The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

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ithink
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by ithink »

Amonhi wrote:
ithink wrote: Amonhi, how am I to believe you are some sort of emissary if you can't even post your real name?
Alma 32,

Peace,
Amonhi
So you're saying you're Alma? Was Alma a moniker too?

And which version of that book and chapter: the original unabridged, or the current modified version?

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ithink
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by ithink »

Amonhi wrote:
freedomforall wrote:
Thomas wrote:The merits of an idea can be discussed without knowing the merits of the man presenting them.

Ideas stand or fall upon their own merits not upon the merits of the presenter.
That way the presenter doesn't have to take responsibility for any false or incorrect info being articulated. Thus a new presenter ought to be able to counter incorrect info to counterbalance that which is wrong...so people can weigh the presented material and come away with a choice instead of one's opinion presented as fact, which in and of itself leaves them less opportunity to implant true doctrine into their mind. Then we have the possibility of someone presenting their own interpretation of scripture thus deceiving the reader, and then truth either becomes obscure or goes out the window.
But if we get a lot of people believing false info with no one being able to counter it with truth, then we have a huge mess. Truth and error begin to do battle and chaos ensues. So then we're back on square one. #:-S
The name Amonhi has only the credibility which has been earned. It does not rely on unearned position or title to establish credibility. If Amonhi is going to have any power or influence in anyone's life, it will be through the principles of priesthood and not through a position in the priesthood. It will be through persuasion and pure intelligence, patience and long suffering while some criticize and attack me, etc. And love unfeigned. I expect the same from all men and woman regardless of their name, title or position in the priesthood.

Peace,
Amonhi
Interesting logic Thomas, Freedom, and Amonhi. But is that what the Church teaches?

The Church teaches that if Joseph Smith was a prophet (ie. the man), then everything else he gave us is true.
"Our entire case as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints rests on the validity of this glorious First Vision. ... Nothing on which we base our doctrine, nothing we teach, nothing we live by is of greater importance than this initial declaration. I submit that if Joseph Smith talked with God the Father and His Beloved Son, then all else of which he spoke is true. This is the hinge on which turns the gate that leads to the path of salvation and eternal life."
- Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley, Ensign Mag., Nov. 1998, pp.70-71
That seem diametrically opposed to what you are saying here.

I'm not comfortable with giving a man a carte blanche, either in name or in what he does.

The Church teaches trust Joseph the man.

You seem to be teaching the exact opposite.

Amonhi
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Amonhi »

ithink wrote:
Jeremy wrote:
ithink wrote:Hence my request for Amonhi's name.
Yeah, I still don't get it. #-o [slow]
I'm saying that Amonhi is asking people to draw their attention to things that Christ explicitly warned us against, and to do this anonymously detracts from his credibility, from my point of view.
Sorry for the confusion ithink, I an not saying "lo here is christ or lower there is Christ" in an attempt to get others to go to some church. I understand that to mean that if people say "the leaders of our church talk to Christ, so you should follow them." Using it as a persuasion tactic. If used to say you can too, then I take no issue, except that it would recommend against using someone else's experience in that way, just a recommendation though.

The kingdom of God is within you and that is where you will find Christ, not here or there as in a physical place or a church, but inside you.

Also, you speak well when you talked of visiting the sick and the poor and giving of your substance, etc. That is pure religion. The change of heart will lead to these things naturally. But planning time to do them is important even more today as our lives become busier.

While saying that, I also feel it is important to come unto Christ in a very literal sense.

Peace,
Amonhu

Amonhi
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Amonhi »

ithink wrote:
Amonhi wrote:
ithink wrote: Amonhi, how am I to believe you are some sort of emissary if you can't even post your real name?
Alma 32,

Peace,
Amonhi
So you're saying you're Alma? Was Alma a moniker too?

And which version of that book and chapter: the original unabridged, or the current modified version?
Apologies for not being clear. Alma in Alma 32 did not expect the people to believe him because of his name or position etc. He recommended that we plant the seed and see if it grows. My recommendation is the same. Apply Alma 32, the whole chapter to my words just as Alma recommends.

I promised not to reveal any information about myself to the public as a result of a particular dead threat I received many years ago. For my families sake, I will not bend on this point.

Peace,
Amonhi

Cookies
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Cookies »

Amonhi, I know you are busy but since you are the only one who can answer this question, I'm going to ask it again.

