What Year are We Actually Living In?

Discuss the last days, Zion, second coming, emergency preparedness, alternative health, etc.
brianj
captain of 1,000
Posts: 4066
Location: Vineyard, Utah

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by brianj »

Meili wrote:Why did the Pagans celebrate a few days after the solstice?
It's really simple. The simple, short answer is that they didn't. The celebrated the solstice on the solstice. The problem is that you aren't using the same calendar. Christmas has been celebrated on December 25 ever since the early 4th century, around 300 years after the crucifixion. But what calendar was used in that region at that time? The Roman calendar. The Roman calendar had the equinox on December 25, see Bradt, Hale, Astronomy Methods, (2004), p. 69.

The Roman calendar eventually became the Julian calendar and was refined until it was replace with the Gregorian calendar in the late 16th century.

2EstablishZion
captain of 100
Posts: 337

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by 2EstablishZion »

Meili wrote:Why did the Pagans celebrate a few days after the solstice?
My understanding is there are three stars in the Southern hemisphere referred to as "the Wise Men".
They dip below the Southern horizon on the solstice and after three days "in the grave" they rise again on December 25.

I do not know if that's true, but I read it somewhere - some consider it the basis of the entire Christ story, I would consider it possibly a sign in the heavens that symbolizes the fact of Christ's life.

Also found this which makes some sense
As the days grow shorter in the period leading up to the winter solstice, the sun appears to stop moving south and stay still for three days on Dec 22nd, 23rd and 24th in the northern hemisphere. To our ancestors this period symbolised the death of the sun god and when three days later on the 25th December the sun started moving again, the sun was reborn and begin its growth which will achieve fullness at the Summer Solstice.

User avatar
captainfearnot
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1966

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by captainfearnot »

Meili wrote:Why did the Pagans celebrate a few days after the solstice?
Some pagans celebrated not the solstice itself, but the "rebirth" of the sun. So if the solstice happens on the 22nd, that's when the sunrise occurs at its southernmost point. Three days later, the sun rises 1/10 of its width further northward, which may have been a significant measurement to them or maybe it was just the smallest increment they could measure. At any rate, that was considered the point at which the sun was "reborn," or the first step in its journey back northward, and that's what they celebrated.

So December 25th has long been considered the sun's birthday, and various pagan sun gods have been celebrated on this day.

User avatar
Rose Garden
Don't ask . . .
Posts: 7031
Contact:

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Rose Garden »

Cool. Thanks for the answers, guys. Very interesting.

User avatar
rewcox
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5873

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by rewcox »

HorribleUsername wrote:I go by what was revealed by Jesus Christ in Doctrine and Covenants, Section 20:1-2, which is as follows:

1 The rise of the Church of Christ in these last days, being one thousand eight hundred and thirty years since the coming of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ in the flesh, it being regularly organized and established agreeable to the laws of our country, by the will and commandments of God, in the fourth month, and on the sixth day of the month which is called April
2 Which commandments were given to Joseph Smith, Jun., who was called of God, and ordained an apostle of Jesus Christ, to be the first elder of this church;

I believe we are in 2016.
I seldom do checks anymore, but the few I did this year was 2016. Has anyone asked Julie Rowe?

Zion2080
captain of 100
Posts: 197

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Zion2080 »

Robin Hood wrote: December 16th, 2016, 7:09 am
Zion2080 wrote:Since the birth of Jesus Christ is just a year in world history. What year are we actually living in? And how close are we to the 7000th year? I believe that we are living between the year 6800-7000 since the Fall of Man. Share your thoughts!
The period between 6,000 and 7,000 is the millennium.
So you are 1000 years out according to the general biblical reckoning.

Then it would be 5924.

