Do you believe Julie?

[durangout]

"There are some among us now who have not been regularly ordained by the heads of the Church and who tell of impending political and economic chaos, the end of the world—something of the “sky is falling, chicken licken” of the fables. They are misleading members to gather to colonies or cults.

Those deceivers say that the Brethren do not know what is going on in the world or that the Brethren approve of their teaching but do not wish to speak of it over the pulpit. Neither is true. The Brethren, by virtue of traveling constantly everywhere on earth, certainly know what is going on, and by virtue of prophetic insight are able to read the signs of the times.

Do not be deceived by them—those deceivers. If there is to be any gathering, it will be announced by those who have been regularly ordained and who are known to the Church to have authority." Oct. 1992 GC


JR says "Ouch!"

[Zathura]

"There are some among us now who have not been regularly ordained by the heads of the Church and who tell of impending political and economic chaos, the end of the world—something of the “sky is falling, chicken licken” of the fables. They are misleading members to gather to colonies or cults.

Those deceivers say that the Brethren do not know what is going on in the world or that the Brethren approve of their teaching but do not wish to speak of it over the pulpit. Neither is true. The Brethren, by virtue of traveling constantly everywhere on earth, certainly know what is going on, and by virtue of prophetic insight are able to read the signs of the times.

Do not be deceived by them—those deceivers. If there is to be any gathering, it will be announced by those who have been regularly ordained and who are known to the Church to have authority." Oct. 1992 GC


JR says "Ouch!"

From what I've seen, these "deceivers" still claim hat Thomas Monson is God's prophet and the chruch is led by Christ's Apostles, do they not, and that God's prophets will be the ones calling others out?? I haven't bothered reading these books so I'm honestly asking.

[durangout]

"There are some among us now who have not been regularly ordained by the heads of the Church and who tell of impending political and economic chaos, the end of the world—something of the “sky is falling, chicken licken” of the fables. They are misleading members to gather to colonies or cults.

Those deceivers say that the Brethren do not know what is going on in the world or that the Brethren approve of their teaching but do not wish to speak of it over the pulpit. Neither is true. The Brethren, by virtue of traveling constantly everywhere on earth, certainly know what is going on, and by virtue of prophetic insight are able to read the signs of the times.

Do not be deceived by them—those deceivers. If there is to be any gathering, it will be announced by those who have been regularly ordained and who are known to the Church to have authority." Oct. 1992 GC


JR says "Ouch!"

From what I've seen, these "deceivers" still claim hat Thomas Monson is God's prophet and the chruch is led by Christ's Apostles, do they not, and that God's prophets will be the ones calling others out?? I haven't bothered reading these books so I'm honestly asking.

These books are best described as scriptures mingled with the philosophies of men. Endowed members were warned about this. satan tells many truths to get you to believe one lie. One of the correct things in the book is what you mention above. Why I ask myself would someone purposely ingest many falsities just to get at one or two truths? That seems very counterproductive to me.

[brianj]

Personal jabs aside, how many JR believers will change their vote if nothing happens this month or next to validate her predictions?

Since I have believed we will be invited to gather long before I came to know of Julie Rowe, if nothing happens this year then I will assume her timing was off.

But if it makes you happy, if nothing happens before the end of November then I will say Hector Sosa was wrong. After all, he specifically said that we will gather in spring 2016 and things will go bad so fast that Obama uses the state of the union as an excuse for trying to suspend elections then refusing to honor the results.

[brianj]

From what I've seen, these "deceivers" still claim hat Thomas Monson is God's prophet and the chruch is led by Christ's Apostles, do they not, and that God's prophets will be the ones calling others out?? I haven't bothered reading these books so I'm honestly asking.

This is correct. Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, and others say that they have seen what is coming. They tell us why we need food storage and how we will use it. They tell us how important it will be for all of us to rely on personal revelation and encourage us to study the scriptures, pray frequently, and draw close to the Holy Ghost so we can rely on personal revelation. And they tell us that, when the invitation (not a call, but an invitation) to gather comes, it will come from the First Presidency - either directly through broadcasts to some stakes or indirectly, with subordinate authorities being delegated to extend the invitation.

And this is why I have such a hard time with people who call Julie Rowe and others deceivers.

Would a deceiver tell us to study scriptures?
Would a deceiver tell us to pray frequently?
Would a deceiver tell us to follow the Prophet?
I could see a deceiver telling us to listen to the Spirit, but only if they were telling us other messages that would lead us away from the Holy Ghost so the answer would come from another issue. But the other three bits of advice don't lead us away from the Holy Ghost - and they are the same advice I receive from other leaders.

