Nations are turning against Israel

[skmo]

The problem with statistics is that they can mean whatever you want them to mean.

Lies, damned lies, and statistics. Numbers can be very easy to manipulate, that's why so many are more worried (and influenced) by opinions than substance.

[brianj]

As bad as this is, it could have been worse. Last month the New York Times posted an editorial from Jimmy Carter encouraging Obama to recognize Palestine diplomatically and grant them full UN membership.

Of course Carter is blind or foolish enough to believe that if the Jews just remove their settlements from the West Bank and allow Palestine independence, everything will be peaceful and happy in the middle east. Never mind that over 70% of Palestinians say a two state solution is unacceptable, or that after Israel removed their settlements from Gaza that small piece of land became a platform for launching thousands of missiles at Israel, or that Palestinians were committing acts of terrorism and war even before the 1967 conflict.

[larsenb]

As bad as this is, it could have been worse. Last month the New York Times posted an editorial from Jimmy Carter encouraging Obama to recognize Palestine diplomatically and grant them full UN membership.

Of course Carter is blind or foolish enough to believe that if the Jews just remove their settlements from the West Bank and allow Palestine independence, everything will be peaceful and happy in the middle east. Never mind that over 70% of Palestinians say a two state solution is unacceptable, or that after Israel removed their settlements from Gaza that small piece of land became a platform for launching thousands of missiles at Israel, or that Palestinians were committing acts of terrorism and war even before the 1967 conflict.

Unfortunately, Israeli leaders through the years, and the founders, earlier, do not have clean hands in this perennial controversy. That LDS have a soft spot for Israel is understandable, but they shouldn't keep blinders on regarding the Israeli/Palestinian controversy and conflict. It is NOT a black-and-white issue.

Even many Orthodox Jews believe the founding and perpetuation of Israel is highly questionable.

My own view is that if the whole world actually goes up against Israel in the 'final' battle, there may be very good reasons for doing so. See my earlier post for at least one of these reasons: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44347#p757393" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[brianj]

I have never come across an orthodox Jew who has been willing to express doubts or questions about the way Israel was founded.

It is correct that the leaders of Israel have not been angelic in their treatment of Palestinians, but most people outside the region fail to recognize that there is a very real war going on. Leaders of Hamas have said they want every Jew in the world to immigrate to Israel so they can all be murdered without being hunted down.

The antisemetic media seems happy and excited to tell you about every apartment building, hospital, mosque and school that the Israeli military destroys, but they conveniently fail to mention that those are retaliatory strikes targeting sites where the Palestinians launched missiles from. And they will never tell you that Israeli missiles aren't causing the occasional secondary explosions.

[Mark]

As bad as this is, it could have been worse. Last month the New York Times posted an editorial from Jimmy Carter encouraging Obama to recognize Palestine diplomatically and grant them full UN membership.

Of course Carter is blind or foolish enough to believe that if the Jews just remove their settlements from the West Bank and allow Palestine independence, everything will be peaceful and happy in the middle east. Never mind that over 70% of Palestinians say a two state solution is unacceptable, or that after Israel removed their settlements from Gaza that small piece of land became a platform for launching thousands of missiles at Israel, or that Palestinians were committing acts of terrorism and war even before the 1967 conflict.

Unfortunately, Israeli leaders through the years, and the founders, earlier, do not have clean hands in this perennial controversy. That LDS have a soft spot for Israel is understandable, but they shouldn't keep blinders on regarding the Israeli/Palestinian controversy and conflict. It is NOT a black-and-white issue.

Even many Orthodox Jews believe the founding and perpetuation of Israel is highly questionable.

My own view is that if the whole world actually goes up against Israel in the 'final' battle, there may be very good reasons for doing so. See my earlier post for at least one of these reasons: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44347#p757393" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Read this article concerning PLO butcher Yasser Arafat and his lifelong goals of the destruction of Israel and tell me about why Israel is to blame for nothing more than defending their sovereign nationhood status in this fight for survival against their Muslim neighbors. You have this completely backwards Bro. and have fallen for the propaganda.

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[larsenb]

As bad as this is, it could have been worse. Last month the New York Times posted an editorial from Jimmy Carter encouraging Obama to recognize Palestine diplomatically and grant them full UN membership.

Of course Carter is blind or foolish enough to believe that if the Jews just remove their settlements from the West Bank and allow Palestine independence, everything will be peaceful and happy in the middle east. Never mind that over 70% of Palestinians say a two state solution is unacceptable, or that after Israel removed their settlements from Gaza that small piece of land became a platform for launching thousands of missiles at Israel, or that Palestinians were committing acts of terrorism and war even before the 1967 conflict.

Unfortunately, Israeli leaders through the years, and the founders, earlier, do not have clean hands in this perennial controversy. That LDS have a soft spot for Israel is understandable, but they shouldn't keep blinders on regarding the Israeli/Palestinian controversy and conflict. It is NOT a black-and-white issue.

Even many Orthodox Jews believe the founding and perpetuation of Israel is highly questionable.

My own view is that if the whole world actually goes up against Israel in the 'final' battle, there may be very good reasons for doing so. See my earlier post for at least one of these reasons: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44347#p757393" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Read this article concerning PLO butcher Yasser Arafat and his lifelong goals of the destruction of Israel and tell me about why Israel is to blame for nothing more than defending their sovereign nationhood status in this fight for survival against their Muslim neighbors. You have this completely backwards Bro. and have fallen for the propaganda.

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You're black-and-whiting it Mark. You probably haven't read about the massacres of whole Palestinian villages before the establishment of the State of Israel. You probably know nothing about the LaVon affair and other false-flag events perpetrated by the Mossad, and much more.

