus both gave about Elias:

And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must FIRST come?

And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall FIRST come, and restore all things. (Matthew 17:10-11)

Elias still hasn't made his presence known and the restoration of all things still hasn't begun. Remember, the restoration of all things is yet future to us:

Therefore, thus saith the Lord unto you, with whom the priesthood hath continued through the lineage of your fathers—for ye are lawful heirs, according to the flesh, and have been hid from the world with Christ in God—therefore your life and the priesthood have remained, and must needs remain through you and your lineage UNTIL the restoration of all things spoken by the mouths of all the holy prophets since the world began. (D&C 86:8-10)

We are certainly in the last days. We have wars and rumors of wars, immense evil and violence, almost daily deadly terror attacks across the globe, whoredoms, pornography at every turn, etc.

When the star of Bethlehem appeared to mark the birth of our Savior Jesus Christ, not many knew its significance at the time. Now this could just be any old random eclipse. However there are so many coincidences with it; especially how it lines up with fall feast timelines, etc., there may be more to it. It may be a sign of things to come perhaps. Just speculation and things to ponder.

This was a really interesting quote! Thanks! Also one line you said stood out to me so I thought I would add to it positively. You said, almost daily terror attacks. You would be surprised and shocked how many there are! Less than half of them hit mainstream news. check this out to see. We currently are actually averaging anywhere from 4 to 6 PER day. And it's actually been on this kind of pattern for years. People really don't see how many we have because of biased media.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... ts_in_2017
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... ugust_2017

[Ezekiel]

The single most important event of the restoration performed by Joseph Smith was the First Vision, which occurred without priesthood. The First Vision started it all. Then came Moroni (a continuation of the ministration of angels), again without Joseph having any priesthood. Then came the Urim and Thummim, the breastplate, and the plates of Mormon. Again, without Joseph having any priesthood. Then Joseph began his translation (ancient seership.) Without priesthood.

The priesthood is important, sure, but so are the gifts. Joseph possessed gifts of God, before ever getting baptized or receiving priesthood. I, myself, received my first 4 best spiritual gifts before I ever got baptized or received any priesthood. The fifth I got after my baptism, but before I got priesthood.

I do not think you have a proper understanding of what "the restoration of all things" entails if you think it's just child's play compared to the restoration of the priesthood performed by Joseph Smith. Everything Joseph did was in part. Nothing was done to completion. Did he receive all the keys? Nope. The keys of translation were never given, nor the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. Those latter keys are held by Gabriel. They were never transferred to Joseph Smith, because it wasn't Joseph's calling to bring to pass the restoration of all things. But the Elias who restores all things will get both the keys of translation and also the keys of bringing to pass the restoration of all things. He gets all the keys. Why? Because he needs all the keys to get his job done and besides, the man has a right to them!



Look at the last verse of section 132. That revelation contained more information which was never given. Look at the Book of Abraham. Notice how it abruptly cuts off at the end. We never got the full account. The Joseph Scroll was never, ever translated, but was lost. Joseph Smith read it, but it wasn't given to the saints. Everything we've got is fragmented, partial, incomplete. It is enough to save and exalt us, provided that the Elias who restores all things comes forth.

The restoration of all things isn't "the restoration of the rest of the things." Elias will not take up where Joseph left off. No, Elias will restore "all things," re-doing all the things that Joseph Smith did imperfectly, but in a perfect manner. For all the work has to be perfectly done, which is impossible, as we are imperfect beings.



For an imperfect being to do something perfect, requires a gift Joseph Smith never had: the gift of the working of miracles. Thus, the Elias who restores all things will be a miracle-working seer, (re-doing and) doing all things perfectly.

Eliases have already come, it is true, but the Elias who restores all things has not, as yet, made a public appearance. He is alive, yes, and thus technically he "is here" on Earth, having already been born, but he is still in his weakness. When the Lord takes him out of his weakness and makes him strong, then you will see "the restoration of all things" that all the prophets prophesied about since the world began.