[setyourselffree]

From what I've seen, these "deceivers" still claim hat Thomas Monson is God's prophet and the chruch is led by Christ's Apostles, do they not, and that God's prophets will be the ones calling others out?? I haven't bothered reading these books so I'm honestly asking.

This is correct. Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, and others say that they have seen what is coming. They tell us why we need food storage and how we will use it. They tell us how important it will be for all of us to rely on personal revelation and encourage us to study the scriptures, pray frequently, and draw close to the Holy Ghost so we can rely on personal revelation. And they tell us that, when the invitation (not a call, but an invitation) to gather comes, it will come from the First Presidency - either directly through broadcasts to some stakes or indirectly, with subordinate authorities being delegated to extend the invitation.

And this is why I have such a hard time with people who call Julie Rowe and others deceivers.

Would a deceiver tell us to study scriptures?
Would a deceiver tell us to pray frequently?
Would a deceiver tell us to follow the Prophet?
I could see a deceiver telling us to listen to the Spirit, but only if they were telling us other messages that would lead us away from the Holy Ghost so the answer would come from another issue. But the other three bits of advice don't lead us away from the Holy Ghost - and they are the same advice I receive from other leaders.

For someone who wants us to follow the prophet, pray, and study our scriptures she sure has divided the Saints throughout the Church.

[Ted]

And this is why I have such a hard time with people who call Julie Rowe and others deceivers.

Would a deceiver tell us to study scriptures?
Would a deceiver tell us to pray frequently?
Would a deceiver tell us to follow the Prophet?
I could see a deceiver telling us to listen to the Spirit, but only if they were telling us other messages that would lead us away from the Holy Ghost so the answer would come from another issue. But the other three bits of advice don't lead us away from the Holy Ghost - and they are the same advice I receive from other leaders.

Why do Julie Rowe and these others charge us money to hear their message if it is so important? Didn't they all claim that the Lord told them to tell others? Did the Lord also tell them to sell their books for profit?

Please don't tell me they make little or nothing off the sales of their books. If money is not a motivation then I assume they wouldn't mind if we all made copies of their books and distributed these copies to all our friends. Please get written permission from the authors of these books to do so and post here. I highly doubt any of these authors would give such permission. They need to put their books in the public domain or shut up, IMHO.

[durangout]

From what I've seen, these "deceivers" still claim hat Thomas Monson is God's prophet and the chruch is led by Christ's Apostles, do they not, and that God's prophets will be the ones calling others out?? I haven't bothered reading these books so I'm honestly asking.

This is correct. Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, and others say that they have seen what is coming. They tell us why we need food storage and how we will use it. They tell us how important it will be for all of us to rely on personal revelation and encourage us to study the scriptures, pray frequently, and draw close to the Holy Ghost so we can rely on personal revelation. And they tell us that, when the invitation (not a call, but an invitation) to gather comes, it will come from the First Presidency - either directly through broadcasts to some stakes or indirectly, with subordinate authorities being delegated to extend the invitation.

And this is why I have such a hard time with people who call Julie Rowe and others deceivers.

Would a deceiver tell us to study scriptures?
Would a deceiver tell us to pray frequently?
Would a deceiver tell us to follow the Prophet?
I could see a deceiver telling us to listen to the Spirit, but only if they were telling us other messages that would lead us away from the Holy Ghost so the answer would come from another issue. But the other three bits of advice don't lead us away from the Holy Ghost - and they are the same advice I receive from other leaders.

JR / Spencer mix truth with copious amounts of false doctrone and other "distortions" of the truth. Read at your own risk.

[smitty94]

From what I've seen, these "deceivers" still claim hat Thomas Monson is God's prophet and the chruch is led by Christ's Apostles, do they not, and that God's prophets will be the ones calling others out?? I haven't bothered reading these books so I'm honestly asking.

This is correct. Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, and others say that they have seen what is coming. Nephi saw what was coming as was commanded to not write it. What makes JR, HS, or Spencer the Lord's chosen vessel's to give us this message? They tell us why we need food storage and how we will use it. Church leaders have told us what to store and why, why do we need Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer to tell us, using their extravagant stories? They tell us how important it will be for all of us to rely on personal revelation and encourage us to study the scriptures, pray frequently, and draw close to the Holy Ghost so we can rely on personal revelation. And they tell us that, when the invitation (not a call, but an invitation) to gather comes, it will come from the First Presidency - either directly through broadcasts to some stakes or indirectly, with subordinate authorities being delegated to extend the invitation. Elder Holland's words directly contradict a call out. So who is right Julie or Elder Holland?

