Always retain a remission of sins

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Amonhi
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Always retain a remission of sins

Post by Amonhi »

I am quoting from PM I sent to someone today that I thought might be useful to others.

If you have the Holy Ghost, then you you have been baptized with fire and received a remission of sins because the Holy Ghost does not dwell in unclean temples and will not dwell in those who have not been baptized by fire and received a remission of sins.

If you want to experience the baptism of fire (remission of your sins as if by fire) and the gift of the Holy Ghost, here is what to do...
2 And they had viewed themselves in their own carnal state, even less than the dust of the earth. And they all cried aloud with one voice, saying: O have mercy, and apply the atoning blood of Christ that we may receive forgiveness of our sins, and our hearts may be purified; for we believe in Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who created heaven and earth, and all things; who shall come down among the children of men.

3 And it came to pass that after they had spoken these words the Spirit of the Lord came upon them, and they were filled with joy, having received a remission of their sins, and having peace of conscience, because of the exceeding faith which they had in Jesus Christ who should come, according to the words which king Benjamin had spoken unto them. - Mosiah 4
The words are NOT important, it is the feeling and intent. You can't act you way through it. You must really feel it.

It is important to have a correct understanding of who God is. God is NOT the tyrant of the universe or the dictator of the universe. He does not smite us for not obeying him, but we are subject to the natural consequences of our actions which can be harmful and painful. He gives us commandments that will help us to avoid the undesirable natural consequences and gain the desirable natural consequences. He gives these commandments and we obey for our benefit, not His.
6 I say unto you, if ye have come to a knowledge of the goodness of God, and his matchless power, and his wisdom, and his patience, and his long-suffering towards the children of men; and also, the atonement which has been prepared from the foundation of the world, that thereby salvation might come to him that should put his trust in the Lord, and should be diligent in keeping his commandments, and continue in the faith even unto the end of his life, I mean the life of the mortal body—

7 I say, that this is the man who receiveth salvation, through the atonement which was prepared from the foundation of the world for all mankind, which ever were since the fall of Adam, or who are, or who ever shall be, even unto the end of the world. - Mosiah 4
If you want to always retain a remission of your sins so that you can have the holy ghost as your constant companion...
11 And again I say unto you as I have said before, that as ye have come to the knowledge of the glory of God, or if ye have known of his goodness and have tasted of his love, and have received a remission of your sins, which causeth such exceedingly great joy in your souls, even so I would that ye should remember, and always retain in remembrance, the greatness of God, and your own nothingness, and his goodness and long-suffering towards you, unworthy creatures, and humble yourselves even in the depths of humility, calling on the name of the Lord daily, and standing steadfastly in the faith of that which is to come, which was spoken by the mouth of the angel.

12 And behold, I say unto you that if ye do this ye shall always rejoice, and be filled with the love of God, and always retain a remission of your sins; and ye shall grow in the knowledge of the glory of him that created you, or in the knowledge of that which is just and true. - Mosiah 4
This is wise advice from an angel who taught King Benjamin.

Peace,
Amonhi

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Jeremy
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by Jeremy »

Isn't it a common belief that that is what the sacrament is for? Repenting and renewing baptismal covenants?

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Original_Intent
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by Original_Intent »

Jeremy wrote:Isn't it a common belief that that is what the sacrament is for? Repenting and renewing baptismal covenants?
That's a rhetorical question, right?

...and yet, maybe it should be discussed.

Finrock
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Posts: 4426

Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by Finrock »

Amonhi wrote:I am quoting from PM I sent to someone today that I thought might be useful to others.

If you have the Holy Ghost, then you you have been baptized with fire and received a remission of sins because the Holy Ghost does not dwell in unclean temples and will not dwell in those who have not been baptized by fire and received a remission of sins.

If you want to experience the baptism of fire (remission of your sins as if by fire) and the gift of the Holy Ghost, here is what to do...
2 And they had viewed themselves in their own carnal state, even less than the dust of the earth. And they all cried aloud with one voice, saying: O have mercy, and apply the atoning blood of Christ that we may receive forgiveness of our sins, and our hearts may be purified; for we believe in Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who created heaven and earth, and all things; who shall come down among the children of men.

3 And it came to pass that after they had spoken these words the Spirit of the Lord came upon them, and they were filled with joy, having received a remission of their sins, and having peace of conscience, because of the exceeding faith which they had in Jesus Christ who should come, according to the words which king Benjamin had spoken unto them. - Mosiah 4
The words are NOT important, it is the feeling and intent. You can't act you way through it. You must really feel it.

