Something big brewing?

[brlenox]

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. God told us what to eat in 1833. About eating animal flesh, He said this:

And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used

This is my religion, our religion. Mormons are experiencing the same health issues as the rest of Americans because we aren't following the Word of Wisdom.

My posts are very mild. I haven't gone a jihad about the torture and killing of animals, yet that is exactly what is going on. I'm not even trying to sell a MLM opportunity.

Just eat your starches, vegetables, and fruits. Take it easy on the nuts, seeds, and stay away from oil, you don't need it either.

The verse before the verse you cherry picked:

D & C 89:12

12 Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;

That meat has been ordained for the use of man, should preclude any instruction which forbids its consumption. I don't know if it is because your answers are just being glib and you are not explaining yourself well, but your council is wrong on too many fronts. Your oil statement above is so far off as to make reason stare. Stay away from man altered oils sure, but you sound much more exclusionary than just that. So if you are going to follow the word of wisdom, an extremist perspective which denies that meat is ordained for man within bounds is not following the word of wisdom but is only one more manner in which individuals worship a God created after their own image. Foolishness at best.

[Arenera]

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. God told us what to eat in 1833. About eating animal flesh, He said this:

And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used

This is my religion, our religion. Mormons are experiencing the same health issues as the rest of Americans because we aren't following the Word of Wisdom.

My posts are very mild. I haven't gone a jihad about the torture and killing of animals, yet that is exactly what is going on. I'm not even trying to sell a MLM opportunity.

Just eat your starches, vegetables, and fruits. Take it easy on the nuts, seeds, and stay away from oil, you don't need it either.

The verse before the verse you cherry picked:

D & C 89:12

12 Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;

That meat has been ordained for the use of man, should preclude any instruction which forbids its consumption. I don't know if it is because your answers are just being glib and you are not explaining yourself well, but your council is wrong on too many fronts. Your oil statement above is so far off as to make reason stare. Stay away from man altered oils sure, but you sound much more exclusionary than just that. So if you are going to follow the word of wisdom, an extremist perspective which denies that meat is ordained for man within bounds is not following the word of wisdom but is only one more manner in which individuals worship a God created after their own image. Foolishness at best.

What is the definition of sparingly? 3 times or more a day, just don't go over 10? You have been drinking the kool-aid too long.

What I have espoused is corroborated by John McDougall, Neal Barnard, Dr. Esselstyn, Dean Ornish and others. Dr. Esselstyn and Dean Ornish have scientifically shown that you can reverse heart disease. All have shown that you can resolve many chronic health issues by staying away from meat, dairy and oils.

So, any of your family, friends or church members have/had any chronic health issues? This is foolishness, thinking that God didn't give us the right way to eat 184 years ago.

Mormons are so smart, but they are dying just like the world around them. Look at you, a Simpson in a Wolf in a Sheep. Way too much meat there.

[Michelle]

Arenera,

I am one of the first people to agree we shouldn't be eating so much meat. I take the Lord at his word and only eat it in winter (and should cold or famine become an issue I would do it then too.) and that sparingly.

However, I don't thing you look at life the way God does and you are not alone.

Yes, life is precious. But we are all going to die. That is part of the plan. As far as I can see God is more concerned with whether we fulfilled the purpose of our creation, then whether we are 8 or 80 when we die. Because, again, we are all going to die. Animals included. The Old Testament says God will require the blood of those we kill, animals, at his hands. But again, they are to be used for food. It is also said that they should not eat the blood or fat of the animals. So unrighteously/excessively killing is bad. Killing animals for need is good. Specific animals fills the purpose of their creation when we eat them. Others are to reproduce and die naturally. Others are to be eaten by other animals.

Finally, I agree that there is a big difference between modern meat and plant production and individual agricultural lifestyles. I believe the first is killing us and the last is God's plan.

Lest we forget, God made clothes for Adam and Eve from the skins of animals. God commanded his early people to sacrifice animals and he gave permission to use them as food. God allowed his Only Begotten Son to die for us. I don't believe he looks at life and death as we do.