And this is why I have such a hard time with people who call Julie Rowe and others deceivers.

Would a deceiver tell us to study scriptures? Yes, see below
Would a deceiver tell us to pray frequently? Yes, see below
Would a deceiver tell us to follow the Prophet? Yes, see below
I could see a deceiver telling us to listen to the Spirit, but only if they were telling us other messages that would lead us away from the Holy Ghost so the answer would come from another issue. But the other three bits of advice don't lead us away from the Holy Ghost - and they are the same advice I receive from other leaders.

Satan will tell us 99 truths to get us to believe 1 lie. Once we believe that 1 lie, it is easier for him to get us to believe 2, and so on.

How many church members could be deceived by someone claiming to be a prophet and then foretelling future events? Probably not many. However, how many could be deceived by someone NOT claiming to be a prophet, telling us to continue following the Prophet, study scriptures, and pray, and but still foretelling future events? It is much easier for satan to mingle scripture (truth) with philosophies of man (lies) and get us to believe it than to tell us outright, unbelievable lies.

I would say follow Julie's advice and (but first stop reading books like hers and VOG, which is not her advice) and pick up the scriptures. Elder Ballard recently explained that spending quality time studying the Book of Mormon, while avoiding things that may be deceiving, will help a person see much clearer any lies satan is spewing. Do it as a test. Drop the NDE books and exclusively read the Scriptures for a time and see what happens. Is Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer telling us to do that? I have talked with many good church members who have almost replaced their scriptures with these books, and teach their children the same.

I have noticed a common theme around personal revelation when I talk with those that believe in Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer's messages. I firmly believe that each of us is entitled to our own personal revelation, but I feel very uneasy when someone discusses this in context of Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer's messages. It seems part of the deception is for satan to get us to believe that our right to personal revelation supersedes the Prophet's right to receive revelation for the church as a whole. If large chunks of saints are asked to go live in tent cities, preparation for that event will come directly through the Prophet, it is his right to receive that revelation for the whole Church. We should then seek personal revelation pertaining to the truthfulness of the Prophet's message. Seeking personal revelation pertaining to the truthfulness of Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer's messages seems very odd. This is just my experience listening to many believers of Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer.

Lastly, I believe there is no reason for the Lord to provide us with a 'movie trailer' for an upcoming event via Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer; however this is what they want us to believe. That the Lord will give some people a preview of what is coming and then have those people give the message to the rest of the Church, and do it for money seems very much like deception to me.

[brianj]

Why do Julie Rowe and these others charge us money to hear their message if it is so important? Didn't they all claim that the Lord told them to tell others? Did the Lord also tell them to sell their books for profit?

I went to one of her talks and wasn't charged any money. I have heard from people who went to listen to her at other appearances around the US and they weren't charged any money either.

Julie did express a belief that, if she posted her book in a downloadable format online, people opposed to her testimony would edit the book and distribute the modified version in an effort to discredit her. With thousands of printed copies of her book in circulation, any effort to distort the statements in her books could be debunked by opening the book.

I understand that a lot of people are upset at Julie Rowe and others for making money off their books. Do you feel the same way about President Monson making money off his books?

[Zathura]

Why do Julie Rowe and these others charge us money to hear their message if it is so important? Didn't they all claim that the Lord told them to tell others? Did the Lord also tell them to sell their books for profit?

I went to one of her talks and wasn't charged any money. I have heard from people who went to listen to her at other appearances around the US and they weren't charged any money either.

Julie did express a belief that, if she posted her book in a downloadable format online, people opposed to her testimony would edit the book and distribute the modified version in an effort to discredit her. With thousands of printed copies of her book in circulation, any effort to distort the statements in her books could be debunked by opening the book.

I understand that a lot of people are upset at Julie Rowe and others for making money off their books. Do you feel the same way about President Monson making money off his books?

It's pure hypocrisy to say that Julie Rowe or anyone else can't charge money for their book for whatever reason, if you're okay with Thomas Monson, Jeffrey Holland, David Bednar, and basically every other Apostle from making money on their own books.

Whatever they are doing with that money is between them and God. It seems almost like Priestcraft to make money off of these books,unless this money for a good purpose like charity or something.