It is important to have a correct understanding of who God is. God is NOT the tyrant of the universe or the dictator of the universe. He does not smite us for not obeying him, but we are subject to the natural consequences of our actions which can be harmful and painful. He gives us commandments that will help us to avoid the undesirable natural consequences and gain the desirable natural consequences. He gives these commandments and we obey for our benefit, not His.
6 I say unto you, if ye have come to a knowledge of the goodness of God, and his matchless power, and his wisdom, and his patience, and his long-suffering towards the children of men; and also, the atonement which has been prepared from the foundation of the world, that thereby salvation might come to him that should put his trust in the Lord, and should be diligent in keeping his commandments, and continue in the faith even unto the end of his life, I mean the life of the mortal body—

7 I say, that this is the man who receiveth salvation, through the atonement which was prepared from the foundation of the world for all mankind, which ever were since the fall of Adam, or who are, or who ever shall be, even unto the end of the world. - Mosiah 4
If you want to always retain a remission of your sins so that you can have the holy ghost as your constant companion...
11 And again I say unto you as I have said before, that as ye have come to the knowledge of the glory of God, or if ye have known of his goodness and have tasted of his love, and have received a remission of your sins, which causeth such exceedingly great joy in your souls, even so I would that ye should remember, and always retain in remembrance, the greatness of God, and your own nothingness, and his goodness and long-suffering towards you, unworthy creatures, and humble yourselves even in the depths of humility, calling on the name of the Lord daily, and standing steadfastly in the faith of that which is to come, which was spoken by the mouth of the angel.

12 And behold, I say unto you that if ye do this ye shall always rejoice, and be filled with the love of God, and always retain a remission of your sins; and ye shall grow in the knowledge of the glory of him that created you, or in the knowledge of that which is just and true. - Mosiah 4
This is wise advice from an angel who taught King Benjamin.

Peace,
Amonhi
I have also pondered what this means in Mosiah 4 that is connected to what you posted a little bit later on in that chapter where King Benjamin gives us another key on how we can retain a remission of our sins:
Mosiah 4 wrote:26 And now, for the sake of these things which I have spoken unto you—that is, for the sake of retaining a remission of your sins from day to day, that ye may walk guiltless before God—I would that ye should impart of your substance to the poor, every man according to that which he hath, such as feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, visiting the sick and administering to their relief, both spiritually and temporally, according to their wants.

27 And see that all these things are done in wisdom and order; for it is not requisite that a man should run faster than he has strength. And again, it is expedient that he should be diligent, that thereby he might win the prize; therefore, all things must be done in order.
-Finrock

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Jeremy
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by Jeremy »

Original_Intent wrote:
Jeremy wrote:Isn't it a common belief that that is what the sacrament is for? Repenting and renewing baptismal covenants?
That's a rhetorical question, right?
Not really.
Original_Intent wrote:...and yet, maybe it should be discussed.
Probably.

brianj
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by brianj »

Jeremy wrote:Isn't it a common belief that that is what the sacrament is for? Repenting and renewing baptismal covenants?
Common belief? Yes. Accurate belief? No.

Most church members, at least in the wards I have been in, don't seem to put any preparation into taking the sacrament. In at least two recent general conferences I recall someone speaking about preparing for the sacrament: getting to church early, quietly listening to the prelude music, contemplating the last week, and repenting of sins before partaking of the sacrament. But it seems a majority of the congregation arrives within five minutes of the start (plus or minus) and many those who are there early treat the time before the meeting starts as a social opportunity instead of turning their thoughts to spiritual topics and letting the prelude music bring the Spirit into their hearts and minds.

I'm not going to say that we sin by not properly preparing for the sacrament, but are we renewing baptismal covenants if we partake without putting thought and repentance into preparing for the ordinance?

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h_p
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by h_p »

The belief that we renew our baptismal covenants by taking the sacrament is not based in scripture.

