Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

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Sarah
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Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

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In an autobiography compiled by Mosiah Hancock's daughters, Mosiah shares a dream/vision he had of the pre-earth life. Below is the excerpt I found at this link: http://www.boap.org/LDS/Early-Saints/MHancock.html
I shall now return to Payson. About the time I was one and twenty years of age, I know not whether to call it a dream or a vision; some have classed it a dream. I do not expect to give it in full: for to me it is sacred, beyond expression, especially some things I have no power to describe in words or to express in writing. Me thought I was taken away somewhere to Oh! such a Glorious Realm. I saw He whom at that time we Reverently spoke of as The Great Eternal. I saw the females at his right side. I have no idea of their number. I there saw the Savior; and calling me by name He said, "Mosiah, I have brought you here that you may know how it was before you went to yonder earth." Thinks I, What earth? for it seemed to me that I had no knowledge of an earth. He said, "As it is written in the Beginning, God created man, male and female, created He them." "And know you that no man is man without female, and that in the Lord. And no female is female without the male, and that in the Lord." I shall not attempt to tell how they were formed...suffice it to say, they were created in pairs, the male and his female. And as they came up to the throne of the Great Eternal the mothers seemed to name the females, and Oh! the respect they seemed to entertain for each other as they marched forth. The right elbow of the female seemed to touch the left elbow of the male. I should judge the males, generally to be about six feet two inches in height, and the females some three or four inches less. Their forms seemed as perfect as a new born infant, with no interference. They marched forth clothed in robes of a light color, tied in front.

They were instructed in everything that could be imagined, the finest oratory and everything of literary turn, including astronomy, trigonometry, surveying and the use of most delicate machinery. The females were taught to weave, to knit, to sew and to work in everything in their departments. Oh! the music of those spheres; I seem inadequate to touch upon the least of those accomplishments of the Heavenly Characters. Yet they were so orderly and harmonious that it seemed as if one could hear a pin drop. I saw some who became more efficient in science or other knowledge and they were advanced from class to class. It seemed as if the female always kept with her companion for they were always together, for I never saw one fall behind. Even those who had been placed to overlook the classes were always together. The male overlooking the males and his female overlooking females. I even had a companion with me that needed no prompting. It seemed that I had been with the Savior so long, it seemed that I wore the same vesture as his. All at once a Heavenly voice seemed to reverberate, as it were, through the immensity of space and said: "Hear all ye, Oh my children! We have a world for you on which you can dwell and you can have the chance on coming up as we have come up." We then gathered together in counsel to devise means of redemption, should it be needed. One arose whom I had always looked upon as the Savior and said that he would go down and lay before the Children of men the gospel that they might have the chance of attaining the glory as the Gods had done by the obedience to the Divine Plan of Life. Then I saw another who supposed his plan to be superior to the plan of the first for he said that he would save all; only that he wanted the glory. I saw that he and his plan were not accepted, so there was considerable commotion. At last I saw, as it were, a platform extended where the contest could be decided. I was indignant at the opposition as we fought with our opponents. The one called Levi became my father, and the one called Clarissa was my mother here on earth. My father seemed a savior as he strove to bring me up in the admonition of the Lord; and blessed be the name of my parents. Clarissa became my mother and she certainly did a christian duty to me. But there are others who have no right with me or mine, that I cheerfully leave in the hands of One that I know doeth all things well. Although I have been weak at times, I trust that I can be worth of Glory hereafter.
But if you search for the vision online, you will also find a version which is quite different. This blog post is an example: http://mormon-chronicles.blogspot.com/2 ... tence.html

Here's the text of the second version:
Mosiah Hancock Journal Addendum, LDS Historical Department; SLC

"When about twenty-one years of age, I was permitted by the power of God, to go into His presence and into my former abode. I saw the Eternal Father on His throne and His wives on His left side, all shining in glory, I saw the Savior and knew Him. It takes the power of the Holy Ghost to tell the difference between the Father and the Son, they look so much alike Jesus said: 'Mosiah, I have brought you here to show you how it was befor e you went to the earth.' I had been to the earth; everything looked so natural and familiar. I seemed to have been a companion of the Savior and talked with him like a friend. Again, He spoke to me and said: 'Look and see man as he came forth.' I looked in the direction indicated and saw an innumerable line of God's children extending further than I could see. They were arranged in pairs, male and female, and passed in front of the Eternal Father who named them; and they were clad in long white robes with girdles tied around the waists; each pair seemed to have been created mates.