I do not know if we will eat meat in the Millennium, maybe not, but right now it is looking beyond the mark to speculate and run ahead of the prophets. I believe the day will come, probably in my lifetime, that we will again experience famine and may NEED to eat meat to survive. As for now, short of supplementation, we do NEED meat for B12.

No meat needed, a little pill will do just as well and not terminate the animal. B12 comes from dirt, roll around in the dirt or your great compost, lick your fingers and you will be good to go!

Arenera,

I hate to say this again, but I have watched the movies you watched, I have read the books you have read, and probably a lot more considering you admitted to being new to this. I have experimented upon the words you are just discovering. Believe me I have studied B12. First, the pill you take is not what you think. Second, agreed that B12 can be gotten from soil, because it comes from bacteria that live in the soil. Animals we eat, like cows, get it from the soil from the roots of the plants they eat. It is then made available to us when we eat the meat.

I would not recommend "roll around in the dirt or your great compost, lick your fingers and you will be good to go" because you will pick up a host of other bacteria and parasites that will not help. I agree that some B12 has been gotten in the past from soil (produce not well washed) but I don't think the advice the Lord gave in the Law of Moses supports your position regarding sanitation. Technically some animals, including cats, get it from eating feces. Should we try that too?

Natural sources of B12 are indispensable. Its effect on our nervous system and health are severe and irreversible. It is actually very difficult to digest, but easy for our bodies to get rid of extra. I agree that there are sources of B12 that do not require the animal to die: milk, eggs, etc. But you may be hard pressed to find it in factory farmed animals, and as a self proclaimed vegan you probably don't want to go there.

I am not trying to argue with you. I am trying to help and save you some trouble. Good luck to you. Try all the experiments in various food religions if you must, but please promise me that you'll come back and correct your posts for those that follow your footsteps when the cracks in the philosophies and your health appear.

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. God told us what to eat in 1833. About eating animal flesh, He said this:

And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used

This is my religion, our religion. Mormons are experiencing the same health issues as the rest of Americans because we aren't following the Word of Wisdom.

My posts are very mild. I haven't gone a jihad about the torture and killing of animals, yet that is exactly what is going on. I'm not even trying to sell a MLM opportunity.

Just eat your starches, vegetables, and fruits. Take it easy on the nuts, seeds, and stay away from oil, you don't need it either.

Arenera,

You have truncated the verse. That might be considered taking the Lord's name in vain. You are using his name to say something different from what he actually said. It is also known as taking something out of context. I do not intend to go back and forth with you, but I cannot stand dishonesty. Especially if it may lead to someone else being led astray.

13 And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine.

Just for good measure lets get the whole context:

Doctrine and Covenants 89:12-13

12 Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;

13 And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine.

Again, I don't disagree life is sacred or that people eat too much meat, but looking beyond the mark has proven a stumbling block to many. I would caution you to not try and say more or less than what the Lord has said.

[Michelle]

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. God told us what to eat in 1833. About eating animal flesh, He said this:

And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used

This is my religion, our religion. Mormons are experiencing the same health issues as the rest of Americans because we aren't following the Word of Wisdom.

My posts are very mild. I haven't gone a jihad about the torture and killing of animals, yet that is exactly what is going on. I'm not even trying to sell a MLM opportunity.

Just eat your starches, vegetables, and fruits. Take it easy on the nuts, seeds, and stay away from oil, you don't need it either.

The verse before the verse you cherry picked:

D & C 89:12

12 Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;

That meat has been ordained for the use of man, should preclude any instruction which forbids its consumption. I don't know if it is because your answers are just being glib and you are not explaining yourself well, but your council is wrong on too many fronts. Your oil statement above is so far off as to make reason stare. Stay away from man altered oils sure, but you sound much more exclusionary than just that. So if you are going to follow the word of wisdom, an extremist perspective which denies that meat is ordained for man within bounds is not following the word of wisdom but is only one more manner in which individuals worship a God created after their own image. Foolishness at best.

