Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

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SmallFarm
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by SmallFarm »

JulesGP wrote:Maybe we should dress like this for the sacrament ordinance :)

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lol I wish :D

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SmallFarm
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

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mingano wrote:Now, keeping these "acceptable standards" in mind, who here thinks it is a major sign of disrespect to wear anything other than a white shirt and tie to sacrament meeting?
I don't go to sacrement meeting because I have social anxiety. Thanks for reminding me that there are those there who will judge me based on my appearance :-w

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gruden2.0
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by gruden2.0 »

mingano, what do you want us to do? Do you want us to join with you in casting stones at her and joining in a rousing round of condemnation?

I remember back in kindergarten where I helpfully pointed out to the teacher how one of the other kids took an extra cookie during milk 'n cookies time. She told me to worry about myself and she would worry about the rest. Good advice. I've proven that I'm more than I can handle on many occasions, and I should stick with that. In pre-mortality, Lucifer was known as the Accuser of the Brethren for accusing them of their mistakes and misdeeds before God. Look where it got him.

I'm sure we could have a thread a mile long on all the ways church members have disappointed us over the years. What's the point? Show a little charity to others and you'll get shown some in return.

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sadie_Mormon
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by sadie_Mormon »

SARAH Ward wrote:mingano: obviously neither of the girls, nor the Mum who runs the dance studio, are an example of Latter-day Saint standards. If they are LDS members, and attend activities and services, then this should indeed be a matter for their Bishop to discuss with them.

+1

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Sariel
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by Sariel »

Fairminded wrote:
Azriel wrote:This thread turned into judging someone for judging someone.
In further news, water is wet.
=))

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sadie_Mormon
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by sadie_Mormon »

Taking into consideration she is a member of the church which means she's a Christian I see much reproof justified. If the church does not instruct her they are then contradicting what the church says they believe. In no way are any of us perfect, but if our church leadership does not guide us in the path that our L_rd Jesus Christ would expect us to live then they have failed us miserably. With that said no one here knows if any action has been taken to address the immodesty of her dress. We can only pray that she will see her error and return to Christ.

"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness." 2 Timothy 3:16 KJV

"Whoso loveth instruction loveth knowledge: but he that hateth reproof is brutish." Proverbs 12:1 KJV

"And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them." Ephesians 5:11 KJV

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gruden2.0
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

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Thinking back, this (belatedly) reminds of years ago when I was dating a young woman who went to BYU. One Sat. eve as we walked through the Wilkinson building on our way somewhere we stopped momentarily at a ballroom dancing contest/showcase going on. I remembering marveling at the dresses the women wore - they revealed a lot and there was no way they could possibly wear garments showing what they were showing. I couldn't believe outfits like that would fly at BYU. She told me they were considered a uniform, and thus they were legal with the honor code.

So, whatever you saw the girl wearing on TV, chances are there are women at BYU wearing something very similar and doing the same thing!

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sadie_Mormon
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by sadie_Mormon »

gruden2.0 wrote:She told me they were considered a uniform, and thus they were legal with the honor code.

So basically the church/school tweaks the Bible as they see necessary. I think the scriptures are very clear on Christ's view on modesty. I was watching some program on BYU once and the dancing at the school came up. I was completely shocked at how revealing their clothes were considering they attend a LDS church institution. What do they get an exemption stamp? There are plenty of dresses that meet modesty requirements.

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sbsion
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

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same could be said of Harry Reid, Mitt Romney? etc......maybe even all of us? :(

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Henmasher
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by Henmasher »

mingano the blowback you are receiving is not because what she did was right it is because of how you came accross.

The lord has plainly taught to judge righteouslly and I am sure the Lord sides with Mingano on this one. What she did was wrong but we still love her and would prefer to see talent dressed modeslty. Nothing should come before virtue and modesty is a part of virtue.

At the end of the day she acted innapropriately, dressed innapropriately, and is not in line with the lords standard for us, to hell with Church standards the lords are higher than that! The church membership is more worried about being accepted right now.

I am surprised at the acceptance of what she wore considering it is an expression of what is inward and clearly not appropriate :-?

Thanks for the pics sadie. I would let my daughter wear that.

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sadie_Mormon
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by sadie_Mormon »

Henmasher wrote:mingano the blowback you are receiving is not because what she did was right it is because of how you came accross.

The lord has plainly taught to judge righteouslly and I am sure the Lord sides with Mingano on this one. What she did was wrong but we still love her and would prefer to see talent dressed modeslty. Nothing should come before virtue and modesty is a part of virtue.

At the end of the day she acted innapropriately, dressed innapropriately, and is not in line with the lords standard for us, to hell with Church standards the lords are higher than that! The church membership is more worried about being accepted right now.

I am surprised at the acceptance of what she wore considering it is an expression of what is inward and clearly not appropriate :-?
AMEN!!