"When thus clothed; they were arranged in classes of about two hundred; the males sitting in front and the females behind them. They were taught in the arts and sciences, and everything necessary to make the heart happy The teachers of the classes received the instruction they imparted from certain notable ones, who in turn got their directions from the Father and the Son- I thought I was one to overlook the classes; I also saw Joseph, Brigham and many others engaged in this work of education. I thought as some became more efficient than others they were advanced from class to class I thought my name was Mosiah, and the names of the other brethren there were the same as upon the earth. All at once there was a gathering of these spirits and the voice of the Great Eternal (for that is what we called God there) spoke: 'Oh, ye my children,' and His voice penetrated throughout space, so countless were His offspring 'We have an earth prepared for you, on which you can dwell and have a chance to come up, thru obeying our Heavenly laws.'

"I there heard the question asked: 'Who will go down and set an example of humility and faithful ness to these my children, that they may be brought, thru obedience to our laws, back into our presence?'

"I thought I saw one in the express image of the Father say, 'Father, I will go down and set a pattern of humility and patience that your children, thru my example, may be brought back again.' How noble, I thought, He looked when He offered Himself so patient before the children of our Father.

"I saw another, who seemed to be a very high military officer who arose and said: 'I will go down to yonder earth and surely I will bring all your children back to you so none of them shall be lost.'

"The plan of the first was accepted as being the only sure plan for an exaltation The plan of the second was rejected with great kindness, but the second was not satisfied; and while the first stood in great humility by the side of the Father, the sec ond with many who stood in with him, went about among the Heavenly hosts to advocate the plan, that was put forth as the rights of the second. This one was Lucifer, a son of the morning, for any had been with the Father for countless ages, and learned their lessons well, and he had been no dull scholar. Finally Lucifer openly rebelled against the Father and the Son and six other mighty ones who stood faithful with them and declared, 'I will have it my way.' I saw the faithful ones gather around the Father and the Son, and Lucifer's workers gathered around him, when one of the notable ones, who was called Michael, arose and said, 'We will decide the contest' It seemed that a platform was extended into space,. upon which we could operate, by what power I could not tell. We who were faithful to the Father and the Son, had a white star upon us, and the others chose a re d star, about one third of the males and females would not accept of either star, but withdrew from the conflict, the females taking the males by the arm, said, 'Come, let us not take part with either side. Let us retire-' (When they were cast out after the manner of spiritual warfare,) they had no power to return. When they were all cleared from the platform and Satan and his followers were all cast down, their female companions wept, and we all wept.