What is the definition of sparingly? The Lord's own words are in times of winter, cold and famine. 3 times or more a day, just don't go over 10? You have been drinking the kool-aid too long.

What I have espoused is corroborated by John McDougall, Neal Barnard, Dr. Esselstyn, Dean Ornish and others. Dr. Esselstyn and Dean Ornish have scientifically shown that you can reverse heart disease. All have shown that you can resolve many chronic health issues by staying away from meat, dairy and oils.No, I have already read and watched the same authors you are quoting. You are mingling the philosophies of men with scripture

So, any of your family, friends or church members have/had any chronic health issues? Yes, many. You are right they are not following the Word of Wisdom. Neither are you though. This is foolishness, thinking that God didn't give us the right way to eat 184 years ago. He absolutely did, but you are advocating something other than what He said. I am taking Him at his word. I do not trust in the arm of flesh, but of God. I can testify he meant what he said because I personally have overcome health problems by doing so.

Mormons are so smart, but they are dying just like the world around them. Look at you, a Simpson in a Wolf in a Sheep. Way too much meat there.I would guess I eat about 5 lbs of meat a year, during winter. Too much by your standards, sufficient for my needs.

You are a very insulting person. Why so testy? Why can't you respectfully state your position and back it up? You won't win any converts with your meanness.

[Arenera]

No meat needed, a little pill will do just as well and not terminate the animal. B12 comes from dirt, roll around in the dirt or your great compost, lick your fingers and you will be good to go!

Arenera,

I hate to say this again, but I have watched the movies you watched, I have read the books you have read, and probably a lot more considering you admitted to being new to this. I have experimented upon the words you are just discovering. Believe me I have studied B12. First, the pill you take is not what you think. Second, agreed that B12 can be gotten from soil, because it comes from bacteria that live in the soil. Animals we eat, like cows, get it from the soil from the roots of the plants they eat. It is then made available to us when we eat the meat.

I would not recommend "roll around in the dirt or your great compost, lick your fingers and you will be good to go" because you will pick up a host of other bacteria and parasites that will not help. I agree that some B12 has been gotten in the past from soil (produce not well washed) but I don't think the advice the Lord gave in the Law of Moses supports your position regarding sanitation. Technically some animals, including cats, get it from eating feces. Should we try that too?

Natural sources of B12 are indispensable. Its effect on our nervous system and health are severe and irreversible. It is actually very difficult to digest, but easy for our bodies to get rid of extra. I agree that there are sources of B12 that do not require the animal to die: milk, eggs, etc. But you may be hard pressed to find it in factory farmed animals, and as a self proclaimed vegan you probably don't want to go there.

I am not trying to argue with you. I am trying to help and save you some trouble. Good luck to you. Try all the experiments in various food religions if you must, but please promise me that you'll come back and correct your posts for those that follow your footsteps when the cracks in the philosophies and your health appear.

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. God told us what to eat in 1833. About eating animal flesh, He said this:

And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used

This is my religion, our religion. Mormons are experiencing the same health issues as the rest of Americans because we aren't following the Word of Wisdom.

My posts are very mild. I haven't gone a jihad about the torture and killing of animals, yet that is exactly what is going on. I'm not even trying to sell a MLM opportunity.

Just eat your starches, vegetables, and fruits. Take it easy on the nuts, seeds, and stay away from oil, you don't need it either.

Arenera,

You have truncated the verse. That might be considered taking the Lord's name in vain. You are using his name to say something different from what he actually said. It is also known as taking something out of context. I do not intend to go back and forth with you, but I cannot stand dishonesty. Especially if it may lead to someone else being led astray.

13 And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine.

Just for good measure lets get the whole context:

Doctrine and Covenants 89:12-13

12 Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;

13 And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine.

Again, I don't disagree life is sacred or that people eat too much meat, but looking beyond the mark has proven a stumbling block to many. I would caution you to not try and say more or less than what the Lord has said.