Its a knowledge thing and perspective. If you take a black-and-white position on this kind of an issue you have automatically blinded yourself to what may be the legitimate other-side-of-the-story.

You OK with their attack on our USS liberty?? Read up on it thoroughly, and then tell me if you think that is was simply an 'Israeli mistake'. I don't think any survivor of that attack would agree with you.

[larsenb]

I have never come across an orthodox Jew who has been willing to express doubts or questions about the way Israel was founded.

It is correct that the leaders of Israel have not been angelic in their treatment of Palestinians, but most people outside the region fail to recognize that there is a very real war going on. Leaders of Hamas have said they want every Jew in the world to immigrate to Israel so they can all be murdered without being hunted down.

The antisemetic media seems happy and excited to tell you about every apartment building, hospital, mosque and school that the Israeli military destroys, but they conveniently fail to mention that those are retaliatory strikes targeting sites where the Palestinians launched missiles from. And they will never tell you that Israeli missiles aren't causing the occasional secondary explosions.

This would suggest to me that your experience and awareness level may be somewhat limited. Here are some links to help you get educated. And there are many, many more.

WHY ORTHODOX JEWS ARE OPPOSED TO A ZIONIST STATE : http://www.nkusa.org/AboutUs/Zionism/opposition.cfm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Read the various articles at this web site: http://www.truetorahjews.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

New York City: 10,000+ Jews Against Israel (U.S. Media Blackout) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMQ9C6vni0w" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Orthodox Jews To Demonstrate Against 'State' Of Israel

Israel's Ultra-Orthodox A Jewish Ghetto Within the Zionist State : http://www.merip.org/mer/mer179/israels-ultra-orthodox" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Why Orthodox Jews are opposed to the Zionist "State" : http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... le1506.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
A Conflict of Faith: Devoted to Jewish Observance, but at ...

From Counter Punch: Why Orthodox Jews Oppose Israel : and http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/05/29/ ... se-israel/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Rebel Rabbis: The Ultra-Orthodox Jews Who Want to See Israel Dismantled : https://video.vice.com/en_us/video/rebe ... d57f407a35" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

To Those Who Think All Jews Are Pro-Israel & Zionists, by Israel Shamir, at: http://rense.com/general50/pro.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Many people, and most LDS, don’t understand that Zionism (as it pertains to the State of Israel) is primarily a political movement and has little to do with religion.

The standard objection by many Orthodox Jews to the State of Israel is that they are still in exile and God has not released them from this exile.

Regarding statements from the leaders of Hamas about Israelis and Jews, you can find similar statements and sentiment coming from Israeli Jews and their supporters regarding Arabs in general and specific organizations such as Hamas, in particular. Both sides feel justified in their attitudes.

As mentioned, the Israelis have been involved in a number of significant false-flag attacks (ref. the Lavon Affair as just one); they perpetrated the attack on the USS Liberty in 1967; and as mentioned, Christopher Bollyn has compiled a massive amount of evidence that Israelis (Mossad and Zionists and Zionist neoCons, primarily) were deeply involved in 9/11.

The Israelis are far from being a righteous nation, especially their leaders, to include those who were involved in the creation of the State of Israel.

You can also find the same attitude among them as that evinced by Sarah Silverman, who said: ~"that if Jesus were alive today, I would be happy to kill him again". Many of them hold their evangelical supporters in contempt, for instance.

Israel and her people are a mix: Mostly good people, but mixed with a fair amount of bad, especially among their leaders.

[Sunain]

The reason I think many align themselves with Israel is because of their western ideals and western society. Their culture basically matches that of most western countries with the exception of Judism being their major religion not Christianity. Just like any western country, they've done a lot of bad stuff but so has UK, USA, Canada, ect. Israel is no different in that regard. They are basically the only western civilized country in the middle east surrounded by Arab muslims who want Jerusalem for themselves. They will do anything to get Jerusalem out of Jewish hands but we all know how that story ends this time.

[larsenb]

The reason I think many align themselves with Israel is because of their western ideals and western society. Their culture basically matches that of most western countries with the exception of Judism being their major religion not Christianity. Just like any western country, they've done a lot of bad stuff but so has UK, USA, Canada, ect. Israel is no different in that regard. They are basically the only western civilized country in the middle east surrounded by Arab muslims who want Jerusalem for themselves. They will do anything to get Jerusalem out of Jewish hands but we all know how that story ends this time.

That's one part of it, but there is a lot more to the whole issue . . . . which is complex. And again, many of Israeli leaders are and have been atheists, despite perhaps nominal observance within their families.

According to Barry Chamish, Yitzak Rabin was murdered in part because he was returning to his Judaic religious roots and refused to carry out something awful demanded by the 'elites'.

[Silver]

Larsen, thanks for sharing your side of the story.

[larsenb]

I have never come across an orthodox Jew who has been willing to express doubts or questions about the way Israel was founded.

It is correct that the leaders of Israel have not been angelic in their treatment of Palestinians, but most people outside the region fail to recognize that there is a very real war going on. Leaders of Hamas have said they want every Jew in the world to immigrate to Israel so they can all be murdered without being hunted down.

The antisemetic media seems happy and excited to tell you about every apartment building, hospital, mosque and school that the Israeli military destroys, but they conveniently fail to mention that those are retaliatory strikes targeting sites where the Palestinians launched missiles from. And they will never tell you that Israeli missiles aren't causing the occasional secondary explosions.

This would suggest to me that your experience and awareness level may be somewhat limited. Here are some links to help you get educated. And there are many, many more.