All prophecies cast shadows, or foreshadows, before their literal fulfillment. All prophetic sequences likewise cast prophetic foreshadow sequences, in which the foreshadow sequence attempts to silhouette the literal prophetic sequence as best it can. But given that shadows are mere silhouettes and can be sharp, or diffuse, and longer or shorter than the object casting the shadow, depending upon the placement of the light source, etc., all prophetic shadows are as great in difference to the literal fulfillment, as a 2-dimensional shadow is to the 3-dimensional person casting it. In other words, Joseph Smith's 3-fold restoration (of the priesthood, of the gospel and of the church) is, essentially, diddly-squat in comparison to the infinitely larger "restoration of all things," regardless of the fact that you find such a comparison laughable.

Nobody gets saved without the Elias who restores all things. Nobody (and also nothing.) Joseph Smith's restoration is useless to save even a single man unless Elias comes forth. Why? Because everyone must be linked, from beginning to end, before Christ comes back, and Joseph's restoration is powerless to do that. Joseph's restoration, then, does nothing, absolutely nothing for salvation. The salvation of man must be complete, from beginning to end, from Adam all the way to the end of man, before Christ comes back, otherwise not even one single soul can be saved and all of mankind must inevitably perish. Look at Joseph's own words:



This verse is speaking of the ministry of the Elias who restores all things, not of Joseph Smith's ministry. Joseph Smith and Mormonism is nothing more than Elias's foreshadow, for all prophecies, as I have already said, generate foreshadows, and just as the foreshadow seeks to silhouette the prophetic sequence that generates it, so Joseph Smith and Mormonism follows, as best it can, the same sequence that Elias will follow, but without the same results. Thus, Joseph sought to establish Zion. And failed. And he failed to translate the whole Book of Mormon (which is missing 116 pages.) And he failed on many other points, too, just as Moses failed to get the tribes into the promised land, and so on and so forth for each of the servants of God. All prophets of ancient or modern date have failed. But none of that matters, because "the restoration of all things" prophesied by the prophets didn't refer to Joseph Smith or any of the others. It only referred to the Elias who restores all things. He, and he alone, is the one who pulls off the Great and Marvelous work. He is the one God uses to "complete the salvation of man" and "seal all things unto the end of all things." This man won't fail at anything.

Assuming you are LDS like myself, then I will say that we are living in Elias's foreshadow (Mormonism), and it is nothing more than that. Elias is powerful to save, and so his foreshadow is likewise powerful to save. But the two are not equivalent. One is a mere shadow that relies upon the other, while the other is the actual flesh and blood person that needs no shadow. Without Elias, the shadow is useless. Without the ministry of Elias, Mormonism does absolutely nothing. This is why Joseph said:



The salvation of God and the revelation of God's arm is a reference to Elias and his ministry. We are to do all within our power, performing all the works God has commanded us to do, and then Elias comes forth and re-does them perfectly, plus all the rest we have no power to do. He must do all this work before Christ gets back, otherwise everything perishes. This is why Elias is called God's "salvation unto the end of the earth."

Of course some other things will come forth. In regards to Elias it is a title given to people who prepare the way thus Joseph Smith could also be considered an Elias. As far as I know all things pertaining to salvation have already been restored. Me thinks you may be reading into some things that arent there. I dont think you are giving Joseph Smith enough credit of what he has accomplished. Maybe thats why you call yourself an anarchist? I appreciate you though.

I can see your concern, however I wouldn't take what LDS Anarchist said as detracting from the work of Joseph Smith. Just because the Elias does all of these things doesn't make what Joseph did any less spectacular or incredible.

It's kind of when our Lord Jesus Christ came upon the land and did his awesome ministry. His work didn't detract from the amazing work Moses and the other prophets of old did in the Old Testament - it just swallowed it up and introduced in a higher law - thus replacing the law of Moses with the law of Christ.