Many mormons are moderately eating the flesh of animals, justified by what they think the Word of Wisdom says. They have moderate chronic diseases. Moderate stumbling block?

[Arenera]

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. God told us what to eat in 1833. About eating animal flesh, He said this:



This is my religion, our religion. Mormons are experiencing the same health issues as the rest of Americans because we aren't following the Word of Wisdom.

My posts are very mild. I haven't gone a jihad about the torture and killing of animals, yet that is exactly what is going on. I'm not even trying to sell a MLM opportunity.

Just eat your starches, vegetables, and fruits. Take it easy on the nuts, seeds, and stay away from oil, you don't need it either.

The verse before the verse you cherry picked:

D & C 89:12

12 Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;

That meat has been ordained for the use of man, should preclude any instruction which forbids its consumption. I don't know if it is because your answers are just being glib and you are not explaining yourself well, but your council is wrong on too many fronts. Your oil statement above is so far off as to make reason stare. Stay away from man altered oils sure, but you sound much more exclusionary than just that. So if you are going to follow the word of wisdom, an extremist perspective which denies that meat is ordained for man within bounds is not following the word of wisdom but is only one more manner in which individuals worship a God created after their own image. Foolishness at best.

What is the definition of sparingly? The Lord's own words are in times of winter, cold and famine. 3 times or more a day, just don't go over 10? You have been drinking the kool-aid too long.

What I have espoused is corroborated by John McDougall, Neal Barnard, Dr. Esselstyn, Dean Ornish and others. Dr. Esselstyn and Dean Ornish have scientifically shown that you can reverse heart disease. All have shown that you can resolve many chronic health issues by staying away from meat, dairy and oils.No, I have already read and watched the same authors you are quoting. You are mingling the philosophies of men with scripture

So, any of your family, friends or church members have/had any chronic health issues? Yes, many. You are right they are not following the Word of Wisdom. Neither are you though. This is foolishness, thinking that God didn't give us the right way to eat 184 years ago. He absolutely did, but you are advocating something other than what He said. I am taking Him at his word. I do not trust in the arm of flesh, but of God. I can testify he meant what he said because I personally have overcome health problems by doing so.

Mormons are so smart, but they are dying just like the world around them. Look at you, a Simpson in a Wolf in a Sheep. Way too much meat there.I would guess I eat about 5 lbs of meat a year, during winter. Too much by your standards, sufficient for my needs.

You are a very insulting person. Why so testy? Why can't you respectfully state your position and back it up? You won't win any converts with your meanness.

How am I being mean? Here is the back up for the position of not eating meat, dairy or oils:

Look at your family, look at your friends, look at members in your ward. Any suffering chronic health issues.

[brlenox]

Bingo. You have nailed it on the proverbial head. God instituted laws which he anticipates his children will ask him about, or seek insight from his appointed servants. You have replaced God...and his appointed servants with learned men. New God's - new instruction. It's a perfect paradigm for a new religious perspective.

My guess these are the same learned men that were you older you might recall instructed us to eat margarine, over butter. Now 30+ years later this common medical advice is known to have contributed to a huge increase in the very heart disease due to trans fats, (man altered) that you claim they now hope to correct with current advice.

These are the same folks that for a time were advising we cut all fats from our diet, somewhat like you espouse. Including fats, that in their absence create "chronic health issues" Omega 3's for instance. Good fats found in a gazillion sources as monounsaturated, and polyunsaturated fats. Then there are those rotten saturated fats that have now been cleared of all evil implication implied by the very doctors that you sustain right arm to the square.

You are convinced that it is the food that we are eating that is causing American the issues, what about the fluoridated water which displaces iodine required for thyroid health. Of course that is good because the number one drug prescribed in America is Levothyroxine and others like it for, guess what - thyroid dysfunction caused by the displacement and lack of iodine. Perhaps you have considered the off gassing that happens every night as you sleep peacefully on your new mattress poisoning your every breath with bromide (fire retardant). Do you have any idea how these and other things are creating mass ill health that simply go unnoticed and covered up by the rhetoric of "it's our diet" that's killing us . How about the phytoestrogens ubiquitous in our lives completely tossing our hormones all over the place.

