When Will the Time Come When We must leave Our Homes?

[GrandMasterB]

If you are polling the members of this board you will find people who thought we were going to gather years ago and people who think you are foolish for believing you might ever have to leave your home.

My answer is: I don't know. I think it could happen as soon as spring 2017, but maybe not until 2020 or 2021. And it might not happen until much later. I have felt a need to rush and get my temple work done as soon as I can, make a better effort at home teaching, and do some other things to prepare spiritually and temporally, but I don't know the cause of that sense of urgency.

Very interesting. I have had the same impressions and I don't know why....yet.

[brianj]

Now I'm curious: how long would it take you to make your family mobile?

I think "How long would it take..." is not nearly as revealing about me as "WHAT would it take..." because the list of things that would make me decide to pack up and leave my home is really, really short. If God appeared to me in person and told me to move, I would. If my wife came to me and said "I'm worried and I'm leaving, so you can pack up and come with me or say goodbye" I'd try to talk her out of it, but eventually I'd go (I know that one won't happen, though.)

That's it. That's the list. I suppose if there was a fire I may go, but it's grass and brush where I live: I could have a dirt zone for 50 yards in any direction in a relatively short time. If there was a chlorine leak I suppose I'd go, but I'd be back soon, too. Nobody's going to drop a nuke anywhere near because there's about $43.86 worth of civilization in the basin, we're not a target.

What else is there? The vaunted "Callout" that's coming? I'll wave to y'all as you go. Exodus to Missouri? It's like 583% humidity there. They can build the new temple without me, they don't need an old fat man with a bad attitude there. Invasion? Who? Colorado? I'll hang a peace sign out front and play Marley music, they'll already think I'm from Colorado (I think I still have an old Colorado driver's license somewhere.)

For the sake of an answer, I could probably have basic food, water, shelter, and protection in my Yukon in a couple of hours, but I can't see it happening. I'm a little different from that old guy, Harry Truman who refused to leave the Mt. St. Helens area. He refused to go because he believed the mountain "wouldn't hurt" him. I have no such illusions about the Uintahs, I just don't care. I've had to leave one place or another in my life too many times. As much as I'm not happy about it being Utah, it's still my home now, and I'm not going.

That answer disturbs me. Hypothetically, if you were living in Europe in 1850, you would have ignored the prophetic counsel to migrate to the Salt Lake valley? In 1 Nephi 2, Lehi is told to take his family camping in a dram. 2 Nephi 5 describes another diving warning, but not involving a face to face meeting. Nor am I aware of any claims of people in Europe or Scandinavia describing a personal interview in conjunction with the counsel to move to Deseret.

If the First Presidency ever invites us to gather, I will go. And I will feel sorry for people who call me Shem and say I am idiotically and blindly following Noah into his ark. I don't believe it matters how old or obese I may be; if I follow the counsel of my leaders and promptings received, I will be a useful servant. And I will be honored to be a useful servant.

[skmo]

That answer disturbs me. Hypothetically, if you were living in Europe in 1850, you would have ignored the prophetic counsel to migrate to the Salt Lake valley?

Disturbs? No need to feel disturbed on my account because I'm stubborn and cynical. Hypothetically I can give all manner of answers about who, how, why, whatever kinds of things, and I've already been through many of them. However, since I'm not in 1850 I couldn't give much of an answer based on that if. I will say that for much of my life I've moved around quite a bit and done what I've felt led to do. I will also say I've never ignored the requests of the prophets and his counselors or the Twelve, although I've clearly fallen short of my full goals to be an obedient servant many times.

If the First Presidency ever invites us to gather, I will go.

I don't discount the possibility of that happening, but I rank its likelihood right up there with the chance I'll pick a Powerball winner. Since I was a wee lad on Colorado's Front Range visiting my grandparents in Happy Valley I've listened to "People who know" or someone who was "told by an apostle's cousin" or someone who "was a neighbor to one of Spencer W. Kimball's bodyguards" (I promise, those are three of a list of many, many more ACTUAL descriptions of people) who told us that calamities are coming next Spring or next Autumn and we'd all better have our two-year food storage ready to move, and if gasoline dried up (which was a perceived possibility in the 1970's) we may have to make handcarts.

