Will it matter, Clinton or Trump, or?

[BTH&T]

BTH&T, the idea that my 'hope" is clouding my judgement doesn't quite capture the real problem. Trump is addressing very important issues and promising to do something about them. In view of our present circumstances, giving him a chance has no downside: either he does, or he doesn't address these issues if he wins the presidency. Why? Because Hillary would be much worse. It's a matter of logic, actually.

Would his election be a complete panacea for healing our nation and people? Probably not, but this would depend on how far he could go, and how his actions might illuminate and bring out of the shadows some very evil people.

Your statements about Trump being a 'deceiver', a liberal, etc., is simply your interpretation of your particular focus. Several accusations have been made against Trump here in this forum that so far simply haven't washed.

I make my judgements solely on Trumps own words, statements, actions and choices over his known lifetime (what I've seen and heard, not from anyone else's opinion)


And my wish list actually encompasses some of the very serious problems confronting this country, and the fact you don't see this, is for someone like me, very disturbing and doesn't bode well for the country or LDS in particular.

I see it, as do most on this site. Most (80% of poll respondents) think it's the wrong move and its too late! You are right it does not bode well, but we knew this day was coming!

Of course the country needs a restoration of values, morals and ethics. But unless you counter some of the very real forces that are driving the dissolution of the family and morals in general, just trying to convince people to adjust their moral compasses, is simply p...... into the wind.

The poll reflects what I suspected (if at all accurate?) Nearly 80% here so far feel the country has sunk to a point of falling. These are real feelings of people, this is not just an election of different parties.

[larsenb]

The poll reflects what I suspected (if at all accurate?) Nearly 80% here so far feel the country has sunk to a point of falling. These are real feelings of people, this is not just an election of different parties.

The utter irony is that LDS in general won't make a choice that may help turn it around. Again, no downside on this choice that I can see, whatsoever.

It reminds me of the story of a person stranded on a house in a flood, prays for help, and eschews what help is sent, because it didn't fit his preconception of being rescued by God. Maybe not dramatic enough.

Of course, I think God works sometimes in very paradoxical, non-intuitive and even ironic ways. That's just me of course. If 80% of people on this forum want to hasten toward apocalypse, they're welcome to that desire.

Regarding your judgement of Trump, here is someone who knows him and how he operates quite well, having a view of Trump diametric from the one you hold: viewtopic.php?f=61&t=42211#p707209" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[BTH&T]

The poll reflects what I suspected (if at all accurate?) Nearly 80% here so far feel the country has sunk to a point of falling. These are real feelings of people, this is not just an election of different parties.

The utter irony is that LDS in general won't make a choice that may help turn it around. Again, no downside on this choice that I can see, whatever.

"We shall have the satisfaction of knowing we have acted conscientiously and have used our best judgement,
and if we have to throw away our votes, we had better do so upon a worthy rather than an unworthy individual who might make use of the weapon we put in his hand to destroy us!" (Joseph Smith Jr., Comprehensive History of the Church 2:208-209)

This quote from Joseph Smith perfectly sums up my opinion at this point, not that I want to hasten an apocalypse.

There are consequences to all of the past POOR choices made, I think that we will be paying the price as a country for the decades of unwise actions.

[larsenb]

. . . . There are consequences to all of the past POOR choices made, I think that we will be paying the price as a country for the decades of unwise actions.

We have already been paying the consequences for our poor choices for the last several decades. A large part of the problem is lack of correct knowledge of what is being done to help lead us along this path.

This of course, is one of the consequences of secret combinations, which the Book of Mormon has tried to emphatically warn us about as a major theme of our own last days. We basically ignore the whole topic . . .

[BTH&T]

. . . . There are consequences to all of the past POOR choices made, I think that we will be paying the price as a country for the decades of unwise actions.

We have already been paying the consequences for our poor choices for the last several decades. A large part of the problem is lack of correct knowledge of what is being done to help lead us along this path.

This of course, is one of the consequences of secret combinations, which the Book of Mormon has tried to emphatically warn us about as a major theme of our own last days. We basically ignore the whole topic . . .

and Trump won't save us from want has already been done, the Nation must come to God in humility.
He will not fix what is broken, he will exacerbate the problem.
All things are spiritual, ignoring that is what is not working.

[lundbaek]

That statement "and if we have to throw away our votes, we had better do so upon a worthy rather than an unworthy individual who might make use of the weapon we put in his hand to destroy us!" by the Prophet Joseph Smith and others saying the same thing by later prophets and apostles were given almost exclusively to Latter-day Saints. Some of those later statements admonished Church members to choose candidates who would uphold the US Constitution. I cannot hold non-LDS people to that standard. Nor can I hold to that standard new or young Church members who have never been exposed to those admonitions thru no fault of their own.

[simpleton]

Just one of many scriptures that could very well apply to us.....if so, just another reason why it doesn't matter who wins the presidency....the inner vessel must be cleansed first....

Jeremiah 5
King James Bible

1Run ye to and fro through the streets of Jerusalem, and see now, and know, and seek in the broad places thereof, if ye can find a man, if there be any that executeth judgment, that seeketh the truth; and I will pardon it.

2And though they say, The LORD liveth; surely they swear falsely.