[Zathura]

From what I've seen, these "deceivers" still claim hat Thomas Monson is God's prophet and the chruch is led by Christ's Apostles, do they not, and that God's prophets will be the ones calling others out?? I haven't bothered reading these books so I'm honestly asking.

This is correct. Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, and others say that they have seen what is coming. Nephi saw what was coming as was commanded to not write it. What makes JR, HS, or Spencer the Lord's chosen vessel's to give us this message? They tell us why we need food storage and how we will use it. Church leaders have told us what to store and why, why do we need Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer to tell us, using their extravagant stories? They tell us how important it will be for all of us to rely on personal revelation and encourage us to study the scriptures, pray frequently, and draw close to the Holy Ghost so we can rely on personal revelation. And they tell us that, when the invitation (not a call, but an invitation) to gather comes, it will come from the First Presidency - either directly through broadcasts to some stakes or indirectly, with subordinate authorities being delegated to extend the invitation. Elder Holland's words directly contradict a call out. So who is right Julie or Elder Holland?

And this is why I have such a hard time with people who call Julie Rowe and others deceivers.

Would a deceiver tell us to study scriptures? Yes, see below
Would a deceiver tell us to pray frequently? Yes, see below
Would a deceiver tell us to follow the Prophet? Yes, see below
I could see a deceiver telling us to listen to the Spirit, but only if they were telling us other messages that would lead us away from the Holy Ghost so the answer would come from another issue. But the other three bits of advice don't lead us away from the Holy Ghost - and they are the same advice I receive from other leaders.

Satan will tell us 99 truths to get us to believe 1 lie. Once we believe that 1 lie, it is easier for him to get us to believe 2, and so on.

How many church members could be deceived by someone claiming to be a prophet and then foretelling future events? Probably not many. However, how many could be deceived by someone NOT claiming to be a prophet, telling us to continue following the Prophet, study scriptures, and pray, and but still foretelling future events? It is much easier for satan to mingle scripture (truth) with philosophies of man (lies) and get us to believe it than to tell us outright, unbelievable lies.

I would say follow Julie's advice and (but first stop reading books like hers and VOG, which is not her advice) and pick up the scriptures. Elder Ballard recently explained that spending quality time studying the Book of Mormon, while avoiding things that may be deceiving, will help a person see much clearer any lies satan is spewing. Do it as a test. Drop the NDE books and exclusively read the Scriptures for a time and see what happens. Is Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer telling us to do that? I have talked with many good church members who have almost replaced their scriptures with these books, and teach their children the same.

I have noticed a common theme around personal revelation when I talk with those that believe in Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer's messages. I firmly believe that each of us is entitled to our own personal revelation, but I feel very uneasy when someone discusses this in context of Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer's messages. It seems part of the deception is for satan to get us to believe that our right to personal revelation supersedes the Prophet's right to receive revelation for the church as a whole. If large chunks of saints are asked to go live in tent cities, preparation for that event will come directly through the Prophet, it is his right to receive that revelation for the whole Church. We should then seek personal revelation pertaining to the truthfulness of the Prophet's message. Seeking personal revelation pertaining to the truthfulness of Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer's messages seems very odd. This is just my experience listening to many believers of Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer.

Lastly, I believe there is no reason for the Lord to provide us with a 'movie trailer' for an upcoming event via Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, or Spencer; however this is what they want us to believe. That the Lord will give some people a preview of what is coming and then have those people give the message to the rest of the Church, and do it for money seems very much like deception to me.

Of course it's wrong if people stop reading scriptures and only read these NDE read books. Its just as bad as dropping scriptures to only read GC talks and the Ensign.

[AgaetisTakk]

Why do Julie Rowe and these others charge us money to hear their message if it is so important? Didn't they all claim that the Lord told them to tell others? Did the Lord also tell them to sell their books for profit?

I went to one of her talks and wasn't charged any money. I have heard from people who went to listen to her at other appearances around the US and they weren't charged any money either.

Julie did express a belief that, if she posted her book in a downloadable format online, people opposed to her testimony would edit the book and distribute the modified version in an effort to discredit her. With thousands of printed copies of her book in circulation, any effort to distort the statements in her books could be debunked by opening the book.

I understand that a lot of people are upset at Julie Rowe and others for making money off their books. Do you feel the same way about President Monson making money off his books?

Julie Rowe does offer her book in a downloadable format online. Both her books are now available on Kindle, and it's only $10 to read the lords message.