Julie Rowe did not spring forth from the mind of Zeus fully grown with schematics for the glorious tent cities we'll be shuttling off to in order to save us from the collapse of civilization which would occur at any time. I've seen all the prognostications. I've heard all the cries of doom. I've heard that the brethren don't say anything because they don't want to cause a panic and that by holding the "call" until the last minute they'll be assured to only get those righteous enough to have had their handcarts packed.

Have you seen the other LDS type gathering site? Since 2001 people over there have quite regularly come up with all manner of warnings about the impending doom. It's next October. No, it'll be in April. No, they meant the following April. I had heard all of these things annually since the mid-70's, and the Internet has just increased the prophesying exponentially. Along the way I've seen people involved in these movements because it provides them with one or two important things: Praise from their fellowmen (which gets soaked up even as it's being denied that it's wanted) and money.

I follow the counsel of my leaders and promptings received, I will be a useful servant.

No doubt. I'm sure there will be some called to serve missions in places around the globe, just like they are now, and some will even be called to Jackson County, MO. Those who are called to serve will likely do so with gladness and love in their hearts, and they (including you, if you are called) will be useful and honored servants. However, if there is to be a great LDS Diaspora to build the "New Jerusalem" I believe the Lord will tell us in His time through His servants. I've learned the value of rumors and independent prophesying. Combine them with $1.99 and you can get a Jr. Bacon Cheeseburger from Wendy's.

That's not to say we shouldn't be prepared for emergencies. We've been counselled for many, many years to have food storage, supplies, and emergency items. This counsel has come to us directly through Priesthood leadership, and I've done my best to do what I could. When we lived in Alaska and went for long stretches with no resupply, we helped feed some who fell short until the planes could fly again.

That is a far cry from those foretelling of a "Callout" or a plan to inhabit "Tent Cities" or such notions. These cries have been bantered around for decades. I do literally mean decades. Every once in a while someone comes along to reinvigorate it. It's a second coming, but it's the second coming of Chicken Little, not the Savior.

If I ever hear things like that from a General Conference talk or an official directive from TFP read from the pulpit, I'll re-evaluate my position. I'm fairly certain that by the time that happens, my former students' children will be planning their retirement parties. I predict that between now and that time there will be no less than 30 people who have had dream visitations, NDE "revelations" and under-the-table warnings from David Bednar's gardener about an impending social breakdown which will be followed by a call for a gathering of the saints. Probably at least a dozen books, as well.

[brianj]

If you are polling the members of this board you will find people who thought we were going to gather years ago and people who think you are foolish for believing you might ever have to leave your home.

My answer is: I don't know. I think it could happen as soon as spring 2017, but maybe not until 2020 or 2021. And it might not happen until much later. I have felt a need to rush and get my temple work done as soon as I can, make a better effort at home teaching, and do some other things to prepare spiritually and temporally, but I don't know the cause of that sense of urgency.

Very interesting. I have had the same impressions and I don't know why....yet.

I have dreamed of traveling to other continents for almost three quarters of my life, but every time I have come close to being able to take such a trip the way has been shut up for me. A job loss, medical emergency, and a variety of other barriers have been placed in my way. But after seeing Prime Minister Netanyahu's Christmas message I feel like I should get the last of my food storage together (I have everything but powdered milk and shortening or oil) and finish the temple work, but also plan a trip to Israel for 2017.

This is a very interesting prompting. The idea of being ready as soon as possible but planning a trip that can't take place if things go bad seems curious. And right now I don't even have the income to finish my preparations, but if I get a job offer I was hoping to receive two weeks ago then I should easily be able to afford both.
I think a big lesson from this is that we should be prepared for whatever comes, but we shouldn't stop living because of what we expect to happen.

And since I mentioned PM Netanyahu's message, I should probably provide a link.

