Homeschooling

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Emma
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Re: Homeschooling

Post by Emma »

Boo wrote: I suspect I will be pilloried if not drawn and quartered for this but my experience with families that home school has been that the children suffered in one way or another and it wasn't easy on the parents either. I think that there are few parents that have the range of knowledge and experience necessary to teach a complete curriculum to multiple children of a variety of ages simultaneously. Who is so talented as to be able to teach AP Calculus and Greek History and Phonetics all well. If you aren't going to teach high school but only elementary subjects then you need to be concerned about the social development of you children as T Zone discovered. My wife and I looked at this issue carefully and considered we might be good candidates to do so . We only had 2 children 8 years apart. My wife was a PhD and I a lawyer (I don't confess that very often). We both had wide ranging interests etc. But after brief experience we concluded that each child would suffer socially and perhaps intellectually if home taught and they would be better off to go to a school and let us supplement their education . We felt that we could in large measure combat negative moral influences encountered in school or even better give them the tools to do so themselves since they had to live in the world ultimately . Our close friends with kids the same age chose to home school. The results have been quite different. My kids both went to BYU on full scholarships and the older one is about to graduate from the Univ of Chicago law school where he went on a full scholarship and the younger one is a freshman at BYU. My friends kids have not fared nearly so well even though they are as smart or smarter than mine. They tend to be withdrawn ( they weren't when younger) and don't function well in a competitive environment ( since they never competed ) and don't know how to work in groups ( since they have no experience doing so). My kids thank me each day that we chose not to HS them. My limited sample is limited but I have observed at least 4 other families that HS at close range and they have similar outcomes. I would ask myself what is best long term for the children and unless the plan is to live in the wilderness which approach will help them function the best throughout their lives. Good luck

Your children went to school 20 + years ago before common core. Would you send them to school today? Most teachers have told us that because of common core they would homeschool their own children instead of subjecting them to the brainwashing government curriculums. As for the social aspect, our children have no problem socializing or competing. They learn that at church and through sports and from their own siblings.



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Last edited by Emma on July 31st, 2014, 6:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ezra
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Re: Homeschooling

Post by Ezra »

H Verlan Andersen The Great and Abominable Church of the Devil p. 148
Using the force of government, the devil compels all parents to send their children to his church for training. There he permits nothing to be taught except the precepts of men and the wisdom of the world. His doctrines of organic evolution, atheism, materialism, and socialism are thus forced upon all children. No one is permitted to teach in his church until they have first been to college and there been indoctrinated with his philosophies. By reason of this learning and their own vainness, frailty, and foolishness, they tend to become proud of their degrees and status, and consequently refuse to hearken unto the counsel of God, or to be guided by the Holy Ghost. (2 N 9:28) ….parents are compelled by the devils’ church to finance with their tax money the corruption of their own children.
If evolution, atheism, materialism, socialism, and similar philosophies of men which are being taught by the public schools today are not the doctrines of Satan, one will find it difficult to find a set of teachings better calculated to serve his purposes, and if socialized education is not his “cunning plan”, to spread these false teachings, one will also find it difficult to design a plan which does the job more effectively and completely…if this is his plan, he “deceiveth the whole world”. (Revelations 12:9) …because there are few who regard socialized education as such. In fact, socialized education has become so universally accepted that the suggestion that it promotes the plan of the evil one may shock some. Teachers especially who have spent so many years and so much of their means obtaining credentials for employment

John Taylor JD 20:107-8
I am told in the revelations to bring up my children in the fear of God…Now we are engaged…in building our temples…that we may become united and linked together by eternal covenants that shall exist in all time and throughout eternity. And then when we have done all this go and deliberately turn out children over to whom? To men who do not believe the Gospel, to men who, according to your faith, are never going to the celestial kingdom of God…And you will turn your children over to them. And you call yourselves Latter-day Saints, do you? I will suppose a case. You expect to be saved in the celestial kingdom of God. Well. Supposing you expectations are realized, which I sometimes doubt, and you look down, down somewhere in a terrestrial or telestial kingdom, as the case may be, and you there see your children, the offspring that God had given you to train up in his fear, to honor him and keep his commandments…And supposing they could converse with you…what would be their feelings towards you? It would be, Father, Mother, you are to blame for this. I would have been with you if you had not tampered with the principles of life and salvation in permitting me to be decoyed away by false teachers, who taught incorrect principles. And this is the result of it. But then I very much question men and women’s getting into the celestial kingdom of God who have no more knowledge about the principles of life and salvation than to go and tamper with the sacred offspring, the principle of life which God entrusted to your care, to thus shuffle it off to imbibe the spirit of unbelief, which leads to destruction and death. I very much doubt in my mind the capability of such people getting there. (Mosiah 23:14) And also trust no one to be neither your teacher nor your minister, except he be a man of God, walking in his ways and keeping his commandments.