You said
Anyone who has had the mighty change of heart is living according to love and therefore has fulfilled the law
Then you said
You are removed from the lower law when you get your C&E the promise.
The following is how I am reading it, am I understanding what you said correctly?
"You are no longer under the law when you have the mighty change of heart."
"you are no longer under the law when you receive your C&E."

:-?

Amonhi
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Amonhi »

Cookies wrote:Amonhi, I know you are busy but since you are the only one who can answer this question, I'm going to ask it again.

You said
Anyone who has had the mighty change of heart is living according to love and therefore has fulfilled the law
Then you said
You are removed from the lower law when you get your C&E the promise.
The following is how I am reading it, am I understanding what you said correctly?
"You are no longer under the law when you have the mighty change of heart."
"you are no longer under the law when you receive your C&E."

:-?
I saw this before and didn't have time to answer it. Now I am at the park and watching sleeping babies. I was responding via my phone, but the last two posts I wanted to respond via my laptop, so I pulled it out and hopefully I can respond before the babies wake up.. hehehe, here's trying.

Thank you for calling me on this!

If you are a servant, unfortunately, you should probably just obey the law because you don't have the spirit or love and no little to nothing about the kingdom of heaven and the principles by which it runs to use any degree of intelligence or principle. (Sorry that's a bit ruff for you who are servants, but I think you would feel most comfortable obeying the law without question anyway, that's why you are servants...)

If you are a son, then you are still under the law as a whole until it is fulfilled as a whole in your life. But your are learning the reasons for the law with the intent to understand true principles. So, if you have the mighty change of heart, and you have not yet fulfilled the law, (received your C&E), then follow Jesus's example and "endure to the end" or in other endure your time under the law until the law is fulfilled when you receive your C&E made sure and your probation has ended. The thing to realize is that love fulfills the law. So if you are stuck in a dilemma that requires you to choose between acting in love or acting in the law, choose love. The spirit also fulfills the law, so if the spirit tells you to act contrary to the law, go with the spirit. I know people whose lives were literally saved by following he spirit against the law.

Then, after you receive your C&E don't throw out the lessons learned while under the law and get drunk and have sex because your going to be exalted anyway. Realize that you need to do what is right because it is right and not because the law said it is right or because you fear the punishment. Do good for goods sake and know that at times doing good means going against the law as it previously was taught. Feel free to verify with God that the action you are about to take is right even when it contradicts the law. You still learn and grow at this point, you are just stepping up your game and learning to be more like God. Learning to live by the morals you learned under the law rather than by the law itself. This is were you have learned correct principles and are now governing yourself by those correct principles.

Telling people what to do and how to live like the law does, has nothing to do with teaching correct principles and letting people govern themselves. The law is about obedience and punishment for lack of obedience. The goal is to govern yourself under the self application of correct principles or learning to apply principles correctly to determine the right coarse of action based on the circumstances.

Did that answer your question from my point of view?

I LOVE Cookies! ;)
Amonhi

Cookies
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Cookies »

Did that answer your question from my point of view?

I LOVE Cookies! ;)
Amonhi
Yes, and EVERYBODY loves Cookies! ;)

Amonhi, I want you to know that I recognize the light that guides you! I appreciate that you don't hide it under a bushel.
The words that you have shared on this forum, especially in this thread, have merited my deepest and sincerest "Thank you!!!" :ymhug:

freedomforall
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by freedomforall »

Amonhi wrote:
Thomas wrote:The merits of an idea can be discussed without knowing the merits of the man presenting them.
An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"[1]), short for argumentum ad hominem, is a general category of fallacies in which a claim or argument is rejected on the basis of some irrelevant fact about the author of or the person presenting the claim or argument.[2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem



Ideas stand or fall upon their own merits not upon the merits of the presenter.
The name Amonhi has only the credibility which has been earned. It does not rely on unearned position or title to establish credibility. If Amonhi is going to have any power or influence in anyone's life, it will be through the principles of priesthood and not through a position in the priesthood. It will be through persuasion and pure intelligence, patience and long suffering while some criticize and attack me, etc. And love unfeigned. I expect the same from all men and woman regardless of their name, title or position in the priesthood.