I view it as a relay race. Each key figure in the different dispensations holds the baton and passes it to the next. At certain points the work and laws have to evolve and progress in order to get us closer and closer to perfection so the second coming of Jesus and the millennium can come forth.

Just things for all of us to ponder. Regardless, I'm sure the fullness of times will be insane and awesome at the same time.

I don't claim to be an expert on the gospel. But the fact of the matter is I've never heard we weren't in the fullness of times or that the restoration of all things has not already happened. Do you have an ensign article or conference address to show me? Otherwise I'm just going to chalk it up to anarchists opinion. Which not knowing the guy doesn't mean that much to me.

To me the restoration of all things means just that - all things. 12 tribes haven't been restored yet, neither has the sealed part of the Book of Mormon been translated and revealed yet. Those are just two examples; there is still much to do.

[setyourselffree]

Of course some other things will come forth. In regards to Elias it is a title given to people who prepare the way thus Joseph Smith could also be considered an Elias. As far as I know all things pertaining to salvation have already been restored. Me thinks you may be reading into some things that arent there. I dont think you are giving Joseph Smith enough credit of what he has accomplished. Maybe thats why you call yourself an anarchist? I appreciate you though.

I can see your concern, however I wouldn't take what LDS Anarchist said as detracting from the work of Joseph Smith. Just because the Elias does all of these things doesn't make what Joseph did any less spectacular or incredible.

It's kind of when our Lord Jesus Christ came upon the land and did his awesome ministry. His work didn't detract from the amazing work Moses and the other prophets of old did in the Old Testament - it just swallowed it up and introduced in a higher law - thus replacing the law of Moses with the law of Christ.

I view it as a relay race. Each key figure in the different dispensations holds the baton and passes it to the next. At certain points the work and laws have to evolve and progress in order to get us closer and closer to perfection so the second coming of Jesus and the millennium can come forth.

Just things for all of us to ponder. Regardless, I'm sure the fullness of times will be insane and awesome at the same time.

I don't claim to be an expert on the gospel. But the fact of the matter is I've never heard we weren't in the fullness of times or that the restoration of all things has not already happened. Do you have an ensign article or conference address to show me? Otherwise I'm just going to chalk it up to anarchists opinion. Which not knowing the guy doesn't mean that much to me.

To me the restoration of all things means just that - all things. 12 tribes haven't been restored yet, neither has the sealed part of the Book of Mormon been translated and revealed yet. Those are just two examples; there is still much to do.

Non of the things you mentioned are pertinent to my salvation. All of the saving ordinances are in place and that is most important. I'm not saying the things you mentioned aren't important because they have to happen before the second coming. But Anarchist was implying that those type of things you mentioned are more important than the things Joseph Smith restored. That is where I differ from him.

[CMajor]

Eclipse is NOT a sign of preparation.

August 21, 2017 is the first day of "Teshuva" which means: "To Repent" "To Return" And begins 40 days of repentence. 32-33 days later is the Rev. 12 Sign of the birth of the Man-Child. Jupiter and Venus are close enough together to form a "New Star"

The Eclipse is the start of a 7 year period known as the "Tribulation" From eclipse 2017 to eclipse 2024. Or in other words, the cleansing of the earth.

[CMajor]

The sign of an eclipse or black sun has always been a bad omen.

For example in 1979 the path of a total eclipse passed over Mt St. Helens, the following year, 1980, Mt St. Helens erupted.
In 1918. America was drawn into World War I, and my Grandfather's brother died with thousands of others from the Spanish Flu.

The eclipse we've just experienced crossed over 4 major FAULT lines. Did you feel the spirit speaking to you when you read the previous line?
The eclipse does not cause earthquakes, it is only symbolic.

Do you see a need for repentence?

