The Exit Narrative

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AI2.0
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The Exit Narrative

Post by AI2.0 »

Some of you may be familiar with the 12 year old girl who got up in Fast and Testimony meeting to proclaim that she was gay. There is a thread on it here:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=45750


I found an article on Fair mormon on this and what struck me was the concept of the 'exit narrative'.

https://www.fairmormon.org/blog/2017/06 ... -year-olds
From the article:
THE EXIT NARRATIVE
While talking about the love of God, which we can all agree with, her speech was calling out the beliefs of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as false. It follows the pattern of a typical exit narrative which reads, I used to believe the Church is true, but now I find joy and happiness outside of Church teachings. I hope you will give up your false beliefs and follow me. Anyone advocating that from the pulpit should be asked to step down, even if they are twelve years old.
Do you agree with me that this is something we deal with on this forum at times? In other words, some forum members share an underlying message in their posts that in essence say: "I used to believe the church is true, but now I find joy and happiness outside of church teachings. I hope you will give up your false beliefs and follow me". I believe this because at times, I've felt that the message a person is sharing is designed to encourage doubts about the gospel and to receive validation by getting others to agree with them.



While I was not there for this girl's 'testimony', I did see this happen once when I was a child in my home ward. Back before the block meeting schedule, we had sunday school exercises in the morning before we split up for sunday school classes. A member of the Sunday School Presidency got up and told us all about his decision to leave the church and then gave his reasons why. We all sat there stunned and uncomfortable. One ward member even yelled 'sit down "______"! But another man, got up, put his arm around this brother and told him how much we all loved him and hoped that he would be able to work out his doubts and frustrations with the gospel and keep coming to church. Incidentally, he did not remain in the church--he had his name removed, but surprisingly, he didn't become bitter as long as I knew him, I think because he felt that there were members who genuinely cared for him, though they disagreed with him and his choices.

I hope that on this forum, we can speak up and counter false beliefs and challenge 'exit narratives' but do so in a way that allows the person to still recognize that we care about them however, I'm not sure if it's possible when our only contact is through words on the screen.

gardener4life
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Re: The Exit Narrative

Post by gardener4life »

It's interesting how things always start out finding fault in the leaders. Then saying they are judgmental when they've only been loving. People then get confused and see behaviors that don't exist because of spiritual wounds they have that are untreated.

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AI2.0
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Posts: 3917

Re: The Exit Narrative

Post by AI2.0 »

gardener4life wrote: August 4th, 2017, 7:48 pm It's interesting how things always start out finding fault in the leaders. Then saying they are judgmental when they've only been loving. People then get confused and see behaviors that don't exist because of spiritual wounds they have that are untreated.
You are right. In the example of the girl in Fast and testimony meeting, she (or her mother) set herself up for having to be corrected and most likely, to get her feelings hurt. There was no way this was going to end in a way that didn't cause strife, since she'd invited friends to come and record the talk as well, which also is not appropriate. I find that people who want to be offended will orchestrate events so as to achieve their desire. :(

diligently seeking
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Posts: 1272

Re: The Exit Narrative

Post by diligently seeking »

AI2.0 wrote: August 4th, 2017, 5:07 pm Some of you may be familiar with the 12 year old girl who got up in Fast and Testimony meeting to proclaim that she was gay. There is a thread on it here:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=45750


I found an article on Fair mormon on this and what struck me was the concept of the 'exit narrative'.

https://www.fairmormon.org/blog/2017/06 ... -year-olds
From the article:
THE EXIT NARRATIVE
While talking about the love of God, which we can all agree with, her speech was calling out the beliefs of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as false. It follows the pattern of a typical exit narrative which reads, I used to believe the Church is true, but now I find joy and happiness outside of Church teachings. I hope you will give up your false beliefs and follow me. Anyone advocating that from the pulpit should be asked to step down, even if they are twelve years old.
Do you agree with me that this is something we deal with on this forum at times? In other words, some forum members share an underlying message in their posts that in essence say: "I used to believe the church is true, but now I find joy and happiness outside of church teachings. I hope you will give up your false beliefs and follow me". I believe this because at times, I've felt that the message a person is sharing is designed to encourage doubts about the gospel and to receive validation by getting others to agree with them.