Peace,
Amonhi
never mind.
Last edited by freedomforall on July 17th, 2014, 4:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ithink
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by ithink »

Amonhi wrote: Sorry for the confusion ithink, I an not saying "lo here is christ or lower there is Christ" in an attempt to get others to go to some church. I understand that to mean that if people say "the leaders of our church talk to Christ, so you should follow them." Using it as a persuasion tactic. If used to say you can too, then I take no issue, except that it would recommend against using someone else's experience in that way, just a recommendation though.

The kingdom of God is within you and that is where you will find Christ, not here or there as in a physical place or a church, but inside you.

Also, you speak well when you talked of visiting the sick and the poor and giving of your substance, etc. That is pure religion. The change of heart will lead to these things naturally. But planning time to do them is important even more today as our lives become busier.

While saying that, I also feel it is important to come unto Christ in a very literal sense.

Peace,
Amonhu
OK, nice response. I appreciate that. But what you seem to have is a recipe for Christ, "lo here". Is it not?

What I'm saying also is you have no way of verifying who it is that is meeting with you. You just don't, do you?

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ithink
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by ithink »

Amonhi wrote:Apologies for not being clear. Alma in Alma 32 did not expect the people to believe him because of his name or position etc. He recommended that we plant the seed and see if it grows. My recommendation is the same. Apply Alma 32, the whole chapter to my words just as Alma recommends.

I promised not to reveal any information about myself to the public as a result of a particular dead threat I received many years ago. For my families sake, I will not bend on this point.

Peace,
Amonhi
Fair enough. Well I've been threatened as well. So we share a common denominator there. But I still went public anyway. The world isn't the same place it was even 5 years ago, so I suppose you might change your mind in the future.

Amonhi
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Amonhi »

ithink wrote:
Amonhi wrote: Sorry for the confusion ithink, I an not saying "lo here is christ or lower there is Christ" in an attempt to get others to go to some church. I understand that to mean that if people say "the leaders of our church talk to Christ, so you should follow them." Using it as a persuasion tactic. If used to say you can too, then I take no issue, except that it would recommend against using someone else's experience in that way, just a recommendation though.

The kingdom of God is within you and that is where you will find Christ, not here or there as in a physical place or a church, but inside you.

Also, you speak well when you talked of visiting the sick and the poor and giving of your substance, etc. That is pure religion. The change of heart will lead to these things naturally. But planning time to do them is important even more today as our lives become busier.

While saying that, I also feel it is important to come unto Christ in a very literal sense.

Peace,
Amonhi
OK, nice response. I appreciate that. But what you seem to have is a recipe for Christ, "lo here". Is it not?
Not unless "here" is inside of you for you, and inside of me for me, and inside of x for x but inside of y for y....
What I'm saying also is you have no way of verifying who it is that is meeting with you. You just don't, do you?
Satan is not capable of expressing the love that I have felt from Christ. It alone, even if you didn't have the witness from the Holy Ghost is enough to tell the difference. Light has nothing to do with it. If you have the Holy Ghost enough to tell if a book is true or not, then you can't miss the witness that this is Christ you are talking to. Remember Simeon and Anna recognized him as a baby by the Holy Ghost. Also we are told that the spirit witnesses of the father and the son. If you couldn't recognize God by the love, God is love, then you couldn't miss the witness of the spirit.

Peace,
Amonhi

Amonhi
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Amonhi »

I'm on my cell phone, so if I neglect to miss spell my usual words, please blame it on auto correct. ;)
ithink wrote:
Amonhi wrote:Apologies for not being clear. Alma in Alma 32 did not expect the people to believe him because of his name or position etc. He recommended that we plant the seed and see if it grows. My recommendation is the same. Apply Alma 32, the whole chapter to my words just as Alma recommends.

I promised not to reveal any information about myself to the public as a result of a particular dead threat I received many years ago. For my families sake, I will not bend on this point.

Peace,
Amonhi
Fair enough. Well I've been threatened as well. So we share a common denominator there. But I still went public anyway. The world isn't the same place it was even 5 years ago, so I suppose you might change your mind in the future.
I am sorry we have that in common. It is a shame. I was threatened by a random protestant preacher I called on the phone to discuss something I had just learned from Christ. Christ said that they, most religious people would react that way and I said, "No way, not in this day and age!" And he said try and see, but be anonymous. .. surprise... He was right...