Amonhi
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Posts: 4650

Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by Amonhi »

Jeremy wrote:Isn't it a common belief that that is what the sacrament is for? Repenting and renewing baptismal covenants?
King Benjamin makes the point and repeats that point a few times. The point is if you always want to retain a remission of sins, then you just have to remember something, one thing...
11 And again I say unto you as I have said before, that as ye have come to the knowledge of the glory of God, or if ye have known of his goodness and have tasted of his love, and have received a remission of your sins, which causeth such exceedingly great joy in your souls, even so I would that ye should remember, and always retain in remembrance, the greatness of God, and your own nothingness, and his goodness and long-suffering towards you, unworthy creatures, and humble yourselves even in the depths of humility, calling on the name of the Lord daily, and standing steadfastly in the faith of that which is to come, which was spoken by the mouth of the angel.

12 And behold, I say unto you that if ye do this ye shall always rejoice, and be filled with the love of God, and always retain a remission of your sins; and ye shall grow in the knowledge of the glory of him that created you, or in the knowledge of that which is just and true. - Mosiah 4
Compare that with this...
3 Nephi 18 - Immediately following the sacrament as administered to the nephites, Jesus taught this.
11 And this shall ye always do to those who repent and are baptized in my name; and ye shall do it in remembrance of my blood, which I have shed for you, that ye may witness unto the Father that ye do always remember me. And if ye do always remember me ye shall have my Spirit to be with you.
Because we can't have the spirit unless we have the remission of sins, there is a connection between remembering the love and mercy of Christ toward us unworthy creatures. If we always remember God's goodness toward us and our own unworthiness of that goodness, then we will begin to treat those who are not worthy of our goodness and mercy and kindness the way God treats us. In other words, we will begin to love our enemy and do good to those who do evil to us, just as God does Good to us even though we are unworthy.

It makes us like God and God is love. God sends his rain on the wicked and the righteous and makes His son to rise on the just and the unjust.
43 ¶Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
...
46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? - Matt:5:
Be ye therefore _________ even as your Father which is in heaven is...

Peace,
Amonhi

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LDS Physician
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by LDS Physician »

h_p wrote: February 8th, 2017, 7:10 am The belief that we renew our baptismal covenants by taking the sacrament is not based in scripture.
At least, not ancient scripture...but several prophets and apostles teach us that the sacrament certainly does renew baptismal covenants (and indeed any covenant we've entered into with God).

https://www.lds.org/ensign/1995/03/i-ha ... n?lang=eng

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Contemplator
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by Contemplator »

I have seen many claims that we are not renewing our baptism covenant when partaking of the sacrament. And, I have not been able to find the words, "renew the baptism covenant" in the scriptures. But, regarding baptism, Alma says in Mosiah 18:
10 Now I say unto you, if this be the desire of your hearts, what have you against being baptized in the name of the Lord, as a witness before him that ye have entered into a covenant with him, that ye will serve him and keep his commandments, that he may pour out his Spirit more abundantly upon you?
So, baptism is an expression, through ordinance, that we are willing to covenant with God to keep his commandments in order to have His spirit. Seems similar to the sacrament prayers.

Juliet
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by Juliet »

I have had to pray with this intent many times when I realized I had a dark spot that still needed to come into the joy of the Holy Spirit. Sometimes we hold that darkness so deep, we don't even realize it, but then we see ourselves acting out of character with who we ought to be, and that is a reminder to look deeper for that dark spot that needs to be brought up to receive the Holy Spirit.

Some of my worst days were realizing I wasn't righteous at all, but indeed in a carnal state. For some reason, it is such a battle to get to the point of seeing myself in that carnal state, when it is the truth; and finally, I buckle down and agonizingly pray for help, realizing I am at fault.

Help always comes and I always feel better afterward. Why is repentance so hard looking forward but such an obvious right choice looking back?

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h_p
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Re: Always retain a remission of sins

Post by h_p »

LDS Physician wrote: March 10th, 2017, 7:03 pm
h_p wrote: February 8th, 2017, 7:10 am The belief that we renew our baptismal covenants by taking the sacrament is not based in scripture.
At least, not ancient scripture...but several prophets and apostles teach us that the sacrament certainly does renew baptismal covenants (and indeed any covenant we've entered into with God).

https://www.lds.org/ensign/1995/03/i-ha ... n?lang=eng
Just to clarify what I was referring to, it's what Elder Anderson said in the April 2015 Sabbath Day Observance training (skip to 14:24):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgferShOYrc

To summarize it, he said, "the title 'renewing our baptismal covenants' is not found in the scriptures. It's not inappropriate, but it can't be the keynote of what we say about the sacrament."

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