Just to be clear, are you saying you disagree with elder Ballard when he says "individuals do not choose to have such (homosexual) attractions"?Sunain wrote: ↑June 21st, 2017, 9:26 pmThe church obviously believes strongly that homosexual influence plays a huge part in whither or not a person decides to have homosexual feelings. Parents teaching that it is acceptable is one of the main reasons it is so prevalent in society now. With the November 2015 policy, the church has made their position very clear that a parents lifestyle can affect their child's choices in life. It was VERY clear from the video of the 12 year old girl that there was definitely parental influence.butterfly wrote: ↑June 21st, 2017, 7:11 pmThe Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints believes that “the experience of same-sex attraction is a complex reality for many people. The attraction itself is not a sin, but acting on it is. Even though individuals do not choose to have such attractions, they do choose how to respond to them. (M. Russell Ballard, 2014).
https://www.lds.org/liahona/2015/09/the ... g=eng&_r=1
What does it mean if you cannot consciously choose something? Is it still a sin? We know that in order to sin, you must choose it of your own free will, otherwise it is at most a transgression. Elder Ballard thinks a person cannot choose to be homosexual or heterosexual. Do you remember the moment you chose to be heterosexual or was it just the way you always were?
When does your heterosexuality become a sin? It becomes a sin when you act upon it outside the bonds of marriage.
If homosexual attraction is not a sin, then why should lust for hetrosexuals be a sin? Isn't lust for hetrosexuals just attraction without acting on it?! Jesus said that physical sexual relations aren't the only definition for sin and that lust is almost the same. Shouldn't this also apply to a woman lusting after another woman?
...desiring things contrary to God’s will or desiring to possess things in a manner that is contrary to His will is lust, and it leads to unhappiness.
https://www.lds.org/ensign/2016/10/love ... t?lang=engAccording to the Family Proclamation, if God's will is that only men and women marry, so they can raise a family and fulfil the Plan of Salvation, therefore is not every other option contrary to His will? Obviously, temple marriages and sealings are for male and female only and all other marriage combinations are forbidden and against His will and plan.The Savior cautioned, “Whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart” (Matthew 5:28).
God knows there is no progression for homosexuals unless they choose to progress and change to follow His commandments, one of which is to multiply and replenish the Earth. Homosexuality is therefore agaist His will since natural procreation isn't possible.
I personally believe that the "Morning and Gay" website is poorly done and that most of the information on it is posted because of the social pressures of the political left and to appease them to stop attacking the church. If that's what members of the church truly believe, how is there ever hope for change for homosexuals to follow God's plan?
It's unfortunate that the church is slowly caving to social and political power rather than standing up for what we've always said. That's why people think the chruch will reverse it's stance on gays just like it did on blacks as discussed earlier in the forum thread. They believe if enough pressure is applied, the church will change. Unfortunately, it seems to be working to some degree. It seems like the church's stance on homosexuality might be the major fracturing point for the members to choose who they will serve in the last days. I agree with many others here in the thread and I don't see the church ever changing the stance that homosexual marriage and sexual relations are a sin and that will cause many more to leave the church and many more not to join.
What I like about this video the most is that it shows the world that we will not tolerate that kind of behaviour in sacrament meeting. If standing up for what we believe is unpopular with the world, that means we are setting an example of righteous living.
It's a very scary thing for many people if he's right. That would mean that no matter how righteous you are, how good of a parent you are, your child could be homosexual.
It also means that it's not something you could help them "repent" from. If they didn't choose homosexuality to begin with, then there was no sin. One must willfully choose to rebel against God in order for it to be sin. Elder Ballard says you can't choose homosexuality so therefore it cannot be a sin according to him.
I understand lust differently than you describe. I am very attracted to my husband but I have never lusted after him. Attraction is normal and good and actually based on several aspects of a person, not just sexuality.
Lust, however, is trying to satisfy your own selfish and carnal desires without regard to the other person.
A homosexual (or heterosexual) can be attracted to someone without ever lusting.
You state that homosexuality is against God's will because it doesn't allow for procreation. What about heterosexual couples who struggle with infertility- can we conclude that their marriage is against God's will because they can't have children?
If, whatever is causing a husband and wife to not bear children, can be healed in the next life, then can whatever is causing homosexuality also be healed in the next life?
If we want hope for homosexuals to follow God's plan, then we first must understand what makes them homosexual. Telling a blind man to repent in order to gain his sight shows that the doctor doesn't understand what causes blindness. According to elder Ballard, telling a homosexual to repent shows you don't know what causes homosexuality.
I agree there are a lot of similarities between the church's stance on gays and blacks & the priesthood. Blacks were believed to have sinned, that's why they were black. They could not enjoy the same privileges as whites because God was obviously punishing them for their sins. Today homosexuals are that way because of "sin". They cannot enjoy the same privileges as heterosexuals because God wants to punish them.
Honestly, the reason why the church is being so swayed by liberal parties on this issue, IMO, is because the church doesn't know what God's will actually is on this subject. There are a few random verses from the bible that some construe to be saying that homosexuality is an abomination. Besides that, there's no revelation on it. There have been several policy changes and updates, but that doesn't sound like the revealed word of God.
The only way to know is to ask God yourself, which is what those who have homosexual loved ones tend to do. And, not surprisingly, they're the ones who come back from the work of seeking and knocking and are filled with love and understanding for homosexuals instead of fear and condemnation.