I appreciate your boldness in calling me to be accountable for lacking the weightier things...

Peace and love,
Amonhi

Amonhi
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Amonhi »

ithink wrote:Interesting logic Thomas, Freedom, and Amonhi. But is that what the Church teaches?

The Church teaches that if Joseph Smith was a prophet (ie. the man), then everything else he gave us is true.
A prophet is not always correct and does not always teach truth. Being a man, even Joseph was fallible.
"Our entire case as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints rests on the validity of this glorious First Vision. ... Nothing on which we base our doctrine, nothing we teach, nothing we live by is of greater importance than this initial declaration. I submit that if Joseph Smith talked with God the Father and His Beloved Son, then all else of which he spoke is true. This is the hinge on which turns the gate that leads to the path of salvation and eternal life."
- Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley, Ensign Mag., Nov. 1998, pp.70-71
This is really poor logic. having knowledge or experience in one area does not meant that you instantly know all things. I would not build my foundation on a man, even Joseph Smith. To do so would inevitably lead to a fall when you begin to see that many undesirable things Joseph did like order the destruction of the printing press that was about to print a story regarding his polygamist relations including the one to his 16 year old wife. Not everything King David did was true or right and he was a prophet and the chosen of the lord.
That seem diametrically opposed to what you are saying here.
It might be. We cannot borrow the oil from Joseph to light our own lamps and hope to make it to the marriage. We can't hope to light our own way by the light of others. We must have our own light to guide us. As well, if Joseph was a true prophet, it doesn't mean that the church today is true any more than because Peter was a true prophet the Catholic Church is true. The logic continues to fail on sooo many levels.
I'm not comfortable with giving a man a carte blanche, either in name or in what he does.

Isn't that essentially what the Hinckley quote above does for Joseph Smith? Because he spoke with God and Jesus Christ everything else he spoke was true? I have spoken with God and Jesus Christ and I know that that logic is flawed. Even Joseph wouldn't have agreed with that.
The Church teaches trust Joseph the man.

You seem to be teaching the exact opposite.
If the church teaches that we should trust everything Joseph said without investigating it, then yes I disagree. I do not teach the exact opposite which is to not trust anything he says without investigating it. I teach that we are to consider and investigate everything that presents itself to our view and to examine it and pray about it and learn from the Holy Ghost what is true and what is not.

Peace,
Amonhi

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ithink
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by ithink »

Amonhi wrote:
ithink wrote:Interesting logic Thomas, Freedom, and Amonhi. But is that what the Church teaches?

The Church teaches that if Joseph Smith was a prophet (ie. the man), then everything else he gave us is true.
A prophet is not always correct and does not always teach truth. Being a man, even Joseph was fallible.
"Our entire case as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints rests on the validity of this glorious First Vision. ... Nothing on which we base our doctrine, nothing we teach, nothing we live by is of greater importance than this initial declaration. I submit that if Joseph Smith talked with God the Father and His Beloved Son, then all else of which he spoke is true. This is the hinge on which turns the gate that leads to the path of salvation and eternal life."
- Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley, Ensign Mag., Nov. 1998, pp.70-71
This is really poor logic. having knowledge or experience in one area does not meant that you instantly know all things. I would not build my foundation on a man, even Joseph Smith. To do so would inevitably lead to a fall when you begin to see that many undesirable things Joseph did like order the destruction of the printing press that was about to print a story regarding his polygamist relations including the one to his 16 year old wife. Not everything King David did was true or right and he was a prophet and the chosen of the lord.
That seem diametrically opposed to what you are saying here.
It might be. We cannot borrow the oil from Joseph to light our own lamps and hope to make it to the marriage. We can't hope to light our own way by the light of others. We must have our own light to guide us. As well, if Joseph was a true prophet, it doesn't mean that the church today is true any more than because Peter was a true prophet the Catholic Church is true. The logic continues to fail on sooo many levels.
I'm not comfortable with giving a man a carte blanche, either in name or in what he does.

Isn't that essentially what the Hinckley quote above does for Joseph Smith? Because he spoke with God and Jesus Christ everything else he spoke was true? I have spoken with God and Jesus Christ and I know that that logic is flawed. Even Joseph wouldn't have agreed with that.
The Church teaches trust Joseph the man.