3O LORD, are not thine eyes upon the truth? thou hast stricken them, but they have not grieved; thou hast consumed them, but they have refused to receive correction: they have made their faces harder than a rock; they have refused to return.

4Therefore I said, Surely these are poor; they are foolish: for they know not the way of the LORD, nor the judgment of their God.

5I will get me unto the great men, and will speak unto them; for they have known the way of the LORD, and the judgment of their God: but these have altogether broken the yoke, and burst the bonds.

6Wherefore a lion out of the forest shall slay them, and a wolf of the evenings shall spoil them, a leopard shall watch over their cities: every one that goeth out thence shall be torn in pieces: because their transgressions are many, and their backslidings are increased.

7How shall I pardon thee for this? thy children have forsaken me, and sworn by them that are no gods: when I had fed them to the full, they then committed adultery, and assembled themselves by troops in the harlots' houses.

8They were as fed horses in the morning: every one neighed after his neighbour's wife.

9Shall I not visit for these things? saith the LORD: and shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

10Go ye up upon her walls, and destroy; but make not a full end: take away her battlements; for they are not the LORD'S.

11For the house of Israel and the house of Judah have dealt very treacherously against me, saith the LORD.

12They have belied the LORD, and said, It is not he; neither shall evil come upon us; neither shall we see sword nor famine:

13And the prophets shall become wind, and the word is not in them: thus shall it be done unto them.

Judgment Proclaimed
14Wherefore thus saith the LORD God of hosts, Because ye speak this word, behold, I will make my words in thy mouth fire, and this people wood, and it shall devour them.

15Lo, I will bring a nation upon you from far, O house of Israel, saith the LORD: it is a mighty nation, it is an ancient nation, a nation whose language thou knowest not, neither understandest what they say.

16Their quiver is as an open sepulchre, they are all mighty men.

17And they shall eat up thine harvest, and thy bread, which thy sons and thy daughters should eat: they shall eat up thy flocks and thine herds: they shall eat up thy vines and thy fig trees: they shall impoverish thy fenced cities, wherein thou trustedst, with the sword.

18Nevertheless in those days, saith the LORD, I will not make a full end with you. 19And it shall come to pass, when ye shall say, Wherefore doeth the LORD our God all these things unto us? then shalt thou answer them, Like as ye have forsaken me, and served strange gods in your land, so shall ye serve strangers in a land that is not yours.

20Declare this in the house of Jacob, and publish it in Judah, saying,

21Hear now this, O foolish people, and without understanding; which have eyes, and see not; which have ears, and hear not:

22Fear ye not me? saith the LORD: will ye not tremble at my presence, which have placed the sand for the bound of the sea by a perpetual decree, that it cannot pass it: and though the waves thereof toss themselves, yet can they not prevail; though they roar, yet can they not pass over it?

23But this people hath a revolting and a rebellious heart; they are revolted and gone.

24Neither say they in their heart, Let us now fear the LORD our God, that giveth rain, both the former and the latter, in his season: he reserveth unto us the appointed weeks of the harvest.

25Your iniquities have turned away these things, and your sins have withholden good things from you.

26For among my people are found wicked men: they lay wait, as he that setteth snares; they set a trap, they catch men.

27As a cage is full of birds, so are their houses full of deceit: therefore they are become great, and waxen rich.

28They are waxen fat, they shine: yea, they overpass the deeds of the wicked: they judge not the cause, the cause of the fatherless, yet they prosper; and the right of the needy do they not judge.

29Shall I not visit for these things? saith the LORD: shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

30A wonderful and horrible thing is committed in the land;

31The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof?

[larsenb]

. . . . There are consequences to all of the past POOR choices made, I think that we will be paying the price as a country for the decades of unwise actions.

We have already been paying the consequences for our poor choices for the last several decades. A large part of the problem is lack of correct knowledge of what is being done to help lead us along this path.

This of course, is one of the consequences of secret combinations, which the Book of Mormon has tried to emphatically warn us about as a major theme of our own last days. We basically ignore the whole topic . . .

and Trump won't save us from want has already been done, the Nation must come to God in humility.
He will not fix what is broken, he will exacerbate the problem.
All things are spiritual, ignoring that is what is not working.

You still miss the point. Trump won't necessarily "save us from what has already been done", but he is the only one speaking up about things, formerly taboo, that CAN be done to help save the country from destruction. Simply bringing to light the evil perpetrators of 9/11 and stopping the illegal wars we have been fomenting and engaging in the last 25 years would go a long way in helping this country disengage from evil actions. This type of thing is NOT trivial. I have been involved in 911 scientific issues for years, trying to educate and bring these things into the light. An almost impossible task, with very few fruits. Trump, persisting in bringing these hidden things to light, alone, would be a tremendous boost to removing us from the clutches of evil men.

And giving Trump a chance to follow through on these things is NOT throwing away your vote. I doubt very much Trump could "exacerbate the problem" by actually addressing the problems. However, in doing so, he may very well force our hidden rulers to do something drastic to bring about their purposes and counteract anything Trump may try to do to stop their agendas. THAT is what really concerns me and gives me the willies.

We are commanded to wake up to our awful situation due to the secret combinations of our day in Ether; 8:24. Bringing to light the hidden acts of darkness involved in the perpetration 9/11 could lead to a massive wakeup call.

And making at least an attempt to stay the course of this country from destruction through appropriate political action is wholly spiritual.