WHY ORTHODOX JEWS ARE OPPOSED TO A ZIONIST STATE : http://www.nkusa.org/AboutUs/Zionism/opposition.cfm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Read the various articles at this web site: http://www.truetorahjews.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

New York City: 10,000+ Jews Against Israel (U.S. Media Blackout) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMQ9C6vni0w" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Orthodox Jews To Demonstrate Against 'State' Of Israel

Israel's Ultra-Orthodox A Jewish Ghetto Within the Zionist State : http://www.merip.org/mer/mer179/israels-ultra-orthodox" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Why Orthodox Jews are opposed to the Zionist "State" : http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... le1506.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
A Conflict of Faith: Devoted to Jewish Observance, but at ...

From Counter Punch: Why Orthodox Jews Oppose Israel : and http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/05/29/ ... se-israel/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Rebel Rabbis: The Ultra-Orthodox Jews Who Want to See Israel Dismantled : https://video.vice.com/en_us/video/rebe ... d57f407a35" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

To Those Who Think All Jews Are Pro-Israel & Zionists, by Israel Shamir, at: http://rense.com/general50/pro.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Many people, and most LDS, don’t understand that Zionism (as it pertains to the State of Israel) is primarily a political movement and has little to do with religion.

The standard objection by many Orthodox Jews to the State of Israel is that they are still in exile and God has not released them from this exile.

Regarding statements from the leaders of Hamas about Israelis and Jews, you can find similar statements and sentiment coming from Israeli Jews and their supporters regarding Arabs in general and specific organizations such as Hamas, in particular. Both sides feel justified in their attitudes.

As mentioned, the Israelis have been involved in a number of significant false-flag attacks (ref. the Lavon Affair as just one); they perpetrated the attack on the USS Liberty in 1967; and as mentioned, Christopher Bollyn has compiled a massive amount of evidence that Israelis (Mossad and Zionists and Zionist neoCons, primarily) were deeply involved in 9/11.

The Israelis are far from being a righteous nation, especially their leaders, to include those who were involved in the creation of the State of Israel.

You can also find the same attitude among them as that evinced by Sarah Silverman, who said: ~"that if Jesus were alive today, I would be happy to kill him again". Many of them hold their evangelical supporters in contempt, for instance.

Israel and her people are a mix: Mostly good people, but mixed with a fair amount of bad, especially among their leaders.

Here's an article from Henry Makow, a Jew, on the same subject of many Orthodox Jews NOT supporting Israel:

Anti-Zionist Jews Laud UN Action

December 28, 2016
Neturei_karta.jpg
"Let no one be fooled. The State of Israel has nothing to do with Judaism, and on the contrary, it has consistently tried to extinguish Torah observance and values."

. . . . . . . . . While Zionists pretend to represent all Jews, they only represent a minority of American Jews.

Statement by Neturei Karta International . U.N Security Council resolution 2334

On behalf of anti-Zionist Jews worldwide, we of Neturei Karta International, Jews United Against Zionism, greet with enthusiasm the recent United Nations Security Council resolution 2334 condemning Israeli settlements as illegal.

For decades, the settlements have been a major cause for bloodshed and unrest in the Holy Land. Hundreds of innocent lives have been sacrificed on the altar of nationalism and lust for land. We congratulate the countries in the Security Council for taking this long-overdue step toward justice and peace. And in particular, we congratulate the President of the State of Palestine, His Excellency Mahmoud Abbas, on his success in achieving the passage of this resolution.

At the same time, we wish to reiterate the Torah position that it is not just the West Bank that is illegally occupied. Jews have been sent into exile by the Almighty, and any kind of Jewish sovereignty over any territory is a violation of that decree. Therefore the concept of the State of Israel is entirely illegitimate and forbidden. The crime is compounded when the creation of this homeland entails the occupation, oppression, subjugation and expulsion of another people.

Before the era of Zionism, Jews lived in Palestine in peace and security, side by side with the Palestinian Arab population. We fervently hope for the day when Jews return to abiding by the laws of the Torah and living in peace with all peoples.

As Jews, we have always been especially pained by the actions of the State of Israel in general, and the radical settlers in particular, since they claim to be acting in our name. Predictably, Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu has reacted with anger to this clear demonstration of unanimous world opinion against his state's crimes. Drawing on Jewish themes, he has cast himself in the role of the Maccabee fighters whose victories we celebrate on Chanukah, and the Security Council nations as their enemies.

Let no one be fooled. The State of Israel has nothing to do with Judaism, and on the contrary, it has consistently tried to extinguish Torah observance and values. The Torah values life and service of the Almighty, while Zionism values land conquest and secular culture. The Maccabees did not go to battle for freedom or independence; they wanted only the right to continue to practice Judaism. If any comparison is to be made to the Chanukah story, it is of Netanyahu and his fellow Zionists to the enemies of the Jewish people in the time of the Maccabees.

Netanyahu has vowed to continue building settlements, but we appeal to the world to realize that the Jewish people in general are not behind him. This show of defiance against the world community and the United States for taking up a just cause is completely against the Torah.

American Orthodox Jews in particular, as loyal citizens enjoined by the Torah to respect their president, are embarrassed and completely disgusted by Netanyahu and his supporters' vicious attacks on President Obama. We also wish to state that the Zionists have no right to control the Western Wall and other holy sites of Jerusalem. All claims the Israeli government makes to these places are baseless.

Furthermore, the recent U.N. General Assembly resolution that the State of Israel has no right to impose its laws on these places, in no way detracts from the holiness of these sites in the eyes of Jews.In these days of Chanukah, may the Almighty send a spirit of repentance into Jewish hearts, so that they look into the Torah and resolve to follow its guidance. And may we be privileged to see peace in the Middle East and the entire world. Amen.
-----------------
Related - Naturei Karta

First Comment from Sid Green


I have commented that Talmudism does not always go along with the Illuminati agenda. This group happens to be in the right here, with all the unjustified hatred of it in Israel. This group of Jews does not follow Cabala; they are just regular Jews who aren't Satanists. The Satanic ones did not see the exile as a punishment, and didn't see it as a sign of the need to follow Torah law more closely.