You seem to be teaching the exact opposite.
If the church teaches that we should trust everything Joseph said without investigating it, then yes I disagree. I do not teach the exact opposite which is to not trust anything he says without investigating it. I teach that we are to consider and investigate everything that presents itself to our view and to examine it and pray about it and learn from the Holy Ghost what is true and what is not.

Peace,
Amonhi
We're not so far apart on these points. Thanks for taking the time to respond to me, I appreciate your point of view and your candor.

deep water
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by deep water »

bump,

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konigking
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by konigking »

I will offer my two cents. The idea is intriguing, that there is a quicky way to have your calling and election made sure. But the tone of the original post and the subsequent comments by the poster made the whole notion suspect to me. But the greater evidence against the proposition were the distasteful thoughts and feelings I had the night that I read that post. It was disturbing. I awoke in the middle of the night. And I don't think my spirituality is suffering greatly. So I think this is bad stuff.

zionminded
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by zionminded »

konigking wrote:I will offer my two cents. The idea is intriguing, that there is a quicky way to have your calling and election made sure. But the tone of the original post and the subsequent comments by the poster made the whole notion suspect to me. But the greater evidence against the proposition were the distasteful thoughts and feelings I had the night that I read that post. It was disturbing. I awoke in the middle of the night. And I don't think my spirituality is suffering greatly. So I think this is bad stuff.
Most members of the church will try to "obey" there way into the CK. The truth is obedience is only one factor. Seeking the Lord personally and asking for further light and knowledge is required. Been to the temple lately? Nowhere in the endowment does it say to sit and just watch, you actually must participate at the veil to enter his presence by conversing with the Lord. This process doesn't happen by simply attending church and being obedient. Detractors and others will "debate" the message or the messenger for many reasons here. Take it to the Lord, then work out your own salvation.

Amonhi
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Amonhi »

konigking wrote:I will offer my two cents. The idea is intriguing, that there is a quicky way to have your calling and election made sure. But the tone of the original post and the subsequent comments by the poster made the whole notion suspect to me. But the greater evidence against the proposition were the distasteful thoughts and feelings I had the night that I read that post. It was disturbing. I awoke in the middle of the night. And I don't think my spirituality is suffering greatly. So I think this is bad stuff.
At present, over the last 3 years from the time I made the initial post, over 100 people have contacted me and thanked me for the information provided in this thread which has helped them to receive their Call and Election made sure. A good number of them also reported at the time that they had also received the second comforter. I have also been told by some of these people that they have helped other friends and family to receive the same. (I am not counting the second generation C&R'rs as part of the 100+ that thanked me for the information in this thread.)

As to my current knowledge, none of them have become Sons of Perdition.

Results speaks louder than two cents. ;)

Peace,
Amonhi

Stourme
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Stourme »

zionminded wrote:
konigking wrote:I will offer my two cents. The idea is intriguing, that there is a quicky way to have your calling and election made sure. But the tone of the original post and the subsequent comments by the poster made the whole notion suspect to me. But the greater evidence against the proposition were the distasteful thoughts and feelings I had the night that I read that post. It was disturbing. I awoke in the middle of the night. And I don't think my spirituality is suffering greatly. So I think this is bad stuff.
Most members of the church will try to "obey" there way into the CK. The truth is obedience is only one factor. Seeking the Lord personally and asking for further light and knowledge is required. Been to the temple lately? Nowhere in the endowment does it say to sit and just watch, you actually must participate at the veil to enter his presence by conversing with the Lord. This process doesn't happen by simply attending church and being obedient. Detractors and others will "debate" the message or the messenger for many reasons here. Take it to the Lord, then work out your own salvation.
An end run + cart before the horse will not get you the salvation you seek.

There are two factors that must be met before the Lord will even consider you, Obedience is paramount. You can't come to the Lord any way possible without first being obedient to His commandments. That is His declaration. The second is attitude. We have to be developing Christ like attributes as well. No one has come before the Lord that wasn't humble first.
zionminded wrote:This process doesn't happen by simply attending church and being obedient.
Every ex-member that gets on the internet to spout their personal disapproval of the Church all have something in common; they all rationalize, in varying degrees, how it's not important to be obedient to the laws taught in the Church.

Anyone that down plays obedience to the laws of the gospel are either apostate or on the road to apostasy.

How many times does the Lord repeat the phrase, "keep my commandments"? Virtually every time he speaks. Obedience, obedience,obedience.