Seems like a good deal for Julie. She's sold over 20,000 copies of both her books. My conservative estimation is she has a revenue of about $200,000 off book sales in just over a year.

[christian.a]

"There are some among us now who have not been regularly ordained by the heads of the Church and who tell of impending political and economic chaos, the end of the world—something of the “sky is falling, chicken licken” of the fables. They are misleading members to gather to colonies or cults.

Those deceivers say that the Brethren do not know what is going on in the world or that the Brethren approve of their teaching but do not wish to speak of it over the pulpit. Neither is true. The Brethren, by virtue of traveling constantly everywhere on earth, certainly know what is going on, and by virtue of prophetic insight are able to read the signs of the times.

Do not be deceived by them—those deceivers. If there is to be any gathering, it will be announced by those who have been regularly ordained and who are known to the Church to have authority." Oct. 1992 GC


JR says "Ouch!"

Keyword: IF. Basically it says if there will be a gathering, the church leaders will announce it, not a member. I agree. You don't want another Waco, Texas incident. However, to play the devils advocate, Julie Rowe isn't saying anything more than that the leaders would announce it. She's not sounding the alarm and telling people to gather, only telling people that she has seen that the general authorities would give the announcement.

As long as it stays that way, I see no harm. If she's wrong, she will have brought judgement and condemnation upon herself for her wrongdoings. If she is right, splendid. We had a little bit of a warning. I don't see why there's so much argument. Either she saw the things she said she did, or she didn't. Time will tell.

[Ted]

Why do Julie Rowe and these others charge us money to hear their message if it is so important? Didn't they all claim that the Lord told them to tell others? Did the Lord also tell them to sell their books for profit?

I went to one of her talks and wasn't charged any money. I have heard from people who went to listen to her at other appearances around the US and they weren't charged any money either.

Julie did express a belief that, if she posted her book in a downloadable format online, people opposed to her testimony would edit the book and distribute the modified version in an effort to discredit her. With thousands of printed copies of her book in circulation, any effort to distort the statements in her books could be debunked by opening the book.

The "lost 116 pages" argument may have been valid in Joseph Smith Jr's day but doesn't really work today. We live in an age that Julie could easily protect against something like this. She could publish her book on a website under her control. She could digital sign the PDF file so it could be easy to detect if the document has been modified. She could just copyright the document ( http://www.copyright.gov" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ). In short, without getting technical, there are ways that could easily protect against someone publishing a derived work these days.

I understand that a lot of people are upset at Julie Rowe and others for making money off their books. Do you feel the same way about President Monson making money off his books?

I don't recall President Monson claiming that the Lord commanded him to write his books to get the message out in any of his books of his that I have read. If so, he would publish the Lord's message on lds.org, most likely, or deliver it in general conference. On the other hand, Julie Rowe and others do make the claim that the Lord told them they should tell other people about their dreams. Correct?

Making the claim that the Lord told her to do it and then profiting off it doesn't sit right with me. This is a huge red flag, IMHO.

[Ted]

Why do Julie Rowe and these others charge us money to hear their message if it is so important? Didn't they all claim that the Lord told them to tell others? Did the Lord also tell them to sell their books for profit?

I went to one of her talks and wasn't charged any money. I have heard from people who went to listen to her at other appearances around the US and they weren't charged any money either.

Julie did express a belief that, if she posted her book in a downloadable format online, people opposed to her testimony would edit the book and distribute the modified version in an effort to discredit her. With thousands of printed copies of her book in circulation, any effort to distort the statements in her books could be debunked by opening the book.

I understand that a lot of people are upset at Julie Rowe and others for making money off their books. Do you feel the same way about President Monson making money off his books?

It's pure hypocrisy to say that Julie Rowe or anyone else can't charge money for their book for whatever reason, if you're okay with Thomas Monson, Jeffrey Holland, David Bednar, and basically every other Apostle from making money on their own books.

And it is not hypocritical to say the Lord told her to do and then profit off it? Please show me in any of the Apostles' books where they state that the Lord told them to write a book about their dreams. Also, there are Apostles that give their books away for free. For example, as kindle ebooks:

http://www.amazon.com/Your-Happily-Afte ... 606416529/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.amazon.com/Remarkable-Soul-W ... 606412442/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Also, keep in mind, there is a major difference between Julie Rowe and the Apostles when it comes to revelation.

Whatever they are doing with that money is between them and God. It seems almost like Priestcraft to make money off of these books,unless this money for a good purpose like charity or something.