[dafty]

If you are polling the members of this board you will find people who thought we were going to gather years ago and people who think you are foolish for believing you might ever have to leave your home.

My answer is: I don't know. I think it could happen as soon as spring 2017, but maybe not until 2020 or 2021. And it might not happen until much later. I have felt a need to rush and get my temple work done as soon as I can, make a better effort at home teaching, and do some other things to prepare spiritually and temporally, but I don't know the cause of that sense of urgency.

Very interesting. I have had the same impressions and I don't know why....yet.

I have dreamed of traveling to other continents for almost three quarters of my life, but every time I have come close to being able to take such a trip the way has been shut up for me. A job loss, medical emergency, and a variety of other barriers have been placed in my way. But after seeing Prime Minister Netanyahu's Christmas message I feel like I should get the last of my food storage together (I have everything but powdered milk and shortening or oil) and finish the temple work, but also plan a trip to Israel for 2017.

This is a very interesting prompting. The idea of being ready as soon as possible but planning a trip that can't take place if things go bad seems curious. And right now I don't even have the income to finish my preparations, but if I get a job offer I was hoping to receive two weeks ago then I should easily be able to afford both.
I think a big lesson from this is that we should be prepared for whatever comes, but we shouldn't stop living because of what we expect to happen.

And since I mentioned PM Netanyahu's message, I should probably provide a link.

Good luck with getting that job and Merry Christmas

[FTC]

Christmas still in full swing. Presents wrapped. A good 8" of Christmas snow, with some dusting here and there. Hot chocolate tasty. Christmas music still being broadcast nationally. No nuclear launch sirens wailing. Looking forward to firing up that blu-ray.
Want me to post an hour-by-hour of how Christmas is totally happening in the most joyous of ways for 2016, and nothing end of world calamties is going to interrupt it? :))

[dafty]

Christmas still in full swing. Presents wrapped. A good 8" of Christmas snow, with some dusting here and there. Hot chocolate tasty. Christmas music still being broadcast nationally. No nuclear launch sirens wailing. Looking forward to firing up that blu-ray.
Want me to post an hour-by-hour of how Christmas is totally happening in the most joyous of ways for 2016, and nothing end of world calamties is going to interrupt it? :))

Im Russian and celebrate Christmas on the 7th of Jan...so hold your guns :)) Merry Christmas to U prophet boy x

[FTC]

#7

I just got done watching Felicity Jones. She was in a Star Wars movie, I'm pretty sure. But, yea, wow, Felicity! :X

And all the end-of-world, doom-and-gloomers, dreaming about tent cities and other atrocities of SHTF will mitigate the cognitive dissonance with "Well, maybe next year."
This will give me successful prophecy #7 and #8. A prophet hath spoken.

This one won't really ramp up until sometime around Fall of 2017. As people start doom-and-glooming New Years 2017/2018.
I'm getting better at this prophecy thing; this one is almost a whole year away!

[dafty]

#7

I just got done watching Felicity Jones. She was in a Star Wars movie, I'm pretty sure. But, yea, wow, Felicity! :X

And all the end-of-world, doom-and-gloomers, dreaming about tent cities and other atrocities of SHTF will mitigate the cognitive dissonance with "Well, maybe next year."
This will give me successful prophecy #7 and #8. A prophet hath spoken.

This one won't really ramp up until sometime around Fall of 2017. As people start doom-and-glooming New Years 2017/2018.
I'm getting better at this prophecy thing; this one is almost a whole year away!

so now I will prophecy unto you. By the October 2017 latter-day King David shall be born O:-)

[FTC]

#7

I just got done watching Felicity Jones. She was in a Star Wars movie, I'm pretty sure. But, yea, wow, Felicity! :X

And all the end-of-world, doom-and-gloomers, dreaming about tent cities and other atrocities of SHTF will mitigate the cognitive dissonance with "Well, maybe next year."
This will give me successful prophecy #7 and #8. A prophet hath spoken.