[BTH&T]

You still miss the point. Trump won't necessarily "save us from what has already been done", but he is the only one speaking up about things, formerly taboo, that CAN be done to help save the country from destruction. Simply bringing to light the evil perpetrators of 9/11 and stopping the illegal wars we have been fomenting and engaging in the last 25 years would go a long way in helping this country disengage from evil actions. This type of thing is NOT trivial. I have been involved in 911 scientific issues for years, trying to educate and bring these things into the light. An almost impossible task, with very few fruits. Trump, persisting in bringing these hidden things to light, alone, would be a tremendous boost to removing us from the clutches of evil men.

And giving Trump a chance to follow through on these things is NOT throwing away your vote. I doubt very much Trump could "exacerbate the problem" by actually addressing the problems. However, in doing so, he may very well force our hidden rulers to do something drastic to bring about their purposes and counteract anything Trump may try to do to stop their agendas. THAT is what really concerns me and gives me the willies.

We are commanded to wake up to our awful situation due to the secret combinations of our day in Ether; 8:24. Bringing to light the hidden acts of darkness involved in the perpetration 9/11 could lead to a massive wakeup call.

And making at least an attempt to stay the course of this country from destruction through appropriate political action is wholly spiritual.

I did not miss the point, I feel that the things you view as important are not the real issues that are needed to move forward.
(9/11, past wars are not what is dragging the country down)

To me Trump is not what he is pretending to be, he is part of the problem.
All of his loud obnoxious rhetoric adds fuel to a fire that distracts from real issues.

Immigration is a real issue, but not number one.
Rule of law is an issue needing attention
Social/family issues (morals & values restored is at the top of my list) Trump is terrible at this!

Looks like we just see the world differently.
I will not give my vote to someone that will not be the President we need, Trump is not what we need!

[lundbaek]

We are commanded to wake up to our awful situation due to the secret combinations of our day in Ether; 8:24. We are also told to "suffer not" that those murderous combination get above us. Latter-day Saints are the only people who have been given those charges. That puts a great responsibility on us, a responsibility which it seems very few members of the Church are honoring, a responsibility that it seems very few members of the Church can tolerate being reminded of.

[BTH&T]

We are commanded to wake up to our awful situation due to the secret combinations of our day in Ether; 8:24. We are also told to "suffer not" that those murderous combination get above us. Latter-day Saints are the only people who have been given those charges. That puts a great responsibility on us, a responsibility which it seems very few members of the Church are honoring, a responsibility that it seems very few members of the Church can tolerate being reminded of.

I am in total agreement with you on this.
In an earlier post you mentioned those that have not been "taught".
To me this is one of the gravest ploys that has been used to bring our country down. Our education system!
The secret combinations have used "education" as a tool to corrupt and blind to the truth.

[Silver]

Fox News weighs in:
Any Republican who thinks it's better to elect Trump than Hillary needs their head examined



By David Ross Meyers
·Published May 03, 2016
· FoxNews.com

It was once unimaginable. Now Donald J. Trump – the reality TV star, questionable businessman, and political bomb thrower – is on the verge of becoming a major party’s presidential candidate.

When Mr. Trump ran for president on the Reform Party ticket in 2000, his candidacy was scoffed at. He was an unserious man running for the most serious position in the free world, and everyone knew it.

Yet now, many Americans – from the public, to the media, to politicians in Washington, D.C. – seem to be acquiescing to the idea of a Donald Trump candidacy and presidency.

The entire country seems to be falling down the rabbit hole.

Donald Trump is unfit to be president of the United States for reasons almost too numerous to mention.

First, Donald Trump’s sole motivation for seeking the presidency is Donald Trump. His careers in business, reality television, and politics have been marked by personal ambition, self-aggrandizement, and a willingness to do or say anything to achieve power, fame, or notoriety. He is exactly the kind of demagogue that our founders feared might try to seek the Presidency for his own personal gain.

Furthermore, Trump lacks the judgment, character, and emotional stability to be president. Given his frequent public outbursts and lack of self-restraint, the thought of Mr. Trump controlling our military and nuclear weapons is unacceptable. The GOP, which has spent decades claiming to be the party of national security, should have been the first to declare Trump unfit for the presidency.

Instead, the opposite has happened. As Trump moves closer to the GOP nomination, many Republican leaders in Washington and across the country have begun to embrace him. Most have not done so because they truly believe in Mr. Trump, but because they have been blinded by personal ambition, ideology, and partisan politics.

Some opportunistic politicians, like Governors Chris Christie and Paul LePage, endorsed Mr. Trump early on in the hopes of future personal benefit. (Mr. LePage, for example, privately proposed that the GOP disavow Mr. Trump on February 20. Six days later, he endorsed him. What else could explain that change besides pure political calculation?)

Worse still are those Republicans who privately (or publicly) oppose Mr. Trump, yet will support him as the Party’s nominee.

From 2006 to 2009, I worked in the White House for George W. Bush. As an actor and writer in New York, this isn’t always a popular thing to tell people. But I do, because I am proud to have worked for a president who led with principle and conviction. As a West Wing staffer, I saw firsthand that President Bush’s sole motivation was to do what he thought was best for our country. People may have disagreed with his policies, but they couldn’t disagree with his intentions.