And Julie Rowe donates all the proceeds from her books to charity or something?

[Ted]

Why do Julie Rowe and these others charge us money to hear their message if it is so important? Didn't they all claim that the Lord told them to tell others? Did the Lord also tell them to sell their books for profit?

I went to one of her talks and wasn't charged any money. I have heard from people who went to listen to her at other appearances around the US and they weren't charged any money either.

Julie did express a belief that, if she posted her book in a downloadable format online, people opposed to her testimony would edit the book and distribute the modified version in an effort to discredit her. With thousands of printed copies of her book in circulation, any effort to distort the statements in her books could be debunked by opening the book.

I understand that a lot of people are upset at Julie Rowe and others for making money off their books. Do you feel the same way about President Monson making money off his books?

Julie Rowe does offer her book in a downloadable format online. Both her books are now available on Kindle, and it's only $10 to read the lords message.

Seems like a good deal for Julie. She's sold over 20,000 copies of both her books. My conservative estimation is she has a revenue of about $200,000 off book sales in just over a year.

It doesn't cost me anything to download the scriptures and the ensign, the actual Lord's message.

I wonder how much she has made from her "energy healing" conference calls that she charges $25/person. How much does Thomas Monson charge folks to attend general conference these days?

[Zathura]

Why do Julie Rowe and these others charge us money to hear their message if it is so important? Didn't they all claim that the Lord told them to tell others? Did the Lord also tell them to sell their books for profit?

I went to one of her talks and wasn't charged any money. I have heard from people who went to listen to her at other appearances around the US and they weren't charged any money either.

Julie did express a belief that, if she posted her book in a downloadable format online, people opposed to her testimony would edit the book and distribute the modified version in an effort to discredit her. With thousands of printed copies of her book in circulation, any effort to distort the statements in her books could be debunked by opening the book.

I understand that a lot of people are upset at Julie Rowe and others for making money off their books. Do you feel the same way about President Monson making money off his books?

It's pure hypocrisy to say that Julie Rowe or anyone else can't charge money for their book for whatever reason, if you're okay with Thomas Monson, Jeffrey Holland, David Bednar, and basically every other Apostle from making money on their own books.

And it is not hypocritical to say the Lord told her to do and then profit off it? Please show me in any of the Apostles' books where they state that the Lord told them to write a book about their dreams. Also, there are Apostles that give their books away for free. For example, as kindle ebooks:

http://www.amazon.com/Your-Happily-Afte ... 606416529/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.amazon.com/Remarkable-Soul-W ... 606412442/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Also, keep in mind, there is a major difference between Julie Rowe and the Apostles when it comes to revelation.

Whatever they are doing with that money is between them and God. It seems almost like Priestcraft to make money off of these books,unless this money for a good purpose like charity or something.

And Julie Rowe donates all the proceeds from her books to charity or something?

I didn't say Julie donates at all, I didn't say that Apostles did either. I know nothing about Julie Rowe, never read her book or her speeches. All I'm saying is anyone who criticizes her for selling her books for profit, while at the same time say that its okay for Thomas Monson or David Bednar to sell their own books, that person is a hypocrite. My opinion is completely objective.

The fact that these apostles offer some books free doesn't change the fact that those same Apostles sell other books for profit. So like I said, what they do with that profit is between them and God. If these Apostles or Julie or Hector or whoever else takes this money and donates it to charity or the church, that'd be fine. If they use it for themselves, that's between them and God.

[Zathura]

From what I've studied, preaching The Word of God in exchange for profit is priestcraft. Writing a book about the gospel and selling it for profit seems to me to be priestcraft. I accept that it could not be, I just suggest that it is. If the profit is used to help the poor, obviously there's no problem with that profit. Whatever these authors do with this profit is between them and God, and they have to answer to him, nobody else.

[Ted]

I didn't say Julie donates at all, I didn't say that Apostles did either. I know nothing about Julie Rowe, never read her book or her speeches. All I'm saying is anyone who criticizes her for selling her books for profit, while at the same time say that its okay for Thomas Monson or David Bednar to sell their own books, that person is a hypocrite. My opinion is completely objective.

The fact that these apostles offer some books free doesn't change the fact that those same Apostles sell other books for profit. So like I said, what they do with that profit is between them and God. If these Apostles or Julie or Hector or whoever else takes this money and donates it to charity or the church, that'd be fine. If they use it for themselves, that's between them and God.