Zion2080
captain of 100
Posts: 197

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Zion2080 »

Robin Hood wrote: December 17th, 2016, 9:17 am
captainfearnot wrote:
Robin Hood wrote:It's obvious that something's wrong, otherwise Christmas day would also be new years day.
There's nothing wrong, it's just arbitrary. Julius Caesar decided to start the year ten days after the solstice because he wanted the year to start on a new moon, and that's when it happened to fall in 46/45 BC, when he invented his calendar. The Romans were big into the lunar cycle.

All of these calendar problems arise because the solar year is not evenly divisible by solar days or lunar months. But we've never had a problem counting the years as they go by. We've always known exactly what year it is.
So on the 25th December is it 2016 years since the birth of Christ, or 2017 years?

I think that on April 6, that's when New Years AND Christmas is.

User avatar
Robin Hood
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 13110
Location: England

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Robin Hood »

Zion2080 wrote: March 28th, 2017, 7:18 pm
Robin Hood wrote: December 17th, 2016, 9:17 am
captainfearnot wrote:
Robin Hood wrote:It's obvious that something's wrong, otherwise Christmas day would also be new years day.
There's nothing wrong, it's just arbitrary. Julius Caesar decided to start the year ten days after the solstice because he wanted the year to start on a new moon, and that's when it happened to fall in 46/45 BC, when he invented his calendar. The Romans were big into the lunar cycle.

All of these calendar problems arise because the solar year is not evenly divisible by solar days or lunar months. But we've never had a problem counting the years as they go by. We've always known exactly what year it is.
So on the 25th December is it 2016 years since the birth of Christ, or 2017 years?

I think that on April 6, that's when New Years AND Christmas is.
I know this is a popular myth within Mormonism, but there is absolutely no justification for this view.
In fact, studies indicate that April is the least likely time for the birth of Christ.

User avatar
inho
captain of 1,000
Posts: 3286
Location: in a galaxy far, far away

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by inho »

Robin Hood wrote: March 29th, 2017, 2:21 am
Zion2080 wrote: March 28th, 2017, 7:18 pm I think that on April 6, that's when New Years AND Christmas is.
I know this is a popular myth within Mormonism, but there is absolutely no justification for this view.
In fact, studies indicate that April is the least likely time for the birth of Christ.
Robin Hood is right.

You can read about it here:
Dating the Birth of Christ by Jeffrey R. Chadwick in BYU Studies vol 49 (4), 2010
or if you prefer listening to a podcast:
When Was Jesus Born? – Jeffrey R. Chadwick in LDS Perspectives Podcast

User avatar
Silver Pie
seeker after Christ
Posts: 8989
Location: In the state that doesn't exist

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Silver Pie »

Zion2080 wrote: March 28th, 2017, 7:18 pm
Robin Hood wrote: December 17th, 2016, 9:17 am
captainfearnot wrote:
Robin Hood wrote:It's obvious that something's wrong, otherwise Christmas day would also be new years day.
There's nothing wrong, it's just arbitrary. Julius Caesar decided to start the year ten days after the solstice because he wanted the year to start on a new moon, and that's when it happened to fall in 46/45 BC, when he invented his calendar. The Romans were big into the lunar cycle.

All of these calendar problems arise because the solar year is not evenly divisible by solar days or lunar months. But we've never had a problem counting the years as they go by. We've always known exactly what year it is.
So on the 25th December is it 2016 years since the birth of Christ, or 2017 years?

I think that on April 6, that's when New Years AND Christmas is.
According to the Book of Mormon, Jesus died the 4th day after his birthday. The Nephites began keeping track of their time according to the sign that indicated his birth. I don't know if they called that time year 1 or year 0 (in other words, not calling it year 1 until the first anniversary of his birth). And in the first month of the year 34, on day 4, there arose such a storm as had never been seen before. It was the first sign of Jesus' death, and more signs followed in the destructions that came upon them.

Thus, the Book of Mormon tells us (if it is true that Jesus died in the spring) that Jesus was born in the spring.