There is strong negative propaganda against Neturei Karta in Israel, and its sad to find out that they are hated for simply being good Jews and standing up for the truth. Refusing to believe that they were punished, the Satanists threw morality out the window. Apparently in Babylon some of the Jews remained faithful despite the heavy pagan influences which molded the Cabala. Most of the Jews who believed this kind of thing were targeted by the Illuminati Kapos and eliminated in Poland. The Jews in Israel today are not God conscious except a few.

- See more at: https://www.henrymakow.com/#sthash.XvFboyt5.dpuf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[brianj]

Makow's editorial is interesting, but we know a little bit more than he does.
How long was it after the church was organized in this dispensation that an Apostle was sent Palestine to dedicate the land for the gathering of the Jews? When was a second delegation sent to rededicate the land?
What spiritual force is behind the drive to aliyah?
If one of us were to tell Makow about this, that prophets have been called and sent to dedicate the land of Eretz Israel for the gathering of the Jews, would he believe it or continue to deny that Jews should be gathering?

The scriptures contain prophecies that state the land of Israel would one day blossom as the rose. This prophecy has come to pass. Thanks to the implementation of new technologies and great blessings, the land is blossoming. But Jews will not really return to their religion until the priesthood is restored to them and a leader of the Aaronic priesthood is called and set apart. Until that day, and even after that day, I will continue to rejoice in the restoration of Judah and Benjamin to their ancestral lands.

[larsenb]

Makow's editorial is interesting, but we know a little bit more than he does.
How long was it after the church was organized in this dispensation that an Apostle was sent Palestine to dedicate the land for the gathering of the Jews? When was a second delegation sent to rededicate the land?
What spiritual force is behind the drive to aliyah?
If one of us were to tell Makow about this, that prophets have been called and sent to dedicate the land of Eretz Israel for the gathering of the Jews, would he believe it or continue to deny that Jews should be gathering?

The scriptures contain prophecies that state the land of Israel would one day blossom as the rose. This prophecy has come to pass. Thanks to the implementation of new technologies and great blessings, the land is blossoming. But Jews will not really return to their religion until the priesthood is restored to them and a leader of the Aaronic priesthood is called and set apart. Until that day, and even after that day, I will continue to rejoice in the restoration of Judah and Benjamin to their ancestral lands.

That's fine. I also believe the hand of God is in it . . . . . and He is probably using the machinations of the dark one regarding Israel to His own advantage.

But I think it is a mistake to think because this is true that it makes the leaders and founders of Israel sacrosanct, beyond criticism and reproach, and that the state of Israel is currently a holy nation. It is not. As the articles indicate, most Israelis are not Torah-observing Jews. And from my perception of the matter, most are secular in outlook, many are atheists, and the binding element among them is their Jewish ethnicity and identity.

One thing the Holocaust narrative has done is impel many Jews to make Aliyah. No question about it. And in some cases those going to Israel may be impelled by the Spirit, as well.

[Silver]

These two things are not mutually exclusive:
1. The land of Israel dedicated by Orson Hyde for the return of...return of who?
2. The dire need for repentance by all who organize and lead the violent activity under the auspices of Zionism.

I've taken the liberty to paste the actual prayer of dedication below as written in a letter from Elder Hyde to "Brother Pratt" (Orson or Parley?) in November 1841. (highlighting mine) He uttered some marvelous things in the prayer that are definitely worth reviewing.

While Elder Hyde (as a member of the Quorum of the Twelve) does mention a future Israel being reigned over by a "descendant from the loins of ancient David," he dedicates the land for the return of the children of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, not just the Jews.

http://www.nyx.net/~cgibbons/orson_hyde_prayer.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Prayer of Orson Hyde on the Mount of Olives

"O Thou! who art from everlasting to everlasting, eternally and unchangeably the same, even the God who rules in the heavens above, and controls the destinies of men on the earth, wilt Thou not condescend, through thine infinite goodness and royal favor, to listen to the prayer of Thy servant which he this day offers up unto Thee in the name of Thy holy child Jesus, upon this land, where the Son of Righteousness set in blood, and thine Anointed One expired.

"Be pleased, O Lord, to forgive all the follies, weaknesses, vanities, and sins of Thy servant, and strengthen him to resist all future temptations. Give him prudence and discernment that he may avoid the evil, and a heart to choose the good; give him fortitude to bear up under trying and adverse circumstances, and grace to endure all things for Thy name's sake, until the end shall come, when all the Saints shall rest in peace.

"Now, O Lord! Thy servant has been obedient to the heavenly vision which Thou gavest him in his native land; and under the shadow of Thine outstretched arm, he has safely arrived in this place to dedicate and consecrate this land unto Thee, for the gathering together of Judah's scattered remnants, according to the predictions of the holy Prophets -- for the building up of Jerusalem again after it has been trodden down by the Gentiles so long, and for rearing a Temple in honor of Thy name. Everlasting thanks be ascribed unto Thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that Thou hast preserved Thy servant from the dangers of the seas, and from the plague and pestilence which have caused the land to mourn. The violence of man has also been restrained, and Thy providential care by night and by day has been exercised over Thine unworthy servant. Accept, therefore, O Lord, the tribute of a grateful heart for all past favors, and be pleased to continue Thy kindness and mercy towards a needy worm of the dust.