From 2009 to 2010, I spent a year working for Congressional Republicans. In contrast to my time at the White House, I saw that many in Congress put their personal and partisan interests ahead of the country’s needs. Many times, the GOP’s only agenda was to defeat Barack Obama at all costs. It didn’t matter what Obama’s policy was; all that mattered was winning and eventually regaining power for the GOP.

This desire for control of the presidency, and the belief that any Republican is better than any Democrat, is why many Republicans are now embracing Trump. They claim that the GOP needs to coalesce behind Mr. Trump because he is a better alternative than Hillary Clinton. He is not.

To begin with, Mr. Trump has autocratic tendencies, and openly admires tyrants such as Vladimir Putin. In fact, his narcissism and cult of personality leadership style seem better suited to countries like North Korea and Uzbekistan than America. Trump has repeatedly attacked core conservative principles such as freedom of speech, freedom of religion, and American leadership on the world stage. He has incited the use of violence against his detractors, called on America to commit war crimes, and suggested the possibility of civil unrest if he is denied the GOP nomination.

Mr. Trump proclaims that he’s going to make America great again, but can’t provide any realistic plans for doing so; instead, he frequently resorts to scapegoating outsiders, foreigners, and minorities. The few policies that Trump has articulated would make America less safe, trample upon our most fundamental rights, and appeal to the basest instincts of the American people.

While I disagree with many of Hillary Clinton’s policies, she is clearly qualified to be president. She possesses judgment and self-restraint. She does not have a track record of irrational, risky, and unsound business decisions and public comments. She has a long record of public service. She can be trusted with controlling our military and nuclear weapons. Mr. Trump cannot.

Any Republican who claims that it’s better to elect Donald Trump than Hillary Clinton either lacks proper judgment, or has become so blinded by partisan ideology that they have lost objectivity.

Many of the GOP voters who support Trump are backing his candidacy because they are desperate for change in Washington. But Republican leaders who embrace Trump aren’t hearing the public’s message or embracing change. Instead, they’re doing what they have always done: whatever is necessary to gain or retain political power.

I saw the same thing happen during my time in Washington with the rise of the Tea Party. Instead of adopting the movement’s more valid positions, such as a real crackdown on Wall Street and corporate America, many Republicans jumped on the bandwagon of hate and divisive rhetoric because they thought it was their best chance of being re-elected.

Yes, Mr. Trump has populist support. But a true leader doesn’t jump on the populist bandwagon – especially when that bandwagon threatens to irretrievably harm their country and party. A true leader explains why that candidate cannot and should not be trusted, and is willing to suffer any consequences that might result from standing strongly behind their position.

Alexander Hamilton has become a cultural zeitgeist recently due to the success of the Broadway musical about his life. Yet Americans are responding to more than a brilliant piece of theatre. They are responding to a time of great men and women in American history -- true leaders who put their love of country above their personal ambitions or partisan ideologies.

In fact, Hamilton faced a choice similar to the one Republicans are facing today. During the election of 1800, Hamilton had to choose between endorsing Thomas Jefferson, his life-long political rival with whom he disagreed on almost every major issue – or Aaron Burr, a dishonest man of flawed character, who many feared would lead America down a dangerous path of tyranny and oppression. Mr. Hamilton chose to endorse Jefferson.

There is still time to stop Donald Trump from becoming the GOP nominee. Republicans must speak out loudly and forcefully against his candidacy – and they must oppose Trump even if he becomes the party’s nominee.

The United States of America was built on 240 years of blood, toil, and sacrifice. We owe our ancestors, and our children, so much better than handing this country over to a man of Mr. Trump’s character and intentions.

Voters will not forget those individuals who supported Mr. Trump. And any Republican who endangers our nation by supporting Donald Trump will not be trusted again.

David Meyers worked in the West Wing of the White House as Assistant Staff Secretary from 2006 to 2009 and Communications Project Director. From 2009 to 2010, he worked as a Communications Advisor for the Senate Republican Leadership. He is now an actor, writer, and Ph.D. candidate in Political Science.

[Silver]

Ayn Rand’s Definition of When a Nation is Doomed
Posted May 2, 2016 by Martin Armstrong

“When you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is flowing to those who deal not in goods, but in favors; when you see that men get rich more easily by graft than by work, and your laws no longer protect you against them, but protect them against you. . . you may know that your society is doomed.”

“Atlas Shrugged” – Ayn Rand
•p. 413 ; Francisco d’Anconia to Bertram Scudder

[lundbaek]

My beef is with members of the LDS Church far more than with non-LDS people.

[larsenb]

Fox News weighs in:
Any Republican who thinks it's better to elect Trump than Hillary needs their head examined

By David Ross Meyers
·Published May 03, 2016
· FoxNews.com

It was once unimaginable. Now Donald J. Trump – the reality TV star, questionable businessman, and political bomb thrower – is on the verge of becoming a major party’s presidential candidate. . . . . .. .

From 2006 to 2009, I worked in the White House for George W. Bush. As an actor and writer in New York, this isn’t always a popular thing to tell people. But I do, because I am proud to have worked for a president who led with principle and conviction. As a West Wing staffer, I saw firsthand that President Bush’s sole motivation was to do what he thought was best for our country. People may have disagreed with his policies, but they couldn’t disagree with his intentions. . . . . .