And throw Planet X, into the mix. The Elites believe this planet or comet will clip the earth or come close enough that the debris field of meteorites will bombard the earth in a BIG way. They have spent trillions of dollars of our tax money building bunkers deep in the ground. The Lord is using this comet or planet for his purposes in cleansing the earth. Course we're on the surface, and hoping to be standing in 'holy places' to avoid certain death. And those un-repentent hiding in the earth will not survive the FIRE that burns the whole earth, while the righteous are caught up into heaven.

Some of us won't make it through in the flesh, and may become spiritual helpers instead. No matter, all is well.

It depends on what your righteous desires are, and how close of a relationship you have with Jesus, that will factor into where you fit in the grand sceme of things. The CLOCK is now ticking, the TIME is NOW. Return to Christ, Repent and love your fellow Christians, regardless of their particular brand of Christianity.

After the riots in Charlottesville, our President did say, "We need to love one another" ever hear that before from the sitting President?

The ride we're having is going to get 'bumpy' let us stop bickering with one another, we don't have time to major in the minor aspects of life. Jesus needs each of us to return to him, and lend a helping hand to others.

I testify that the Lord Jesus Christ lives, and loves us. His atonement is the greatest gift to mankind. The coming earthquakes, floods, fires are for those who choose not to repent. Mother earth needs to cleanse herself. Stand to Holy Places, knowing that if you die tomorrow, you will be in good hands. Amen.

[FTC]

Ah the prophecy police. How I missed you guys.

I'm totally Ok with adding troll to my self-appointed prophetic calling. Previously, I was just a budding counter-prophet. Now, I shall be entitled as Trolling Counter Prophet!!!!!!!! *OMINOUS MUSIC*

The thing is, regardless of whatever title is placed upon me, the FACT still remains that I (counter-)prophesy better than ALL of the other "prophets", dreams, predictionists, supposers, guessers, near death experiencers, spirit visitations, out of body experiencers, that infest this site. Combined. ALL of my counter prophecies have come true. Every. Single. One. Of them. Granted, I have only made a little over a dozen or so (with a few yet to come), but, still, facts - mine have all come true. And I even date stamp my prophecies. I've actually taken up a personal policy that I don't prophesy without a date stamp. As I've ponderized upon my self-appointed prophet-seer-ship, I think I'm just at the beginning phases. I'm thinking that this just must be the line-upon-line process of becoming a Master Prophet

And here we all are. Yet again!! With another "prophecy" that didn't come true. Nothing. Not. One. Single. Thing. end of world, second coming, earth starting the process of transfiguration, happened. Alright, fine. I didn't specifically say I prophesied it, but its close enough to count.
With the hurricanes, and the earthquakes in Idaho, and the fires in the Pacific Northwest, I prophesy that they won't be any initiator of anything second coming ish at all. Sure, its a little late because they're mostly past, which makes for a very weak prophecy when done after the fact, but I prophesy nothing will become of it.

By the numbers, you should be seeking my counsel, before anybody else around this place, when it comes to prophecies.

Worlds without end.

[FTC]

Oh. And while we're at it. The next eclipse that's going to cross the US, and leave a little x-marks-the-spot nearby Adam-Ondi-Ahman with this most recent eclipse's path. Nothing. Absolutely nothing.

There. Now I have a date stamped prophecy several years out. Bookmark this thread.

[Alaris]

All the hurricanes ... and fires ... nothing? Doubling down eh. You realize the hurricanes and the fires are concrete evidences that provide far more evidence that 8/21 was a sign rather than it being a "nothing."

The spirit in which you engage is obvious. You are saying that you know a celestial event isn't a sign which is a negative. In order to prove a negative you must either A: Know the mind of God on this specific matter or B: Be full of it. I guess C. Antagonizing in hopes of generating a negative interaction is also a possib...probability. Saying nothing will happen IS a prophecy. Saying something means nothing is beyond presumptuous as you presume to know the mind of God on the matter.