Zion2080
captain of 100
Posts: 197

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Zion2080 »

You agree with me? Awesome. Also, I looked up the duration between Christ's birth and death on

https://www.timeanddate.com/date/durati ... 2=00&s2=00 and got:

Jesus was 33 years and 4 days, and 15 hours old when he left his mortal life. (Born at 0:00 and died at 15:00)

If it is 2017 years since his birth, and Christ was born April 6, then New Years Day AND Christmas is April 6, making April 10 Easter. So technically, it is not 2017 until April 6. Also, Christ died around the very end of the 4th seal. Probably the 4900s. Lets say we take 4900 and add it to 2017. Then we get the year 6916. Or it could be 6924 (add 7 years for the tribulations after the 7th seal is opened).

Zion2080
captain of 100
Posts: 197

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Zion2080 »

Silver Pie wrote: March 29th, 2017, 4:49 pm
Zion2080 wrote: March 28th, 2017, 7:18 pm
Robin Hood wrote: December 17th, 2016, 9:17 am
captainfearnot wrote:
There's nothing wrong, it's just arbitrary. Julius Caesar decided to start the year ten days after the solstice because he wanted the year to start on a new moon, and that's when it happened to fall in 46/45 BC, when he invented his calendar. The Romans were big into the lunar cycle.

All of these calendar problems arise because the solar year is not evenly divisible by solar days or lunar months. But we've never had a problem counting the years as they go by. We've always known exactly what year it is.
So on the 25th December is it 2016 years since the birth of Christ, or 2017 years?

I think that on April 6, that's when New Years AND Christmas is.
According to the Book of Mormon, Jesus died the 4th day after his birthday. The Nephites began keeping track of their time according to the sign that indicated his birth. I don't know if they called that time year 1 or year 0 (in other words, not calling it year 1 until the first anniversary of his birth). And in the first month of the year 34, on day 4, there arose such a storm as had never been seen before. It was the first sign of Jesus' death, and more signs followed in the destructions that came upon them.

Thus, the Book of Mormon tells us (if it is true that Jesus died in the spring) that Jesus was born in the spring.


You agree with me? Awesome. Also, I looked up the duration between Christ's birth and death on

https://www.timeanddate.com/date/durati ... 2=00&s2=00 and got:

Jesus was 33 years and 4 days, and 15 hours old when he left his mortal life. (Born at 0:00 and died at 15:00)

If it is 2017 years since his birth, and Christ was born April 6, then New Years Day AND Christmas is April 6, making April 10 Easter. So technically, it is not 2017 until April 6. Also, Christ died around the very end of the 4th seal. Probably the 4900s. Lets say we take 4900 and add it to 2017. Then we get the year 6916. Or it could be 6924 (add 7 years for the tribulations after the 7th seal is opened).

User avatar
Silver Pie
seeker after Christ
Posts: 8989
Location: In the state that doesn't exist

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Silver Pie »

Zion2080 wrote: March 29th, 2017, 5:49 pm You agree with me? Awesome.
Essentially, yes. In Jesus' society, they didn't use our months and days, and I understand that their days moved around (like, for example, how Easter is not on the same date each year), but that date definitely fits the season recorded in the Book of Mormon (and, since the Nephites were eye witnesses, I would expect they knew what they were talking about, even if modern so-called scholars insist to the contrary).

Also, I looked up the duration between Christ's birth and death on

https://www.timeanddate.com/date/durati ... 2=00&s2=00 and got:

Jesus was 33 years and 4 days, and 15 hours old when he left his mortal life. (Born at 0:00 and died at 15:00)
Then that would mean that the Nephites called the day he was born the first day of year one. But we don't know if their year one corresponds to our 1 A.D.

If it is 2017 years since his birth, and Christ was born April 6, then New Years Day AND Christmas is April 6, making April 10 Easter. So technically, it is not 2017 until April 6. Also, Christ died around the very end of the 4th seal. Probably the 4900s. Lets say we take 4900 and add it to 2017. Then we get the year 6916. Or it could be 6924 (add 7 years for the tribulations after the 7th seal is opened).
Even though there is disagreement as to what year he was actually born (I've heard assorted numbers, from around 3 B.C to 6 A.D.), your number is probably a good ball park figure.

