I understand what you mean but since this topic is about the seals, I will use Joseph Smith's words.SkyBird wrote:D&C 77: 10-11 states the the 144,000 are "high priests" (older guys) and a true "high priest" includes his wife in the true order of heaven IMO. Without the queen of heaven standing by the side of our Father or Christ, I don't believe you would have a true "high priest." So to me these "high priests" 144,000 are male and female (couples) translated beings going out to gather all that will come to the "Church of the Firstborn" (a spiritual church that has been gathering members since the days of Adam and Eve to the time Christ returns in glory IMO.abelchirino wrote:Some have stated that the sixth and the seventh seal overlap in order to have the 144000 sealed in the sixth seal and have the lost tribes return in the seventh seal. Some, like you have stated that the sixth seal hasn't ended yet because the 144000 haven't been sealed yet, or the ten tribes haven't returned yet.letsjet wrote:We are still in the sixth seal period of time. The 144,000 High Priests are set apart near the end of the sixth seal. Obviously the lost ten tribes have to return before that event can happen.
A careful reading of D&C Chapter 77 puts everything into correct chronological order.
Revelations 7:4 talks about the 144,000 being sealed. D&C 77:10 clearly states that the events in Revelations Chapter 7 takes place during the 6th seal.
Revelations 8:1 talks about the events that take place when the seventh seal is opened. D&C 77:13 says that the events in Revelations Chapter 9 take place “after the opening of the seventh seal, before the coming of Christ.”
Revelations Chapter 9 talks about the formation of an army of 200 million men who will kill one third of the earth’s population. This army apparently forms on the Euphrates River, either in Syria or Iraq. It would appear that the Seventh Dispensation will start off with a “bang!”
There is no way that we are living in the 7th Dispensation. Too many things have to happen first. The return of the Lost Ten Tribes is just one event, but it is an important one. We need to keep in mind, however, that horrible events can happen quickly!
Revelation is really clear, and D&C helps us understand. The 144000 are sealed in the sixth seal. Yet they are then sent out into the world to preach during the seventh. This we know because the world is already going through all the punishments when they go out to preach. That is the reason why their physical state have to be changed-so that they can survive the punishments. Yet the scriptures say that they are virgins. At least that is what it sounds like. This means that they have not been married and they may still be young individuals (around the age of missionaries now-a-days). Many scholars and some GA's have stated then that the meaning of the scriptures are as follows:
The 144000 are sealed during the sixth seal.
The 144000 were picked out, chosen and sealed before they are born.
The 144000 are born close to the end of the sixth seal.
By the beginning of the seventh seal, while the world is suffering all of the punishments and judgments, once the lost tribes return, but before they actually marry, the 144000 are physically changed and sent out into the world to preach the gospel one last time.
I don't believe that there is an overlapping. If we look at the words of the scriptures and quotes from other authorities closely we will see that there is no overlapping. Now I'm not saying that we are in the sixth seal or seventh seal. I really don't know. But during the October Conference of 2001, Pres. Gordon B. Hinckley quoted some verses from Joel and said that they have already been fulfilled. Among the prophecies he mentioned are "And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke. The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the Lord come". This could give us a clue into what seal we could be in.
10 Q. What time are the things spoken of in this chapter to be accomplished?
A. They are to be accomplished in the sixth thousand years, or the opening of the sixth seal.
11 Q. What are we to understand by sealing the one hundred and forty-four thousand, out of all the tribes of Israel—twelve thousand out of every tribe?
A. We are to understand that those who are sealed are high priests, ordained unto the holy order of God, to administer the everlasting gospel; for they are they who are ordained out of every nation, kindred, tongue, and people, by the angels to whom is given power over the nations of the earth, to bring as many as will come to the church of the Firstborn.