Isaiah 55:8 ¶ For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

The X marks the spot near Independence means nothing too? Again you have to know the mind of God or be God himself to declare these as "not signs from God." This is why attaching pride to positions is folly. Your choices become:

A. double down
B. realize it's time to eat all your words, open your mind, swallow your pride

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_5dE81WV8k

It's not too late to jump off the Prophecy Troll Train - others are already disembarking. The PTT certainly isn't saving anyone and only fosters a spirit of fear for those to post their feelings, thoughts, and beliefs as to what is coming.

[FTC]

I do know the mind of God. God cleanses His vineyard. Figuratively, He does that by hewing down the branches that do not produce good fruit and casting them out. (see Jacob 5) I also know the mind of God in that he is a God of truth, and desires all truth to be circumscribed into one whole.
Every single "prophet" in here (and even others out in my real-life), that has tried to declare end-of-world stuff, has produced bad fruit. Because none of their prophecies have been truthful. In contrast, all my prophecies have come true. Its just that you, and all the rest of the fearmongers, don't like that. :YMTONGUE: Because it ruins your chance to puff yourself up in your pride of being the Road Warrior of some delusional end of world hero fantasy.
What this all boils down to is that, as a counter-prophet, I'm on the Lord's errand. I'm His servant. (*) O:-) (*) Good, I'm glad that I ridicule and demean those that throw out spurious prophecies. As a counter-prophet, I'm serving the Lord by helping Him to cleanse his vineyard of all the bad prophecy fruit. I feel pretty darn good about that!! :ymapplause:

Its been a while, so I better make one of these for reference:

FTC's successful prophecy count = 14
Doom and gloom end-of-worlders' = 0

I really do want to say that I've had 15 successful ones, but I'm feeling in somewhat of a less than megalomaniac mood.
Ok, that moment has passed. Now I'll get in 15. That little 9/23 "prophecy". Yea, it'll make Wikipedia's failed apocalyptic events list, too.

Worlds without see ya in two weeks! :))

[FTC]

ALL of my counter prophecies have come true.

Lol. I'd love for you to counter-prophesy me! But all my prophecies take years to be fulfilled, so we'll have some time to wait to see which of us got it right (me, of course) and which of us got it wrong (you, of course.) But don't let my confidence intimidate you. Counter prophesy me in something, and we'll have a go at it.

What are the timestamps for the occurrence (at least the starting time) of your future prophecies? Not much of a useful prophet if all you got is "imminent". I'm already one-up on you because I got what it takes to timestamp my prophecies.

Currently, my farthest out prophecies are 12/23/2020 and April 9, 2024. I'm sure I'll make more along that way that will also come true.

[Alaris]

I do know the mind of God. God cleanses His vineyard. Figuratively, He does that by hewing down the branches that do not produce good fruit and casting them out. (see Jacob 5) I also know the mind of God in that he is a God of truth, and desires all truth to be circumscribed into one whole.
Every single "prophet" in here (and even others out in my real-life), that has tried to declare end-of-world stuff, has produced bad fruit. Because none of their prophecies have been truthful. In contrast, all my prophecies have come true. Its just that you, and all the rest of the fearmongers, don't like that. :YMTONGUE: Because it ruins your chance to puff yourself up in your pride of being the Road Warrior of some delusional end of world hero fantasy.
What this all boils down to is that, as a counter-prophet, I'm on the Lord's errand. I'm His servant. (*) O:-) (*) Good, I'm glad that I ridicule and demean those that throw out spurious prophecies. As a counter-prophet, I'm serving the Lord by helping Him to cleanse his vineyard of all the bad prophecy fruit. I feel pretty darn good about that!! :ymapplause:

Its been a while, so I better make one of these for reference:

FTC's successful prophecy count = 14
Doom and gloom end-of-worlders' = 0

I really do want to say that I've had 15 successful ones, but I'm feeling in somewhat of a less than megalomaniac mood.
Ok, that moment has passed. Now I'll get in 15. That little 9/23 "prophecy". Yea, it'll make Wikipedia's failed apocalyptic events list, too.