This is why I homeschool
And the curriculum I use is this

http://latterdaylearning.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Emma
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Re: Homeschooling

Post by Emma »

Yup! Ezra, that is right. Same with us.

worthit
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Re: Homeschooling

Post by worthit »

Boo you have a good point. It is hard on the parents and children. My experience has been that it never really received much support and but did receive significant opposition. I chose to do so when I was told not to buy or make clothes with elastic waist. The boys will pull them down, said the other parents--who sent their children to school. (Bellevue, Nebraska)

So we did. At least I did. Their father was and is gone most of the time. Not good. Yet the other concerns, while on the surface seem important, are really a reflection of different values. Oldest graduated from BYU Provo, and is out of her second year in law school. The next three want to run their own business. One is out on a mission, youngest set to go in one year.

I stressed until the children were tested. At eight the oldest tested out at 10th grade level. Slowed down. I don't condemn parents who send their children to others to be taught. The problem with PS, though, is that in many instances, what the parents want taught, and what the PS provides are not the same. The agenda is not the same. When we assume they are being taught reading, writing, and arithmetic, much of the time--most of the time, as studies have shown, they are being taught worldly versions of sex, "socialization" (turn around and shut up?) with behavioral science--meaning emotionally taught. I know many parents who have children that after having spent the best part of their day in school cannot successfully address teaching. Some PS students may do well in Calculus, so do some HS, but not everyone in PS takes or needs Calculus, so that is an exaggerated statement. And so typical. The competitive edge seems all important to most successful PS students.

How do you teach Algebra? I had it in high school. Do you remember it? Yes, I do, and use it. But if most parents don't remember or use it, is it that critical, really? What are their attitudes about gay marriage, because they start that in kindergarten in PS.

The bottom line is different for HS. Do they love each other? How well do they see, help and serve others? What are the principles of freedom they are learning and living? What are their interests? Instead of being stuck with one book on the subject for the semester, HS students have many choices and can compare values, and truths presented in the material. That PS students receive certification, that does not always translate into knowledge, or even usable knowledge. HS students understand the principles of freedom, not because of a class, but because they live it. Their knowledge base is generally wider, though not certified. Sure, some are weird, some fail. But I don't think HS has a corner on that. If 85% of students test better through HS, why would you want to condemn that method because of the 15% that don't?

At least in the case of my six children, the "withdrawn" participation is a courtesy. Most teens don't realize how competitive, inappropriate, and mean spirited some of their conversations are. HS teens are not there to police. You will only notice the impact of their example for a good thing, generally, if you look for good.

Kitkat
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Re: Homeschooling

Post by Kitkat »

As a former educator, I grappled at length with the Homeschool decision. Even after I made the choice to homeschool I still worry if I'm doing what is best for my children. I was never shy as a child until I entered kindergarten, in fact my mother was shocked to learn I was reserved at school, even a bit withdrawn. This withdrawness continued until I was finished with high school. I was never teased, and relatively well liked, but the freedom and joy I felt when my public school days were over was incredible. I know this is not everyone's experience, but it was mine. I think so much of properly socializing a child is individual. What would those 13 years of my life have been like if I had been given another option for school? I'll never know. Public school taught me many valuable skills, but the thing that stands out, as far as socializing, is that it taught me how to blend in, go with flow, how to not get noticed for saying the wrong thing :).

The pressure on parents, no matter how we school our children is immense. I have talked with so many parents who say they just teach their children correct standards and then give the chance to make their own decisions. My thoughts as I look around me and see all of us struggling so greatly, myself included, I think, why not try something different, the traditional approach just isn't delivering the results I want to see for my children.

I was a bt discouraged by the negative responses i got, especially from family, as we homeschooled and then I had a dream about 1/2 a year into homeschooling my oldest son, a dream that has comforted me greatly in my personal choice. I dreamed my son was in a classroom behind a closed door. He came to the door, knowing I was there and was telling me what the teacher was saying. I was alarmed at what he said and I began to diligently explain to him why that was not right. I'm sorry mom, he said, I have to go, they are telling me to do something else now, and he was gone.