(Doctrine and Covenants | Section 77:10 - 11)
Doctrine and Covenants 77:6-7
Joseph Smith is really clear. The earth will have only seven thousand years of temporal existence before it receives its celestial glory and it becomes a sea of glass. Each seal represents one thousand years-to quote our dear President, "period". The concept of overlapping seals is as wrong as the concept of the first thousand years overlapping the second thousand years. Two does not overlap one. God did not give any on-and-a-half seals nor one-and-a-half thousand years in His calculation. So the sixth and seventh seal cannot overlap. It would also take away from the symbolism. We know seven means "an perfection". So it is during the beginning of the seventh seal that the earth is being perfected and sanctified in preparation to the coming of the Son of God.6 Q. What are we to understand by the book which John saw, which was sealed on the back with seven seals? A. We are to understand that it contains the revealed will, mysteries, and the works of God; the hidden things of his economy concerning this earth during the seven thousand years of its continuance, or its temporal existence.
7 Q. What are we to understand by the seven seals with which it was sealed? A. We are to understand that the first seal contains the things of the first thousand years, and the second also of the second thousand years, and so on until the seventh.
We therefore have to turn to John, for he is the one that saw the opening of the seals. Now we have to learn that when John saw the seals, he saw what was occurring in heaven, and what was occurring on earth separately. That is why, some of the later chapters of Revelation is only a repeat (with addition detail) of what is spoken during the opening of the seals. The book with the seals is not on earth, it is in heaven. It is not opened in the earth, but rather in heaven. So therefore, most of what he sees is either occurring in heaven or from the perspective of heaven. He later sees those same events either occurring on the earth or from the perspective of the earth. That is also why we can trust that the half hour spoken of after the opening of the seventh seal is not a half hour of thirty minutes.
Now remembering that he is seeing these things occurring in heaven, and that in heaven they are showing him things of the earth, he says he sees the four angels and the other ascending from the east telling them
. And then he saysHurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads
. This is all happening in heaven during the sixth seal. This is evident by the fact that he immediately sees multitudes (together with the 144,000 for sure) in heaven praising God.And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel
It is also important that it is during the opening of the seventh seal that John sees the armies of Gog (who I believe to be a part of, if not the leader of, the second beast). He goes on describing the army for some verses and even numbers them, "two hundred thousand thousand". This is the same number that attack the Jews. They are also the ones who greatly depopulate the earth (which corresponds with the King of Assyria that Isaiah uses as a type who boasts of accomplishing what, according to Joseph Smith, every tyrannical dictator has ever desired-greatly depopulating the earth). Now Joseph Smith said this will take place during the seventh seal.
According to chapters 10 and 11 of Revelations, I believe that the return of the lost tribes and the building of the Jerusalem temple will occur during the seventh seal as well. Also the war of Gog against the Jews will occur during the seventh seal. We know then, that Christ will not make His appearance to the Jews until the seventh seal.
Revelations 14 gives us further detail. Now John is seeing things as they will occur on the earth, or from the perspective of the earth. He sees Jesus Christ and the 144,000 upon Mount Zion (which is America). I believe that this refers to the moment in which they are physically sealed and sent out unto all nations to preach the Gospel one last time. This is occurring after all that I have just mentioned. Verse four then gives us a very interesting characteristic of this group,
I don't think that John can get any clearer than that.These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins
Now I understand that because Joseph Smith said that they would be High Priests, that it is logical to think that they are married. But I have not found one verse in scripture that makes marriage a requirement for High Priests. For Bishops I do find one but not for High Priests (correct me if I'm wrong). It also means they will all be men, as I have read certain quotes from GA's which say the same thing. Now because of Alma, we know that High Priests are chosen and ordained to become High Priests before they are born. This certainly matches what John says will happen with these 144,000. Before they were born, they were chosen and sealed for their mission, but once born, when the time is right, they will be sealed unto those responsibilities. It is then when they will have their calling and election made sure as I think Orson Pratt said. So these chosen people, have either all been born or are still being born and will, during the seventh seal, be called unto their mission.
Now I personally believe that we are on the seventh seal, so that would mean that they probably have all been born already and that the Lord is preparing them for what they were foreordained to do.