Forget Monson or Bednar for a moment and compare Julie Rowe to Deiter Uchtdorf. Uchtdorf's books are freely downloadable to kindle readers. I don't think Uchtdorf makes the claim that the Lord or anyone else told him to write and publish this books like Rowe claims with her books. There, now you don't have to call me a hypocrite anymore.

Julie, of course, profits from her "energy healing" conference talks as well. I don't think Monson or Bednar sell their conference talks as far as I know. Am I still being a hypocrite in your completely objective opinion?

Comparing Julie Rowe to Monson or Bednar is comparing apples to oranges, IMHO. Julie makes the claim that the Lord told her to publish these books. Neither Monson or Bednar make that claim in their books, as far as I know. If the Lord wants his will or prophecy to be known that is usually announced in conference or some official declaration and NOT sold in a book. Julie Rowe is selling prophecy of the Lord, if her claims are true. Monson and Bednar, on the other hand, are selling their inspirational messages and stories and NOT any kind of prophecy, as far as I know.

If Rowe's claims are true then it seems that she is a prophet and seer by definition...

Prophet: a person regarded as an inspired teacher or proclaimer of the will of God.

seer: a person who is supposed to be able, through supernatural insight, to see what the future holds.

What is your completely objective opinion?

[brlenox]

From what I've seen, these "deceivers" still claim hat Thomas Monson is God's prophet and the church is led by Christ's Apostles, do they not, and that God's prophets will be the ones calling others out?? I haven't bothered reading these books so I'm honestly asking.

This is correct. Julie Rowe, Hector Sosa, and others say that they have seen what is coming. They tell us why we need food storage and how we will use it. They tell us how important it will be for all of us to rely on personal revelation and encourage us to study the scriptures, pray frequently, and draw close to the Holy Ghost so we can rely on personal revelation. And they tell us that, when the invitation (not a call, but an invitation) to gather comes, it will come from the First Presidency - either directly through broadcasts to some stakes or indirectly, with subordinate authorities being delegated to extend the invitation.

And this is why I have such a hard time with people who call Julie Rowe and others deceivers.

Would a deceiver tell us to study scriptures?
Would a deceiver tell us to pray frequently?
Would a deceiver tell us to follow the Prophet?

I could see a deceiver telling us to listen to the Spirit, but only if they were telling us other messages that would lead us away from the Holy Ghost so the answer would come from another issue. But the other three bits of advice don't lead us away from the Holy Ghost - and they are the same advice I receive from other leaders.

Acts 16:16 And it came to pass, as we went to prayer, a certain damsel possessed with a spirit of divination met us, which brought her masters much gain by soothsaying:

div·i·na·tion ˌdivəˈnāSH(ə)n/noun the practice of seeking knowledge of the future or the unknown by supernatural means.

17 The same followed Paul and us, and cried, saying,These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation.

Acts illustrates that someone who has the talent of seeking knowledge of the future or the unknown by supernatural means may preach of the veracity of the leaders of the church and declare them servants of the most high God that know the path of salvation.

At this point what makes this person any different from those in this day and age which might do the same. However, almost surprisingly Paul recognizes that she is not what she appears and

Acts 16:18
18 And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour.

What Paul does here is referenced by a Joseph Smith statement:

...who can drag into daylight and develop the hidden mysteries of the false spirits that so frequently are made manifest among the Latter-day Saints? We answer that no man can do this without the Priesthood, and having a knowledge of the laws by which spirits are governed; for as no man knows the things of God, but by the Spirit of God, so no man knows the spirit of the devil, and his power and influence, but by possessing intelligence which is more than human, and having unfolded through the medium of the Priesthood the mysteries operations of his devices; without knowing the angelic form, the sanctified look and gesture, and the zeal that is frequently manifested by him for the glory of God, together with the prophetic spirit, the gracious influence, the godly appearance, and the holy garb, which are so characteristic of his proceedings and his mysterious windings.

A man must have the discerning of spirits before he can drag into daylight this hellish influence and unfold it unto the world in all its soul-destroying, diabolical, and horrid colors; for nothing is a greater injury to the children of men than to be under the influence of a false spirit when they think they have the Spirit of God. ((Contributor, vol. 3 (October 1881-September 1882), Vol. Iii. June, 1882. No. 9. 257 - 258.))

For myself this opens the potential that we must be very cautious as to whom we give credence as spokesmen for the Lord. I feel the recent "spurious" observation by the Brethren may be an identifying effort that references the Joseph Smith quote that should subtly influence our recognition of a potential acknowledgment that all is not as it appears.