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Spaced_Out »

I have mentioned this many times, I received a strong witness from the HG that the 4th seal ended when the law of Moses was fulfilled ie. 33AD our calendar. Subtract 33y from 2017, then add 4,000 and you have the right year.

Z2100
captain of 100
Posts: 748

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Z2100 »

Spaced_Out wrote: March 29th, 2017, 11:29 pm I have mentioned this many times, I received a strong witness from the HG that the 4th seal ended when the law of Moses was fulfilled ie. 33AD our calendar. Subtract 33y from 2017, then add 4,000 and you have the right year.

It would be the year 5984. Only 16 more years left? Of course, it takes us to 2033. Good estimating. :)

User avatar
Silver Pie
seeker after Christ
Posts: 8989
Location: In the state that doesn't exist

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Silver Pie »

Z2100 wrote: March 30th, 2017, 1:37 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: March 29th, 2017, 11:29 pm I have mentioned this many times, I received a strong witness from the HG that the 4th seal ended when the law of Moses was fulfilled ie. 33AD our calendar. Subtract 33y from 2017, then add 4,000 and you have the right year.

It would be the year 5984. Only 16 more years left? Of course, it takes us to 2033. Good estimating. :)
That's conceivable, I think. Personally, I think our society will fall apart completely around 2025, if not sooner. No actual scripture reference for that (nor prophet's words), just a guess. If the year of His return is around 2033, the remnant of Lehi need to rise up and fulfill their prophesied role (building the temple, building the New Jerusalem, both with the Gentiles "assisting") before then. And, of course, all unrepentant Gentiles will be swept off the land (desolating scourge and all that).

Sunain
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2711
Location: Canada

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Sunain »

Z2100 wrote: March 30th, 2017, 1:37 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: March 29th, 2017, 11:29 pm I have mentioned this many times, I received a strong witness from the HG that the 4th seal ended when the law of Moses was fulfilled ie. 33AD our calendar. Subtract 33y from 2017, then add 4,000 and you have the right year.

It would be the year 5984. Only 16 more years left? Of course, it takes us to 2033. Good estimating. :)
I always thought 2033 seemed logical but then I keep getting the "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only" scripture going through my mind. Then I realized, that scripture doesn't say we wouldn't know the year. Samuel knew the Savior would come in 5 years and conditions here in our day are quickly approaching the same as it was for the Nephities at that time where they were prosecuted for their belief in Christ.

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Spaced_Out »

Sunain wrote: March 31st, 2017, 9:58 pm
Z2100 wrote: March 30th, 2017, 1:37 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: March 29th, 2017, 11:29 pm I have mentioned this many times, I received a strong witness from the HG that the 4th seal ended when the law of Moses was fulfilled ie. 33AD our calendar. Subtract 33y from 2017, then add 4,000 and you have the right year.

It would be the year 5984. Only 16 more years left? Of course, it takes us to 2033. Good estimating. :)
I always thought 2033 seemed logical but then I keep getting the "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only" scripture going through my mind. Then I realized, that scripture doesn't say we wouldn't know the year. Samuel knew the Savior would come in 5 years and conditions here in our day are quickly approaching the same as it was for the Nephities at that time where they were prosecuted for their belief in Christ.
2033 is the start of the 7th seal so the second coming is a bit beyond that.
Yes the new Jerusalem and calling of the 144,000 will occur prior to 2033 as well as all the destruction's and tribulations.

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Spaced_Out »

There is another tetrad of solar eclipse and blood moons in 2033.. A bit of weird information that I found which seems to match the dates...