While I was not there for this girl's 'testimony', I did see this happen once when I was a child in my home ward. Back before the block meeting schedule, we had sunday school exercises in the morning before we split up for sunday school classes. A member of the Sunday School Presidency got up and told us all about his decision to leave the church and then gave his reasons why. We all sat there stunned and uncomfortable. One ward member even yelled 'sit down "______"! But another man, got up, put his arm around this brother and told him how much we all loved him and hoped that he would be able to work out his doubts and frustrations with the gospel and keep coming to church. Incidentally, he did not remain in the church--he had his name removed, but surprisingly, he didn't become bitter as long as I knew him, I think because he felt that there were members who genuinely cared for him, though they disagreed with him and his choices.

I hope that on this forum, we can speak up and counter false beliefs and challenge 'exit narratives' but do so in a way that allows the person to still recognize that we care about them however, I'm not sure if it's possible when our only contact is through words on the screen.

Curious, out side of what the Lord tells us in D&C section 1 proclaiming that the church is the only true and Living Church upon the Earth with which the Lord is well pleased speaking unto it collectively and not individually --where does that phrase "I know the church is true" in our testimonies come from? Does it mean what we desire for it to mean when we express it? Or, is and can there be much more packaged to that statement then we understand and express in our testimonies? Furthermore, could we state in our testimonies as definitively as we state "the church is true" "I know that the church is under condemnation"?

Just two years after the Lord established his church through the Prophet Joseph Smith as definitively as he made the statements about the church being the only true and Living Church ---he definitively stated that the church was under condemnation. How do both expressions coexist and hold true if the "church is true" like we want for that expression to mean? There's so much in the scriptures that adds clarity to what these definitions mean. Too often we are afraid of that clarity and want to stick to the comforting *narrative that exists*. True?

This body of Christ that we are members of is not without a splendid amount of blessings that have been in our lives. I simply state there is more and we should be receiving them and there is a reason why we either do or don't.

drtanner
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Posts: 1850

Re: The Exit Narrative

Post by drtanner »

It is important to understand the context and meaning of this condemnation. It does not mean the church is not true today. This talk from Elder Oaks is helpful to understanding what that condemnation means to us personally and the context of President Bensons talk:

https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/dallin-h ... us-christ/

How do I know that the keys to administer the ordinances of salvation are still alive and well in this church? When I walk through the temple doors I can not deny what I feel and the sacred experiences that I have and continue to experienced there. This is one of many witnesses to me. We have true prophets on the earth that still hold the key and this is still the Lords true and living church. That being said there is a difference between the church and the gospel and each have a role to play. We can not be saved by a congregation. We must have a personal relationship with the savior, and there is no better way to gain that then through reading and applying the doctrine in the Book of Mormon.




diligently seeking
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1272

Re: The Exit Narrative

Post by diligently seeking »

drtanner wrote: August 6th, 2017, 9:33 am It is important to understand the context and meaning of this condemnation. It does not mean the church is not true today. This talk from Elder Oaks is helpful to understanding what that condemnation means to us personally and the context of President Bensons talk:

https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/dallin-h ... us-christ/

How do I know that the keys to administer the ordinances of salvation are still alive and well in this church? When I walk through the temple doors I can not deny what I feel and the sacred experiences that I have and continue to experienced there. This is one of many witnesses to me. We have true prophets on the earth that still hold the key and this is still the Lords true and living church. That being said there is a difference between the church and the gospel and each have a role to play. We can not be saved by a congregation. We must have a personal relationship with the savior, and there is no better way to gain that then through reading and applying the doctrine in the Book of Mormon.



Drtanner, I like much of what you have shared, and my soul and own experience resonates with much of what you have shared. For you--the gospel Jesus Christ is more alive and efficacious in your life because you are striving to lift the condemnation that is placed upon you for taking lightly the book of mormon message. Keep on keeping on brother. :)

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