"O Thou, Who didst covenant with Abraham, Thy friend, and who didst renew that covenant with Isaac, and confirm the same with Jacob with an oath, that Thou wouldst not only give them this land for an everlasting inheritance, but that Thou wouldst also remember their seed forever. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob have long since closed their eyes in death, and made the grave their mansion. Their children are scattered and dispersed abroad among the nations of the Gentiles like sheep that have no shepherd, and are still looking forward for the fulfillment of those promises which Thou didst make concerning them; and even this land, which once poured forth nature's richest bounty, and flowed, as it were, with milk and honey, has, to a certain extent, been smitten with barrenness and sterility since it drank from murderous hands the blood of Him who never sinned.

"Grant, therefore, O Lord, in the name of Thy well-beloved Son, Jesus Christ, to remove the barrenness and sterility of this land, and let springs of living water break forth to water its thirsty soil. Let the vine and olive produce in their strength, and the fig-tree bloom and flourish. Let the land become abundantly fruitful when possessed by its rightful heirs; let it again flow with plenty to feed the returning prodigals who come home with a spirit of grace and supplication; upon it let the clouds distil virtue and richness, and let the fields smile with plenty. Let the flocks and the herds greatly increase and multiply upon the mountains and the hills; and let Thy great kindness conquer and subdue the unbelief of Thy people. Do Thou take from them their stony heart, and give them a heart of flesh; and may the Sun of Thy favor dispel the cold mists of darkness which have beclouded their atmosphere. Incline them to gather in upon this land according to Thy word. Let them come like clouds and like doves to their windows. Let the large ships of the nations bring them from the distant isles; and let kings become their nursing fathers, and queens with motherly fondness wipe the tear of sorrow from their eye.

"Thou, O Lord, did once move upon the heart of Cyrus to show favor unto Jerusalem and her children. Do Thou now also be pleased to inspire the hearts of kings and the powers of the earth to look with a friendly eye towards this place, and with a desire to see Thy righteous purposes executed in relation thereto. Let them know that it is Thy good pleasure to restore the kingdom unto Israel -- raise up Jerusalem as its capital, and constitute her people a distinct nation and government, with David Thy servant, even a descendant from the loins of ancient David to be their king.

"Let that nation or that people who shall take an active part in behalf of Abraham's children, and in the raising up of Jerusalem, find favor in Thy sight. Let not their enemies prevail against them, neither let pestilence or famine overcome them, but let the glory of Israel overshadow them, and the power of the Highest protect them; while that nation or kingdom that will not serve Thee in this glorious work must perish, according to Thy word --- Yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted.

"Though Thy servant is now far from his home, and from the land bedewed with his earliest tear, yet he remembers, O Lord, his friend: who are there, and family, whom for Thy sake he has left. Though poverty and privation be our earthly lot, yet ah! do Thou richly endow us with an inheritance where moth and rust do not corrupt, and where thieves do not break through and steal.

"The hands that have fed, clothed, or shown favor unto the family of Thy servant in his absence, or that shall hereafter do so, let them not lose their reward, but let a special blessing rest upon them, and in Thy kingdom let them have an inheritance when Thou shalt come to be glorified in this society.

"Do Thou also look with favor upon all those through whose liberality I have been enabled to come to this land; and in the day when Thou shalt reward all people according to their works, let these also not be passed by or forgotten, but in time let them be in readiness to enjoy the glory of those mansions which Jesus has gone to prepare. Particularly do Thou bless the stranger in Philadelphia, whom I never saw, but who sent me gold, with a request that I should pray for him in Jerusalem. Now, O Lord, let blessings come upon him from an unexpected quarter, and let his basket be filled, and his storehouse abound with plenty, and let not the good things of the earth be his only portion, but let him be found among those to whom it shall be said, `Thou hast been faithful over a few things, and I will make thee ruler over many.'

"O my Father in heaven! I now ask Thee in the name of Jesus to remember Zion, with all her Stakes, and with all her assemblies. She has been grievously afflicted and smitten; she has mourned; she has wept; her enemies have triumphed, and have said, `Ah, where is thy God?' Her Priests and Prophets have groaned in chains and fetters within the gloomy walls of prisons, while many were slain, and now sleep in the arms of death. How long, O Lord, shall iniquity triumph, and sin go unpunished?

"Do Thou arise in the majesty of Thy strength, and make bare Thine arm in behalf of Thy people. Redress their wrongs, and turn their sorrow into joy. Pour the spirit of light and knowledge, grace and wisdom, into the hearts of her Prophets, and clothe her Priests with salvation. Let light and knowledge march forth through the empire of darkness, and may the honest in heart flow to their standard, and join in the march to go forth to meet the Bridegroom.

"Let a peculiar blessing rest upon the Presidency of Thy Church, for at them are the arrows of the enemy directed. Be Thou to them a sun and a shield, their strong tower and hiding place; and in the time of distress or danger be Thou near to deliver. Also the quorum of the Twelve, do Thou be pleased to stand by them for Thou knowest the obstacles which they have to encounter, the temptations to which they are exposed, and the privations which they must suffer. Give us, [the Twelve] therefore, strength according to our day, and help us to bear a faithful testimony of Jesus and His Gospel, to finish with fidelity and honor the work which Thou hast given us to do, and then give us a place in Thy glorious kingdom. And let this blessing rest upon every faithful officer and member in Thy Church. And all the glory and honor will we ascribe unto God and the Lamb forever and ever. Amen."

[Be_of_good_cheer]

I cannot fathom any American Orthodox Jewish being bothered by Netenyahu vigorously standing up to Obumm'er's stabbing of our best ally in the back. Netenyahu shows how to stand up for your nation.