D&C 130
20 There is a law, irrevocably decreed in heaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all blessings are predicated—
21 And when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated.


There is no way around this principle ever. Including the calling and election.

zionminded
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by zionminded »

Stourme, I think you missed my point. Clearly obedience is important, in fact its vital, however, obedience alone isn't enough.

Thomas
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Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Thomas »

Stourme wrote:
zionminded wrote:
konigking wrote:I will offer my two cents. The idea is intriguing, that there is a quicky way to have your calling and election made sure. But the tone of the original post and the subsequent comments by the poster made the whole notion suspect to me. But the greater evidence against the proposition were the distasteful thoughts and feelings I had the night that I read that post. It was disturbing. I awoke in the middle of the night. And I don't think my spirituality is suffering greatly. So I think this is bad stuff.
Most members of the church will try to "obey" there way into the CK. The truth is obedience is only one factor. Seeking the Lord personally and asking for further light and knowledge is required. Been to the temple lately? Nowhere in the endowment does it say to sit and just watch, you actually must participate at the veil to enter his presence by conversing with the Lord. This process doesn't happen by simply attending church and being obedient. Detractors and others will "debate" the message or the messenger for many reasons here. Take it to the Lord, then work out your own salvation.
An end run + cart before the horse will not get you the salvation you seek.

There are two factors that must be met before the Lord will even consider you, Obedience is paramount. You can't come to the Lord any way possible without first being obedient to His commandments. That is His declaration. The second is attitude. We have to be developing Christ like attributes as well. No one has come before the Lord that wasn't humble first.
zionminded wrote:This process doesn't happen by simply attending church and being obedient.
Every ex-member that gets on the internet to spout their personal disapproval of the Church all have something in common; they all rationalize, in varying degrees, how it's not important to be obedient to the laws taught in the Church.

Anyone that down plays obedience to the laws of the gospel are either apostate or on the road to apostasy.

How many times does the Lord repeat the phrase, "keep my commandments"? Virtually every time he speaks. Obedience, obedience,obedience.

D&C 130
20 There is a law, irrevocably decreed in heaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all blessings are predicated—
21 And when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated.


There is no way around this principle ever. Including the calling and election.
Why do you fight against the principles taught by Joseph Smith?

You understanding might be different than Amonhi's but you can leave him out of it and find the same advice from Joseph.
D&C 131: 5 (May 17th, 1843.) The more sure word of prophecy means a man’s knowing that he is sealed up unto eternal life, by revelation and the spirit of prophecy, through the power of the Holy Priesthood.

6 It is impossible for a man to be saved in ignorance.
You advise people to go through life in ignorance of their status before God, when God has clearly stated that you cannot be saved in that condition.

Perhaps you should consider your words, whether you are leading people to salvation or damnation. Consider what that means for you.
Section Six 1843-44, p.366 TPJS

I am going on in my progress for eternal life. It is not only necessary that you should be baptized for your dead, but you will have to go through all the ordinances for them, the same as you have gone through to save yourselves. There will be 144,000 saviors on Mount Zion, and with them an innumerable host that no man can number. Oh! I beseech you to go forward, go forward and make your calling and your election sure; and if any man preach any other Gospel than that which I have preached, he shall be cursed; and some of you who now hear me shall see it, and know that I testify the truth concerning them.

Stourme
captain of 100
Posts: 324

Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Stourme »

Amonhi wrote:
konigking wrote:I will offer my two cents. The idea is intriguing, that there is a quicky way to have your calling and election made sure. But the tone of the original post and the subsequent comments by the poster made the whole notion suspect to me. But the greater evidence against the proposition were the distasteful thoughts and feelings I had the night that I read that post. It was disturbing. I awoke in the middle of the night. And I don't think my spirituality is suffering greatly. So I think this is bad stuff.
At present, over the last 3 years from the time I made the initial post, over 100 people have contacted me and thanked me for the information provided in this thread which has helped them to receive their Call and Election made sure. A good number of them also reported at the time that they had also received the second comforter. I have also been told by some of these people that they have helped other friends and family to receive the same. (I am not counting the second generation C&R'rs as part of the 100+ that thanked me for the information in this thread.)

As to my current knowledge, none of them have become Sons of Perdition.