"No females took part against the Father and the Son, but all took sides in their favor, except the. neutral ones already mentioned. After the tears were dried, from our eyes, the voice of the Great Eternal spoke again and said, 'Hear, O ye my children;' His voice penetrating the immensity of space so that all could hear it; it is decreed by the Great Eternal that the females shall not follow their ma les in their banishment, but for every male that has kept his first estate and fought valiantly for the Father and the Son, there are two females. Again it is decreed that those males who have taken no part in this great conflict shall keep their females and a race of servants shall they be.' I then saw that the notable ones who had taken such an interest in the rights of the Father and the Son were appointed to gather up those lone females whose companions had been cast down They were again placed in classes. each man having two females in the ranks behind him. I there saw that they were again taught in their classes, which now contained about three hundred. I next saw Michael and his companion proceed a long way off, to people the earth where Lucifer and his FOLLOWERS HAD BEEN CAST. As time passed, other notable ones followed as they were appointed. During all this time the classes met frequently, being taught by instructors appointed. Each member knew his or her own-place, and took it each time, and the best of order prevailed. They were asked, first the males, and then the females behind them, 'Will you obey the Gospel of Jesus Christ, when you go to that earth?' Some would answer, yes, but not all. Some could be asked, Will you obey that law which placed the Gods on high? And in very few cases I would hear the females say, 'I want my own mate' Sometimes the question would be asked of a male, 'Will you obey that higher law? and he would answer, 'I wish to enjoy myself with the females' Sometimes when the question would be asked of the females she would reply 'I wish to enjoy myself with the males.' Again the question would be asked of the males, 'If you will not join the Church of Christ, what do you wish to be? He would som etimes say, 'I wish to be a judge, or an officer of high rank among the people ' Then he would be asked, 'Will you sustain the laws of God and also the rights of all mankind?' and the answer in every instance was, 'yes. ' I saw there that those who were proficient in their classes were advanced more rapidly until they became most perfect in those heavenly teachings, but some males, even there in Heaven would neglect their females and their classes and not meet with them. They would go off, arm in arm, as men now go, not having any desire for their duties. I never saw a female leave her place in the class assigned her by the Heavenly powers. I saw Abraham, when he came back from the earth, and many of the notable ones, when they came back to be crowned I saw them step upon the platform of the Gods and receive their crowns, and enter into their exaltations. At last I s aw the time when Joseph was to go forth, and the voice of the Great Eternal said, 'Oh, my neglected daughters, gather around these my faithful servants who have been faithful in teaching you the principles of righteousness and of our kingdom, that others may come up and have the chance to be glorified-' I saw many of them gather around Joseph and form a ring with him and the Savior in the center. They made a covenant with him that they would meet him on the earth and help him establish that great work upon the earth. I saw many of them gather around Brigham Young, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, and many other notable ones, and around many who have not become so notable. They formed rings around each of them with Christ in the center each time, for He rehearsed to them the Covenant. They would take each other by the hand, in the circle and bow their faces down to Him, in the center, and in the most solemn manner agree to meet them here, until every one of those neglected daughters was provided for; and they were filled with such joy that their songs made a paradise of the realm.

"At last The time came for me to go to the earth. The Savior came to me and said, 'Mosiah, it is time for you to prepare to go. You have been faithful so long here it is time for you to go, that you may return and be as we are.' As I beheld Him, I thought, 'How is it that I am not as you are now? For it seemed, that I knew nothing of the earth or the changes a probation there would make in me. However, I said, 'Who will go down to that earth, and be my father, and help me that I may be brought in the ways of truth and righteousness?' A male by the name of Levi stepped forth, in the presence of the Son, and said, 'I will go down to yonder earth, a nd by the help of the Great Eternal, I will try to do as well by you as you have done for me, for I am grateful to you for all your kindness to me.' He returned to his place, being an instructor of a class. I was one among others who was appointed to instruct him and the other teachers of classes. A female came out of the class and bowing before the Savior and me, said, 'I will go down and be your mother.' In a short time the man disappeared and was immediately followed by the woman. I knew my departure was near at hand and I asked, 'If on my return I could have the same position I then held.' Then the Savior said, Yes, and greater, but you have to go down to the earth, and take a lowly position and be misunderstood by man, even your brethren and endure many hardships ant set many examples of humility and patience, that you may return and enter the glory, even such a s I have.' He then added, 'Your time is now come to take your mission to the earth,' and He laid His hands on my head, as He had done to others, and set me apart for that important mission. He again said to me, 'I will see you safely thru until you return again.' I fully believe on that promise. It seemed as though a way was opened before me, and I dived down toward the earth with the speed of lightening and awoke while sailing thru space.

The End.

Mosiah Hancock
Now to solve the mystery, we look at the comments under that blog post and get some explanation for why there are two versions:
The Young Family Historian said...

I commented a little while back on this addendum. Interestingly enough, this addendum may be proved to be false....the original vision and the addendum are very different from each other. I still believe visions and dreams are very personal, but this one has always seemed a bit off to me.....
Mar 12, 2014, 11:06:00 PM

The Young Family Historian said...

As a descendant of Mosiah, I have been working with the LDS Church History Department about this addendum. I have an original manuscript along with BYU, the U of U, and the Church History Department of Mosiah's Original Writings. This so called addendum is FALSE. The original dream or vision is not as detailed as this one, and I have been contacted by other family members who have said that this was an embellished version of the original as well.

The Young Family Historian said...