[larsenb]

I cannot fathom any American Orthodox Jewish being bothered by Netenyahu vigorously standing up to Obumm'er's stabbing of our best ally in the back. Netenyahu shows how to stand up for your nation.

Can you fathom many Orthodox Jews being against the very State of Israel? They are. At the same time, they probably don't want to see Israel necessarily destroyed. Many of them live there, or have relatives there.

I don't particularly see Israel as our best ally. Allies don't viciously attack one of our intelligence ships, the USS liberty by name. Allies don't allow elements in their government to be involved in perpetrating 9/11. And there are other reasons, as well.

[GrandMasterB]

I cannot fathom any American Orthodox Jewish being bothered by Netenyahu vigorously standing up to Obumm'er's stabbing of our best ally in the back. Netenyahu shows how to stand up for your nation.

Can you fathom many Orthodox Jews being against the very State of Israel? They are. At the same time, they probably don't want to see Israel necessarily destroyed. Many of them live there, or have relatives there.

I don't particularly see Israel as our best ally. Allies don't viciously attack one of our intelligence ships, the USS liberty by name. Allies don't allow elements in their government to be involved in perpetrating 9/11. And there are other reasons, as well.

I love these conspiracy theories. =))

[brianj]

There is abundant evidence that the Israeli military attempted to sink the Liberty and kill all aboard. We don't know why, and their mistaken identity excuse is obviously not true. BUT that was nearly 50 years ago, everybody involved is either retired or dead, and we have developed a very strong relationship with Israel since then.

By the "hold it against them" argument, we should not have relations with Germany, Italy, or Japan. Yet we have very strong relationships with all four of those countries.

[larsenb]

I cannot fathom any American Orthodox Jewish being bothered by Netenyahu vigorously standing up to Obumm'er's stabbing of our best ally in the back. Netenyahu shows how to stand up for your nation.

Can you fathom many Orthodox Jews being against the very State of Israel? They are. At the same time, they probably don't want to see Israel necessarily destroyed. Many of them live there, or have relatives there.

I don't particularly see Israel as our best ally. Allies don't viciously attack one of our intelligence ships, the USS liberty by name. Allies don't allow elements in their government to be involved in perpetrating 9/11. And there are other reasons, as well.

I love these conspiracy theories. =))

I'm always in awe and wonderment about people who make statements about something they know nothing about.

[larsenb]

There is abundant evidence that the Israeli military attempted to sink the Liberty and kill all aboard. We don't know why, and their mistaken identity excuse is obviously not true. BUT that was nearly 50 years ago, everybody involved is either retired or dead, and we have developed a very strong relationship with Israel since then.

By the "hold it against them" argument, we should not have relations with Germany, Italy, or Japan. Yet we have very strong relationships with all four of those countries.

My argument is that thinking Israel is our best ally is off the mark. That doesn't mean we don't establish good relations with them. Their highly probable involvement (speaking of elements of the Mossad, etc., and Zionist-connected neocons) in the perpetration of 9/11 still hangs over any relationship we have with Israel. This needs serious resolution. And there are other reasons, as well.

If this assertion of Israeli involvement with 9/11 bothers anyone, they need to read the evidence Christopher Bollyn has discovered and assembled in his book: Solving 9-11, the Deception That Changed the World. Give that a thorough read and study, then get back to me.

This does not mean they acted alone. Kevin Ryan documents the non-Israeli faction that were deeply involved, as well , in his book: Another Nineteen: Investigating Legitimate 9/11 Suspects. And the orders for the perpetration of 9/11 undoubtedly came from the highest levels of the cabal that Pres. Benson warned us about.

If you're still bothered by this assertion, just give a bit of thought about who has greatly benefited by our involvement in the Near and Middle East, by our plan to overthrow 7 Muslim countries in five years that was on the table within weeks of 9/11, according to General Wesley Clark. What country would benefit by having the Muslims fighting amongst themselves? The premier of what country even stated that 9/11 was very good for them, said just after the 9/11 events? The answer is: Israel. And we've all heard about the dancing, gleeful Israelis seen celebrating and high-fiving in New Jersey as they happily videoed the attacks on the WTC. They later said they were under orders to document it. They were Mossad agents, as it came out.

And does anyone remember the Israeli Mossad agents that were caught shortly after 9/11 in a plot to bomb the Mexican Parliament?

[Sunain]

Palestinians to Trump: moving embassy to Jerusalem equals declaration of war
A close aide to Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas calls Trump's stated intention to move the US Embassy to the Israeli capital 'a declaration of war on Muslims', as another official threatens to call on Arab, Muslim countries to remove embassies from Washington.
Elior Levy|Published: 07.01.17 , 12:07
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340 ... 27,00.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Palestinian Authority has stepped up its combative rhetoric against US President-elect Donald Trump's stated mission to transfer the US Embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, which was repeated by one of his top aides.

The sentiment was expressed by Palestinian Authority Mahmoud Abbas's close advisor Mahmoud al-Habash, who on Friday called it "a declaration of war on Muslims." The description was significant not only for its content, but also for the fact that it echoed a similar sentiment voiced by former Jerusalem Mufi Achrama Sabri, whose extreme views are normally not shared by the PA.

"Everything can collapse if the embassy will be moved to Jerusalem," said al-Habash. "It can open a wide door to possibilities that no one wants." He added that they will not be able to sit idly by if such a move occurs.

Another official in the Palestinian Fatah party stated that if the embassy will be moved to Jerusalem, the PA will demand that that Arab and Muslim countries remove their embassies from Washington. The officials stressed that is not merely a Palestinian issue, but an Arab and Muslim one as well.