David Meyers worked in the West Wing of the White House as Assistant Staff Secretary from 2006 to 2009 and Communications Project Director. From 2009 to 2010, he worked as a Communications Advisor for the Senate Republican Leadership. He is now an actor, writer, and Ph.D. candidate in Political Science.

Anyone who would say: "Any Republican who thinks it's better to elect Trump than Hillary needs their head examined", definitely needs their head examined.

All you need to know about David Meyers is where he says:

From 2006 to 2009, I worked in the White House for George W. Bush. As an actor and writer in New York, this isn’t always a popular thing to tell people. But I do, because I am proud to have worked for a president who led with principle and conviction. As a West Wing staffer, I saw firsthand that President Bush’s sole motivation was to do what he thought was best for our country. People may have disagreed with his policies, but they couldn’t disagree with his intentions.
"

The rest of his piece is vitriolic, judgemental garbage.

[larsenb]

. . . . I did not miss the point, I feel that the things you view as important are not the real issues that are needed to move forward.
(9/11, past wars are not what is dragging the country down)

To me Trump is not what he is pretending to be, he is part of the problem.
All of his loud obnoxious rhetoric adds fuel to a fire that distracts from real issues.

Immigration is a real issue, but not number one.
Rule of law is an issue needing attention
Social/family issues (morals & values restored is at the top of my list) Trump is terrible at this!

Looks like we just see the world differently.
I will not give my vote to someone that will not be the President we need, Trump is not what we need!

Where you say: “Looks like we just see the world differently”, that is an exceedingly true statement.

BTW, Trump talks about immigration as a serious problem. And though the phrase “Rule of law” is a nebulous generalization, Trump has actually decried abuse of the rule of law in the case of BLM overreach in the western lands use controversy.

Regarding social/family issues, economic well-being has a lot to do with maintaining families and lessening the general stressors of life. When economic well-being is lacking, people are much more apt to run to and be seduced by cheap comforts. Trump is very much focused on this issue . . . probably his main appeal.

Here is where you miss the point. It has mainly to do with not recognizing the importance of issues such as 9/11 and our conduct of illegal wars, and Trumps going up against the globalists, and the machinations of the global elite, in general.

First a little anecdote: Christopher Bollyn, a premier 9/11 truth researcher, was paying a visit to Dr. Steven Jones to learn firsthand about what Dr. Jones was doing in the scientific end of this research.

At one point, Steve felt impressed to show Christopher (he is not LDS) the passages in the Book of Mormon regarding the danger of secret combinations in the last days, specifically the Ether 8:22-26 passages. Christopher was astonished, seeing that we had the key to understanding and doing something about egregious issues such as 9/11. He was very enthusiastic when he saw this.

The problem is, LDS generally ignore these emphatic warnings; probably 80% or more want to hear nothing about this topic. They don’t see the connection between the existence of these groups and 9/11; they don’t understand how these groups actually drive agendas to undermine the family. They’re largely oblivious to this possibility and know nothing about the connections. I NEVER hear any understanding or discussion of this issue in quorum.

I’ve given hints about where you can come up to speed on how the ‘elites’ have actual plans and agendas to undermine the family and our morals in general at: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=42199&p=707207#p707207" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

To see how they are doing this in the education of our children, read up on the agendas educators such as Thomas Mann or John Dewey were hell-bent in implementing. And of course, Charlotte Izerbyt is the primary source for this whole subject. Read some of her books.

Where you say: ” I feel that the things you view as important are not the real issues that are needed to move forward”, this implies you don’t assign the same importance to these issues that the Lord and Moroni do in Ether 8:24 . . . . and later President Benson:

Wherefore, the Lord commandeth you, when ye shall see these things come among you that ye shall awake to a sense of your awful situation, because of this secret combination which shall be among you; or wo be unto it, because of the blood of them who have been slain; for they cry from the dust for vengeance upon it, and also upon those who built it up.

So the Lord commands us to “wake up to a sense [our] awful situation, BECAUSE of this secret combination which shall be among you. I.e., the secret combination is the CAUSE of our awful situation. And President Benson basically reiterates this idea in his Fall 1988 “I Testify” talk.

Globalism is a premier goal of this secret combination, as are wars and getting various people to war against one another. Stopping the march to globalization and stopping the pre-emptive wars we have been and are engaged in. etc., etc., is to go up against the globalists, AKA, the single secret combination Moroni, the Lord and President Benson all talk about.

And if Trump can actually get a real investigation of 9/11 off the ground, this stands a chance of exposing the evil people who were the higher level perpetrators of 9/11, and who are undoubtedly allied with globalist controllers.

The last portion of the Ether 8:24 verse is very intriguing. Notice how it says: “wo be unto it, because of the blood of them who have been slain; for they cry from the dust for vengeance upon it”. He isn’t talking about ancient dust. He is talking about blood mingled with dust from our day. Can you think of an event that happened a few years ago that generated innumerable body fragments of flesh and bone, mingled with blood that permeated enormous amounts of dust??

So many of our illegal political/warfare operations, the growing control grid, the universal surveillance, the phony war on terror, the growing police state, etc., etc, hang directly on and were justified by the events of 9/11. You don’t expose or force them out of hiding, their agendas continue, and your attempts to improve the moral climate become no more than p…… into the wind . . . as I mentioned in my linked post, above.