Thanks for the pics sadie. I would let my daughter wear that.
I personally think these dresses are immodest considering you couldn't pull off wearing your garments with it. Plus your shoulders, forearms, and thighs are exposed. However there are MUCH worse attire worn today then in those pictures. Those pictures are very tame compared to stuff I see daily.

imperfectionst
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by imperfectionst »

mingano wrote:Warning - very slutty dress.

http://realitytv.about.com/od/soyouthin ... TYCD-9.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This is an 18 year old Mormon from American Fork. She is currently one of the finalists on the show So You Think You Can Dance. Does anybody else think she is an exceptionally poor representative of the church with her seeming obsession with dressing like this? Shouldn't her bishop have some words about this? Or is everything good because she's on national TV?
Hoochie mamma. She definitely needs a word with my bishop.

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Jeremy
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by Jeremy »

4 They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.
5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?
6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.
7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.
10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.
I am certainly guilty of judging others...nevertheless, I should not be so quick to cast a stone...lest I shall find 100's more headed my direction.

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durangout
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by durangout »

Wow, she's stunning.

btw why do you care so much about what someone else does? What is your point in starting this thread?

Calling this girl out b/c of her performance outfit (I really don't think this is everyday wear for her), reminds me a little of a situation that I had run into in the past. There was this guy who always talked about the evils of porn. No matter what the discussion subject was during priesthood, it always came back to porn somehow for this guy. After a time, it because obvious to me that this guy was the one with the porn problem not the people listening to him. The phrase "me thinks he doth protest too much" came to mind.

Anywho...me thinks you protest too much about this girl's attaire--maybe secretly you REALLY, REALLY LIKE what's she's wearing and can't admit it? :D
Last edited by durangout on September 4th, 2012, 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mgsbigdog
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by mgsbigdog »

Where's the outrage over lds young women playing volleyball? Have you seen those shorts? What about lds male wrestling? You can't put garments on with those wrestling uniforms. They should really be excommunicated! And those evil football players wearing "tight or revealing" spandex football pants! And can you believe those young men in stake basketball games that wear tank tops! They are obviously not worthy of their priesthood and there is no way they can serve missions with the new raised bar!

Bottom line guys. Knock it off you sound like my whining two year old.

mingano
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by mingano »

JulesGP wrote:Mingano I'm truly trying to understand the ultimate point you want to make. Is it that we live in Babylon and members are regularly compromising their standards? We know that, it's very sad - and it happens in many forms, not just modesty. But maybe I would not feel so bothered by this thread if we were talking about the CONCEPT of the lack of modesty in the church - which is definitely a problem, rather than pointing out specific young girls with their names and personal details, and attaching the word "slutty" to them. :-s
The point is that when somebody is specifically going out of her way to present an image that does not represent us well, when she is called "sexy mormon" and her own mother is calling her the "hot tamale" we can either speak out and let the world know that we are not like that or we can remain silent and allow people to form incorrect beliefs about us. Are we to be a peculiar people or not? Is our reputation to be one of "wow, those Mormons sure can churn out the hotties and man can they show lots of skin!" or should we be known for something else?

When some criminal makes the news and happens to be a member (or even a former member) the cry goes out swift and strong that we distance ourselves from anybody who does not represent our values and is acting in contract to the gospel. Anybody who does wrong in a very visible format is denounced and portrayed as somebody who is not a true Mormon (and nobody ever mentions throwing stones). But when it comes to modesty, suddenly anybody who points out the emperor's new clothes (just a single square foot or two of fabric away from matching that description) is chastised and told to simply ignore it, nobody's business, harmless and even necessary, standards of modesty shouldn't even be discussed because there is so much hard work and talent there, and look at everybody else who is breaking the standards so it must be ok...

That is my point.

mingano
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by mingano »

durangout wrote:Anywho...me thinks you protest too much about this girl's attaire--maybe secretly you REALLY, REALLY LIKE what's she's wearing and can't admit it? :D
Actually, I'm repulsed by it. I'm probably too harsh but I find that donning such attire demonstrates what I consider to be major character flaws. Maybe in another thread if anybody really cares (and let's face it, we both know that nobody does) we can describe the outfits that LDS find most attractive. I'm sure that LDS concepts of attractive fashion is significantly different than the rest of the world, but again, I doubt anybody cares enough to start a thread on it.

mingano
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by mingano »

gruden2.0 wrote:Show a little charity to others and you'll get shown some in return.
Nah, that never works.

mingano
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by mingano »

Jeremy wrote:I am certainly guilty of judging others...nevertheless, I should not be so quick to cast a stone...lest I shall find 100's more headed my direction.
You don't find any difference between casting stones (ie: executing somebody) or judging somebody as fallen forever and expressing an objection to a specific style of dress?

ATL Wake
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by ATL Wake »

mingano wrote: Does anybody else think she is an exceptionally poor representative of the church with her seeming obsession with dressing like this?
Not sure. Never met her. I have no idea if she's kind or nice to people. I don't know if she is humble or serves other people. Hard to tell all this from the link you posted.