I could go on for pages of the ridiculous advice of doctors and scientists that fly in the face of common sense even. Yet, they have become your mentors and guides. AI2.0 is absolutely correct. When you have fought the hard fight and done all these "healthy things that they counsel and when at around 40 or so you start to decline in health in small ways at first but over the next decade or so increasingly worse and worse you will realize that things aren't adding up.

I was a body builder, class A bracket racquetball competitor, ate extremely healthy my entire life then suddenly things went awry. I tried being a vegetarian for several years hoping to slow down the train wreck - only got worse. I am only now starting to get ahead of the curve and it is basically because I have had to relearn everything I thought knew about health. And I assure you, I know more about health than you will most likely ever know.

But you know, all of that aside, it should not detract from the fact that you are claiming scriptural support for vegetarianism by stepping over the verse that says meat is ordained for man in moderation and claiming that a radical extremist vegetarian state is supported by those same scriptures. That is false. It may be what you prefer but if you are going to claim that the 184 year old WOW is of God then you must acknowledge that meat is ordained for man or you are simply self affirming truth and your truth is a lie.

[skmo]

How am I being mean? Here is the back up for the position of not eating meat, dairy or oils:

Look at your family, look at your friends, look at members in your ward. Any suffering chronic health issues.

It's terribly insulting to say someone with chronic health issues got them from their eating habits. My mother had chronic health issues all of her life. If you're going to tell me she brought them on herself, you and I will have a very serious intellectual problem. It's kind of funny, she passed away over a decade ago, and I'm still going to jump up and defy someone accusing my mother of causing her own suffering like I did when I was a brash and impulsive teenager. I would hope I'm misunderstanding you, and that you wouldn't do something so foolishly rude.

[Silver]

Once upon a time there was a cow. The cow was very worried about getting eaten by Mormons. Then the cow read this thread and breathed a sigh of relief because she realized that Mormons like to discuss the eating of meat more than they like to actually eat meat which all ties back to the original post of this thread that categorically declares that something big is brewing. Yeah, like Mormon discussions. About meat. Discussions about meat are brewing. Brewing like coffee which is bad. Really bad, but not as bad as discussing meat. If you look closely, there is a place in your refrigerator where you can keep meat. You could put a cow in there. Or a pig. Or even a chicken. You can't put fish in there though. Because everyone knows that fish is not meat. Except when the resurrected Lord appeared before his disciples and said:

41 unto them, Have ye here any meat?

42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.

43 And he took it, and did eat before them.

Which proves that fish is meat and it's OK to eat because Jesus would never set a bad example. Except there are some things that Jesus does that we can't do like making a small whip and whipping the tarnation out of moneychangers in the temple. Well, we could do that if we saw some moneychangers, but our temples don't allow moneychangers so we'll have to go somewhere else to whip on 'em. Cowboys use whips to make cows walk faster. Cows are made of meat. Which end up in countless Mormon discussions.

[Arenera]

How am I being mean? Here is the back up for the position of not eating meat, dairy or oils:

Look at your family, look at your friends, look at members in your ward. Any suffering chronic health issues.

It's terribly insulting to say someone with chronic health issues got them from their eating habits. My mother had chronic health issues all of her life. If you're going to tell me she brought them on herself, you and I will have a very serious intellectual problem. It's kind of funny, she passed away over a decade ago, and I'm still going to jump up and defy someone accusing my mother of causing her own suffering like I did when I was a brash and impulsive teenager. I would hope I'm misunderstanding you, and that you wouldn't do something so foolishly rude.

What chronic health issues did she have? Most people don't realize that what they are eating are causing the issues.

Obesity, heart disease, diabetes, rheumatoid arthritis and many others are related to eating meat, dairy and too many oils. The doctors I have mentioned and others who promote a healthy eating method instead of treating symptoms with pills have had great great success with their patients when they eat healthy.