This one won't really ramp up until sometime around Fall of 2017. As people start doom-and-glooming New Years 2017/2018.
I'm getting better at this prophecy thing; this one is almost a whole year away!

so now I will prophecy unto you. By the October 2017 latter-day King David shall be born O:-)

Yes!! Now things are getting lively.
So what happens when, sorry, I guess I should grant a cordial if, if that doesn't happen, then what?

[dafty]

#7

I just got done watching Felicity Jones. She was in a Star Wars movie, I'm pretty sure. But, yea, wow, Felicity! :X

And all the end-of-world, doom-and-gloomers, dreaming about tent cities and other atrocities of SHTF will mitigate the cognitive dissonance with "Well, maybe next year."
This will give me successful prophecy #7 and #8. A prophet hath spoken.

This one won't really ramp up until sometime around Fall of 2017. As people start doom-and-glooming New Years 2017/2018.
I'm getting better at this prophecy thing; this one is almost a whole year away!

so now I will prophecy unto you. By the October 2017 latter-day King David shall be born O:-)

Yes!! Now things are getting lively.
So what happens when, sorry, I guess I should grant a cordial if, if that doesn't happen, then what?

thats an excellent question...what do u suggest then? x

[skmo]

#7

I just got done watching Felicity Jones. She was in a Star Wars movie, I'm pretty sure. But, yea, wow, Felicity! :X



This one won't really ramp up until sometime around Fall of 2017. As people start doom-and-glooming New Years 2017/2018.
I'm getting better at this prophecy thing; this one is almost a whole year away!

so now I will prophecy unto you. By the October 2017 latter-day King David shall be born O:-)

Yes!! Now things are getting lively.
So what happens when, sorry, I guess I should grant a cordial if, if that doesn't happen, then what?

thats an excellent question...what do u suggest then? x

Let the prophet prophesy, let the false prophets blather and babble nonsensically (they seem to be capable of a never-ending stream of it) and remind each individual to study the scriptures, pray for guidance and understanding, and exercise faith in God that He does things in His time in His established way. Realize that the vast, ENORMOUSLY VAST group of "prophets" or people sharing their hidden dreams or spiritual NDEs are at best deluded and/or blinded souls, and often enough hucksters selling spiritual snake oil.

[skmo]

So what happens when, sorry, I guess I should grant a cordial if, if that doesn't happen, then what?

Fixed it for you.

[freedomforall]

Be Ye Also Ready

Also: Will there be a calling out to all members to go and live in tent cities?

An excerpt:
As to the question of ‘when’, we do not know for sure. We can see the signs of the Second Coming being fulfilled all around us, but we don’t know the exact day, or even year. The best thing we can do is read the scriptures, follow the Prophet, and listen to the Spirit. That is good advice not only for the future, but for living each day.

[FTC]

Christmas still in full swing. Presents wrapped. A good 8" of Christmas snow, with some dusting here and there. Hot chocolate tasty. Christmas music still being broadcast nationally. No nuclear launch sirens wailing. Looking forward to firing up that blu-ray.
Want me to post an hour-by-hour of how Christmas is totally happening in the most joyous of ways for 2016, and nothing end of world calamties is going to interrupt it? :))

Im Russian and celebrate Christmas on the 7th of Jan...so hold your guns :)) Merry Christmas to U prophet boy x

So how was Russian Christmas? Yea. So anyways. #8

[kfb]

How close do you think we are to having all he11 break loose? Only 40% of LDS church members are active and most of the active members make bad choices frequently. I know there is a lot of good people in the world. By the time we travel back to Jackson County Missouri, there could be hundreds of millions of people there and in the Rocky Mountains. Sin is everywhere and there are some corrupt people in the church. How long do you think it will be until we will have to flee our homes because of the wickedness in the world?

Usually if you ask when the "call out" will happen or when are we going to the New Jerusalem, many on this forum usually say the following spring or fall. Usually in their minds it is always about 6 months away. At least That is what they have been saying since 2000. If I had to say when it might be I'd say 10-20 years or so. But I'm definitely in the minority.