[Zathura]

I didn't say Julie donates at all, I didn't say that Apostles did either. I know nothing about Julie Rowe, never read her book or her speeches. All I'm saying is anyone who criticizes her for selling her books for profit, while at the same time say that its okay for Thomas Monson or David Bednar to sell their own books, that person is a hypocrite. My opinion is completely objective.

The fact that these apostles offer some books free doesn't change the fact that those same Apostles sell other books for profit. So like I said, what they do with that profit is between them and God. If these Apostles or Julie or Hector or whoever else takes this money and donates it to charity or the church, that'd be fine. If they use it for themselves, that's between them and God.

Forget Monson or Bednar for a moment and compare Julie Rowe to Deiter Uchtdorf. Uchtdorf's books are freely downloadable to kindle readers. I don't think Uchtdorf makes the claim that the Lord or anyone else told him to write and publish this books like Rowe claims with her books. There, now you don't have to call me a hypocrite anymore.

Julie, of course, profits from her "energy healing" conference talks as well. I don't think Monson or Bednar sell their conference talks as far as I know. Am I still being a hypocrite in your completely objective opinion?

Comparing Julie Rowe to Monson or Bednar is comparing apples to oranges, IMHO. Julie makes the claim that the Lord told her to publish these books. Neither Monson or Bednar make that claim in their books, as far as I know. If the Lord wants his will or prophecy to be known that is usually announced in conference or some official declaration and NOT sold in a book. Julie Rowe is selling prophecy of the Lord, if her claims are true. Monson and Bednar, on the other hand, are selling their inspirational messages and stories and NOT any kind of prophecy, as far as I know.

If Rowe's claims are true then it seems that she is a prophet and seer by definition...

Prophet: a person regarded as an inspired teacher or proclaimer of the will of God.

seer: a person who is supposed to be able, through supernatural insight, to see what the future holds.

What is your completely objective opinion?

By these terms, no you aren't . You're correct

[brianj]

Seems like a good deal for Julie. She's sold over 20,000 copies of both her books. My conservative estimation is she has a revenue of about $200,000 off book sales in just over a year.

How do you come to that estimation?
She's sold 20,000 books. Kindle books are $10 each, and the paperback books are about $12.50 or $13.50 each for an average of $13 each. At 20,000 books, if we hypothetically assume 80% physical and 20% electronic sales, is $248,000. So for her to make $200,000, she would somehow have to collect 80% of the profits. I know a published author, and therefore I know that your number is pure fantasy.

Book retailers usually buy books at half the price they sell the book for, and this includes ebooks since publishers dishonestly claim producing ebooks is as expensive as printing physical books. I understand that authors typically receive 25% at most of the wholesale cost as the publisher pays for printing, advertising, and takes their cut of the profit.

So if we assume $248,000 in sales, then half of that - $124,000 - goes to the retailers. One quarter of the other half - $31,000 - would be the best case for Julie's cut. Then again, we don't know how Cedar Fort does business. Julie has claimed that she only receives about 50 cents per book, or $10,000 from those 20,000 books.

But at either extreme, or anywhere in between, does it matter what Julie is doing with the money? She is high profile enough that I don't think she has used the profits for a luxury vacation, a luxury car, or to buy a bigger house. If she is using the money to increase her food storage - something she intends to share with others when the time comes - I expect she would still be criticized even though such selflessness is above reproach. But, naturally, this is speculation. I don't know how she spends her money and I don't think it is any business of mine to ask.

[zionminded]

That's right. Her publisher keeps most of it. Now then, she has been promoting her book (nothing wrong about that), and she has an armed body guard on her trips, costs of airfare, hotels etc. She's not rolling in the dough AND, then she has to put up with all the crap from skeptical Mormon's who publicly tear her down. That's gotta be costly too (emotionally).

[iWriteStuff]

That's right. Her publisher keeps most of it. Now then, she has been promoting her book (nothing wrong about that), and she has an armed body guard on her trips, costs of airfare, hotels etc. She's not rolling in the dough AND, then she has to put up with all the crap from skeptical Mormon's who publicly tear her down. That's gotta be costly too (emotionally).

I wonder if she considers her food storage consecrated like I do.... sure, feed my family with it, but it's ready to go to the church at a moment's notice if it is asked of me. In that sense, anything she puts there couldn't be considered "personal" profit anyway, except on a 1099 for the IRS.