Abbas himself also commented on the possible scenario of the US Embassy moving to the Israeli capital. Abbas took a less militant tone, voicing his hope that Trump will not seek to implement his past statements, as it would cause irrevocable damage to the peace process.

"We heard a lot of statements relating to moving the US embassy, which we hope are not correct and will not be implemented, but if implemented then the peace process in the Middle East, and even peace in the world, will be in a crisis we will not be able to come out from," stated Abbas.

The Palestinian campaign against transferring the US embassy to Jerusalem comes less than two weeks before Trump's inauguration and days before the international peace conference that is set to be held next week in Paris. The conference will focus on trying to find a solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

Moving US Embassy to Jerusalem is 'red line,' Jordan warns
Published January 07, 2017 Associated Press

Jordan's government spokesman warned on Thursday of "catastrophic" repercussions if President-elect Donald Trump makes good on a campaign promise to move the U.S. Embassy in Israel to contested Jerusalem.

Such a move could affect relations between the U.S. and regional allies, including Jordan, Information Minister Mohammed Momani told The Associated Press, addressing the issue publicly for the first time.

An embassy move would be a "red line" for Jordan, would "inflame the Islamic and Arab streets" and serve as a "gift to extremists," he said, adding that Jordan would use all possible political and diplomatic means to try and prevent such a decision.

The U.S. considers pro-Western Jordan as an important ally in a turbulent Mideast. The Hashemite kingdom is a key member of a U.S.-led military coalition against Islamic State extremists in neighboring Syria and Iraq, and maintains discreet security ties with Israel.

Jordan also has a stake in Jerusalem, serving as custodian of Islam's third holiest shrine in the city's eastern sector.

Israel captured east Jerusalem from Jordan in 1967 and annexed it to its capital. The Palestinians want to establish the capital of a future state in the city's eastern sector. Addressing the conflicting claims in the city would be central to any renewed Israeli-Palestinian negotiations on the terms of Palestinian statehood.

Jerusalem looms large in rival Israeli and Palestinian national narratives, and disputes over holy sites there have sparked several rounds of deadly violence over the years.

Much of the world has not recognized Israel's annexation of east Jerusalem and most countries, including the United States, maintain their embassies in Tel Aviv, Israel's vibrant commercial center and seaside metropolis.

Momani, the Jordanian minister, said that moving the U.S. Embassy to Jerusalem "will have catastrophic implications on several levels, including the regional situation." He said countries in the region would likely "think about different things and steps they should take in order to stop this from happening."

"It will definitely affect the bilateral relationship between countries in the region, including Jordan, and the parties that will be related to such a decision," he said.

Trump said during the presidential campaign that he intended to move the U.S. Embassy to Jerusalem.

Last month, Trump adviser Kellyanne Conway was quoted as saying that moving the embassy to Jerusalem is a "very big priority" for the president-elect.

Trump's choice for U.S. ambassador in Israel, David Friedman, has said he looks forward to working from Jerusalem.

This very well could be the defining point of Trump's administration.

[Mark]

There is abundant evidence that the Israeli military attempted to sink the Liberty and kill all aboard. We don't know why, and their mistaken identity excuse is obviously not true. BUT that was nearly 50 years ago, everybody involved is either retired or dead, and we have developed a very strong relationship with Israel since then.

By the "hold it against them" argument, we should not have relations with Germany, Italy, or Japan. Yet we have very strong relationships with all four of those countries.

My argument is that thinking Israel is our best ally is off the mark. That doesn't mean we don't establish good relations with them. Their highly probable involvement (speaking of elements of the Mossad, etc., and Zionist-connected neocons) in the perpetration of 9/11 still hangs over any relationship we have with Israel. This needs serious resolution. And there are other reasons, as well.

If this assertion of Israeli involvement with 9/11 bothers anyone, they need to read the evidence Christopher Bollyn has discovered and assembled in his book: Solving 9-11, the Deception That Changed the World. Give that a thorough read and study, then get back to me.

This does not mean they acted alone. Kevin Ryan documents the non-Israeli faction that were deeply involved, as well , in his book: Another Nineteen: Investigating Legitimate 9/11 Suspects. And the orders for the perpetration of 9/11 undoubtedly came from the highest levels of the cabal that Pres. Benson warned us about.

If you're still bothered by this assertion, just give a bit of thought about who has greatly benefited by our involvement in the Near and Middle East, by our plan to overthrow 7 Muslim countries in five years that was on the table within weeks of 9/11, according to General Wesley Clark. What country would benefit by having the Muslims fighting amongst themselves? The premier of what country even stated that 9/11 was very good for them, said just after the 9/11 events? The answer is: Israel. And we've all heard about the dancing, gleeful Israelis seen celebrating and high-fiving in New Jersey as they happily videoed the attacks on the WTC. They later said they were under orders to document it. They were Mossad agents, as it came out.

And does anyone remember the Israeli Mossad agents that were caught shortly after 9/11 in a plot to bomb the Mexican Parliament?

Do not let your 9-11 involvement theories that are full of unproven and unsubstantiated allegations distract you from seeing the big picture regarding the destiny of Judah and the state of Israel. Pres Bensons speech outlines our relationship and kinship with the Jews and Israel. Are you as an American responsible and accountable for the actions and decisions of latter day gadiantons like Obama in our govt?

https://www.lds.org/ensign/1976/12/a-me ... h?lang=eng" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[brianj]

Palestinians to Trump: moving embassy to Jerusalem equals declaration of war
A close aide to Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas calls Trump's stated intention to move the US Embassy to the Israeli capital 'a declaration of war on Muslims', as another official threatens to call on Arab, Muslim countries to remove embassies from Washington.
Elior Levy|Published: 07.01.17 , 12:07
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340 ... 27,00.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This very well could be the defining point of Trump's administration.