Since the inner vessel is what God concerns himself more with, I dont really care about the outer vessel.

It's a dance costume. Did you freak out during the Olympics with swimming suits and track shorts, and sports bras being worn?
mingano wrote: Shouldn't her bishop have some words about this?
What possible reason would the bishop have to talk with her about this? Why would he want to lose his priesthood by exerting authority over her? (See D&C 121)
mingano wrote: Or is everything good because she's on national TV?
TV has nothing to do with this. Dancers wear costumes like this in every dance theater in ever studio in every city in the country.

keeprunning
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by keeprunning »

ATL Wake wrote:
mingano wrote: Does anybody else think she is an exceptionally poor representative of the church with her seeming obsession with dressing like this?
Not sure. Never met her. I have no idea if she's kind or nice to people. I don't know if she is humble or serves other people. Hard to tell all this from the link you posted.

Since the inner vessel is what God concerns himself more with, I dont really care about the outer vessel.

It's a dance costume. Did you freak out during the Olympics with swimming suits and track shorts, and sports bras being worn?
mingano wrote: Shouldn't her bishop have some words about this?
What possible reason would the bishop have to talk with her about this? Why would he want to lose his priesthood by exerting authority over her? (See D&C 121)
mingano wrote: Or is everything good because she's on national TV?
TV has nothing to do with this. Dancers wear costumes like this in every dance theater in ever studio in every city in the country.
I agree! Here is a good example of man looking on the outward appearance again. Who knows but the Lord how much love she has in her heart for Him?

KOMYU
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by KOMYU »

"Youth! Young men and young women facing their eternal destiny. What can we do to make them happy? What can we say and do to make them worthy citizens of our republic, and faithful members of the Church of Jesus Christ? That is the question. The world is passing through troublous times. Young people of today think of nothing but themselves. They have no reverence for parents or old age. They talk as if they alone know everything. As for girls, they are forward, immodest, and unwomanly in speech, behavior, and dress. That is a terrific arraignment when we think of these young men and young women present in this group today and that they are representing many other hundreds and thousands of young people.

Possibly some of you will say or will think that it is a pretty severe arraignment of our young people today. Others of you will consider it a real denunciation. Well, all of you will be surprised when I tell you that what I have just read was written about young people who lived six hundred and seventy-two years ago. That makes you feel better, does it? It was written in the year 1274 after Christ. I cited it merely to bring to our attention that we are prone to think that our own young folks are worse than anybody else and that they are heading for perdition as they have never been before." -david o McKay

This post reminds me of another story about president McKay. I believe it was a parade of some sort going on where some of the women in the parade were wearing what some would consider in appropriate clothing. A woman onlooker turned to president McKay commenting on how inappropriate the dress was by these women and president McKay turned and said something to the effect of I didn't see anything that wasn't lovely and virtuous.

I agree with durangout on this in that I thought she looked stunning. Just my perspective.....I hope I am not judging her falsely. Women are the most beautiful creations God has made. There is a line between porn and just outright beauty and maybe just maybe that line is within us rather than the "perpetrator". Love begets love, truth begets truth etc..... The virtues always beget each other and cleaveth to their own. So for someone to say that never works is contradicting the scriptures and the spirit of God. My thoughts....

mingano
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by mingano »

Romans 14:13 applies.

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Henmasher
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by Henmasher »

keeprunning wrote:
ATL Wake wrote:
mingano wrote: Does anybody else think she is an exceptionally poor representative of the church with her seeming obsession with dressing like this?
Not sure. Never met her. I have no idea if she's kind or nice to people. I don't know if she is humble or serves other people. Hard to tell all this from the link you posted.

Since the inner vessel is what God concerns himself more with, I dont really care about the outer vessel.

It's a dance costume. Did you freak out during the Olympics with swimming suits and track shorts, and sports bras being worn?
mingano wrote: Shouldn't her bishop have some words about this?
What possible reason would the bishop have to talk with her about this? Why would he want to lose his priesthood by exerting authority over her? (See D&C 121)
mingano wrote: Or is everything good because she's on national TV?
TV has nothing to do with this. Dancers wear costumes like this in every dance theater in ever studio in every city in the country.
I agree! Here is a good example of man looking on the outward appearance again. Who knows but the Lord how much love she has in her heart for Him?
So was mingano correct in saying she acted wrong. The focus has been solely on the clothing and not the performance with reaked of sexualization and lustful motives. There is a difference between swimmers competing in a race and lust charged dancing with minimal clothing. Good grief

mingano
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Re: Egregiously violating church standards on national TV

Post by mingano »

And don't forget how Nigel was openly lusting after her body, waxing on and on about how hot and sexy she was. (And then, when the voters continually asked for her to leave he and the other judges stepped in to save her.)

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