Worlds without see ya in two weeks! :))

Now I'm certain of the spirit you have listed to obey. The only fearmongering is from you trying to frighten people from sharing their personal beliefs, their predictions, and yes ... even their prophecies. You are saving no one by trying to mock and shut people down. You accuse me of pride, yet all the self praise is only to be found in that self same post that contains that very accusation.

I can prove you are wrong about 9/23 being "nothing."

1 Nephi 15:8 And I said unto them: Have ye inquired of the Lord?

Have you inquired of the Lord on 9/23 FTC? Answer this question honestly and the proof will be here for all to see. Here are your choices:

1. Answer honestly and admit you have not
2. Answer honestly and admit you have though you have not received an answer
3. Lie and pretend you have and received an answer that 9/23 is just another day

I know these are the only options available because if you had prayed, you would either be awaiting the answer or you would have received the same answer from the same Spirit of Truth that has spoken to me my friend. It's not too late to change course FTC. Pride will not take you where you need to be to stand in safe places. Trolling people while pretending it's somehow the Lord's work is truly reprehensible.

[Alaris]

What are the timestamps for the occurrence (at least the starting time) of your future prophecies? Not much of a useful prophet if all you got is "imminent". I'm already one-up on you because I got what it takes to timestamp my prophecies.

Currently, my farthest out prophecies are 12/23/2020 and April 9, 2024. I'm sure I'll make more along that way that will also come true.

Oh, this is fun. Well, the only date I have is 11 April 2033. That's the date the sixth thousand years ends and the seventh thousand years begins. So, we've got awhile to wait... I can say that the Elias who restores all things will stand up before that date and will translate all the records, up to and including the first six sealed portions of the book that is sealed with seven seals. After that date he will translate the seventh portion. Before that date he will also do a lot of other things, but I got no dates on any of this stuff, other than "before or after this date," so it's kind of hard.

What is not supposed to happen on 12/23/2020 and April 9, 2024? Maybe I can prophesy about those things. (And then you can counter-prophesy me.) Given that those dates are a bit sooner than the 2033 date.

What's not supposed to happen? lol

[FTC]

I do know the mind of God. God cleanses His vineyard. Figuratively, He does that by hewing down the branches that do not produce good fruit and casting them out. (see Jacob 5) I also know the mind of God in that he is a God of truth, and desires all truth to be circumscribed into one whole.
Every single "prophet" in here (and even others out in my real-life), that has tried to declare end-of-world stuff, has produced bad fruit. Because none of their prophecies have been truthful. In contrast, all my prophecies have come true. Its just that you, and all the rest of the fearmongers, don't like that. :YMTONGUE: Because it ruins your chance to puff yourself up in your pride of being the Road Warrior of some delusional end of world hero fantasy.
What this all boils down to is that, as a counter-prophet, I'm on the Lord's errand. I'm His servant. (*) O:-) (*) Good, I'm glad that I ridicule and demean those that throw out spurious prophecies. As a counter-prophet, I'm serving the Lord by helping Him to cleanse his vineyard of all the bad prophecy fruit. I feel pretty darn good about that!! :ymapplause:

Its been a while, so I better make one of these for reference:

FTC's successful prophecy count = 14
Doom and gloom end-of-worlders' = 0

I really do want to say that I've had 15 successful ones, but I'm feeling in somewhat of a less than megalomaniac mood.
Ok, that moment has passed. Now I'll get in 15. That little 9/23 "prophecy". Yea, it'll make Wikipedia's failed apocalyptic events list, too.

Worlds without see ya in two weeks! :))

Now I'm certain of the spirit you have listed to obey. The only fearmongering is from you trying to frighten people from sharing their personal beliefs, their predictions, and yes ... even their prophecies. You are saving no one by trying to mock and shut people down. You accuse me of pride, yet all the self praise is only to be found in that self same post that contains that very accusation.