The embellishment occurred sometime in the late 1960's or 1970's when a polygamous group published it. This is what myself and the church historian spoke about. My great-aunt was one of the original writers of this history. Her daughter has also stated that who ever published it embellished the original.
May 20, 2014, 11:50:00 PM


Thought I would just share my find here, because I have always wondered about this vision, and now feel a lot more comfortable with the first version rather than the second.

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Sarah
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by Sarah »

Just bumping this up for Kingdom of Zion. Many of those who feel the Church went off track by not living polygamy really like one particular version of this vision (that was fabricated) that reinforces the idea that there are going to be billions more women in the Celestial Kingdom than there are men.

gardener4life
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by gardener4life »

It seems like you are worried about confirming it, maybe because of that addended piece.

One of the things you don't have to worry too much on is that if its a true vision then it will mesh with and agree with what's said in the scriptures and with modern revelation. When someone is else describing something like an inspired dream I can't always tell if its inspired or not.

But here's one interesting note; in Lehi's dream, Nephi relates the process of at one time asking the Lord to confirm the dream to him that his father saw. Then later he receives the same dream of the tree of life. But what I thought was interesting is Nephi when describing the filthy waters in the dream says, that when his dad had the dream because of being harrowed up in worry stress, etc...things of the world, he didn't recognize that the water meant the filthiness of the world or that it was filthy. So sometimes you might have most the things right in the dream but one thing might be off because of something during the day affecting your signal reception. (Isn't that interesting?)

Another thought is that sometimes inspired dreams might be to teach, or help but some of them might just be to comfort that person. Spiritual gifts ARE real, and many people have them. But be careful if you use them the wrong way or try to use them on the world, then Satan may twist their use and that can cause a lot of anguish.

I am not an expert on this subject but Marco and a few others might be able to help you. Alaris might too. But regardless if its inspired there's a key usually in the scriptures that will match up with something to help confirm it.

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Sarah
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by Sarah »

gardener4life wrote: January 17th, 2018, 3:43 am It seems like you are worried about confirming it, maybe because of that addended piece.

One of the things you don't have to worry too much on is that if its a true vision then it will mesh with and agree with what's said in the scriptures and with modern revelation. When someone is else describing something like an inspired dream I can't always tell if its inspired or not.

But here's one interesting note; in Lehi's dream, Nephi relates the process of at one time asking the Lord to confirm the dream to him that his father saw. Then later he receives the same dream of the tree of life. But what I thought was interesting is Nephi when describing the filthy waters in the dream says, that when his dad had the dream because of being harrowed up in worry stress, etc...things of the world, he didn't recognize that the water meant the filthiness of the world or that it was filthy. So sometimes you might have most the things right in the dream but one thing might be off because of something during the day affecting your signal reception. (Isn't that interesting?)

Another thought is that sometimes inspired dreams might be to teach, or help but some of them might just be to comfort that person. Spiritual gifts ARE real, and many people have them. But be careful if you use them the wrong way or try to use them on the world, then Satan may twist their use and that can cause a lot of anguish.

I am not an expert on this subject but Marco and a few others might be able to help you. Alaris might too. But regardless if its inspired there's a key usually in the scriptures that will match up with something to help confirm it.
The reason why I searched this out is because I kept seeing people quote the second version which seemed a little weird to me. I went on a search for the original and discovered that the first is the original and the second was fabricated, most likely it appears from these comments, by a polygamous group. I believe in plural marriage for eternity but not like most people who assume there will of necessity need to be at least twice as many females as there are males to make it work. And some of these complicated theories on the afterlife, seem to be revelations that explain why there are so many more women than men. I just think it is one of Satan's ways of swaying some to criticize the Church for the revelation to let go of polygamy, and justify their own actions or desire for it in the future. I really don't know or care too much if the dream is valid or not. But thanks for your comment.
Last edited by Sarah on January 19th, 2018, 1:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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AI2.0
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by AI2.0 »

The second version is not only weird, it's actually creepy. What's even more creepy is that someone doctored his writing to attempt to deceive others.

Thanks for sharing this, and for bumping it--I must have missed it back when you originally posted it.