[kfb]

I believe Elder Holland when he says:
"You see, one of the truly exciting things about this dispensation is that it is a time of mighty, accelerated change. And one thing that has changed is that the Church of God will never again flee. "

https://www.lds.org/broadcasts/article/ ... g?lang=eng" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The church may not ever flee, but you can be sure that thousands of saints and gentiles will flee, many to the Rocky Mountains or other places of safety. If you are living in a large city when this country eventually collapses you will be in real peril.

[Mcox]

Well since the church is made up of saints, then no. So I understand the quote of Elder Holland to mean the church and its people. I have never heard a general authority ever say we will flee to the mountains, have you? Nope until they do, I'm not thinking about it one bit.

[freedomforall]

To the OP, I think around age 80 +/-

[Matchmaker]

Well since the church is made up of saints, then no. So I understand the quote of Elder Holland to mean the church and its people. I have never heard a general authority ever say we will flee to the mountains, have you? Nope until they do, I'm not thinking about it one bit.

Are we in agreement that there's nothing wrong with one (LDS or otherwise) fleeing a devastated city like Chicago in the event of civil unrest, food shortages or natural disasters and heading west to be with friends or relatives in Utah or thereabouts?

[Mcox]

Well since the church is made up of saints, then no. So I understand the quote of Elder Holland to mean the church and its people. I have never heard a general authority ever say we will flee to the mountains, have you? Nope until they do, I'm not thinking about it one bit.

Are we in agreement that there's nothing wrong with one (LDS or otherwise) fleeing a devastated city like Chicago in the event of civil unrest, food shortages or natural disasters and heading west to be with friends or relatives in Utah or thereabouts?

We are in total agreement. I just do not believe in the AVOW, NDE belief in a call out to tent cities.

[Silver]

Well since the church is made up of saints, then no. So I understand the quote of Elder Holland to mean the church and its people. I have never heard a general authority ever say we will flee to the mountains, have you? Nope until they do, I'm not thinking about it one bit.

Are we in agreement that there's nothing wrong with one (LDS or otherwise) fleeing a devastated city like Chicago in the event of civil unrest, food shortages or natural disasters and heading west to be with friends or relatives in Utah or thereabouts?

We are in total agreement. I just do not believe in the AVOW, NDE belief in a call out to tent cities.

Speaking of AVOW, how are they handling the non-fulfillment of David Horne's busted predictions?

[brianj]

Are we in agreement that there's nothing wrong with one (LDS or otherwise) fleeing a devastated city like Chicago in the event of civil unrest, food shortages or natural disasters and heading west to be with friends or relatives in Utah or thereabouts?

I will disagree. In this church we have a duty to take care of one another, a duty not only mentioned in conferences but explicitly described in scripture. One LDS individual or family to flee a devastated city like Chicago, or even many families, going to live with friends or family in the intermountain west is an act of abandonment toward those who don't have friends or family they can rely on to host them.

One of the biggest problems with the church, from my perspective, is too much focus on families. I have known people who would very faithfully home teach relatives every single month, but who would never visit other assigned families no matter how great the need of those families. I recall one ward I was in, with several multi-generational families, where if a person in one of those families needed something several relatives would immediately drop everything to provide help. Need a babysitter? I'll reschedule my doctor's appointment. But in that ward, if you weren't part of one of those families, somebody might help you if they feel like it and have nothing better to do. One time my wife needed a babysitter for just a couple of hours to attend a class, and I could not get out of work. The person who had agreed to watch our daughter wasn't home, and later that week Relief Society sisters berated my wife, telling her that she shouldn't have a child if she can't take care of it.

If you feel the need to flee a city because of impending danger, you have somewhere to go, and you invite those who don't have friends or family to take them in, only then do I see nothing wrong with fleeing.

[freedomforall]

Are we in agreement that there's nothing wrong with one (LDS or otherwise) fleeing a devastated city like Chicago in the event of civil unrest, food shortages or natural disasters and heading west to be with friends or relatives in Utah or thereabouts?