[Silver]

Fox News weighs in:
Any Republican who thinks it's better to elect Trump than Hillary needs their head examined

By David Ross Meyers
·Published May 03, 2016
· FoxNews.com

It was once unimaginable. Now Donald J. Trump – the reality TV star, questionable businessman, and political bomb thrower – is on the verge of becoming a major party’s presidential candidate. . . . . .. .

From 2006 to 2009, I worked in the White House for George W. Bush. As an actor and writer in New York, this isn’t always a popular thing to tell people. But I do, because I am proud to have worked for a president who led with principle and conviction. As a West Wing staffer, I saw firsthand that President Bush’s sole motivation was to do what he thought was best for our country. People may have disagreed with his policies, but they couldn’t disagree with his intentions. . . . . .

David Meyers worked in the West Wing of the White House as Assistant Staff Secretary from 2006 to 2009 and Communications Project Director. From 2009 to 2010, he worked as a Communications Advisor for the Senate Republican Leadership. He is now an actor, writer, and Ph.D. candidate in Political Science.

Anyone who would say: "Any Republican who thinks it's better to elect Trump than Hillary needs their head examined", definitely needs their head examined.

All you need to know about David Meyers is where he says:

From 2006 to 2009, I worked in the White House for George W. Bush. As an actor and writer in New York, this isn’t always a popular thing to tell people. But I do, because I am proud to have worked for a president who led with principle and conviction. As a West Wing staffer, I saw firsthand that President Bush’s sole motivation was to do what he thought was best for our country. People may have disagreed with his policies, but they couldn’t disagree with his intentions.
"

The rest of his piece is vitriolic, judgemental garbage.

Please understand that I only posted the article for informational purposes. It's not that I'm a Trump-hater.

[larsenb]

Fox News weighs in:
Any Republican who thinks it's better to elect Trump than Hillary needs their head examined

By David Ross Meyers
·Published May 03, 2016
· FoxNews.com

It was once unimaginable. Now Donald J. Trump – the reality TV star, questionable businessman, and political bomb thrower – is on the verge of becoming a major party’s presidential candidate. . . . . .. .

From 2006 to 2009, I worked in the White House for George W. Bush. As an actor and writer in New York, this isn’t always a popular thing to tell people. But I do, because I am proud to have worked for a president who led with principle and conviction. As a West Wing staffer, I saw firsthand that President Bush’s sole motivation was to do what he thought was best for our country. People may have disagreed with his policies, but they couldn’t disagree with his intentions. . . . . .

David Meyers worked in the West Wing of the White House as Assistant Staff Secretary from 2006 to 2009 and Communications Project Director. From 2009 to 2010, he worked as a Communications Advisor for the Senate Republican Leadership. He is now an actor, writer, and Ph.D. candidate in Political Science.

Anyone who would say: "Any Republican who thinks it's better to elect Trump than Hillary needs their head examined", definitely needs their head examined.

All you need to know about David Meyers is where he says:

From 2006 to 2009, I worked in the White House for George W. Bush. As an actor and writer in New York, this isn’t always a popular thing to tell people. But I do, because I am proud to have worked for a president who led with principle and conviction. As a West Wing staffer, I saw firsthand that President Bush’s sole motivation was to do what he thought was best for our country. People may have disagreed with his policies, but they couldn’t disagree with his intentions.
"

The rest of his piece is vitriolic, judgemental garbage.

Please understand that I only posted the article for informational purposes. It's not that I'm a Trump-hater.

I understood that. Hard to see you agreeing to: "Any Republican who thinks it's better to elect Trump than Hillary needs their head examined"

[Rachael]

I don't think it will matter too much. Every time we get really screwed over or go to war, or stay at war, or free trade agreements, taxes raised, etc., it usually a bipartisan agreement. All that matters much is whether you think Hillary or Trump is more aesthetically appealing to look at on the news programs for the next 4 years

[Ezra]

Democrats vs republicans= sociilizem through wealfare or warfare. Pick your poison.

I would rather pick a constitutionalist who would accually make a difference. I'm sick or warfare and wealfare.

[Fiannan]

There is one big difference, Trump is not a psychopathic warmonger!

[FamilyFunnyFarm]

There is one big difference, Trump is not a psychopathic warmonger!

She scares me! She doesn't even try to hide her evil anymore.

[Silver]

There is one big difference, Trump is not a psychopathic warmonger!

She scares me! She doesn't even try to hide her evil anymore.

We came. We saw. He died. (followed by evil burst of cackling)

[Silver]

https://www.facebook.com/sassefornebras ... 1420862025" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AN OPEN LETTER TO MAJORITY AMERICA

TO: Those who think both leading presidential candidates are dishonest and have little chance of leading America forward:

(…or, stated more simply)
TO: The majority of America:

Note: If you are one of those rare souls who genuinely believe Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump are honorable people – if they are the role models you want for your kids – then this letter is not for you. Instead, this letter is for the majority of Americans who wonder why the nation that put a man on the moon can’t find a healthy leader who can take us forward together.

I want to tell you about four unsolicited conversations from the Fremont Wal-Mart this morning:

**Retired union Democrat meat-packer:
“What the heck is wrong with that city where you work? Why can’t they give us a normal person? Is it really so hard?”