The Word of Wisdom talks about conspiring men, and that is exactly what has happened. Not only with tobacco and alcohol, but the food also.

I don't blame people for suffering they have/had gone through. We know today what has caused much of it. God knew back in 1833. Our traditions and "moderation" have led mormons into the same health crisis.

Hate me all you want, but hopefully if you or someone you love is having some of these health issues, you will consider a whole-food plant-based diet that doesn't include meat, dairy and added oils.

[skmo]

Hate me all you want...

I generally don't hate zealots. I pity them. Your insensitivity and effrontery is granted forgiveness based on lack of reasoning. I shall try not to trouble you further.

[Arenera]

Hate me all you want...

I generally don't hate zealots. I pity them. Your insensitivity and effrontery is granted forgiveness based on lack of reasoning. I shall try not to trouble you further.

Insensitivity? Who isn't reasoning? Is someone a zealot because they promote life-saving options?

[wetnoodle]

I am one of the first people to agree we shouldn't be eating so much meat. I take the Lord at his word and only eat it in winter (and should cold or famine become an issue I would do it then too.) and that sparingly.

Hijack your own thread!!

It was entertaining until PETA came along.

[RocknRoll]

And then there's this...

D&C Section 49
18 And whoso forbiddeth to abstain from meats, that man should not eat the same, is not ordained of God;

19 For, behold, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, and that which cometh of the earth, is ordained for the use of man for food and for raiment, and that he might have in abundance.

Just sayin'...

[Michelle]

I am one of the first people to agree we shouldn't be eating so much meat. I take the Lord at his word and only eat it in winter (and should cold or famine become an issue I would do it then too.) and that sparingly.

Hijack your own thread!!

It was entertaining until PETA came along.

That is my quote, but I didn't intend to hijack the thread. It was Arenera who suggested being vegan would avoid war or something. (Quote below)I'm not really sure why she brought it up. But she also got rude with multiple people and just couldn't seem to stop herself from spouting her version of the WOW. I refrained for awhile, then I clarified what she was missing, as did others. Comment boards are like Sunday school. Few comment, many listen. I could only let her go on so long unchallenged. I'd hate to see anybody follow her in her manipulation of scripture.

"Postby Arenera » Wed Aug 16, 2017 6:06 pm

Some people have recently become vegans! Saving the lives of God's creatures and understanding sparingly does not mean eating meat 3 times a day."

[lemuel]

I'll just leave this here again:

https://www.reddit.com/r/keto/wiki/keto_in_a_nutshell

[Z2100]

We are getting nowhere with this discussion. We went from military to the word of wisdom. lol

[lemuel]

We are getting nowhere with this discussion lol

But I've lost 40 lbs with the keto diet this year.

[gruden2.0]

Wow, I've seen a lot of threadjacks in my time, but going from Hill AFB and military equipment being moved around to a veganism debate has to top them all. I think I got whiplash.

The What The Health documentary has emboldened some vegans, but it has an agenda and overlooks some glaring problems. What veganism is, like other -isms, is a dogma. It's difficult to find a vegan who will have a candid discussion but there are a few.

The fact is, vegans die at the same ages of the same things non-vegans do, although they'll never allow themselves to see this. The reason is, is they're eating too many things they shouldn't (grains and beans which are loaded with inflammation-causing lectins) and not enough of what they do need, B12, omega-3s, taurine, carnintine, and probably many more things. These things are crucial to long-term health. That these things are easily obtained from animals and difficult-to-impossible from the plant kingdom is a pretty good indicator we were designed to eat this. Rolling around a compost pile and licking it, really? You will die early if you make a habit of that, for sure.

The other thing the WoW says that people overlook is that it is not a commandment, but some good advice from the lord (v. 2) to help us live better. Should we never eat meat? No. Should we take it easy on the meat? Yes. There is research that shows that people living in many different cultures in many different places in the world live much longer and healthier by restricting animal-based foods. But they do eat some (2-4 ounces per days seems to be where it's at), and that's enough to get those nutrients we need.