Muslims have already declared war on the United States, so why not?

[cab]

There is abundant evidence that the Israeli military attempted to sink the Liberty and kill all aboard. We don't know why, and their mistaken identity excuse is obviously not true. BUT that was nearly 50 years ago, everybody involved is either retired or dead, and we have developed a very strong relationship with Israel since then.

By the "hold it against them" argument, we should not have relations with Germany, Italy, or Japan. Yet we have very strong relationships with all four of those countries.

My argument is that thinking Israel is our best ally is off the mark. That doesn't mean we don't establish good relations with them. Their highly probable involvement (speaking of elements of the Mossad, etc., and Zionist-connected neocons) in the perpetration of 9/11 still hangs over any relationship we have with Israel. This needs serious resolution. And there are other reasons, as well.

If this assertion of Israeli involvement with 9/11 bothers anyone, they need to read the evidence Christopher Bollyn has discovered and assembled in his book: Solving 9-11, the Deception That Changed the World. Give that a thorough read and study, then get back to me.

This does not mean they acted alone. Kevin Ryan documents the non-Israeli faction that were deeply involved, as well , in his book: Another Nineteen: Investigating Legitimate 9/11 Suspects. And the orders for the perpetration of 9/11 undoubtedly came from the highest levels of the cabal that Pres. Benson warned us about.

If you're still bothered by this assertion, just give a bit of thought about who has greatly benefited by our involvement in the Near and Middle East, by our plan to overthrow 7 Muslim countries in five years that was on the table within weeks of 9/11, according to General Wesley Clark. What country would benefit by having the Muslims fighting amongst themselves? The premier of what country even stated that 9/11 was very good for them, said just after the 9/11 events? The answer is: Israel. And we've all heard about the dancing, gleeful Israelis seen celebrating and high-fiving in New Jersey as they happily videoed the attacks on the WTC. They later said they were under orders to document it. They were Mossad agents, as it came out.

And does anyone remember the Israeli Mossad agents that were caught shortly after 9/11 in a plot to bomb the Mexican Parliament?

Do not let your 9-11 involvement theories that are full of unproven and unsubstantiated allegations distract you from seeing the big picture regarding the destiny of Judah and the state of Israel. Pres Bensons speech outlines our relationship and kinship with the Jews and Israel. Are you as an American responsible and accountable for the actions and decisions of latter day gadiantons like Obama in our govt?

https://www.lds.org/ensign/1976/12/a-me ... h?lang=eng" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is amazing how people limit their view of modern day Gadianton to just the Democratic party. Before ever saying something like that again, PLEASE go read the book President Benson recommended over the pulpit called "None Dare Call it Conspiracy" by Gary Allen.

Modern Day Gadianton has most of the LDS community blindly supporting the State of Israel. I wish I could scream this from the rooftops - "ISRAEL is not the State of Israel!!! Orthodox Jews are NOT Jews!!!"

Before you fight me on this point, please go look at the Talmud. This is what the Orthodox/Pharasiacal Jews follow. This book completely confirms that their church is the synagogue of Satan. Please ask yourselves what IS Israel, what makes one a Jew?

[Sunain]

Israelis outraged by UNESCO naming town a Palestinian heritage site

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Updated: Friday, July 7, 2017, 8:07 PM

JERUSALEM — The U.N. cultural agency on Friday declared the old city in the West Bank town of Hebron as a Palestinian world heritage site, a decision that outraged Israeli officials who say the move negated the deep Jewish ties to the biblical town and its ancient shrine.

The move was the latest chapter in Israel's contentious relationship with UNESCO, an agency it accuses of being an anti-Israeli tool that makes decisions out of political considerations.

While the Palestinians welcomed the action, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu called it "another delusional decision by UNESCO."

Both Jews and Muslims revere the same site in Hebron as the traditional burial place of the biblical patriarchs and matriarchs — Jews call it the Tomb of the Patriarchs, while for Muslims it is the Ibrahimi Mosque.

The 12-3 vote, with six abstentions, came on a secret ballot at an annual UNESCO World Heritage Committee meeting in Krakow, Poland. The proposal came from the Palestinian side. Israel contended that its historic links to Hebron were ignored and its ambassador to UNESCO left the session.

UNESCO spokeswoman Lucia Iglesias confirmed that Hebron's old city was put on the agency's World Heritage list and on the list of sites in danger. She would not elaborate, saying the exact wording would be decided later.

The decision obliges the World Heritage committee to review its status annually.

"This is a historical development because it stressed that Hebron and the Ibrahimi Mosque historically belong to the Palestinian people," said Palestinian Minister of Tourism Rula Maayah.

But Israel's Deputy Foreign Minister Tzipi Hotovely said UNESCO's "automatic Arab majority succeeded in passing the proposed resolution that attempts to appropriate the national symbols of the Jewish people."

She added: "This is a badge of shame for UNESCO, who time after time chooses to stand on the side of lies."

Netanyahu expressed outrage that UNESCO determined the Tomb of the Patriarchs in Hebron "is a Palestinian site, meaning not Jewish, and that the site is in danger."

"Not a Jewish site?!" he asked sarcastically. "Who is buried there? Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Sarah, Rebecca and Leah — our patriarchs and matriarchs!"

Netanyahu pointed to extremists blowing up religious sites in the Middle East and said, "It is only in those places where Israel is, such as Hebron, that freedom of religion for all is ensured."

This is the second time in as many months (links to earlier post in this thread) that I can recall that the UN/UNESCO has voted to disavow any historical relevance for Jewish sites. The UN is trying to whitewash Israel.