Me: “Actually, it is for them – because most people in DC buy the nonsense that DC is the center of the world. You and I, despite our party differences, both agree that Fremont is the center.”

Union Democrat (interrupting): “…Because this is where my grandkids are.”

**Young evangelical mom:
“I want to cry. I disagree with Hillary Clinton on almost every single thing – but I will vote for her before Trump. I could never tell my kids later that I voted for that man.”

**Middle-aged Republican male (more political than the other folks):
“It feels like the train-car to hell is accelerating. Why is DC more filled with weirdos and yet more powerful at the same time? How do we slow this down long enough to have a conversation about actually fixing our country?”

**Trump supporter (again, unsolicited):
“Please understand: I’m going to vote for him, but I don’t like him. And I don’t trust him – I mean, I’m not stupid. But how else can I send a signal to Washington?!”
________

I’ve ignored my phone most of today, but the voicemail is overflowing with party bosses and politicos telling me that “although Trump is terrible,” we “have to” support him, “because the only choice is Trump or Hillary.”

This open letter aims simply to ask “WHY is that the only choice?”

Melissa and I got the kids launched on homework, so I’ve been sitting out by the river, reflecting on the great gap between what folks in my town are talking about, and what folks in the DC bubble are talking about.

I trust the judgment of this farm town way more than I trust DC. And so I’d like to share a dozen-ish observations on these Wal-Mart and other conversations today:

1.
Washington isn’t fooling anyone -- Neither political party works. They bicker like children about tiny things, and yet they can’t even identify the biggest issues we face. They’re like a couple arguing about what color to paint the living room, and meanwhile, their house is on fire. They resort to character attacks as step one because they think voters are too dumb for a real debate. They very often prioritize the agendas of lobbyists (for whom many of them will eventually work) over the urgent needs of Main Street America. I signed up for the Party of Abraham Lincoln -- and I will work to reform and restore the GOP -- but let’s tell the plain truth that right now both parties lack vision.

2.
As a result, normal Americans don’t like either party. If you ask Americans if they identify as Democrat or Republican, almost half of the nation interrupts to say: “Neither.”

3.
Young people despise the two parties even more than the general electorate. And why shouldn’t they? The main thing that unites most Democrats is being anti-Republican; the main thing that unites most Republicans is being anti-Democrat. No one knows what either party is for -- but almost everyone knows neither party has any solutions for our problems. “Unproductive” doesn’t begin to summarize how messed up this is.

4.
Our problems are huge right now, but one of the most obvious is that we’ve not passed along the meaning of America to the next generation. If we don’t get them to re-engage -- thinking about how we defend a free society in the face of global jihadis, or how we balance our budgets after baby boomers have dishonestly over-promised for decades, or how we protect First Amendment values in the face of the safe-space movement – then all will indeed have been lost. One of the bright spots with the rising generation, though, is that they really would like to rethink the often knee-jerk partisanship of their parents and grandparents. We should encourage this rethinking.

5.
These two national political parties are enough of a mess that I believe they will come apart. It might not happen fully in 2016 – and I’ll continue fighting to revive the GOP with ideas -- but when people’s needs aren’t being met, they ultimately find other solutions.

6.
In the history of polling, we’ve basically never had a candidate viewed negatively by half of the electorate. This year, we have two. In fact, we now have the two most unpopular candidates ever – Hillary by a little, and Trump by miles (including now 3 out of 4 women – who vote more and influence more votes than men). There are dumpster fires in my town more popular than these two “leaders.”

7.
With Clinton and Trump, the fix is in. Heads, they win; tails, you lose. Why are we confined to these two terrible options? This is America. If both choices stink, we reject them and go bigger. That’s what we do.

8.
Remember: our Founders didn’t want entrenched political parties. So why should we accept this terrible choice?

9.
So...let’s have a thought experiment for a few weeks: Why shouldn’t America draft an honest leader who will focus on 70% solutions for the next four years? You know...an adult?
(Two notes for reporters:
**Such a leader should be able to campaign 24/7 for the next six months. Therefore he/she likely can’t be an engaged parent with little kids.
**Although I’m one of the most conservative members of the Senate, I'm not interested in an ideological purity test, because even a genuine consensus candidate would almost certainly be more conservative than either of the two dishonest liberals now leading the two national parties.)

10.
Imagine if we had a candidate:
...who hadn’t spent his/her life in politics either buying politicians or being bought

…who didn’t want to stitch together a coalition based on anger but wanted to take a whole nation forward

…who pledged to serve for only one term, as a care-taker problem-solver for this messy moment

…who knew that Washington isn’t competent to micromanage the lives of free people, but instead wanted to SERVE by focusing on 3 or 4 big national problems,
such as:
A. A national security strategy for the age of cyber and jihad;
B. Honest budgeting/entitlement reform so that we stop stealing from future generations;
C. Empowering states and local governments to improve K-12 education, and letting Washington figure out how to update federal programs to adjust to now needing lifelong learners in an age where folks are obviously not going to work at a single job for a lifetime anymore; and
D. Retiring career politicians by ending all the incumbency protections, special rules, and revolving door opportunities for folks who should be public “servants,” not masters.

This really shouldn’t be that hard.

The oath I took is to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution. In brief, that means I’m for limited government.