Results speaks louder than two cents. ;)

Peace,
Amonhi
Amonhi wrote:At present, over the last 3 years from the time I made the initial post, over 100 people have contacted me
I am deeply saddened by you and the people you have helped to deceive.

Jesus foretold what is going to happen to all of them.

Luke 13:
25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:


At the judgement people will try to enter the Lord's kingdom because they think they have been promised salvation.

26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.

But Lord, we have been in thy presence....

27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

The REAL Lord didn't even know you...you were deceived...and He casts you out just like He casts out the devil; depart! No argument, no explanation, no negotiation. Just go...

28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.

Weeping and gnashing of teeth because you thought you had salvation and exaltation but were deceived by the devil himself. And when that realization finally sinks in, you'll weep.

D&C 130
20 There is a law, irrevocably decreed in heaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all blessings are predicated—
21 And when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated.


There is no salvation or promise of salvation outside the laws and ordinances of the gospel and the priesthood as given to the Prophet Joseph Smith Jr. And contained in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints today. None.

There is no other priesthood, no end runs, no short cuts.

1. And anyone that claims to have some special message from God and is outside the proper channels and authority of the Church is an imposter. A deceiver. An anti-Christ. God is a God of perfect order.
2. Anyone that claims to have seen God but yet is not worthy to enter the Lord's Temple and stand in holy places, is a liar.

-Stourme

zionminded
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1438

Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by zionminded »

Stourme, there is a difference between somebody assurping stewardship, and somebody gifted with a powerful testimony to bring others to Christ. Truth comes from many sources.

Stourme
captain of 100
Posts: 324

Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Stourme »

Thomas wrote:Why do you fight against the twisting of and the mischaracterization of the principles taught by Joseph Smith?
There, fixed it.
Because at the last day I want to be found to have been valiant in the testimony of Jesus.
Thomas wrote:You understanding might be different than Amonhi's but...
Different? My understanding comes from quoting the prophets. My understanding comes from following the prophets. My advice to every living soul is to follow the prophet. My understanding won't lead me to hell.

Amonhi has been deceived. Amonhi is trying to deceive others. And if you continue to follow this false teacher, you're going to reap his reward.
D&C 131: 5 (May 17th, 1843.) The more sure word of prophecy means a man’s knowing that he is sealed up unto eternal life, by revelation and the spirit of prophecy, through the power of the Holy Priesthood.
"through the power of the Holy Priesthood" as given to Joseph Smith Jr. and through the appointed channels laid down by the Lord before the world was even created.

Amonhi has admitted that he is not part of those appointed channels.

D&C 132:
45 For I have conferred upon you the keys and power of the priesthood, wherein I restore all things, and make known unto you all things in due time.

46 And verily, verily, I say unto you, that whatsoever you seal on earth shall be sealed in heaven; and whatsoever you bind on earth, in my name and by my word, saith the Lord, it shall be eternally bound in the heavens; and whosesoever sins you remit on earth shall be remitted eternally in the heavens; and whosesoever sins you retain on earth shall be retained in heaven.


The Lord doesn't work outside this organization. Never. God has never claimed to send angels to ordain anyone outside this organization. If He did He would create competition in the gospel. The gospel would be divided and God would be divided.

D & C 42
11 Again I say unto you, that it shall not be given to any one to go forth to preach my gospel, or to build up my church, except he be ordained by some one who has authority,
and it is known to the church that he has authority and has been regularly ordained by the heads of the church.

Amonhi, by his own admission is NOT regularly ordained by the heads of the Church. Therefore, it is proper and correct to warn others that this man is, in the words of Joseph F. Smith, an imposter. Follow him and reap his reward at the judgement.
Thomas wrote:You advise people to go through life in ignorance of their status before God, when God has clearly stated that you cannot be saved in that condition.
If you want to know you're standing before God, go to your Bishop and ask for a priesthood blessing. Ask for a patriarchal blessing. Read it if you already have one. Take one step at a time.

Satan has literally billions of spirits on the other side that followed him. That do his bidding. There are at least several evil spirits for every single living soul on this earth at any given time. And they wonder this earth trying to snare who ever they can. And YES they do physically appear to people when the conditions are right.