Right now I'm reading the book The Plant Paradox and it has helped our family greatly in a short period of time, hopefully some of you will check it out. It's a diet that's the closest thing to the WoW I've ever seen. Hopefully some of you will check it out and try it, it's pretty easy to lose weight and feel better when you follow it. The author does a good job of not being dogmatic, he takes the tone "If you want to live longer try this..." which is a healthy attitude I think. If it's healthy and useful, put it out there without being pushy and people who are interested will try it out.

[Arenera]

I am one of the first people to agree we shouldn't be eating so much meat. I take the Lord at his word and only eat it in winter (and should cold or famine become an issue I would do it then too.) and that sparingly.

Hijack your own thread!!

It was entertaining until PETA came along.

That is my quote, but I didn't intend to hijack the thread. It was Arenera who suggested being vegan would avoid war or something. (Quote below)I'm not really sure why she brought it up. But she also got rude with multiple people and just couldn't seem to stop herself from spouting her version of the WOW. I refrained for awhile, then I clarified what she was missing, as did others. Comment boards are like Sunday school. Few comment, many listen. I could only let her go on so long unchallenged. I'd hate to see anybody follow her in her manipulation of scripture.

"Postby Arenera » Wed Aug 16, 2017 6:06 pm

Some people have recently become vegans! Saving the lives of God's creatures and understanding sparingly does not mean eating meat 3 times a day."

WoW, you would think I was Remnant!? (Did you like the pun with WoW?)

Just because someone is blond, doesn't mean they are dumb. I have interpreted the Word of Wisdom correctly. But don't believe me.

Check this site, you can get the book for $5. Read it. http://discoveringthewordofwisdom.com/

Here is a real life story: http://discoveringthewordofwisdom.com/w ... #more-4293

[brlenox]

I am one of the first people to agree we shouldn't be eating so much meat. I take the Lord at his word and only eat it in winter (and should cold or famine become an issue I would do it then too.) and that sparingly.

Hijack your own thread!!

It was entertaining until PETA came along.

That is my quote, but I didn't intend to hijack the thread. It was Arenera who suggested being vegan would avoid war or something. (Quote below)I'm not really sure why she brought it up. But she also got rude with multiple people and just couldn't seem to stop herself from spouting her version of the WOW. I refrained for awhile, then I clarified what she was missing, as did others. Comment boards are like Sunday school. Few comment, many listen. I could only let her go on so long unchallenged. I'd hate to see anybody follow her in her manipulation of scripture.

"Postby Arenera » Wed Aug 16, 2017 6:06 pm

Some people have recently become vegans! Saving the lives of God's creatures and understanding sparingly does not mean eating meat 3 times a day."

WoW, you would think I was Remnant!? (Did you like the pun with WoW?)

Just because someone is blond, doesn't mean they are dumb. I have interpreted the Word of Wisdom correctly. But don't believe me.

This is an astounding characteristic that I have always found very intriguing. I can't fathom it and cannot comprehend how someone will step over clearly defined scriptural information such as the issue here with God stating that He himself has ordained meat for man and then you boldface deny that is true. Every time I see this I am reminded of this same trait as it resides in a certain group of people. Now, I am absolutely not equating you to being one of these types but the possession of this trait is interesting because even when I read it as an element of the character of this group of people I cannot fathom that they can do what is described by Joseph Smith:

All sin shall be forgiven, except the sin against the Holy Ghost, for Jesus Christ will save all except the sons of perdition. What must a man do to commit the unpardonable sin? He has got to deny the plan of salvation; he has got to say that the sun does not shine while he sees it with his eyes open; he has got to receive the Holy Ghost, deny Jesus Christ when the heavens are open to him, know God, and then sin against Him. After a man has sinned the sin against the Holy Ghost, there is no repentance for him.Joseph Smith, “The King Follett Discourse: a Newly Amalgamated Text” by Stan Larson, BYU Studies, vol. 18 (1977-1978), Number 2 - Winter 1978, 205-06.