I can prove you are wrong about 9/23 being "nothing."

1 Nephi 15:8 And I said unto them: Have ye inquired of the Lord?

Have you inquired of the Lord on 9/23 FTC? Answer this question honestly and the proof will be here for all to see. Here are your choices:

1. Answer honestly and admit you have not
2. Answer honestly and admit you have though you have not received an answer
3. Lie and pretend you have and received an answer that 9/23 is just another day

I know these are the only options available because if you had prayed, you would either be awaiting the answer or you would have received the same answer from the same Spirit of Truth that has spoken to me my friend. It's not too late to change course FTC. Pride will not take you where you need to be to stand in safe places. Trolling people while pretending it's somehow the Lord's work is truly reprehensible.

Oh, I most certainly prayed. And I did receive answer!!!! Now, I didn't do a 24 hour prayer, like Enos did, but a 5 hour answer makes up for it. The answer fits perfectly for what I think everytime someone makes an end of world prediction, especially 9/23. Looking forward to #15!

[Alaris]

.

[Spaced_Out]

Eclipse is NOT a sign of preparation.

August 21, 2017 is the first day of "Teshuva" which means: "To Repent" "To Return" And begins 40 days of repentence. 32-33 days later is the Rev. 12 Sign of the birth of the Man-Child. Jupiter and Venus are close enough together to form a "New Star"

The Eclipse is the start of a 7 year period known as the "Tribulation" From eclipse 2017 to eclipse 2024. Or in other words, the cleansing of the earth.

Yip totally agree, I have been predicting an economic disaster by Nov 2017 or 2018 at the latest, as time shortens we are seeing all the things happening. Hurricane, bush fires California, NKorea escalating problems, and there is lots of very scary problems with the economy that are coming to a head.
650k mandatory evacuation is not nothing happening, the same with Huston, also many areas will be uninhabitable after the hurricane has past. I don;t think that that any on the islands that suffered 95% of all infrastructure destroyed are saying nothing has happened. Hurricane Irma is breaking records for size and length of time that a cat 5 has been sustained. There is a large CME on the way as well.

There will be no call out this is only the start....

"Greatest Evacuation In History" - 650,000 Ordered To Leave Florida
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-09-0 ... ve-florida

[BeNotDeceived]

Eclipse is NOT a sign of preparation.

August 21, 2017 is the first day of "Teshuva" which means: "To Repent" "To Return" And begins 40 days of repentence. 32-33 days later is the Rev. 12 Sign of the birth of the Man-Child. Jupiter and Venus are close enough together to form a "New Star"

The Eclipse is the start of a 7 year period known as the "Tribulation" From eclipse 2017 to eclipse 2024. Or in other words, the cleansing of the earth.

I agree it marks a 7 year period, but 8/21/17 to 4/8/2024 is far short of seven years. April 2017 to April 2024 is President Trumps effection 'till selection of a successor begins. Two-term presidents serve 8 years, but really their administrations are only at full effect for 7. First comes seven years of prosperity is the biblical pattern upon which was postulated this timeframe as it also matches 2000 years as per the Parable of the Good Samaritan. I made some threads and many posts about this many months before having any knowledge of the two eclipses that match time wise.

Now Irma is precisely on course to devastate the one location for the mainland US where OTEC is feasible. Seems hurricanes could of been neutralized beginning about 60 years ago IAW Genesis 1:28. How many times have we missed the import of "and subdue it"? LDSFF is where I first felt the weight of those words. Reminds me of Did You Get the Right Message, another of my favorite GC talks, from which I chose my avatar. How many commas am I lacking. :-\ #-o

The first eclipse marks when prosperity may be known to have begun as defined over a series of posts on this forum. The second stroke of the X marks the conclusion of prosperity and portends seven years of a different sort, subject to merciful intervention.