I will disagree. In this church we have a duty to take care of one another, a duty not only mentioned in conferences but explicitly described in scripture. One LDS individual or family to flee a devastated city like Chicago, or even many families, going to live with friends or family in the intermountain west is an act of abandonment toward those who don't have friends or family they can rely on to host them.

One of the biggest problems with the church, from my perspective, is too much focus on families. I have known people who would very faithfully home teach relatives every single month, but who would never visit other assigned families no matter how great the need of those families. I recall one ward I was in, with several multi-generational families, where if a person in one of those families needed something several relatives would immediately drop everything to provide help. Need a babysitter? I'll reschedule my doctor's appointment. But in that ward, if you weren't part of one of those families, somebody might help you if they feel like it and have nothing better to do. One time my wife needed a babysitter for just a couple of hours to attend a class, and I could not get out of work. The person who had agreed to watch our daughter wasn't home, and later that week Relief Society sisters berated my wife, telling her that she shouldn't have a child if she can't take care of it.

If you feel the need to flee a city because of impending danger, you have somewhere to go, and you invite those who don't have friends or family to take them in, only then do I see nothing wrong with fleeing.

In the church body we have Saints and we have Aints.
We have Aints that think they are Saints.
We also have Saints that make mistakes but try harder to live righteously. They try with all their might to keep the commandments.
Then we have Aints that ridicule the Saints for sins committed, something like misery loves company.
We have Aints because they don't understand scripture or maybe do not read them. Church is nothing more than a social hangout for some.
We have Saints that try to love the Aints and help them along the path.
Sometimes we have Saints that are quick to point out the faults of others.
We have Aints that would like to be Saints but find it hard to achieve because of bad examples of some Saints.

So we have Saints and Aints and those in between.

God has his work cut out for himself. Wheat and Tares. No?

[Silver]

Are we in agreement that there's nothing wrong with one (LDS or otherwise) fleeing a devastated city like Chicago in the event of civil unrest, food shortages or natural disasters and heading west to be with friends or relatives in Utah or thereabouts?

I will disagree. In this church we have a duty to take care of one another, a duty not only mentioned in conferences but explicitly described in scripture. One LDS individual or family to flee a devastated city like Chicago, or even many families, going to live with friends or family in the intermountain west is an act of abandonment toward those who don't have friends or family they can rely on to host them.

One of the biggest problems with the church, from my perspective, is too much focus on families. I have known people who would very faithfully home teach relatives every single month, but who would never visit other assigned families no matter how great the need of those families. I recall one ward I was in, with several multi-generational families, where if a person in one of those families needed something several relatives would immediately drop everything to provide help. Need a babysitter? I'll reschedule my doctor's appointment. But in that ward, if you weren't part of one of those families, somebody might help you if they feel like it and have nothing better to do. One time my wife needed a babysitter for just a couple of hours to attend a class, and I could not get out of work. The person who had agreed to watch our daughter wasn't home, and later that week Relief Society sisters berated my wife, telling her that she shouldn't have a child if she can't take care of it.

If you feel the need to flee a city because of impending danger, you have somewhere to go, and you invite those who don't have friends or family to take them in, only then do I see nothing wrong with fleeing.

In the church body we have Saints and we have Aints.
We have Aints that think they are Saints.
We also have Saints that make mistakes but try harder to live righteously. They try with all their might to keep the commandments.
Then we have Aints that ridicule the Saints for sins committed, something like misery loves company.
We have Aints because they don't understand scripture or maybe do not read them. Church is nothing more than a social hangout for some.
We have Saints that try to love the Aints and help them along the path.
Sometimes we have Saints that are quick to point out the faults of others.
We have Aints that would like to be Saints but find it hard to achieve because of bad examples of some Saints.

So we have Saints and Aints and those in between.

God has his work cut out for himself. Wheat and Tares. No?

FFA, quite profound. I really like what you've written. It tickled my funny bone a bit too. I found myself wanting say out loud, "I do not like green eggs and ham!" at the end.