Crackers
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by Crackers »

I agree that it's creepy, and I think it would feel fictional/doctored even without the first version to compare it to. That second version clearly had an agenda.

gardener4life
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by gardener4life »

I would keep it simple. Don't worry about it. If those guys lied it will come out. The Lord says those that try to thwart his work (which includes twisting it around) will have it come to their shame.

I know you aren't too worried but I still wanted to hit on a point;

What I would focus on is that you have to believe that Heavenly Father and Jesus are aware of your circumstances and will bless and reward you for living right in a way that you can live with. Whether or not there is or isn't poygamy, you will be happy after this life for living right and choosing well. This is one of the true meanings of in my father's house are many mansions. The many mansions correlates with how Earth houses mansions of different species of animals that can all have their own 'habitat' and way to live. Heavenly Father will see how your heart yearns / greatly desires a place for your own to be happy in after this life. He rewards the faithful.

Doctrine and Covenants 112:10-11
10 Be thou humble; and the Lord thy God shall lead thee by the hand, and give thee answer to thy prayers.

Mosiah 9:18
18 And God did hear our cries and did answer our prayers; and we did go forth in his might; yea, we did go forth against the Lamanites, and in one day and a night we did slay three thousand and forty-three; we did slay them even until we had driven them out of our land.

Abraham 2:19 And the Lord appeared unto me in answer to my prayers, and said unto me: Unto thy seed will I give this bland. (He's not going to appear to everyone right away probably. But the point is that there will be attention for what you need.)

Doctrine and Covenants 16:3-4
3 And I will tell you that which no man knoweth save me and thee alone— (What's the point of this? Individual attention for those that are obedient. He will be their savior and come to their aid. Also there are MANY scriptures with wording like this. Doesn't it make you feel good?)

Focus on this until you feel strong. Don't worry about polygamy. The point of eternal life and salvation is to be happy. Unhappiness comes from the mortal probation state and we won't always have these worries and stress like this. Someday that will be done away with.

Juliet
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by Juliet »

The 2nd version says the women would be forced to sit in the back of class in heaven. Who knew Earth was more respectful to women than heaven? If it's true I won't be going back to that place.

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Sarah
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by Sarah »

Juliet wrote: January 17th, 2018, 1:20 pm The 2nd version says the women would be forced to sit in the back of class in heaven. Who knew Earth was more respectful to women than heaven? If it's true I won't be going back to that place.
Good catch. I also noticed that in the original account he said the females were to the right of God, in the fake account it says his wives were on the left.

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Jamescm
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by Jamescm »

With the greatest due respect to the daughters of God, what seems awkward about the second account is the idea that not a single daughter was cast down with Satan, nor shirked her duties in study before birth. They have many spiritual and social strengths that men lack, but for every one is a shortcoming or weakness that men tend to make up. My own marriage, my parents, my wife's parents, other elders, and things my wife says goes on in relief society all make it clear to me that neither sex is more innately spiritual, righteous, harmonious, or faithful than the other; that is why neither of us fully "are" without the other. Also... "Enjoy myself with the females". "Enjoy myself with the males". Hrm...

One notable positive feature of the second account, however, is describing Lucifer's plan as having been "lovingly" declined. Certainly I imagine our Heavenly Father would be patient in responding to Lucifer's offer, even if it were motivated by pride or selfishness. He would probably also explain clearly to him and all of us -why- He would decline, leaving Lucifer no room for a (perceptibly) justified indignation or hurt. This is a detail I haven't heard expressed before.

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True
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by True »

I swear we’be talked about this before and this guy was some guy that thought the manifesto was wrong and had a “vision” for polygamy’s sake....

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inho
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by inho »

True wrote: January 18th, 2018, 2:05 pm I swear we’be talked about this before and this guy was some guy that thought the manifesto was wrong and had a “vision” for polygamy’s sake....
Are you referring to Mosiah Hancock? He died years before the manifesto.

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True
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Re: Mosiah Hancock's vision of his pre-earth life.

Post by True »

inho wrote: January 19th, 2018, 12:50 pm
True wrote: January 18th, 2018, 2:05 pm I swear we’be talked about this before and this guy was some guy that thought the manifesto was wrong and had a “vision” for polygamy’s sake....
Are you referring to Mosiah Hancock? He died years before the manifesto.
Ok. I guess I remembered wrong.

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