Golly gee, eat whatever you want but don't do it on the principle of such overt denial of truth. Finrock does the same thing and it just makes me feel gobsmacked. Now again I am not saying you are a son of perdition, you have already admitted to being blond and that pretty much negates accountability. However, still this ability to sidestep the obvious such as Joseph defines only becomes more comprehended by me as I observe it in a living human being...well notwithstanding the blond thing ...but dang close to a human being.

[Yahtzee]

Arenera, you're turning every thread you post on into a word of wisdom post.
You're becoming the Robert Sinclair of the word of wisdom. It HAS to be by greeting, not commandment.

[Seek the Truth]

We are getting nowhere with this discussion lol

But I've lost 40 lbs with the keto diet this year.

What does your daily food look like.

[BeNotDeceived]

Some people have recently become vegans! Saving the lives of God's creatures and understanding sparingly does not mean eating meat 3 times a day.

Arenera,

I am one of the first people to agree we shouldn't be eating so much meat. I take the Lord at his word and only eat it in winter (and should cold or famine become an issue I would do it then too.) and that sparingly.

However, I don't thing you look at life the way God does and you are not alone.

Yes, life is precious. But we are all going to die. That is part of the plan. As far as I can see God is more concerned with whether we fulfilled the purpose of our creation, then whether we are 8 or 80 when we die. Because, again, we are all going to die. Animals included. The Old Testament says God will require the blood of those we kill, animals, at his hands. But again, they are to be used for food. It is also said that they should not eat the blood or fat of the animals. So unrighteously/excessively killing is bad. Killing animals for need is good. Specific animals fills the purpose of their creation when we eat them. Others are to reproduce and die naturally. Others are to be eaten by other animals.

Finally, I agree that there is a big difference between modern meat and plant production and individual agricultural lifestyles. I believe the first is killing us and the last is God's plan.

Lest we forget, God made clothes for Adam and Eve from the skins of animals. God commanded his early people to sacrifice animals and he gave permission to use them as food. God allowed his Only Begotten Son to die for us. I don't believe he looks at life and death as we do.

I do not know if we will eat meat in the Millennium, maybe not, but right now it is looking beyond the mark to speculate and run ahead of the prophets. I believe the day will come, probably in my lifetime, that we will again experience famine and may NEED to eat meat to survive. As for now, short of supplementation, we do NEED meat for B12.

No meat needed, a little pill will do just as well and not terminate the animal. B12 comes from dirt, roll around in the dirt or your great compost, lick your fingers and you will be good to go!

Technically Incorrect. B12 is a by product of fermentation which requires certain types of bacteria to carry out the process. These bacteria can be found in dirt but better still they can be found in the lower intestine of folks with a healthy intestinal flora. Antibiotic abuse can destroy the b-12 producing bacteria in the lower intestine and necessitate the need for some form of supplementation. Preferably from dirt which is near a cat litter box so that maybe you can contract Toxoplasmosis the cat version of trichinosis from pigs, or better still near those tasty little swirls of raccoon poop, the one with all of the little berry seeds clumped together is also a great source of Baylisascaris procyonis, a fun little round worm that makes an infected person see swimming lines in their vision as it migrates to the fluid of the eyeball and goes skinny dipping. Well I could go on and on about the wondrous benefits of getting your b12 from dirt sources but maybe NOT!

A guy on base got a certain joy from grabbing up a worm wet with morning dew and swallowing it whole to the shock of onlookers. He tried his little trick at home and became deathly ill due to dogs doing their duty on the home turf.

Adds new meaning to the phrase:

DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME =))

[frankcastle]

Talk about a thread hijack. I might as well perpetuate it. I have found good results living the Paleo diet. I would say it is about the complete opposite of a Vegan. I really don't care what other people eat or drink, as long as they aren't hurting other people - for example, drinking and driving. Taxes and insurance premiums are never going to go down, even if everyone suddenly followed the WoW to the letter. We have too many corrupt politicians for that. And who really wants to live a real long life anyway - all you will get to do is watch more of your family members and friends die.