That dream gave me courage and confidence to keep on my path. The other thing that has inspired me to keep going, as homeschooling is a big commitment, was that after my son finished kindergarten I felt closer to him! I had this relationship with him in a way that I had not had before. I knew him better. Not that I am perfect, no way! My kids know it :).

People tell me all the time I'm crazy, they don't know how I do it, but on the flip side I don't know how they do it. How do they find the time to hav e scriptures and prayers with each child, get them all fed and out the door, comb all their hair, and have down time to just get to know them.

I know it's such a personal choice none of us are fit to call the shots for each other, but it add my voice to encourage those who homeschool, because all the pressure to raise perfect children is overwhelming :).

With all this said, I believe god doesn't really judge us harshly as long as we are truly loving each other.

BrotherOfMahonri
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Re: Homeschooling

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

I appreciate your perspectives... Here is my perspective as an imperfect father and husband for what it is worth.

School. Where did it come from, how did it get to where it is now? What about the LDS perspective of schooling? When did we accept public schooling as a church, what was the consensus when it came our way? What is God's perspective of schooling? Is our societal version of "Schooling" children the same as God's version of "Schooling" (see D&C 88:77-79 https://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testa ... ang=eng#76) ? What do the scriptures teach about schooling? These are questions to ponder and study if you have not as of yet.

Home schoolers (like my wife and I) get a bad wrap it seems upfront due to what most people hear about home school and see in some rare cases (like my older brother Jr. High Teacher who has a home schooled student starting in his math class and is "way behind and unable to learn the math concepts") where a child was home schooled but truly was a baby sitter at home - so selfish parents could do what they wanted to do - therefor the child who was quote "home schooled" suffered greatly at the expense of the parent's selfishness or the ignorance of the parents who failed to allow the Holy Spirit to help them school and raise their children properly.

I could list study after study proving that properly home schooled children have a great ability, desire, and mindset to learn many times more than do students who attended public school (see this post I put here about those studies and how sending a child to school before age 8 is a form of child abuse: http://goo.gl/HD9vVs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ) - but that would be wrong of me to bore us all with FACTS and data from social scientists. Being this is the LDS "FREEDOM" Forum, I feel we each need to sit back and take a big breath, put off our politically correct and socially normal biases on either side and ask ourselves a few questions about the freedom God gave us and the responsibility to teach our children the TRUTH (which is in Jesus Christ), and what the purpose of this life truly is in the end... to know the only true God, and his Son Jesus Christ - and if any form of schooling fits that purpose.

What is the purpose of this life? Is the purpose of this life to "socialize" our children to fit in with society (many nice LDS people will quote to us on our front porch how we are to live in the world but not be of the world)? Even if we were to create children who were social masters - teaching them the gospel while socializing them in any form of school, in the next life none of those socializing "associations" would continue (see D&C 132:7 https://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testa ... lang=eng#6 "All covenants, contracts... ASSOCIATIONS... not sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise.... are of no efficacy, virtue or force in and after the resurrection... they have an end... "

I fear that we all too often bow to Babylonian false traditions that are introduced slowly into our church, of which our societal version of schooling and socializing our children fits in nicely. The Holy Spirit has confirmed and lead my wife and I gently but assuredly down the path of properly home schooling our children, or better said, the Holy Spirit has confirmed we are to be patriarch and matriarch in our home, to put our home in order, and allow the Spirit to help us teach our children. Proper Home schooling is just a societal politically correct phraseology that should truly translate to, "Heaven's Schooling and Learning System by the Holy Spirit" if understood and implemented correctly.

I don't care if my children know calculus - math will never carry them to Christ, an appreciation for math is great, and if the Holy Spirit conducts our children to master concepts of math, it will be in God's workings and plan for them individually - what matters is that our Home Schooled children know and love God (which includes his creations and understanding the things around them) in their childhood and youth.

What I care about, and what the Holy Spirit whispers to us as a couple wanting our temple marriage to be sealed by the Holy Spirit of Promise, is that our children can see clearly the false traditions of our times, false traditions that are spelled out in the scriptures written for the saints (us) today. I want our children to be able to recognize the scriptural warnings about unbelief (which unbelief truly means believing in things that are not true - like many of the traditions you see in our LDS culture today - esp. adopted and practiced in public school families, so that they are socially acceptable) amongst our fellow saints - to be a peculiar light unto all those around them, not a socialized child that fits in the mold.