User avatar
Kingdom of ZION
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1939

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Kingdom of ZION »

Robin Hood wrote: March 29th, 2017, 2:21 am
Zion2080 wrote: March 28th, 2017, 7:18 pm
Robin Hood wrote: December 17th, 2016, 9:17 am
captainfearnot wrote:
There's nothing wrong, it's just arbitrary. Julius Caesar decided to start the year ten days after the solstice because he wanted the year to start on a new moon, and that's when it happened to fall in 46/45 BC, when he invented his calendar. The Romans were big into the lunar cycle.

All of these calendar problems arise because the solar year is not evenly divisible by solar days or lunar months. But we've never had a problem counting the years as they go by. We've always known exactly what year it is.
So on the 25th December is it 2016 years since the birth of Christ, or 2017 years?

I think that on April 6, that's when New Years AND Christmas is.
I know this is a popular myth within Mormonism, but there is absolutely no justification for this view.
In fact, studies indicate that April is the least likely time for the birth of Christ.

In the Ancient Hebrew's Solstice Calendar, with the two new years days (both of them), they always come on the same days each year, the spring and fall EQUINOXES: March 20th and September 22nd. Thereby, Passover is always on April 3rd (being the 15th day of Abib or Aviv, being the ancient name rather than Nissan) and Tabernacles is always on October 6th (being the 15th day of Tishri). Of course these Feasts start at sunset the day before as does the same day ;)

The Messiah was KILLED on the true Passover (April 3rd), and the Jews wanted him taken off of the cross before the evening (being April 4th) because it started their Passover according to the Lunar (Babylonian) Calendar that Apostate Israel had been keeping since about 586 B.C. when they were taken into Babylon. But Joseph Smith being a true Prophet in the Latter Days discerned the correct time of April 6th, being the day of the Messiah Resurrection from the grave and we are privilege to have this second witness to the correctness of his divine revelation up[on the subject and witnessing to his calling as a Prophet. For truly the Messiah celebrated the true Passover on the night of April 3rd (April 2nd), and was taken that night and killed on the morrow on April 3rd. He was laid in the tomb the nights of April 4th (April 3rd), 5th (April 4th), and 6th (April 5th), and then rose on the Morning of the the next day, April 6th, having been in the tomb three and one half days.

Now if you were to ask me to venture as guess as to the date of His birth... I would say it was on the Day of Atonement, the 10th day of Tishri, being always October 1st.

If you want other witnesses about the sacredness of the correct calendar and when the most Holy Days are: What night and then next day did Moroni first appear to Joseph and subsequent what day was it that he was commanded to go up year after year in an attempt to receive the Book of Mormon? And again, what day was it that Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery receive visitation in the Kirtland Temple, by the Messiah, Noah, Moses, and Elijah?

And again, if you were to ask me to venture a guess as to what day the First Vision happened, that open that Dispensation... whether is was in the years of 1816 thru 1824, depending on the account you like best: See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Vision it mattereth not to me, but it most likely was April 3rd, Passover.

Shalom

User avatar
BeNotDeceived
Agent38
Posts: 8960
Location: Tralfamadore
Contact:

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by BeNotDeceived »

brianj wrote: December 18th, 2016, 3:31 pm
Meili wrote:Why did the Pagans celebrate a few days after the solstice?
It's really simple. The simple, short answer is that they didn't. The celebrated the solstice on the solstice. The problem is that you aren't using the same calendar. Christmas has been celebrated on December 25 ever since the early 4th century, around 300 years after the crucifixion. But what calendar was used in that region at that time? The Roman calendar. The Roman calendar had the equinox on December 25, see Bradt, Hale, Astronomy Methods, (2004), p. 69.

The Roman calendar eventually became the Julian calendar and was refined until it was replace with the Gregorian calendar in the late 16th century.
Occasionally a local radio preacher will rail on the Catholic Church about this; Ellie claims to be the most knowledgeable preacher of our time when in reality he is sadly mistaken. My seminary teacher taught the same mistaken belief though; thanks for your clarification. O:-)

User avatar
BeNotDeceived
Agent38
Posts: 8960
Location: Tralfamadore
Contact:

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by BeNotDeceived »

Sunain wrote: March 31st, 2017, 9:58 pm
Z2100 wrote: March 30th, 2017, 1:37 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: March 29th, 2017, 11:29 pm I have mentioned this many times, I received a strong witness from the HG that the 4th seal ended when the law of Moses was fulfilled ie. 33AD our calendar. Subtract 33y from 2017, then add 4,000 and you have the right year.