And there is no reason to believe that either of these two national frontrunners believe in limiting anything about DC’s power.

I believe that most Americans can still be for limited government again -- if they were given a winsome candidate who wanted Washington to focus on a small number of really important, urgent things -- in a way that tried to bring people together instead of driving us apart.

I think there is room – an appetite – for such a candidate.

What am I missing?

More importantly, what are the people at the Fremont Wal-Mart missing?

Because I don’t think they are wrong. They deserve better. They deserve a Congress that tackles the biggest policy problems facing the nation. And they deserve a president who knows that his or her job is not to “reign,” but to serve as commander-in-chief and to “faithfully execute” the laws – not to claim imperial powers to rewrite them with his pen and phone.

The sun is mostly set on the Platte River -- and the kids need baths. So g’night.

Ben

[BTH&T]

BTW, Trump talks about immigration as a serious problem.
And though the phrase “Rule of law” is a nebulous generalization, Trump has actually decried abuse of the rule of law in the case of BLM overreach in the western lands use controversy.
The Rule of Law is not a nebulous term, it means that one upholds the law at all times, not just when it fits or suits you.


Regarding social/family issues, economic well-being has a lot to do with maintaining families and lessening the general stressors of life. When economic well-being is lacking, people are much more apt to run to and be seduced by cheap comforts. Trump is very much focused on this issue . . . probably his main appeal. He does seem focused on cheap comforts for all but him!

Here is where you miss the point. IN YOUR OPINION

It has mainly to do with not recognizing the importance of issues such as 9/11 and our conduct of illegal wars, and Trumps going up against the globalists, and the machinations of the global elite, in general.First a little anecdote: Christopher Bollyn, a premier 9/11 truth researcher, was paying a visit to Dr. Steven Jones to learn firsthand about what Dr. Jones was doing in the scientific end of this research.At one point, Steve felt impressed to show Christopher (he is not LDS) the passages in the Book of Mormon regarding the danger of secret combinations in the last days, specifically the Ether 8:22-26 passages. Christopher was astonished, seeing that we had the key to understanding and doing something about egregious issues such as 9/11. He was very enthusiastic when he saw this.The problem is, LDS generally ignore these emphatic warnings; probably 80% or more want to hear nothing about this topic. They don’t see the connection between the existence of these groups and 9/11; they don’t understand how these groups actually drive agendas to undermine the family. They’re largely oblivious to this possibility and know nothing about the connections. I NEVER hear any understanding or discussion of this issue in quorum.

I’ve given hints about where you can come up to speed (condescending aren't you??)
on how the ‘elites’ have actual plans and agendas to undermine the family and our morals in general at: http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=42199&p=707207#p707207

To see how they are doing this in the education of our children, read up on the agendas educators such as Thomas Mann or John Dewey were hell-bent in implementing. And of course, Charlotte Izerbyt is the primary source for this whole subject. Read some of her books. I Have

Where you say: ” I feel that the things you view as important are not the real issues that are needed to move forward”, this implies you don’t assign the same importance to these issues that the Lord and Moroni do in Ether 8:24 . . . . and later President Benson: condescending again!

Wherefore, the Lord commandeth you, when ye shall see these things come among you that ye shall awake to a sense of your awful situation, because of this secret combination which shall be among you; or wo be unto it, because of the blood of them who have been slain; for they cry from the dust for vengeance upon it, and also upon those who built it up.

So the Lord commands us to “wake up to a sense [our] awful situation, BECAUSE of this secret combination which shall be among you. I.e., the secret combination is the CAUSE of our awful situation. And President Benson basically reiterates this idea in his Fall 1988 “I Testify” talk. WAKE UP YOURSELF, TRUMP IS PART OF THE EVIL

Globalism is a premier goal of this secret combination, as are wars and getting various people to war against one another. Stopping the march to globalization and stopping the pre-emptive wars we have been and are engaged in. etc., etc., is to go up against the globalists, AKA, the single secret combination Moroni, the Lord and President Benson all talk about. And if Trump can actually get a real investigation of 9/11 off the ground, this stands a chance of exposing the evil people who were the higher level perpetrators of 9/11, and who are undoubtedly allied with globalist controllers.The last portion of the Ether 8:24 verse is very intriguing. Notice how it says: “wo be unto it, because of the blood of them who have been slain; for they cry from the dust for vengeance upon it”. He isn’t talking about ancient dust. He is talking about blood mingled with dust from our day. Can you think of an event that happened a few years ago that generated innumerable body fragments of flesh and bone, mingled with blood that permeated enormous amounts of dust??So many of our illegal political/warfare operations, the growing control grid, the universal surveillance, the phony war on terror, the growing police state, etc., etc, hang directly on and were justified by the events of 9/11. You don’t expose or force them out of hiding, their agendas continue, and your attempts to improve the moral climate become no more than p…… into the wind . . . as I mentioned in my linked post, above.

I do not think you are understand what I am saying.
IMO, we are already "under the evil" of the secret combinations and are feeling the consequences. (Too late)
I know that God could fix all of this in an instant, but I also know that the people in this country today seem past feeling and "doing whats right"
It is very sad to think that you feel it a small thing to stand for morals and principles of truth and right! In your words that's just "P.....ing into the wind"

I will stand for truth, do my best and leave the rest to God!