I want my children to be able to see through these false traditions that even and especially the Saints of these last days are adopting - traditions that in the end are not helping children become sons and daughters to the most high God, but rather, socially admired CEOs, Mathematicians, CFOs, scientists, etc. accepted of the world. I do not know of any scriptural support of socializing children, training them up to be able to socialize in the world properly. Even Joseph of Egypt, who in my view was in the World but not of the World in his time in Egypt- was home schooled by his dad as far as we know. Did he know calculus, did he understand the theory of relativity, did he socialize well with his own publicly schooled or at least publicly socialized brothers who seemed to be accepted by the babylonian cultures of their days?

I feel strongly that in the end, when we face our loving Creator, we will be shocked when the majority of us are NOT allowed to continue as parents in one of the two lower degrees of Glory within the 3 degrees of glory in the Celestial Kingdom - because we feared our societal norms (like public school) more than we loved the idea of raising our own children with the Holy Spirit as our guide - truly practicing Godhood, as mother and father - where our Heavenly Father can trust us to properly trust his Spirit and raise his spirit children up unto him. Nowhere do I find in God's work, the traditions of socializing children - but on the contrary, I find isolating and insulating children within the family unit, far far away from Babylon and her false traditions.

I fear that the majority of us saints, who think public school is OK (my wife was a public school teacher mind you before we met and married and were awoken line up line as we heeded the Holy Spirit and put off the traditions of our society) - are missing out on truly some of the most beautiful relationships available in this life - relationships that cannot flower and blossom fully if a child is away from parents more than they are with them - during the MOST IMPRESSIONABLE YEARS OF THEIR LIVES, and frankly put, public school (introduced by communists as one of their planks to introducing communism to our society, who wanted to get at the children in the U.S.A. and are succeeding greatly) is ungodly, and despite all the good that occurs within public school, despite the good teachers (my wife was one of them) no amount of good will make up for the false traditions that will be introduced into the minds of children by peers, teachers, or curriculums in public schools.

We kid ourselves if we think Satan has not been planning for our children for thousands of years, mastering the subtle approach within any institution, any model, any "LDS safe" media, anything this world has created, including especially public, government controlled school. This may offend many mothers and fathers. Not my intent. Pressure in this false society and economy is ginormous when parents consider homeschooling. Nothing is sweeter than doing that which the spirit tells you to do, and I would dare venture and say that the Holy Spirit will confirm to all parents who ask in sincerity and are not living in Babylon themselves (being deceived) - that they should keep their children out of public school entirely, and that they (the parents) can teach their children themselves, which is most pleasing to God, by living so that the Holy Spirit is their teacher.

So the heart and core of this topic to me boils down to the purpose of this life, which is to know and love God, and become like him. I'm sorry if it offends you, but God doesn't send his kids to public school, in fact, this earth is no public school as some argue, but a hand crafted and planned by God's own hand world for our learning to hear his voice. Socializing traditions for the most part distract children from hearing his voice.

Public school has been corrupted if there was a good purpose in it. Gone are the days of sending our children to public school - and "socializing" them - and expecting them to see with their spiritual eyes as they mature into adulthood. I know because I was one of them, and it has been and continues to be a painful awakening to our awful situation, an awakening that our children ages 9 and down are able to see much more clearly then the children raised in the LDS homes where the fear of not socializing their children drowns out the whisperings of the spirit - telling them to believe in the truth, stop practicing unbelief, which unbelief is believing in things that are not true, like the belief that unless you have all these skills, tools, etc. as parents, you will fail in home schooling your children. A big bunch of bologna.

Any mother or father can home school. There is no curriculum, but the curriculum of following the Holy Spirit. He is the one helping us teach our children. He is one giving us the ideas. He is one telling us to ignore the pressure about curriculums, grade-levels, testing, etc. He is the one sweetly showing us that true home schooling is nothing more than learning to be an eternal family. Mother and Father, doing no other hobby than loving their children and raising them up to know and love God - and for those who are thinking, I can do that with my kids in public school are kidding themselves, and the impressionable years of a child's life will be spent mostly away from the parents, under the tutelage of a communistic organization, which is acceptable to way too many Latter Day Saints, who are ignorantly deceived that all is well in Zion-public-school, because our children are making money and getting good jobs... marrying in the temple, and having families.

This is a helpful introduction to the church never wanting public school and being against it, but the saints, just like all the saints of old, wanting babylonian traditions and benefits more than maybe the responsibility to follow the spirit and do things God's way:
http://youtu.be/nocNwBGTjT8

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Honor
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Location: WA

Re: Homeschooling

Post by Honor »

Loved this, ^^^^ thank you!

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