It would be the year 5984. Only 16 more years left? Of course, it takes us to 2033. Good estimating. :)
I always thought 2033 seemed logical but then I keep getting the "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only" scripture going through my mind. Then I realized, that scripture doesn't say we wouldn't know the year. Samuel knew the Savior would come in 5 years and conditions here in our day are quickly approaching the same as it was for the Nephities at that time where they were prosecuted for their belief in Christ.
7 years suffering per the type pattern set by Pharaoh's Dream will be cut short leaving the end year unknown.

Z2100
captain of 100
Posts: 748

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Z2100 »

Spaced_Out wrote: March 31st, 2017, 11:20 pm
Sunain wrote: March 31st, 2017, 9:58 pm
Z2100 wrote: March 30th, 2017, 1:37 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: March 29th, 2017, 11:29 pm I have mentioned this many times, I received a strong witness from the HG that the 4th seal ended when the law of Moses was fulfilled ie. 33AD our calendar. Subtract 33y from 2017, then add 4,000 and you have the right year.

It would be the year 5984. Only 16 more years left? Of course, it takes us to 2033. Good estimating. :)
I always thought 2033 seemed logical but then I keep getting the "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only" scripture going through my mind. Then I realized, that scripture doesn't say we wouldn't know the year. Samuel knew the Savior would come in 5 years and conditions here in our day are quickly approaching the same as it was for the Nephities at that time where they were prosecuted for their belief in Christ.
2033 is the start of the 7th seal so the second coming is a bit beyond that.
Yes the new Jerusalem and calling of the 144,000 will occur prior to 2033 as well as all the destruction's and tribulations.

Haha. Your dates are too soon :)

User avatar
Robin Hood
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 13110
Location: England

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Robin Hood »

Z2100 wrote: April 28th, 2017, 7:22 am
Spaced_Out wrote: March 31st, 2017, 11:20 pm
Sunain wrote: March 31st, 2017, 9:58 pm
Z2100 wrote: March 30th, 2017, 1:37 pm


It would be the year 5984. Only 16 more years left? Of course, it takes us to 2033. Good estimating. :)
I always thought 2033 seemed logical but then I keep getting the "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only" scripture going through my mind. Then I realized, that scripture doesn't say we wouldn't know the year. Samuel knew the Savior would come in 5 years and conditions here in our day are quickly approaching the same as it was for the Nephities at that time where they were prosecuted for their belief in Christ.
2033 is the start of the 7th seal so the second coming is a bit beyond that.
Yes the new Jerusalem and calling of the 144,000 will occur prior to 2033 as well as all the destruction's and tribulations.

Haha. Your dates are too soon :)
You're right.

User avatar
Durzan
The Lord's Trusty Maverick
Posts: 3727
Location: Standing between the Light and the Darkness.

Re: What Year are We Actually Living In?

Post by Durzan »

Keep in mind that we neither know the hour nor the day. The Second Coming and the events leading up to it could easily happen tomorrow, or a year from now, in about ten or twenty years, or in a hundred years, etc.

We can have fun guessing, but in the end, things can fall apart in a matter of weeks if it be the Lord's will. Likewise, things can decline at a slow pace for us, meaning that the second coming would be decades away or longer.

In either way, prepare your heart and mind for when the Lord comes, whether it will be immediately, or a couple hundred years from now.

That being said, I do think we are close to the days of tribulation... though I won't put an exact date on it. (Other than the possibility of the US being destroyed as a nation within the next 5 or so years due to wickedness... and no, I am not going to expound further on that line of thought.)

Post Reply