People see an actual spirit from the other side and they marvel. Shock and awe. How awesome it is...but that spirit is not your buddy or your friend. It's not like Hollywood. He won't be snarling, threatening, wearing horns and look like a monster. He will come as an angel giving instructions and promises of glory. Even Moses had to discern who the devil was. The devil almost deceived Moses..... MOSES. #-o :-o

Look at these words of Jesus Christ!

Doctrine and Covenants 67:
13 Ye are not able to abide the presence of God now, neither the ministering of angels; wherefore, continue in patience until ye are perfected.


Jesus is talking to men who are going to receive their calling and election. But they aren't even able to receive ministering angels yet, much less Jesus Himself until they had reached a level of perfection.

But you think Amonhi has found some secret device to by pass all these rules?????!!!!

I. AM. NOT. A. FOOL.

-Stourme

User avatar
Franco
captain of 100
Posts: 321

Re: The Fastest Way to Make Your Calling and Election Sure

Post by Franco »

Stourme wrote:
Thomas wrote:Why do you fight against the twisting of and the mischaracterization of the principles taught by Joseph Smith?
There, fixed it.
Because at the last day I want to be found to have been valiant in the testimony of Jesus.
Thomas wrote:You understanding might be different than Amonhi's but...
Different? My understanding comes from quoting the prophets. My understanding comes from following the prophets. My advice to every living soul is to follow the prophet. My understanding won't lead me to hell.

Amonhi has been deceived. Amonhi is trying to deceive others. And if you continue to follow this false teacher, you're going to reap his reward.
D&C 131: 5 (May 17th, 1843.) The more sure word of prophecy means a man’s knowing that he is sealed up unto eternal life, by revelation and the spirit of prophecy, through the power of the Holy Priesthood.
"through the power of the Holy Priesthood" as given to Joseph Smith Jr. and through the appointed channels laid down by the Lord before the world was even created.

Amonhi has admitted that he is not part of those appointed channels.

D&C 132:
45 For I have conferred upon you the keys and power of the priesthood, wherein I restore all things, and make known unto you all things in due time.

46 And verily, verily, I say unto you, that whatsoever you seal on earth shall be sealed in heaven; and whatsoever you bind on earth, in my name and by my word, saith the Lord, it shall be eternally bound in the heavens; and whosesoever sins you remit on earth shall be remitted eternally in the heavens; and whosesoever sins you retain on earth shall be retained in heaven.


The Lord doesn't work outside this organization. Never. God has never claimed to send angels to ordain anyone outside this organization. If He did He would create competition in the gospel. The gospel would be divided and God would be divided.

D & C 42
11 Again I say unto you, that it shall not be given to any one to go forth to preach my gospel, or to build up my church, except he be ordained by some one who has authority,
and it is known to the church that he has authority and has been regularly ordained by the heads of the church.

Amonhi, by his own admission is NOT regularly ordained by the heads of the Church. Therefore, it is proper and correct to warn others that this man is, in the words of Joseph F. Smith, an imposter. Follow him and reap his reward at the judgement.
Thomas wrote:You advise people to go through life in ignorance of their status before God, when God has clearly stated that you cannot be saved in that condition.
If you want to know you're standing before God, go to your Bishop and ask for a priesthood blessing. Ask for a patriarchal blessing. Read it if you already have one. Take one step at a time.

Satan has literally billions of spirits on the other side that followed him. That do his bidding. There are at least several evil spirits for every single living soul on this earth at any given time. And they wonder this earth trying to snare who ever they can. And YES they do physically appear to people when the conditions are right.

People see an actual spirit from the other side and they marvel. Shock and awe. How awesome it is...but that spirit is not your buddy or your friend. It's not like Hollywood. He won't be snarling, threatening, wearing horns and look like a monster. He will come as an angel giving instructions and promises of glory. Even Moses had to discern who the devil was. The devil almost deceived Moses..... MOSES. #-o :-o

Look at these words of Jesus Christ!

Doctrine and Covenants 67:
13 Ye are not able to abide the presence of God now, neither the ministering of angels; wherefore, continue in patience until ye are perfected.


Jesus is talking to men who are going to receive their calling and election. But they aren't even able to receive ministering angels yet, much less Jesus Himself until they had reached a level of perfection.

But you think Amonhi has found some secret device to by pass all these rules?????!!!!

I. AM. NOT. A. FOOL.

-Stourme
I love reading these refutations to people like Amonhi and Thomas. Great job, Strourme.

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